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Colorado NR license allocation
Elk
Contributors to this thread:
sticksender 19-Nov-22
WI Shedhead 19-Nov-22
PECO2 19-Nov-22
DonVathome 19-Nov-22
[email protected] 19-Nov-22
[email protected] 19-Nov-22
LUNG$HOT 19-Nov-22
Aspen Ghost 19-Nov-22
[email protected] 19-Nov-22
elkocd 21-Nov-22
Treeline 21-Nov-22
LUNG$HOT 21-Nov-22
[email protected] 21-Nov-22
Orion 21-Nov-22
Darrell 22-Nov-22
Scoot 22-Nov-22
Bow Bullet 22-Nov-22
Treeline 22-Nov-22
Cazador 22-Nov-22
Tracker 22-Nov-22
Darrell 22-Nov-22
stealthycat 22-Nov-22
Darrell 22-Nov-22
Bow Bullet 22-Nov-22
Darrell 23-Nov-22
Orion 23-Nov-22
Jethro 23-Nov-22
From: sticksender
19-Nov-22
Here's a heads-up for NR's of Colorado who may be planning a future application for a limited big game license. Under current rules, if a hunt code (deer, elk, bear) requires 6 or more points for residents to draw (3-year average ending in 2009) then NR are capped at 20% of the licenses for that hunt code. Other limited hunt codes allow a 35% NR cap. This has now been changed by the Wildlife Commission to reflect current draw results, instead of the old 2009 numbers.

Affected will be hunts such as Unit 40 archery elk (drops from 18 licenses per year to 10 for NR) and Unit 76 archery elk (drops from 44 licenses to 25 annually). Along with several other hunt codes/species. This will obviously boost point creep for NR and may cause "point leap" on some of these hunts. Just something to consider if you are borderline on drawing your desired hunt.

Pronghorn I don't believe are affected, since there is no NR cap on that species. NR demand for pronghorn licenses has always been very low.

It's actually pretty surprising this change was not done sooner. I believe the outfitter lobby had worked to delay it, until now.

From: WI Shedhead
19-Nov-22
Another classic bait and switch by a game department at the expense of the nrs.

Thier is no shame in screwing guys anymore because the money keeps flowing

From: PECO2
19-Nov-22
Lots of chatter about this on the Colorado page. Good info for all.

From: DonVathome
19-Nov-22
Yikes I have been waiting for unit 40 archery. Somehow, even before this new update, I got 2 years behind every year that passed. That is going to really really hurt NR elk bowhunters. I remember when I drew CO archery sheep my wife asked me to withdraw my CO 7 elk app, I might have drawn that year, I think I had 5 points. It is probably going to take 20 this year.

SS that is a good thing to let guys know, thanks!

19-Nov-22
Still can stop in Walmart on your way and buy an over the counter, either sex elk tag good for about half the popular elk habitat in the State.

Even with the change nonresidents will still represent around half the elk hunters in Colorado. Some states don't allow any nonresidents access to elk hunting.

19-Nov-22
The 3 issues before the CPW Commission addressing big game , elk, deer, bear and pronghorn) are # 1. the recent one just approved, ie, High Demand units that required on average of 6 RESIDENT PP, over a three year period. That three year period has now been updated from 2007-09, to more current dates, of 2019, 2020, and 2021, with a one year lag. As before the break down will remain 80/20 percent, Res VS Nonresident. This will shift more elk and deer units and licenses to resident hunters, but not a lot, only approx. 200 I understand. Bear and Pronghorn are not an issue as the demand from nonresidents in minimal. But deer and especially elk are in high demand and as other elk and deer states place more restriction on non residents, that will place more pressure on the Colorado deer and elk resource from non residents.

#2, issue is OTC for elk. Approx. 75% of the elk in Colorado are in OTC units, the remaining are in Limited Draw units. Some recommendations have been to eliminate all OTC units and go for all Limited Draw elk licenses for bow residents and nonresidents. Another recommendation is to cap all resident and non residents for OTC tags. And then, only limit non residents to OTC elk tags. Nearly 53,000 bow hunters hunted elk in Colorado and 51% were nonresidents. For the past two elk archery seasons, nonresidents are now purchasing more OTC elk license that resident bow hunters. "Crowding" has become a big issue.

# 3, issue, is to provide more resident elk license and change the current license allocation from 65% resident / 35% nonresident. Change could be be status quo, 75/35% or 80/20% . CPW staff, while at first recommended 80/20 but then as digressed to 75/25%. Hard to tell at this point where is will end up.

Issues 2 and 3 are still being under investigation by staff and the CPW Commission as to any adjustments in the near future. We are sure that change will happen but to what degree. The next big game 5 yr season structure 2024-2028, will be under review by next spring and these remaining issues will be resolved with the next few months or year or so.

From: LUNG$HOT
19-Nov-22
That’s interesting for sure. I kind of like the idea of limiting the non res to OTC only but I’m afraid they would also need to cap them as well. If not it will create crazy grid lock even worse than it already is in OTC. Then there’s the obvious of resident hunters not getting tags they apply for in LE and adding to the OTC madness as well. And I can only imagine being a non resident with a ton of PP for CO and essentially having them wiped out. I’d be pissed.

From: Aspen Ghost
19-Nov-22
Limiting NRs to OTC will really wreck OTC areas for those residents who like to hunt an OTC area. The resident will have a better shot at a limited area I guess but I'm not sure how often that will happen. If that is combined with a cap on OTC permits for NRs that will help.

But the impact on revenue will be huge. Not only for the lost NR permits sales but also the loss of qualifying license sales (small game) that NRs are currently buying in order to participate in the draws. They would have to increase the NR OTC permit fee significantly to compensate for the lost revenue. With a significant increase in NR permit fees they may not even need the NR OTC cap.

19-Nov-22
Loss of revenue? A few million here and few million there. Actually the CPW is revenue black and if they can come up with a new program, like , "Keep Colorado Wild" and raise up to 36 million dollars with an increase fee (op-out is optional) on auto registration where the first 30 million goes to improve and build new Parks, they can surely come up with another plan to compensate any loss from nonresident license fees. From a few unofficial polls, resident hunters are willing to take a license fee increase to make up some of the difference.

From: elkocd
21-Nov-22
sticksender, can you post a link to where it shows these changes have been approved and implemented? I have been following these as I have 15 NR elk points, but I have seen nothing that says they have made any decisions only that there were options. I did see from the last meeting notes back in Sept. I think, that the only option that could be implemented for the upcoming season was the one you are stating. The 80/20 split for the high demand units. But... as said I can't find anything that says that recommendation went thru.

21-Nov-22
No matter what is being discussed. Currently The current system can not stand and will be changed eventually. So a NR building and or hoarding CO points is no longer a good strategy. Burn em as soon as possible.

From: Treeline
21-Nov-22
Based on the last few years, I would be all for doing away with OTC elk hunting in this state and limiting all licenses. The overcrowding archery and OTC rifle hunts is over the top. Not sure if I will ever get another OTC license in this state after last year. Sucks when you are trying to hunt close to home and can't even find a parking place in 8 different areas around the house.

21-Nov-22
I would be upset also if I lived there.

From: LUNG$HOT
21-Nov-22
Agreed Treeline. It’s getting unbearable. As a resident I’d have no problem with doing away with OTC hunt as long as they are willing to support the residents in some form. If need be I’d pay a bit more for a tag to offset the financial piece but I don’t think they really NEED the crazy revenue from it. I know Wyoming system isn’t perfect but limiting to non res to draw for otc is a start and guarantee the residents access to the otc tags makes sense. They also need to divide the OTC units up by region like Idaho. Will also help with overcrowding.

21-Nov-22
elkocd, here is what the CPW Commission approved for the 2023 season at their Nov. 17 meeting, ie,, updating the three years used to identify the high demand units for 80:20 and keeping the preference threshold at 6 points (the staff recommendation) instead of raising it to 10 (which means more licenses for residents). The Commission also approved the CPW staff to conduct additional outreach (for 2024) on going with 75:25 across the board and changing the 80:20 units to 90:10.

Yep, more outreach!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! my best, Paul

From: Orion
21-Nov-22
That 80/20 change is thirteen years past due so nonresidents shouldn't be crying considering CPW delayed it way longer then their policy stated.

From: Darrell
22-Nov-22
Ouch! I've been on the cusp of 76 so now I guess I need to look at other options. Basically that means the incredibly sweet spot I've been scouting the last two summers is going to be a waste for me. Oh well, it was fun dreaming.

From: Scoot
22-Nov-22
This sucks, but at least it benefits the residents of the state, instead of welfare to guides. Residents of the state deserve preferential treatment. The issue for me always becomes, how much preferential treatment? This will hurt my chances at the unit I was hoping to draw in the next two years. Either I'll reconsider that unit and apply elsewhere or I'll have to wait longer...

From: Bow Bullet
22-Nov-22
Well Darrell, I'm a resident with enough to draw 76 but behind the curve on 61 so if you'd be so kind as to pm me those sweet spot coordinates in 76 it would be greatly appreciated. ??

From: Treeline
22-Nov-22
If I was a nonresident, I am not sure Colorado would even be in the mix for elk, even the top tier units pale against much lower demand hunts in other states with far better quality…

It is still awfully cheap to build points in this state even for a nonresident, though. So the point races will likely continue.

From: Cazador
22-Nov-22
The odds on draw units will always change as states make modifications, every state has done it, a lot of them recently. I'm curious on what we will see if anything in the next few years with OTC units as this affects me more than drawing a tag every 3-5-10 years.

I see no need to make any of the OTC units draw for residents, and I really hope it doesn't go that way. Elk aren't my favorite species to hunt, but I still enjoy hunting them every year. I also don't think residents need to see any excessive tag fees in order to make up revenue when NRs are not even near what they would pay to come an hunt elk. We shall see, but I don't expect much. What really is bothering me as of late are the flipping of regions over to draw slowly but surely, which in the end causes more crowding in the remaining OTC units.

In the end CO has been good to me, and it's still the place to be in my opinion for guys that get off the couch.

From: Tracker
22-Nov-22
Colorado still will be the best opportunity for a NR to hunt Elk and I am appreciative for the opportunity they give us NR's. I was lucky enough to draw a Unit 2 archery tag a few years ago. 21 year wait but worth it.

From: Darrell
22-Nov-22
Bow Bullet,

I'm open to sharing what I have with someone at some point, just not yet. Hope to move to CO or WY at some point in my future so my points could still get me there. I would be open to sharing my info with someone who has some good intel on one of the lower point units. Guessing I need to start researching other options as I figure I went from a slight chance to draw this year and slightly increasing each year going forward to no chance for at least 5-10 more years.

From: stealthycat
22-Nov-22
if all non-residents stopped going to Colorado to hunt - Colorado would change their views towards NR's really fast

without NR money, Colorado would hurt in many areas (tourism and G&F money)

From: Darrell
22-Nov-22
Stealthy,

True that, but CO has the mountains and the elk so we are going to keep coming as long as its at all feasible, just like an addict to his dealer. It is the other "golden rule." "He who has the gold makes the rules." :)

From: Bow Bullet
22-Nov-22
Yeah Darrell, I was just joshing ya. I forget this site changes emojis to double question marks.

From: Darrell
23-Nov-22
Actually, Bow Bullet, if it becomes clear I will never hunt 76, I will share what I've found with someone who gets the tag. I might even offer to share it on the condition of going with him to call and help pack out a really nice bull. Will be a couple years at least before we move to the mountains, if that ever actually happens, but if the choice ends up being WY where I would still be CO non-resident, I likely will make someone a great offer on a spot I've found on my own that is incredibly sweet.

From: Orion
23-Nov-22
Stealthy do you boycott all the other western states with a NR cap on licenses?

From: Jethro
23-Nov-22
I'm surprised Jims hasn't started an every forum crusade to stop the taking away of NR tags.

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