Mathews Inc.
South Afirca, Scary
International
Contributors to this thread:
SlipShot 03-Aug-18
Dale06 03-Aug-18
Franklin 03-Aug-18
bowonly 03-Aug-18
Bake 03-Aug-18
Bowriter 03-Aug-18
Redheadtwo 03-Aug-18
Robear 04-Aug-18
ELKMAN 04-Aug-18
ELKMAN 04-Aug-18
Bowfreak 04-Aug-18
Buffalo1 04-Aug-18
jjs 04-Aug-18
Bushwacker 04-Aug-18
Buffalo1 04-Aug-18
SixLomaz 04-Aug-18
ground hunter 04-Aug-18
Sitting Bull 05-Aug-18
Rocky D 05-Aug-18
petedrummond 05-Aug-18
Treeline 05-Aug-18
Buffalo1 05-Aug-18
Adventurewriter 05-Aug-18
Adventurewriter 05-Aug-18
Keith in colorado 07-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 07-Aug-18
Buffalo1 07-Aug-18
Ollie 07-Aug-18
Buffalo1 07-Aug-18
Lever action 07-Aug-18
Adventurewriter 08-Aug-18
Adventurewriter 08-Aug-18
AZ~Rich 09-Aug-18
altitude sick 09-Aug-18
Hans 1 09-Aug-18
JTV 20-Aug-18
pointingdogs 20-Aug-18
Ollie 20-Aug-18
Pat Lefemine 20-Aug-18
altitude sick 20-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 20-Aug-18
HighLife 20-Aug-18
Robear 22-Aug-18
DMTJAGER 23-Aug-18
krieger 25-Aug-18
AZ~Rich 26-Aug-18
Buffalo1 27-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
Bowriter 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
Tody 28-Aug-18
jjs 28-Aug-18
JTV 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
Lever action 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
TEmbry 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
TEmbry 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 28-Aug-18
yeager 28-Aug-18
Rut Nut 28-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
PAbowhunter1064 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
jcurri 29-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 29-Aug-18
altitude sick 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 29-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 29-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 29-Aug-18
PAbowhunter1064 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
GhostBird 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
PAbowhunter1064 29-Aug-18
Highlife 29-Aug-18
Highlife 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 29-Aug-18
Highlife 29-Aug-18
Highlife 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 29-Aug-18
TrapperKayak 29-Aug-18
Highlife 29-Aug-18
Highlife 29-Aug-18
Highlife 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
PAbowhunter1064 29-Aug-18
Rut Nut 29-Aug-18
SJJ 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
Dooner 29-Aug-18
Ken Moody Safaris 29-Aug-18
Beav 29-Aug-18
Firehuntfish 30-Aug-18
Stekewood 30-Aug-18
Rut Nut 30-Aug-18
Adventurewriter 30-Aug-18
Buffalo1 12-Sep-18
Griz 12-Sep-18
Griz 12-Sep-18
Rut Nut 12-Sep-18
Fuzzy 12-Sep-18
Dale06 12-Sep-18
Inshart 12-Sep-18
Griz 12-Sep-18
XbowfromNY 12-Sep-18
Fuzzy 18-Sep-18
From: SlipShot
03-Aug-18

SlipShot's Link
I know this is not new, but wow! South Africa's economy has suffered for sometime, how do they not know this is going to make things way worse? Unless I'm missing something?

From: Dale06
03-Aug-18
What’s going on there is the current president intends to change the constitution and take land from white farmers and give it to black people. Or that’s my understanding. I’ve been there twice and thought of going back. I wonder what the country will look like in five years.

From: Franklin
03-Aug-18
It will be a disaster in SA. No way the black landowners and farmers will match what the white landowners production. It`s a recipe for disaster.... if they violently takeover the property, any person that patronizes SA is a scumbag.

From: bowonly
03-Aug-18
Zimbabwe all over again. How do they expect a better outcome? There, the breadbasket of Africa turned into a nation of ruin. I met an 18 year old apprentice PH in Zim whose family was evicted from their farm. He said armed men showed up at their farm house at dusk and told them if they were still there at dawn, they would be shot. They left and lived, but some farmers resisted and died.

From: Bake
03-Aug-18
My PH in 2016 said that legal papers had been filed to evict his family from their farm, but they hadn't been able to prove that the area had been occupied at the time the farm was established, so it was thrown out. Hope they continue to be able to keep their farm.

Interesting stuff for sure

From: Bowriter
03-Aug-18
Got a man on the ground there, right now. This happens to some degree, every time there is an election coming up. Sometimes, it gets deadly.

From: Redheadtwo
03-Aug-18
Sounds like the black/white crap going on here in the USA. I am not trying to start a political fight.

From: Robear
04-Aug-18
I have seen first hand what happened in Zimbabwe. It was horrible. I cannot see how it would be to much different in S.A.

From: ELKMAN
04-Aug-18
Any way to fly into Namibia with out going through Joburg?

From: ELKMAN
04-Aug-18
Sounds like war is brewing. I know I wouldn't give up what was mine just because someone said "hey we think it's time to give someone else a turn that hasn't earned it"...

From: Bowfreak
04-Aug-18
Yes there is Elkman. I think it is through Doho.

From: Buffalo1
04-Aug-18
Atlanta to Frankfurt then Frankfurt to Windhoek. Hotel directly across the street from airport in Frankfurt to get a day room.

Extremely convenient.

From: jjs
04-Aug-18
There already have been some farmers relocating to Russia to farm in fear of their lives. As Robear stated it will eventually turn into a tribal civil war before it is over.

From: Bushwacker
04-Aug-18
Fly Qatar, layover in Doha, then straight into Windhoek

From: Buffalo1
04-Aug-18
August 31 was going to be the ending date for the "committee" to make their recommendations about amending the RSA constitution regarding "land grabbing." The deadline date has now been moved to the end of September to give the "committee" to formulate their recommendation(s) to the amending process of the constitution.

The question is- will the Russians interfere with the amendment recommendation process?

From: SixLomaz
04-Aug-18
Divide and conquer is a universal recipe for political domination success. It works every time and everywhere.

04-Aug-18
It will end up being armed conflict.....

From: Sitting Bull
05-Aug-18
Before they evicted me I'd burn everything I could to the ground and poison the water supply. Leave them nothing. It will ruin South Africa as it did in Zimbabwe. On a less violent tack, When are the black South Africans going to admit that all of the black tribes of southern Africa stole the land from the Bushmen and push them into the desert area's in order to survive? I'm sure the Bushmen would like to have their land back.

From: Rocky D
05-Aug-18
Hmm, wasn’t Obama just over there acting as a frontman just recently. Racial divide, poor economy, and promoting a failed system that is the New Democratic party’s catch phrase... SOCIALISM.

From: petedrummond
05-Aug-18
I believe Lufthansa has direct flights to Windhoek from germany.

From: Treeline
05-Aug-18
Socialism at it’s finest. This is where the Dems policies want to take the US. I have friends in SA and it is getting very bad.

From: Buffalo1
05-Aug-18
Treeline,

Can you be specific about “it is getting very bad” statement? Tks

05-Aug-18
Come on guys...you are spoiling the nice happy lefty ending that had the international liberals yodeling of justice and doing cartwheels...that whole story already has a nice bow tied on it when Mandela was released...turn it all over and surely is a short period of time they will be designing space age jet engines and astonish the world with efficiency and the place will be running like a a swiss watch...come on man get those white devils out of there!!! grrrrrrrrr...............

05-Aug-18
After all all they did was take one of the most primitive corners of the world and turn it into a garden spot.... and considering the remote location a economic wonder

07-Aug-18
Was In RSA in may, there was a farm auction down the road from where we were hunting, The family had been trying to sell this farm for several years with no offers (go figure). Anyway, they decided on an auction, only 1 person showed up and no bids were given! Nobody wants to buy anything if they are going to loose it! I imagine these unsold properties will be the first to go. I was also told by another person, tour operator, that a farm we passed by that was over grown and the building falling down was the first one in that region the government took and gave to someone else. They said after all the animals were killed for food and the crops failed the New farmers walked away and it has been sitting like that for several years. Will get much worse before it gets better.

From: TrapperKayak
07-Aug-18

From: Buffalo1
07-Aug-18
I talked with an RSA outfitter Sunday aft at a wildlife expo. I talked with him at length about the land grabbing issue. He said it is simply the current president posturing for support for next year’s election. Not really a big issue, just a lot of media hype.

So who do you believe is telling the true story?

From: Ollie
07-Aug-18
Just got back from a hunting trip in Namibia. Flew Qatar airlines through Doha airport directly to Windhoek. There are also a few other direct flights into Windhoek which permits you to bypass Johannesburg. Seems like most people that have problems with stuff stolen out of their baggage have connected through J'burg.

The problems in SA are real. My outfitter's father lives in SA so I talked with him a bit about the current situation. He thinks a lot of it is political posturing by the black majority party to maintain their control of the government. He thinks that most people realize that it would be suicide to go the route that Zimbabwe took. They are still trying to recover from the fallout. Namibia does not have anywhere near the racial unrest that is present in many other African countries. That said, they have problems with the government resettling native Africans to farms. They quickly kill all of the game and then trespass and poach from surrounding lands that are managing game properly. We drove through a lot of areas where the natives had settled and they have decimated the habitat with cattle and goat farming. Hard to see how things will get any better given the present political climate of appeasement to native Africaners.

From: Buffalo1
07-Aug-18
Ollie, great feedback from "boots on the ground." Tks

From: Lever action
07-Aug-18
SA is a wreak. A small time on the internet will reveal all anyone needs to know.

08-Aug-18
I take anything from someone who has a great interest ( outfitters) in the idea its over hyped...I talked to a guy recently about his first trip to SA and he said the best week of my life...first five days had the best hunting experience of his life then two guy broke into the parents house killing the PH's elderly parents stealing a little...they easily tracked them down and actually captured them

08-Aug-18
I meant to say best week of my life and worst week of my life...

From: AZ~Rich
09-Aug-18
How many people died from homicide last weekend in Chicago? I heard it was over 40!

09-Aug-18
Exactly, The whole countries annual Homicide rate is probably equal to a busy Chicago weekend.

From: Hans 1
09-Aug-18
Spent a few weeks there about a year ago. The crime and racial unease is very real and is noticed. The outfitting and tourism groups do a good job at hiding it from guests. The crime is very real and much goes undocumented. I did a trip there in 2015 also ,one of the concessions we hunted and wanted to return to had been lost to the restructuring or what ever it is called. Going with a quality PH you should have no problems.

From: JTV
20-Aug-18

JTV's Link
Well crap ... it HAS started .....

https://www.news.com.au/finance/economy/world-economy/south-africa-begins-seizing-whiteowned-farms/news-story/8937f899bd3f131bfc4ffb648ea5c53b

From: pointingdogs
20-Aug-18
Never been to SA. I had hoped to go in a year or two. So my question: They call these "farms". For those of you that have been to SA and hunted..... can you actually farm this land? I was under the impression that some of these hunting operations are only good for hunting and not farming [I am sure that there are exceptions]. Thanks in advance.

From: Ollie
20-Aug-18
It would probably be more accurate to refer to the hunting operations as being "ranches." In general, the land is too arid and probably not fertile enough for truck or row cropping. Cattle/goat/sheep ranching are pretty common. My wife and I got a rental car and drove from Namibia to Victoria Falls. Saw plenty of cattle and goat ranching but very, very few planted crops other than large backyard gardens.

From: Pat Lefemine
20-Aug-18
There is farming in RSA on some game ranches but they are highly irrigated. Some of the best alfalfa fields I’ve ever seen have been in RSA.

20-Aug-18
So far it’s just politics. They are saying no white person should own more than 25,000 acres. And the far left want to take ranch’s over 25,000. But many others in the country remember what happened the last time they did it. I read a lot are not waiting and are headed out now.

20-Aug-18
It’s “game farm” not livestock farm. “Farm” is the term used in Africa not ranch per se.

From: HighLife
20-Aug-18
My wife and I are still going unless there's a full blown battle going on we're in.

From: Robear
22-Aug-18
President Trump has asked Secretary of State Pompeo to closely study the situation.

From: DMTJAGER
23-Aug-18
Reminds me slightly of socialist Argentina in the 80's when the country was in seriously bad financial shape so the PM seized the Falkland Islands to draw attention away from the countries ever worsening financial woes. Unfortunately for the white citizens of SA there is no one willing, at least not yet to come to their rescue. If the blacks do take over most if not all the farms I predict it will end in a large scale if not a nation wide complete collapse in the agricultural out put and wide spread food shortages will occur if not famine will become a very real possibility. Farming, especially large scale complicated farming isn't something to be undertaken by near if not complete novices and not expect it to end in disaster. I know if I were forced to abandon my farm and given 24-48 hours to get out of face rape and murder any equipment as well as ANYTHING I would be leaving behind wouldn't be of much use for very long, and complete novices attempting farming without the benefit of modern mechanized equipment is doomed to failure. After 75 years of one form or another of collectivism and over 100 million people disarmed, rounded up and systematically murdered and every single country who has gone socialist/communist has failed miserably one would think mankind would've learned their lesson. Obviously not. I hope the worst doesn't come to pass.

From: krieger
25-Aug-18
DMT,

I don't think those people learn very fast, if at all. Very bad deal..sounds like the farmers need machine guns and lot of ammo to rebuff the brute mob mentality.

From: AZ~Rich
26-Aug-18
Sorry, I just had a vision of that old movie "Zulu" with Michael Cain fending off thousands of warriors who came in waves.

From: Buffalo1
27-Aug-18

Buffalo1's Link
Just found this on Facebook and also on Africanhunting.com. It might be of interest to some folks.

From: TrapperKayak
28-Aug-18
When I went last year, there was some of the farm takeover occurring and the PHs were talking about it and some murders that had taken place. Glad I went when I did, and would not think of taking my wife there. She would have hated it anyway. Maybe to the Nat. parks but not to where I hunted. Would have bored the snot outta her. They spoke of this president as being a complete moron.

28-Aug-18
I’m there with my family every year for months and travel all over SA. This year we were in the Waterberg, North West, Salt Rock Beach, Durban, and Johannesburg. We stayed four days in Johannesburg and had a wonderful time driving thru the city and everything :) I wouldn’t believe all this hype. The land situation has been going on since 1998. If all of your negative information is coming from some PH then I’d advise broadening your perspective. Believe it or not there are Americans who think our president is a moron and that the US will crash and burn any day now.

28-Aug-18

Ken Moody Safaris's Link

28-Aug-18
Here’s a family archery hunt with follow on eco tour we did this July. These guys took 18 animals and had a great adventure. We traveled from the Waterberg Mountains to the lowveldt outside of Phalaborwa. Everything went splendidly.

From: Bowriter
28-Aug-18
As of a news release yesterday, 8-26, figures show they are killiing one white landowner, every five days with no reprisal.

28-Aug-18

Ken Moody Safaris's embedded Photo
Ken Moody Safaris's embedded Photo
Yep, there’s violence everywhere.

From: TrapperKayak
28-Aug-18
There's one big difference though. In Chicago, it's mostly intra-racial, and in SA, it's inter... Just saying. We understand your stance in defense of taking families to SA to hunt and have a good time, since its your way of life, but facts are facts, no one I know is taking their family to the south side of Chicago on vacation.

28-Aug-18
Facts are facts and you’ll find damned few “facts” in this thread. Mostly a lot of fear mongering. People work, visit, and vacation in Chicago all the time. Why? Aren’t they afraid for their lives :)

From: Tody
28-Aug-18
I live near Chicago and bad stuff happens every day, however I try to stay out of the problem areas. In general if you stay away from the crime infested neighborhoods you should be okay. It is however not a guarantee since some of the offenders like to travel and find easy pray. I imagine SA can be similar in that sense.

From: jjs
28-Aug-18
'Farmland' on youtube watched it several days ago describing what is happening in SA.

Just read on Zerohedge.com where the SA government just pass a law for gun confiscation which will lead to tyranny, bad situation for the white people and Obama was just recently there praising the SA Prime Minister.

From: JTV
28-Aug-18

JTV's Link
https://www.zerohedge.com/news/2018-08-27/south-africa-civil-war-looms-white-farmers-black-hitler-willing-die-over-property

28-Aug-18

Ken Moody Safaris's embedded Photo
Ken Moody Safaris's embedded Photo
Yea, ok...

28-Aug-18
While some hide under their beds others enjoy the beauty and spectacular hunting and touring found in South Africa.

From: Lever action
28-Aug-18
NOBODY is paying to visit the west side of Chicago! ANYONE offering vacations on the west side of Chicago would be assumed an idiot!

Geez! :D

28-Aug-18
In 2016 Chicago recorded 765 murders. Cape Town, South Africa’s most dangerous city, had 61. We tour Cape Town all the time but we don’t offer tours to its worst areas. If you’re looking for a reason to bury your head and stay home you can always find one.

From: TEmbry
28-Aug-18
I think the point that has many people rightfully nervous is the fact that the very places being targeted for these attacks are the farms where you are paying thousands of dollars to go. I have zero interest in hunting SA so it’s a moot point to me. Just find it curious how some act as though it’s ridiculous to even be concerned.

I probably have a higher statistical chance of dying on an October Mtn goat hunt or spot and stalk grizzly than being murdered in SA, it’s not keeping me from going but I also certainly admit it’s a risky activity.

28-Aug-18
“...places being targeted...are the farms where you are paying thousands of dollars to go.” This statement is false. Any farm attacks being carried out are generally occurring on agricultural farms or are random attacks of retribution. Game farms are not being specifically targeted. Your statement is misleading and again, simply not true.

From: TEmbry
28-Aug-18
Literally ten posts ago you stated farm is the term of use for game ranches. There are even articles quoting an owner of a game ranch about how his is next in line for forfeiture.

I’m not a doomsdayer but I think it’s disingenous to act like there is nothing to see here please move along. Admitting the risk (however small) and stating how your operations mitigate these risks would be a better approach IMO.

28-Aug-18
Farm can be ag or game. Additionally, you are conflating land claims with farm attacks which is itself disingenuous and not necessarily related. Also, “articles” are subjective. Look at that Zero Hedge garbage just posted. I’m expecting Alex Jones to be quoted next. People like to believe and report doom and gloom for some reason. I suppose it relieves boredom. I’ve spent over 3000 days in Africa most of it in the bush and I’ve never been subjected to anything crime related. I seriously doubt anyone here that’s traveled and hunted SA has either.

From: yeager
28-Aug-18
Just got back from South Africa on August 23. Flew into Johannesburg and then spent the first 9 days traveling through Botswana and up to Victoria Falls and back. Then bowhunted for another 10 days in South Africa just north of Ellisras. Never had any bad issues what so ever. In fact, my wife and I have already booked another 10 day hunt for 2020, and will also do a 5 day Safaris to Kruger National Park.

From: Rut Nut
28-Aug-18
With all due respect, if I wanted unbiased information about Africa, the LAST person I would ask is someone who makes a living SELLING hunts/tours in Africa.

29-Aug-18
No, better to get it from the internet then from a fellow American who lives there four to five months of the year. If you think I’d risk the safety of my family, friends, and clients for a buck then you’re quite the sad, cynical individual. With all due respect...

29-Aug-18

Ken Moody Safaris's embedded Photo
Ken Moody Safaris's embedded Photo
Here’s my son in Zululand. Can’t believe I took him to spooky SA. Somebody call child services. He’s the one in the middle, btw :)

29-Aug-18

PAbowhunter1064's Link
Pretty good documentary piece here...I'm sure there's nothing at all to worry about. If you don't feel like listening to this poor woman's horrific story, just fast forward to about the 5:42 mark.

Great picture Ken...certainly no reason for child services to be called, but your son's skin color (the one in the middle), is what the SA government seems to be having such a problem with. Btw...I've never been to Africa, but I did go on the safari at Wild Animal Kingdom last year. ;-)

29-Aug-18
Maybe I can link the sad stories of Americans killed by illegal immigrants right here in the US. Same effect but doesn’t disway me from traveling through out the US.

From: jcurri
29-Aug-18
I live in Chicago. The actual city and not the burbs. I've been here for 21 years and never had a problem. Avoid the "bad" neighborhoods and it's a great place to live and work.

From: TrapperKayak
29-Aug-18
When I was there last fall, I felt safe. I was under the care of the PH, and he had a gun, and so did I of course. We traveled to a game refuge after the hunts and saw a lot of game. We also saw a lot of poverty along the way there, a lot of 'hard working' highway crews (note sarcasm), and nothing too threatening. The PH talked extensively haw the blacks in SA were much better off financially under apartheid in the past, and how things are turning sour fast due to the changing governmental environment. Its not the hunting outfits that are in trouble with black takeover there as it is the vulnerable white family farmer. it is the lack of the government to understand how capitalism works, so they are turning more to forceable takeover and corrupt money dealings, with the government officials hoarding the money and forcing the citizens back into dependency. Ultimately it is not going to end up well. It is probably far safer than many other African countries that harbor far more extreme terrorism, but the trend is not in the right direction IMO. Not according to the safari owners and PHs where I went. And they have LIVED there all their lives, which adds up to way more than 3000 days.

29-Aug-18
While these events are tragic. those same farmers are more likely to be killed on the road than in their home. My last trip to Africa was during the Ebola scare I have to go to Detroit two to three times a week for work I’m sure my risk level is many more times just doing that . Actually the hour and a half drive is probably the most likely to get me killed. Facts, stats and numbers are a funny thing. for example if you listen to the left wing media, guns are the number one killer in the US. But you are almost 1,000,000 times more likely to die in a pool or vehicle accident or a tennis racket or a heart attack from being fat.

29-Aug-18
Believing blacks were better off under apartheid is exactly the racist mentality that has lead to SAs problems. You reap what you sow.

From: TrapperKayak
29-Aug-18
So, then, turnabout is fair play you say?

From: TrapperKayak
29-Aug-18
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YH329UbQokY

From: TrapperKayak
29-Aug-18
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FT3CLYhrCyA

It is not looking good. Revenge/Retaliation is never good.

29-Aug-18
Again, you reap what you sow.

From: TrapperKayak
29-Aug-18
Sure, so you say just perpetuating the problem, turning it in the opposite direction, is the solution?? THAT is what is wrong and the problem with SA NOW!! Nothing is solved. That is exactly the same as the extreme left wing mentality we have here in the US. Nice...

29-Aug-18
Link as many sad stories as you wish, Ken, but try to find ONE where the US government has considered passing legislation that forcibly removes white families from their homes, due to their skin color. Murder happens everywhere, but South Africa is actually sanctioning it for the benefit of it's black citizens. Reap what you sow? Sounds like you're actually in favor of what's happening over there?

29-Aug-18
You speak without knowledge.

From: GhostBird
29-Aug-18
The US government did remove thousands of families from there homes (or just killed them) because of their skin color. Native Americans... remember them?

29-Aug-18

Ken Moody Safaris's embedded Photo
Ken Moody Safaris's embedded Photo
When 9% of any population controls 100% of that country’s wealth you will inevitably have political, economical, and yes physical repercussions once the majority takes control. This is basic human nature. The majority now asks, “who did you purchase this land from initially? Yourselves is the answer.” Blacks in SA we’re basically indentured servants from 1948 til 1994. They were not allowed to be educated, hold government office, own land, etc. When the uneducated come to power corruption ensues and SA now finds itself with incompetent leadership desperately trying to cling to power (ANC). They are not so incompetent however, as to not recognize the enormous amounts of revenue that tourism generates for the country and as a result, this industry should continue to flourish provided basic public safety can be assured. So far, traveling and hunting in SA has been perfectly safe and will continue to be so in the future. So again, what was sowed is now being reaped.

29-Aug-18
Point taken, Ghostbird. Is it fair to say that Native Americans raided, killed, and took other Native Americans from rival tribes as slaves, too? Did some Native Americans target white settlers as they made their way west across the great frontier? Did some of those Native Americans serve as scouts and assist the US government in locating and eradicating/relocating some Native American tribes? I get your point, and it's a valid one, but I guess I was just looking for a more current event, within the last 150 years.

From: Highlife
29-Aug-18
PA look up imminent domain our government does it all the time.

From: Highlife
29-Aug-18
My family and I live and work in Chicago. What happens every weekend here sure the hell doesn't dictate how my family works or carries on how we live. BTW we also don't walk around scared just alert to our surroundings lol

29-Aug-18
Dave, hope you’re ready for December!

From: TrapperKayak
29-Aug-18
Ghostbird, Yes that happened. But do the Native American governments turn on the whites and retaliate in these modern times? No, they try to get along with modern peoples, forming businesses that employ them (read, casinos, etc.), and are successful at that, or else they just live their own lives and not bother the rest of non-Indian society. But forming a big counter revolution is not in their itinerary, nor should it be in South Africa's...

From: Highlife
29-Aug-18
Geez Ken this thread has me scared but we will be there don't want to be mistaken for a sissy lol. BTW I'm pulling back 90 lbs now.

From: Highlife
29-Aug-18
That's with a slingshot.......Let's go for buff crazy laff incerted here

29-Aug-18
Dave, don’t forget the loin cloth. From what Brenda tells me it won’t take up much space in the luggage:)

Trapper...you’ve got to be kidding me with that last post of yours.

From: TrapperKayak
29-Aug-18
Highlife, do they come in and murder your family too? They alert you first, give you a chance to review their proposal, and then pay you for the land they 'take' to develop a super highway, etc. They don't come in and shoot you execution style, steal your money and do whatever to your children. Totally a weak defense there....

From: TrapperKayak
29-Aug-18
Ken, which one, the one to Ghostbird, or the one about left wing mentality? Some of these messages pass each other in cyberspace.

From: Highlife
29-Aug-18
Ironically I'm in a blind in South Dakota waiting for a pronghorn to show up. Should I be worried about the Lakota taking back the ranch? IS MY LIFE IN DANGER? LMAO

From: Highlife
29-Aug-18
Look up the building of interstate 55 state police killed a man for rejecting the idea of the government taking his land and died defending it. Nothing weak there

From: Highlife
29-Aug-18
Ken you've known me how long? Loin cloth is always packed for the next adventure!

29-Aug-18
Nevermind.

29-Aug-18

PAbowhunter1064's embedded Photo
PAbowhunter1064's embedded Photo
Wellllllllll.....ALRIGHTY THEN!!!

From: Rut Nut
29-Aug-18
From: Ken Moody Safaris29-Aug-18

No, better to get it from the internet then from a fellow American who lives there four to five months of the year. If you think I’d risk the safety of my family, friends, and clients for a buck then you’re quite the sad, cynical individual. With all due respect...

Not cynical Ken- practical- with a little common sense thrown in. When I buy a used car, I don’t trust what the salesman tells me..........I get a mechanic to check it over before I sign on the dotted line. If you wanna call that “cynical”, so be it.

BTW, you said: “ So far, traveling and hunting in SA has been perfectly safe and will continue to be so in the future. “ I think that’s a pretty foolish statement to make given the political/economic climate of some of these foreign countries. Nobody really knows what will happen in the future!

From: SJJ
29-Aug-18

SJJ's Link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a_bDc7FfItk

29-Aug-18
And the last time you were in SA?

From: Dooner
29-Aug-18
Ken, I watched the documentary. I also have dear friends that left SA because of the black on white racism. It does look more & more like SA is, slowly, going the way of Zim. They're making moves to disarm the farmers, and changing the constitution so that it's "legal" to expropriate (take) the farms. It's just sad. How can they think it will go any better for them than it did with Zim? Aren't they asking the white farmers to come back in Zim??

29-Aug-18
SA is not going the way of Zim. You guys need to get a grip.

From: Beav
29-Aug-18
A guy I worked construction with in the late 90's has parents on the Western Cape of South Africa and are grape farmers. He said that their neighbors were murdered a month ago and they have also been threatened. They said in that particular area things are not stable.

From: Firehuntfish
30-Aug-18
The South African outfitters are between a rock and a hard place in this issue... If an outfitter defends or rationalizes the political climate in RSA, then he is accused of misrepresenting the facts to protect his business interests. If he makes no comment, then it's assumed that he is avoiding the issue thus validating the concerns.... It's a no-win situation.....

Like most of the outfitters who are sponsors here, I have been fielding a fair amount of questions from prospective safari clients. I am telling them what I have been saying for the last 13 years that I have been going to Africa and that is that this rhetoric from the current president is nothing new. These threats are nothing new...Ramaphosa is not Mugabe. He actually came into power with his own wealth. Much of it generated from investments in RSA's agricultural & tourist economy. It makes no financial sense that he would to be stupid enough to cut of his own nose to spite his face.

As with any 3rd world country, there are unknowns and nothing is 100% certain. However, Ramaphosa has already walked back his comments and is redefining what any "land re-appropriations" might look like. They are not the wholesale land grabs threatening to put all white farmers and land owners on the street. That would collapse RSA's economy tomorrow, and Ramaphosa knows it.... I completely agree with Ken here.... You cannot compare RSA to Zim, and I honestly don't see RSA on this path.

No one can accurately predict RSA's future, and the fake news and hype generated by the international media is not helping. The facts right now are these.... South African Outfitters and tour operators and are open for business and business is good. Most RSA outfitters and tour operators are having record years due to more Americans traveling and spending money on safari vacations. It's business as usual, and these folks are taking the rhetoric in stride and going on about their business just as they have done since '94.... 10% of the population generates 85% of the GNP in RSA. Ramaphosa has done the math and he is aware of the source...

We are personally having our best year yet at Limcroma, and we are nearly full for the peak of season next year. I am planning my 7th African safari for 2019, and I encourage anyone thinking about an African safari to make it happen hopefully with one of the many fine Bowsite sponsors....! An African safari is still the best value dollar for dollar than any other outfitted hunt you can find. As a final thought, I have personally traveled extensively through all of the provinces of RSA, Botswana, Namibia, Zimbabwe, and Zambia as recently as last year. On numerous occasions, in many areas, my wife and I were the only white faces among a sea of black faces. We have never been met with hostility or aggression at any point in time. If anything, the opposite has been true as many blacks dependent on the tourist and hunting trades for their livelihoods welcome foreign visitors warmly. Crime is a reality in RSA, and there are places that you would avoid just like there are places in the USA you would avoid. However, the insinuation that all crime occurring in RSA is racially motivated and rampant in the streets is a completely false narrative.

From: Stekewood
30-Aug-18
Thank you Ken and Daniel for your valuable insight and first hand observations.

From: Rut Nut
30-Aug-18
From: Firehuntfish 30-Aug-18

No one can accurately predict RSA's future

Well, that much we can agree on!

30-Aug-18
I have spent a lot of time in 3rd world countries all over the world and behind the scenes in many... The idea that "what are they thinking it will be just like Zim" is not valid' they people in power don't give a crap about the average person and and not doing anything for the betterment of the country only to line their pockets and advance their personal agenda... I stopped being surprised how little the people in power in these screwed up countries care about anything but themselves any kind of "national pride" ..."for the people'"they speak of is just to advance their positions...nothing more ...brutally nothing more....

From: Buffalo1
12-Sep-18
I’m just back in US from RSA with no travel issues. Learned a lot about what is “factual” about issues in RSA and how much “bogus BS” is being shared by media about RSA. The BS is having impact on their tourism.

Sometimes you need take things with a grain of salt and always be aware of your surroundings.

I slept soundly every night and no fears during the days.

From: Griz
12-Sep-18
http://www.politicsweb.co.za/opinion/farm-murders-factchecking-the-factcheckers Lots of details but the conclusion is short.

From: Griz
12-Sep-18
http://www.politicsweb.co.za/opinion/farm-murders-factchecking-the-factcheckers Lots of details but the conclusion is short.

From: Rut Nut
12-Sep-18
From Griz's link above:

Conclusion

"The above all suggests that there is ample evidence that white farmers, particularly in the east of the country, are being “targeted” at an extraordinarily high rate. This is especially so if you make the most appropriate like-for-like comparison when it comes to the type of murder. Indeed, it is difficult to see what could possibly have motivated reputable “fact-checking” websites to go out and insist on the contrary.

There were 24 murder-robberies in England & Wales (population 56 000 000) in the year ending March 2017, a raubmord rate of 0,04 per 100 000. If the robbery-murder rate was ever to come close to reaching the same level there, as on white farms in South Africa, there would be well over 20 000 such homicides a year. In the United States the figure would be over 100 000.

If such a catastrophe was ever to occur in their own societies it is difficult to imagine that the first impulse of such fact-checkers, and the intellectuals citing their work, would be to try and strenuously downplay the enormity of the problem, in an effort to hobble any sustained political efforts to try and deal with it."

From: Fuzzy
12-Sep-18
Ken let me know when you start booking safaris in Chicago, I may be interested ;)

From: Dale06
12-Sep-18
Rut Nur, Interesting facts but there just might be a difference between a drug/gang murder in South Chicago, and a white farmer and his family being murdered because they don’t want to give up their land.

From: Inshart
12-Sep-18
Adventurewriter, you just gave the definition of a democrat!!!!!!!!

From: Griz
12-Sep-18
Inshart, That's exactly what the article is trying to point out. Read the whole thing and not just the conclusion.

From: XbowfromNY
12-Sep-18
Blood Diamond is a good movie.

From: Fuzzy
18-Sep-18
XbowfromNY, yep it's good movie. "Legends of the Fall " is better.

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