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Discuss Bloodtrail 44 - lousy shot
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This bloodtrail is 100% real and it will not be easy. Use your head. Do not try to think like me as it will result in failure. Good luck.
i'm on it... 9 points already feeling like I gonna win this one.... Bring it Pat
The weather guys usually never get the forecast correct, so I figured I’d chance it.......9 for me, but it’s probably all downhill from here :-(
"Do not try to think like me..."
That is very good advice,....... for anyone........anywhere...... at anytime!!
I feel like I’m going to have 100% until I come to the question about the deer drive. :-)
Lol, Brotsky! You can’t see them in Pat’s pic, but there is a group of a dozen or so drivers hiding just inside the wood line. They do their best work 5 minutes after legal sunrise, and 5 minutes before legal sunset. Here in PA, there’s a deer driver or trespasser behind every tree! :)
Scored a 9 on Question 1!!! I think I’ll just quit now while I’m still undefeated!!
C'mon Josh.....Us PA boys are gonna kick ass on this challenge!!
Perfect score. I think I'll quit while I'm perfect :)
Question #1 was a no-brainer. Pending rain....pfttt...why would you be in a stand if that was a concern?
Bring on #2, Pat.
Got a perfect 9... Lol. How do you advance to the next ? I must have missed that part... :/
Oh, each day... Read..says my wife.
I'll stick by not shooting with heavy rain coming but I understand that it's a personal choice based on experience. As far as "why are you in the stand if you don't plan to shoot" comment, again personal choice. I'll many times sit out til past shooting light with no intention of shooting. I like being in the woods and I like watching critters.
Buck appears "5 minutes before legal sunset". What does "legal sunset" mean? It's legal to shoot 30 minutes PAST sunset in PA. Is this a trick question?
"Is this a trick question?"
Now you're getting the hang of this...
Here's one for you......Pat LeFemine is PARTICIPATING in the Bloodtrail challenge!! Check the scores, and you'll see his score. If he composed this challenge, wouldn't it be rather moot to participate in it?......What will REALLY scare me though, is if he doesn't get a perfect score!! LOL
Jake those CT boys needs all the help they can get.
Maybe he still hasn't found the deer yet and really just needs our help.
The next deer he loses Will be the first I think
Jake I participate in a few ??just to test the app behind the game. Of course I know the correct answers. I will choose both correct and incorrect answers.
I'm going to stop now, and use this as evidence that I'm perfect ha ha ha ha! In truth, it always feels good to get a bit of a win, as I usually blow these up!
That was a good CYA response, Pat! :-/
Wait... if he didn't shoot there would be no bloodtrail.
Troy, give up trying to pin down a man who's Indian name is Dances With Turkeys.
Busta, '5 minutes before legal sunset' in PA is 25 minutes past real sunset.
T-roy and Ambush, Spot on responses!!
I thought it was “Chases after Turkeys”?
I respectfully disagree with Pat . There is more than one correct answer to question number 1. I would elaborate but it would be unfair to others.
Still better than “One Who Flies With Inflatable Ewe” !
"Lousy Hit Edition?" Does that mean no trick questions, the challenge is already built in?
You guys are quick! I was gonna say to Bou……………………………….good thing this isn't a TURKEY blood trail! ;-)
Let's go! I've been waiting for another bloodtrail. Curious to see how challenging it's gonna be...
OK, Dances With Turkeys just got his revenge on me with question #2.
He's dead wrong, obviously, but what can I do :(
The comment " if are comfortable" is a different answer for each hunter depending on his skill the weapon and distance of the shot, 9 for me.
I’m paying so much attention there were already two clues before I even knew we had a new challenge. As usual, I started strong, and as usual, I’ll probably fart, start, stumble, and fall before it’s halfway done..........
so if this is the "lousy shot" challenge then the best shot on #2 must not be the right choice?? Should just have an arrow pointing at the guts.. oh wait he does.
Got 2nd answer right, but IMO, between A and D is my aiming point - a little higher and a bit further back. I don't like hugging the shoulder. Unless I'm using my Ravine :o
Rupe, quit counting, you're not good at math. :)
^^^^^^^ Ambush, I thought my third grade edumacashun was failing me there.......:-)
I would wait until that near front leg was brought forward before taking a shot but that's just me.
None of these shots are any good if that overhanging branch is in the flight path of the arrow.
The shoulder is extended back already . Would a liked up two inches from D.
I cant believe question 2 answer is D. the deers leg is back so that's a shoulder shot. Yes I'd shoot there with a gun.
There's more room in the "V" with the leg straight down or slightly back than there is with the leg forward. Doesn't seem logical, but it's true. The scapula tilts forward from the top "hinge" with the leg straight, and it hangs straight down with the leg stretched forward.
You're all welcome for your free anatomy lesson of the day.
I think we would all prefer that leg to be straight down or forward, but the situation as pictured/stated, i dont know how anybody could get that wrong. But thats just me....
Some guys need to do their own blood trail challenges so everything can be perfect
Stick......ALL my blood trails are challenges! Must be those cheap broad heads;-)
Tree hugger.....gotta disagree with your “shoulder” comment.
Of the options given, D is the best shot. We all know that a shot was taken, D may not be perfect for you, but knowing a shot was taken, D is the best.
Of the options given, D is the best shot. We all know that a shot was taken, D may not be perfect for you, but knowing a shot was taken, D is the best.
Scapula is not an issue. A few inches to the left and we'll hit humerus before we even get close to the scapula. There's your anatomy lesson.
"a new clue every day", that was 4 days ago. DA
I arrowed my first elk at 40 yards 5 minutes before dark and recovered her 40 yards later under headlamp. I arrowed my second elk 10 minutes before dark with pending rain. Watched her tip over and field dressed in the rain, in the dark. I think you have to have confidence in the shot and your ability to pull it off.
I don't understand the rationale for the correct answer on #3 - if I understand correctly, you are saying wait until midnight (when the rain is expected) to begin actual trailing???? Sounds like terrible logic to me - why would you not want to find/follow the trail well before the rain is expected, even if the shot was marginal?
if its going to rain at 12 ,why wait till 12 ?? 2.5 +.5 =10pm that was enough if you jump it and back out you can come back the next morning . you wold have a better idea of were he was . it would have gone a little farther and died it was a gut shot .m2c
Just wait til next Saturday at 1 if he’s dead now he will be dead then...also I would shoot between a&d for the second question... or at least I aim there prob hit in hoof..
As always, reading the discussion is as fun as playing the game.
I'd like to hear the reason behind waiting until rain starts to start looking for blood. I kind of thought you would want to find blood and move slow. Before your blood trail is gone since you said you have no idea where he left the field
My guess.....A check of the radar indicated the the rain was going to hold off until later. Finding the spot where the deer left the field may have indicated that it did indeed head towards the thicket and if left there long enough it would be dead in its bed. If they weren't able to find it that night before the rain they at least have a place to start grid searching after the rain. Push that deer and who knows where or far it goes and finding it after the rain becomes much more unlikely.
Sorry, but this just proves that just because you make the Bloodtrail Challenge doesn't mean you make the right choices. Correct answer for 3 should be to wait 2 hrs. Waiting only 30 min on that shot potentially pushes that deer deeper into the thicket and perhaps gone forever. There's a chance he bedded down just off the field edge. You should have had a general idea where he exited the field already with visual observation. Starting the search in 30 min is a bad choice.
I would not track to the wood line after in minutes. If he was bedded just inside he could be pushed even further.
I chose to wait 2hrs also. Ruined my perfect score!
None of the answers on Question 3 agreed with what I would do, I got part credit . I f I had read the answers in detail I would have a perfect score .
How could you not be focused on the deer you just gut shot! even a good hit you want a point you last saw the animal.I like 5-6hrs minimum even then they could still be alive.
I am 100% so far. Although I would have handled things different on Q3. I would try to give it a half hour, check my arrow and decide from there what to do. Sure looks like a gut shot from the video.
I chose the half hour thinking all deer exited the field looked like a gut liver maybe one lung shot to me. Arrow looked like it deflected toward gut so in the ribs on entry to me.
IMO, A is the best choice of the 4 options. Unless a significant vessel was hit in the guts (highly unlikely) the deer will probably still be alive, even after 4+ hrs. Possibly a liver hit, but looked too far back, IMO. By waiting 30 minutes before trying to find where the deer exited the field, if the deer was bedded, close, there would be a better possibility that it may have stiffened up and gotten sickly enough to stay bedded even if you get close during your initial search. I probably would have waited 10 minutes vs 30, but that wasn’t one of the options. Also, by finding for sure where the deer exited the field, it at least gives you a somewhat reasonable starting point if the rain washes out the blood trail. Personally, I’d wait till the next morning, because I’m betting the deer is still alive, even after 4.5 hrs, but that’s not a given choice either.
None of the choices for 3 are good ones. If this deer headed for thicket he is most likely bedded within ear shot of the field. Wandering around in the field 30 min. after the shot just increases the chance of pushing him farther away, and does nothing to increase the chances of finding him. Anything you find in the field 30 mins. after the shot will still be there before the rain starts. With the shot placement well behind the ribs a liver hit is unlikely unless this deer has an enlarged liver. The normal liver does not extend beyond the caudal edge of the rib cage. Best option would be to leave the area as quietly as possible and return at first light the next morning with as much help as you can find to start a grid search.
Don't think I'd wait until heavy rain to start tracking. I'd get on it within a couple of hours of the shot.
Completely disagree with the answer to question 3. The buck could easily be bedded just off the field. Trying to identify and flag that location with such a horrible shot is way too risky. If bumped 10 minutes after the shot you'd likely never find him. Of course you could get extremely lucky and get another opportunity to put a second arrow in him but you can't count on that.
Personally I wouldn’t wait til midnight. Two was reasonable to figure where he entered the woods and assess the blood along the way. Doesn’t look good up til that point back off - does look good go get him.
Just my .02
So your plan is to wait for the rain to start before you trail? Oh boys.
Thanks for doing these Pat. I disagree on question 3, but so what... I’d rather take my chances after 2 hours. You didn’t see where the deer went, etc... could be bedded anywhere - I wouldn’t risk bumping him so quickly like the “right” answer recommends. Looking forward to what I’ll learn from this bloodtrail.
Not sure what I'm doing wrong, but not getting a any response to my answer 3 submission, but have gleaned from the comments my answer was wrong.
“Do not try to think like me” he says.
Who in hell can do that, I say. ;-)
Calling for rain after midnight. Doesn't say rain AT midnight. Could be 12:30am, could be 3am. That shot looks like a gut shot to me. Chances are that deer is going to bed up and if undisturbed will die. In it's bed. Start bumping a gut shot deer is the surest way to NOT recover it. I would get down after 30 min or so, check the arrow and make a final determination. But based on the vid, I'm waiting.
loving the people that think 7pm +4 and a half hours =midnight
"weather forecast which calls for havy rain starting at midnight. "
I have no idea why one would wait until 11:30 to start tracking this deer.
You have to realize this is all subjective. The deer is the subject and Pat is the "tive"
I try to answer as soon as the clue comes out and always BEFORE coming on this discussion. I like to see what I would do compared to others without influence. And quite often there are definitely more correct answers than the one scored highest That's the subjective part.
If it makes you mad , don't play. Some guys just want to be right. Some want others to be wrong too, if they were. Some try to purposely mislead others if they were "wrong" and some try to throw others off in a good natured way.
For clue #2, (for me with my shooting skills) I had to choose between a shot I didn't like and one I really didn't like and I guessed "wrong". I had typed up a response about how the best shot, given the dark and rain, was a pure gut shot. Just slip out, come back in the morning and claim my deer freshly dead in his first bed within ten yards of the field edge. I deleted it before posting.
In the end it's just a deverserion. Nothing to be lost but perhaps some pride and we might even learn something. I've killed a lot of animals, but not many whitetail, so it's entertaining and educational for me and fun.
It’s a shame something as important as an internet blood trail game is treated so arbitrarily
But..but..but 11:30 is past my bedtime.
Bigfoot wait a half hour then wait 4.5 hours.
I would wait 4 hours before looking for where the deer exited the field. The only gut shot deer I have not found are the ones I have pushed too soon. Blood trails usually are not too sparse and you can move along on them quickly. Pushing a gut shot deer is worse than doing a body search for a 400 yarde radius. Understanding I am neither the subject or the ive of this subjective analysis.
I got this one wrong. I debated back and forth for a bit. If im waiting 5 hours til the heavy rains r gonna wash the trail away, im waiting til morning and not chancing bumping a potentially still live/bedded up deer. I will look in the daylight. But obviously the decision made paid off.
I didn’t care for ANY of the choices because none of them involved any information whatsoever about what was found on or around the arrow/site of the hit.
Guess I should’ve given the title of the challenge more weight and just assumed Worst Case.
As always I have the benefit of hindsight. I was tortured with my decision and in the end my decision turned out to be the right one. Stay tuned to find out why.
I thought the shot was perfect and took out lungs, etc. I would guess that deer went no farther than 100 yards and I had no issue with waiting for a little and then tracking. Rain at midnight or after? Hell, it would rain just at easy at 11 pm. Yep, a big 0 for #3. I really deserved a 9, maybe even a 12, but then not my game. Coyotes? Yep heard them just before I shot and even while I was waiting to get down. Honest! my best, Paul
Lungshot? He wasnt shootin at a goose, paul....;^)
Definitely not lung shot.
I think after getting down and seeing the arrow, that is the deciding factor. Pat has not shown the hit results on the arrow. Also, the angle of the camera is making it look more to the right. But, then again Pat could have gone on auto-pilot an moved his pin a little more to the right of the front leg.
Although none of the choices offered fit what I think I would have done I think Pat chose the best option listed.
I got three wrong or Pat did! I want an extra turn as I have never experienced "havy" rain.
Solid gut hit, obviously a dead deer, bad shot, damage done. The only question is whether or not you are going to push it before it dies and lose it. If you don’t push it, it’s not likely to go far. I know it’s gonna rain, you knew that too when you got in the stand and then botched a chip shot (we've all been there). You have to wait till dawn and grid. I don’t care if you got lucky and found the deer or not, the correct answer is not listed for question 3. Here’s the real question though, what is the correct answer for the rest of us, that don’t self video, and only have the memory of what we think we saw to go on? There's only one responsible answer. It’s obviously sleep and wait and grid at dawn.
Everyone needs to remember that you are not looking for a right or wrong answer, you are looking for what Pat's answer is. Sometimes the wrong answer is right and the right answer is wrong. :-)
I'm with Dave on #3. I got part credit on 1 cause I didn't like the position of the leg & figured he was trying to trick us some. Mine would have been just as good.
I see a gut shot deer. I'm waiting till morning. If I push it I lose it. If I wait coyotes may get a freebie but it is my only chance. Won't go far and will bed up. Cant risk pushing it. I didn't have that choice option in the game so I'm OUT.
Brotsky has it right. There are no right or wrong answers to these contests, just Pat's answers, which I often disagree with. #2 and #3 are examples of this.
D is right because he was shooting 'downhill', and a higher aiming point would have resulted in too high a hit. I agree with t-roy on the leaving it until the next morning, IF YOU KNOW IT WAS A GUT SHOT BY LOOKING AT THE ARROW. Why wait until it starts raining to go after it, when if gut shot, you'd likely chase it out in the dark in the rain and never see it again. The best option for a gut shot deer is to wait until morning and go when you can see, IMO. HOWEVER, To me, in the video, the shot looked like a liver shot. Obviously we didn't have the knowledge of the arrow green slime and watery blood, so IMO my choice to wait 10 min., mark the spot, and give it an hour and a half was the best option, to get on it with plenty of time before it rains and washes any potential blood away. Had I KNOWN the shot was a gut shot, I'd have either waited until morning, or possibly pick the 'right' choice (but I doubt it.) Another thing, the blood looks like the color of lung blood, so that was confusing. Had I been on this trail of a gut shot deer and saw that, I would have had renewed hope.
Seems when the weather man says its gonna start raining at noon.....I'm in tree getting poured on at 8 am....just saying.....lol
OK, so is it implied that the game is to guess Pat's answer, rather than the right answer? I must have missed that. Or is this just the consensus from past blood trail games? In the absence of the right answer (waiting till dawn) picking the next best answer of waiting the max time given was the only "good" choice, of course. I've watched/re-watched the shot several times on a large monitor now and it looks way too low and back to get liver.
I thought the shot was possibly liver and the back of the off side lung, but I’m half blind. Up until today’s clue we had no idea what tale the arrow told, so.......a day late and a dollar short on that stage of the game.
I like these games, even though they aren’t “fair” from this side of the iPad, because as Pat said, he has the benefit of hindsight and we don’t have all his info. I don’t get my panties in a wad about, it’s just entertainment. What the hell else am I gonna do until turkey season !
Pat, nicely noted, that we'd be grumpy on this one. So I just smiled at my correct answer of backing out and waiting till morning to do circles/grid/line of travel tracking with light, looking for the deer visually, rather than risking bumping a gut shot deer into the oblivion with rain on the way... which yeilded a 3. What? Ill admit, that blood splotch sure looked pretty good and bright, raising my optimism. But I think it's a question of "art" v fact here saying waiting till the morning is a 3 vs at least a 6 or something given, on a gut shot, you are likely close to the deer where you backed out. The rain is a risk, but so is tracking on the gut shot...
Ok, I'm done whining. Maybe. We will see what tomorrow brings :) ha ha ha!
I started this game thinking, "this should be fun", but also wondering why I hadn't participated in many of these bloodtrail challenges. I do recall doing a couple of these years ago. I remember now why I gave up on these. Clue 4 is why. I guess I'm one of those guys that "take this far too seriously". I do think teaching guys the wrong way to trail a gut shot deer is something we should take serious. Here are two excerpts from Clue #4: "The deer is obviously gut shot and very likely is still alive", "Pushing him too early pushes him further into the thickets". Despite these two very true statements and because rain is coming and presumably "the trail will be lost", the choice is to push the deer anyway and "hope for the best"? Really? Just because it is going to rain it's determined that "you will lose this buck" if you don't proceed. That's BS. I've found gut shot bucks covered in 6 inches of snow the next day with no bloodtrail and no tracks by doing a thorough grid search. Like I said, I don't care if you got lucky and found the deer, its the wrong call going that night. Most guys reading this that follow this advice will not be so lucky. They'll jump the buck and never find it. The right move is to wait and grid. You were wrong about the trailing but you were right when you said this one was gonna be ugly!
Here is the key guys:
Pick the second best answer to all questions and you'll bat at least 85%
You have to learn to accept that there is no one right answer for every question, especially the ones asking how long to wait. Multiple answers can sometimes lead to a recovery in the end and are very subjective.
My personal experience, I hate it when a blood trail challenge turns to a deer finding mission - there's no more blood.
In my area with no coyotes it’s a no brainer to wait til morning regardless of the forecast. Unfortunately, I have had my fair share of gut shots and have not lost a single deer when I waited overnight. Most if not all were found within 50 yards of where I last saw them.
Gut shot deer I ALWAYS wait until morning but I hunt in an urban setting and we don't have coyotes around.
Horse sh!t.got 3 points on 4 waiting for morning.
Dang it. Sorry about giving details.
3 points for waiting until morning! It was said that there was no blood trail anyway; what's rain gonna hurt? It can't wash away nothing. I'm waiting until daylight and doing a grid search.
Hmm... 4/4. Something will go terribly wrong, I am confident in that.
I believe what Pat is trying to do, give use a training scenario because even though we work hard NOT to screw up, we do. One thing that I did notice, an I have had experience with it. An sometime take notice, it can be raining pretty good, but in the woods its not that hard. But, you step out into the fields an you get drenched. Look at the trees in Pats area, lots of leaves. They can and will break up the rain drops. An the best thing, that deer went into the thicket. Look not only on the ground, but about 24-30 inches off the ground. On the thicket. In short Pat is telling us what he was thinking and did. And he probably was thinking that about what kind of feedback he would get.
Question 4 is totally wrong. Yiu our just gonna keep bumping that deer and he wont leave much blood. He will die where he lays down or closest water source. Rain or not your not gonna find much blood. Paunch and liver shots. I can tell these answers are from rookies. First thing was noted arrow . Some grrennot good. Should backout right then and there. He would be dead within 150 yards
Ha! Some of you guys kill me. ;-)
This year I hit a buck too far back, broadside, at 12 yds. In the woods, one hour prior to sunset. 12 yard shot, 18' up tree. Centered, but back too far. Buck ran with tail tight 50-60 yards. Wobbled and walked slowly 20 yards more and bedded.
I watched the deer for the next 1 1/4 hrs until dark. Snuck out of the woods downwind. Returned next morning. Found several beds. Deer moved another 15 yards and was bedded next to a downfall. Still alive but very hurt. 16 hours later still alive.
Went back to truck and got my bow. Returned, deer had moved off. Saw the deer bed again 50+ yards. Backed out for another few hours.
Deer moved again from this third bed. Found the deer bedded 50+ yards away. Hurt bad. Finished with another arrow. 18+ hrs from first hit.
Autopsy revealed arrow (Rage 2") hit one lobe of the liver.
Hardly any blood trail too.
Rookies???? There's quite a little bit of deer experience on this thread. . . .
I'm at 100%. Not for much longer, I'm sure. I can usually pass the first 3-4 questions on these things, then I start missing. Analyzing blood spatter always gets me! And I don't know how ANYONE would miss question #2. That actually disturbs me
Hindsight on these is HUGE. In the heat of the moment, it would be easy to make different decisions.
Based on a couple gut shot animals that I have been involved with (including a rifle shot mule deer that we bumped and eventually lost in trees after trailing pin sized drops of blood and dry tracks in dirt), I would wait until morning without question. That buck was clearly gutshot and likely was bedded close by. Mark the spot and then sight search in the morning makes the most sense.
I don’t seem to recall reading anyplace where “the plan” had been posted. Kinda hard to stick to “the plan” when I don’t know it is!!!
Need to shoot bigger broadheads to put more blood on the ground! Hell, your shooting a compound that will probably blow a 2" solid broadhead thru any deer out there!
Still say, with what you got, wait till daylight!
Troy, “the plan” was the “correct” answer to #3
As always Troy, the “plan” is in Pat’s head ;-)
And here’s what happens when you leave a deer overnight where I live.......
Gotta love a guy that makes a bad decision then laughs at you for calling him on it. You don’t get a pass just because you own the website.
I'm getting down in around 30 minutes to mark the spot of the shot. THEN, I'm headed to town to get a dog headed my way. The dog handler calls the "shots" after that.
I am really pissed. If I don't win a blood trail challenge I am going to put 4 bullets in the cylinder, spin it, and pull the trigger. Life sucks. Been nice knowing yall.
Bigger broadheads? Then I could say, "if you used a crossbow he likely wouldn't have made it to the woods." Where do you draw the line on equipment to make up for a bad hit? I can't wait to find out how this plays out.
Regarding blood spatter, I actually used that for the first time this year. I hit a buck behind front shoulder, but was a bit low, and still looked like a heart shot. The blood trail led us to an ATV trail paralleling a river and the last blood drop was pointing North, while the trail leading up to it was Westerly. I looked for that buck the remainder of my week off, since I shot him on a Saturday. Didn't find him and my only theory is he tried crossing the river and ended up on a cattail island, or drowned. But that blood drop had me thinking of these BTCs.
There’s a winner??
I thought these challenges were originally to help and teach.....but then as I realized they are just made up fairy dust and unicorns.
No way I continue to track. I would have waited until the next morning.
The correct way to follow up on a gut shot is to back out . Give the animal at least 8-12 hours regardless of the weather. If you leave it alone and it doesn't get bumped by coyotes. It will be within 100 yards of where you shot it. What difference does it make if the coyotes get to it first ? If you jump it by pushing it too soon you will probably never find it anyway . Pat may have gotten lucky on this one and I'm pretty sure we don't have all the info yet but I would definitely be waiting based on the current information .
If it HAD been a unicorn, you would have gotten both lungs. Kill zone on those is a lot further back. Of course, antler point restrictions could possibly make the shot a non starter.
Confirmed gut shot then found bed number one. I can't see anything positive coming from continuing down the trail on this one. Obviously it worked out but that's not the best decision.
Sorry Pat, but #4 makes no sense. You clearly state "There's no blood past this spot" and the deer was obviously gut shot based upon the debris on the arrow. So the "correct" answer you provide would only push the deer further, and since there's no blood,......can't say more without giving the answer away. I protest! :)
Looks like if I read the comments first I could have guessed the right (Pat's) answer. I had a gut shot last year, same scenario as this challenge, waited till morning and found the buck 200 yards from shot in the rain.
I changed my perspective. The game should be what did Pat do. I have a perfect score. Pat missed two.
I think there's more damage that just gut and he finds it within 200 yards . That just from the view from the hit to me .
So, playing UNO with the kids last night, every time I got down to two cards someone would throw down a "Draw 4" or "switch hands" on me. Man I'm steamed, I take that s#!+ seriously man! Just like this bloodtrail game.
Still trying to figure out why it is only partial credit to do the obvious thing and come back in the morning.
No blood anyways. Rain can't wash away blood if it isn't there. I'd wait till morning but that's me. LOL at greenmountain!
Gut shot deer is a dead deer. Almost guaranteed. They can't live without those facilities. How far they go is the difference. I think most will lay down and die within 200-300 yards. Thats something a guy can work with even without blood trail if you have general direction. If they get farther than that.....they can go a long ways. I took my 3 pts from #4. I'm waiting tell morning.
I think the point several of us have made is these blood trailing games could be a very useful educational tool for young hunters. Unfortunately, those inexperienced hunters will walk away from this game largely misinformed, IMO. Allowing a gut shot deer at least 8-12 hours to die, regardless of weather conditions, is bow hunting 101. I'm glad Pat got lucky, but that doesn't suddenly change the curriculum.
The Iowa Democratic caucus last night reminds me of this game. The answers are murky and no one wins! :-)
Gut shot will almost always lay down within a 100-200 yards of the shot IF they are not pressured. I went to the thickest spot to find my buck last year and that was the only guy shot deer in 50 yrs of hunting, so all of the articles I've read were spot on.
Wow! Whoever made the decisions for the answer choices in this challenge is apparently not much better at that than he is making a solid shot on a deer. #4 is clearly wrong. The "pile" of blood in the photo is from coughing up blood coming from the gut shot. There won't be any blood trail to follow. Whether or not rain is coming makes no difference. The deer won't go far if he isn't pushed. Back out, let him die without pushing him and recover with a grid search or dog in the AM. This challenge should be renamed to Lousy Answers Bloodtrail Challenge.
Just realized answer one and two to Clue 4 are the same thing. Trick question indeed. I hope you got a 9 whether you picked either one of those wrong answers.
answer 1 to clue 4 is stick to the plan(mark where the deer left the field and WAIT 4.5 hours).......answer 2 is to keep tracking.........not the same thing at all
No doubt pat thought of all these scenarios from the tree stand and was confident in his ability to move forward with his decision. the deer was probably stiff when he found it but for us playing along we were being safe picking #1.
I didn't want to risk the weatherman being wrong ……………………………..it happens all the time around here! ;-)
Will there be "Participation Trophies"?
Ghost, yes. It’s called coming in last. ;)
I'm dying for redemption. It's hard to be correct on #4 and only get 3 points. Bring out the big number 5 Pat!
#3 got me...I was operating under the assumption that heavy rain starting at midnight meant that there would be heavy rain at midnight... 2 hours should be enough to "start" tracking and assess the situation... I feel like the explanation for #4 validates this...rain will wash away the blood trail and you'll lose the deer...
It would be cool if you could include the actual forecast for the night...I like to look at precip percentages and such to make weather based decisions...
For the record....I enjoy these blood trail games and I’ve learned from them. Don’t forget the last two sentences in the game description Pat gave. Don’t take it too seriously, it’s just a game!
I thought the same as deebz for #3.
Well I started great with the first two questions scoring a 9 each time. But that video clearly showed a gut shot deer. You do not push a gut shot deer. You are better off going home and starting out in the morning. It should be 100-200 yards away.
Is it just me or has it been a couple of days since a new question was posted.
Apparently Pat has been on the phone with his realtor all day today! ;-)
"Waiting for Clue #5 or the Iowa Caucus results, we'll see which comes first."
Iowa wins once again!
Or maybe, Pat has a job that required him to be at work at 7 am and can't come back in the morning to track the deer.
Pat still looking for the deer to complete the challenge questions?
Knife, you literally made me LOL. Thanks.
I purposely answered 5 with the only correct choice, wait till morning knowing Pat made the incorrect choice the answer. Chasing a gut shot deer goes against all logic and proven deer science. Gut shot is a mortal wound, so let him expire. I haven't seen SNY cover too thick to find a deer, only hunters who lack the patience and resolve to keep at it.
answered what i would do on 4 and was "wrong" , tempted to answer the same way on 5 but i didnt and got it "right"....so 4 nine's and 1 three so far
I’m waiting till morning to look for that deer. It not that big of a buck, anyway.
That should take some of the heat off of you for your sucky answers, Pat......for a few posts anyway!
I'm wrong evidently. But I've been in on trailing gut shot deer. In thickets. After big weather fronts and thunderstorms.
What we all learned as a group that gut shots are really actually simple if you have patience.
No matter what the case, never go look for a minimum of 8 hours. Almost all deer bed within site of the shot. Even getting down out of the stand we are sneaky and careful and always stalk away the opposite direction.
Every last time we've done it that way the deer has been dead in its first bed at 8 plus hours and almost never make a full 100 yards. Most have been dead appx 70 yards away.
AFTER you bump the deer from the first bed it gets REALLY hard to find them. Takes hours and lots of work to do it.
We won't even do it with a dog before 8 hours as they won't be dead.
Though my score dropped at the choices of leave it overnight, thats the best plan we've ever formulated and since then, its been 100% recovery on those that jump the string or we make a bad hit on.
And I realize we all have our own formulas or thoughts, but if you had not gotten down to go look for blood, then that deer would have never made it to the thicket to start with in our experience.
Looking for a dead deer beats looking for a live one every last time.
I haven't read all the posts but it looked to me like the deer was hit in the liver. If so, it was likely dead in several minutes. I have no way to slow down the video to check closely.
^^^ Freeze frame, looked like pure guts to me.
I wanna know: 1. How thick are the coyotes in the area? 2. What's the temperature when Pat shot and forecast for the morning? 3. Can you track on to the neighbor's property or is it totally off limits? 4. Does Pat have K114 with him on this hunt? 5. Did he shoot this deer on the last night he was hunting this property? 6. Where is the boot picture?
Can we get the number of people guessing option 1 two 3 or 4. Be interesting to see how many people pick a certain number that are not correct
Some of you guys make me wish I could make it better by hanging a dirty t shirt over the right side of the TV. Like I did tonight for the SOTU.
I bet you wish you could tear up Pats notes!! HAHA!!!!
Green slim on arrow, gut shot. I thought liver but after watching a few times it's clear it was gut, at least to me.
"Lousy Shot Edition" and the best I've done on these thing yet....I wonder what that says about me?? LOL
I told you guys. I asked for the Iowa or Kansas bucks but nooo, y’all just had to have the gut shot PA deer!!!
I predicted Pat's answer for number 5. I still chose what I feel is the correct answer based on the clues and took a zero. I am enjoying the game so far as it is just a game. When we complain I notice we keep coming back.
Pat's math skills are off.
Four 9's and got a 3 on number 5. I agree to wait until morning, but that isn't the way this challenge is going. So I picked move up the tracking an hour. Since Pat said you must have a blood trail to find the deer, I would get out there before the rain comes, not when the rain begins.
Peco-go back to question 3 the plan was to start before the rain arrived....now that the rain has moved up ,if you move up the tracking the same amount of time your still starting BEFORE the rain gets their
Bigfoot, yeah I see it now. I complicated the question trying to beat the trickery.
I did the exact same thing PECO. I also used the wrong logic on last question. How am I going to cover ALL trails in 15 minutes? My logic was continue in the direction already established since I only have 15 minutes left....but I'm not complaining, I look at these as both a game and way to look at real situations from others prospective. Lets get to "which quadrant has the deer in the picture", I like looking for the antler tip, ear or hoof!
WOW! Lamest BTC ever. Almost every "correct" answer is WRONG.
Just when I thought it couldn't get worse, Q6. Another 3 for me.
If this was important to my life at all, I'd be really pissed at the choice for "Correct" answer on #6.
Actually, about half of them so far :(
Me too! At this point, I am wondering how I recovered ANY of the deer I shot this year! ;-)
Question #4 answer is ridiculous. Blood stopped, it's dark and "Stick with the plan" and proceed (I assume)?? Yeah right...blunder around in the dark and bump a gut shot deer right before it rains. That's not what I would do.
OK, WTF, all trails? You mean North trails (up-hill) too? I mean if you're on a Westerly trail and it veers North, or an Southerly trail veers East, OK, follow it. I don't really get 'all trails', all trails from where, the last blood? So turn around and follow the same trail you were just on to check 'North'?
I get what you're saying here, there's logic to the decisions you made, obviously, because you found the deer. But there isn't logic to the various choices you're offering to go with them - this is where you lose people. We aren't trying to figure out what we'd do, but we're trying to figure 'you' out.
One person can't obviously go more than one direction at once, so the #6 question is about priority, based on the urgency. You check South and South/Westerly first, then proceed with others, since you already told us in the clue, gut shot deer in this area tend to go down-hill and your dotted (blood) trail is going in that direction. But how do you possibly quickly walk all trails at once?
New Indian name for Pat - 'All Trails', short for 'Man who walks All Trails'.
Haha!! Pat should change the title to:
BTC: Lousy Decisions Edition
I'm kinda proud that I'm not at top score. High scores reflect a lot of bad answers.
I am underwhelmed but I should know by now............
I have a feeling that we're all being manipulated by Pat. Having been on a hunt with him before he found a deer that another guy shot that should never have been found. It was impressive. A curve's coming. LOL!
Not sure how u can walk all the trails in 15 minutes!
Best answer is to address the likely direction given this limited time frame. S and SW
Where are these trails? The thicket is so thick that you can see only 3 yards.
nvgoat, I was thinking the opposite, get the hell outta Dodge and go NE and then N. back to the start, then go back (in the rain) pick it up in the morning to find a dead deer in the light of day. WITH A DOG.
I went with the deer drive and got extra credit.
That 3 yard BS was added to the story mid stream to help justify the absurd decision to push a gut shot deer and offset the blow back everyone was posting. That’s why it took until last night to get the clue posted. Duh.
I thought like nvgoat. Figured not enough time to check all trails before the rain hit.
Busta'ribs X2 I had the exact same thought.
knew i was not going to get 6 right and i was correct(i didnt)
The gut shot deer is more predictable than pat for sure. Lol I'm sinking like a turd in a punch bowl!
I would like to know the first and second trail (if necessary ) you checked.
I think the moral of this story is: A) Don't gut shoot deer. B) If you do gut shoot a deer, don't make a BTC about it, and try to justify your poor recovery decisions.
Hmmm.....so this is the fourth gut shot deer on this property over the years? Why so many? Poor shot selections? Buck fever? Lack of shooting practice?
Honestly? some of you need to take a breather - it's a game on the interweb. You'd think this was life and death the way you are acting. It is for the deer, it's not for you.
Grey Ghost, Three gut shot deer in 30 years by me, my kids, my friends and my wife. Maybe one day we'll be perfect like you but until then we'll keep trying.
I'm thinking a "3" is a perfectly score?
Every blood trail is different. I like performing an autopsy on the other end of the crime scene to learn more.
We need more of these on Bowsite.
If I remember correctly the deer was hit on the left side, and tend to favor that side as they walk/run. Based on info my am's wer was correct, so I agree 3 is a good score lol
Pat, for some of us, failure is not an option. :-)
So everyone votes for #3 on the difficult blood trail and lousy shot, and then bitches about it. I love it! :)
by "everyone" do you mean.......
Everyone needs to take a DEEP breath and do what I have learned to do. Just employ the WWPD rule, it is amazing how much it helps. :>)
Playing along, I am at 42 after #6
I don’t know what you guys are whining about. It’s a game that this girl personally find pretty spot on! Pat is making us think about what we would do.
If you base the success of a BTC on the entertainment value of the comments, this one is #1.
I love when the Almighty GG blesses us with his infinite wisdom! It's a sure blessing from above each and every time.
The game is fun and gives you choices to think about. Ya never know but it could possibly make ya better hunter or help in a recovery down the road. Diggin’ the challenge so far!
You're welcome, Nick. I'm glad I can help. ;-)
You’re right Pat, it’s NOT life or death.....................it’s more important than that! ;-)
Rut Nut, could you please explain your last post?
Thanks for explaining that
Yeah, i was a little unsure too. I was on the edge of being a bit “triggered”. Thanks for gettin it cleared up 40 yard.
It’s a game right? :) so I’m in it to win!! Perfect score so far, but I agree with others that given the clues we have, in real life I would wait longer and probably do some things differently.. But I wasn’t there and don’t know the property etc. like Pat obviously does so I’m tryin to look at it like he would/did. “WWPD” Lol
Never trust weather forecasts to be accurate on timing, especially down to the half hour. There are too many variables.
all this is why i picked option 3 from the offerings and miss the CF, oh the humanity...
“WWPD”? Should be “WSPD”!
I'm starting to question if I could even find my truck, certainly not a gutshot deer.
an outfitter once told me, after lamenting a poor shot on an antelope with a recurve that was eventually found, and in fact never went out of sight, to quit whining about making a less than perfect shot and having to wait a few hours to recover it.
he said you are out here trying to get close to a wild animal and kill it with a sharp stick. if at the end of the day your tag is on the carcass and the meat is in the cooler it was successful and ended perfectly. it does not always happen and anything in between is details that don't matter so stop bemoaning some part of the process that did not go the way intended.
I figured if a guy who sees many hunters for a year, has his livelihood depending on their success, needs to protect the game as a resource, etc. can look at it that way that say something about perspective.
it was 25 years ago and to this day I still keep those words in mind. the goal is to kill it and find it and use it. you either did that or not. I am betting that there is a dead deer at the end of this challenge which basically means the hunter dun real good.
Hello Bou bound: I think all on this site agree that when we release an arrow or a bullet at an animal we take the responsibility for recovering the animal if at all possible. We can question each other on how we go about it but the motive should be clear. The animal is valuable and should not be squandered. There are those who take a quick look and conclude that just a little blood means that the animal is not badly hurt so it is ok to hunt another. Few of us here are that type.
LMAO, dont answer like I did on #7. I went for the A.Pauls/M.Pauls method. Got a smooth 0 for a score
I truly thought I was going to blow #7, but I didn't, even though I stuck to my gut.
run after it and choke it out.....OBVIOUSLY
I thought, if you are tracking, you should have your bow with you. So finish him off. I opted to go get the bow you should have with you in the first place and finish him off. Silly me, zero on Q7. I disagree with sitting there all night staring at him, and that gets you 6 points? Maybe a good idea if you have coyotes, but why not just finish him off vs baby sitting him all night? Either finish him or go get a nap and get him in the morning.
I agree PECO, I would have had my bow with me. If not, I would have absolutely gone to get it and finish him off as quickly as possible. If he falls right back down after getting up, I don't believe you have to worry about losing him at that point. It is our responsibility to put the animal out of it's misery ASAP! I totally disagree with the answer to question 7
PECO I'm with you IRL but I went with the answers offered, I've ZERO idea why the tracker didn't have bow in hand
Track a gutshot deer all night. Find him still alive, then (and only then) sit back and give him time to die.
Not "might be illegal", it IS illegal to attempt to kill a deer after legal shooting light. At least in PA.
Correct and using a light is considered spotlighting. A very serious offense.
So really you would sit there all night in the heavy rain and wait for him to die? That's a 6 point answer?
It’s not necessary but if someone wanted to then, why not? I’ve sat on a wounded animal before to keep my eye on him.
In 40 plus years of bow hunting I never met someone that didn't there weapon while looking for a kill, whether for a follow up or a pic. You always tell a person new to this stuff , bring your bow just in case. I've seen more than one dispatched with knife after a good chase but don't do that stuff, especially with horns. I'm in no way disrespecting your way just was surprized and after reading the comments the legal part makes it clear.
Here in Pa you better have the blessing of the PGC and local warden if your gonna be out there with a weapon after legal shooting hours especially 4 or 5 hours after quitting time. Hell they want you to call the regional office and tell them your out there looking for one after quitting time
I suck. And I would probably not have found that deer. I do suspect, however, that there was a lot of luck involved in finding this animal. I'm guessing I'd have waited till morning, grid searched down the hill in the thicket, and not went back up the hill. I would need crows to show me where he went.
Seriously???? You "scoured" every trail in 20 minutes????? All this scenario shows is that some guys should not hunt with a bow because they don't have the skill or the knowledge to do so ethically.
After getting #3 wrong, I have 9 points on each clue. Once you figures Pat's logic out they are actually pretty easy. Pat's actions were wrong (but lucky), but his logic is easy to figure out.
I don't advocate breaking game laws. I also will NOT leave a wounded animal alive if I have means to kill it.
I think you were very fortunate to find this deer.
X-man. I was trying to figure out Pat's logic. You guys can make fun of me for this. But was serious when I chose "choke it out". Thinking he might have meant go up and kill it with a knife it hand to hand combat. I mean for gosh sakes, we are talking about a man that will literally poke a black mamba
We all knew going into this that is was NOT "text book"
The Pauls brothers better get 18 points for answering "D" on question 7 or this whole challenge is moot.
Being on the ground and only physically able to, you know.... check one trail at a time...... then it hit me there IS a way to check "all trails" at once. With a helicopter! Why didn't I think of that! Next level for sure...... =D
How the hell would I know it's illegal to choke a deer after sunset!!! And why wouldn't I have my bow?
Didn't read others answers but, if comfortable, I'll shoot. Now...in order to shoot I have to be comfortable with the shot figuring on ensuing sunset and rain. A very well hit deer isn't going to go that far.
X100 Fuzzy...it is the ethical thing to do on a wounded animal.
Well since almost 69% disagree with me, I'll take my six points and keep quiet.
I would have been looking for the corn trail on one of the trails.......
Why would you go in on a blood trail looking for a wounded deer without a bow? If you don’t the have the ability to finish him off....wth are you walking in risking bumping him? Sorry but if I have an arrow in one already, the only reason I’m in there is to find him dead or kill him when I find him.
I can understand not carrying your bow into the thicket if you can only see 3 feet. You'll be going slow enough without picking up your arrows all the time - in the dark.
I started off well- then my answers went south on this challenge. I ran copies of every question and then tore the copies of the questions in half !
x200 fuzzy, Ill also take my chances with the wardens. If they are going to fine me for attempting to recover a wounded deer at night, then so be it.. No way I'm watching/waiting for him to die.. I'd have had a bow along, even if it was an old beater/backup bow to finish him off if found alive...
Greg, did that make you feel better ? ;-)
I wonder why Pat even does these things. His rind must be made from iron !
Very proud of my 0 on the last question. There is no chance I'm leaving that buck suffering all night.
Hello SBH. In many states you are not allowed to carry a bow when trying to recover a deer after dark. In Vermont in order to recover a deer legally you must contact the warden first. If you enlist a licensed tracker he may carry a firearm to dispatch your deer if necessary. The way the law reads you can only carry a knife for the purpose of dressing the dead deer.
I know what the law says...……………………………………..and I know what is the right thing to do! ;-)
Waiting for question 8...……………………………………………..
How can a hunter leave an animal to suffer, if a clear, 20yd open shot is available?
What happened to taking an animal out as quickly and humanely as possible?
Somebody needs to please explain this situation to me. I’m not getting something.
Perhaps like Wisconsin, it is illegal to dispatch a deer after legal "shooting hours". That includes one that has been shot and wounded during legal "shooting hours"?
I'd ask those who put ethics before the laws, are you prepared to pay the price if caught during a violation, and if so, what laws do you pick and choose?
I agree, I’d kill the deer one way or another
dont forget that "doing the right thing" comes with a prize of not hunting for (at least) 3 years
Pete- I'll own it and take the consequences.
Bigfoot- might or might not! I'll take my chances with the magistrate. I think with my record and reputation, I would not get a license suspension.
Oh man, I just did this whole bloodtrail challenge this morning. I feel like Pat was baiting me with question #7, cause I mean I know what I would do, pretty sure I know what my brother would do, I've been there with my dad with the light and the hatchet... Headlamp ON, weapon in each hand quick pep talk to get the heart rate up, gettin that rose bowl walking through the tunnel feeling - Here we go boys THIS IS WHAT WE PLAY FOR!!!!!!!
63 points ain't too bad for this one. :)
I enjoy these way more than the text book ones.
A fun blood trail Pat, looking forward to the next one. Maybe you could dig up some early blood trailers and repost and let some of us retry and get rid of some of those horrible scores lol.
51 final score. In Michigan my brother in law took the John Deere Gator back to the woods after dark and and cut a small load of wood. Neighbor called DNR and said he was back there poaching. The guy doesn't even hunt. As he was coming up to the house he was greeted by the Game Warden. Chainsaw still warm and a load of wood, it was clear there was no illegal take of deer going on. Many of us on here, myself included would have brought our bow and killed that deer in the dark. We probably would have "got away with it." But be careful, the woods have eyes and ears.
I’m afraid I’d have to agree with the ones who say they would have killed that buck, but I’d probably have used a .22 rifle. Gunshots here at night aren’t investigated nor worried about by the neighbors. We all have hog problems and living in the country any of us might fire a gun at any time. In another state, not so much.
Thanks for the “bone” on the last one Pat, I needed it ! And thanks for doing these, they’re fun to do, and more fun to read all the comments......
0 points for choosing heart??????? I mean WTH kinda bullcrap.....;^)
I can't believe that hit the liver...
So Pat, now that we know this ended up the best it could possibly end up, what happened on the shot? Just one of those deals where you botch the shot? Or did the deer move on you? Buck fever?
It wasn’t buck fever. Strictly operator error. Good thing I didn’t flub my Iowa or Kansas bucks. Those blood trails will be a little less stressful for you guys.
I have been bowhunting for a very long time. I have been rifle hunting for a very long time. In many states and provinces. Killing never used to bother me, nor the thought of a wounded animal. When you hunt things can happen, we all can miss and we all can make a bad shot. I have not wounded an animal for decades, literally. Bow shot deer and elk usually have dropped within sight or at least hearing. When they haven't they didn't go far and died very quickly. This past season I hit a buck high. Perfect left and right, but over the lungs. Arrow fully penetrated. I saw him twice after that, head held high with a mature rack, big holes high in the body. Could not get close enough. He suffered, was shot a month later during muzzle season by neighbors when he couldn't get out of his bed. Really has bothered me, nearly to the point I'm not sure I want to go again. I will, but it's going to take a lot to let another arrow go. This was not a low percentage shot by the way, I don't take them. Still can't believe I did that.
I didn't mention buck fever as a slam, but I've honestly had it rear it's ugly head every once in awhile during my long deer hunting career.
Doing what's right is easy when others are. Looking, when no one is looking is when ones ethics come into play. I guess we have more poachers among us than I thought.
Pat, I'm wondering how that deer tasted after sitting over night with guts flowing inside.?
well hell. did ok all the wayu thru then blew the last one by clicking the wrong answer (not the one I intended)
LBshooter, I've had the unfortunate experience of leaving one overnight. It tasted fine after being recovered the next day in cold temps. I did not eat the inner loins however as they seemed a little funky and made me nervous.
I gut shot a doe one evening, recovered her the next morning. It was probably a 30 degree night. She ate fine.
Trax, I wouldn’t let that one incident worry me to the point of giving up. I felt the same way when losing the few I’ve lost, but anyone who says he’s never lost an animal either hasn’t hunted much, has been very lucky, or is just not remembering correctly. (I wanted to say lying, but......). :-) All the more reason to keep on, you don’t want that experience to be the last memory you have of your hunting career.
Doing what's right takes guts sometimes(NO pun intended)……………………………...especially when it is NOT the "popular" decision! ;-)
I will do what needs to be done, sleep well that night and have no problems looking at myself in the mirror the next morning.
This entire thing was a joke. Starting with our fearless leader (who I do give credit for having the balls to post this mess) endorsing the wrong decision of pushing an obvious gut shot deer with no weapon that he had zero chance of finding dead, just because it was going to rain, doubling down because it ran into a thicket that you can’t see more than three yards in, predictably pushing the deer (duh) and then backing out till morning like he should have done to begin with, then even more predictably exclaiming that the deer would have never been found if all the bad decisions he made were not made. I don’t buy it. Hey, we all botch shots, I’ve done it plenty of times, so unfortunately I speak from lots of experience trailing gut shot deer, believe me. Pat, on the other hand, shoots much better than me apparently, and has a lot less experience on gut shot deer, as he stated above. That said, I will tell you you that he got lucky finding that deer. very lucky. I think he would have had a very good chance of finding the deer close by with no blood trail the next day if he quietly climbed down an hour after the shot it and slipped out in the opposite direction and didn’t bump the deer. Same scenario ten times and I bet you push and loose the deer 7 or 8 times (or more) going that night. I totally take my chance with waiting till the next day and grid searching every time. Teaching guys to do it the wrong way just because you found the deer is irresponsible. Even if this is just a game.
I just checked my score and you only missed one question! Not bad. :^)
You are right drycreek and thanks, but he deserved better than that.
Thanks Pat. Always a good time.
Thanks Pat! I really enjoy these! Great practice! Always good to hear others opinions, may just help one day if this scenario were to arise.
Looking forward to the Bloodtrail Challenges for Iowa and Kansas....after the swelling goes down from the results of this thread.
I ended up with a score of 57 and only that high because I was guessing what Pat did, not what I would do. Of course most questions were set up to force you to pick the best from poor choices.
It is a game, but a game played with a real live (or dead animal), so #7 kinda bothers me. One of the guiding clues was that "if it rains, you will NOT find that animal in the thickets!!!". Period!!
Then after bumbling into the animal still alive, in the pouring rain, it's decided it's ok to leave the buck, "because he won't go far anyway". Well you don't know that. Gut shot deer don't go up hill either. You don't know that right after you leave a couple of coyotes or local dogs won't come and harrass that buck back into the thickets, in the rain where he will "..never be found, ever!". You didn't know how much that buck had left in him. If he was "almost done" then wait the half hour or so. If you thought it was going to be too long to wait in the rain, then you'd have to consider he could move in those few hours, never to be found. If you're happy having a general area to find the carcass, with the help of birds, in a few days and collect a euro, then whatever.
I agree on not breaking the law (for you) and the risk involved in hand to horn conflict is not worth it. But to just walk away, in my mind, is careless and disrespectful. 69% agree with you and my opinion on an internet forum means nothing to anyone, but it did bother me enough that I wanted to express it. You of course can always fall back on "well I got the deer so my decisions were all right" and no one can counter that.
In the words of a small boyhood friend of mine "You can probably beat me up, but you can never make me like it!"
Pat, I have a serious question not meant tongue in cheek related to the BT challenges in general. Are they even meant to be strictly a teaching tool or are they just a run down of how you found that particular deer and we are guessing what you did/what happened for fun and to maybe learn a thing or two and generate discussion? I'm guessing it's the latter and everyone needs to lighten up and not take things so seriously!
Pat maybe he went up hill because you bumped him. If you would have just backed out to begin with would he have been at or near the spot you found the pool of blood? Glad it worked out not sure you made what is going to be the highest percentage of recovery over the long term. Some times going for it on 4th and long works but most of the time you better off punting.
JohnMC for the spike in the end zone in OT.
Thanks Pat,love BTC,need more!
Yeah, I'm not thinking Pat intends these to be a teaching tool. Pretty sure they are for entertainment/sick torture for the most part.
Brotsky, good question.
I never said they were teaching tools. Others call them that, not me. If they were, I’d feel a responsibility to stick with conventional wisdom. I’ve shot over 300 big game animals in my 42 years of bowhunting and I have made lots of mistakes by taking risks, but also by not taking risks. I like thinking outside the box. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn’t.
To your question:
Since I have hindsight I know exactly where the deer was hit, where it went, how far, and all the twists and turns it took. I base all my questions off the reality of what the deer did. Not necessarily what I did. There’s really no way to get a perfect score unless you cheat or get lucky. It’s all based on the real deal. Nature is random.
This buck went entirely off script. I honestly cannot believe I recovered him. He did everything he wasn’t supposed to do. But the same went for me. I had a great buck that was mortally hit go uphill once so I always check uphill as well as downhill trails. In this track I was covering a lot of trails Quickly. That led me to that uphill blood drop and that put me on his trail. Lucky? You bet. However I bet that 95% of hunters would never consider the deer would go straight up a cliff. They wouldn’t bother to look there. But that’s what happened so I built a question that reflected reality.
Now, I want to address some of the immature behavior on this discussion.
I really have a tough time understanding why a handful of you get enraged over these games. Either they have a problem with me, are just generally miserable people, or their ego gets bruised because they got the question wrong. I don’t get upset at all. I’ve got way bigger things to worry about than some tough guy on the interweb. If it makes them feel better to chest thump then have at it.
To summarize: no- it’s not a learning tool; yes-it’s entirely based on the randomness that occurs on every Bloodtrail.
Not likely John. The deer walked downhill for about 100 yards after the pool and when I found the trail at the top he was walking slowly. His first bed was where I found him. If I bumped him, no doubt he’d head into those thickets. My guess is he came from the north facing hill slope and was trying to get back there. I saw nothing that led me to believe I bumped him. I was above him the entire time so it’s unlikely since he wouldn’t have come uphill if I bumped him from uphill.
this was a good one Pat - very well done and well played with an outcome not many would have achieved. Helluva BAD shot though! Lol. What went wrong there?
Regarding deer going uphill, some may recall a semi-live Ohio hunt I did in 2017 with Matt Anderson. I shot a nice 200# dressed out 10 point last 10 minutes of the hunt. Shot looked good maybe just a tad high but I was 22' or more above it at 17 yards. He ran down about an 80 degree incline at 250 yards, that was about 50 yards to the bottom. Basically a cliff. We tracked him along that bottom another 150 yards, then he WENT BACK UP THAT CLIFF for another 50 yards nearly straight uphill. Top of hill, he was out of blood. I was ready to give up after extensive searching. Matt was NOT giving up he said "I know you are a good shot on live deer and you always know where you hit the deer it has to be dead". He went off another 75 yards and found it. Not one drop of blood left to drip. Total track on high double lung with two holes - about 600 yards. Tell me how a double lung buck goes up an incline like that as his last act before expiring?
I have a feeling most wardens that hunt would understand and after investigating would let you walk for finishing off a deer. Now with that said had Pat walked back and got his bow their is a chance he could have bumped the deer away on the way back.
Glad to hear you can let the expert rants bounce off. They are always right or never admit they are wrong. Conventional works most of the time. Sometimes you have to go off script as this one proved. I always like the challenges and sometimes call BS... but I would be willing to bet you would call BS on a few of my tactics. I’m good with that. I only get irritated when people accuse me of spending too much on my broadheads :-)
First interweb blood trail I have done and switched from doing what I thought was right and then guessing what pat was doing. Enjoyed it. Thanks Pat.
I've discovered in 73 years there are no absolutes in hunting. Didn't take all those years.
Just completed the challenge. I have to say that the answers were not correct as given, but rather the actions that Pat took. The reason why the buck changed direction and went uphill is because Pay was chasing an animal that was still alive and if he was trying to avoid him. If he had not gone after him in the dark he would have been at the first location where he had bedded down hundreds of yards earlier. I found my buck last year in the pouring rain with no blood trail at all just by taking section by section in the thick Rose and Thorn bushes. Just because the buck was found does not mean the choice is made where the correct ones in my humble opinion.
of course the choices were right How arrogant to say great outcome bad choices.
There was only one goal when he triggers that release and that was to tag the deer. Mission accomplished. If You looking for style point you are looking at the wrong sport. Take up figure skating
I was doomed from the beginning because I've seen several of the bucks Pat has shot in the last couple years and really didn't believe him when the first question said he wanted to shoot it! :D
I started question 1 off with "D". In my eyes the "correct answer" to that question is strictly an opinion. First of all I wouldn't have taken a shot at that buck at all. 2nd I wouldn't have taken up the trail on a gut shot deer that soon and 3rd wouldn't take up the trail at all without my bow in hand. 4th I'd NEVER leave a deer suffering when I had the opportunity to dispatch ethically. So in the end I don't agree with Pat but this is his challenge and he did it his way. Glad he found his buck but he also had a ton of luck on his side as well.
“ Tell me how a double lung buck goes up an incline like that as his last act before expiring?”
Simple - he was a SPITEFUL SOB!
I’ll fess up: on the question where the “correct” answer was “stick with the plan”.... I had NO CLUE what “the plan” WAS, so I figured Pat had one and wasn’t in the mood to share. Got that one right. Got some others “wrong”.
Pat may have absolute authority here, but not in my world... and I’m sure we’re both 100% OK with that.
FWIW, I’m one of those who would NOT be found trailing a deer without having the means to finish it in hand, should the need arise. I might well unstring my bow, but it sure wouldn’t be sitting in the vehicle. I have finished off a deer with my knife... Once. Years ago, when I was a whole lot younger, stronger and dumber. His hide is now part of my quiver, just so I won’t forget the lesson.
I shot my Elk twice, just to end it; watched a deer die slowly when I realized that it would likely upset the neighbors (rifle season) if I were to take another shot. Took much too long. Should’ve gone back to the truck for my bow. Would’ve been easier on both of us. So no surprise that I’ll take a follow-up shot should the opportunity arise.
And I would sure like to think that any CO that I might run across would give me the benefit of the doubt if I could produce a carcass with clear evidence of a bad hit. But seriously?? I don’t hunt where I need to worry too much about being encountered by the Fish Cops, so I’m willing to take my chances on doing the right thing. If I were plunking whitetails in a suburban neighborhood, I might well feel forced to let one ride it out or even be lost, if I was sure that that was what the Law would require.
I wouldn’t LIKE it, mind you.
So I guess my philosophy boils down to “Always do The Right Thing - unless it’ll likely get you arrested.”
Pat, I am curious if this deer didn't eat well? You said, "a nice PA 7pt that will eat well (or not)" Did you find that quite a bit of the meat was lost or soured due to the gut hit and leaving until morning? That statement just struck me as odd... Pete
"Operater error," please elaborate.
I dunno if this guy should be allowed to buy more hunting land!!! The amish might do one of those kloppity kloppity drive by shootings on him !!
( just kidding pat, please dun ban me :D )
My best score ever. I love these “challenges”...
I think you should give away Bowsite Hats to the top 20...
"I think you should give away Bowsite Hats to the top 20..."
Agreed!! Unless they're flat brims. ;)
I answered the questions based on an almost identical scenario of a doe I shot in 08 or 09. Had 3 gut shot deer over the last 40 years. Two recovered, one lost. The one I just mentioned, another one that followed the "gut shot deer always do this" script, and a buck that was lost. He was gut shot, started to bleed, not heavily, but enough to track. He went downhill, uphill, started to rain. Stopped came back in the morning. We stopped trailing where the deer entered a green briar/honeysuckle patch. This patch is about 250 acres. All sign was gone. We looked for the better part of the day, and the following.
As far as carrying a weapon to finish it off. I'm well aware of PA's laws. And as a CCW, I am always carrying, either my Shield or XDm. I also have my knife, which I have used several times over the last 40 years. Nasty, don't like it. You come out of the woods, at midnight, at the end of a dead end road, dragging a deer and carrying your bow and the warden is waiting, your long night just got way longer. Especially if it has two holes and is still warm.
My score wasn't on the high end. Woke up bummed out. Besides 20 below this morning think I'll sell my bow and quit my guiding job.
Thanks for doing these Pat, we do enjoy ribbing you a little in the discussion and you take it like a champ!
You are so right about them not following the script! The buck I shot this year only went about 75 yards and I made a good shot on him. However, I was so busy watching where I thought he would go after the hit I wasn’t paying attention to my surroundings. I was shocked when his short blood trail made a loop and he actually expired about 50 yards in front of my stand. I should have seen him expire easily but I was so focused on what I was sure he was going to do I completely lost sight of the obvious. Great learning lesson!
After doing so many of these I start to think what Pat might be thinking and answer that way but he still he gets you on another. Lots of cry babies, love it. Keep them coming Pat.
People should keep in mind that Pat was out wrestled by a wounded turkey, never mind an antlered buck!
By the way, that was a seriously bad shot. I couldn't tell from that video where the entrance was.
I wouldn’t pass judgment that it was a poor shot. The arrow placement was not good. Many of us have been there with less than ideal placement. We strive to be the best archers possible, this is our responsibility. The reason I bring this up is that I recently had a “poor shot”. I was petrified at what happened. At 25 yards, my arrow flew about 3 feet left. This was all on video. I studied the arrow only to find one fletching came loose. I recovered the animal, but there was a period of time I doubted myself. Keep your chin up and don’t doubt your ability.
The problem is that giving points for the "right" answer implies that it is a "teaching" tool. When, in fact, this scenario was anything but. Your "right" answers are decidedly wrong. We shouldn't be guessing what mistakes you made. Everyone should be guessing or learning what the proper decisions are in tracking a shot animal to optimize chances of recovery. Just because you got lucky and made the recovery despite a comedy of errors doesn't mean you made the right decisions. I expected more of you on this. Very disappointing. I hope the guys who scored well on this challenge aren't too proud of themselves, thinking they know the proper way to track an animal.
Hey Dave. Eat a Snickers, would ya?!
Actually Dave, I scored a 72. And I would put my tracking skills against yours any day and twice on Sunday. Sounds like ArcheryTalk is missing their village idiot.
The fact that points were awarded implies it’s a game, not a teaching tool.
I'm with t-roy and bowbender. Based on all of Dave's responses, he is the expert. I scored 60 and felt pretty good. I'm not a perfect tracker, but I seldom come out without the deer. Have had to go off script a few times and got lucky that it worked. The problem is that deer don't always read the script. Some people need to lighten up a bit.
My score left me feeling neither good nor bad about myself. It was not an exercise that generates that type of self appraisal.
It was nothing more than a few minutes of entertainment on the computer regardless of how seriously some seem to take it.
You guys who are enraged over this game may have bigger problems than a lost deer. Seek help. Or better yet move your bitter bullshit back to ArcheryTalk or Twitter.
Thank you Pat, this was probably my favorite bloodtrail game yet!
I for one applaud you Pat. It takes a lot of self-confidence to put yourself out there to the scrutiny of every passionate bow hunter on the internet. Who among us has not had to make decisions on the fly in next to impossible situations. We do what we believe to be in the best interest of recovering the animal in the quickest and most humane way possible given our experience and knowledge. It all comes down to the old saying,"People in glass houses shouldn't throw stones."
Pat don't take this wrong but...that WAS a lousy shot. Good gravy that was bad. Instead of hunting that night, you should have bought a lottery ticket. You may have wasted a $1,000,000 lottery winning ticket with the luck you used up in finding that deer.
"Pat don't take this wrong but...that WAS a lousy shot. Good gravy that was bad."
Ya, and we ALL make them. Difference is, how many of us are willing to put our bad shots on display?
Haha good lord you can tell it’s the off season around here ... thanks for putting this on I enjoyed it!
"Actually Dave, I scored a 72. And I would put my tracking skills against yours any day and twice on Sunday. Sounds like ArcheryTalk is missing their village idiot. "
And I'll take that challenge any day because if you scored a 72, you are precisely the kind of person I alluded to in an earlier post who thinks they know it all and clearly know nothing and should not by hunting with a bow in hand.
So, how did it eat??? I scored less than I would have liked but that is because I answered on how I would have proceeded, if I lost points, oh well but I would hoped the results would have turned out the same. Enjoyed it and learned a bit in the process.
From: CCRider 08-Feb-20 You guys who are enraged over this game may have bigger problems than a lost deer
Tossed the inner loins into my coyote pile. The rest went into a batch of sausage. From the time I left him alive to the time I recovered him was only 4 hours. It was fine. Nothing wasted!!
"And I'll take that challenge any day because if you scored a 72, you are precisely the kind of person I alluded to in an earlier post who thinks they know it all and clearly know nothing and should not by hunting with a bow in hand."
Reading be hard. I said this was almost identical to a doe I shot in in 07 or 08. The steps I took and what the deer did, was almost a play by play. Thing is, I DON'T know everything. Every blood trail is a learning experience.
I do know this. The last deer I lost was in in 1998, the buck I mentioned. Now, I'm not a stone cold killer like a lot of guys on here, but I've shot over twenty five deer since then without a loss. Not a huge number, but I'm AM hitting 100% on recovery.
And remember one thing, this is a game. Just like Monopoly is not a lesson on economics, this is not a lesson on bloodtrailing. It's just a recap of a hunt, bad shot and recovery. Perhaps you could entertain us with a great BTC as GG did.
That deer gets donated to Hunters Sharing The Harvest program
Ha! This is cracking me up and I really don't want to pile on, but I can't help myself. Anyone else have that "Help Wanted" commercial going on in their head? You know, the one that says "Don't be a Dave."
"That deer gets donated to Hunters Sharing The Harvest program"
Why would that be.
"Ha! This is cracking me up and I really don't want to pile on, but I can't help myself. Anyone else have that "Help Wanted" commercial going on in their head? You know, the one that says "Don't be a Dave." "
Only the ones who are proud of themselves for getting a good score for answering the questions wrong. I know who the smart hunters are by the PM's I've received in support of my criticisms. The rest of you just like to glue your lips to someone's a$$.
It is about time to lock this thread. Just sayin.
I answered #3 incorrectly in that I chose B. Wait 2 hours and start tracking. That was after watching the video 1 time. I had actually thought to myself that was a lung shot deer. After seeing the end result I went back and watched the video again and clearly could see after a few rewinds it was all guts. Goes to show even in a video the first time you see something it may not be what you think......When the matter on the arrow indicated guts I had assumed based on what I saw on the video that it was a quartering shot because I didn't go back and re watch it. Like in real life most only get 1 chance to see what happened.
I'd suggest those that think it was correct to go after a gut shot deer in the dark, or in broad daylight, do some research before answering that question. I've only had one gut shot deer in 50 years of hunting, and by listening and learning from better hunters than me I was able to find my buck the next morning in pouring rain, no more than 200 yards from the shot. I think the learning part of this challenge comes from applying your personal experiences to each question and comparing it to what was deemed as the correct answer.
320Bull brings an interesting question (back) up that I raised early in this thread that no one bothered to respond to. In the absence of video footage, which of course, 99% of us do not have, whats the “right” call regarding go time? To put my question in context (and this may be hard for some of Pat’s most loyal subjects) the “right” call ignores the outcome of this particular challenge and the goal of course is to give you the best chance to find the deer. I know I had to watch the video at least three times, with pauses, to be certain the hit was so low and far back. In fact, in my minds eye, when I first watched at real speed, I thought it actually may have been liver/guts. Additionally, the arrow had a lighted nock, which also certainly helps accurately I.D. the point of impact. Again, I’m guessing most guys aren’t using lighted nocks either. So my question is, when would you go if this happened to you?
this thread dies slower than a gut-shot whitetail
the only evidence needed besides the uncertainty of where the arrow struck in real time, is what was on the arrow when it was found. Having found brown matter on the arrow dictates that you wait at least 12 hours before following the deer. Any other answer to that question to me is not reasonable regardless of weather conditions or daylight remaining. I would much rather look between 100 and 200 yards by grid patterning been chasing a deer in the dark with very little blood trail to go by while pushing the deer farther and farther along. The fact that the deer was found does not make the decisions made correct.
And the fact that no one wants to play any longer really answers the question as well...
One thing is clear...if there are as many gut shot tracking experts on here as it appears......someone has to be shooting a lot of deer in the guts. However, I'm sure it's always the friend of a friend.