anyone need a great treestand elk hunt
Elk
At Olympic Mountain outfitters during the 13 day early bow season 2013 we had 17 baited stands all across Western Washington and we had 18 hunters hunt out of those stands and 13 of them shot an elk less than 30 yards. we were able to harvest 8 bulls and 1 cow, 1 hunter passed up a bull because it had a broken horn, 1 hunter missed a bull and 2 hunters wounded bulls. We have clearly put the odds in your favor and we are now booking hunts for 2014. Feel free to call, text or email me any time if you have any questions about my operation or to book a great hunt. Mike Vaughn
[email protected] 360-470-8708
Pm me with cost of the hunt.What an elk tag cost there??Do you need a general license too??Planning g a trip out that way for Blacktails.Adding an elk hunt would be cool if affordable
sign me up withmy broken broken abck this might work TINK
If one has nothing to say that is bad then say nothing.
PM me as well. This would make a great trip for my 75 year old father. He always wanted to hunt Elk.... He was very ill a couple months back... almost passed. Since His wheels don't work as good as they use to a tree stand hunt would be great.
Haters please keep your comments to yourselves.
jjs.... my mother also taught me that if you have nothing good to say then say nothing at all so I'll bite my tounge. But it sure isn't easy!!! I wasn't a client. I'm a licensed Montana outfitter who went there to work so I know what really went on. Oh Lord!
I personally know Mule Power is dead on his post above. For those knowledgable bowsiters who understand the phrase "caveat emptor".... Then enough has been said....
3X, make that 4X what MP says. There are also other options for elderly or handicapped hunts. Just search on this site or see/call BNAA (also a sponsor).
PM me as well, with price etc jerbear
elk hunting....Texas style. Warm, dry, comfortable
Thanks Seminole and Mulepower..... This is why this site is great
The elevated box blind in the photo above has always produced at least 2 of my opportunities at bulls during the 13 day early bow season. This year the client on the first hunt cleanly mist a 5x5 and harvested a cow the next day. On the second hunt Washington States lieutenant governor Brad Owen made a great shot on this 4x4 bull, at 30 yards. It was his first Bull Elk and first time hunting with Olympic Mountain Outfitters in the early bow season. I know their haters out their, but my style of bow hunting elk is no different than a great Ohio whitetail hunt, or any other state with great whitetail hunting in fact the only difference is the scenery of Western WA. and the animal that will walk under your stand could weigh more than 1200 pounds. And just like a great whitetail hunt their are no guarantees, the hunter must be patience, quite, sent free and make a great shot. We have many different kinds of stand locations all over Western WA. for every skill level, from box blinds in trees, on stilts and on the ground to ladder stands and hang-on stands from 15 to 30 feet up. For the hunter that wants to call one in or spot and stalk I recommend a Semi Guided hunt, it comes with great hunting, great food, lodging, airport pickup and a much lower success rate. In a couple of days I will post the photo of 0ne of the two bulls that was harvested in 2012 early bow season out of the hang on box blind in photo above, you might recognize the shooter. Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Keepitreal: no corn, just a few thousand pounds of apples... That is not the issue. If you really want to know the details, pm welka, me or Mule Power. If you are still interested well then by all means go and remember we gave you a friendly warning. Sometimes the guy who you think is your enemy is really your friend.
Yep those are apples, I put out around 300,000 pounds of them a season I have a semi truck that brings a 40,000 pound load to camp every two weeks sometimes sooner and to address mule power sorry not all friendship and business relationships work out it was the working together part, that did it, it probably shouldn't have been done.
300,000 pounds is a bit more than "just a few thousand pounds" lol
You like apples...how do you like these apples? Haha
This guy is a Bowsite sponsor and is being very clear about the type of hunt he is advertising. This method would not be legal in some states, but apparently in Washington it's an acceptable method of harvesting elk. I hope those who choose to hunt with him achieve great success.
I don't know anything about the "backstory" predicating any of the previous posts. What I do know is that a Bowsite sponsor who appears to be clearly advertising his services to a select "target market" deserves some respect. I'm supportive of the sponsor and of those who choose to hunt with him. Good luck gents!
I agree with arctichill... this outfitter is a Bowsite sponsor, and the posts filled with innuendo are inappropriate.
Also, I just read 8 Outfitter Reports right here on the Bowsite about Olympic Mountain Outfitters and they all rated it at 4 or 5 stars, with guys stating they plan to go back in the future.
I agree with Arctic and Jimbo.
This is not the post for your issues with the outfiter. Write an outfitter review and put your grievences in there and guys can read both sides and make their own decisions.
If clients go and have a good time and write good reports then he's doing his job If he's not such a great boss that's really not a client issue.
This post is for the outfiiter and potential hunters to discuss the hunt.
BTW You may not be one to hunt over bait but it is a very effective and accceptable way to hunt in many parts of the country.
Vomit
No issue with the outfitter, just the concept.
Can you say food plot. That seems to be perfectly acceptable anywhere. IMO opinion I don't really see a difference. Just saying. And yes under MY circumstances I have hunted high fence. Rory
Been a Bowhunter 57 of my 72 years now. Done it all & 95% DIY & Public land in 13 states & 2 Canadian provinces. Had several guided Biggame Bowhunts (mostly required) & a few Semi guided, like drop camp ect. Oh, I've bait hunted (when legal) & even a few High fence for some Exotics I could not afford to chase in their native countries. IT was all Bowhunting to me & EACH a great experience. I can also remember recurve Bowhunting & "MAYBE" see 1 Deer in 30 days & trust me, NO Bonus tag crap back then. ONE DEER per year, no matter if you had Bow & gun tag or not. Yep, filled a few either sex tags with a DOE (shame on me). TODAY, with all the game cams, BAIT "ATTRACTANTS" like rack rage & Deer Cain ect sold in EVERY STATE (legal to hunt over or not) & FOOD PLOTS-YOU get the PICTURE. Who does fair chase???? Hmmmmm, damn few for REAL. IF it's legal, keep your mouth shut. If it's not your way, We don't care & know what, hunting will be just fine as it has been in the past. OUR BIGGEST concern for hunting (any kind) should be (my opinion) how FEW of the younger generation seem to be involved.. We will have "these" & many other "disagreements" until time ends & I guess it boils down to, IF it is legal, do not condeme what another chooses. I think there is something about casting the 1st stone only if you for sure are right.
I hunted with Mike 2 years ago and you won't find a harder working outfitter anywhere. Not all the elk are Rosie's, where I shot mine it was classified as Rocky Mt. He has areas all over, the first day we hunted 2hrs away close to the coast. If you don't like the baiting aspect don't go but if you want to shoot an elk Mikes the guy.
Thanks Seminole
Best of Luck, Jeff (Bowsite Sponsor)
You should see how they do it in MI. They drive around in trucks till they see some. Then they jump out and try to shoot one. I've never even heard of someone taking one with a bow here in MI. If a person is lucky enough to draw a tag, its considered a once in a lifetime hunt so most hunters only hunt with a firearm.
The scenery looks pretty cool there in WA. If I was ever to hunt Elk I'm not sure I would want to hunt this way unless I was the one who found the spot, set up the stands, and did the work for myself. Then it might feel a bit more rewarding to me. Course by the time I did all that work I wouldn't have any time left to hunt.
Wouldn't mind sitting in that stand watching the Elk. Maybe take my camera. Or... follow the heaviest trails to see where most of the Elk are coming from. Might find a good ambush spot that way.
"I hunted with Olympic Mt. last year and can attest to the fact that the area is so thick that baiting is the only viable method of hunting."
Chip T, I called in and killed my first elk last year in central Oregon only a couple miles from the ocean and I promise you that these areas are all equally rugged and thick.
I was walking through 6-8 foot ferns in this area that were so thick, the elk had paths under the fronds.
The attached pic is what I call an "elk cave." The elk were using this path and it was so thick that it grew up and over and made a cave that was so dark you had to look where you put your feet and was 20 yards long.
It is very difficult, but to say that it is "the only viable method of hunting" is just false and a cop out.
Now, if you want to hunt elk over apples in a tree, I'm fine with that as long as it's legal. But don't try and justify it like it's necessary.
18 shot 13....those ain't that good a odds for baited. I would think a good guide in a good place could get a higher % than that real hunting.
ah... deleted posts.
Jimbo & Sage.... these threads are for discussion good bad and ugly. It's truly for the benefit of the forum users. As far as a review: They are for clients and I was not a client.
I know what I'm talking about though. I wrote every word of the text for Mike's brochure & website brother. I know what goes on there and this has zero to do with the bait issue. It's about honesty. By the way.... a good % of the reviews are from family and friends of family. I know that and a lot more. I have absolutely NOTHING against baiting where legal. But, and I hope you can respect this: I do have a grudge against outfitters who give honest ones a bad reputation.
Like I said.... as friends our differences didn't undermine my hard earned reputation. But it sure did when outfitting. You wouldn't be on Bowsite if you didn't know me either.
Delete my posts one more time and I'll start my own thread. This is Bowsite: The cream rises to the top and everything else sinks to the bottom.
Leave this post in place Mike & I promise I will walk away now! And... my word is as good as a signed contract.
Well mule you sure sound like the fox and sour grapes. ex partners have a lot in common with ex wives and their opinions judged accordingly. this year the archery bull kill was probably between sixty to seventy percent. And our group went two for three. Can we count the bull his 11 year old kid killed too?
You tell 'em TBM. Maybe you should go on out and show 'em how it should be done. By the way, how many elk you have you killed? Sorry I forgot, please remind us.
No sour grapes Pete. You've been on Bowsite long enough to know that I have a good reputation as both an outfitter and a person. Sounds like your group did well. Good for you. And yes you can count the bull that Tyler or Tanner killed! The year I was there a total of 1 bull was killed. Blacktail Bob left early. I'd say that speaks volumes to the people here who know him. A couple of my clients asked for a free hunt in Montana as compensation and a show of good faith on my part. Truth is stands were only baited the day before hunters arrived. Some the very day they were picked up at the airport. Perhaps Mike learned a thing or two about hard work that season to your benefit.
My thoughts are not at all opinion. They are facts. Clients like you don't always know the whole picture. Do I sound like the only one who knows some different things than you? It's not uncommon for clients to walk away with a different perspective. You killed bulls: You are happy. I can understand that.
Now as I promised in my last post.... I'll shut up. I think enough has been said.
Mule- I think you handled it fine, unfortunately there many outfitters that don't know how to run a business and make poor choices all the way around. This creates a challenge for the good ones. I've only hunted with an outfitter once, in ID 23 years ago, not a good experience. I've only heard good things about your operation and wish you continued success.
DJ
Is a thread where a SPONSOR is trying to drum up business an appropriate place to chime in with negative posts? Wouldn't it be more classy to write up an outfitter report an leave SPONSORS alone when they try to "make a living"? If it was someone who was not a SPONSOR I would think public "bashing" would be more appropriate. Should we be more considerate of SPONSORS? Because they keep BOWSITE operating? Even if I hated someone I wouldn't try to keep them from feeding their family... Mike
Mike: Bowsite is a place to share your thoughts on bowhunting including outfitters. As long as it is done in a professional and accurate way, if a hunter has a bad experience with a sponsor then you should have the right to communicate that grievance either by post or by outfitter review. If you read the pm I sent you, you may come to a different conclusion. Sometimes you make a mistake and don't want to share. I care about bowsiters more than you might expect. Believe it or not I am trying to help you not hurt you. If I really opened up on what I observed, I guarantee it would make you rethink your post above.
Seminole I would like a pm to hear your side
Florida Mike "Is a thread where a SPONSOR is trying to drum up business an appropriate place to chime in with negative posts?"
Yes! Let me ask you this.... if a politician came here and paid his fee to campaign should anyone who knows of skeletons in his closet keep their mouth shut? What country is this again???
Wouldn't it be nice to know that all Bowsite sponsors were top notch? Just shelling out a few bucks doesn't mean they go through a screening process. But then again... THIS is just that isn't it?
If they simply pay to have a banner in place and be able to respond to reviews it's one thing. As soon as a thread starts it's a place for anyone who has knowledge on the subject to comment. Like I said twice... he didn't know this place existed until I showed it to him AND paying money to be a sponsor does not give anyone immunity. My take is if you do a good job you have no worries. If not then you should be careful because Bowsite, as we all know, leaves no stone unturned and the truth always comes out. That's what makes Bowsite such an incredible resource.... there's always sure to be someone here with first hand experience of whatever it is the users want to know or talk about. I'd be interested to hear your thoughts on this after considering these points.
One more perspective real quick Mike: After my experience... I was kind enough NOT to post an outfitter review bud. Did you ever stop to look at it that way?
After reading your post the perspective I get is that you are a very nice and caring person. But I already know you and knew that. Nice to know we have lots of those here too bud! You are the kind of people I hope to help today.
The folks at Tuttulik were just trying to make a living also. Wish I had a heads up before I donated my 5K.
Why don't you just tell the whole story then, MP?
Midwest: It really is a painful one to hear... trust me - I will pm you a snippet and take it at that. Forrest: PM sent.
Maybe the guy is wrong and Seminole and Mule Power are 100% right but there are ways to handle things and this is not the correct way.
On two separate posts Mule Power said that that would be his last post but yet he keeps posting. If you had such a bad experience you had and still do have an opportunity to start a thread of your own, Key word OWN, thread instead of hijacking his.
Also if you cared so much about your fellow bowsiters why not post a thread prior to this or an outfitter review.
There are always 2 sides to a story and right now we don't even have one, thinly veiled threats and promises of divulging information are all we have to go on.
When a guy says the issue is honesty, or ethics, or to sum it up, integrity, I'd say that covers it. What else do you really need to know? You're right Leo I said I was done but the other posts warranted replies I thought. Sorry. I did say if you want more feel free to PM. I thought and hope you agree that was nicer than the alternative.
I have nothing against it guys and I bet it's fine method of hunting in that area. But I think it's the picture you're posting of the cow and a calf feeding at a big mound of bait in a open field and the box blind that gets guys typing fingers a bit twitchy. If the pic wasn't there you might have a better response.
If you go back and look at the original post of those who were trying to give others a "heads up", you will note the posts were no where even close to blatant attempts to bash the outfitter. PMs are a good way for those who want to hear and that is what was offered. Several have been sent and more can if needed. As a matter of fact, several were sent by me on request via PM prior to the '13 hunt season to interested bowsiters. If you want the whole scoop, then PM Seminole, MP, or me and we will be glad to PM you also. There may be others who are "lurking", have an experience and can PM you their story also. Now, let's take all this energy on posting and go and kill a wolf! Good luck to all.
Welka: That is exactly what you SHOULD NOT be doing. The system on the site is to post an outfitter report with your side. The outfitter then gets to tell his side.
Then the buyer can make his own decision or contact you or outfitter for any clarification.
This outfitter is paying to be on here, unlike some, so he also has rights.
You don't get to contact every potential client and give only your version of the story.
I don't even know this outfitter but understand the ad business better than most.
Air your grievances on an outfitter report and let the buyer make his own decision.
This outfitter, like any other, may have had issues in the past and if he has fixed those issues he should be allowed to show a track record of improvement.
That's the great thing about the outfitter reports. You can see a history.
How many guys see outfitter reports vs. see threads though?
If i am spending thousands, or tens of thousands, on hunt(s), i want info. all of it. valid, invalid, good, bad, biased, unbiased, successful, dismal failure, etc,etc.
just give it to me in volumes and i will decipher from there. the more info the better. even if it is not all accurate it provides specific things for me to inquire about when speaking to other references, or the outfitter himself.
all that aside, i would value a guide's opinion of an outfitter 10X more than a hunters. a hunter is there for a week. he could see the best or worst in any given week. a guide on the other hand knows the whole deal, all the facts, the good, the bad, and the ugly. He may have years of data to draw conclusions on. ,may have an axe to grind........maybe not.........again that is for me to decipher.
mule power, for whatever motivation he may have, is a well informed voice that should be heard. he did not drop in for a week and experience the operation he was, apparently to some degree, an insider and part of it!
whether he should be believed or not is up to any potenital client to corroberate through normal due diligence.
Ultimately it depends on what Pat wants. His website, his sponsors, his rules. If he wants to confine criticism of sponsors to outfitter reviews or DM's then I have no problems. If he starts losing sponsors because they get bashed every time they start a thread on their product I wouldn't blame him for it. If he doesn't care then I certainly don't either.
Personally I think that it is inappropriate to highjack a sponsors thread with some mysterious, can't talk about negativity. Start a thread that will come up in the Search engine or DM guys. Nothing annoys me more than guys who won''t just come out and say what they think.
I've been watching the thread from the start but didn't feel I had a right to post on something I know nothing about. I don't know who's right or wrong..
But,, I will say that Drop Tine is 100% right. I wanted to post what Drop Tine just stated a day or so ago.
Respectfully Teeton
Bou +1. As a hunter who will spend thousands on these hunts and equally important, time away from home and work, I want to know everything possible about an outfitter. I have no problem at all with people hunting over bait and have thought about going on this particular hunt in the future but I would be extremely pissed if I found out that the stands were over hunted and baited the day before I got there. Not that it means anything but post what happened, the past is the past so lets hear the facts and let the chips fall where they may. They it is up to us to decide if this is the place we want to hunt.
Pat, I'm sure any experience you have with an outfitter is as good as it gets. If there's a best week or best stand.... or best behavior then that's what you will get. With all due respect of course....
Mule,
I am assuming you know the outfitting business as well as anybody.
One thing in the outfitting business for sure is that a bad outfitter can be almost impossible to put out of business, especially if they do not violate any major game laws. They can go to new shows or any number of things to continue bilking their customers.
Another thing is you can't please everybody. I don't care how good of outfitter you are you are going to get a few hunters whom will make your life miserable.
Another given is, a successful hunter is almost always a very happy camper and is usually a repeat customer The ones who don't kill, even though they give positive lip service, seldom rebook, and many badmouth your operation.
I have considered becoming a Bowsite Sponsor but after watching the threads on here for a year or so I am having second thoughts.
What I am witnessing on here and Monster Mulies is a tendency to bring out a general hatred of outfitters from many in the hunting public and therefore it carries over into many of their comments and also a "piling on" effect seems to happen by many commentors whom don't have first hand knowledge of what really happened.
By the way Mule I don't see your name on the list of Bowsite Outfitters.
I find it odd that the people posting negative comments about the sponsor, and saying they just want to help everybody out, are not concerned enough to post an outfitter review that stays for all to see long after this thread is dead and gone. JMHO
Stoney you make some great points. I signed Olympic Mountain on as a Bowsite sponsor. I was much more than just an employee. At the time I had my own separate Olympic Mountain Outfitters checking account and all of the hunters booked here were mine and provided services from a separate camp managed by me and my employees from my Montana outfitting business. I sold that recently which is why you no longer see me listed as a sponsor. I have my share of reviews. I am about to launch a new business though so one day you will again. There is NO question Bowsite is a great resource for both hunters and outfitters. That's why OMO is still here and will likely continue to book hunters here. I have never frequented Monster Mulies though I've heard good things about it but I can tell you that if you are considering becoming a sponsor here you should follow through and do it as long as you are a reputable outfitter. You will have no regrets.
One thing worth mentioning about your post is this & I think you'll agree: I think one of the best references are guys who say "No, I did not kill anything but I would go back in a heartbeat" On the other hand the worst would be a client who says "Yeah... I killed a bull there.... but I'd never go back" The point there is that success rates aren't everything. I know a couple of those guys but they are quiet non-confrontational types although they will speak up if they feel a friend could use a hand.... which may answer Sureshot's question.
Mule, I am going to step out on a limb here and not hide behind a pm. I received a pm from one of your friends, even though I didn't ask for one, as I personally have no desire to hunt elk from a treestand over truck loads of apples. After receiving the pm I read the outfitter reviews, curiosity got the best of me since you posted earlier that most of the reviews were from family and friends of family. After reading the reviews I noticed one from 2013, I know Pete and I don't believe him or the other guys accompanying him on the hunt are friends or family. I then noticed there were 5 reviews from 2010, which I assume to be the year you were affiliated with OM. I also noticed that you appear to be the person that responded to 3 of the 5 reviews, or 60%. Could you please explain why you responded to the reviews, which you say the majority of them are family and friends of family, in the favorable way you did, if you were witnessing what you stated above. I find it quite concerning that when you had a financial relationship with OM you had nothing bad to say about them , and 3 years later you have nothing good to say. I am just curious as the reviews would have been posted after the hunts which you witnessed all of these terrible things happening on. Is it possible you have an axe to grind.
Sureshot... I'm trying to leave it alone man. Those reviews were all from 2010. I forgot... I DID sign Mike on the year before I worked with him. I stand corrected. They were Mikes hunters but since mine was the email associated with the sponsorship the review notices came to me and it was up to me to reply. At the time I was doing my best to help Mike grow the business. Also... I met Mike's cousin and his friends while booking hunts in the south and we got along great, as the replies indicate, so I was comfortable replying. Back then I was also pretty much teaching Mike to use the internet. That was before I spent the season there. I didn't work with Olympic Mountain until 2011. Two of the 5 reviews as you may have noticed were from the same guy. Another was from a guy posted a review but wasn't a hunter. He just helped around camp. His review puzzled both of us. I asked Mike what to do and he asked that I just post a reply to be amicable and leave it alone.
Notice there are zero reviews from 2011. There was 1 bull killed that year and the guy doesn't use the internet. I know nothing about the reviews from years after that.
I have no idea who PMd you or why. I had plenty to say when I had relations with Mike. I'm a straight shooter Jeff. Several times during and after the season I said exactly what was on my mind and he became pretty heated... but never denied anything I had to say because I was literally holding it all together on my end serving not only my clients but his as well when he put them in my camp without notice.
As far as reviews are concerned: It is my experience that people who had a great hunt, or are relatives or friends of an outfitter, will be more than happy to post positive reviews. For the most part people who have had bad experiences would rather just put them behind themselves and move on. Sometimes they are even embarrassed feeling they should have done more homework. Maybe people will accuse them of having an ax to grind? Whatever the case may be, in general I think there are considerably more positive reviews posted than negative ones.
I respect your questions. I have nothing to hide and you can feel free to ask me anything you like here or on PMs. I know that I don't want to upset Pat which is also why I don't intend to create my own thread. I hope I have answered your questions... I did my best to be complete with my reply. Have a nice day.
Mule,
For what it's worth, I would venture to say that one of your posts was deleted as a result to my response to that post. My response was also deleted. Out of respect for the moderators, I won't repost what I had before, but in essence it was simply an echo of the "support our Bowsite sponsors" message. I just don't want you to mistakenly blame someone else for the deletions when I believe it was my doing.
Jesse
Thanks for the clarification sir. I appreciate it. Good for all of us really. I'm not new around here and hope you and most remember.... not the bad guy! I knew that negativity wouldn't end well. But it is what it is. Can't say I have no regrets I'll say that. But I also wouldn't change a thing if I could.
Someone asked me once, "what makes a good outfitter?" I won't bore you with my long winded answer but in a nutshell I said the same thing that makes a good carpenter, doctor, or parent: Integrity. It was the same answer I once gave when another Montana outfitter asked me how I managed to get so many repeat clients. You can't fake integrity. I hope nobody judges me simply because they don't agree with my words on this particular thread. But as Stoney said: You can't please everybody.
Mule,
I also included in my deleted post that I respect you and appreciate 99.9% of the comments you post on Bowsite (something very close to that, if not verbatim).
This has obviously been a heated topic for you. Details aside, your emotional attachment to this issue is a clear indication that you take great pride in your work and that you have a sincere appreciation for the business of outfitting/guiding. Anybody who would fault you for that isn't worth his salt. I'm a self-employed Homebuilder. I deal with overcoming the objections created by dishonest contractors regularly.
Admittedly, I did not agree with the content of your deleted post. Obviously, my opinion is just that...mine. It's not right or wrong, it's not good or bad. It's just what I think.
With that said, I think you are a great asset to Bowsite and truly a "good guy."
Jesse, you are certainly no stranger to me either. I'm very familiar with your posts and opinions and have nothing but respect for them. I wouldn't expect everyone to agree with the posts in this thread. As a cardinal rule in life I always make it a point to put myself in the other guys shoes. Any time I see someone lash out at an outfitter I go on the defense. My first course of action is to evaluate the hunter. Such was the case when the guy came on here and berated BNAA. Turns out the guy wasn't even on the hunt!!! It's a never ending battle to try to deal with anti outfitter sentiment. Many feel they take people's money for nothing. It's not always due to a bad hunt or dishonest business owner either. Some just feel that outfitters are unnecessary and that there's no reason most people shouldn't just work a little harder and go DIY. I'm all about DIY and, unlike 90+% of outfitters encourage it and have pointed many do it yourself hunters in the right direction.
I wish I would have read your last post before I went to bed last night. I would probably have slept a little better. For what it's worth bud... this thread leaves a bad taste in my mouth too just so you & other guys that are cursing me know.
I can't wait til it fades to page 2!
Well mule maybe if you shut up and quit your whining it might go away! Every hunter saw elk this year and most got shots. Go away.
Ok wise guy. In your honor I'll tell you why I feel the way I do. Like I said... anti outfitter sentiment runs deep. The reputable ones despise dishonest ones even more than the hunters. If you could, for one second, imagine how I felt when I realized I was a dishonest outfitter!!! I told my long time repeat clients and my guides what to expect based on my trust in the guy who told me what to tell them. Then to feel guilty and be downright and embarrassed and having to try to explain to guides who were also embarrassed & struggling and hunters who had spent thousands and never saw an elk. If you did that well then I know the property you hunted. Yours is not an overview of the entire operation. If you're a smart guy you might realize that. Go ahead... bump the thread up again my friend. I could go on for days......
Mule, I hate these threads as much as you do. The main reasn I hate them is because people like yourself want to berate this sponsor when a couple months ago you were complaining about a guy that asked how to post a review. In the previous thread you thought it wrong to bash a sponsor and offer pm's to give the details without posting an outfitter review and giving the outfitter a chance to respond. It is funny how a couple months can change one's opinion. When you jump into a thread like this, especially after supporting this outfitter when you had financial ties with him, it looks very suspect. It is even more suspect when you post angrily about bringing him to this site as a sponsor, which he still is, and you are not. So while you think one sponsor or outfittrr should be spared from this type of thread, why is this differrent? I personally respect the sponsor for not getting into a pissing match.
As you stated "Leave this post in place Mike & I promise I will walk aesy now! And...My word is as good as a signed contract." Really Mule?
Mule, short of posting a photo of the thread owner with a dart in his forehead, I think you got your point across... again, and again, and again, and again, and again... ELEVEN POSTS!
Please STOP!
Otherwise, I hope Pat deletes the entire thread.
Good grief!
Partnerships are tough and many times one side feels cheated. Outfitter reviews are where just that should be posted. Having seen this before with outfitters bashing each other it never ends well. OMO has taken the high road and his hunters have come on here and on the reviews to support him!
Jimbo, Unfortunately deleting this thread would harm the sponsor and benefit Mule. Mule had succeded in putting Pat in a very bad position, and if I were Pat, I would not be happy.
Mark Millis From Outdoor America, and Deer City USA was able to harvest this 4x4 bull on the second hunt during the 2012 early archery season at Olympic Mountain Outfitters out of the treestand in the above photo. He said it was the best hunt he had ever been on. He was able to film the hunt, get the shot on film and sense he shot it in the heart it expired 30 yards from the tree. Mark also said it was the best footage he had ever handed in to his former boss Steve Gruber..... Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Is this elk hunt in an urban environment?
At Olympic Mountain Outfitters we have had many guides and camp cooks work for us over the 17 years we have been in service. Most have turned into long lasting friendships that stretch from the east coast to west coast. In the 17 years their have been four guides and three camp cooks that I have terminated due to poor performance, differences Or just not a good representative for Olympic Mountain Outfitters. The person giving me a hard time on this site falls under this category we can reefer to him as (mule Boy)He lives just outside Pittsburgh PA and tried to make it as a Montana outfitter and failed then tried to work for me. (mule boy) Was is Washington for 18 days and Their were many differences. That was three years ago and I guess he is still sore. (Mule Boy) Sorry for dashing your dreams of working for a Washington Outfitter now get a job, go on with life and Quit being a hatter, that will be the last time I address you.
Midwest.... At Olympic Mountain Outfitters we have treestand locations all over Western WA. Most are in Remote locations but we have a few that are in urban areas. We use the urban stand locations for our clients that are not seasoned elk hunters and have not taken the steps to make themselves sent free or are just noisy. The elk That live in urban areas are willing to eat apples under someone's apple tree in their front yard therefore they are use to a certain amount of human sent and noise. This makes them easy to kill and the stand location is great for children and noise adults that smell like the city..........Mike Vaughn...Olympic Mountain Outfitters
I think if you as an outfitter start a thread here to advertise your business, then you open yourself up to scrutiny and should be ready to answer questions- however tough, they may be.
I agree with Bou bound- if I am going to put down my hard earned money on a hunt, I want to hear it all- the good bad and the ugly! I'll take it all in and then sort it out and make a decision.
This reminds me of a thread I started a couple years ago when I found out about an outfitter that went out of business and disappeared a few days before hunters were to come into camp. Although I had no dog in the fight, I posted what I knew to alert guys that might be booked with this outfitter to try to get information before they left for camp and spent time and money on a trip that could(and turned out to be) already over. When I posted the facts that were reported to me, I got accused of everything from having an ax to grind, to being an internet hoaxter that made the whole thing up. Eventually, several sources involved came forward to corroborate the facts.
I took a lot of heat for posting what I knew, simply to try to help some people that may not know what was going on. But if it happens again, I would do it all over. If I was in that position, I hope someone would do the same for me and give me the "heads up"!
So mike are you saying you assess clients for how noisy they are and how they smell before assigning them a stand? I take it that the stinky and loud clients get stands close to civilization. Is that what you said above
He said, he said. Your word against his.
That is all I have seen so far, and if that is the only info you can give Mule, you have done all you can. If you have other verifiable facts about this guy,then post them here or on the outfitter section or file a complaint with the state board. Othewise you are beating a dead mule.
Ok Mike you asked for it. At the risk of being banned from here I'll start my own thread. For those who don't understand... there is no screening process to become a sponsor. Just write the check. Should that give you protection or immunity from people who have first hand knowledge speaking up? If you feel that way you are not like lots of Americans!
I told you guys I supported Mike 100% and helped generate the 2010 reviews in anticipation of selling hunts on 2011. At the time I responded to them I was still in the dark. Later I was floored to find out that I had been fooled like a rookie client. As soon as I found out what goes on up there I turned tail and RAN! Before berating me you need to read my posts better.
I CANNOT believe Mike that with you knowing what I know you would dare to poke a stick in the bees nest! Pat I hope you honor freedom of speech. Banning me for the truth would be a disservice to your users. Mike has already threatened me in a PM to by the way. Franco... from Washington still works for us. So does Will. Like I said in my deleted post: If Washington required outfitters to be licensed on private land as they do in most states yours would have been revoked long ago. The timber companies would have helped them do it too!
You own the place Pat. I'll sleep on this and wait to see if you send me a PM asking that I refrain myself from a detailed thread. If so I will surely honor your request. You and I go back further than you and Mike and you know I have great respect for you and all you have accomplished. I plan to be a sponsor again soon too.
One pic of a dead bull means nothing. Nothing!
Rut Nut u are 100 percent I recall that thread u posted ,, they were killing the messenger you !!
So far no one has commented on the two small bulls I have posted. I figured I better post a bigger one or someone might think we just shoot small bulls. This 6x7 bull was harvested the first week of the early bow season 2013. The client Kevin Dahm from IL. made a great shot from a hang on stand 25 feet off the ground. His stand location was in an old orchard that had been their since the homestead days located in a remote part of Western Washington. The herd of Elk that visit that orchard have been doing so for more than a 100 years.
My uncle used to have two sets of boxing gloves in his basement. When we were kids and got in arguments he'd make us duke it out. Pat, can we set something like that up? TBM could referee and post a play by play. -20 straight temperature tomorrow. Need some entertainment while I hibernate.
Bou'bound..... I would like to answer all questions no matter how silly...... I do not smell clients but I have seen clients smoke cigarettes and cigars while at camp and I even guide children that have a hard time sitting still. I realize by starting this post I open myself up to criticism, haters and dumb questions. But as an honest hard working outfitter with a great success rate, I have nothing to hide and I am not going away!.... Mike Vaughn...Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Alwayshunting,
I've never hunted in Washington before. Is that 6x7 a "good" bull for your area? Also, is the 7th point on one of the antlers hidden or are you counting the "cheater" near the base of the left antler as the 7th point? I'm assuming that is a Roosevelt's elk? I've never hunted (or even seen) a wild Rosie before so I apologize if my questions seem ignorant.
Arctichill,
We are counting the cheater point down by the base of the antler, our state would count it as a point and I'm sure the hunter would like it called a point to. This bull is not a monster but it is a nice one. I don't know what it scores but I would guess between 220 and 235. At Olympic Mountain Outfitters we have shot Rosie bulls that score up to 292 inches. we have seen bulls that score over 300 in and around our land leases but once they get that big they become very elusive. We had a couple of clients come very close to harvesting a 340 inch Rosie in 2012. One of my bow hunters from MN. got within 20 yards of him but could not get a shot through the thick brush. The bull was a main frame 6x6 with a 18 inch drop tine on one side and weighed more than 1,200 pounds..........Thanks for the question.... Mike Vaughn....Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Mike- You were better off not responding to the posts! If you and Mule want to "air it out" for all to read, by all means do so, I'm sure you will have many interested readers. I thought by you letting Mule post with no response was a great idea, but when you answered and referred to him as "Mule Boy", it shows a side that is neither professional or kind. Like I said feel free to battle it out, there is a way to do it were guys would respect you without the name calling.
DJ
Well said Straight Shooter- I agree.
To expound on the last two posts. In addition to your response to Mule Power, your response to Bou'bound made me sit up and take notice. I'm not to sure that you worded that to your advantage.
Some of you who are criticizing a few of us for not posting on the OF section, need to think about the following.... maybe we are trying to be "kind" to the OF and provide our feedback to others via PM, because we don't want to have a potentially sure fire blow to a man's business. Hmmm??? As bad as the experience was with OM or anyone has with other OFs, providing negative feedbback on the OF feedback section for all to see may not be fair to the OF. Mule has it right in that most of the posts are positive. ANYONE can post a question about a particular OF on Bowsite and get PMs from others to hear all sides of the story. That's a more professional way to give an evaluation and not purposefully try to damage a business. Now, if the OF decides to take off the gloves, then that's a different story. Pat's system and it works just fine with the different options we have to post replies.
I didn't think this was the place to settle old scores and was quite disappointed in Mule Power. I was pretty impresssed with the outfitter not responding to Mule. Then, after Mule finally quit posting this guy decides to open his mouth. I don't know about the rest of you guys but I would never book a hunt with an Outfitter that wants to argue and antagonize like these two. This is about the most unprofessional behavior you could get on a site like this.JMHO
Straight Shooter
My wife said the same thing. The truth is I work way to hard and will probably be broken by the time I am 60 and when someone bad mouths me I take offence. I just came off a long hard season where I shoveled and distributed 297,000 pounds of apples to tree stands all over W. WA. I had worked every day since July up until Dec. 20th and can't remember much sleep. I must have lost my mind for a moment. I'll Try To Do Better....Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
So if a guy wants good stands in the more remote area he should not smoke in camp, leave the kids at home, and be quiet around the lodge. Good tip. Should put that on the website.
Who says the more remote stands are the best place to see elk?
How do you keep the bears from being a problem with that many apples? David
This was the first bull harvested in 2013. Bob Russell From IL. shot this bull from a ground blind at less than 20 yards and less than one hour into our 13 day early bow season. The land least he was hunting on is located less than a half a mile from city limits and was only 5 acres big. The town itself has elk walking through the streets and the 2,000 pound apple pile that sits 20 yards from the ground blind has to be replaced every third day during season. The client that sits in the blind usually volunteers to be their as Bob did. We like to move our guided hunters around to different properties and stand locations thought their hunt so that they can get a good feel for Western Washington and see all the sites....Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
TX Hunter: He is not held accountable for his actions by a Board of Outfitters or any other entity as we are in Montana where they are very strict. Washington state does not require.... as far as I know from what Mike told me.... outfitters on private land to be licensed. A shame! He is held accountable if found to be hunting off of private land. He has a letter from the attorneys of the local timbers companies that state if he is again caught trespassing they will prosecute to the fullest extent of the law.
Midwest: Yes it is an urban hunt. My camp was next to a condemned house with the tents anchored to rusted out cars with scrap metal all around. He has one property where you won't see houses and traffic. Incidentally... it is the one where his reports come from and where people like Pete Drummond form their opinion. It is also the ONLY property where guys like Mark Millis will hunt. I booked Jake (Medicinemann) there as well because I wanted him to have the best odds at getting his NA slam and he needed a Rosey. Interestingly... he did kill a bull but would never go back for several reasons. Yes...Jake has been watching this thread in disgust. Tom Miranda hunted with Mike as well. Mike told me he "sucked" and didn't know anything about hunting. The other properties are a joke. One guy was in a stand at the end of a cul-de-sac where the neighbor would come out and yell up at him "You'll never kill an elk here" The guy asked to be relocated but Mike tells him what he tells every hunter who makes that request "I worked hard baiting that stand all year. If you want to move I'll put you somewhere not nearly as good as this spot AND you won't be coming back here because I'm gonna put someone else in your tree and let them kill your elk" Quote unquote.
Blacktail Bob left early and I can't say for sure as he has never communicated with me again but my guess he would never rebook. He paid top dollar for a baited hunt and we never dumped the first apple until the morning of the day he arrived. He watched the landowner, Gary, come and go along his driveway a mere 75 yards away with traffic passing on the main highway on a regular basis. I had two gun hunters, the repeats I gave free hunts to the next year, who were on that same lease. The one and only bull that occasionally wandered onto that land was killed on day 1 by the neighbor and they watched the remaining cows eat the rotten apples every day until they left. They told me not to worry as they knew me from our prior relations and believed me when I said I had no idea what to expect but only believed in what I had been told. Thank God!
The only client I had that killed a bull spent the entire week with his brother 50 yards from a guys house in a rundown building full of junk with an unused attached greenhouse. They sat in chairs looking out doors on opposite side of the building. Prior to killing a small 3 by 4 that scores about 160 they were MISERABLE. A hunt should be an overall experience, not just a dead animal. It was a long week for them and me. I felt bad and was sooo relieved whe they finally killed an elk. The pics above are NOT average bulls. The last one is what you can expect. The antlers in Mikes booth are ancient and borrowed and none of his clients have even seen an elk or blacktail that even comes close to their size.
So anyway I'll confess for DAMN sure I'm not proud of this thread. I AM proud that I consider my fellow Bowsiters great people and good enough friends, & being a man of principle, I could not let you be mislead. And no... this is NOT my last post. Since Mike finally "stooped to my level" I'm compelled to at least defend myself and reply to his personal insults about Mule Boy and his outfitting business.
In the meantime, if this all sounds like he said/she said (isn't that what reviews are?).... see the link for a good read. Please make sure to read my last post (Joe Ferraro) on page 3 as well as the gentleman below me.
That is a beauty. Sounds like a good experience and a great way to enjoy the ways of the wily wapiti in the wilds of Washington
mule, sounds like you helped bait for blacktail bob the day of his arriuval?
David Bears are a problem, we try to keep our apples piles in open areas where elk like to feed and can see all around them. The bears are still going to eat their but when 25 to 60 head of elk move in they can drive off a few bears. If the area is to tight the bears win. The trick is to have enough apples to feed all the animals in the woods. We are not allowed to shoot the bears over bait or on a piece of property that is being baited. .Mike Vaughn.. Olympic Mountain Outfitters
@ Snuffer: Yes I did sir. He was my client as were all Bowsiters booked that season. Might have been the evening before actually. Can't rightly remember if I did the airport pickup that day or baited but it wasn't there 24 hours prior to the hunt. It's been 2 1/2 years. If I remember right it was that morning.
At Olympic Mountain Outfitters in the 17 years of operation we have had 94% of our clients tell us they were very happy with their hunt and most have either hunted with us again or plan on hunting with us in the future. 4% of them either hunted in extreme weather when animal movement was low Or had a bad hunt due to reasons beyond my control. And 2% nobody should have to take hunting. In past I have noticed that if their is a client complaint it comes from a semi guided hunter that had to crawl through our thick woods in search of an elk and came up empty this has always been the case. Do not book a semi guided hunt unless you are in great shape and can crawl through our woods like a ninja or want to sit in a non bated stand with low odds. This is why we recommend the guided hunt over the bait. Since we have switched tactics about 7 years ago and started the baiting program our guided hunters success rate has been around and above 80% with the exception of three years ago when our 13 day archery season landed in the middle of a heat wave temperatures above 90. Our average temperature during bow season is 74 degrees. I have noticed that during the early bow season on the days that the temperature is below 90 and it doesn't rain we kill lots of elk. Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Sounds great. What does a baited hunt cost and how many days is it.
I read through all this and all I can say is REALLY?
I like to shoot things on occasion. Even went to Africa and shot a few animals out of a blind once. But at least I realized I was just shooting and I never pretended I was hunting.
Now all I do most years is elk hunt. I dream, plan, scout and work out for that one month each fall where I have the privilege to chase elk. This is not elk hunting and elk deserve better.
Sorry but I could not hold my tongue any longer.
All those years of baiting,repeat hunters,great success % on private property. I would expect to see some photos of decent bulls posted. David
Kevin Dunn from CA. was able to harvest this monster Rosie a few years back with Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Nice bull but not a monster. A few years back? What year? Over apples? David
I find it hilarious the amount of people that talk about baiting how and how it isn't hunting. It's just another tactic folks. Hunting elk over bait isn't real hunting? But bugling them in and preying on their bigges weakness, sex, is any different?? I love to bait bears. It isn't about the kill. As we speak, I'm working on tree stands, bait collection for May. I love the very aspect of collecting bait. If you're so sour on it, then don't sit a wallow. Or a water hole and leave the cow calls at home too. Become the purist that YOU believe you are. I love the preaching about the elk deserve better. Ahh yes. They deserve to be shot at longer distances on the ground where the risk of a wound is much larger than out of a stand at 20 yards. I am willing to bet that you've never sat a stand JRB. Much less killed an animal from a stand. As someone who has much experience in this arena, let me be the first to educate you on the fact of, just because it's at a bait, doesn't mean they've lost their minds. I'd argue that preying on their sexual appetite makes them much more vulnerable than preying on their good appetite. And when the moment of truth comes to get your bow, draw it back and complete the shot, it's not nearly as simple as you want to believe it is. You've narrowed the playing field down to 20 yard minus. Makes for a harder task at actually making the shot. Baiting is fun. If you like to work hard, enjoy being busy preparing for the hunt, loading up the truck, then I strongly recommend you try a baited hunt before you cast anymore stones at your BOWHUNTING BROTHERS!!!! Fight PETA, not YOUR OWN KIND!!!!
Drnaln: Ancient. Biggest bull ever killed. Mike insulted the guy too. Said he didn't even deserve a bull like that.
Mike... LOL.... in a study conducted by an independent firm? You quoting percentages? Hilarious really. I know you're new around here Mike but this is Bowsite: Don't make up random numbers man... these guys will spot that a mile away!
I've been wanting to make a quick comment on all of the success rates you've quoted here and elsewhere anyway so here goes.....
Hunters everywhere, and surely Bowsiters, define success rates by the number of dead recovered animals. Olympic Mountain however (nowhere near Olympic or any other mountain by the way)considers any animals that comes in range where a shot is taken to be as good as a kill. Mike would say "That's a dead elk! I did my job & it's not my fault that a-hole missed or made such a bad shot & we never found it" As a result, using round numbers, if 10 guys hunted, 2 killed bulls, 3 wounded but never found them, and 2 others flat out missed, you and I would see a 70% success rate. When a guy like Mr Drummond would ask later that year "how'd the rest of the season go Mike?" That is the answer he would get and, since it appears he hunted THE prime lease, may have no reason to doubt it. One more time: Why do I care? Why am I here? Again.. because nobody despises dishonest outfitters more than honest ones.
Saying I am from Pittsburgh Mike is like saying you are from Seattle. I live in farm country not even in the same county as Pgh. I am proud to be from Pa, as are many Bowsiters. There are lots of great hunters and great people here. There are lots of us all over the west too doing what we love.
"In the 17 years their have been four guides and three camp cooks that I have terminated due to poor performance, differences Or just not a good representative for Olympic Mountain Outfitters. The person giving me a hard time on this site falls under this category"
You cannot be serious!!! Terminated? First of all I wasn't an employee. More importantly you knew I was not going to be a part of that mess you call an outfit somewhere around midway through the season. And in the end you never... ever... even suggested that I wasn't welcome back. Much less "terminate" me. It was obviously not necessary. I walked away without either of us speaking a word of what just happened or what the future had in store. That statement right there is a fine and classic example of the way you operate. Completely false statement Mike and you and all of my clients know it. Sheesh! So do the other employees if you'd like me to send a text or three and have them chime in.
Last (I hope) For those you also mislead (your specialty) about my business: I bought an outfit from a guy who didn't need the money from it. He ran 2 to 4 hunters a year for fun. He had no website, no brochure, not even a business card. In a very short period not only did I pay him off but also accumulated an impressive string of mules as well as some quality saddle horses and all the tack trailer truck and goodies that go with a REAL Outfit. Not just a mini-van to truck rotten apples in and a couple treestands. I grew it, with the help of my 100% satisfied references, to cater to around 45 to 60 clients per year. Every employee I ever had is still a friend. So are my clients... to this day.
Also during that time I managed to have the highest rate of repeat clients in the Bitterroot Valley. I had other outfitters, whom I am also still friends with, call and ask me "HOW THE HECK DO YOU DO IT!" Pretty simple to answer, I just be me and do what I love to do. My camps were IMPECCABLE. So was the food. So was the effort which elk or no elk was always appreciated. Then, as most Bowsiters are aware of, the USF&WS introduced wolves in my back yard. My authorized unit was ground zero for wolf predation. Literally the only unit in Montana that lost it's elk licenses due to wolves. I failed? No... my area went to a draw. We went from unlimited deer and elk licenses to 25 elk permits with a max of 10% for non-res hunters. Since you are so good with math today you know that means 2 licenses. TWO! So I sold everything. Sold the business to my brother who is doing quite well hunting another area & with other activities authorized on the USFS user permit... and I moved on. So, in conclusion, you would have been better served to let me stick my neck in the noose here and retain some respect from the sympathetic souls by keeping your mouth shut. Instead, you gave us yet another fine example of how you have a great way of twisting the truth and flat out making up stories. Pathologic liars (look it up Mike) are also known to eventually believe that their own stories are in fact the truth, as you have done for years with your artificial success rates. Can you dispute one word about me or the story of my business? Nobody really cares but I can give you the contact info for the Board of Outfitters as well as my permit administrator with the US Forest Service, both of whom are personal references of mine. So is one of my competitors who is now a Montana Senator. My level of integrity, although admittedly compromised on this thread, is miles out of your league.
You don't know how to tell the truth anymore. I have nothing against legal baiting but you also don't know what real hunting is either. While on that subject... when we fished for salmon and the fly fisherman reprimanded you for illegal snagging, it was obvious you didn't know how to fish legally either. You are not an outdoorsman. Like I said above, you're a guy with a minivan, an apple connection, a couple ladder stands, and zero integrity. Look that up to.
Yeah guys... negativity sucks. But facts are facts. It's a fact I hate shady outfitters. It's a fact I was railroaded by one myself. I hope that doesn't ever happen to you. My apologies to anyone who hates this thread.... but for some reason couldn't resist reading it. For those who will take another shot at me... if you don't like it don't read it. For those who think there may be some truth to what I'm saying and maybe even appreciate me going out on a limb. Thanks man. Bou you are a wise man buddy!
As they say... it can be a cruel world. Bowsite is just a cross section of it, good, bad, and sometimes ugly.
DConcrete,
I don't find any of this hilarious, only sad.
Scott Jenkins from ID. was also able to harvest a P&Y Rosie In Western WA....Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Call it what you want boys, but it's the same. I may not agree with how you do things, but I'll damn sure stand up to defend you to do it. Baiting is fun. Before you throw those stones, try it. You may find that you like it. Ahh yes archery95, call me ignorant with your exclamation points. Tell me how I'm wrong? Enlighten me as to how?
....."you're a guy with a minivan, an apple connection, a couple ladder stands, and zero integrity. Look that up to."
I will admit it is early, there are still 300 days left in the year, but that quote has a chance for 2014 quote of the year.
And yes I agree. It is sad. It's sad that so many of you are so quick to throw away rights. It's sad that so many of you want to ban more and more things. It's sad that you'll cast stones to harm, rather than support each other. It's sad that you demean others because you think your way is the only way. Anything else is unethical. Get off your high horses both of you, before you fall and get hurt.
I have nothing against hunting elk from a tree stand baited by apples if the state says it's legal. Some of the photos are obviously quite old & was just curious when those elk were taken & if they were taken over apples? David
Nile Swast from Pa. was also able to make a great shot on his hunt with Olympic mountain Outfitters out of his treestand The bull was a 6x6 and scored 276...Mike Vaughn
Mike. Thanks for answering my questions. My last question. Did Blacktail Bob hunt with you & is he on your reference list? I met Bob a few years ago when I was guiding at Arrow 5 Outfitters & believe he would be a great guy to contact if considering a hunt with you. David
DConcrete, I feel the same as you do. Texas is probably the king of corn ! But just because you have a corn feeder, doesn't mean you are gonna connect on a good buck. In fact, most of them avoid corn feeders . They WILL circle 100-200 yd. downwind of them during the rut to see what their nose finds, just like they will go downwind of a crop field or a food plot. Just like they will come in downwind of estrous scent ( sometimes ) . That said, I don't hunt corn feeders much for deer , except to take does at the end of the season when I need to. I use them a lot however to kill hogs, mostly at night. I need every advantage to kill as many as I can ( hence the night hunting ) because they do a lot of damage. Maybe if you are hunting a large unpressured ranch, the big bucks would pour into the corn. I wouldn't know about that. I only feed enough corn to keep the hogs interested and to put them where I can maybe get a shot, but I see no difference in that and sitting on the edge of an ag field or a food plot.
I know lots of guys that shoot bears over bait. That seems to be perfectly acceptable. I don't see much difference between that and what is going on here. Neither one is my cup of tea, and I have no interest in participating in either. That being said, If this is a good fit for someone else, have at it and good luck, I wish you well.
I've never shot an elk. I've been trying. Being unable to move like a ninja makes it tough. I do know other guys (also not ninjas) get them at times, so I haven't abandoned all hope. Going back to Colorado, maybe Montana or New Mexico again in September to give it another try.. Will have to make room for Nun-Chuks in my pack.
It's a fact that you won't call them in in western WA. The close proximity to people, houses etc and the high pressure makes them all but silent and call shy.
Dave..I feel the same way, he would be a great person to contact he seen lost of elk and took pictures of some nice bulls out in front of his blind the day before his hunt and I took great care of him and his wife. As I do all clients. Unfortunately it was in 2011 when we had a heat wave during the early bow season and the elk he was watching walked into the thick woods and never came out until the temperature dropped below 90 sadly his hunt was over by that time. As an outfitter it eats me up inside when a client doesn't get an opportunity at the animal he came for. But in the end I know I have done all I can do. And no one should blame me for the weather. Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
This photo was taken from a elevated box blind at Olympic Mountain Outfitters by a client. This and the next few photos are rare because clients are usually to busy trying to kill the animal instead of taking it's picture and I do not sit in stands and take pictures or use trail cameras at stand location in fear of scaring them off.. Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters..
The Medicine Man had a great hunt with Olympic Mountain Outfitters He was able to harvest this nice 5x5 from a hang on stand.... Mike Vaughn.. Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Pat would be a fool to remove this thread. Best entertainment on the internet! Now that I logged in to get updated, I will log out and check back in tomorrow.
Mule Power,
I say thanks for posting this and outing a poor outfitter. If I was fooled into paying money for a hunt like this, I would be pissed.
I knew everyone would love that, The truth is I am guilty of wacking a bull out of a tree as well. It is a great hunt, a great experience and everyone should try it....I shot this bull out of an Olympic Mountain Outfitters tree stand because We ran out of clients to fill stands. It was The last four hours of the 2013 early bow season their were six empty stand to chose from within a 20 min drive, We picked a property that had two stands on it. I lost the coin toss between me and one of my guides that also had a bow tag so I had to walk the steep hill almost a mile to a stand that had produced two bulls the year before but so far this year my clients that sat their had only seen a cow and a calf meanwhile my guide that works for me got to go to the orchard which has produced many big bulls. This year a client shot one on opening day and other clients had seen and heard other bulls but no one had shot one their in 12 days. When I got to the top of the hill I was kinda sweated up, their were bull rubs all over just as their were the last time I was their and the apple pile was almost demolished but to tell you the truth I didn't have much faith. I had never killed a bull from a tree stand before and this one is only 15 feet off the ground and 17 yards from the apple pile. The stand location is very tight (not a big opening in the woods) and I am more likely to see a bear that I can't shoot than an elk but my clients kill elk hear so I crawled up the tree and into the stand. nocked an arrow and hung my bow on a bow hanger that a client had left screwed into a limb. as I sat their I couldn't help from thinking it would nice to harvest a big bull all though I would be happy to kill that calf mother and put her in the freezer for the family. Pretty soon I noticed I only had an hour to get the job done it was about that time when I heard a calf chirp off in the forest I grabbed my bow off of the hanger and aimed it at apple pile and hid behind my bow, then a snap pop crack just to the left of my tree I clipped my release onto the string and assumed the position, a calf elk walks out right under my tree stand walks away from me, circles the apple pile and puts its head down facing me I hear another snap pop crack and I am thinking come on big sally then I see it, it parted the trees with his horns and walked right under me, I could have lend over and spit on him he was so close. He walked straight away from me and stopped at 12 yards and gave me the most perfect shot but I didn't move a muscle he was very alert then he took two steps and put his head down for an apple that's when I drew my bow, he heard the wheels on my Mathews turning and just as he looked up at me I sunk an arrow into his heart. He went 100 yards down hill and expired. I have killed an elk most every year since I was a teenager mostly cows in the late season with my bow after guiding all my hunters for the year. This bull was just as exciting to harvest as any bull I ever called in for a client or shot myself. I hope I get the chance to hunt out of an Olympic Mountain Outfitters stand location again some day. Again it is a great hunt and everyone should try it one day....Mike Vaughn.... Olympic mountain Outfitters
anyone need a great treestand elk hunt.
This will be my last post for a while.
..Mike Vaughn... Olympic Mountain Outfitters
So where are the bowsite guys (jake, bob, etc.) who are being spoken for by others above.
You know those guys are nothing but professional Bou. Not interested in being a part of this. Look at the bullets I've been dodging. Why would they want to voluntarily line up in front of a firing squad of insults like I did right? I was worried Bob would tear me a new one on here after his half hunt. So I'm still thanking God for his professionalism!
Mike: "The Medicine Man had a great hunt with Olympic Mountain Outfitters" "Again it is a great hunt and everyone should try it one day....Mike Vaughn.... Olympic mountain Outfitters" Is he on your reference list? No! He never hunted with me but he is a personal reference.
Like I said above.... a great hunt is more than a dead animal. Isn't it interesting that now, the one year I was there to witness was THE one & only year where weather was a factor in the total lack of success? The review at the link suggests that is not true.
The other thing I mentioned: One of the best references is a hunter who did NOT punch his or her tag but says it was a great experience and I'd go back in a heartbeat. A big reason why they say that is their genuine feelings for the outfitters and guides efforts and ethics, personalities, and what they saw as far as game. The worst has to be a guy like Jake and plenty of others who say "Yeah, I killed an elk but you couldn't pay me to go back there!" That speaks volumes does it not. There were even employees who live in Washington who asked to come and work for us in Montana and they did for several seasons now. Hmmm
If this is your last post for awhile then it will be mine too. I'd imagine you're on your way east to Wisconsin, Harrisburg & elsewhere to recite your lines standing in front of the racks that honestly represent what clients may have a chance at taking home. Good luck with that Mike. But not with my friends here on Bowsite!
So, are you more proud of the elk or the apples?
I had no idea elk would eat apples or come to bait like that. I thought Washington was the apple growing capital of the U.S. We midwesterners always hear about crop damage, is there a lot of orchard damage from elk?
After reading this thread I wouldn't hunt with either of the 2 "outfitters" in the pissing match.
I think I'm a pretty good judge of character and if I were going on a guided elk hunt, Mule Power would be the first guy I'd call. I don't think you've tarnished your rep at all here. I've never met ya and I'd vouch for ya
That last picture makes me sick to my stomach...what have we come to?
Never would I have imagined that a good scoop shovel would be a hunting guide's go-to piece of equipment, to each his own I guess. But it makes me wonder...I set my 7 year old son on the deck the other day in a makeshift blind of stacked deck chairs and he managed to bag 2 sparrows with his BB gun at the bird feeder 3 yards away. Does that make me a good sparrow guide?
Another great photo from Olympic Mountain Outfitters .....Mike Vaughn
Your "last post for awhile" didn't last very long. LOL.
I don't know Mule Power either…………… but I think I'd go on an elk hunt with him too.
Treestands, bait, elk hunting???????? Probably not for me, especially if I'd be hunting near a main road and houses 75yds away. But for an older fella, like my father, that would probably be the ticket for him. I guess it has it's place. Of course, I have no problem killing a deer 75yds away from someones house either, so what do I know. I guess I just don't think of elk hunting in that context.
But then, elk are where you find them. Ultimately, if it's legal, then have at it.
I have held my tongue for personal reasons.
Mule Power.....don't ever post one of my personal text messages in a public forum again without my permission.
Uh oh........ Lol
I would be pissed too.....
Deleted and my apologies. What was I thinking????? Obviously not a whole lot at the time. Doh!
As wilhille so eloquently stated, "I would be pissed too..."!
Like I said these thing should be handled in Outfitter Reports. That way the finger pointing is limited.
I like a good arguement but online they may never stop.
I feel bad for both sides because obiously some ahrd feelings.
I wish everyone on this post a great year of hunting and happiness!
x2 Bou'bound - that minivan quote has to be in the running for one of the best at year's end.
Integrity and reputation are 2 different things. The former almost always speaks for itself. The latter can be formed in an instant.
In my experience, the more someone goes on about how righteous they consider themselves, the more suspect their righteousness becomes.
Better to keep quiet and let your integrity prove itself.
Better to keep quiet and let someones lack of integrity prove itself.
My opinion.
Worry more about your character than your reputation.
Your character is what you really are; your reputation is what people THINK you are.
I do like that saying can I use that????
The Client that took this photo Was able to pass up this young bull Out of an Olympic Mountain Outfitters stand location.. Mike Vaughn
.......Andy as long as no laws were broken you are a great sparrow guide...
These elk have come out of the hills and are feeding in one of Olympic Mountain Outfitters many leased properties. We welcome them with green grass and apple piles. Their will be no hunting pressure until the early bow season Sep.2nd-14th and then it will be a slaughter. Until then the elk will be getting fat and happy happy happy ............Mike Vaughn ....Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Tags are over the counter
After a client makes a great shot we drag the animal back to where we can load it into a truck using this handy sled. We drag it using either man power or with a truck.... My sled has been getting over used can anyone tell me the name of a product that would patch the holes and cracks in the bottom of it? It is made of a hard plastic. Thank you in advance .... Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Geeze Mike,
I did everything I could to give you the benefit of the doubt throughout this thread. It seems that each post though, makes it harder for me to support you despite you being a Bowsite Sponsor. I'm always rooting for entrepreneurs to be successful, but in some cases they do themselves more harm than good. "...and then it will be a slaughter." What the heck is that???
I'll tell you what it is...a lose, lose situation for you. For those who are arguing (on your behalf) that hunting over bait is a legitimate, fair chase method, your use of the word "slaughter" just slaughtered their argument. For those who have said that hunting elk over bait isn't really hunting you just confirmed their opinions. I've never heard of a guy hunting a domestic pig, but I know guys who have slaughtered hand-fed farm animals.
You can't successfully use the word slaughter and then post pictures of bulls that most on here would consider to be less than ideal in the "inches of antler" category. If it is a slaughter then the bulls on your leases obviously don't get very big. If there are big bulls present (as you've stated) then it must not be as much of a slaughter as you have claimed or else your hunters would have held out for some better quality. You are consistently writing about two-week long hunts, while featuring pictures of rightfully proud hunters posing with their average elk. Then you claim it's a slaughter???
I've told you publicly and via PM that I wish you all the success in the world. That hasn't changed, but as far as this thread is concerned I'm not seeing the momentum shifting in your favor.
"...We drag the animal back to where we can load it into a truck..."
"We drag it either using man power or with a truck..."
Just so I understand this: you drag the elk with a truck until you get it back to where you can load it into a truck?
Mike - (HINT)
This is a thread you want to plummet (HINT) to the bottom of the bowsite thread list, to get lost in cyber-space forever, to not be ressurrected let along kept alive (HINT).
why you keep bringing it to the top (HINT) is crazy man. if you have desire to bring harm to yourself and your business (HINT)there are less public ways to do it.
honestly, if there were not credible people who are acknowledging (HINT) that you actually exist and hunt this way i would believe it is a hoax (HINT) given that so many of your comments are actually self-lobbed hand grenades that are coming back at you like boomerangs
.......Andy as long as no laws were broken you are a great sparrow guide...
Thanks! You answered more than just one question I had bouncing through my head!
I just read thru this thread. As far as baiting goes I don't really care if someone baits or not as long as its not against the law. I have hunted south Texas and just because your sitting on a corn pile doesn't mean your going to shoot a big buck. I never even seen one in a weeks worth of hunting.
The interesting thing to me is. If I were to ever go on a guided elk hunt I had always thought that I would go with Mule Power. My opinion hasn't change after this thread. He has always had good info when discussions come up about outfitters. This one hits home with him so its going to be a sensitive subject for him.
Another great stand location at Olympic Mountain Outfitters......Mike Vaughn
One thing that I have learned from this thread is that everyones definition of "this will be my last post for a while" is really relative! Geezzz....
DJ
Mike, You really need to take Bou's advice and let this thread die quickly.
Elk slaughter??? How fast are you wanting potential clients to run in the opposite direction?
Is that a Smoking or Non-Smoking Box? David
Alwayshunting, you seem to be a master baiter.
I honestly don't see the issue here, well with an outfitter offering baited hunts.
More and more elk are being treestand hunted over wallows, water etc.
Bait/Stands is widely accepted as "normal" for other animals, predominantly black bear and in some places whitetails. It is an accepted, effective and legal (baring local rules) method.
It is HUGELY different from what an average hunter would think when you say "elk hunt" and many elk hunters would never consider this. It's a niche market.
Personally, not interested, wasn't at the very first post, but only because if I am paying an outfitter to hunt, it won't be sitting in a stand and it won't be over bait. Personal feelings. I sit in tree stands enough here for deer. If I am going across the country to hunt an animal I can't see here, it won't be sitting in a tree, it will be run and gun calling in the back country.
Just personal choice.
I would like to answer a few questions that have come up. Baiting for elk is legal in only two states Washington and Oregon. The reason why you don't see it being done very much is because it is a very expensive proposition. And is easier to hunt the animal down then it is to bait it in. Unlike bears, elk come in herds and around here it could be 15 to a 100. If you don't have a semi truck load on hand you may as well give it up it isn't gonna work. And yes it is a full time job. Most hunters could not afford this but as an outfitter in Western Washington we feel this is what it takes to get the job done and we are willing to make the sacrifice so our clients can have a legitimate opportunity to harvest an elk. Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Mike, if, by some act of god, you actually pick up a hunter from this debaucle of a thread...please please let us know who it is, so that we might prepare a Darwin award for said.
I would like to explain the term slaughter. From a client perspective it will be a great tree stand elk hunt and will be very difficult they will have to remain quiet sent free and put time in the stand and not everyone will get one. But from an outfitters perspective it will be a slaughter. In the 13 day season I will lose a total of at least four nights of sleep and there could be as many as four or five elk killed in one day. I will be covered from head to toe with blood for most of the season I call that a slaughter. Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
SitO:
The fans get up and they get out of town. The arena is empty except for one man, Still driving and striving as fast as he can. The sun has gone down and the moon has come up, And long ago somebody left with the cup. But he's driving and striving and hugging the turns.
He's going the distance. He's going for speed.
WOW.... I think you should do as others have suggested and let this thread get pushed to the bottom and beyond. I have been around a number of outfitters and never had one describe shooting elk as a "slaughter." If you want to bait elk where it is legal, knock yourself out... but please don't continue to push your elk slaughters on the rest of us
To answer another question that has come up. Yes Western Washington has elk walking through people's yards, crossing highways, in agriculture fields and just about everywhere except for the densely people populated areas. You can go into the mountains to hunt them but there are less elk up their. It is kinda like whitetail hunting in Michigan except for the hills are bigger the wood lots are bigger and they are evergreens instead of hardwood.... Mike Vaughn..... Olympic Mountain Outfitters
You've obviously never hunted Michigan... Or you have and that's where you learned to bait with apples...
Seminole-
HAHAHAHA!! LOLingMFAO!
Close it with that one.
Seminole, that was perfect!
You said ..... "And is easier to hunt the animal down then it is to bait it in"
Well it's obvious that you have NEVER hunted elk "in the wild" without bait.
You have convinced me (just like all the others) that you are not an "elk hunter"! and most importantly you should NOT be a guide (of any type).
I agree with many others in that Mule IS far and away a much better representative of an elk guide than you ever will be. PERIOD!
THE REALLY SAD PART IS THAT YOU JUST DON'T GET IT!
Several HINTS above and yet you continue to post.
The detractors for this thread are actually helping his buisness. I would venture to say a majority of people on this site would not consider this hunt. However, there are certainly those among us who would regardless of what others think or say. By continuing to help this thread continue, even though you may be making negative comments, you are only increasing the advertising bang for his buck.
yup, I guarantee you the guys booking hunts are not responding on this thread.
This thread is like a car wreck. As you drive by, you know you shouldn't ... but you just have to look.
Mike apparently thinks that by keeping this going, he gets more advertising bang for his Bowsite Sponsor buck. (he may be right)
Some readers think he should let the thread die; so he doesn't keep exposing himself. (they may be right as well)
Others think the rest of us should let it die, because he's getting a lot of free exposure.
I look at it this way: Both sides of this debate (Bait vs No Bait) have been discussed ad nauseam both in this thread and the other one; and both Mike, and a former associate have had a chance to tell their side of the story. Now everyone can make up their own mind about how they feel about all of it.
I say Mission Accomplished. Anyone who books a hunt after reading this, should have a pretty clear expectation of what they will get, and who they are dealing with. It would hard to imagine a scenario where a Hunter shows up and is surprised by the way he will be hunting or by the outfitter he's dealing with.
I like to say: There is an ass for every seat.
If this is what you want, by all means book it, and good luck to you. The other type of Elk Hunters should be happy that there will be less competition for the tags they hope to draw, or the Bull they hope to call in.
We will now return to our regularly schedule debate.
Since nobody else pointed this out; I have to nominate 'Bou for "Best Quote of the Thread":
" Sounds like a good experience and a great way to enjoy the ways of the wily wapiti in the wilds of Washington "
Here's the one and only bull killed by all of my clients. Couldn't find this pic before. This is more along the lines of what you can expect. They don't live long.
"Anyone who books a hunt after reading this, should have a pretty clear expectation of what they will get, and who they are dealing with. It would hard to imagine a scenario where a hunter shows up and is surprised by the way he will be hunting or by the outfitter he's dealing with."
Exactly Ace. Great post.
Actually,I have NO idea if this is a good or bad outfitter.
We have one disgruntled ex-emplyoee.
A few previous clients - good and bad.
Bunch of anti-baiters.
Like I said in the beginning. You had a bad hunt, fill out an Outfitters Report. You don't like baiting for elk, stop reading this thread. He treated you wrong as an employee, file a lawsuit or complaint.
Mike I never met you but if I were to give you advice about advertising in the future - stick to sites that cater to southern hunters. Most of them don't get their panties all in a twist when someone brings up baiting.
That's some good eats right there!
Great idea for settling this once and for all. Everyone sends me $25 for each time he posted to this thread. This will fund the $5200 hunt cost for me and I will cover transportation and if the hunt warrants, the tips. I will provide "live hunt report", plenty of pics, and an unbiased outfitter review. Plus I can put all contributors names in a hat and have a raffle for my apple fed elk meat. PM me for Paypal account info.
I have no issue if it's legal and cant understand why others would. I don't see it much differently than placing a stand on a route into a food plot. Let's stay together instead of divided. If you don't like baiting don't do it.
How is this any different that hunting out of a box over the only water around in South Africa?
Ace- If you look at the beginning of this thread, the "bait vs. no bait" had nothing to do with how this spun out of control. The "bad car wreck" reference is exactly how I would explain me always coming back to read additional posts.
To each his own, I'm just curious if some of the bowsiters on here that I have respect for knew what they were getting into before they booked.
DJ
I think Mule should have taken a little of his own advice and done a little more research on the hunts before booking with this outfitter.
The client of Olympic Mountain Outfitters in the above photo had hunted in Montana with an outfitter for years and had never shot an elk. His brother who also hunted with him had never shot one either until, they came to Western Washington and hunted with Olympic Mountain Outfitters. The first year one of them was able to harvest the small Bull in the photo in the above post. His brother had an opportunity at a larger bull but just couldn't get the shot I think it was too far away and moving. They had such a great hunt with Olympic Mountain Outfitters they immediately booked a hunt for the following year with me. I asked them if they would like to hunt on the same piece of property they hunted before. They told me they did not care they would leave that up to me. So the following year I put them on a nother piece of property least by Olympic Mountain Outfitters to show them a different part of Washington state. Again they sat in a blind overlooking a field saw lots of elk and on the third day shot this crazy looking 6 x 6 slightly wounded another bull equal of size under a 150 yards away from the blind and saw a monster at 380 yards away but felt it was too far away for them to make the shot. I call that a success story and another great hunt from Olympic Mountain Outfitters. ....... But that is a rifle hunt and this is a bowsight so I think we should stick to archery stories. Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Moarch- That was my point, before he put his word behind this outfitter and signed on with him, he should have checked the hunts out a little better. As stated earlier I would not hunt elk over piles of apples either. I hope you and your family had a good Christmas and thanks again for the help with my Ranger last fall. Jeff
I am curious whethet anyone other than Mule Power or someone thst booked a hunt with Mule Power through this outfitter, felt they were misled about these hunts. If you want send a pm and you can stay anonymous. Thanks
Sheesh here goes. Hold on a sec while I put on my helmet. Every time Mike posts people bash him. Every time I posts guys bash me. But when you do that am I wrong to defend myself? Am I wrong to say what I believe? Most if not all of what I said isn't an opinion. I just stated the facts. I didn't say, if you even read my posts, that I was debating the right or wrong of baiting. Actually I did say that I had nothing against it if a guy wants to bait or hunt over bait. If that were the case I wouldn't have had anything to do with Olympic Mountain Outfitters. I will admit that after reading a few posts on the elk baiting thread and considering some things like disease transmission, I feel a little differently.
After I read the posts from Sage Buffalo and loprofile I had to go work on a compressor. Those kind of posts bother me. I take them to heart, that's the kind of guy I am. The whole time I thought, what a mess. But I have no regrets. To say I am just a disgruntled employees shows you haven't really read what I had to say. I was upset because there were people who know me and took my word for things. Then I found out that I had unintentionally misinformed them because I trusted someone else. Is that wrong? If you sold a product or service to friends and the company you worked for screwed them how would you feel? That's pretty personal. Then for people to tell you to shut up, or maybe pay money so they can book a slaughter and see for themselves. Man! :-(
Sureshot: "I think Mule should have taken a little of his own advice and done a little more research on the hunts before booking with this outfitter." Very good point.
First of all someone already corrected you in that I did not book a hunt. But I'll rephrase the question for you.... maybe I should have done a little more research before becoming a business associate. Good point. So please don't get mad because I'm going to answer that. OK?
In knew Mike for several years before 2011. As a fellow exhibitor at hunting shows. We had neighboring booths a time or two. I've spent my share of time hanging out at his booth too. Therefore, what I knew was identical to what any prospective hunter knew which is what the outfitter wants them to know. By the time I considered doing what I did I had heard the lines for 10 years. Keep this in mind too: There were hunters who came to the booth to pick up mounts. They were the happy ones. But the hunters who aren't happy, or downright mad, don't drive to Harrisburg or other shows to go to a booth and raise hell. Makes sense right? So looking back, I only got one perspective when it came to Mike's clients. Is that too hard to understand or believe? I had no reason to doubt Mike. We never had any personal problems.
Then in 2010 he decided that he wanted to expand. People weren't happy to find out that their elk killed east of I-5 weren't recognized by Pope & Young as a Roosevelts. Mike needed properties further to the west for guys wanting P&Y Rosies. Plus he had just found the connection with unlimited apples. But the properties were far apart and so he needed someone with experience to manage them. We came up with a plan where I would run everything on the west side, & book all of my own hunters as well. So I re-wrote the brochure. Mike gave me the content which I still believed to all to be true. I got rid of all the terrible grammar and lack of punctuation, so it was what I was used to: professional. We used that text for the website as well. Mike advanced me enough money to become a Bowsite sponsor and I paid him back. I got him to get his 2010 clients to post reviews to get the ball rolling.
To that point there was no reason to doubt anything he had told me. I'd known him for 10 years! But when I arrived and saw the properties he had lined up I was... way less than happy. They weren't like the pictures. He has that one lease I mentioned, the decent one, owned by a guy named Jack. If you book your hunt loprofile you better make sure that's where you hunt! Jack's mother has some money, Jack isn't much of a hunter, but he wanted to kill elk. So they made an arrangement for Mike to bait him in elk and cover some of the bills, and in return Jack gets to um.... wound elk before any hunters are allowed to hunt there. The place is or was ideal. At the end of a long dead end road. A long way to the nearest gate which gave the public access to the timber company land behind it. They used to leave the gate locked until early the 1st day of hunting season but now they leave it open so there are people right along the back fence at first light which changed everything. BUT... I was told I would have the same conditions. When I showed up it was 1 mile to a gate that got people in behind my lease. It didn't really matter though because by the time we set camp in the junk yard next to the condemned house the 2 or 3 elk that had wandered the place were long gone. He told me he checked it out, talked to the landowner, and it was "awesome". They were also supposed to build a bridge so hunters could cross a large stream to get to the majority of the place. The guy started building when the first hunters were there bringing in supplies with a tractor and just trashed the place. Guys like Seminole and Welka and many more never saw an elk or even a fresh terd. Those guys went into Montana mode and hiked for miles but still, there were no elk or any sign of them to be found. Mike had not held up his end of the bargain. How would I have known? How would I have known ahead of time that I'd be baiting a day or two before my clients showed up when my buddy of 10 years said it would be done per our handshake agreement?
So... how were hunters misled you ask? Does that mean I have permission to answer?
Once we figured out that there were no elk Mike came up with another plan. He would take the semi-guided ones to some other properties including Jack's. He put up strips of flagging tape and told them they were not to cross the tape because the guys who paid top dollar for guided (baited stand) hunts would be pissed. The semi guided hunters were to sneak around behind the guided ones being completely quiet and try to cut off the elk before they got to the fields. Those guided guys said they heard people talking back in the woods but Mike brushed them off saying that was impossible. They knew different and were NOT happy campers. Same on other properties. Hunters were dropped at opposite ends of the lease and told to sneak in behind the stands & not show their faces at the pickup spots until the guided guys were long gone. Then they would come out on the road in the dark and be picked up and taken to a different camp. Yeah.
I hired a cook. Great guy from Michigan. Family man who was a full time taxidermist and a bear guide. He based his entire year around coming west to work. Two weeks before the season Mike said tell him we don't need him. What!!! "I found a guy. He is "the bomb". Owns his own restaurant and everything. Cheap too." You don't have to take my disgruntled word for any of this story. Ask Seminole or Welka, or the guys son, a good kid who came to work for me in Montana the past 2 years! The guy was a drunk. He went to get groceries and didn't come back. When he did he had a stray dog he'd picked up??? I went to pick up hunters at another property. I told the guy to feed the hunters who came back on foot but that I would call him to tell him to put the steaks on for my guys when I was on the way. He never answered the phone. When I got to camp they hunters were staring at their COLD RAW steaks on their plates and looking at me. They knew me so they told me later "we knew the $h1t was about to hit the fan" I went in the guys camper and he was passed out. I woke him up and he asked "is there a problem?" Mike fired him the next morning. Yeah! Guess who the new cook was for the entire season? Disgruntled Joe (Mule Power) Not only managing the camp and transporting hunters etc but food shopping, cooking, doing dishes, preparing showers etc etc. All the stuff I had hired a guy to do and for not a dime extra. Sleep became a thing of the past. By the way... breakfast and dinner were always on time and we ate like kings. I only know how to do things one way.... the right way and/or the way I tell my clients it is going to be. And that's how it will be NO MATTER WHAT.
How Sureshot or anyone else, could I ever have done research to possibly foresee all that?
One more thing and then you can bash the hell out of me if you care to: Mike brought a long time friend named Bill to help him work the shows. Bill had never hunted over bait. He was also a bow only guy. Must be nice right? RIGHT! He was a great guy! Always laughing. Me and him hit it off and told stories of hunts gone by to each other. On the way to Harrisburg they did one show in Wisconsin. By the time they got to Pa though Bill was totally stressed out. Midway through the 9 day show he told Mike he wanted to fly home. He said he couldn't do it anymore. He couldn't stand there and tell hunters the things Mike had told him to say. Mike wasn't happy with his sales pitch either. Too honest. Bill said that he couldn't keep telling them about guaranteed shots, big bulls, and other stuff. He asked Mike how he would deal with the hunters when they arrived and the truth came out. No answer. Mike told him that he had to finish the show to pay for his travel and meals and to cover the cost of airfare home. He said he also needed him for one more show up in Springfield Mass and then he could leave. Needless to say Bill was a mess in Springfield. Hated every minute of it. Mike didn't want him to do the talking anymore anyway so Bill's main job was to be there to help set up and tear down and cover the booth if Mike had to go eat or take a piss.
The thing about that story is this: Bill knew Mike longer than I did. Based on what Mike told him he thought he knew what went on on the road. I knew Mike pretty damn long, and based on what he told me and all those people who walked up to his booth, thought I knew what went on back in Washington. We were both wrong. What we found out is that Mike is pretty good at what he does. What is that? You can answer that for yourself!
Mike's dad worked for him one year. He did shows too and decided that wasn't for him either. He also cooked for a little while. Mike found out he was quitting when he saw an ad in the paper his own dad ran to find his replacement.
Do I sound like the only guy who wouldn't work with Mike again? Do I sound like a guy who simply has a beef with baiting? Do I sound like someone who decided a little too late that he didn't like the job he applied for or that his boss was a little rough to work for? Please.
I'm no different than you guys. I don't want to read this crap any more than you do. I don't like typing it any more than you like reading it either. I come here to learn a little.... and mostly to hang out with the boys and have fun. But remember... I introduced Olympic Mountain Outfitters to Bowsite. I wrote the words you read on his website when you found your way to it through Bowsite. How would you feel? So this is how I sleep at night... by undoing that a little if I can. How does that saying go "I brought you into this world and I can take you out of it"
Not enough? I could type ten posts as long as this one. I'm already an a$$h0le so there's nothing to lose right? Thank God some people appreciate it. I hope a couple more do after learning a little more.
Have a great day and go on the hunt of a lifetime every year if you can.
Mule Power, When I referenced checking out the outfitter before booking hunts, I was referencing the hunts you booked for him. I understand you claim to have written the website, I also understand you booked the hunters in your camp, correct me if I am wrong and I will not be offended. I also am taking from your posts that the hunters in your camp were on semi-guided hunts, correct? I also gather that one of the biggest complaints is that the stands for these hunters were not baited, correct? I have looked at this outfitter website, the website you wrote, and it says quite plainly that semi-guided hunts are non baited, correct me again if I am mistaken.
If you go up and reread my post above you will notice that I asked if anyone other than YOU or a hunter YOU booked felt as though they were misled about their hunt. Thanks, Jeff
Yes Jeff I saw where you asked about other hunters who booked hunts. I was referring to where you said "before he put his word behind this outfitter and signed on with him, he should have checked the hunts out a little better" Perhaps I'm wrong but I thought you meant me, not hunters who booked. And beside Seminole and Welka there were others who felt they didn't get what was promised. They aren't Bowsiters and not so sure they even use the internet.
To answer your other question: I had guided hunters as well. Bow and gun. And you are correct, semi guided hunts do not include bait. Meals and a camp. But they are said to be in areas with good resident elk populations where the outfitter can help us with a game plan to hunt them.
I hope I answered your questions and feel free to ask anymore here or on a PM if you prefer.
I like Jake's post the best. Ouch.
Mule Power, I meant you should have checked things out better. If I am going to put my name behind somebody and make promises, then I am going to know I can deliver. I do not doubt for one moment that you are a good elk guide, as well as a good person for that matter. But, I have not seen anyone other than you and hunters booked by you, for one season, complain about this sponsor misleading them. Not one hunter has filled out a negative outfitter review, nor have you, for that reason I think you are wrong to beat this sponsor up now. Your complaints would have held a lot more weight in 2011, not 2 years later. It would be interesting to see what you would have thought of an ex employee acting in this msnner when you wete a sponsor. JMHO
The only way to get this much drama would be to order all 27 seasons of The Young and the Restless.
I am sorry for the disgruntled EX employee and his friends that have tried to tarnish my image on this site. But as there are no previous clients that have joined them and I know there are many watching. Some have even joined in to defend me. So therefore I am going to continue. Here is another bull killed during the 13 day early bow season in 2013. By a client from Illinois who has been willing to defend me on this post. Pete had a great time on his Olympic Mountain Outfitters guided archery elk hunt in 2013. And you can too in 2014 Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Sureshot: Like an unsatisfied client I just walked away. This is his first thread/post EVER on Bowsite. So The first time I was ever inclined to comment.
Also... what makes you think all hunters use or came from Bowsite? I said I booked SOME here. Most came from shows. Three from here that year and you have heard from two of them. The third left early and hasn't commented. The one from the year before that said he isn't commenting for personal reasons. Then there was the group who posted on Accurate reloading at the link I provided. 9 hunters none happy who saw 1 spike I believe between all of them.
Love to reply to the last part of your post: I have never had a disgruntled employee. The reason is I do my best to do unto others as I would have the do unto me. Most employees are also friends after working for me. A few employees from Washington are also friends to this day as well. If I gave them reason to tell people I didn't keep my word in any way I would be prepared to take my licks.
Nick: You love it you old dog! ha ha I'm smart enough to listen to you these days after realizing that it was you who first figured out that TBM is a genius. I'll say it... you were right man. :-)
And Sureshot, since you're persistent about reviews and seem to think I'm possibly full of it allow me to be persistent as well... here's a group of 5 from 2011 that posted on Hunt Washington. See the link and scroll down toward the bottom to the post from NorthAmBigGameHunter. I especially like that one, it's a classic from start to finish.
While you're at it click on the link from 724wd in the 2nd post down.
14 hunters right there that share my "opinion". Am I still a guy with a personal problem?
This is a fun thread to follow. the funny thing is Mule is doing less damage to Mike than Mike is doing to Mike..........and Mike does not see it. it's comical.
Alwayshunting: Here is a way you can show your good faith and dispell the "stories" about your outfitting business:
Simply print out a COMPLETE list of your clients from last year with contact info or make it available your website. If you are reputable, there should be no problem. I have NEVER met a guided hunter that would not be HAPPY to give his opinion of his hunt, so don't hide beind privacy issues.
I wouldn't reply if I hunted there lol.... I would feel like a douche nozzle!
I was initially on the sponsor's side just because he is a sponsor.Now I just feel disgusted by it all. Especially the no shame about the another great hunt line.... I seriously doubt anyone would use this guy, come on bowsite and talk up this outfitter. I am kind of embarrassed for him and his clients. Not because off the baiting, but for trying to pass this off as a hunt. I wouldn't book this for my daughter. Fire away, I can handle it.
Mule, Thanks that is what I was wanting to see.
It's about time for Mike to post a picture of another happy client with a spike and a mouth full of apple sauce. This s like a really bad dream. Like a big giant baby bird pooping in its own nest. Completely laughable. Reminds me of something my grandpa used to say. "Better to keep your mouth shut and perceived to be a fool, than to speak and confirm it"
This is a photo of a semi guided hunter that hunted with Olympic Mountain Outfitters. He was able to run down this bull in the forest of Western Washington. He walked out of my camp 1 hour before daylight on the first day of his hunt only going by map of the area that I handed him the day before. And harvested this bull 2 miles from camp. My hats off to You Chad from Ohio as there were many clients who thought they could do what you have done and only a few have succeeded. This is why I recommend the fully guided hunt there are plenty of Bulls in the area that can score up to and just over 300 inches but most hunters choose to shoot the one standing directly in front of them. Our woods are thick and intimidating and I have seen hunters throw their hands in the air and say I can't do it. Again I recommend the fully guided hunt out of a tree stand over a bait pile.......Mike Vaughn .........Olympic Mountain Outfitters
I don't think Mule is trying to do damage. It appears he is having to defend/explain himself on here. Which to me I can't understand why he should have to do in the first place.
If I were to ever go on a guided elk hunt Mule would be the first guy I would call to give my business too.
Mike,
You keep referencing "300" inch bulls, yet you haven't shown us a picture of one that was shot with a bow that would qualify for Pope and Young...?
This photo is part of Olympic Mountain Outfitters most Western camp. it is where are semi guided hunters stay and hunt. Also a few guided hunters stay in this camp as well but travel to other properties to hunt. If anybody is interested in a guided or semi guided hunt this year or in the future you can certainly email me and I will give you a list of phone numbers of everyone who hunted with Olympic Mountain Outfitters in the last 2 years including Washington States lieutenant governor and a couple of TV celebrities .........Mike Vaughn......... Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Those would be decent racks on a mule deer!!
Please see my last post.
Thanks!
X2
"You keep referencing "300" inch bulls, yet you haven't shown us a picture of one that was shot with a bow that would qualify for Pope and Young...?"
DJ
I wish Mike would post a pic of a 350+ bull....maybe a few of them. Obviously, that's not going to happen. If he did though, how many people reading this thread and villanizing baiting would look into booking this hunt? That's a rhetorical question because even if Mike could post pics of that caliber of bull those people booking the hunts would never publicize it.
It's just an interesting thought to ponder. Nobody here is going to admit to changing their opinion about this whole situation if the bulls in these pictures were monsters. I can guarantee though, that Olympic Mountain phone's ringer would be able to decipher the difference in activity and it would be relative to the increase in inches of antler.
For those asking about P&Y bulls, why doesn't P&Y differentiate between baited bulls, called bulls, stalked bulls, alfalfa field bulls, private land bulls, water hole bulls, and long-bow killed bulls? I can't answer that question. The fact that there is no distinction is the very reason this outfitter would thrive if the majority his bulls did in fact meet P&Y minimums.
Arctic,
The ONLY reason I mentioned PnY in my post was because he keeps referencing "300" bulls... Yet, he hasn't posted any that are bow kills that reach the PnY minimum of 225"...
No other reason...
Mike, In your first post you referenced 18 hunters last year, 13 of them having shots under 30 yards. 9 elk recovered, 8 bulls and 1 cow, 1 miss, 1 passed on a bull, 2 wounds. Could you elaborate on how many of these hunters were on fully guided hunts. Also seeing 1 of the elk killed was a cow is it safe to assume that 5 hunters did not have any elk at all within shooting range?
Aldo, I noticed in the review Pete posted that he referenced other hunters in camp hearing other hunters near their stands, is this common?
Lastly, 17 years in buisness is a pretty long time, what is the largest bull a paying client has killed in that time?
From pat above.
I also happen to know Mike and he is a great guy running an honest business.
Mike may not want to delete the few negative threads but I have no problem with it.
Pat do you still feel this way......
From: Bou'bound Date: 08-Jan-14
This is a fun thread to follow. the funny thing is Mule is doing less damage to Mike than Mike is doing to Mike..........and Mike does not see it. it's comical.
I have been thinking the same thing! ;-)
If we can get 35 more posts on this thread I can drop the charge for sending me on this hunt from $25 to $20 per post. A 20% reduction. (I am still waiting for the first payment to flood in).
Nick,
I thought your comment about 300" bulls was great. My tangent about P&Y rules was just an aside. It's funny to me me how so many people have such polarized views on what method of hunting any particular species is considered acceptable. P&Y has done what I believe is a pretty good job of creating guidelines. Again, I think your comment was spot on. I was just offering some food for thought.
Mike must be sleeping in this morning.
Arcticchill
The minimum for Pope & Young is 225 inches on a Roosevelt Elk and I have shown a few on this post and I will show more but I don't have to go back to the woods until July so I better save some. At Olympic Mountain Outfitters our clients have opportunities at Pope and young bulls every year. And usually we manage to harvest at least one per year. And other clients have opportunities at them but fail to get the animal on the ground. They didn't get big by being stupid. For a 350 class Roosevelt bull you are going to need to be super lucky or draw a tag in a unit that has a lot of trophies. Then we are back to the issue of having to draw a tag to hunt elk. I do think a hunter should put in for the trophy units and hope to get drawn in his or her lifetime. But the truth is I want to hunt every year for elk and so do my clients and that's why they book a hunt with Olympic Mountain Outfitters. You can buy a tag at Walmart or even NAPA Auto Supply and just go elk hunting. They cost $498.00.non. Res. Mike Vaughn.... .......Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Mike, Any chance you could answer the questions I asked? Thanks
I've been on the fence while following this one, but this last picture sealed the deal. Any hunt I can go on and run across the street to get a snickers if I'm hungry seems like a pretty good deal.
Seriously though, is this thread for real? A "bowsite classic" IMHO. I'm looking forward to the next 900" of harvested elk to be posted, or 8 pictures if you're counting at home.
Baited Elk hunt....disgruntled employee....lol
If you wanted a baited a ELK hunt this one looks fine....I dont see a problem
Mule whatever should give it a rest....he said what he needs to say
Looks like a Shell Station? I have a Shell Credit Card so I want that stand! David
If there were only a hang on stand on that power pole, in the last picture; then maybe I'd pay 5 grand to come hunt at the petting zoo.
04-Jan-14 Mike Vaughn says "Boubound - I would like to answer all questions no matter how silly."
I have given Mule Power a rough go of it, at first I thought he might be a disgruntled ex employee. Hell he might still be a disgruntled ex employee:-) However, after receiving a couple pm's then going back and reading Pete's Outfitter review, I have to think Mule put his neck out and I commend him for staying his ground.
I wonder why Mike answers so many questions but when asked about actual numbers of hunters fully guided in 2013 he refuses to answer. I also wonder why he will not answer a question about Pete's review that stated some hunters in other areas complained of hearing other hunters blowing calls and car doors slamming. I assume he will not respind to that because of the accusations (I believe to be true) Mule Power leveled against him pertaining to this.
I think if you book with Mike, as Mule said, you better hope you get to hunt somewhere other than the places my hunters got. Do you suppose the five hunters that had no shots were the same hunters hearing the other hunters blowing calls and slamming car doors? Do you suppose they may have got picked to hunt the locations Mule Power was referring to? I guess only Mike could answer those questions.
I don't know a single person that would decline a unit 1 AZ tag and those bulls are "in town" just as the picture above shows for the OPs Washington hunt. It's not too different in NM 34 either.
DcoleinPA said Master Baiter!!!!!!
clicking on this thread is like the feeling i get on December 20th when I look under the Christmas tree.
Damn.......Santa did not come, what a bummer......
On this thread I get that same feeling of deep dissappointment when I look at who has posted since I last checked and see that Mike has not added anything else to the thread.
But boy is it great when I see that he has because I know I am in for a treat and a chuckle.
Sure shot
There have been so many negative threads on my post by people who are unfamiliar with Western Washington and the way I run my operation I stopped reading a long time ago and started searching for question marks and I found your question. Out of the 18 hunters the 5 that did not have an opportunity to harvest a bull saw plenty of elk under their stands. A couple of the clients even had spikes and cows at 5 yards. But a lot of the units that we hunt are three point and better. To answer your second question, yes it is possible to hear a person talking from one of my stands locations I have two stand locations that are very near city limits that produce Elk for me every year. And to answer your third question. The biggest Roosevelt bull elk Olympic Mountain Outfitters clients has ever harvested was 292 inches and some change.... Mike Vaughn.......... Olympic Mountain Outfitters
reading this, all I can say is
"Huh?"
& "Really?"
The elk herd that visits one of my stand locations also wander through these peoples yard and mow their grass at least 4 times a month. During the rut a large Bull always joins the herd..... .........Mike Vaughn ........Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Mike, In the outfitter review I refererenced, the review referred to your clients complaining of hearing other hunters car doors slamming and those other hunters blowing elk calls.
In a post above you stated that the stands near town were hunted by clients that knew where they were hunting. If a client knew he was hunting around other hunters, why would they complain about it
Also, you referenced success rates of 80% or better. Could you tellus what constitutes a succesful hunter?
Thanks
What this thread really has boiled down to, as usual, is baiters debating with non-baiters. If you're in the former camp, if legal, it's your right. I'm not asking you to stop doing so. However, if you're still reading this thread, my feelings are reflected in the manner in which I hunt. To date, that has never been over a salt block, feeder, or bait pile.
Did Rowdy Dowdy ever hunt with you Mike?
Sorry couldn't resist....
Popcorn?
The short comment made by Jake tells me all I need to know. The solid and stoic sponsors on this site NEVER have to defend themselves, their actions and clients do it for them.
Yawning with hand on cheek
It makes my guts hurt knowing that some consider this an archery hunt for elk. For those physically unable (handicapped), I get it. For the rest, I'm sorry you are missing what I consider the pinnacle of bow action. On foot, in the elk wilderness, during the rut, bow in hand. Nothing like it!
I have no problems with it, just sorry for what some are missing...
Matt
Is the last picture another one taken by a client from one of your blinds??
I'd be afraid a client might shoot someone's livestock thinking it is an elk!
Sure shot,
I would love to answer all your questions so that you feel comfortable booking your hunt with Olympic Mountain Outfitters. We like to move our clients around to different stand location throughout Western Washington during the hunt and we always have more stand locations than we do clients. God forbid if it should happen but if a client does have a bad experience in a stand location we can quickly move that Hunter to another stand location. Over the years we have learned that our clients have a much better experience when they get to hunt in many stand locations all over Western Washington. There are also a certain amount of clients that once they see their stand location they tell me that's the spot they want to kill their Elk and they choose to stay in that stand location until they do. There are also a certain amount of clients that tag out in the first day or two and then don't get to see many stands locations but get to experience a great fishing trip for salmon or sturgeon or hang out and listen to all the Elk stories at camp and eat great food. To answer your next question my definition of a successful client is a client who fired or could have fired their weapon at the animal they had come for...... Mike Vaughn ................ Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Thanks Mike. I appreciate the answers. Is it safe to assume then, that it would purely be the luck of the draw whether you are hunting near the citu or in close proximity to other hunters?
Also thanks for clearing up the success rate, I always refer to that as the shot oppurtunity rate. What would be your success rate on a P&Y elk?
I am still waiting for a complete reference list. One for this past fall would be fine..........
Or you PM me with one....
Here's another great stand location at Olympic Mountain Outfitters. It has been producing elk and deer for us for many years. The hunting seasons in Washington are very short. Therefore the animals are unpressured and are willing to walk by such a structure.......... Mike Vaughn.......... Olympic Mountain Outfitters
Sureshot
Up above mike indicated that noisy and less scent conscious hunters got city stands where elk we used to nixie and human scent
Sureshot
Up above mike indicated that noisy and less scent conscious hunters got city stands where elk we used to nixie and human scent. "We use the urban stand locations for our clients that are not seasoned elk hunters and have not taken the steps to make themselves sent free or are just noisy. "
I am pretty sure you guys were children at one time.
I'm pretty sure water is wet...unless it's froze then it's not
TBM says "18 shot 13....those ain't that good a odds for baited. I would think a good guide in a good place could get a higher % than that real hunting.
Mike Vaughn says - Since we have switched tactics about 7 years ago and started the baiting program our guided hunters success rate has been around and above 80% with the exception of three years ago when our 13 day archery season landed in the middle of a heat wave temperatures above 90. "
I say - 18 hunters in 2013. 72% or 13 of those had shot opportunities. 50% of the 18 hunters, or nine of them, shot and recovered elk one of them being a cow. 28% of the hunters did not have a shot at a legal elk..
I never thought I would agree with TBM. :-)
I forgot to add what Mule.said - "Hunters everywhere, and surely Bowsiters, define success rates by the number of dead recovered animals. Olympic Mountain however (nowhere near Olympic or any other mountain by the way)considers any animals that comes in range where a shot is taken to be as good as a kill. Mike would say "That's a dead elk! I did my job & it's not my fault that a-hole missed or made such a bad shot & we never found it" As a result, using round numbers, if 10 guys hunted, 2 killed bulls, 3 wounded but never found them, and 2 others flat out missed, you and I would see a 70% success rate. When a guy like Mr Drummond would ask later that year "how'd the rest of the season go Mike?" That is the answer he would get and, since it appears he hunted THE prime lease, may have no reason to doubt it. "
"My word is as good as a signed contract."
Pisses and moans for days...
Cranky1... do you have a bone to pick? My word is BETTER than signed contract. They have loopholes.
You are 1 for 1 on pissing and moaning my friend. Even Mike knows that's 100%.
"Even Mike knows that's 100%". Now that's a good one.
DJ
Well maybe not. Apparently his math ain't all that great.
How do you like me know? lol
You guys are bad... But hears another great photo of a Great stand location at Olympic Mountain Outfitters Mike Vaughn
We also Offer cow elk hunts in the late season at a discounted rate. Mike Vaughn Olympic Mountain Outfitters
After reading this entertaining thread I have an observation and question. The term "great" seems to be overused in describing the stand locations, the shots, even the elk themselves! nothing is good, everything is Great! My question though is this; why would a person need a fully guided hunt if you are going to sit in a box all day in front of a pile of apples? What in the world does your guide do? Guide you to and from your stand? Make sure you can find home base if you drank a little too much in the box? It's a puzzle to me!
Mike says - Bob Russell From IL. shot this bull from a ground blind at less than 20 yards and less than one hour into our 13 day early bow season. The land least he was hunting on is located less than a half a mile from city limits and was only 5 acres big. The town itself has elk walking through the streets and the 2,000 pound apple pile that sits 20 yards from the ground blind has to be replaced every third day during season
The guys doing live hunts in CT are jealous, the outfitters always get the big leases.:-)
All joking aside, 5 acres seems small, do you have agreements with all the surrounding landowners to track and recover wounded animals? .Â
It's hard enough to drag a deer out of someones pool, getting one of these out would be a real chore.
how many openings do you have left for 2014 Mike
Seems to me that none of the "hero" shots include bait, gas stations or the aforementioned rusted out cars. It's almost as though they're hesitant to depict the hunt as it was, perhaps attempting to portray it differently.
This guy however, musters it up and has the stones to take his "hero" shot with the feed bucket next to him.
Ill just leave this here...
"Hell has no fury like a woman scorned!"
Not if you know the background and basis for it in the context of this situation
Must...fight...urge...to...keep...checking...this... thread....
Me too, brother.......thought I had it licked
Any chance of gettin a fresh glass of cider at camp?
"Here's another great stand location at Olympic Mountain Outfitters. It has been producing elk and deer for us for many years. The hunting seasons in Washington are very short. Therefore the animals are unpressured and are willing to walk by such a structure.......... Mike Vaughn.......... Olympic Mountain Outfitters"
You would think with 300,000 pounds of apples and unpressured elk, you should have better than a 72% shot opportunity on any legal elk last year.
Olympic Mountain Outfitters On April 5, 2007, Michael Vaughn signed a plea agreement with the United States Attorney's Office, Western District of Washington. Vaughn pled guilty to one count of conducting unauthorized work activity within the National Forest System (Un-permitted big game guiding operation). Vaughn agreed to a $2,000.00 fine and two (2) years of probation. The probation included, no hunting and to reimburse the United States Forest Service $1,800.00 paid to Vaughn for the undercover black bear hunt.
Just thought this was an interesting tidbit.
Grabbing a slice of apple pie and another cup of coffee. This is going to get even more interesting after SureShot's post.
really that stuff can happen to anyone though. there are only so many places a guy can dump this many apples.
Oh my, "the undercover black bear hunt"? What exactly was that? Sureshot, I have some renters I'm trying to track down to serve, I may be in need of your services. Lol
DJ
Research & Development is working up a Go Pro Apple Mount, should be ready for the 2015 season. The footage will be incredible. Negotiations with a major cable network are proceeding and the search for a host has begun. Sponsors Sara Lee and Marie Callenders are fighting over naming rights. Lazy Boy Recliners supplying official chairs for the soon to be named Pro Staff.
I sure hope the moron who books a hunt with this guy decides to do a live hunt so we can all laugh some more. I can see it now, " hold on guys i hear something coming,sounds like a big one, oh nevermind it was just someone pulling up to get gas"
I want to say thank you to the bowsiters that have booked their hunt with Olympic Mountain Outfitters for the upcoming bow season as a result of this post. I also want to thank the negative Bowsiters for keeping my post on top for the last 13 days. As we have two weeks of bow season and many stands locations we still have a few more archery hunts to book for this year. I will keep posting pictures of stand locations and happy clients of Olympic Mountain Outfitters every now and then for the bowsiters who like them. Here is another bull killed during the 2013, thirteen day archery season by an Olympic Mountain Outfitters client from Michigan. .......Mike Vaughn............ Olympic Mountain Outfitters
I'm surprised how small the bodies look for Roosevelt Elk! I arrowed a young Rosie bull in Northern California a couple years back & the body was huge compared to Rockies I've been around. David
I was shocked to see in the 2014 BSC catalog a hunt that sure seems like this one! I wouldnt think that Neil or anyone affiliated with BSC would recommend this hunt after all the negative comments ive read from multiple sites but maybe im wrong!
There are only two things that puzzle me about a thread like this:
1) How does it ever die?
and
2) How does anyone win?
and they're the same question.
Crankin101, did you mail in your deposit for your elk/bear combo hunt yet? Better hurry up this thread has them filling up fast!
It still blows my mind that Washington doesn't require outfitter licenses for ALL outfitters.
In Montana, Wyoming, Colorado and the rest of the Rocky Mountain states, this thread wouldn't even exist because there would be no "outfitter" to talk about! If you wanted to hang out with Mike Crankin you'd have to schedule a conjugal visit. ;-) Maybe you could bring him an apple pie with a hacksaw blade in it.
Yeah Sureshot... he knows the laws, and how to break them. When we went salmon "fishing" he showed me his snagging techniques. When I asked him if snagging was legal he said "no but I'm allowed to attempt to set the hook 3 times per cast before they can call it snagging"
Mike, No problem, your'e welcome. The least you could do for us, after we kept your thread on top, is tell us the story. It had to be really exciting getting arrested for taking a federal officer on an illegal hunt. In fact I bet that was even more exciting than watching Mark Mills shooting a raghorn on tv.
interesting..................
http://www.fwoa.org/newsletters/sept2007.pdf
Olympic Mountain Outfitters On April 5, 2007, Michael Vaughn signed a plea agreement with the United States Attorney's Office, Western District of Washington. Vaughn pled guilty to one count of conducting unauthorized work activity within the National Forest System (Un-permitted big game guiding operation). Vaughn agreed to a $2,000.00 fine and two (2) years of probation. The probation included, no hunting and to reimburse the United States Forest Service $1,800.00 paid to Vaughn for the undercover black bear hunt.
Nah Muley, Im a public land DIY guy myself.
As for "setting the hook", if youre not creating action with your lure youre not fishin!
how are the bookings this week?
Well, I would think after Seminole's post above, they probably dried up pretty durn quick! ;-}
Candor, this is a zombie thread. You gotta shoot it in the head ! I can't believe it .............
I would like any of you to PM me on the negativity you think should be discussed please and let me form my own opinion of this outfit. I have been thinking about this place lately when Mike first posted but now without reading all the nonsence thats been going on in this thread it turns me off.
I have over 25,000.00 in 6 hunts trying to collect an elk and been with some really good outfitters both in the states and Canada have a lot of expense paid out all good trips for the most parts and shot deer on all trips but no shot at elk yet so I am snake bit so far.
I thought maybe this might be what I need and now all this negativity. pretty darn sad I'd say. PM me if you think theres anything I need to know or send me your phone number that I can call you.
Thanks
Glenn / Cat
If you want an elk that bad just to say you shot one, there are lots of high fence operations out there where they guarantee one. You just have to walk up to them and shoot. I hunted whitetail in IL last year and stayed near one of them. It was owned by a well known bowhunter on tv that has his own show. There were some monsters in there as they would all lay by the road side fence. It was comical to hear about some of these guys that paid $10k to "Bow hunt" an elk and then look at the smiles on their faces in the kill shots. I wonder what stories they told their friends amount the mounts on their walls. To each his own I guess.
While many of you speak with scorn and self righteous indignation of the hunting methods employed by Olympic Mountain Outfitters, there are a couple of undeniable facts at play here. First, there are photos of dead elk with smiling "hunters" behind them. Secondly, there are some gracefully sculpted apple mounds. I believe we owe Mike Vaughn an apology! Mike I hereby dub thee "Master Baiter of the Year" GH
This thread reminds me of the energizer bunny.....it keeps going and going and going......
grayhorse... I do appreciate the fact that you can see through the negativity from some of the people on this site. So I will be happy to post another photo of another happy client of Olympic Mountain Outfitters during the 2013 season....... Ryan Allen from Wyoming shot this bull on an Olympic Mountain Outfitter land lease. He had spotted it from his tree stand location and got down out of his stand, stalked it down and killed it on the 4th day of his hunt. On the first day of his hunt he said he saw a bull he would have been happy to shoot in Wyoming it had crowns on both sides and had a huge body. That big one was out of range but the one in the photo was only at 25 yards and it made him very happy as it was his first Roosevelt elk..... Mike Vaughn......... Olympic Mountain Outfitters
25,000 on 6 elk hunts yikes .... Elk are a species best served for the DIY type guy ,, Todays bow hunters want the shortest way to get there critter ,, Why a guy needs a outfitter for a species he can hunt on his own is so Strange . The idea of bow hunting is learning the critter there feeding habits there strong /weak points hiring a guide outfitter what really has the bow hunter done except throw done his coin so as to get a shot while others have done all the wk .. Louis
Most animals can be hunted by DIY especially if you live in the area they live in. When you don't it's sometimes necessary to let someone else handle the logistics and do the scouting. especially if you have limited time available. A guy who has 5 vacation days is going to be hard pressed to DIY if they live on the other side of the country. Not so strange to me.
bb 5 days even the best elk hunters would say good luck with that any 5 day hunt is a roll of the dice!!!!Most elk hunts guided are running 1000 a day that's insane for a species u can hunt without a guide ,, bow hunting is about learning the species we chase but todays bow hunters want success without the effort. If I call u a elk or hang a stand and u shoot a elk really stop and ask yourself what did u really do on this hunt except pay for the right to shoot , the outfitter has done all the work for you if this is how u want to fill a trophy room go at it , not my cup of tea . I guess I will never understand this use of guides for all species guys hunt ,, to each there own
City hunter...The "experts"can say anything they want and usually do. even many non experts have their say as well. If a guy has a limited amount of time, regardless of what the experts and non experts say. An outfitted hunt is a viable option. Is it better that he stays home because the experts say "Good Luck with that"? Of course any 5 day hunt is a roll of the dice, so is a 10 day hunt. That's not the point.
I never understood why guys play golf at public US courses. The real way to enjoy the sport is the way it was meant to be enjoyed. Commit weeks at time, and 10's of thousands of dollars and go to Scotland and do it the way it was meant to be done. Anything less than the ulitmate is a flat out waste of time and is only done by wimps. It is amazine what some of those guys think is golfing.
saying that a guided wilderness elk hunt is taking the easy way out is a lot different than having issues with a baitpile elk hunt which is taking the easy way out.
I was hoping this thread would fade away but since it resurfaced I don't feel bad about making a quick post.
Grayhorse.... do ya' think he missed the point? Just a little? lmao!
Bou - I think Tiger Woods is the best thing that ever happened to fishing.
Lou
How much time do you devote every year to your elk hunt?
How many kids do you have? How many employees depend on you and your business?
So if I understand you, even guys that love to hunt elk, but have heavy responsibility and/or limited time don't deserve to and shouldn't hunt elk if their only option is to hire an outfitter?
Hunts like the one being discussed do have a place in the world, IMO. For instance, my dad is 73 and has a hard time getting around these days. I could see him doing something like this.
That being said, seeing perfectly healthy, able bodied men smiling proudly in photos with undersized elk and having those photos displayed in the triumphant manner which they have been in this thread really goes against any kind of hunting spirit that I have ever learned.
To each his own, but.... sheeesh. Don't call it hunting. It's target practice using live animals.
I can see were guys are limited on time and use outfitters. I am all for them being able to do that. I like the research, scouting ( internet and boots on the ground), and planning just as much as the hunt.
With all due respect Lou... and I have nothing but respect for you as an elk hunter. I've often thought of PMing you to see if you'd mind if I join you in griz country some day if you want to know the truth. But one thing I think you may not have considered is that not everyone looks at is a lifetime passion like you and I do. I had many clients over the years who already knew it was their one and only elk hunt. Next year they were off to Quebec for bou or Africa or who knows where. They're more like hit and run guys who just want to experience something they've heard so much about from guys like us and hope to maybe actually kill one in the process. They don't really care if they are what one would consider a bonafide elk hunter.
That said... doing a hunt like this doesn't really appeal to those guys who joined me in the high country of Montana. But... there are the few, the not so proud, who are physically able to go on a real hunt but just only really want to pay money to shoot $h1T and go home and tell the guys at the office they are an elk hunter. I hear you there brother.
"there are the few, the not so proud, who are physically able to go on a real hunt but just only really want to pay money to shoot $h1T and go home and tell the guys at the office they are an elk hunter."
x2
Mike- I think ya might wanna go back and re-read grayhorse's post a couple more times! ;-)
Mule Power could you tell me how I can become a "bonafide elk hunter" like you and all your friends from Pennsylvania? Is there a test? I tried to find you on the Montana listing of Licensed Outfitters but couldn't find you. What is the name of your outfit?
Im a sponsor of Bowsite as well and i dont think that being a sponsor gives us any amunity or special privledges.It is what it is.If the hunts are legal its legal,if there is illegal activity beware,just because a guy is a sponsor doesnt mean your covered.As for the bowsite reviews on outfits,for the most part there good,but they are manipulated and padded by some.Posted reviews are given by same persons multiple times and in some cases they are requested by the outfitter only by those that will post a top rated hunt.Getting a five star rateing in some cases means nothing.So in saying that threads with the whole skinny from both ends of the horse are great working tools for bowsiters.Everyone makes their own calls on when ,where and with whom they hunt.Im sure that the long thread here has created the oposite result for both ends of either the pros and cons,People tend to buck trends.
There is NOTHING else that can come from this thread. The hunt is legal, over bait, via an outfitter. Period.
At this point, it's just free advertising.
People will either want to go on it, or not.
PLEASE LET THIS THREAD DIE
Mule- he does seem a bit selective in his comprehension! Bob H - the merit of this thread lies in the debate over hunting styles, bait vs non-bait. Calling vs still-hunting vs tree-stand over water vs food plot (alfalfa field comes to mind) vs wilderness solo bivy vs outfitter wilderness camp vs motel room and restaurant vs barstool bs'ing. It is all relative to me and varies by degree. Certainly there is a wide range of styles to be discussed. Maybe a new thread would be in order. My only comment on the many styles - do whatever blows your hair back. But judge not !!!! GH
I'm on the list Pete. License #9271. But... the truth is being a licensed outfitter doesn't make you an elk hunter. No piece of paper does that. It's in your blood. I know elk outfitters that don't hunt elk and couldn't kill one if they tried if you want to know the truth. They are just business men. Sorry if the post offended you. It wasn't meant to. I didn't make it personal, like your post is.
I'll take a crack at defining an elk hunter: Someone who thinks about it 24/7/365. Enjoys everything about it and not just the kill. Loves the places where the elk call home and the challenges that come with it. Enjoys sharing their passion with anyone else who would like to try it.
I guess you could plug the word deer or any other species I and it would work. I'm sure others could add to that but that's good enough.... I hope.
Bob: I don't think thread could be considered very valuable as advertising.
And Greyhorse... I disagree. If you go back to the beginning I said I couldn't care less what methods people choose to use to hunt. it doesn't affect other people so it shouldn't matter. It's about being honest with prospective clients which does affect others.
Pete: Here's a link to all of the licensed Montana Outfitters in alphabetical order for you since for some reason it's important.
You can also look up some reviews here under Indian Summer Outfitters. You can PM me if you'd like to book a hunt. We are full for this year though. I'd be glad to help you plan a DIY hunt as well. Let me know if you're interested in that bud. Take care.....
Mule - I am with you 1000% on the need for honesty in outfitting and any other human interaction. Absolutely a MUST!!! Crooks cast a bad light on the rest for sure! As to judging the hunting methods, I can easily remember when I was young man full of piss & vinegar and fully capable of running to the top of about any mountain. I looked with disdain at the road hunters driving below.And the guys hiding in the haystack or waiting by a waterhole! It seemed like they were missing the whole idea. Now that I've put on a few miles (and a couple bronc rides gone bad) I'm not QUITE as judgmental. Not saying I've joined the road brigade, but I can start to understand a little more. My 2 cents . ..
apparently there are many different ideas on what "Great" is..... To me this hunt would not qualify as "Great"
That reminds of an old tune......"The old Gray Mare (horse) ain't what she used to be." Ha! Keep on plugging along grayhorse.
My old mule ain't what he used to be, neither am I, but we put a lot of miles on in the wilderness areas of NM & AZ every year. I'm a lucky man for sure.
Steve I devote a heck more time to my archery shooting skills then I do hunting . This year I allowed 9 days reason is I took a newbie ,, hes been on guided elk hunts in new mex, never had a shot on a bull . I could have had a shot first day but stayed back while I tried to get him a great bull ! I enjoy introducing guys into DIY elk mountains . And I know within a few hours if this person likes elk hunting or not . I killed my bull 3rd or 4th day. I got the newbie multiple shots on bulls he just couldn't make it happen !!
NO kids for me I knew early in life that not all folks were meant to have kids !!!
Work I figured my work around the fact that Bow hunting is more important to me then chasing the dollar Im self employed have workers/sub contractors .I will never be rich have no desire to be but I am rich in many other ways , while u guys are chasing the dollar im chasing my passion !!!!
Steve what I enjoy most about DIY hunting is planning maps gps Google earth .Just daydreaming of that one moment ! One needs to learn about the target species ,all there habits there strong points and weak points , when and were to execute your plan comes with trial and error , and when u bugle a mature bull into bow range on public land there is no sweeter sound when your arrow sinks thru his chest and death is quick !!Plus the pack out is so sweet a true test of body and mind ... Ive been lucky and have done some good guided hunts but to be honest my DIY elk hold a higher place in my mind ! reason being it was all me that made it happen !!!
This Topic has been locked. Thank you.
