Got home from work in time to set up a couple properties this evening. Running mostly snares with a few footholds thrown in. Hope to get around 40-50 more out by the end of the weekend. Saturday a fellow bowsiter is going with me to help check the line and see how it’s done. I’ll update as the yotes pile up. Follow along if ya like. Wisconsin teacher has a couple on the board already. Hopefully he’ll add some updates. If anyone else is out after the yotes post up some pics.
Looking forward to it! What are you running for legholds? Also, it would be interesting to see some kind of pictorial how-to play by play of a couple of your sets. (dirthole/flat, etc) Just a thought.
This should be a good thread. I was looking at trying to get some coyote sets going in the early spring before fawning. I was looking on EBay and some complete "kits" are being sold there. I watched some Youtubes on how to put in a set. It didn't look too hard. For you trappers....do you get alot of non-target animals in your leg hold traps?
JL...if you can catch a yote, you can catch pretty much anything. They’re pretty smart critters. You will definitely catch some non target animals as well. Grinners (possums) are the biggest pain, IMO.
The guys I was talking to in eastern Canada we’re Getting $150 for a prime yote last year. They said Canada Goose cost company is driving the demand. I guess they use them to line the coat hoods.
Thanks jl. The best way to learn is to get out there and do it. In my opinion snares would be your easier option. Troy was correct in his response. Yotes are smart critters and can cause someone just getting into it to quit. Any non target catches in traps can be released. Bou. Jtv’s response was spot on. Buyers don’t like holes in the pelts. Ace, I had a few sell for 100$ last year my average came in at 49.50$ I made enough to pay for most of my elk hunt. There’s not much profit to be made if you look at all the expenses and time associated. I just enjoy the fact I’m helping the deer and other critters out. I encourage everyone who can to get out and catch a few.
I'm glad to see your posts WV hillbilly. I set my traps a few days ago. For those that are just getting started I'd like to hear WV's suggestions. My experience has been way better with footholds than snares. But, snares are extremely effective if you can find where coyotes are passing under a fence. I have had good luck identifying trails (like in WV's photo) and then setting a string of footholds on the trail. I will prepare the area by using a weedwhacker to knock the grass down to bare dirt. Then set the footholds in the bare dirt because a coyote will always walk on bare dirt when given the chance. You can "aim" the coyotes foot toward your traps by placing pine cones, etc where you don't want him to step.
Good Morning, Cable Restraints (snares) are incredibly effective setting volume helps the odds. I usually set out 75 to 100 snares, 24 leg holds. The best sets for Coyotes are the dirt hole, walk through, scent post. But, Zags out of New York has been teaching us the Pipe Dream that is really effective and helps with wet conditions. Wv Hillbilly is spot on I trap mostly to control predators and help the deer herd. But I also enjoy water trapping, muskrats, mink, otter, beaver when needed. Market prices are driven by the trim market currently. The antis are being very successful in attacking trapping and fur. Buy yourself and wife a coat!
We can’t use snares up here except submerged for beaver. I am starting next week for coyotes. Bobcats are protected so I have a feeling that I will be busy releasing more bobcats than dispatching coyotes until the cats wise up. We have a lot of bobcats up here and they too kill deer. Very common to release a 35-40 pound tom. They get nasty too.
Thanks elkstabber good luck this year. Where I live in Ohio we have a lot of fence rows and grass fields. With small wood lots. I find a lot of great situations that snares are very effective and can be set quickly. Back in Wv it’s more open big woods with less fence rows. Traps produce better for me in that situation. It’s definitely not a one is better than the other, it’s what works best for you and the area your in.
I highly recommend everyone joining your state trapper associations. They all need our help and are out there every day fighting the antis to preserve the most effective means we have for predator control. Most associations have yearly events with multiple demonstrations on setting traps and snares and putting up the catch. Good to hear from ya screwball. You think Chris is snowed in yet?
I'm going into my 4th season for coyotes. Last year will be hard to beat but I'm working my tail off. We started the season with 16" of snow which means I needed to buy a snowmobile. Due to the deep snow, I'm struggling finding coyotes that are not running deer trails. A few of my farms are loaded with deer so I'm going to check them again after Christmas. I have 5 dozen sets out and got 2 coyotes earlier this week. Since then we had more cold -20 and snow. The -20 took my sled out of commission, so my goal for the week is to get my sled running, reopen trails and add a few more sets where I've seen tracks. It's been a challenging first 12 days, but I'm going to keep pushing and see what happens next.
The pipe dream set is the real deal. Ive been using it for 5 years. Simple and faster than a dirthole. Last season we were so sloppy wet that you couldnt keep anything else working and the pipe dream was killing yotes. I even used it this summer trapping yotes that were robbing my cousins cantalope field.
No Mercy Nope, struck out on them. Had 2 sets out but the little feeder creek froze up on me. Looks like they moved out of my immediate area. They are my goal for next year!
J Miller nice job on the fisher had a couple sets out conibears had sign used fresh beaver in boxes no luck. Wish they would give us more then 7 day season.
If I tried this trapping thing it's only to stop the yotes on the property from cleaning out the fawns. I have 6 yotes on one 30 second vid this year. I was more concerned about releasing unwanted animals like coons, possums, foxes and cats and how to safely release them with hurting them or me. I found this vid on Youtube. This method seemed the most professional and humane way to do it. There were other vids showing people trying to do it with various methods and they didn't seem to know what they were doing.
I seen a noose vid and that looked ok but like the guy in the above vid noted, it can suffocate the animal. I don't want to do that for one and two it's likely illegal to kill one that way or out of season. Michigan went to year round yote hunting under certain conditions.
JL, the foothold traps are adjusted so that lighter animals pass over and heavier animals will fire the trap. For example, I saw where a grey fox stepped on a trap yesterday and didn't trip it. But a coyote will. Occasionally a deer will step on the trap and fire it but a deer's hooves can't get caught in a foothold trap.
Its not perfect. It gets tricky because if a raccoon jumps on it or if a skunk digs up the trap they might get caught. (skunks will dig up traps because they feed on grubs/worms and are attracted to freshly disturbed soil).
You could have a top lot yote bring $150 but don`t think you will be getting $150 or even $100 for a eastern yote on average. Taxidermists will pay that much for uniques like blacks, reds, blondes etc. Western yote belly fur is a decent market right now, eastern`s have notoriously bad belly fur.
Trapping is in a man/woman`s blood....they rarely do it for the $$$$. It`s takes conviction and hard work, hard core trappers are one of a kind. My hats off to those that do it.
Elite I'm fortunate that I have a piece of riverbottom that has a fisher nearly every year. Last winter I caught one in a foothold 3 days after the season closed and had to release it. I try to get them on bait before the season opens to get one in the area.
I made this set yesterday. Trap is in the low spot in front of the small hole.
I made this set yesterday. Trap is in the low spot in front of the small hole.
Congrats on all the catches fellas. I especially like the pics with the kids involved!
I got home in time to set up another property this evening. Didn’t catch anything today but lord willing tomorrow will be here soon. Buckeye I sell to fur harvesters. They have a pickup route that runs through the town closest to me. Cuts out shipping cost and I get way better prices than local auctions.
New set I put in today. Looked like this when I started. Location is beside a two track where it meets a field.
New set I put in today. Looked like this when I started. Location is beside a two track where it meets a field.
Nice pics rmhunter. T-roy here’s some pics of my typical set. I seem to get better action with the flat sets. I do still throw in dirt holes and piss posts. I usually don’t run a ton of traps when targeting yotes but some spots are no good for snares and to good to pass up.
There are a million ways to make a million different sets. Trap size and technique is up to you. I’ve grown to like the sleepy creek 1-3/4 laminated jaws. I’ve yet to catch one in a mb550 but hear good things about them. Check your local regulations. Every state has different standards.
Before I bed or stake the trap I push the stake in the ground and make a 6” deep hole around 1-1/2 around
Before I bed or stake the trap I push the stake in the ground and make a 6” deep hole around 1-1/2 around
The trap in the pic is a duke 1-3/4. I like the pan 10-12” away from the hole. A lot of people like the larger traps and will tell you anything smaller than a number two won’t hold one. I’ve met quite a few yotes that will tell ya different.
WV hillbilly I have been using mb550s for a couple years now and love them, im going to give the snares a try this season. I usually dont start trapping hard til after New Year's because of all the deer hunters. Good luck
Would make some great show and tell in schools. I bet these kids could really help educate other kids on why trapping is necessary and how much they could learn about nature
I like to blend the set back in once it’s bedded and covered. Then apply bait or lure and a shot of fox piss
I like to blend the set back in once it’s bedded and covered. Then apply bait or lure and a shot of fox piss
Completed set. Takes me about two minutes or so. I can put in four snares in that time. And I won’t have to release a possum from the snares tomorrow.
Hope this helps anyone new to the sport. Like I said earlier there are a bunch of different sets and ways to do them. 10 people will have 10 different opinions. I showed the snare set up I run in the thread last year.
Jl. I don’t a lot of guys do. I put a few bigger pieces of dirt near the pan before I sift dirt over it. Helps keep dirt from filling up under the pan. I try to keep things as simple as possible.
JL I use wax paper to cover my pans, just tear off a piece and roll it around in your hand to get it soften up and lay it over your pan then sift. I've tried fiberglass pan covers and underalls but the wax paper is cheaper and easier for me
One week from Saturday starts our Christmas break which means I'll be setting traps that morning. Between driving a bus, teaching school, and chores in the dark when I get home, the break is really the only time I have to trap.
A few random things based on what I've read above:
In Arkansas, we can't set a snare where it will touch a fence when fully extended. Really cuts down on snare placement in my neck of the Ozarks.
Sleepy Creek traps have ceased production as of last year, I think Minnesota Trapline Products bought up their remaining inventory and is selling what is left.
I've gotten to where I really like Duke Traps dogless coil springs. Fast and easy to set, fires fast (I use the 4 coil), and holds well.
I've tried covering pans with coffee filters, wax paper, even big leaves. I've gotten to where I just put a piece of polyfill under the pan. Seems to work well and is fast and cheap.
I have one of the catch poles for release, but never use it much. The notched plywood works well but is awkward to tote around sometimes. I've turned a lot of dogs and pet cats loose just by wrapping a coat or blanket around them so the biting end couldn't reach me and talking quietly to them as I took the trap off.
I have a cousin (pretty much a professional trapper) that uses the catch poles to strangle any bobcats he catches. No holes in the hide that way.
Beautiful yote rmhunter. Thanks for the heads up on sleepy creek salagi. I better stock up on what sleepy creeks they have. Unfortunately bou, your right on that statement.
I caught Bambi’s sister today. Short rodeo ride later I had her cut loose. Ran off with a angry look on her face. No yotes today. Heading to a 3 spot league shoot now. Hopefully have some action tomorrow.
I catch multiple yotes every year on this same trail.
I catch multiple yotes every year on this same trail.
Good info jtv. Hope it works out for ya next year. I set up another property today. Was a muddy mess we got rain last night and this morning. Ended up with one yote today.
Are you guys checking the sets everyday? I didn't look at the MI regs yet but I think I read a while back it's a reg that you have to run the sets everyday??
From the Arkansas Trappers Facebook page (posted by a buyer)
HERE ARE THE FUR PRICES WE ARE PAYING NOW. I WILL LIST THE TOP PRICE, SO SOME WILL BE LOWER AND SOME MAY BE HIGHER. BEAVER 6.00,,,, OTTER 15.00,,,, RACCOON 2.50,,,, MINK 6.00,,,,, MUSKRAT 3.00,,,, NUTRIA 2.00,,,, DRY CASTER 60.00,,,, GREEN CASTER 42.00,,,, COYOTE 8.00,,,, RED FOX 10.00,,,, GREY FOX 8.00,,,,, OPOSSUM .50,,,,, BOBCAT 25.00,,,,, SKUNK 5.00,,,, SKUNK JUICE 9.00 OZ,,,,, WE DO BUY SKULLS, CALL FOR PRICES.
KsRancher, green is wet, right off the beaver, either sold fresh right away or frozen. Dry is cleaned of fat, etc and hung to dry. Either way, it will be dried and ground for use.
Any of you guys have luck with coyotes using the “pipe dream” set? I’ve never tried this set but am going to give it a try between Christmas and New Years. I’ve watched quite a few videos on them and seems like it’d be a little easier than a dirt hole.
Western Coyotes bring top dollar for the trim market mainly. That price is legit. Eastern's are darker and bring low dollar. Schmitty78, pipe dream is real deal and worked great here in WI with the wet year. The grass clippings works well rather than dirt as well. Found more luck with screen though to help hold clippings in place.
2019 Fur Prices: Fur Harvesters March 2019 Auction Results
March 12, 2019 by Jeremiah 26 Comments
The second major fur auction in 2019 has come and gone, and there weren’t many surprises. With the exception of coyote and bobcat, fur prices for most species remain low. Here are some details:
Beaver sold at 75%, with a wider spread than the recent NAFA auction. The better Eastern beavers averaged $14.56, more than $3 better than the NAFA sale, but Section III beavers averaged less than $8.
Western coyotes averaged about $88. These same pelts averaged a little over $100 at last year’s March auction. The coyote market may be seeing a slight pullback on the higher end skins, but the demand is obviously still there, and prices remain very profitable for Western coyote trappers. Similar to the recent NAFA auction, demand for lower end coyotes has risen considerably. Perhaps some manufacturers have found recent success using these as parka trim, and are bidding up the supply of lower cost substitutes. That’s great for coyote trappers outside of the Western states. Eastern coyotes averaged a whopping $59, and Centrals averaged $33!
Western bobcats, averaged $416. While this is a great price level in the overall scheme of things, it is considerably lower than the nearly $600 these cats brought in last year’s March auction. On a positive note, cat prices increased in other regions, with Canadian, Southern and Central cats all averaging around $90. Not bad for the lower end cats.
Muskrat averaged $3.80, a little higher than last year.
Red fox ranged from $24-27, but only sold at 42%, meaning only the better pelts likely sold.
Raccoon sold well, at 83%, with averages ranging from $4.62 to $12.28. These are considerable lower prices than the NAFA auction, but the FHA coon collection may have been of different quality overall.
Lynx averaged around $73, a small improvement, but still far below long term averages.
Marten prices took a pretty big hit from last year’s levels, ranging from $76 for the biggest and best heavy Alaskan and Canadian skins, down to $29 for the large semi-heavies. 70% sold.
Mink, Otter, Fisher, Grey Fox and Weasel mostly didn’t sell, and were retained to be offered at the next auction.
Skunk averaged $3.90, Badgers $26, and Oppossums $2.
Nothing has changed, and everything’s changed. That’s the story of the fur market heading into the 2019-2020 fur selling season. The demand for raw fur remains where it’s been for years – quite low. The Chinese and Russian economies continue to struggle along, meaning our biggest fur buying countries just aren’t consuming much fur. On the supply side, however, the entire market has been shifted upside down.
The NAFA Debacle
North American Fur Auctions, the largest seller of wild fur in North America, is going bankrupt. After years of struggling with finances amidst rock bottom fur prices, the company dug itself a hole it couldn’t get out of. The vast majority of NAFA’s business is in ranch mink, and their strategy of financially backing struggling mink ranchers backfired. It appears that NAFA is going to be acquired, or merged, with Saga Furs, a Finnish auction company that only deals in ranched fur. Saga has no interest in wild fur, and thus NAFA won’t be accepting wild fur in 2019-2020.
Fur Selling Options
Fur Harvesters Auction, Inc., a wild fur company first and foremost, is still in business and plans to offer a huge collection of wild fur in the coming season. FHA is gearing up to have the capacity to take a lot of the fur that NAFA used to receive, and I’d encourage folks who haven’t shipped before to give FHA a shot. Groenewold Fur and Wool Company is also gearing up to take more fur, and is expanding routes into new states beyond its normal buying area. You can also ship your fur to GFWCO. They’ll grade it and offer a price. If you don’t like the price, they’ll ship it back on their dime. A number of small fur buyers will still be operating and remain a good option for selling your fur. Keep in mind that many country fur buyers bought your fur and shipped it off to NAFA. With this option gone, the country buyers that remain won’t be willing to take on added risk, and may not pay much for fur until some market certainty returns. That said, a savvy buyer with an appetite for risk could do quite well over the next year or two.
Broad Fur Price Outlook
We’ve struggled with low fur prices for a long time, but over the past few years I’ve predicted the low prices would bottom and start to rebound around 2020. That prediction is based on the production cycle for ranch fur and the clearing of the overproduction of fur in the market. That is happening right now. After several years of rock bottom prices, mink ranchers around the world have pelted out and gone out of business over the past 2-3 years. Their excess production continues to work through the supply chain, and there won’t be nearly as many ranch mink entering the market until a couple of years after fur prices recover.
As a general rule, most wild fur follows ranch fur prices. That’s because if given a choice, buyers prefer the ranch product due to its large quantities of uniform goods. It just makes large scale production of most items much easier. When ranch fur gets expensive, it is often substituted with wild fur, and wild fur prices go up. So as the availability of ranch mink and fox dries up, and demand returns, we should begin to see increasing prices of wild mink, muskrat, beaver, otter, raccoon and fox. That’s a big ‘if’, but I think we’re headed in that direction.
The fur market also depends on demand from the major fur consuming countries, mainly Russia and China. Both countries’ economies are struggling, and the strength of the U.S. Dollar makes fur even more expensive for them to purchase. The lack of a solid trade deal with China has been a challenge as well. Most folks would look at these factors and think we’re in a worst case scenario for fur across the board. I look at them and see a bottom that the market should begin crawling out of over the next couple of years.
2019-2020 Market
With so many uncertainties around how wild fur will be sold this year, it will be challenging to track the market and prices. Without NAFA to go to, buyers will be looking to FHA, as well as a number of medium and large regional fur buyers like Groenewold, Zander, Petska, etc. Trappers may have a tough time deciding where to sell. State association fur sales should see an uptick in attendance, and a lot of fur may remain in freezers until some certainty arises in the market. That said, I do not expect fur prices to go any lower this year than they’ve been the past couple of years. We’ve hit the bottom, and the only question is how long it’ll be until we see recovery. I look forward to watching this new fur market unfold.
Fashion vs. Utility
The fur market is driven by two types of consumer demand: fashion and utility. Fashion trends often drive the high end market for select high quality pelts, and can help support high fur prices for specific items. For instance, the beautiful white black-spotted furs worn by affluent women in Russia is supporting the market for top end Western bobcats. The fur-trimmed hoods on Canada Goose parkas is driving the incredible demand for coyotes. Other furs like muskrat and otter have benefitted from fashion trends in the past. This can be great for fur prices, but can be devastating when the fashion trends go away.
Fur is consumed as a utility in many places due to its incredible warmth, durability and functionality. Populations in cold climates wear lots of fur, and consume most of what’s not used in the fashion market. This is great for items not supported by fashion trends, like raccoon and muskrat, but utility demand can challenge fur prices because consumers aren’t paying a great deal for these items, and price doesn’t react as well to shorter supply, since demand tops out at a certain price point, above which consumers just can’t afford.
2019-2020 Fur Price Forecast
Coyote
The coyote market has been the one exception to the low fur market the past several years. The success of Canada Goose and their high end parkas trimmed with coyote fur has been the sole driver of coyote prices, and this should continue into the upcoming fur season. The best quality Western coyotes should average $70-100, with semi heavy Westerns and top quality Easterns averaging $40-50. If demand continues to be strong, it can bring up demand for coyotes from the South and Midwest, but these prices could be volatile, likely ranging from $15-30.
Beaver
Outside of the hatter market, where beaver pelts are ground up and used to make felt hats, the demand for beaver has been almost nonexistent lately, and the spread between low end and high end beaver has all but disappeared. Most beaver will continue to average $10-14 regardless of where they are produced. There is a possibility, however, to see some upside in this market if some of the traditional uses for beaver start to come back in style with fewer ranch mink pelts on the market. If that occurs, we could see $15-20 averages for beaver from the better sections.
Muskrat
Expect $3-4 averages for rats this year, with potential for some upside. With fewer ranch mink on the horizon, we could see higher prices as the season unfolds.
Mink
Wild mink have been low for a long time, and with furriers often substituting ranch mink with muskrats, it may take more movement in the overall market for mink prices to recover. Expect around $5 for females and possibly $8-10 for males.
Otter
Just like they have the past few seasons, otter should average around $20-30 this year.
Raccoon
Some demand is beginning to develop for the higher quality raccoon pelts that come from the upper Midwest. Much of this is likely driven by lower priced substitutes for the popular coyote-trimmed parkas. The better coons could average $10-15. There is a great deal of variability in coon pelt, both in size and fur thickness. Lower end coon may average $5 or less, and some may not be sellable until the market develops further.
Red Fox
The market hasn’t had much use for red fox in recent years, but the price should maintain a bottom of $10-15. Ranch fox are going through the same overproduction and financial troubles as the mink industry is, and lower quantities of ranch goods may help wild fox a bit.
Bobcat
The cat market has recently been characterized by a huge price difference between the high and low ends of pelt quality. The top Western cats with wide white, spotted bellies are still in demand for the high end fashion market and should continue to average $300-400, but this market is highly specialized and doesn’t have much use for the rest of the cats. Bobcats from most other parts of the country should average $30-60, with some falling in between the two extremes.
Lynx, Marten and Fisher
Demand for these three items is specialized and not very strong as of late. Lynx have moved along at $60-70 averages for years, and should continue at this level until something changes. Marten experienced weakness late last season, which points to potentially lower prices this season, at least until the unsold goods work their way through the market. Most lower 48 marten should average $20-40, while the big and dark Alaskan and Canadian marten may bring $50-60, with some upward movement potential later in the season. Fisher prices can fluctuate widely, and may bounce around between $20-40 this year, with potential for upside.
Hillbilly that is a great average on easterns. Do you get many color variations? We get everything from red, blond to black which doesn’t help the average. Hope to lay a few pieces of steel this weekend. It is the start of PA ‘s fisher season. Wish I had more time. Trapping is far from dead. Trappers are the canary in the mine. When we go, hunting will be soon to follow. Everybody should support your local and national trapping organizations and take a kid out on the trapline with you. It is better than waking up on Christmas morning. You never know what the next trap may hold . Good luck to everyone stringing steel this year!
I have a lot of clearcut here on my place in Ms. lots if roads through it that the coyotes are using. I have only caught a few in Duke 1.75 dirt hole sets. I only have time for about 2 dozen sets and would like to get some better traps. What are you guys using? Was looking at some of the fully modified traps, but I’m not sure.
Thanks mad trapper. Your comments are spot on. I usually get a handful of reds a year and a couple blonds. Haven’t caught a black yet but a few guys I know have. Shiloh a lot of guys like the mb550. They are pricey but the ones I have are very well built. We got 4” of snow last night hopefully they ran before and after it quit. I’ll find out after work.
JL's link shows some good averages from the FHA sale, however it doesn't say what percentage of the hides were sold. They may have only sold the top 10%.
I had a good weekend. I picked up 3 coyotes over the weekend. One was on the classic 2-track set. The farmer drove through a CRP field a few weeks ago so I set both tire tracks and yesterday there was a 37 pound male waiting for me. The other 2 came from swampy ground where I broke trail and made sets as I walked through. With this deep snow, they will have to use my trails eventually. I stepped off my snowmobile trail and was up to knee deep snow. Looks like it will be cold mid-week (-15) so they should move again.
Nothing today. Didn’t even cut a track in the new snow. Guess they holed up last night. Getting more snow now. They probably won’t move much until Wednesday now.
I was in my stand yesterday afternoon deer hunting and had two responding to the doe in a can call. One was a long howler and one was a responding yipper. Couldn't get them to come in though. I had the Sony cam set up too.
Your right about one thing elkpacker. It’s not bow hunting. The yotes don’t die much quicker or ethically than a 22 to the brain at close range. Not sure what your thinking on that part is.
One of the amazing things I have learned on the Wisconsin site is if you use your Bowsite filter you can eliminate the undesirable posts you see. "You" simply don't open them. Trapping is hunting related, It is done to control predation on the deer herd. Any time and thing I learn is appreciated.
Unfortunately so will the game in Colorado when they re-introduce the wolf.
The "predator" is the latest tool of the anti-hunting crowd. Let the predator population explode with no controls and you eliminate one of hunting`s greatest arguments....herd control.
If predators can control the herds there is really no "need" for hunters....eliminate the excess game animals and you eliminate the "want" of hunters.
If you think there is no stepping stone from eliminating trapping to eliminate hunting your crazy. It`s "death by 1000 cuts".....you can`t let them get their foot in the door.
Good looking yote WV. -30 here this morning when I checked. It was a good check just because the truck and snowmobile actually started. No coyotes but maybe tomorrow.
2 more days and I can start laying steel. Not counting the #1 long spring set in the shed which yielded a pack rat today. Not much money in those hides.
Elkpacker1 do you have any evidence or experience to back your statement? I haven’t seen any pictures on here that show what your saying. How could the coyote in the last pic I posted be asleep when I walked up if it was in such agonizing pain and discomfort? People that don’t know any better make statements like yours all the time. Try educating yourself with real facts and experience. Like I’ve said in past threads if all sportsman aren’t together then all sportsman will loose. Sounds like your playing for the other team. You’ve got a choice don’t click on the thread if it hurts you feelings.
Elkpacker1 probably isn't that unusual. For a number of years I had a military friend that I let hunt my farm. He was from Colorado and when I told him that I was trapping coyotes he was very hesitant to keep hunting. We went for a walk and I showed him one of my sets, which of course he couldn't see. I told him to go ahead and step on the trap and then once it was fired I'd show him how it all worked. He acted like I had just threatened him. That was when I realized that he was scared of the traps!
So I stepped on it with my boot and it wouldn't fire. Then I had to put my hand on it to get it to trip. I made a fist and pushed slowly. He was visibly nervous and must have thought that I was about to lose my hand. Of course, the trap sprung on my wrist. So I calmly stepped on both sides and released my hand. No big deal.
He saw for the first time how a foothold trap works and saw that it wasn't a big deal. He also said that trapping was (mostly) illegal in Colorado and had never seen a foothold. This was a Duke 1-3/4. He just didn't know better. He didn't know that traps just hold the animal. That they don't really cause any real amount of pain. Of course nearly every trapper has caught himself more than once when setting traps.
My guess is that Elkpacker1 might be an avid hunter from a part of the country that doesn't allow much trapping so he/she is ignorant. Or, possibly, he/she is actually an anti and is just trolling us.
I’d like to put some coyotes to sleep on my property. I wish power snares were legal here.... but we have to use non lethal snares here in Michigan. I’m a newbie trapper.... having only caught raccoons so far. My buddy retired to the U.P. 2 years ago and has caught a nice bobcat,,,, A few otters and several beavers.
Trapping isn't for everyone, and that's OK. I thought I wanted to be a trapper 30 years ago and when I took the CT trapping class, I only made it halfway through. I probably had the same feelings as Elkpacker, and didn't finish the class. Five or six years later, after educating myself more on it, I took the course again. I became a nuisance wildlife control operator (NWCO). I still hadn't done any fur trapping for another two years. Squirrels in a house is a lot different than a free ranging beaver or coyote. I went on to fur trap for about 14 years, catching every native species in CT, except a bobcat. I still want to catch a cat, but I've lost the drive to check and maintain traps daily. I'm still a NWCO though as my main income.
Elkpacker, educate yourself more on the subject and your view may change. I believe it was Illinois that benefitted from trapped otters that were relocated there. Illinois didn't have any and a bunch of them were trapped with #11 double long spring foot traps and released in that state. If the foot traps were so cruel, the otters would not have survived to repopulate the state.
There are enough pics on on this thread of steel leg traps. If I were a troll they would be on the internet like others who posted pics of animals they kill in Africa or shot a Elk on a reservation and so on. I live in WA and bow hunting Elk with my recurve horse and mules is my thing. I do not allow trapping of anything on my ranch excepte thos #$%^^ moles. I stick a flare in the holes and gasem. As to coyotees and ocassional big cat going after my small dog chickens or new born colts. I put on a guillie suite armed with a 870 pump 18 inch barell loaded with 00buck. I call them in close say 15 feet and no more yote. After I started this the yotes started staying away from my barn and working the moles and what ever else they go after. When I was a kid in Maryland we belonged to the izak Walton league. Nice pond with an infestation of musk rates. Some went down trying to shoot them with a shotgun while n the water and or trap them. Many a leg trap had a chewed off paw. I took my Winchester 70 FW 243. other side of the pond. Killed 5 in one evening.. the problem was they were tunneling through a dam causing damage. No , I do not nor ever under stand traps unless for vermin.
I’m a Police Officer in a medium sized suburban area (about 25 square miles)..... where trapping and hunting is illegal......
We have regular outbreaks of distemper in raccoons and skunks,, And mange in coyotes.....
That is natures way of controlling overpopulations of those animals. We get sent every day to sick raccoons and skunks in peoples yards during these outbreaks.......
Trapping helps to manage populations and maintain health in those populations........
We also have large numbers of car deer collisions. You can either allow hunting.... or deal with the consequences. Same goes for trapping.
Interesting Elkpacker1. I took my hunters safety class at the Izaak Walton League in Gaithersburg, I think it was off of Clopper Rd. There was a pond there that my buddies and I used to catch bass. Wonder if it was the same pond where you shot the muskrats?
Anyhow, if a person doesn't want to trap that's certainly up to them. No doubt that living on a ranch you've seen your share of vermin. Muskrats are well known for burrowing through dams. If you choose methods such as hunting for muskrats/coyotes/big cats that is certainly up to you. But, it is hard to deny that trapping is MUCH more effective. And, they are just as dead either way in the end.
I only have 5 dozen or so sets out on 3 properties, and a lot in the truck ready to go. I would like to double that over Christmas break but with this snow and lack of trails with tracks on them, it has been challenging. I'm seeing a few tracks, but in random spots or on snowmobile trails out in open fields.
I had a coyote on one swamp last night but it would not walk on my packed down path. It paralleled me and crossed my tracks but would not walk down them towards my sets.
Elk stabber, that is the place. lived of Clopper rd for many years. Yes the pond had nice bass/blue gills. years later they stocked it with trout. The creek behind the bond had excellent fishing as well
Elk stabber, that is the place. lived of Clopper rd for many years. Yes the pond had nice bass/blue gills. years later they stocked it with trout. The creek behind the bond had excellent fishing as well
Elk packer, in all the years I have trapped, starting at 8 years old, now 73, I have seen only one trapped animal chew it’s foot off. It was a coon. They don’t intentionally chew the foot. They chew the trap and because the foot is numb, don’t realize they are chewing the foot too. I have released more animals in my lifetime than most and have never had more than a scratch on a foot, especially with my offsets and neoprene covered jaws. If you had left those muskrats alone and not blasted them, nature would have got them with a virus that lasts in the holes they make for 7 years. I make good money off anti-trappers after beavers flood their property. $500 per beaver. I don’t do their killing for free, plus they are excellent to eat, as are muskrats. I use a 330 conibear on beaver and 110’s for muskrats. Instant death when that bar hits the back of the head. No wounding or suffering involved and the animal isn’t simply wasted as vermin. I never kill a woodchuck. I trap him and relocate. The same with skunks. A lot of people could be rightfully labeled as vermin. Animals are just animals, out making a living. We send arrows through deer that run off bleeding to death, arrow bear and listen to them give out a death moan, but despise trapping. Antis show videos of foxes in traps but never show a mouse in a trap writhing in agony or fighting one of those sticky traps. Pretty wins every time. As a biologist, I call it hypocrisy, or ignorance.
Good posts big bear and lawdy. Elk packer if the guys setting for muskrats would of set up the traps to drown the rats they wouldn’t of had the twist offs. Rats are one of the hardest fighting animals in a trap. They will actually flop around so much they break their leg and twist free. That’s why it’s important to make the set so they get in deep enough water to drown quickly. Doesn’t seem like your opinion will change, even with the great posts others have directed your way. It’s a long ways to travel but your more than welcome to come out here and run the line with me to see first hand how the animals react and their condition when caught.
Today was one of those days you wish you had 50 more sets out. Every property had tracks in the snow. I got four today. Three in snares and one foothold. One of the snared ones chewed out so I brought three home. For those who don’t know a chew out is when the yote chews the cable into.
Like pics here caught in steal traps, and others saying how they caught domestic cats and dogs had to unsnare them. How many are not. There is a strong reason trapping is all but dead. Mostly cause the pelts bring very little. No, my mind will never be changed. When I pack in every year for two - three weeks during archery elk I delight in seeing other animals roaming the wilderness .
I guess cant have my own opinion and beliefs., I must be speaking to some closet Democrates . As the pictures show the animals in steel traps it is very cruel. Whats the title of this string. If this is all some of you can do to make extra $$.
"I guess cant have my own opinion and beliefs., I must be speaking to some closet Democrates ."
Democrates, he was a Greek philosopher, right?
You are welcome to your opinions, but as the late, great Jeff Coggins said, "If you are going to be dumb, you better be tough".
Do you eat those moles and coyotes? If not, you might offend Democrates. I presume you would be perfectly fine if he decreed that you were no longer able to gas moles or kill coyotes unless you did - on account of it offending his sensibilities?
Far from a d elkpacker. My opinion is saddles, bits, and horse shoes are animal cruelty. Also putting a bunch dead animal parts on your horse or mules back and forcing it to pack the extra weight off a mountain side probably isn’t something your animals have good dreams about. See how that works. It’s a uniformed opinion. What’s cruel about the trap pictures? It’s just a device holding the foot of a animal. I see no blood or gore in any of the pictures. Not much different than big bear handcuffing someone.
By all means keep your opinion and don’t try to research or understand anything more about what your saying. Kinda sounds like a dem strategy right there.
I’ll be sure to give ya a nod across the fence when the rest of us are fighting for your right to trad bow.
Ya might try not clicking on the thread anymore since it hurts your little feelers so much.
If I lived closer Hillbilly.... I’d love to follow you on your line to learn how to trap.... I’ve set for coyote and bobcat... but have never caught either. Here’s a picture of a bobcat I killed on a hound hunt with my son a few years back. Keep up the good work of keeping the trapping heritage alive...!!!!!
Thanks big bear. Great pic. Probably even better time spent with your son. Your more than welcome to come along if you ever get the time to make it down here.
ElkP1....I've been reading your posts. I understand where you're coming from but I think your logic maybe selective. If an animal pictured in a trap is cruel and people make money off of it, then wouldn't it be cruel for you to show a pic of your elk with an arrow stuck in it? Plus....you paid money to shoot that elk. Animal in trap - Elk stuck with an arrow...........bait plot - bait pile. I think trapping and hunting are doing the same thing, just different methods. With your logic, ya might have a tough position to hold when you say one is bad and one is good when both have the same end game.
My kids all hunt but one daughter, and my granddaughter started accompanying me on the trapline at 2. She is now 13 and makes a better set than me. She is a very good mink trapper and at 7 trapped a huge 55 pound coyote. All my kids took the trapping class but work and family have kept them off the line. I consider trapping to be a life skill. Everyone says that if catastrophe ever hit this country they would live off the land. Good luck, especially if guns and ammo were gone. Regardless, we would find big game very scarce, especially if everyone was out there, private land or public. Trappers with simple monofilament would make snares for rabbits and squirrels no fed would find. Again, it’s a basic life skill.
To show my appreciation for you guys out there trapping if you or one of your kids get a unique animal or if it`s their 1st animal they trap I will tan that hide at no charge.
I have been tanning for over 35 years and tan for many taxidermists. Doesn`t matter what species and that even includes skunk (that`s the animal many kids get for their 1st animal... lol". Shoot me a pm and I will give you the details.
If we could legally keep a bobcat, I would definitely contact you, even if it cost me. We tried but were defeated by the antis. Now they are complaining about too many bobcats taking songbirds and house cats. Unintended consequences.
Respect for the animal is one thing I hear from anti-trapping people. If I didn't respect the animal, would I get up every morning at 4:45 when it is -30 to make sure my line is taken care of and that if there is an animal there, it will not have to wait any longer than it has too? These are the same people than have never been in the woods and came upon a blood trail that leads to a coyote killed deer. If you want cruel, follow the blood trail through the woods and find the parts of the deer that were ripped away as it struggled to fight for its life. If that doesn't make you sick, you have no respect for animals. I don't know of anyone who respects the animal than me. If I didn't have respect, I wouldn't bust my butt to be there every day or call in sick to track deer for a friend. It is all about the animals and being a STEWARD OF THE LAND.
People make the mistake of countering an emotion based argument with a factual or logic based argument. If it worked no one would smoke or be overweight. If I am reading it right Elkpacker opposes because of the lack of fair chase. I can see that as a valid reason to oppose. There is a sense of fairness involved, a basic human emotion. Trapping is needed in most urban areas because man has created in imbalance in the eco system. Cats, dogs , chickens, sheep garbage, gardens , open space , browse , deer etc. etc. create an opportunity abundance that nature fills. As a way of addressing the issue most find it’s easier to kill to remove the over abundance. Until they have an emotional attachment to the species. If some one were to kill and dump trophy class deer that were eating their flowers and gardens I imagine most would say the same thing as Elkpacker. A farmer here did that Legally with elk and the hunting community was outraged and wanted the practice banned. Same shoe, different foot, so to speak.
The reason I made the offer is I have done this in the past for youth trappers. I can`t tell you how many letters I got from parents and kids that were so appreciative, respectful and proud of the animal they trapped. Try finding a kid that will sit down and hand write a letter today and thank someone for a kind gesture. These are the kids I want to be around.
Trapping teaches a lot more than how to set a trap.
Not sure about “lack of fair chase” when I am trying to get a coyote to put his foot on a 2” square of ground when he has 100’s of square miles to avoid it.
A coyote is the only animal that can dig up a trap without tripping it, and then, just to make you feel even worse, take a dump on it. Probably the toughest animal to trap.
“Not sure about “lack of fair chase” when I am trying to get a coyote to put his foot on a 2” square of ground when he has 100’s of square miles to avoid it.”
Except you don’t randomly place the trap you target very specific areas. Would you rather be hunted or trapped on the way to dinner?
Whitey, I would rather try to avoid a trap than walk to a food source, probably placed there by a human or grown to attract me, where danger is in the trees or some camoed up guy is waiting with a rifle or bow with ozonics, Scentloc, or nosejammer anywhere’s from 10 to 200 yards away. As a coyote, I can smell you up to 8 hours after you have been to that set. Obvious that you have never trapped or tried to trap a coyote. Trapping isn’t easy and is the most regulated activity you can do in the woods. Letting predators multiply beyond the carrying capacity is a recipe for disaster for both prey and predator. Trappers take or try to take the excess. We leave the seed so we can come back next year. Unlike bows, guns, etc, our traps and equipment hasn’t changed in hundreds of years. Pretty primitive. We really have to scout and learn about furbearers to even have a chance at success. Take a trapping course and even if you don’t intend to trap, you will hopefully understand what it is all about. Most of my fellow biologists trap.
Lawdy, Not once have I argued against trapping. Re read what I said it should be clear that only speculated why someone else might be opposed to it. The only thing obvious is that you substitute assumption for knowledge. Mining and logging are far more regulated than trapping.
Lawdy.... I can attest to that.... I have set dirt hole sets and snares for coyotes... and haven’t caught one yet. Bobcats are supposed to be easier to catch than coyotes.... but my sets for them have produced nothing. Someday I’ll catch one...... I had a pack of coyotes yipping all around me while deer hunting my place this year. It sounded like there was 10 of them.
My apologies Whitey, but when I talked about regulation I meant in relation to animal harvest. I log and there is no way I am regulated as much as when I trap unless I log on fed land which I will not do. Not worth it.
BB, I always set two or three traps at each set. Coyotes can’t count. For a really clever one I make a set using a horseshoe instead of a trap, and the coyote plays with it and gets used to it. After rebidding it a dozen times, I substitute the trap for it. It sometimes works. We can’t use snares here so you have to get creative. I only trap in deep snow up here with frozen ground so I only use grapples. Tough trapping. Up here the coyotes feed at the deer feeding stations. They love grain and whack deer that get off the beaten trails into deep snow. They do a number on beagles too. One guy up here lost two. I had my male attacked while hare hunting last winter but I was close and my beagle is one tough customer. He got bitten but held his own. I use tracking collars and never leave a hound in the woods even if I have to spend the night. Running coyotes up here with big hounds is huge up here. One hunter in Milan, NH below us averages over 50 per winter. I watched two of his hounds chase down a big tired coyote across my cut and kill it. It was quick.
I’m glad that Lawdy pointed out that the trapped paw GOES NUMB pretty quickly. Yes, sometimes they chew at the trap and don’t recognize the numb toes as being part of their foot.
But I have to agree that for non-hunters and Antis, pics of animals caught in traps are really disturbing/inflammatory. You simply can’t imagine what other people will imagine on behalf of that “helpless” animal, and the Antis will only play those emotions for all they’re worth. These are the people who promote the idea that putting out bait to hunt bears is the same thing as the Medieval practice of Bear-Baiting. They have no clue, and the ignorance of those willing to believe them is their greatest asset.
I should be able to set kill traps like power snares and conibears on my own land.......
It’s the non hunters that push for non lethal snares and footholds to protect domestic dogs that trespass onto my property. Yet I can concede that non lethal snares and footholds are good to help maintain the right to trap...... by not accidentally killing someone’s dog that trespassed onto my property.
There were coyote tracks all over in the snow where my deer gut pile was last weekend. The guts are long gone. Unfortunately I can’t set traps for them right now.. because I’m only out here on weekends. I might have to try to kill some with a rifle.
I made a few sets yesterday. Took my time, tried a couple of different ones, just enjoyed myself. Figured with the fur prices what they are, exercise and enjoyment is where I'll profit the most.
Ran the taps before church this morning, had 2 possums and a rabbit, turned them all loose. Had to wake up both possums, they were sound asleep. The rabbit was in a #2 - 4 coil and wasn't hurt much at all. He was at a set I spent too much time on, (long story behind that that dates back a few years). I have 5 traps set at that spot and the bunny managed to spring 3 of them. Didn't have time to remake them, I'll head back out there in a bit and do so. One of the possums had both feet on the left side caught in the trap, leave it to a possum to pull that off as well. Always fun when you connect even if it is not what you were looking for,
I noticed something interesting in following this thread, many of the arguments Elkpacker is using to denounce trapping are the same ones I've heard directed at bow hunting.
As a trapper, the last thing you want is for the animal to be in pain. You want them to be as comfortable as possible. I always liked long chains with lots of swivels. No sharp edges on the jaws. So many fox and coyote, where I could see the set from a distance, were curled up asleep.
Raccoon fur mittens with braintanned buckskin leather
Raccoon fur mittens with braintanned buckskin leather
Coyote hat and headband
Coyote hat and headband
Beaver trapper hat with braintanned buckskin ties
Beaver trapper hat with braintanned buckskin ties
Fur is the warmest clothing material on the planet. I tan every animal and catch and turn them into wonderfully warm mittens, hats, and headbands. The temperature can be well below zero and I'm warm and cozy with my fur. It's the ultimate green, renewable resource.
Beautiful work jmiller. Your doing something there not many folks can do nowadays. I’ve tanned a few muskrats, beaver and deer hides but don’t have the talent to turn them into a garment yet.
One coyote today. Had a big rubbed place on the back that was just starting to fur back up and another on the leg so she wasn't worth skinning but at least the chickens and the fawns are safer.
When I went back yesterday afternoon to reset the traps the rabbit had thrown, I had a house cat in the trap that had caught the possum. He wasn't hurt. I recognized him and even though he was a little too far from his home to suit me, we had a discussion and I turned him loose. He laid there while I remade the set, I had to carry him out in the field and tell him to go home before he would leave. Shortly after that, I managed to catch my thumb in a #3 offset. First time I've done that in years. And as proof I was listening in class at church when we talked about guarding your tongue, all I said was mmph! while thinking, "I really wish I hadn't done that." ;)
Keep after em fella's, especially the Coyotes. WI Shedhead nice picture of your son and his coon, wondering what make and model the nice old 22 rifle is he's holding. Merry Christmas to all of you.
Yes! It is a lot of hard work, from baiting, to checking, to skinning and hide preparation. However, it’s another great excuse to get outside and help ranchers as well as deer populations! Merry Christmas everyone!
Good question JTV, it’s my son who mainly has the ambition for this...his closest spot is about 7 miles from our city, the furthest about 50 miles away. We find good areas, bait them, and place snares within 100-300 yds of the bait. Does that make sense? The only direction from our city we don’t snare, is South.
Can anyone tell me if road killed deer can be used for coyote snaring in Michigan ?? Assuming that I have obtained a road kill permit for the deer....... The Trapping Digest isn’t really clear on the issue.
Same to ya big striper. I got home late from wv yesterday so I didn’t get any of the line back up. I got two locations set back up this evening after work. It’s so wet here I need a boat to get to the rest of the line. Hopefully it’ll freeze this week and I can get back in action.
What a fascinating thread. I trapped a bit back in the late 70s early 80s. If I recall correctly we got $35 to $45 for a raccoon and $70 to $90 for a fox. Heck even an opossum was worth $4 or $5 . That was a lot of money for a teenager.
Of course I guess I'd run a big circle if my tail was in a trap.
Of course I guess I'd run a big circle if my tail was in a trap.
I didn't get to trap much this year, my oldest daughter was down from Alaska for the first time in a year and a half. She was so busy visiting that she couldn't go with me. She still talks about trapping with me when sh was little, (she'll be 30 this month). I've been going to pull traps all week but instead set a few more today after we put Katie on a plane back to her husband. I'll have to pull them Sunday, but anyway I needed to do something.
We talk about catch circles and here is the circle I found waiting for me today. There is a small log in the middle of that. The grinner was pretty upset and wouldn't sull up (actually charged me a couple of times), but I turned him loose anyway.
Good luck salagi. That’s the first time I’ve heard of a aggressive possum. Jtv I saw a possum doing the exact same thing this year sitting in a stand before dark.
wv hillbilly, I've had possums bare their teeth at me and hiss but that was the first one I've ever had actually come at me. He did so twice. It was kind of comical. I think it was more of a bluff charge than an actual "I'm gonna eat you" charge, but I was dodging just the same, those teeth are pointy and sharp. ;) I pulled traps yesterday, I'm done for the year. Once more, no money but lot's of enjoyment, I will be doing some varmint calling though I hope.
Well, since you asked .... (Didn’t anybody ever tell you to be careful what you wish for?
The difference between a pic of an animal in a trap and an animal being shot is that right up ‘til the shot is taken, the animal can escape.
And you have to stop pretending that we’re working around rational people here.
To a non-hunter who is not comfortable with trapping, that trapped animal is utterly helpless and waiting for the death that it knows is coming. They DON’T know that, of course, but you can’t stop another person from psychologically substituting themselves for the animal while bringing a whole bunch of human emotional baggage with them.
So it sets off a whole bunch of (literally) Sympathetic stuff that takes their rational processes off-line.
So the equivalence is that a dead animal is a dead animal; the false equivalence is in thinking that the PR value (for the Antis) is comparable.
Hey Dino, what are you getting for a prepared hide? Just was told today that a guy was snaring coyotes, got a young one from this year. Sold it to a guy for $30 and a large one would get $50 for it. No skinning or stretching, just selling the whole animal? Thought that sounded pretty good, but the guy buying must be getting "twice" that, I would think?
That’s a wrap for me. I pulled everything today. Had a cherry colored one in one of the last spots. Time to cut firewood for next year. Shoot some 3d and indoor paper shoots and get ready for September.
Arlone prices will vary depending on what part of the country your in.
This is our 5th one of the year. These boys get a charge out of checking the line. Oldest son dispatched the yote for me......his favorite part at the ripe old age of 7!!
This is our 5th one of the year. These boys get a charge out of checking the line. Oldest son dispatched the yote for me......his favorite part at the ripe old age of 7!!
Great thread,,this pic is my buddy that lives in Michigan, 80 yes i said 80..l years old,, i met this stud while bowhunting in the mid west. He was solo...and still rippin it...Fantastic dude... sent me pic of his trapping season so far...the pic is frame worthy. Whats sad is EVERYTHING (pelts on tne barn) that you see he was paid $ 110 for ... unbelievable.....
From BB, above: “it maybe (I think you mean may be) the photos of the live doomed animals that some find a bit unsettling”. Who finds it “a bit unsettling”? This is a hunting site, after all. I mean, we kill animals for fun here, right? Other than one illiterate that selectively likes to wipe out certain species above (moles, I think?), I didn’t notice anyone that seemed upset by this thread. To the contrary, this thread, along with others (like the annual Babine trapping thread) are some of the more popular posts on the site.
