Sitka Gear
Utah Commisioner Caught Baiting
Mule Deer
Contributors to this thread:
Thornton 07-Jun-24
Thornton 07-Jun-24
Grey Ghost 07-Jun-24
drycreek 07-Jun-24
Mike Ukrainetz 07-Jun-24
Nyati 07-Jun-24
LBshooter 07-Jun-24
redneck hunter 08-Jun-24
Glunt@work 08-Jun-24
Dale06 08-Jun-24
drycreek 08-Jun-24
Grey Ghost 08-Jun-24
JakeBrake 08-Jun-24
Groundhunter 08-Jun-24
sawtooth 08-Jun-24
sawtooth 08-Jun-24
sawtooth 08-Jun-24
Grey Ghost 08-Jun-24
IdyllwildArcher 08-Jun-24
IdyllwildArcher 08-Jun-24
DConcrete 08-Jun-24
DConcrete 08-Jun-24
Orion 08-Jun-24
Orion 08-Jun-24
drycreek 08-Jun-24
IdyllwildArcher 08-Jun-24
Corax_latrans 08-Jun-24
DConcrete 08-Jun-24
DConcrete 08-Jun-24
Orion 08-Jun-24
IdyllwildArcher 08-Jun-24
Aspen Ghost 08-Jun-24
Grey Ghost 08-Jun-24
Twinetickler 08-Jun-24
RK 08-Jun-24
From: Thornton
07-Jun-24

Thornton's embedded Photo
Thornton's embedded Photo

From: Thornton
07-Jun-24

Thornton's Link

From: Grey Ghost
07-Jun-24
"The DWR’s report did not specify what kind of bait the suspects allegedly used, according to the Tribune."

How does a 62 page report NOT include what kind of bait they allegedly used?

From: drycreek
07-Jun-24
It’s pretty simple really, if it’s not legal, don’t do it !

07-Jun-24
Grey Ghost nailed it. Deceptive headlines to smear a Trophy hunter. It was probably old salt at a cattle trough. You could use salt in 2020 and it could still be in the soil.

From: Nyati
07-Jun-24
Mississippi Commissioner was cited for hunting turkeys over a baited field this spring. Apparently someone released a bunch of crickets on the property

From: LBshooter
07-Jun-24
Rules for thee and not for me. Typical from people in power, hope he gets the book thrown aT him if found guilty .

08-Jun-24

Ricky The Cabel Guy's Link
a little more info here...

"Robert said he and his father did not shoot a buck, and they didn’t see anyone else shoot a buck while they were at the ranch. They did notice salt licks and water troughs in the areas where they were hunting.

“We asked the outfitters about it three different times and they were like ‘No, the division knows about it,’ and ‘We’ve talked to the division about it and they’re fine with it,’” Robert said.

They deferred to Heaton, Robert said, knowing that he was on the Wildlife Board. “As far as we were concerned, Mr. Heaton is the division,” Robert said.

The 2021 law includes exemptions for salt licks placed by agricultural producers for agriculture purposes. Hunters can hunt over such salt licks, according to DWR.

Heaton Ranch is a cattle ranch that has also invited guests to help with cattle drives, and Robert had taken pictures of cattle in the area where they were hunting."

if this is about salt licks and water troughs on an active "cattle ranch"...this could get interesting.

08-Jun-24
Lots of rumors on Monster Muleys about apples etc. A lot of jabbing back and forth. Take it for what it's worth.

From: Glunt@work
08-Jun-24
The politics around antlers in Utah is a mess.

From: Dale06
08-Jun-24
The politics and extreme infatuation with antler size is far from being confined to Utah.

From: drycreek
08-Jun-24
If you ask me, and nobody did, getting your ass all up in the air about baiting is a useless way to spend your time. Has anyone anywhere ever actually proved that it is detrimental in any way to wildlife ? Yeah, I’ve heard all the arguments, but I’ve never seen any concrete evidence that it harms wildlife in any way. If we are going to claim disease spreading, then take out the guzzlers in the arid regions and stop feeding elk in the winter. Oh, the government does that so it’s okay ! If we are going to say it makes hunting too easy, reduce the bag limits. Outlaw food plots too. Stop hunting pronghorn over water. If it offends your sensibilities, then just don’t do it. The bottom line is, you just have so many tags, no matter what. Who is the official arbiter of ethics ? If it’s the government, we are all in deep doo doo !

From: Grey Ghost
08-Jun-24

Grey Ghost's Link
Drycreek, there's been plenty of research on the affects of baiting. My link has links to several studies, if you care to learn about their findings.

From: JakeBrake
08-Jun-24
Drycreek wins for best post on bowsite in a long time!

Well said and I couldn’t agree more !!

Everyone wants to split hairs on baiting when there’s really no hairs to split…”baiting”comes in all forms…some just don’t want to admit it

From: Groundhunter
08-Jun-24
Dry creek, your dead on. When state agencies bait with corn, for sharp shooters, for herd reduction, then fine an old man for putting out some apples..... true story...

From: sawtooth
08-Jun-24
Dry Creek is correct, the rest is all politics.

From: sawtooth
08-Jun-24
Don't believe all the fake research reports, even the hunting world has their Fauchi's. But, the liberal hunters will believe and report anything if it furthers their agenda.

From: sawtooth
08-Jun-24
Fauci !!!! Oh well, you libs get it.

From: Grey Ghost
08-Jun-24
The article I linked to is from the National Deer Association. They are as far from a liberal anti-hunting group as you can get. But I'm sure you guys know far more than the biologists who study this stuff for a living.

08-Jun-24
Do you all ignore the laws you don't think are worth following?

Driving fast in a school zone can be done over and over without ever hurting anyone. But if everyone speeds in a school zone all the time, eventually, a kid gets killed, so the law is put in place for no one to do it ever.

Laws are put in place for a reason and you guys who bait white tail in the east piling on about the ridiculousness of someone baiting in one of the premier mule deer trophy units in the west...

There's a lot more at play here. This was done on private land in a unit that is primarily public land. Your biases don't even begin to measure up to a comparison to this case.

08-Jun-24
Tell the guy that waited 30 years for this tag and will hunt it once in his lifetime, that it's no big deal when all the big deer are on a ranch that he has no access to that is surrounded by public land. Or the guy who waited decades to draw the ranch next door in the CMWU hunt and he's now hunting on a ranch that doesn't bait and, hmm, where are all the deer? The Pons unit this happened in takes decades to draw.

This doesn't even come close to bearing a resemblance to what you guys are dealing with in the East. Different specie, different kind of hunt, different land ownership layout, different state, different climate, different everything.

And because everything is so much different and the stakes higher as it's a once-in-a-lifetime hunt, that changes the stakes involved when creating management laws and the stakes involved when breaking the law. The sentence is heavier for stealing a diamond necklace than it is for stealing a can of chicken broth for good reason.

Your bias for baiting based on you doing it for whitetail is like thinking that you'd enjoy eating pig brains because you like bacon.

From: DConcrete
08-Jun-24
You clearly know nothing of the Paunsagunt, or the deer there. Or where they are. Or anything. Additionally, I’d say this case goes nowhere. It’s a working cattle ranch. There’s salt and water on every cattle ranch and every national forest. Goodluck Utah. And you wonder why over 2000 animals are Poached every year. Because you’re only looking for the low hanging, revenue producing tickets to write.

From: DConcrete
08-Jun-24
Oh and to answer your first question Ike, do I agree with and follow every law just so I’m a good boy? F-no.

From: Orion
08-Jun-24
I don't think salt and water is the issue. It's the truck loads of apples being dumped out there that is the issue

From: Orion
08-Jun-24

Orion's embedded Photo
Orion's embedded Photo

From: drycreek
08-Jun-24
GG, the talking heads that are in the news have an agenda too. Most all of them are against baiting. If they want to stop the spread of diseases, they might want to pay a little more attention to deer breeding operations. I’m 77 years old and people were slinging corn to deer in Texas since I was a kid, but we have only had CWD for a few years. We got 99% of it in our public herd right next to high fences. Go figure.

08-Jun-24
"You clearly know nothing of the Paunsagunt..," Incorrect. I've never hunted deer there as is the case for 99.999% of hunters, but I've spent a total of about 3 weeks in the unit in total on two different trips to the unit, which is probably more than most people on this thread.

"...or the deer there. Or where they are." Incorrect. About 10 years ago, I spoke with the biologist for the area at length about the unit and also had a brief discussion with the CO for the area. I know more than the average hunter about the unit and its deer.

"Or anything." Are you 'F-in' kidding me? First off, you're way off base with your assumptions that you've pulled out of your ass and are dead wrong and if this is just salt and water, I'd agree with you about it going nowhere, but if you reread my posts, you'll see I never said anything about the guy being guilty of baiting, but rather just a response to white tail hunters poopooing baiting mule deer in a trophy unit.

But secondly, you're going to just straight up insult my intelligence? Seriously... F you. AFAIC, someone who insults people's intelligence from the safety of their home computer is nothing more than a blow-hard coward. I'll be at P&Y next spring if you want to say that to my face.

08-Jun-24
Can you imagine how good an apple must taste to a water-stressed deer??

Seems to me that the only people who don’t have any problems with baiting are in deer-choked regions and have access to substantial acreage on Private land.

No pattern there, I’m sure….

From: DConcrete
08-Jun-24
Orion, You do realize that those pictures could’ve been from Any year previous years before the baiting ban, right? I don’t see the date on there.

2nd of all, Ike, don’t be a fool And try to tell Somebody to come Meet ya out In the parking lot.

3rd of all, I don’t really care what biologist you talked to. One of the very best and hunted a lot spots on the pauns isn’t even close To the heatons. I stand by my statement. You don’t know shit about the pauns.

If you’re looking for a, meet me in the parking lot reaction, go get that from Somebody else And f you too.

From: DConcrete
08-Jun-24
Mule deer in southern Utah aren’t water stressed. The pauns has a lot of water as a matter of fact. Natural and tanks. I know an apple Must taste good to a deer though regardless.

Mule deer are built for drought and a lot less water. They’re not an antelope. Or a whitey.

From: Orion
08-Jun-24
DConcrete that pic and many others will be used in the prosecution on the case.

08-Jun-24
DConcrete, you don't know me or what I know or where I've been or anything about me that you pretend to know. You are a self-assuming blowhard. It's too bad that some of Bill's kindness and humility didn't rub off on you.

FWIW, I never pretended to know more about the unit than you do. It's you that's knocking other people down to build yourself up, which is typical of insecure, haughty blowhards.

From: Aspen Ghost
08-Jun-24
Why would an Investigative report (even a redacted one) be released to the public prior to any charges being filed?

From: Grey Ghost
08-Jun-24
I love apples, but not to kill deer. I’m following this one.

From: Twinetickler
08-Jun-24
Orion not that I care about Wade Heaton, but that picture is from 2017 on the Henry Mountains. The outfitter was Wade Lemon and the hunt is posted on Youtube. It has nothing to do with Heatons case. The issue here is for years Heaton was making decisions for all of us on Utahs wildlife board. It was an extreme example of a conflict of interest. He shot down the general archery elk hunt on the Paunsaugunt knowing he didn't want more people on the unit. He's always looked out for what's best for him and his interests with his decisions he made while being on the wildlife board. This baiting issue if nothing else will be a positive removing him from the Board. He did not have the general publics best interest in mind, it was his bottom line that was priority.

From: RK
08-Jun-24
We will all know the facts eventually. None of us know them now. Which makes us all look stupid

I'm following for the truth and the results of the investigation

09-Jun-24
"Laws are put in place for a reason..."

indeed they are.

unfortunately in many cases...the real "reason" has more to do with pressure from special interest groups than the stated goal of the legislation.

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