Mathews Inc.
The space between my sight pins are inco
Equipment
Contributors to this thread:
cterrell881 20-Mar-20
Ucsdryder 20-Mar-20
Trial153 20-Mar-20
Chuckster 20-Mar-20
GF 20-Mar-20
GF 20-Mar-20
Matt 21-Mar-20
cterrell881 21-Mar-20
Bou'bound 21-Mar-20
BC173 21-Mar-20
KSflatlander 21-Mar-20
cath8r 21-Mar-20
APauls 21-Mar-20
sticksender 21-Mar-20
x-man 21-Mar-20
Ambush 21-Mar-20
Timex 21-Mar-20
GF 21-Mar-20
cterrell881 21-Mar-20
Bou'bound 21-Mar-20
Bowbender 21-Mar-20
GLP 21-Mar-20
cterrell881 21-Mar-20
cterrell881 21-Mar-20
Timex 21-Mar-20
cterrell881 21-Mar-20
Matt 21-Mar-20
cterrell881 21-Mar-20
Timex 21-Mar-20
cterrell881 23-Mar-20
Timex 23-Mar-20
x-man 23-Mar-20
cterrell881 25-Mar-20
kscoyote 25-Mar-20
cterrell881 25-Mar-20
Mike Ukrainetz 25-Mar-20
Bowfreak 26-Mar-20
JTreeman 26-Mar-20
Bowfreak 26-Mar-20
Ambush 26-Mar-20
Cheesehead Mike 29-Mar-20
OFFHNTN 30-Mar-20
From: cterrell881
20-Mar-20

cterrell881's embedded Photo
cterrell881's embedded Photo
I have a 5 pin fixed sight. I sighted my bow in today for 20,30, and 40yd. In theory the space between my pins should be the same or get bigger as you go farther. My pins are closer between 30-40 than they are at 20-40. Does anyone know why this is? My groupings are great so far and I paid particular attention to my form and anchor points.

From: Ucsdryder
20-Mar-20
That isn’t right. I would assume you are coming out of your bubble maybe? Make sure you’re always circling your peep around the housing.

From: Trial153
20-Mar-20
You moveing your anchor point because your top pin is too high in the houseing. Do these two things to correct it. First if you can, move the entire sight closer to the riser. If you cant skip it and move to step two. Next center the top pin in the housing. Then if you can move the entire housing up a smidge do it. Then sight your twenty yard pin and subsequent pins in.

From: Chuckster
20-Mar-20
Yea, somethings wrong. If your arrows have decent speed, shoot at 20yds using your 30yd pin. You might be surprised how close you are. I know some guys that use the first pin for 30 and under because if they used a pin for 20 and 30 they would be stacked right next to each other.

Another out of the box thought I had: maybe your arrows are porpoising (sp) and haven't recovered by the time they hit the target and hit high. You "set" your 20yd pin to where the arrow is hitting and woala, your 20 is sighted in. Now you go to set your 30yd pin but the arrow has had long enough time to recover. Now they are hitting low so you move the pin lower to sight in at 30, creating the pin gap you now have. Your 40yd pin looks good in relation to your 30yd pin because again, the arrow has recovered.

What rest are you using?

From: GF
20-Mar-20
Weeeelll....

If you think about it....

Maybe???

The Disclaimer is that I have hardly messed with peep and pins and I traded off the Contraption for another longbow several years back....

But I used to sight in my scoped (full-size, fixed-6) .22 so that I was basically dead-on (minute of gopher-noggin) from 35 to about 60; you have to consider the flat portion of the trajectory and where it’s showing up.

I guess the big difference between my .22 and a compound is that the boollitts are probably moving at four times the speed, but the crosshairs are only an inch and a half above the line of bore. Maybe if you have quite a low anchor point, you could keep that arrow climbing on out to some considerable distance?

With my bows, a buddy noticed that I’m more consistent between about 25 yards and 40 than I am at 25 and in. Kinda looks like you’ve got the same thing going on.

But odds are that there is something either pretty unique or pretty screwy about your set-up... or your sights are just plain Wrong.

It doesn’t seem at all likely that you’d have gaps like that between your pins, but every pin sets the arrow on a slightly different arc, and if it’s working for you, there might just be a good reason for that. After all, gravity IS a Constant, which is a lot more than can be said for everyone’s form & shot-to-shot execution...

And that top pin does seem to be sitting really high in the ring.

From: GF
20-Mar-20

From: Matt
21-Mar-20
That would not be the case if you were centering your sight housing in your peep when aiming. Unless you have a trick for overcoming gravity.

From: cterrell881
21-Mar-20
I know my anchor point is consistent I have a kisser button and made sure it was correct when testing it out. I called two local shops and they both told me it is uncommon for this to be the case but it does happen. Sometimes people have this happen out to 50-60 yards. They didn’t have an explanation for it tho. I’ll tinker around with it. but my local shop set everything up brand new so I doubt it’s the bow or set up. If it was shooting inconsistent I’d be worried or know I’m just not shooting good that day, but I’m shooting 2 inch groups out to 40 yards center. I just thought maybe there was someone with a explanation for this with some cool science to back it up. Thanks for the insight. I’ll update everyone if I figure out no doing something wrong or if I have an explanation.

From: Bou'bound
21-Mar-20
forget the sight for a minute

we know it is impossible for the actual trajectory of a fired object to fall, flatten relatively, and then fall again without additional energy being applied mid-flight which does not happen with an arrow or bullet. energy is applied once unless you have a booster engine on your arrow.

given that, all things equal, your gap can't lessen over distance if only the absolute arrow trajectory is involved.

now go back to the sight question...........something is not “all things equal”, something other than the absolute trajectory of the arrow is changing your aiming process and the odd gap in the pins is compensating for that factor.

From: BC173
21-Mar-20
Do exactly what Trial said.

From: KSflatlander
21-Mar-20
Bou’bound X2.

Interesting post. If you figure it out let us know the cause.

From: cath8r
21-Mar-20
I bet, based on my experience, if you put your 20 yard pin (top pin) in the center of the housing, you will see that the gaps will be normal (40 and 50 being normally spaced apart). It relates back to a form/anchor issue.

From: APauls
21-Mar-20
I had that once before and I was dead nuts accurate as well. But it was still wrong. It was me. Some form issue. My bet is it is related to where your pin and housing is Centered or not in the peep

From: sticksender
21-Mar-20
Are you using a peep?

From: x-man
21-Mar-20
I've sen this plenty. Every time it's the shooter not centering the pin housing exactly the same for each shot. Now though, is where it gets harder to diagnose over the internet. Without stepping on anyone's toes too hard, I'd say your local shop is mostly to blame. I would venture to guess that your peep is not properly placed, or your draw length is set wrong or maybe both.

Once your draw length is proper and comfortable, you should draw your bow with your eyes closed, let down, draw again, let down, draw again(keeping your eyes closed). Come to a comfortable anchor, then open your eyes. If you don't see the sight pin housing through the peep, then it's not setup correct.

From: Ambush
21-Mar-20
^^^ Solid info right there from Mr X.

And for multi pin sights, I generally put the middle pin right in the middle of the housing, sight that first, then adjust the rest.

From: Timex
21-Mar-20
This is just a suggestion & I believe it to be best & you definitely have room to do it

Put your 20 yard pin in the center of the sight ring then 20 & 30 below that. It's simple put the 20 in the center then move the entire site up until 20 is dead on.

The reason for this is. When you draw back your peep is center your eye the sight ring center the peep & the pin center the ring it becomes automatic for 20 yard shots & if ya hunt whitetail the most common shot distance

From: GF
21-Mar-20
I think Ambush is making pretty good sense, there… Why would you NOT put your middle pin in the middle of the ring???

Also wondering… If the yellow pin is your 40-yard, what the hell are you doing with the other two so far below it? The bottom one looks like it might be about right for shooting Clout... but I didn’t think that was a Thing for you compound guys!

From: cterrell881
21-Mar-20
Thanks for all the info. I did set my peep the way C suggested but as we know it can move initially when setting up the bow. I’ll test this out again. Also, I’ll move the top pin more center and reSight it in and see what happens. I’ll keep everyone posted. Thanks for all the insight.

From: Bou'bound
21-Mar-20
In site. That was a good one!!

From: Bowbender
21-Mar-20
"Come to a comfortable anchor, then open your eyes. If you don't see the sight pin housing through the peep, then it's not setup correct."

^^^^X2^^^^

From: GLP
21-Mar-20
I agree with x-man and ambush. Great info

From: cterrell881
21-Mar-20
Thanks for all the info. I did set my peep the way C suggested but as we know it can move initially when setting up the bow. I’ll test this out again. Also, I’ll move the top pin more center and reSight it in and see what happens. I’ll keep everyone posted. Thanks for all the insight.

From: cterrell881
21-Mar-20

cterrell881's embedded Photo
cterrell881's embedded Photo
So I started the day shooting with my original set up. Before this I made sure my peep was correct by drawing back, anchoring with my eyes closed and then seeing where my pin ended up, which was dead on. I shot 20, 30, and 40. I didn’t move or adjust anything from yesterday. Everything was shooting true like it was before. Groupings were good and center of target. I decided to figure it out. I moved the top pin more center as it was suggested. I sighted in for 20, then 30, then 40. The pic shows what the pins look like now. They are spaced as you’d expect. It wasn’t my anchor or form. It has to be something with the angle I was holding my bow with the top pin so far up. I don’t know the science behind it but it fixed my problem even tho it wasn’t exactly a problem.

From: Timex
21-Mar-20
Gf to each his own but with my compound my 20 yard pin is 2" low at 30 yards. And I hunt eastern woods whitetails so the top pin My 20-30 yard pin in the center of the apiture covers 90% of the shots I'll ever take in the woods. & just like a × is in the center of a rifle scope I want my most used pin in the center of the sight ring

From: cterrell881
21-Mar-20
Times - I plan to eventually make my top pin 40 yards with the same idea. I want my pins to cover out to 80. I want to practice out to 60 yards first and hit consistently. When I’m confident out to 60 I’m gonna adjust my pins starting at 40 yards.

From: Matt
21-Mar-20
If you want to shoot 80 yards, buy a 7 pin sight. Setting your top pin at 40 sounds like a way better idea than it is.

From: cterrell881
21-Mar-20
Thanks for the advice Matt.

From: Timex
21-Mar-20
If you plan on pins to 80 I'd suggest a sliding sight with a center pin & 2 below. You're gonna need a REALLY fast bow or some really light arrows or both to shoot 1 pin to 40 yards.

From: cterrell881
23-Mar-20
Timex, thanks for the advice.

From: Timex
23-Mar-20
I'm just curious what do you hunt & where. If your out west perhaps 40 yd shots are norm but in the eastern hardwoods 40 yards is a loooooong shot in fact in 40 years of bowhunting in VA WVA & MD iv killed well over 200 deer with both trad & compound bows & 2 have been at 50yds less than 10 at 40yds perhaps 30 at 30yds so that would be roughly 150 of 200 deer killed inside of 30 yds & honestly the majority have been inside of 20yds. I can completely understand long range practice. But would never ever want to have to hold a 40yrd pin low at close range

From: x-man
23-Mar-20
His profile says he's from Alaska...

From: cterrell881
25-Mar-20
I hunt Alaska anything from brown and black bear to caribou and moose. even musk ox and elk and the occasional blacktail. Pretty much all of my hunting is spot and stalk. I personally dont have any issues holding the pin 7 inches low at 20 when I have my top pin at 40. Ive practiced it and 20 adn 30 yard shots holding low has become easy. Most of my hunting shots are between 40-60 yards. Ive been in situations where i would have loved to be confident up to 80 yards but Im just not there yet. I understand you have your way of doing things and Im sure hunting deer from a stand or blind you wouldnt want or need to shoot longer than 20 or 30 yards. but believe it or not there is more than one way of doing things and I have an idea about what Im doing. I appreciate your opinion and if I ever decide to start hunting deer from a blind or stand ill keep it in mind.

From: kscoyote
25-Mar-20
You didn't mention it and I cant see one but are you using a magnifier lense in your sight? I've seen this before where someone installed one designed for a single pin sight with multiple pins. This will give the same large gap between pins in the middle of your sight aperature.

From: cterrell881
25-Mar-20
No I don’t use one because archery only hunts around Alaska don’t allow it. That’s interesting tho.

25-Mar-20
To shoot out to 80 yds with a 5 pin sight you are going to have to move your 20 pin back to near the top of your sight housing and get the pins spaced out properly. Sight in at 20, sight in at 80 or even just 60, match a sight tape to the 2 pins, move your 30, 40, 50, 60, 70 and that is what it is, anything else is something screwball you are doing with your form. Period. It's math and physics.

From: Bowfreak
26-Mar-20
It still looks to me like your pin gap is a little off. Your top 3 pins are tight with a big gape to your 50 and a slightly smaller gap to the 60. Maybe it doesn't really look like that and it is only what I am perceiving from the pic?

From: JTreeman
26-Mar-20
I don’t think his 50/60 bottom pins are sighted in. He just has them slid to the bottom working on sighting in top 3. That’s what I suspect anyway.

—Jim

From: Bowfreak
26-Mar-20
Gotcha Jim. That makes much more sense and after rereading....it is what he said. LOL.

From: Ambush
26-Mar-20
For better accuracy and longe range, I’d definitely recommend a three or five pin slider. If you much prefer to have forty yards as a top pin, then get a three pin sight. Center the middle pin in the housing. Once you have your sight tape established, sight in the forty (top) and the sixty (bottom) and the fifty still in the Center of the housing.

You can choose which pin you use as your floater, but using the bottom pin gives you the longest range possible. Using a three pin will give you a pretty clear view and not much chance of pin confusion

Lots of hunters swear by the MBG sight and they are not overly expensive. I’m using a Spot Hogg that’s been dragged through a lot and has been faultless.

The closer you can keep your pins to the center of your housing, the more natural your sight picture will be. Being older and easily confused but still very excitable at shot opportunities, I much prefer three pins. Top, middle or bottom, no multiple “middles” to screw me up. I’m not shooting a fast bow, so I can only shoot out to ninety five yards before my vanes risks hitting the sight housing. I shoot four fletch which gives me a bit more clearance. A Blazer on top would probably knock several yards off that range.

29-Mar-20
I have a 5 pin CBE Tek Hybrid sight with pins sighted in from 20 to 60 yards. It's also a slider sight with a yardage tape and I can shoot out to 120 yards using the slider and my bottom pin.

From: OFFHNTN
30-Mar-20
Mike nailed my thoughts for those of you asking "why not center your top tip?". He may not have enough fps to accommodate setting the other pins before he runs out of room on the bottom of his sight housing.

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