KUIU
Colorado archery unit 66 or 49? 9 point
Elk
Contributors to this thread:
elkster 17-Jan-19
elkocd 17-Jan-19
Stick 17-Jan-19
elkster 17-Jan-19
Stick 17-Jan-19
Cheesehead Mike 18-Jan-19
OFFHNTN 18-Jan-19
Billyvanness 18-Jan-19
Billyvanness 18-Jan-19
Billyvanness 18-Jan-19
elkster 18-Jan-19
lineman21 18-Jan-19
Stick 18-Jan-19
cnelk 18-Jan-19
elkster 18-Jan-19
Firsty 19-Jan-19
cnelk 19-Jan-19
elkocd 20-Jan-19
cnelk 20-Jan-19
joehunter 20-Jan-19
Vids 20-Jan-19
elkocd 20-Jan-19
Cowalkabout 20-Jan-19
Quinn @work 20-Jan-19
Cheesehead 21-Jan-19
cnelk 21-Jan-19
Wishedhead 21-Jan-19
Cheesehead Mike 22-Jan-19
joehunter 22-Jan-19
PECO 22-Jan-19
Cheesehead 25-Jan-19
Firsty 25-Jan-19
cnelk 25-Jan-19
Tdwhip 25-Jan-19
Jethro 26-Jan-19
Yellowjacket 26-Jan-19
Wishedhead 26-Jan-19
Cheesehead Mike 28-Jan-19
cnelk 28-Jan-19
Cheesehead Mike 28-Jan-19
cnelk 28-Jan-19
Cheesehead Mike 28-Jan-19
cnelk 28-Jan-19
Cheesehead Mike 28-Jan-19
Vids 29-Jan-19
huntabsarokee 29-Jan-19
cnelk 29-Jan-19
PECO 29-Jan-19
SoDakSooner 29-Jan-19
Firsty 30-Jan-19
Donnybowhunter 30-Jan-19
cnelk 30-Jan-19
Michael 30-Jan-19
elkster 30-Jan-19
From: elkster
17-Jan-19
I give up on point creep. Does anyone have outfitter recommendations for these 2 units? I've always been d.I.y., but as a non-res I won't have enough time to scout proper. Hence the outfitter. These 2 units required the most points (6 and 4), of the remaining units. I'll never catch up to unit 40. I've camped in 66, and know how high it is.

From: elkocd
17-Jan-19
Tell me about it... I'm at 11. Serious no mans land. 40 will be 13 or more this year. 76 a point or two above that.

I've been in 40 deer hunting, not sure I'd want to spend that many points DIY there anyway. Too much private and not into shooting a bull after it jumps a fence. Deer with a rifle maybe yes. Not a big bull with a bow. They can go too far even when hit good.

76 would be great, but I don't think I will catch anytime soon.

That leaves me with nothing in archery. I've been looking some at first rifle hunts. Lots of bugling still going on then. I wish CO would average points between applicants. I'd go in with my son for a 49 or 66 archery hunt.

From: Stick
17-Jan-19
I have been saving points for years, like 16. I can probably draw unit 76, but have no one to hunt with...I hear that 76 is steep and rough in some areas...I am in pretty good shape for my age, but who is gonna go bowhunting with a 69 year old that they don't know. So, I may have to bite the bullet if I want to hunt 76 and go with a guide, maybe in rifle season. I hate it , but that is my fate since I started a few years late saving points.

From: elkster
17-Jan-19
Stick, You could hunt archery with a guide in 76. Or 40. You are in the position I wish I was in.

elkocd, if I weren't so stubborn, I'd look into rifle hunts too. It would open some possibilities. Gotta bow hunt my bulls though.

From: Stick
17-Jan-19
Actually, I am a bowhunter, have not taken a rifle after elk in many, many years, only then cause my brother is not a bowhunter. I may end up with an outfitter if I can find one that will cater to a bowhunter. I am old school and shoot traditional...so would have to get within 30yds, that is my limit. I would be sick to death to cripple one of those beautiful animals. I have always wanted to go deep into a wilderness area on horse back, ...outfitter just might be worth the money to do that.

18-Jan-19
I hunted 49 in 2007 and 2010 and drew it both times with 2 points. It was a decent hunt with 2 points but it's hard to imagine it being a 9-point unit. I don't think point creep would have ever hit 49 so hard if it weren't for Eastman's and Huntin' Fool blowing it out of proportion. That's what happens when a 2 point unit gets too much publicity, it suddenly becomes a 5 point unit with guys spending up to 13 points to hunt it... Crazy! I've had comparable hunts in CO OTC units...

From: OFFHNTN
18-Jan-19
Agree with Mike. I've hunted both, I would choose 66.

18-Jan-19
It’s really a like good otc unit with limited hunters. I did see a couple bombers but they were super tough to get in on. Loaded up with cows.

18-Jan-19
Not a 9 point hunt for sure

18-Jan-19
Sorry that was for 49 I don’t know 66

From: elkster
18-Jan-19
Thanks for the responses. I understand these units are not worth 9 pts. But they are the highest point units available to me at this point in my life. Age 54, unit 40 is at least 7 yrs away. I've hunted o.t.c. since '87. On a whim, started accumulating points at age 45. Should have hunted 1 pt. units adjacent to my favorite o.t.c. every other year (hindsight is 20-20). Stick, like you, I hunt traditional and have a 30 yrd. range. It would be worth paying a guide UNLESS you could spend the entire season and have a packer on call.

If anyone has experience with a guide in either unit, please lemme know.

From: lineman21
18-Jan-19
The reality is that 49 and 66 are 9 point units because that’s all you will ever be able to draw for archery. I also have 9 points and will be cashing them in on one of these 2 units. Sucks but it’s all you can do unless you like accumulating points for the sake of accumulating points.

From: Stick
18-Jan-19
Well, I certainly agree with all of you....I am stuck with 76, and my age catching up with me. 10 years ago I would take off in 76 by myself and chase the elk. Now, have to think about maybe getting hurt several miles from trailhead and becoming bear bait..62 was another thought 5 years ago, but the point creep has knocked me out of that unit....so maybe next year I will find me a guide and take my chances with him and celebrate my 70th birthday chasing elk..( from horse back)...I would love to for once ride horses instead of climbing for miles each morning.

From: cnelk
18-Jan-19
You guys should/could have burned your PPs before now.

So yeah, it you want to hunt 49, you're gonna leave some PPs on the table.

Last year 5 PPs was a guarantee tag for NonRes 49 archery.

Very seldom will you find a unit that takes 5PPs for both Res & NR

From: elkster
18-Jan-19
cnelk, 4 yrs ago unit 40 was a 7 point unit. I didn't look into it further and kept building points. I didn't look into it because I knew I wouldn't hunt due to health reasons which jeopardized hunting for the last 3 seasons. I was surprised the see the point creep in 40 when I looked this month.

I noticed the same thing with res and non res. in the same unit you mentioned. I've still had good o.t.c. hunts in the meantime, and plan to for years to come now.

From: Firsty
19-Jan-19
I would look at 20, been some monsters coming out of there

From: cnelk
19-Jan-19
20 is a 3 PP unit

From: elkocd
20-Jan-19
"20 is a 3 PP unit"

I'm not sure it matters what it's taken in the past to draw a unit. There are so many guys now with 5-10 points that will never draw one of the tags they wanted when they started, they will have to start burning the points on perceived lesser units or just not hunt. The CO pref points situation is the worst by far IMHO. My son as an example: he's a sophomore in HS. He now has 5 points will be 6 after this year. By the time he's able to hunt after school he will have 8. When that time comes I will likely put him in for a hunt that he can easily draw so he can hunt and stop chasing points that will do him no good. He will NEVER draw one of the units we're talking about above so I would rather he just hunts. I will be looking at units for him that have the opportunity to hunt with less pressure and from there it's just about working hard and we'll find him a good bull, but it will have nothing to do with how few points it took the year before to draw.

From: cnelk
20-Jan-19
Ive played the Colorado PP game for decades. Ive drawn unit 10 ML elk , and unit 61 archery elk - and have 7 PPs again.

And Ive hunted elk each and every year.

Never is a long time. You just dont know what the CPW will do with PPs in the future. Maybe nothing, maybe something.

Ive chosen to play the game.

From: joehunter
20-Jan-19
elkocd - why wait take the kid now! Only 100 bucks for a youth tag! Believe me it is much easier to take them while in High School than when they are in college or starting a full time job.

From: Vids
20-Jan-19
I'm sort of in the same boat. I have 6-7 pp and not sure what to do. Most of my hunting partners are non residents and they can't draw what I can. Was planning on 76 in a year or two, but honestly not that excited about going solo. I'd love to find a good partner to hunt 76 with, but don't want to burn points hunting with someone I barely know. It's just way more fun with a partner. We'll see. I'm mostly able to hunt where I want every year and still get a point, I'll figure out a plan someday, but don't want to wait forever to burn them.

From: elkocd
20-Jan-19
"why wait take the kid now! Only 100 bucks for a youth tag! Believe me it is much easier to take them while in High School than when they are in college or starting a full time job."

Oh i do!. He hunts elk every year. He's already taken two 6 point bulls in OR. He hunted CO deer this last year. He'll draw a good OR archery elk tag this year, then probably WY next year. So, it's not a matter of him not hunting, just a matter of when he'll have time for CO and still find a little time for school :)

From: Cowalkabout
20-Jan-19
I live in Pagosa Springs Colorado and have spent many days hiking and hunting in units 76, 77, 78 and 771. While I don’t have the points to draw 76 tag yet either I am willing to hike in and help someone else that draws the tag. guide that is friend of mine had clients take 2 monster bulls in the otc tag areas this year in units 75, 751. One went 379 and one went 382 I believe. Lots of big elk in the otc areas around here.

From: Quinn @work
20-Jan-19
elkocd,

Take him hunting whenever you can in OTC units now. I'd keep putting him in for preference points for a long time. Things will change here in CO and it's better to have a bunch of points when that happens. Don't burn 5-6 points on a marginal unit like 49 when he has a whole life ahead of him to collect points and hope for the best. He's one of the lucky one's that has age on his side. Unlike all us old guys trying to figure out where to dump their useless points.

From: Cheesehead
21-Jan-19
Last year 49 took 6 points for Non res 100% and 7 Pts for RESIDENT???

65 / 35 split is BS!!

All The BGSS surveys are bias to making archery, ALL archery limited draw. One commissioner keeps spouting off that all archery hunters want all units limited. She is speaking from or for guides.

RESIDENT archery hunters will get the short end of the stick for the next BGSS.

From: cnelk
21-Jan-19
Cheesehead

Like I mentioned above, it took 5 PPs for both RES & NR to draw 49 in 2018. Some lucky ones drew it with 4, but 5 PPs was the guarantee.

From: Wishedhead
21-Jan-19
Took 5 points be for me and my partner last year. I wouldn’t use more points than that in 49.

22-Jan-19
Yeah, I don't know where Cheesehead got his numbers... or his name...

From: joehunter
22-Jan-19
elkocd- "Oh i do!. He hunts elk every year. He's already taken two 6 point bulls in OR. He hunted CO deer this last year. He'll draw a good OR archery elk tag this year, then probably WY next year. So, it's not a matter of him not hunting, just a matter of when he'll have time for CO and still find a little time for school :)

Nice work!

From: PECO
22-Jan-19
49 not worth more than 5 points, so where would a resident go with 8 points. Just thinking out loud. There are more than a few units not worth the points. However with point creep and with a lot of guys most likely dumping their points in the next few years, these 4-5 point units may be the new 10 point units.

From: Cheesehead
25-Jan-19

Cheesehead's embedded Photo
Cheesehead's embedded Photo
So am i reading this wrong???

Resident with 6 PP pre draw applicants 18, Post-Draw successful Resident w 6 pp 13?

Where did the 5 tags go or not go?

From: Firsty
25-Jan-19
Might have applied as a group with a guy with less points maybe?

From: cnelk
25-Jan-19
Yeah. Youre reading it wrong.

Look at the Post Draw. There were 29 Res that drew with 4 PPs [23% chance - 29 of 126 tags]. 2 NR drew with 4 PPs [ 5% chance - 2 of 39 tags]

They next level at 5 PPs all drew, and so on up until the tag allotment was exhausted.

From: Tdwhip
25-Jan-19
My group hit the lottery we drew one of the two nonresident tags with four points. I can remember when this was a one point unit. With the current point creep I will never be able to hunt 49 again. The fire did use no favors, but I ran into more hunters in the woods then I ever do in my over-the-counter unit.

From: Jethro
26-Jan-19
In the example shown above 18 Res applied with 6 points, 13 were awarded tags. 48 Res applied with 5 points 41 were awarded tags. But the 5 and 6 point pool were considered 100%. What causes that in the stats? I've seen that often but never knew what causes those statistics.

From: Yellowjacket
26-Jan-19
I didn't have an elk tag last year but was in 49 a few times during the season. After the fire in 49 last year it looked to me like all the hunters piled into one drainage. Add the ATV crowd and it looked crazy crowded.

From: Wishedhead
26-Jan-19
It did and it was

28-Jan-19
Since 2 non-resident tags were drawn with 4 points it means that anybody had a chance of drawing with 2 points, therefore that is the minimum number of points needed.

I've always believed that when you see situations like this where 35 non-residents applied with 5 points and only 28 drew tags, but yet applicants with fewer points drew is because 7 applicants with 5 points had problems with their applications, such as credit cards denied or maybe other mistakes. There could be a group of 4 applicants and one of them had a problem with their credit card and it kicked all 4 of them out of the draw. I also wondered if somebody (or a group) with 5 points drew and then turned their tag(s) back right away before the statistics were published if that would show them as applying but not drawing because they turned their tag(s) back.

From: cnelk
28-Jan-19
Cheesehead Mike

The document date is May 21, 2018. Based on the 'return tag' format - affidavits and forms - any returned tags will not be shown on the Draw Recap.

See page 16 of the Regs for 'Refunds, Reissues, Exchanges

Per the new system, applicants had until June 20, 2018 to pay for their tag. If the CC on file failed to accept the charges, the license is surrendered - and you lose both license AND PPs.

28-Jan-19
Thanks cnelk. So what's the reason that everybody with 5 points didn't draw when 2 applicants with 4 points did?

From: cnelk
28-Jan-19
Mike - I see what youre referring to - the difference of 7 PRE-DRAW and POST-Draw

They prob effed up their application or maybe Modified it?

28-Jan-19
On the page on the left, "Pre Draw Applicants" it shows that there were 35 NR applicants with 5 points. On the page on the right, "Post Draw Successful" it shows that 28 NR applicants with 5 points drew. So that would mean that 7 applicants with 5 points did not draw... What am I missing?

From: cnelk
28-Jan-19
Maybe it was 2 group of applications? i.e. One group of 3, one group of 4, and unlike WY, the CPW doesnt extend the quota?

Great question

28-Jan-19
Oh I see what you're saying. There might have only been 2 tags left so there wouldn't have been enough tags for a group of 4 or a group of 3 to draw so they dropped into the pool of applicants with 4 points and drew 2 applicants for the remaining tags, one of which was the friend of Tdwhip who posted above.

From: Vids
29-Jan-19
Those applicants also could have applied as groups with folks that had fewer points. They show up on the post draw summary as having 5 points but they were grouped up with someone that had 2 points so they didn't get drawn, something like that.

29-Jan-19
I also thought it was like what Vids said. Someone in the Group had less points and held the higher pointer members down.

From: cnelk
29-Jan-19
I sent an inquiry to the CPW.

Their reply was exactly what we discussed. Group applications with PP holders with some with 6 PPs and some with 3 PPs. And since the lowest Point holder is the referenced amount, the group got denied

Classic example on how many dont read the Regs.

From: PECO
29-Jan-19
No need to read the complicated regs, just come here and ask. ;(

From: SoDakSooner
29-Jan-19
We didn't hunt last year, but camped in 48 on half moon rd during the season and did some hiking in multiple units. I agree 49 was swamped since so much of it was off limits due to the burn. We were also there during muzzy season so it was worse. We were hiking in 49 on the last day of muzzy season and there were 16 vehicles at one trailhead. It was nuts. Makes me rethink wanting to hunt that unit.... :) Were in kind of the same boat although the points we have (5) better fits 49 than someone with more. If we do hunt 49 with 5 unless things change, we won't wait 5 years to hunt it again. There are better units for less points IMO. If it were still a 2 point unit like when I started building points I'd have no problem, but too many threads like this get people excited about it....lol.

From: Firsty
30-Jan-19
You guys crack me up

30-Jan-19
Let's keep pushing up the point creep. Bring up units in an open forum for everyone to pursue. Why cant you do your own research ?

From: cnelk
30-Jan-19
Ive been hearing really good things about GMU 500.... right next to 49

Only 1-2 PPs!

From: Michael
30-Jan-19
That settles it. I am burning my 5 points on a 1 point cow tag.

From: elkster
30-Jan-19
Donnybowhunter, "why can't you do your own research?"

Go back and read the first post, Donnybowhunter.

I AM doing my own research. I asked if anyone had experience with an outfitter in these units. Didn't ask for opinions of where I should hunt. My research led me to these.

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