Help with tuning education.
Equipment
Would like input hopefully for the last time for quite a while, from those who have attained the level of expert or at least very knowledgeable who have helped me in the past about how to tune a compound bow in figuring out how I could be getting my broad heads and field points hitting within 2-3” of each other at 40 yards and 2” and under at 30 yards but per my fletching strikes in my paper tune sheets my bow is out of tune. Or are my results normal and can be expected as my bow maybe only slightly out of tune. I just aren’t knowledgeable enough to answer this question for myself. This is the second time in as many months I have gone through the process of paper tuning this bow and stopping because the closer I got to a bullet hole the worse my arrow was out of center, or more accurately the tip pointing left away from the center of the bow. A little back ground first. I must confess this is the first time I really attempted to tune a bow and not simply sight in with my broad heads. Yes my BH’s were hitting close enough to my FPs that it would’ve most likely resulted in a fatal hit but close enough is NEVER ethically good enough. I really wanted to get my FPs and FB/BH hitting close enough that the difference was negligible. To combat this difference, I had always in the past had two bows of the same exact model set up exactly the same. I used one for 3-D and field points only and the other for hunting and fixed blade BHs only. I am a HUGE Darton fan and now own 3 Darton compounds now. About 4 years ago I shot a 60lb DS3714 at a Deer Classic and fell head over heels for it, but at $750 and I already had several perfectly good bows I simply couldn’t justify the cost especially being married with two boys and the primary source of income. Two years ago I stumbled across to good a deal to pass up on a literal NIB 60lb DS 3716 and bought it. Unfortunately I couldn’t afford to buy a second one so if I were going to use it for hunting and 3D I would have to tune it to shoot FPs and FB/BHs. My NIB DS3714 remained inactive until just before last year’s deer season and I then set it up to shoot FB/BHs only. Took two nice doe’s with it but no bucks. This year decided to really tune it and get it set up correctly. I also had to drop the draw weight from 58lbs to 52/53lbs due to worsening shoulder issues. I started by researching bow tuning and built a draw board and already have amassed all the tools one should need to tune a compound along with all the needed tech sheets from Darton on tuning a DS 3714. Using the draw board confirmed my cams were in time per factory marks and did my best to use one of my old 2314 XX78 Super Slam arrows to check my cams at rest for lean and pretty sure there was none. Set my nock level. I fletch all my own carbons and use a G5 ASD to square both ends of my arrows after cutting an equal amount of both ends to give me my final length of 29”. I broad head spin test all arrows then double check with my Apple Archery spin jig. The arrows I used to tune my bow I just recently switched to on the advice of some great people here, they are Beman made for Cabela’s Carbon Stalker Extreme 340 spine arrows. I fletched them with 3” Q2i Fusion X-II fletchings. I also had a half dozen of these same exact arrows fletched with Flex Flech 4.18 vanes. I began paper tuning using only the arrows with the Q2i/X-II fletchings. Bottom line I ran out of left adjustment before I could eliminate a nock right tear. I maxed out the left rest adjustment and moved the launcher as far left as the mounting holes allowed. The picture I have included shows four shots left to right the far left is shot #1 and 2, 3, and 4 fallowed and I ran out of adjustment by shot #4 I also saw unmistakably that my arrow field point was ridiculously too far to the left. At this point I gave up and re-centered my rest purely by eye. The paper tune did however confirm I had no vertical arrow flight issues with my rest. I then decided to start sighting in with my FB/BH of choice a 3 blade 100 grain 1-1/8” CD Wasp Boss SST. Luckily and Mercifully I needed only to adjust my sights vertical POI and very, very minor adjustments to its horizontal POI to get my 20, 30 and 40 yard pins set. I then figured WTH might as well try out field points. Shot at 20 and they were under 2” apart dead level next to each other, I thought nice, but calm down its only 20 yards. Moved to 30 and shot 90% as well, both dead level about 2.5” apart. Thought even a broken clock is right 2x a day and repeated the process 5 more times and all five times both FP and BHs hit close enough to make me more than happy. Moved to 40 yards and again similar results, granted my two arrow group opened up to about 3”. I pretty much called it a day at that point. Should add that the arrows I shot at 40 yards were with the Flex Fletch 4.18” fletchings. Both arrows are less than 3 grains difference in weight, with the FF arrows being the lighter of the two. I am including my last groups at 30 and 40 yards as well as a picture of my paper tune as examples of what I found and my end results.
So did I luck out and get my bow close enough to being well tuned and that’s why it is IN MY OPINION shooting pretty well and does the fact I am shooting comparatively small fixed blade BHs attached to arrows that I squared both ends and are all spinning broad heads as close to perfect as my eye can judge? I will grant you 40 yards isn’t an exceptionally long distance to shoot, but for me my shoulder issues and my present skill set it’s pretty far. Would appreciate the input from
Would like input from those who have been helping me recently with their advice who obviously have attained the level of expert or at least very knowledgeable about how to tune a compound bow in figuring out how I could be getting my broad heads and field points hitting within 2-3” of each other at 40 yards and 2” and under at 30 yards but per my fletching strikes in my paper tune sheets my bow is out of tune. Or are my results normal and can be expected as my bow maybe only slightly out of tune? This is the second time in as many months I have gone through the process of paper tuning this bow and stopping because the closer I got to a bullet hole the worse my arrow was out of center, or more accurately the tip pointing left away from the center of the bow. I tried substituting modified French tune after the first time paper tuning didn’t work, but that ended up also not working and why I returned to paper tuning. A little back ground first. I must confess this is the first time I really attempted to tune a bow and not simply sight in with my broad heads. I had always in the past had two bows of the same exact model set up exactly the same. I used one for 3-D and field points only and the other for hunting and fixed blade BHs only. I am a HUGE Darton fan and own 4 Darton compounds now. About 4 years ago I shot a 60lb DS3714 at a Deer Classic and fell head over heels for it, but at $750 and I already had several perfectly good bows I simply couldn’t justify the cost especially being married with two boys and the primary source of income. I recently stumbled across to good a deal to pass up on a literal NIB 60lb DS 3716 and bought it. Unfortunately I couldn’t afford to buy a second one so if I were going to use it for hunting and 3D I would have to tune it to shoot FPs and FB/BHs. My NIB DS3714 remained inactive until just before last year’s deer season and I then set it up to shoot FB/BHs only. Took two nice doe’s with it but no bucks. This year decided to really tune it and get it set up correctly. I also had to drop the draw weight from 58lbs to 52/53lbs due to worsening shoulder issues. I started by researching bow tuning and built a draw board and already have amassed all the tools one should need to tune a compound along with all the needed tech sheets from Darton on tuning a DS 3714. Using the draw board confirmed my cams were in time per factory marks and did my best to use one of my old 2314 XX78 Super Slam arrows to check my cams at rest for lean and pretty sure there was none. Set my nock level. I fletch all my own carbons and use a G5 ASD to square both ends of my arrows after cutting an equal amount of both ends to give me my final length of 29”. I broad head spin test all arrows then double check with my Apple Archery spin jig. The arrows I used to tune my bow are Beman made for Cabela’s Carbon Stalker Extreme 340 spine arrows. I fletched them with 3” Q2i Fusion X-II fletchings. I also had a half dozen of these same exact arrows fletched with Flex Flech 4.18 vanes. I began paper tuning using only the arrows with the Q2i/X-II fletchings. Bottom line I ran out of left adjustment before I could eliminate a nock right tear. I maxed out the left rest adjustment and moved the launcher as far left as the mounting holes allowed. The picture I have included shows four shots left to right the far left is shot #1 and 2, 3, and 4 fallowed and I ran out of adjustment by shot #4 I also saw unmistakably that my arrow field point was ridiculously too far to the left. At this point I gave up and re-centered my rest purely by eye. The paper tune did however confirm I had no horizontal arrow flight issues with my rest. I then decided to start sighting in with my FB/BH of choice a 3 blade 100 grain 1-1/8” CD Wasp Boss SST. Luckily and Mercifully I needed only to adjust my sights vertical POI and very, very minor adjustments to its horizontal POI to get my 20, 30 and 40 yard pins set. I then figured WTH might as well try out field points. Shot at 20 and they were under 2” apart dead level next to each other, I thought nice, but calm down its only 20 yards. Moved to 30 and shot 90% as well, both dead level about 2.5” apart. Thought even a blind clock is right 2x a day and repeated the process 5 more times and all five times both FP and BHs hit close enough to make me more than happy. Moved to 40 yards and again similar results, granted my two arrow group opened up to about 3”. I pretty much called it a day at that point. Should add that the arrows I shot at 40 yards were with the Flex Fletch 4.18” fletchings. Both arrows are less than 3 grains difference in weight, with the FF arrows being the lighter of the two. I am including my last groups at 30 and 40 yards as well as a picture of my paper tune as examples of what I found and my end results.
So did I luck out and get my bow close enough to being well tuned and that’s why it is IN MY OPINION shooting pretty well and does the fact I am shooting comparatively small fixed blade BHs attached to arrows that I squared both ends and are all spinning broad heads as close to perfect as my eye can judge? I will grant you 40 yards isn’t an exceptionally long distance to shoot, but for me my shoulder issues and my present skill set it’s pretty far. Would appreciate the input from those who are far more experienced than I.
Does your bow have Yokes? If so, I would move my rest back to about 13/16" center shot and start tuning with the yokes, You'll need a press to do that. For a right tear like you have you would twist the right yokes, ( a few twists in your case by the look of it) Next, your cams should not be straight when the bow is at rest! They should be close to straight at full draw. Don't worry about cam lean at rest unless it is starting to wear your serving out.
The darton ds3714 has yokes but they are floating so useless for yoke tuning, if you like darton and you want a more tunable bow look at the spectre E, im pretty sure its got a static yoke, I keep saying this, and guys get mad, but never buy a bow that you cant yoke tune!! Sounds like your close so resight or get a good mech and go hunting, then sell all your fleet of bows and get a spectra E
I would be moving the rest to the right not left with that tear.
I have to admit, I couldn't read all of that novel you wrote. Am I to understand that your paper tear is nock-right but your broadheads are hitting to the right of your FP's? That does not make sense.
Are you right handed or left handed?
This game has become my favorite when I was a child because Archery was very popular these days and mostly everybody relies on it spending their free time. So I loved reading the article because it is very interesting and I would love to thank DMTKAGER for writing it so well.
I never paper tune. I simply walk back tune with fieldpoints and my FP and BH will stack out to as far as I care to shoot as long as the arrows spin true.
What Skipmaster1 said, same thing for me, I don't paper tune...
What Xman said is correct! Righty or lefty?
So many variables, I am just going to throw some out there...
First I would sure that my sight is 100 percent parallel and square to my bow with my 2nd and third axis dead on...
It looks like you are shooting pretty consistently based upon your narrative and the photos.... But I have a few other questions...
(I don't paper tune) but when paper tuning, how far from the paper are you? I would be 7-10 yards at least. Some arrows bend and fishtail more than others... maybe move back farther to let the arrow stabilize???
This could also be hand torque, or release torque. Do you use a string loop? What release do you use?
Are you sure you are not getting fletching contact at the rest? powder is the best way to tell, but kind of messy.
Your bow maybe very well tuned for the way you are shooting it, are you aiming at the exact same dot? Not the whole red circle??
Just Some thoughts.
Good Luck, Scar
I just go to special training in throwing and this allows me to maintain aggression. I have not heard about special education in bow. However, this sport makes it possible not to be disappointed in another education with a bunch of homework. You can easily take pieces of paper from the dissertation, which were evaluated on a three-way by teacher and throw arrows at them
Paper tune will help in determining if you have the correct spine for your bow. A "tear right" is a sign of a overspined arrow, you can keep getting it regardless of where you move your rest. Tuning BHs to field points requires very slight movement of your rest. You may be impacting the target where you are aiming but that doesn`t mean you are getting everything you can out of your bow and arrow performance. Perfect arrow flight aids in penetration and utilizing your bows energy.
This is the reason many paper tune.
Throw the paper away and bare shaft tune your bow.
Matt
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I agree with bare shaft tuning I've shot both trad & compound for many years & a bare shaft hitting the same as field points at 20 yards is as good as my skill level needs. I shoot fixed 2 edge broadheads & as long as my bare shafts are good my broadheads always fly straight. Drove myself crazy paper tuning many years ago shooting a compound with fingers & gave up on it & went to bare shaft methods. It's been my experience that in most cases folks with tuning problems are shooting too stiff a shaft 75% of the time.
I have had very good luck with my local archery shop setting up my bow. Afterwards, I walk back to check that the arrows are shooting straight. If not, I will make small rest adjustments. As far as broadheads, some are spot on and impact right with my field points or are an inch or two off - at 40 yards. I shot the Wac'Em broadhead at 60 yards and it was right in the middle. Never got that close to an antelope! Good luck in your tuning efforts
