Moultrie Products
Is Suffering Part of It?
Equipment
Contributors to this thread:
Candor 20-Dec-19
WV Mountaineer 20-Dec-19
Bake 20-Dec-19
stick n string 20-Dec-19
wyobullshooter 20-Dec-19
Paul@thefort 20-Dec-19
Franklin 20-Dec-19
redquebec 20-Dec-19
drycreek 20-Dec-19
GF 20-Dec-19
elk yinzer 20-Dec-19
Scoot 20-Dec-19
SBH 20-Dec-19
RD in WI 20-Dec-19
cnelk 20-Dec-19
Jaquomo 20-Dec-19
nmwapiti 21-Dec-19
hawkeye in PA 21-Dec-19
Bou'bound 21-Dec-19
LINK 21-Dec-19
Grubby 21-Dec-19
Jaquomo 21-Dec-19
Inshart 21-Dec-19
Ken Taylor 21-Dec-19
APauls 21-Dec-19
Zackman 21-Dec-19
Candor 21-Dec-19
altitude sick 21-Dec-19
GF 21-Dec-19
BOWUNTR 21-Dec-19
RD in WI 21-Dec-19
lawdy 21-Dec-19
Scar Finga 21-Dec-19
Brian M. 21-Dec-19
Jaquomo 21-Dec-19
Jaquomo 21-Dec-19
Scooby-doo 21-Dec-19
StickFlicker 21-Dec-19
TD 21-Dec-19
GF 21-Dec-19
Timex 21-Dec-19
Jaquomo 21-Dec-19
lawdy 21-Dec-19
Ambush 21-Dec-19
Huntiam 21-Dec-19
Jaquomo 21-Dec-19
APauls 21-Dec-19
Scoot 21-Dec-19
rooster 22-Dec-19
Jaquomo 22-Dec-19
Ambush 22-Dec-19
Duke 22-Dec-19
Scooby-doo 22-Dec-19
HH 22-Dec-19
RT 22-Dec-19
wyobullshooter 22-Dec-19
walks with a gimp 22-Dec-19
South Farm 23-Dec-19
SBH 23-Dec-19
Vonfoust 23-Dec-19
Brotsky 23-Dec-19
Helgermite 23-Dec-19
Will 23-Dec-19
From: Candor
20-Dec-19
I received my electric vest today. It is quite slick and I am sure will make enduring cold mornings much easier. Which brings up a question - much of the joy of bowhunting is that it is tough. So, if you could, would you buy a suit that would keep you utterly comfortable in all weather, were a suit like that to exist, not be bulky.... So you could hunt in any weather and not experience discomfort from head to toe. Step into -5 degrees with a 20 mph wind and it is no different than sitting in your easy chair.

I know that is not where this electric vests puts me. And this process started long ago.... But I expect in my lifetime I will see technology evolve to where it will require little toughness to get it done. We are already a fraction of the men our grandparents were. Life gets easier, which is seemingly great. I will be the first to say how much I enjoy duck hunting with neoprene or insulated waders or looking forward to pushing a button on my chest to microwave my kidneys and warm up on a cold day....

But how easy do we want hunting?

20-Dec-19
Yes I'd buy it and smile happily every time i set in it.

Referring to how easy hunting should or shouldn't be, I've never understood that. I hear the talk of this any simply wander what things must be like for other people.

If hunting is to easy, put a pack on and hunt elk for 13 days. Come here and walk in 5-6 miles in the area I hunt. Carrying a stand, day gear, and packing all that and a whole deer out in one trip. It is a lot of things but easy isn't one of them. Setting in a mid western state in a tree, when its single digits or less with wind, is a lot of things. However, easy ain't one of them. And, rifle hunting might be easy over a food plot or somewhere glass works for you. But, set yourself in heavy timber or brush, on a 70& slope, in COLD weather, 3 miles from camp, where a long shot might be 75 yards if you are lucky. And, try to kill a deer with a rifle when they come through moving. They could have elk horns on their head and you couldn't see them. So, any kill is a earned one in those conditions. It wouldn't be easy with a missile. Much less a rifle.

So, being comfortable to me is something that would only add to the enjoyment. There is enough suffering and fighting in every other sector of my hunting then to wander of it is too easy.

From: Bake
20-Dec-19
I look forward to the day that I can wear a light suit that cools or heats you to a comfortable temp.

I didn’t dress appropriately tonight, and I got cold. I’d much rather have been warm.

I’ve been miserable tired on elk hunts. I’d much rather have been in better shape

I don’t think misery is a part of it. I’m doing it for fun. Not to prove how tough I am

20-Dec-19
I bowhunt for a lot of reasons, the “challenge” is part of it, but that isnt a big percentage part that draws me. And being uncomfortable isnt any of the bit of challenge that provides any draw to me. Heck yes, id buy a suit that keeps me comfy in any temps, in a heartbeat. Because that would open up a lot more hunting opportunity to me.

20-Dec-19
Anything that adds to my comfort level, I’m all for it. The older I get , the more I hate being cold.

From: Paul@thefort
20-Dec-19
I guess we all could set in a manufactured "plastic" blind with heater or air conditioner. But wait, they exist now.

Not for me, I will to feel the chill of the air and or the sweat running down my back just like my caveman ancestors did! or Gee, like the animals we hunt. Well almost!!!!!!!!!!!

From: Franklin
20-Dec-19
There is something to be said for those that are physically and mentally tougher than others....they usually are more successful because they can endure and persevere.

Whatever keeps you in the game is definitely going to help.

From: redquebec
20-Dec-19
Easier is...just easier. I have a hobby, I read everything I can that is well written and well researched about how native american life and culture was changed, transformed and unfortunately destroyed less than 2 centuries ago. It is amazing to me to ponder how thousands of years of knowledge, culture, woodscraft and wisdom was quickly altered and even traded in for white technology. Guns, knives, traps, ropes, metal cookwares, certain articles of clothing, heck even coffee and sugar were quickly adopted by the natives.

Yes, there were some leaders that warned their people about losing their woodcraft. And yes, there were some that were fiercely proud, but the vast majority took to the new whiteman's technology because it was...easier. I think about this often when I'm sitting in the woods. I would love to have a deep knowledge base in aboriginal woodcraft, but we have it easier. Way easier.

Human's have consistently improved their lot in life by making life more comfortable and easier. I wonder what the future holds.

From: drycreek
20-Dec-19
What WV said, and the older I get, the better easy sounds.

From: GF
20-Dec-19
Yup. The older I get, the tougher I ain’t !

I’ve had hunts where I wondered if I was doing some kind of penance up front and others where I was basically comfortable all day long. I don’t feel ennobled for having been miserable some times.

But as Geirach once said, there IS something to be said for knowing how to take care of yourself in conditions in which some care must be taken.

And I do feel better for knowing that I’ve managed to spend long days outdoors in negative triple-digit windchills and sub-zero temps. 40 below is 40 below on either scale, and I’ve been outside all day long in that. It’s good to know that that kind of weather is survivable, and even better when you know how you did it....

From: elk yinzer
20-Dec-19
I'm good with old fashioned acclimation....for now. It seems like part of being a manly man. I guess I'll change my mind once I go through manopause.

From: Scoot
20-Dec-19
Yep for sure.

From: SBH
20-Dec-19
I’m with Paul! If it were easy...everyone would do it. I’m glad it’s uncomfortable and difficult at times. I love me some struggle. Makes me feel alive!!!

From: RD in WI
20-Dec-19
I love the fact that archery is hard and not everyone can do it. I also respect the hell out of people who have a mastery of things that I cannot grasp. Additionally, I am grateful when people who know things that I don't, help me - like a mechanic. I happily exchange my money for their expertise and feel blessed that they are available for me. As far as magic clothes, I like a slight sting of cold, so I am reminded of what I am enduring to kill my quarry. Without some difficulty, hunting would just be a video game. V/R - Rich

From: cnelk
20-Dec-19
Embrace the suck!

From: Jaquomo
20-Dec-19
I hunt naked, covered only in a thin layer of dried mud, because I want to truly experience the harsh essence of the hunt.

From: nmwapiti
21-Dec-19
For a second there I thought Lou was talking about chasing women...

21-Dec-19
Go get 'em Lou! LOL

I prefer to keep my hunting simple and some what "economical".

From: Bou'bound
21-Dec-19
the dynamics changed the day people no longer needed to go anywhere near the deer woods to scout. sit in front of screen and see what is where and when

only endure the inconvenience of actually going to the woods when the season is in.

From: LINK
21-Dec-19
If they made a package of wet paper towels that could be used for bathing or wiping your rear would you use them while roughing it in the mountains.....Oh wait. ;)

From: Grubby
21-Dec-19
Making sure you don’t suffer is more a part of it. I will definitely endure some misery but I sure don’t need to suffer to enjoy myself.

From: Jaquomo
21-Dec-19
I only use Sitka mud..

Seriously, suffering on occasion is part of hunting, when things sometimes go sideways. But anyone who goes out of their way to "suffer" for some sort of self-flagellation penance needs to see a shrink.

From: Inshart
21-Dec-19
I enjoy "easy" as much as anyone, but every time I take that pack full of elk meat off and set it on the tailgate or next to the tent, with the sweat literally dripping from every spot on my body, I sigh and collapse to the ground completely spent. The next morning I realize pre-hunt fitness is a good thing ....... that is the best "not easy" there is.

From: Ken Taylor
21-Dec-19
Where I live, depending on something with batteries to keep you warm in the winter has the potential to put you in a very bad situation.

21-Dec-19
From the title I thought we were talking about marital experiences.

From: APauls
21-Dec-19
Is buy it for the same reason I drive to my hunting spot instead of walking. It’s more comfortable, efficient, and effective.

But I do get where you’re coming from. There is a certain “high” achieved from overcoming adversity. Speaking personally though, I achieve that same high when persevering through nasty weather with good gear and I am comfortable.

From: Zackman
21-Dec-19
You wouldn’t bowhunt if you didn’t enjoy suffering a little

From: Candor
21-Dec-19
lol@ Habitat.

I do not like suffering. But I know that when I have suffered it makes success sweeter. It also keeps me tough but probably ages me disproportionately. It has to be one of the many reasons our ancestors had shorter lifespans. Life was an ass kicker. But I generally think our grandparents et al lived a life with a higher level of gratitude and I am certain that was because they generally just worked harder. Similar to any sort of negotiation, the tougher it is the more you enjoy when it works out.

But I believe it unarguable that tenacity and overall hunting skills are sharpened by having suffered and persevered.

And conscious recognition of this will likely not change my decisions on buying a fictitious heated suit that enables me to effortlessly glide through the woods immune to weather.

21-Dec-19
I agree there is a certain feeling of peace or contentment. When in extreme places or conditions.

WHEN you are prepared. And have the appropriate gear.

From: GF
21-Dec-19
“Where I live, depending on something with batteries to keep you warm in the winter has the potential to put you in a very bad situation.”

I feel the same way about e-bikes! Or really any technology that enables a person to attempt things that they would shy away from without it.

Like Lou said - sometimes things go sideways and you’re out there On Your Own. And I have a bit of a history of getting myself into things that were a lot harder to get back out of even WITHOUT relying on technological assistance.

It’s a Gift.

From: BOWUNTR
21-Dec-19
Some would say that using a tree stand is uncomfortable... Ed F

From: RD in WI
21-Dec-19
Well said Inshart and Candor.

From: lawdy
21-Dec-19
We have a small motel and cabins near us that caters to sportsmen. Last summer a guy booked a cabin. When he arrived with his wife, they informed Rick, the owner that they were nudists. He didn’t know what to say but okay. The next morning both were fly fishing on the river naked. The game warden had to go down there we all watched him lead them out. They were a young couple. She was blonde, about 110 pounds, and gorgeous. Best customers Rick ever had and pretty exciting for this little village. Haven’t seen excitement like that since the 20 or so naked hippies went through the rapids on a giant Navy raft, replete with a keg and several bongs, and capsized. They all walked naked up the road to get back to their camp.

From: Scar Finga
21-Dec-19
I would buy it in a second! I live in the heat of the desert! I am a cold Sissy For Sure!!! Oddly, I also hate the high heat during the summer here. The rest of the year here is awesome. I was cold this am at 39, not freezing, but a little cold... But I am wearing shorts and a T shirt this afternoon:)

From: Brian M.
21-Dec-19
Yes, of course. Less layers and more comfort? Means longer hunts in worse weather and less bulk to interfere with a shot.

From: Jaquomo
21-Dec-19
GF, what you're missing is that anywhere you can get with an ebike, you can generally pedal out if something were to go wrong. You know, like a regular bicycle without the "e". In fact, much of my training rides in summer are done with no assist, so I'm riding a 50# fat tire bike.

Now if the technology on your 4WD vehicle fails, there ain't no pedaling it home... think about how many times you've used that technology to get into places you wouldn't otherwise....

From: Jaquomo
21-Dec-19
DP. Damned technology!

From: Scooby-doo
21-Dec-19
Bake said it all!! I believe comfort can make any hunt more enjoyable. I have started carrying a rather bulky chair cushion on my whitetail sits. It is a bit of a pain to pack in but makes a huge difference on a sit of 4hrs or more. The do all coverall would be awesome and I would spend thousands for one do it all weather one!! Shawn

From: StickFlicker
21-Dec-19
Less so as I get older!

From: TD
21-Dec-19
Wait a second..... we talking leather and chains or bowhunting???

If it were easy every Tom, Dick and urban metro liberal would be out there..... likely in their leather and chains..... batteries not included....

From: GF
21-Dec-19
I know it’s technically POSSIBLE to pedal a dead e-bike, Lou.... I’d just consider that UNDUE suffering!!

Question, though - can you unhook a couple of wires from that battery and use the juice to start a fire??

From: Timex
21-Dec-19
Probably the closest iv come other than socks with batterys & hand warmers. Is a Coleman stove in a duck blind not so much for heat but hot coffee. & chunky soup

From: Jaquomo
21-Dec-19
Technically possible? No, it's simply a 7 speed fat bike. No different than any other 7 speed fat bike. Like I said, I ride all over all summer with no battery or assist, climb hills with the battery turned off. Its just a bike. Not suffering anymore than pedaling my conventional MTB.

There are no wires to the battery. I suspect McGuyver could start a fire somehow. I have no clue how. Thats why I always carry a survival kit with five different ways to start fire.

From: lawdy
21-Dec-19
They sell ebikes here. The feds made all bikes illegal on their land up here. A father riding a pedal bike with his 10 year old daughter was stopped and arrested. The judge threw it out and gave the guy a warning. The crazy thing is that pickups are allowed, and of course, their people atv’s all over the place. Supposedly our land but they rule it. Communism. I walk and hunt deep. If a fed warden can’t drive there, he won’t go. Plus they quit at 4. Wicked lazy but I think it is great except for the fact we pay them one hell of a salary with bennies.

From: Ambush
21-Dec-19
Suffer when you have to to get it done. But to go looking for it?

When you were young, single and eager, did you look for girls with crabs, so you could suffer for the cause?

From: Huntiam
21-Dec-19
I got mine yrs ago..Heater Body Suit

From: Jaquomo
21-Dec-19
I got crabs years ago. Didn't go looking for it, figured it was part of the deal, like getting cold and stiff sitting on a bucket on a frozen lake when it was -20 in order to catch an 8 pound rainbow. At the time the rewards seemed to outweigh the unpleasantries.

Now I ice fish in an insulated portable hut, propane heater, color sonar flasher. Haven't had crabs since college. Must be getting soft...

From: APauls
21-Dec-19
Oh Jaq, a flasher? Bro you need Panoptix Livescope

From: Scoot
21-Dec-19
TMI Jaq. ;)

From: rooster
22-Dec-19
Yes, yes I would. I also scuba dive and living in NW Ohio the only local diving we have is quarries or the Great Lakes all of which require a heavy wet suit or dry suit. Could a guy dive these waters without a suit? Maybe but not for long.

From: Jaquomo
22-Dec-19
Agree on the Livescope. Back when I was ice fishing for money I'd have had one if it was available then. But for what I do now the Vexilar FLX-28 does a real fine job. Long way from a bucket and a spud bar like we used to do it back when I was younger, dumber and tougher.

From: Ambush
22-Dec-19
^^^...and could endure the crabs....

From: Duke
22-Dec-19
I personally don’t recognize any animal taken unless hunter is wearing a loin cloth and there’s a war party involved, preferably pre and post-hunt with obscure uncooked animal parts served as appetizers... Just my option though.

From: Scooby-doo
22-Dec-19
I got crabs as well years ago, hottest chick in high school no less. It was worth the cause a few baths in Kwell and the buggars were gone and we continued on when we were cured. I would love a do all camo get up, as it is now I carry all my clothes into my whitetail stands cause I sweat like a 3 dollar you know what. As I have gotten older I want comfort more than ever. shawn

From: HH
22-Dec-19

HH's embedded Photo
HH's embedded Photo
Hardeay or no way.

Gotta live hard to be hard.

K

From: RT
22-Dec-19
Hunting public land is all the suffering one needs. Might as well be warm.

22-Dec-19
No doubt RT! Not once have I ever thought at the end of a hunt “damn, I sure wish I’d suffered more”! lol!

22-Dec-19
We still have to think about our health and getting sick shouldn't be a requirement to take a big deer with a bow. I've had the crud for a long time now and have missed out on some hunting days. I've convinced myself that I do need to go to the doctor as I'm not going to shake this without meds, real meds... I say buy it if you can afford it and enjoy your outdoors. Just bought the wife a Heater Body suit and she likes it a lot.

From: South Farm
23-Dec-19
Misery is a state of mind. You can be pretty damn miserable spending thousands of dollars and lugging in all the crap in the world, all in the name of being "comfortable". Personally, I don't like anything "electric", because you risk failure and then what? I'd look into layering and buying the best non-battery operated outers you can find. One less thing to worry about.

From: SBH
23-Dec-19
I don't know who coined it but....."type 2 fun" I think I heard the sitka guy say it on a podcast but basically.....fun aint always fun for some of us! I can relate.

From: Vonfoust
23-Dec-19
Lou you've really painted a picture here. I've seen the xrays. That guy, with crabs, riding the backcountry on an ebike only covered in mud. Not really what I wanted to be picturing through the holidays!

From: Brotsky
23-Dec-19
The only suffering I do is when I'm at work and would rather be hunting. I can't compare any conditions I experience hunting to that level of misery!

From: Helgermite
23-Dec-19
I've always felt the greater the effort put forth, the greater the satisfaction of success.

However, this does not apply to freezing your ass off.

From: Will
23-Dec-19
Maybe on the suit, if it fit well and was durable and quiet, maybe I'd try it. That said, I do believe a long drag is a good, positive part of hunting. So I guess I like stuff that can make it harder in some ways...

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