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Elephants allowed in, polar bears next??
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Contributors to this thread:
Huntcell 08-Mar-18
IdyllwildArcher 08-Mar-18
LKH 08-Mar-18
Kurt 08-Mar-18
Elkhorn 08-Mar-18
Ollie 08-Mar-18
LKH 08-Mar-18
kota-man 08-Mar-18
IdyllwildArcher 08-Mar-18
Franklin 08-Mar-18
Bou'bound 08-Mar-18
Treeline 08-Mar-18
JTV 16-Mar-18
Fuzzy 19-Mar-18
Waterfowler 19-Mar-18
Fuzzy 19-Mar-18
Kurt 19-Mar-18
Treeline 19-Mar-18
Bowmania 19-Mar-18
Kurt 19-Mar-18
From: Huntcell
08-Mar-18

Huntcell 's Link
The Trump administration once again plans to allow trophies from elephants hunted legally in Zimbabwe and Zambia to be brought into the US.

08-Mar-18
The problem is, he can't do it with an EA or telling someone in the Fed Govt to give the permit. It'd have to go through congress due to the Marine Mammals Protection Act. It's been attached to a bill that hasn't gone through a few times, but that was only for bears that were legally killed before the Act was passed.

It's ridiculous. The best science to date has been done by the Canadians and there's no evidence that Polar bears are endangered at this current time. Polar bear, walrus, marine otter, and seals, should be huntable in Alaska by non-natives too. Allowing natives to hunt them betrays the fact that they are truly not endangered and that the entire ban was just a feel-good law. When Emperor geese were put on the ESA, traditional use was also banned. In unit 23 in AK, Dall sheep have no season for even natives and Dall sheep are not endangered - the fact is, the numbers are down so it's illegal even for natives and locals to take a sheep. The fact remains, when numbers actually go down, the government moves in to prevent extinction. Canada has been hunting bears for over 30 years without hurting their populations since the US banned bear hunting in AK. It has absolutely nothing to do with science.

As far as odds of reversing the MMPA? That's not going to happen unless this country gets split in two.

From: LKH
08-Mar-18
Actually, polar bears are probably going to become extinct. Loss of sea ice is accelerating and soon will be incapable or supporting polar bears. Hudson Bay bears have been decreasing their size. Many places have to do bear patrols to keep the bears out.

Walrus have been struggling and are being forced to land far from traditional feed.

Much of the opposition to listing polar bears comes from those who fear it will stop resource extraction or other developments. It's why you should never argue with someone who's job depends on being right.

From: Kurt
08-Mar-18
And what makes LKH the polar bear expert? Reading the (fake) news? Bear numbers are actually higher now (28,000) than anytime over the past 30 years (look up the studies, I'm not going to provide them). People probably think they are starving from what they read...recent personal experience showed otherwise.

From: Elkhorn
08-Mar-18
Manitoba has a very healthy population of polar bears

From: Ollie
08-Mar-18
Bottom line is if any administration is going to change the regulations to be more favorable to hunters, it will be Trump's.

From: LKH
08-Mar-18
Kurt, I'm not an expert and I didn't challenge current populations. Some are high and doing okay. What I can do is read and follow what is happening. I'm also not naive enough to buy the chant of "fake news" used by those who don't like what they hear.

Almost every year we see less ice. I lived in AK for 30 years and the climate is warming, even faster than we thought likely 20 years ago.

From: kota-man
08-Mar-18
The Inuits told me the Polar Bear will adapt whether there’s ice or not. Granted this isn’t some printed piece written by some scientist in New Hampshire, but instead was from the people that live with these bears. Yet with the disappearing sea ice, the population continues to grow....hmmmm.

08-Mar-18
They're not going to go extinct with less sea ice. Much of the population deals without sea ice for part of the year already. Their range may shrink, but they won't go extinct. And they are currently not endangered. Their numbers are fine. And sport hunting some males is not going to hurt the population. All that, even if the sea ice is shrinking, makes banning the hunting of them ridiculous at the current time. And this country banned polar bear hunting in the 70s before anyone ever was talking about shrinking sea ice or global climate change.

From: Franklin
08-Mar-18
Polar Bear populations are THRIVING....actually becoming pests. Man made Climate Change is a hoax.

From: Bou'bound
08-Mar-18
Does Manitoba have a season on the horizon possibly.

From: Treeline
08-Mar-18
There are very conflicting studies regarding the polar ice caps and annual variation of the extent of frozen areas on both poles.

Interestingly, some of the biggest mass extinctions have occurred due to global cooling events (glaciation). Humans shrank down to a very low number and almost went extinct during one of those fairly recent periods of glaciation.

The cycle starts spiraling downward due to more sunlight reflected off of ice and snow as more surface area becomes covered and fresh water gets locked up as ice that eventually results in massive glaciation.

Global cooling is bad.

We are still at the tail end of an ice age. Looking at the geologic record that indicates multiple ice ages with intermediate glaciation and warming periods. Following the cycle, median world temperatures should, hopefully increase. During warm periods in between ice ages, there was higher animal diversity and the planet was able to support higher overall numbers of animals.

Global warming is good!

And this cycle has been going on for millions of years - way before our first ancestors stood upright...

From: JTV
16-Mar-18

JTV's Link
Read this ... hit piece or not ? .... when it comes to hunting and conservation, I like stacking the deck myself .... Link ^^

https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/national-international/Trump-Wildlife-Protection-Board-Has-Many-Trophy-Hunters-477092303.html

From: Fuzzy
19-Mar-18
Treeline, your post is spot-on.

There's a couple of sites near where I live (one in far SW Virginia and one in Eastern Tennessee) which have fairly "recent" fossil deposits.

One is a a salt bog with Pleistocene magafauna fossils (mammoth, saber tooth cats, etc)

The other has a bit older deposits of fossils associated with tropical climates: tapirs, alligators, etc.

The take-away?

Climate changes.

From: Waterfowler
19-Mar-18

Waterfowler's embedded Photo
Waterfowler's embedded Photo
April will be 10 years for me that this has been in cold storage in Canada. He was perfectly legal to import the day I dropped the string. One month later , not legal. The change hasn't saved one polar bear I assure you.

From: Fuzzy
19-Mar-18
Waterfowler that sucks big time. People are dumb. Governments are dumber.

Wow.

From: Kurt
19-Mar-18
Nice bear Waterfowler! Hope you get to bring him down in the next few years.

From: Treeline
19-Mar-18
Congratulations on a great bear, Waterfowler!

Hopefully there will be positive changes for the hunting community with the new administration. Particularly with respect to importation restrictions of non-endangered animals as well as removing restrictions on wolves, grizzlies, and polar bears in the US. Heck, although it is a different issue, I would love to see hunting of seals, walrus, and whales for non-natives as well!

The money provided from regulated hunting of these species provides much needed funding for continued research, development of management planning, and improvements to habitat that does not have to come out of tax payer's pockets.

From: Bowmania
19-Mar-18
In Resolute Bay the natives kill 40 polar bears a year. They reserve 8 to 10 tags (of the 40) for non-native hunters and are sold for a pretty penny. All the money goes into the small town with varying population of 190 to 220. And that's a big deal. If they didn't sell any of the tags they'd still kill 40 bears.

I'd be darned surprised if Canadians weren't sick of American's telling them what to do with THEIR bears.

I'm not going to get into what the natives think of global warming. Let's just say they're not liberal.

Bowmania

From: Kurt
19-Mar-18
Todd, more bears now, limit is 50 this year, up to 15 for non-Inuits in Resolute. The left over licenses go back to the village if less than 15 non-Inuit hunters are booked.

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