Black Gold Sights
Touchy subject (crossbow)
Equipment
Contributors to this thread:
Pumatom 11-Jun-18
HDE 11-Jun-18
JTV 11-Jun-18
Buffalo1 11-Jun-18
ryanrc 11-Jun-18
Woods Walker 11-Jun-18
BTM 11-Jun-18
BIG BEAR 11-Jun-18
Skippy 11-Jun-18
Hunter77 11-Jun-18
Glunt@work 11-Jun-18
drycreek 11-Jun-18
Pyrannah 11-Jun-18
T Mac 11-Jun-18
SBH 11-Jun-18
BigOk 11-Jun-18
Ned 11-Jun-18
longbeard 11-Jun-18
lewis 11-Jun-18
Russell 11-Jun-18
elk yinzer 11-Jun-18
Ned 11-Jun-18
Glunt@work 11-Jun-18
elk yinzer 11-Jun-18
DL 12-Jun-18
Eric Vaillancourt 12-Jun-18
Bowriter 12-Jun-18
Tonybear61 12-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 12-Jun-18
scentman 12-Jun-18
12yards 12-Jun-18
ELKMAN 12-Jun-18
AndrewE 12-Jun-18
LBshooter 12-Jun-18
sportoutfitter 12-Jun-18
JayG@work 12-Jun-18
jjs 12-Jun-18
Chris S 12-Jun-18
Bowriter 12-Jun-18
wilbur 12-Jun-18
RIT 12-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 12-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 12-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 12-Jun-18
Bigdan 12-Jun-18
Shawn 12-Jun-18
Bowriter 12-Jun-18
Live2hunt 12-Jun-18
BOHUNTER09 12-Jun-18
Bowriter 12-Jun-18
Bowriter 12-Jun-18
tradmt 12-Jun-18
drycreek 12-Jun-18
MichaelArnette 12-Jun-18
LBshooter 12-Jun-18
Bowriter 12-Jun-18
spike78 12-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 12-Jun-18
tradmt 12-Jun-18
RutnStrut 12-Jun-18
Killinstuff 12-Jun-18
wyobullshooter 12-Jun-18
HEAD DOCTOR 12-Jun-18
Cowdoc 13-Jun-18
Scout 13-Jun-18
Pintail 13-Jun-18
HDE 13-Jun-18
PECO 13-Jun-18
buckscent 13-Jun-18
midwest 13-Jun-18
Bowriter 13-Jun-18
RutnStrut 13-Jun-18
wyobullshooter 13-Jun-18
Killinstuff 13-Jun-18
splitlimb13 13-Jun-18
wyobullshooter 13-Jun-18
Boreal 13-Jun-18
Bou'bound 13-Jun-18
wyobullshooter 13-Jun-18
TJ 13-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 13-Jun-18
Glunt@work 13-Jun-18
deerstalker 13-Jun-18
Pumatom 13-Jun-18
DanaC 13-Jun-18
Bowriter 14-Jun-18
creed 14-Jun-18
wifishkiller 14-Jun-18
APauls 14-Jun-18
Rut Nut 14-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 14-Jun-18
Outdoordan 14-Jun-18
spike78 14-Jun-18
Tonybear61 14-Jun-18
7mm08 15-Jun-18
tradmt 15-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 15-Jun-18
TJ 15-Jun-18
Ned 15-Jun-18
jjs 15-Jun-18
Snag 15-Jun-18
Bowriter 15-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 15-Jun-18
SteveBNY 16-Jun-18
BOHNTR 16-Jun-18
buc i 313 16-Jun-18
casekiska 16-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 16-Jun-18
JTV 16-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 16-Jun-18
BIG BEAR 16-Jun-18
Skippy 16-Jun-18
BIG BEAR 16-Jun-18
tradmt 16-Jun-18
splitlimb13 16-Jun-18
drycreek 16-Jun-18
Snag 16-Jun-18
Snag 16-Jun-18
WV Mountaineer 16-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 16-Jun-18
SteveBNY 17-Jun-18
Missouribreaks 17-Jun-18
From: Pumatom
11-Jun-18
Been a bow hunter 30 plus years Shoulder is wore out Can get a permit for a crossbow Appreciate any advice Tom

From: HDE
11-Jun-18
Get it and don't look back.

From: JTV
11-Jun-18
No comment ...

From: Buffalo1
11-Jun-18
If you want to shoot a crossbow- then shoot a crossbow.

In the famous words of Dirty Harry, "A man has got to know his limitations."

From: ryanrc
11-Jun-18
The Excalibur seems kinda cool. Bummer about the shoulder. I have held a couple of them at cabelas and they i wouldn't want to drag one through the woods. Maybe you can find a low poundage compound.

From: Woods Walker
11-Jun-18
If getting one meant that I could hunt again I'd do it in a nano-second.

From: BTM
11-Jun-18
Check your state's regs, of course.

From: BIG BEAR
11-Jun-18
I wouldn't give it a second thought....... and I wouldn't seek approval from anyone else. If it's legal and it keeps you hunting more power to you.

From: Skippy
11-Jun-18
Get one and go hunt! Screw the nay Sayers.

From: Hunter77
11-Jun-18
I Second Skippy!

From: Glunt@work
11-Jun-18
A crossbow site might be a better place get info on the latest models. I have met two guys who shoot a bow with one arm and a mouth tab. Both were great shots and successful hunters. I tried their set-up and could hit pretty well at 20 yards right off the bat. They were both very good shots.

Glad you will keep hunting! I don't care to hunt with a crossbow but if the day comes where I can't shoot a bow anymore, I will rifle, handgun and muzzleloader hunt.

From: drycreek
11-Jun-18
I second Glunt. I've thought twice that I might have to use a crossbow, so I bought one, then sold it when I discovered Elite bows. Then, a few years later bought a good used one at a really good price. Sold that sucker too and made $100 on the deal. I never shot at an animal with either of them, but they were deadly on targets :-). They are just too clunky for me to haul around. If it gets to that point, I'll just burn some more powder.

One thing I did learn researching them, you don't have to pay $1000/$1500 for one. Go on AT into the crossbow classifieds and get a good used one and save a bunch.

From: Pyrannah
11-Jun-18
You do you man!

From: T Mac
11-Jun-18
I would check A/T and research one’s in your budget range.

From: SBH
11-Jun-18
Ya I would probably gun hunt rather then drag one of those things around. No judgement here though, do what you want to do, but keep hunting.

You can gun hunt and still create the same challenges for yourself in terms of getting in close. I bow hunt all rifle season from a tree and you could do that while using a rifle or muzzle loader. The one thing you'll miss out on is bugling bulls in Archery only seasons. you could still be out there calling for friends. Its not all about the kill.

From: BigOk
11-Jun-18
By whatever means necessary to continue hunting.

From: Ned
11-Jun-18
lower the draw weight , 45 or 50 lbs is plenty to kill a deer. 50 or 55 lbs with 75% let off. If that's too difficult, it becomes a personal choice. Me? I would have to lay down the bow if I couldn't shoot it any more, I would PERSONALLY hunt with a muzzleloader or a rifle before I hunted with a crossbow during archery season.

From: longbeard
11-Jun-18
The question I have for guys like Ned is why? What is so horrible about a crossbow that you would never consider picking one up even if that’s the only way you could stay in the game?

From: lewis
11-Jun-18
It is what it is my wife had total shoulder replacement surgery a few years back and couldn’t draw her bow without a lot of concern. I love hunting with her so she opted for the x bow she got an Excalibur and never looked back.A lot of deer wished she had just hung it up.Good Luck Lewis

From: Russell
11-Jun-18
Them traditional crossbows have been around much longer than our modern compounds.

What's the big deal?

Back in the mid 70's, mechanical releases were illegal for hunting in NY. Look at us now.

From: elk yinzer
11-Jun-18
Buy a middle of the road model, used if money matters much, with good bolts and coc broadheads and do your thing this fall. The Neds of the world can take a damn hike.

Call a good orthopedic group if you haven't yet. If rehab doesn't work aim for surgery the day after the season and rehab like it means something to you, if it does. If you enjoy toting an xbow around and squeezing the trigger, more power to you and enjoy your victory lap and ride into the sunset.

From: Ned
11-Jun-18
I didn't say using a crossbow is horrible, I said I wouldn't use one during the archery season as a personal choice. I have a personal and spiritual connection with hunting with a bow and arrow. I wouldn't get near the satisfaction of accomplishment from harvesting an animal with a weapon that is held and fired like a gun. There's no mental challenge in it for me.

From: Glunt@work
11-Jun-18
"The question I have for guys like Ned is why? What is so horrible about a crossbow that you would never consider picking one up even if that’s the only way you could stay in the game?:

Nothing horrible about them, they just don't interest me for hunting. I like all sorts of weapons but crossbows and compounds just aren't my thing. I have no issue with someone who would have a hard time pulling a bow choosing to use a crossbow during bow season. I enjoy handgun hunting (open sight 5.5" Ruger Bisley Blackhawk .45LC) and Muzzleloader (Lyman kit .54 cal Hawken copy shooting roundballs) and occasionally rifle hunting (anything from a lever gun to a long range rig). If crossbows were the only way to keep hunting, I might consider one. Fortunately, there are many rifle seasons here where I can use stuff that does interest me if I can't shoot a bow someday. I have a rifle pronghorn tag and a new 38-55 Winchester lever gun that I have been wanting to take on a hunt.

I'm not a fan of full crossbow inclusion during archery season in my state because competition for limited tags, crowding, shrinking land access and constant calendar conflicts with other weapon seasons running concurrent with bow season are the main issues bowhunting faces here. Crossbows wouldn't help with any of those and could amplify them.

From: elk yinzer
11-Jun-18

From: DL
12-Jun-18
Puma Tom I faced the same thing you are. I went to the ortho surgeon and was told what he would do to correct it. It’s at the point it’s hard to put a coat on. Anyway, got a crossbow and used it once bear hunting. That was three years ago. I haven’t hunted during bow season since. I imagine someday I will use it Hunting but it just isn’t “fun” anymore. I have to lube the arrows before I shoot a target. If I don’t the block melts Onto the arrow and takes a gorilla to pull them out. Maybe it’s my age. I just Don’t enjoy Anything about using a crossbow. God help you if you ever need a quick follow up shot. Like any hunting gear do your research on them. Aging sucks especially when your joints have to be replaced or reworked.

12-Jun-18
A long story but here goes. I was in your situation. I had 2 shoulder surgeries on my left shoulder and one on my right shoulder. Frankly, I was just tired of being cut up. I have also had 14 knees surgeries. So, i applied for a crossbow permit.

I went to the doctor and got the paperwork done and sent everything in. It was DENIED due to not a specific enough diagnosis.

I bought a crossbow and started shooting it. It was heavy, clunky, and I just never felt safe. It felt weird trusting the safety. I also did not like putting my fingers in front of the string to load it.

I went back to the doctor to get a more specific diagnosis. While filling out the paperwork he said he could fix my shoulder if I wanted to give it another try.

I said ok, sold the crossbow, had the surgery, and started rehab. I started by shooting a 12 pound kids recurve and eventually worked up to 50#’s over 6 months. After 6 months I could shoot about 12 arrows in a session before it was painful. It has been 3-4 years and I am now headed to Africa with an 80# bow for Cape buffalo.

It is your choice and I have nothing against crossbow hunters. It is just not for me. I do also rifle and muzzleloader hunt and enjoy them all.

Have fun. Life is too short. Do what makes you happy.

From: Bowriter
12-Jun-18
Been shooting a crossbow for 10-years, forced to. Heard all the "Ned speak, crap". Never actually met anyone or heard of anyone who quit hunting rather than use a crossbow. Sounds good but when it comes down to it, mostly methane. Go for it, buy a medium price model to start $500, something along there. Best thing you can get is a cranks cocker. That saves a lot of wear and tear on the shoulder, too. You'll probably hate the dang thing, I do but, but at least you can still hunt. Ignore any and all naysayers. One thing I know for sure, I aint having any more surgeries on either of my shoulders.

From: Tonybear61
12-Jun-18
If allowed in your area look into getting a draw and hold release, you could probably adapt your current equipment which you are already used to. Save hundreds of dollars in the process.

The T shape of a crossbow is lousy to haul over the woods, they are heavy, noisy and you may be swayed by all the info demonstrating they can shoot close patterns out to 100 yds or so (they can). However humans don't have clear eyesight out to that range. (think arrow, bolt obstructions n the woods). A few hunting buddies who converted to this superior weapon found out they didn't like it, used it like a gun and lost the romance and feeling of using archery equip. Thus I would recommend the draw hold option and turning yours down to min. weight, as a well placed arrow at close range is a well placed arrow, it will do the job. Again think of why you stated bow hunting instead of gun hunting in the first place. Wasn't it so you could have close range encounters, see the arrow fly???

12-Jun-18
In many states you no longer have to have a sore shoulder to use a crossbow. They are legal for all hunters during most seasons including the general archery seasons.

In some states, such as Wisconsin and Michigan, most former bowhunters have quit shooting their compound bows and are now hunting the general archery season with the much more efficient scoped crossbow. Crossbow hunters now out number bowhunters in those states. Many retail outlets have converted their archery centers to include huge selections of scoped crossbows. They do this because so many are switching from being bowhunters to crossbow hunters, and where legal, most new archery season hunters begin with the scoped crossbow. You may as well follow the crossbow revolution and join in with the scoped and superior weapon. Buy two today, widely available everywhere real bows were formerly sold!

From: scentman
12-Jun-18
what Big Bear said. JTV keep your no comments to yourself :9) smiley face inserted

From: 12yards
12-Jun-18
Honestly I'm not a fan of xbows in archery seasons. But I will probably be in your situation in the coming years. It will be a tough decision, or maybe it won't.

From: ELKMAN
12-Jun-18
I have zero issues with cross guns as long as their kept in gun season. Where the issues arise is when people start trying to equate cross guns with archery...

From: AndrewE
12-Jun-18
The horror

From: LBshooter
12-Jun-18
Yea elkman, crossguns should never be mistaken with compguns.

12-Jun-18
Keep huntin Tom. If it’s legal and right for you, who cares about the naysayers.

From: JayG@work
12-Jun-18
Right now my shoulder is pretty much shot. I have two severe tears in my rotor cuff and my supraspinatus muscle is torn almost in two. Last year I was hunting with Kelly and I couldn't get my bow back so they gave me a crossbow. I haven't hunted with anything but a bow since 1988, so it felt too strange to me. I had a real nice 9 come in to about 10 yards. I had the crosshairs of the scope on it with the crossbow resting across my knee and I could have killed the buck without even raising it... I just didn't feel right about it so I took a picture of it and let it slide.. I am looking at perhaps a total shoulder replacement and this year may buy one to hunt with. Me personally,, I would rather bow hunt, but it that stops being an option, I will try to hunt with the most challenging tool that I can use which would allow a quick, clean and humane kill of the animal I was hunting.

From: jjs
12-Jun-18
My shoulders are shot (4 surgeries) and several yrs ago I bought my first compound Elite 35, shot some with it but never hunted with it, got a Super Curve Borders 40# recurve and shoots like a 50# w/o much stress on the shoulders, the back muscles are primary used. It put the smile back on and enjoyment back in the field. The Elite hardly put any stress on the shoulder either, is quiet, smooth and quick, may use it when the shoulders really get bad that I can't scratch my head but hard to put the recurve down because of the enjoyment.

From: Chris S
12-Jun-18
Go hunt....enjoy yourself.

From: Bowriter
12-Jun-18
Most of what Missouri Breaks posted is false and cannot be sustained with factual data.

From: wilbur
12-Jun-18
Life is short. The Lord only gave us all so many days to participate. Do whatever you have to do to put and keep that smile on your face. If it's legal who gives a rats azz what anyone thinks.

From: RIT
12-Jun-18
I love the tear soup in these threads.

12-Jun-18
Which parts are false?

12-Jun-18

Missouribreaks's Link

12-Jun-18
Bowriter and others, do you believe that compound bow use has increased since this article, or decreased ? Do you believe that crossbow selection has expanded at retail, or decreased? Do you believe there are more archery hunters in Michigan using compounds, or crossbows?

From: Bigdan
12-Jun-18
If could not hunt with my bow any longer I would hunt with a gun in Montana you can't use a cross gun in archery season

From: Shawn
12-Jun-18
Jay if you have rotator cuff injuries you will need a reverse total replacement and than you will be advised not to shoot a bow unless it is your drawing shoulder. If it is your bow arm than no go as the reverse shoulder replacement may dislocate when drawing a bow of any weight. Shawn

From: Bowriter
12-Jun-18
Well MO Breaks, I'll tell you what the facts tell me. (1) Compound use has decreased. (2) crossbow use has increased. (3) I believe there are more archery hunters in almost all states using vertical bows than crossbows. Ohio, might, I say might because the last figures I saw did not substantiate this, might be an exception. Crossbows usually average across the board less than 30% of all archery hunters in states that have allowed the use of crossbows by the general public for three or more years.

What is commonly seen is this: In the first two years, there is a rush on crossbow purchases. This is primarily hunters who formerly only gun hunted. Then, at approximately year three, that number drops considerably as hunters find it does not shoot like a rifle. This data was made public by GA a few years ago and other states, just legalizing the use, saw the exact same trends. AL was one of those states that saw a return to more compounds than the previous number. Crossbow hunters bought vertical bows.

Now. Here is a major question. Unless a state sells a separate license for a crossbow or a vertical bow, where do they get that data? I'm sure there may be some, but I don't know of one. Those figures are usually provided by someone with an agenda. A hypothesis is advanced and then data is manipulated to prove the hypothesis. It is common in almost every state, depending on who wants to prove what. But...here is the bottom line. Nationwide, the number of hunters in all categories is decreasing at a somewhat alarming rate. To discourage anyone from hunting, regardless of the equipment is a severe case of viewrectitis.

From: Live2hunt
12-Jun-18
WI is a separate license because it is a different weapon than archery gear and they can adjust the season for there use. A good plan, I hope they shorten the X-gun season, not the Archery season.

From: BOHUNTER09
12-Jun-18
I believe I read that more deer recorded as crossbow kills than compounds in Wisconsin in 2017. Data collected when deer killed is registered

From: Bowriter
12-Jun-18
And here are the figures directly from WI. As you can see, they have no way of knowing anything but the number or crossbow licenses sold.This figure is exactly indicative of the trend I stated earlier. It is impossible, I was told, to assign a percentage comparison between crossbows and vertical bows. However, that said, believe what you want. This is directly from the WI DNR. It is a copy paste, not my words. But I will add, my contact there, who shall remain nameless, indicated he had no idea how accurate any of the figures were. I can also add, in my home state, where crossbows havelegal for general use in archery season for over a dozen years, it is "thought to be" roughly 12% of all archery hunters use one. And I can tell you for a solid fact, that is nothing more than guess.

2014-17 Archery and Crossbow license sales figures BOTH contain Patrons and upgrade license sales • Patrons and upgrades are counted twice because they can’t be separated in either group as Patron hunters do not have to declare a weapon type • There was a 13,000 loss in Firearm deer hunters between 2015 and 2016 • There was a similar 13,000 increase in archery/crossbow hunters between 2014 and 2015. Downward trends in individual deer hunters began in the late 1990’s. Nationally, it is well documented that the hunting population is aging and hunters are falling out at a faster rate than recruitment of new hunters is occurring. Wisconsin appears to be retaining and recruiting hunters at a faster rate than most other states as our rate of decline is less than the national average.

Now here is the main question. In what way could the use of crossbows possibly impact you? No state has ever decreased the number of hunting days or bag limits due to the inclusion of crossbows. There is no data to show the wounding loss is any higher. No data to show the accident rate is any higher. No data to show loss of access to hunting land. Therefore, until it becomes illegal to use a vertical bow, how can it matter you what anyone else shoots? I use nothing but open face spinning reels. Some anglers use nothing but casting reels. Some use nothing but spincast reels. Should those be regulated with special seasons? You may laugh but that is a very accurate analogy.

Starting this fall, pneumatic bows will be legal for the disabled, here, during archery only season. They are legal for everyone during the centerfire rifle season. For one reason and one reason only, I am somewhat opposed to their inclusion. That is reason is, it brings us one step closer to the one season-any equipment scenario. In NO WAY, will it impact any vertical bowhunter.

From: Bowriter
12-Jun-18
What may be confusing is this fact. During the 2017-18 deer season in WI, the number of deer killed with a crossbow exceeded the number killed with vertical bows. That does not mean there were more crossbow hunters. It simply reflects the simple set of data: (1) Older hunters, younger hunters and women are buying and using, crossbows more than vertical bows. That is a simple reflection of the demographics of hunters. (2) This is early in that three-year swing period of which I wrote earlier. I have two very good friends in WI who are rabidly opposed to crossbows. Both are outdoor writers. Both admit, they truly have no factual basis for their feelings. However, I have not seen any evidence, either, has "doctored" the data to prove a point.

From: tradmt
12-Jun-18
The reality is this,...if you hunt with a crossbow, you are not a bowhunter, and this is a bowhunting site.

From: drycreek
12-Jun-18
Once again, I agree with Glunt. Right down to the 5.5" Ruger Bisley in .45 Colt. I have a T/C Hawken too, but I cheat and use conical bullets :-). I never took either one of my crossbows to the woods, matter of fact, I never shot either of them over a dozen times each. It just ain't my thing !

Unlike some of y'all, I don't hate them, but I sure as hell won't ever buy another. Too many other ways I can bring home the bacon.

12-Jun-18
?????? that’s what they are for

From: LBshooter
12-Jun-18
I don't like to bring this up but I seem to feel the need to compare. I don't care what you use in archery season, if it's legal than shoot/hunt with it. If it keeps a guy with disabilities out hunting then go for it, it's about the hunt. Now let's compare, Crossbow uses sights, has a trigger and does not force the shooter to hold the weight back.

Compgun has sights, trigger and has a let off allowing one to hold the weight back easier and for longer period of time. Now the diffence I see is that a crossbow has the butt stock which helps to stabilize the shot, oh, but wait, compguns have stabilizers too. It's amazing how these two weapons are so close in comparison when one compares it to the longbow or recurve. Now, as I stated earlier, I don't care what you use, if it allows you to be in the woods hunting and enjoying the outdoors then do it. But, for crying out loud, you compgun shooters beating up crossgun users is a little hypocritical, don't you think. The crossgun gives the hunter an advantage, well I think the case is clearly made that compguns gives the shooter advantages too. So those in glass houses should not be throwing the first stone, eh?

From: Bowriter
12-Jun-18
The reality is, if you hunt with anything other than a recurve or lopngbow, you are not a bow hunter. If you have sights, you are not a bowhunter. If you use a treestand, you are not a bowhunter. If you use a ranging device, you are not a bowhunter. If you have a cell phone, you are not a bowhunter. I have heard all of those and a lot more.

But, on a positive note, the bass are tearing the frogs and flukes up in heavy grass right at daylight.

From: spike78
12-Jun-18
Nothing wrong with a crossbow if needed. I own an Elite Hunter set at 72 pounds and I find it easy and smooth drawing. Pick one up used on EBay and set it at 45-50 pounds and it should not be much of a problem drawing unless your shoulder is totally shot.

12-Jun-18
I think those who propose one season, use any weapon, are on to something.

From: tradmt
12-Jun-18
You should pass that shit around Bowriter, sounds likes its high grade.

From: RutnStrut
12-Jun-18
Crossbows in archery season are fine for the elderly/disabled. But for the able bodied I don't care for them. Funny how here in WI once you didn't need a disabled permit for one, there were a lot more "bad" shoulders. A lot of those guys with those supposedly bad shoulders have no problem playing golf all summer though.

From: Killinstuff
12-Jun-18
Always shake my head at such threads. One fella gets bent out of shape cause he thinks it's a little easier for the other guy if uses this or that to kill stuff with. It's not the weapon morons! It's the hunter that kills stuff and thinking it's easier with this or that is dumb thinking. Dropping the string or pulling a trigger is the smallest part and the end of the process so why do you care what the other guy does???. Don't you guys get that? If you're afraid of what the other is using, get better at being a hunter and you won't need to be afraid anymore. Go about your business, get better as a hunter and you won't have a need to worry anymore that crossbow Joe is going to kill "your" deer. And by the way, it's not a team sport, you get to hunt how you want all by yourself lucky for you. So don't be afraid. And if "your" spot has guys with crossbows all around you also hunting, re-read the line about being a better hunter.

12-Jun-18
Wow, thanks for the enlightenment Killinstuff. I do have to disagree with you though...it is the weapon,moron.

You make a lot of assumptions in your diatribe. Arguably, trad gear may be harder to become consistently accurate with compared to a compound, although there are many dedicated trad shooters that are just as deadly within what many would consider reasonable bow range. That said, even with a compound you still have to use your power to draw the bow. You still have to be able to draw the bow while in relative close proximity to game. And yes, even though it's considerably longer than those that shoot trad, you can only hold a compound at full draw for a finite amount of time. I challenge anyone to show me a compound that I can attach a 6X scope, use a mechanical cocking device, place on shooting sticks, and wait motionless for hours on end for an animal to come into range and simply squeeze the trigger. Those that claim a compound is no different than a crossbow have an extreme viewpoint that most reasonable people dismiss for what it is...nonsense.

As far as being afraid? Sorry, but you're wrong there too. I'm not afraid of a crossbow. They haven't negatively effected my success rate in the slightest. Hell, in my neck of the woods most don't leave the bed of a pickup truck, or their atv, although they certainly must think they're a "bowhunter" riding around with a bolt loaded in their cocked crossbow. So no, I don't worry about anyone else killing my deer, elk, or anything else.

You're correct, as long as it's legal, people can hunt however they choose. Damn sure doesn't mean I have to embrace the idea of an able-bodied person hauling around a crossbow during archery season. If that makes me "divisive", so be it. There's probably a few other things that I don't care for that are legal as well. Won't change anything, and they can do what they darn well please, but that doesn't mean I have to like the fact crossbows are legal during archery season...even though it doesn't have a damn thing to do with being a better hunter.

As to the OP's question, if someone's disabled and chooses to use a crossbow, then that's absolutely what they should do. I personally wouldn't, but that's simply an individual choice.

From: HEAD DOCTOR
12-Jun-18

HEAD DOCTOR's embedded Photo
HEAD DOCTOR's embedded Photo
I have been shooting a crossbow since 2010 because of a disability. I shot a PSE tac15i for awhile but it was just to front heavy and just plain to heavy. Cross bows are a real pain in the butt to shoot. They are bulky, awkward and hard to draw back unless you use a cranking mechanism. You really can't go roving and shooting stumps etc. like you used to with a vertical bow (I really miss this) They shoot to hard and breaking arrows is very common. So I went to a PSE tac10i which was more balanced and about two pounds lighter. It's hard to imagine 2#'s would make a difference but at 70 years old it does. I have a friend (72 yrs. old) that is shooting a Ravin R10. He came over and hunted javelina with me this year and I held his bow to feel the balance and comfort. Man it was light 7.5 pound with quiver and arrows and well balanced. Yes, it's pretty pricey around $1500.00 but I am sure it would last you a long time and a very good investment at the end of the day. It is also very narrow, not cocked about 10 inches and cocked i believe 6 inches wide at the limb pins of the cam. It has a built in cocking mechanism. Do I have one....not yet, but I'm saving for it. I have an Arizona elk tag this year....that's a good excuse, isn't it honey????

From: Cowdoc
13-Jun-18
Pumatom,

I was in your shoes. Actually didn't bowhunt a couple years. Said I was just going to hunt with a camera. Friends pressured me to get a cross gun so we could still hunt together. Think I"ve shot a total of twelve bolts through it, 8 to sight it in and 4 to kill deer. Thing scares the piss out of me, even unloaded. Just had bad feelings about a dry fire occurring with a piece of anatomy in the way. Its heavy, bulky, clanky, and takes forever to reload. As a joke I texted a friend that "I put the crosshairs on him and squeezed the trigger, I love bowhunting".

Finally had the reverse shoulder replacement. A year later couldn't draw my daughters 25 pound bow, but I kept working at it. Killed my first gobbler with a 55# longbow this spring. Hope to never use the Mission crossbow again.

Honestly didn't think I'd ever bowhunt again. The crossbow enabled me to still participate and enjoy hunting with my friends and I was thankful for the game I shot. Don't care what others think or say, do what you want to do.

From: Scout
13-Jun-18
I have had three shoulder surgeries one on left two on right, I went for an MRI yesterday because of severe pain in my right shoulder. If they tell me I need another one, I will buy a cross bow. Do I like the idea, no, but I love to bow hunt and if that's what it takes to keep me hunting I'll do it.

From: Pintail
13-Jun-18
Years ago I jumped off the high horse of being a purist. Longbows and flyrods were given company by crossbows and spinning rods. There are far too many people who have opinions about things they never tried because of peer pressure. Bottom line is, YOUR personal pleasure is yours and yours alone if someone doesn't like your equipment tell them to go elsewhere. Life is way too short to quibble about equipment choice, fill some tags, fillet some fish and have fun doing it. The biggest part of this argument is about selfish people who don't want to share the woods using their choice of equipment.

From: HDE
13-Jun-18
Life is good when you don't give a flying rip about what other people think...

Just to rattle some cages - what would be the discussion if veterans were allowed to use a crossbow, regardless if they did or not and regardless of any opinion they would not, even when they are healthy and physically fit?

From: PECO
13-Jun-18
I tried one, did not like it, and donated it to a good cause. I also got my nephew into hunting with it. If I were unable to still shoot a compound and trad bows, maybe I would of liked it a little more. Give it a try, if you like it great, if not, there is always muzzle loaders and rifles. Most of us like guns too, and probably started with them.

From: buckscent
13-Jun-18
Barnett Recruit is a low priced, light weight, and accurate cross bow..Use only the 4 power scope, not the aim point...

From: midwest
13-Jun-18
There's always the mouth tab option, too.

13-Jun-18
they made them legal during archery season where I live years ago. There are still less hunters every year than when they were not legal. The idea that legalizing xbows will impact archery hunters doesn't fly with me anymore.....it's just not true. I almost never even see another bowhunter much less an xbowhunter.

From: Bowriter
13-Jun-18
It appears to me, with the exception of some hard-ankle purists, the majority has finally come to accept the crossbow for what it is. As a person who testified before our game commission, lobbying to outlaw the crossbow, even for the handicapped, it took me a while to get educated, too. I fully realize, their are some among this assemblage who never will accept change or hard facts. On the other hand, there are some who do, completely understand the role of the crossbow. I find that heartening.

From: RutnStrut
13-Jun-18
"Just to rattle some cages - what would be the discussion if veterans were allowed to use a crossbow, regardless if they did or not and regardless of any opinion they would not, even when they are healthy and physically fit?"

Most of the vets that I know, and I know a lot and hunt with a few. Would not use a crossbow if they were able bodied. Hell a lot of them don't like to take help when they need it. So I think you are trying to stir the wrong pot with this one.

13-Jun-18
HDE, what cages are you trying to rattle?

There are those that simply don’t like the idea of an able-bodied person being allowed to use a crossbow during archery season. On the flip side, there are those that have absolutely no problem with it. Being a veteran or not has nothing to do with it.

From: Killinstuff
13-Jun-18
Wyobullshooter you are simply afraid. I only use a longbow and couldn't care less what the other guy does. I'm guessing MI has about as many crossbow hunters as any state. In three months of hunting, I NEVER see another guy while I'm in the woods and I hunt public land so what's there to be upset about? It has ZERO impact on my experience. If crossbow hunters do have an impact on your experience that's on you. Don't blame the other guy. Become a better hunter and guys won't have anything to cry about.

From: splitlimb13
13-Jun-18
Seems like a lot of discussions are turning arguments over the dumbest crap. If this guy has a bum shoulder and wants to use a cross bow that's his business. Matter of fact I think the only issue I see with the original post is that he made it in the first place,I would not be seeking approval or opinions at all. If it's legal in the state that he hunts that's all that matters. In my state only the the mobility impaired or any legal sporting arm Hunters are allowed to use them, even if it was legal for archery Hunters to use them I it wouldn't bother me in the slightest. I personally would not use it if it was an option,but I dang sure wouldn't care if the others did.

13-Jun-18
"Wyobullshooter you are simply afraid. I only use a longbow"

Say no more. That explains your blind agenda. Now, take a deep breath. Either that, or work on your reading comprehension. I was crystal clear in my post. Crossbow hunters have ZERO impact on my hunting as well. I rarely see a crossbow hunter in the woods on the public land I hunt either. Where's the blame, and where's the fear? I'll put my bowhunting accomplishments up against anyone and have nothing to feel envy over, so I'm not really concerned that some internet chucklehead thinks I need to become a better hunter. And I'm NOT upset, except for your lame attempt to put words in my mouth.

I'll try this again. Those that hunt with crossbows have absolutely ZERO effect on me. That DOES NOT change the fact I am against an able-bodied person be able to use a crossbow during archery season. Period. I don't know how to make my opinion any more simple.

From: Boreal
13-Jun-18
IMHO, crossbows may belong, they just don't belong here.

I wouldn't go on a Catholic Wedding Forum and talk about an up coming same sex marriage.

I wouldn't go on a Christian Faith Forum, ask questions about Muslim traditions and justify it by saying "It's the same thing. We all believe in God."

I know these are poor comparisons. Bowhunting is much more important than religion!

From: Bou'bound
13-Jun-18
Accept embrace welcome them and focus on important things in you life

13-Jun-18
"Accept embrace welcome them and focus on important things in you life"

I can assure you I don't lose any sleep over the fact crossbow are allowed during archery season. I can also assure you, at nearly 65, I fully know what's important and what isn't. Good grief, you guys sound like Hillary, what with the all inclusive, all everything acceptance. Ain't drinking that Kool-Aid, whether we're talking politics or bowhunting.

If someone chooses to shoot an untuned bow, with dull broadheads, and plows through the woods you hunt irrespectful of wind direction, or if there's any other hunters in the area, etc, then I can only assume you accept, embrace, and welcome them as well? After all, how can anyone question how anyone else hunts. Sorry, I don't share that mindset.

From: TJ
13-Jun-18
I've got a torn rotator cuff right shoulder plus other problems. I used to shoot 85 lb bow then had to drop to 55 then to 40lb even that's tough.I bought a crossbow and I'm in the process of setting it up.I got a form from DOW Colorado for permission to use a crossbow for elk.You have to have a doctor fill out part of the accommodations form. I'm supposed to send it in 1 month before hunting.I hunt in Alabama and have killed a lot of deer with a compound since 1971 when I got out of the army.I'll be seventy in September and still love hunting deer, turkey but really want to take an elk.Really hated giving up the compound. Hope it works out. Good Luck!! You can't use a scope on the crossbow have to use red-dot has to be 1x or less.

13-Jun-18
There should be no discrimination, use any weapon, one season, close down hunting when harvest quotas are met.

From: Glunt@work
13-Jun-18
I get that bow seasons are often longer, less crowded and sometimes timed with the rut so its often a good season to be in the woods and I get the desire to continue with that. I know states are different but currently here in CO a crossbow hunter or an ex-bowhunter that can't draw a bow (and chooses not to get a crossbow permit) can choose one of 5 elk seasons, one of 5 deer seasons, seasons for bear, pronghorn, sheep, goat, moose & lion. Some are limited draw, some are OTC. If that day comes, I will hunt just as much, it just won't be in bow season and won't be with a crossbow.

I'm good with disabled people who would choose to get a permit and continue in bow season with a crossbow. They can rifle hunt during archery as far as I am concerned. I get it. But here, and many states, not being able to shoot a bow and not wanting to hunt with a crossbow doesn't mean hunting is over, far from it.

From: deerstalker
13-Jun-18
No problem with the crossbow, just follow state regs. I think we should be tolerant of different implements as there are many anti hunters who would like to shut down all hunters. We need to increase our numbers going forward, younger new hunters, female hunters, older hunters. What ever works, use several different implements during the proper seasons if that works for you!

From: Pumatom
13-Jun-18
Thank you for all the encouragement and advice Don't worry I'll be hunting until I can no longer climb the hills Tom.

From: DanaC
13-Jun-18
Regardless of how others 'feel' about crossbows, a) they are legal in some situations and b) since they shoot like rifles, you'll need to develop some riflery skills to shoot one well. A lot of elitists think that rifles are 'too easy' but you don't see any of those guys taking trophies at Camp Perry...

From: Bowriter
14-Jun-18
TJ-I think AL changed that scope law a few years ago. You might check to be sure.

From: creed
14-Jun-18
I have two massive irreparable tears in my rotator cuff and somewhere not too far down the road I am looking at a reverse shoulder replacement. I can still pull a 60lb bow but that is going to come to an end. Rather than sit at home during AZ's Dec/Jan archery season in the heat of the rut I will shoot a crossbow. I can't imagine missing that fantastic experience when the opportunity to hunt still exists. I don't want to shoot a crossbow but to give up hunting rutting mule deer is not even an option to me.

From: wifishkiller
14-Jun-18
If your dinged up, get one and have fun! Nothing wrong with doing what you have to, to keep hunting!

I shoot just about anything that slings an arrow, killed a pile of hogs with Excalibur matrix 330s.

From: APauls
14-Jun-18
Every couple years I use a 169gr head that flies at 3,000fps. Keep life fun and don't sweat the small stuff. Don't paint yourself into a corner.

From: Rut Nut
14-Jun-18
Do what makes you HAPPY! : )

14-Jun-18
Hunting the hard way is not for everyone.

From: Outdoordan
14-Jun-18
I don't think there is much difference between a crossbow and a compound. Both use sights and triggers. In fact, I think a compound resembles a crossbow more than a trad bow. I personally love hunting with every weapon, and at one time I was an archery only snob. lol. I say go for it and have fun. As above, do what makes YOU happy.

From: spike78
14-Jun-18
I always thought hunting was about being in nature and solitude not about what you carried in?

From: Tonybear61
14-Jun-18
they can shoot close patterns out to 100 yds or so (they can). That is the truth, no- most hunters I know cannot do that with a hand held bow of any kind. Compounds are not crossbows or airbows

Yes it does affect archery seasons and the method of take (just look at WI). It will ultimately change the structure of the season and create some limitations (season length, where used, etc.) for the hand held bow users that don't need to be there.

If they were not such a superior weapon why did the ATA change their stance to no longer supporting them in the archery season???

If you are putting all weapon users in some brotherhood where "anything goes" and its OK as long as you are a hunter, think.... would you do the same for fishing?

That's right, open up my favorite stream, lake, river to any and all methods, all season cause after all we are just fishermen. They should all be treated the same whether people flyfish, net, spear or use traps... In reality we all know they are not. There are limits and specific seasons based on method of take and species.

You know method of take matters. So stop kidding yourselves, just because a weapon launches an arrow doesn't mean it gets universal acceptance as archery equipment. Our forefathers of this sport spent way too much time and effort to get archery seasons separate from firearms. And for good reason. Let's not throw that all away in some plan to make everyone the same for the common good, etc. We all know bowhunters are a different breed always have been.

From: 7mm08
15-Jun-18
I faced the same predicament in my mid 50's. Shoulders were shot from working out and shooting 10-12000 arrows a year out of my recurves. Sat a season out and moped around... the next year wife talked me into accepting the doc's waiver for a CB. Still couldn't bring myself to hunt with it. The next season my wife had a heart to heart with me about how I could throw in the towel and mope around or go enjoy the life I earned and paid dues on. Killed two nice deer that year with the C.B. Go for it. We can't live to please everybody else. They will get old some day... if they are lucky, and be faced with the same decisions and discrimination.

From: tradmt
15-Jun-18
I picked up a nice .308 a while back, has a nice stock on it.

15-Jun-18
The .308 would be very effective during the archery seasons, crossbows are too. Yes our forefathers worked hard, modern hunters however were not satisfied with hunting the hard way, time to reunite the hunting seasons and level the playing field. When harvest quotas are filled, end the season just like is already done with many other species.

From: TJ
15-Jun-18
Bowriter, Yep! In Alabama you can use a higher power scope but in Colorado it has to be 1x or less.I wish Colorado would change that rule!!

From: Ned
15-Jun-18
To those of you who think shooting a compound bow is easy, you've obviously never had to deal with the mental aspects of shooting a bow, which is probably an educated guess of 90% of shooting, then throw in a healthy dose of target panick or buck fever and this clearly details the difference of shooting a bow compared to shooting a crossgun. I've never met anyone who gets target panick from shooting a gun. Maybe a little anticipation, but nothing compared to real target panick. You also don't need to draw the crossgun in the presence of game. It's pre loaded. I have nothing against the crossgun, just don't think it belongs in the archery season, for obvious reasons. States that have legalized their use during archery seasons don't care about any of this, they just care about making more revenue through license sales and so forth. Ohio's deer archery harvest has now surpassed the gun harvest, don't know if that's good or bad, but personally as a bowhunter, I wish they would allow the crossgun during gun season or late season, like muzzleloader for instance, or on private land only. Now that the archery kill in Ohio has surpassed the gun kill, they will probably shorten or they may as well get rid of the archery season all together, which would be a sad state of affairs.

From: jjs
15-Jun-18
Sad situation where bow hunting has come, came up BC (before compounds) and had to work really hard to become proficient to be able to take game, the key word is 'work', just like most things in life ie: sports, job, education ect. Now it is instant gratification with self rationalization to reaffirm one's own justificstion to by-pass the work/effort to put into the hunt. Between bow hunters and muzzle load (one shot rifle) hunters haven't seen the vast technology change. With duck hunting (except motorize dekes) or upland game hunting withjust vast lost of habitat has change these hunts, other wise it still the boot leather and either a double or auto shotgun to get after it. Deer hunting over the years has been a war on killing instead of the hunt. Maybe if I was born during the technology boom of killing deer I wouldn't care either because I would never known the work/effort that had to go into bow hunting, the last of the Mohicans.

From: Snag
15-Jun-18
Words like “tolerate” are creeping into the language of hunters. It’s very simple...bows are weapons that are held by its string at full draw by the strength of the archer. NO trigger, no gun stock, no full let-off, no optics. There is a big difference between a bow and a crossbow. They just plan do NOT belong in an archery season. But big $$$ backs them. And we all know if you squeak loud and long enough you will get some grease...at least that’s the plan with each no device they try and cram into the archery world.

From: Bowriter
15-Jun-18
Bowriter, Yep! In Alabama you can use a higher power scope but in Colorado it has to be 1x or less.I wish Colorado would change that rule!!

It won't make any difference unless your eyes are like mine. The scope in mine is 2x but I never shot over 35-yards so it doesn't matter. Unless you are trying to shoot a group at longer distances, magnification is of no added value. Keep in mind, yes, you can sight a crossbow in to shoot 100-yards. But if you do, you can't shoot 30-yards.

15-Jun-18
I would sight a modern day crossbow in for about 125 yards, kill them way out there!! Archery season at it's best.

From: SteveBNY
16-Jun-18
"Hunting the hard way is not for everyone." That is why so many use a compound. The ONLY reason they use one instead of a trad bow, is because it is easier and they want or need easier. Which is fine with me until they demand that their choice of easier is the bar all must use. At that point, they are a hypocrite - nothing else.

From: BOHNTR
16-Jun-18
"Crossbows are the devil" (Momma Boucher)

From: buc i 313
16-Jun-18
Tom,

I have used long bow, re-curve, and currently a compound. I have no negative issue's with crossbows or those who may use one.

After having rotator cuff surgery 5/21/18, falling on the same shoulder about a week later I'm not to sure I can recover in sufficient time to shoot a bow. At 75 years of age I just do not heal as quickly as I once did. A crossbow may be my only option to hunt this season. (Crossbows are legal in Ohio,) Hopefully I'll recover in / with enough time to shoot my bow, re-curve or compound proficiently.

Health permitting I'll be in the woods. There is a huge "114" I'm after :^}

Tom, you hunt as you wish with your choice of equipment. It isn't anyone's business to judge what implement you use. Good luck, good hunting.

From: casekiska
16-Jun-18
buc i 313 - If I may, I'd like to relate my story and then offer a possible solution.

I'm 73 and have shot a bow right handed since I was a kid.

I severely injured my left shoulder in February of 2017. In late March I had rotator cuff surgery, and then all spring & summer & early fall did the prescribed physical therapy. By mid-October I still could not raise my left hand & arm with a bow to be able to shoot. Then I discovered if I shot as a left handed archer I could draw a 43# bow, aim, and execute a shot. I realized I had two weeks (before the rut & my vacation) to teach myself to shoot left handed with reasonable deer hunting accuracy. I practiced a lot and by November 1 I was able to keep a 6" group at 20 yards. I know that's not great shooting, but it certainly is good enough accuracy to harvest a deer. I will add that in early November 2017 I was able to take a buck and a doe here in Wisconsin as a left handed archer,...both were close shots, under 15 yards,...but I was able to stay in the woods as a bowhunter and did not have to resort to a crossbow.

Perhaps Sir, you could explore this option. Switching to left handed worked for me, it might for you too! (PS - I know what you mean about healing slowly, even a small cut or small strain seems to take forever to get better!)

16-Jun-18
Sure are a lot of health issues with bowhunters. How did we ever make it in the past as a bowhunting culture? Did we try harder?

From: JTV
16-Jun-18
many years back, after a treestand fall, a doc told me he could write up a letter for me to get a handicap permit to use a crossbow.. I told him he was nuts if I'd ever drop that low ... I went out with a walking cast, back/body brace, climbed into another stand killed a big 9 pt with my VERTICAL bow (reduced poundage/different arrows/retuned) and dragged him out myself .....If I was on deaths doorstep, I still wouldnt use a crossbow, I'd go back to my firearms, at least with those, there isnt any hiding what they are ..

16-Jun-18
I think other weapons are fine, but one is NOT a bowhunter if a real bow is not used. Stop lying to your wife, kids and friends.

Good post Jtv.

From: BIG BEAR
16-Jun-18
If you are healthy and you hunt with a crossbow during archery season you are a S.O.B. and I’d like to slap your momma.......

There. Is that loyal enough ?? :-)

From: Skippy
16-Jun-18
I'm surprised there's not more shoulder injuries the way some people pat themselves on the back because they're real bow hunters.

From: BIG BEAR
16-Jun-18
80% let off prevents that. ^^^^

From: tradmt
16-Jun-18
I have been looking in here every couple days just to see this thread. Never disappoints.

From: splitlimb13
16-Jun-18
"Hunting the hard way is not for everyone." I have an idea ! Let's take away treestands ,ground blinds , feeders and food plots! Anyone?? Let's go back to ground hunting. I'd be fine with that too.

From: drycreek
16-Jun-18
LOL @ Skippy !

That's funny right there, I don't care who you are !

From: Snag
16-Jun-18
Why is bowhunting any different then any other sport? If you can’t physically do the activity do something else. Pick up a rifle or a crossbow and pursue game that way. Just don’t use them during the archery season. They’re not bows. Different is different...but in this world we live in there is a bent toward blurring the lines in many areas.

From: Snag
16-Jun-18

16-Jun-18
Missouribreaks, your dumb crap gets old all the time.

16-Jun-18
May as well have one season, use whatever weapon.

From: SteveBNY
17-Jun-18
Missouribreaks - what brand recurve or longbow do you bowhunt with - exclusively?

17-Jun-18
Osage selfbow only for last 49 hunting seasons. Cedar arrows and bows made by me. Exclusively!

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