****** Disclaimer- yes I know I could ask this question on the leather wall but those guys are special*****
For those of you that shoot the satori what riser length and limb length did you go with?
I currently have a 30.5" draw length with my compound.
There are so many different choices between the 17, 19 and 21 in risers plus the short medium and long limbs.
Watching one of the Fred eichler satori videos he States you should go twice your compound draw length as a minimum. I don't know if I should go with the 19-in riser and the long limbs or the 21-in riser and the medium or long limbs? I would rather have a bow that's pleasant to shoot.
Another good source for information is Tradtalk.com. Jim Casto is on both sites and know a lot about Satoris. He has owned several combinations of risers and limbs.
Some of your questions are more generic and not specific to Hoyts. Your draw will likely be between 29 and 30 depending on your shooting style - target or hunting. The choice between riser length is personal but I really like the feel of a 21” riser (not a Hoyt and I shoot medium or short limbs because my draw is only 28”. A 21 with long limbs should give you a very sweet setup.
Thanks for your opinion on riser and limb length.
Kodiak - the satori has ILF limbs. Is that the same as an ILF bow?
All of that adjustability is intriguing, but if you have access to someone who can actually put it to good use for you, the primary benefit of ILF is that you’re not locked in with a single manufacturer for limbs. So if cost is any kind of a concern (or even if it isn’t!!) just be aware that it might be many years before you’re good enough to make a convincing argument that a $150 bow is holding you back any....
FWIW, most people shoot better with a longer bow; maybe ILF has changed everything the way that deep sidecuts have changed skis, but last I checked, Target bows were often 72”. You can definitely go shorter in a hunting bow, but of the six on my rack, they run 52”, 60”, 62”, 62”, 62” and 64”.... I’ve done 100% of my hunting with the three 62s. No problems from a tree stand, none on the ground in the northeast and none at home in the Rockies. I bought the short one because I have 2 boys and got a screamin’ deal on a classic at a low draw weight....
The one thing that throws me about the Satori (apart from the fact that the riser alone is more than I have ever paid for a stickbow, including a couple of very desirable Customs) is that it’s a VERY heavy riser, but if you’re used to a compound, you’ll probably never notice that... And at that rate, the long+long that Phil recommended does sound like a sweet shooter. Then if you wanted something a little more maneuverable for hunting you could shorten it up. Because you don’t want to start out with hunting-weight limbs anyway....
FWIW, recommending a bow at twice your compound draw length doesn’t make any sense to me; HALF of your compound draw WEIGHT seems reasonable, though.
But again, ILF.... So no need to drop $350 on your starter set. And lest you be offended by the thought of lightweight limbs for learning with, just be aware that a lot of guys who hunt with with bows in the #50+ bracket also own a lighter bow for practicing their form. And the #1 issue for most people getting started is being overbowed...
I might also suggest that you learn to shoot that recurve with sights first; a peep and a pin with weight you can totally dominate, and you'll figure it out real quick whether you’re missing because of a form issue or something else. And it’s a lot easier to learn how to hit what you’re looking at without sights if your form isn't a major variable from on shot to the next.....
First set of limbs #45-#50 is why most people never get good enough to hunt past 15 yards, so they quit. And if you draw 29”-30”, that #45-#50 will put you a lot a lot closer to #50-#55....
Almost guaranteed Failure if you start out at that poundage... At the very least, you will struggle long and needlessly.
I shoot a 70 lb + compound now.
I was planning on buying the #45 limbs. Is that too much to start with? I was planning practicing and hunting with those limbs.
Don't let GF taint your thinking.
Why do you think so many “trad” guys snapshoot and can only hit stuff inside of 15 yards????
The margin for success with traditional archery seems very small.
It just depends on how slowly and painfully you want to learn and what level of (in)competence you’re willing to settle for.
And as Joe pointed out, that last #5 can make a HUGE difference in your accuracy. When you’re learning, the last thing you want to be thinking about is the draw weight; if you set it up right, you should be able to basically change nothing - except for basically tripling your holding weight and learning a clean release off of your fingers. Then you’ll start slapping ‘em in there like you’re used to and then you can remove the sights if you want.
Then if you’re shooting goes to hell, you’ll know that it’s in aiming error and not a form error...
One thing that will really help (both strength and for warmup to prevent injuries) is a training aid like a Bowfit. I stretch with a Bowfit every time before hunting or shooting, and for strength during the off-season when I can't shoot outside.
Pm me if you have any questions.
Yes, lower weight limbs are better to start with and learn form but the muscles you will use build fast if you shoot regularly and soon you would likely be ditching the light limbs. Find a bow in the 40s to try. If its a struggle, go light. If it feels ok and you can draw and anchor for a few seconds without a struggle, you will be fine. My guess is that 40# limbs will be 43# at your draw and 45# limbs will be 48#ish assuming your draw ends up at 29" or a tad over which would be normal. Either is plenty for hunting and higher would be too high for getting started in most cases. Tons of guys hunt with bows in the 40s up to mid 50s, myself included (52# -57#).
"the satori has ILF limbs. Is that the same as an ILF bow?"
"ILF" is International Limb Fitting system, meaning if manufacturer correctly, all riser/limb combinations should interchange...
"So no need to drop $350 on your starter set."... Not necessarily, Hoyt is kinda high dollar, so if you wanta get your feet wet to try without a lot of investment, search the bay, there are 19" Chinese knockoff risers similar to the Satori for around a hundred bucks, and you can also pick cheap ILF limbs (especially the lower weights) for under a hundred bucks...
What are you DOING to those poor bows??? I can’t recall as I’ve EVER heard of ILF limbs blowing up, so (JMO) there may be an operator-related factor there....
Dirty Mike..start cheaper, and start at 30 - 35#s. Then move on from there.
So I decided I'm going to get a recurve to learn on in the 25-30 lb range and then also buy the satori.
For a hunting bow would you guys go 40, 45, or 50 lb? I'm kind of thinking 45 lb.
If I am following the math correctly.... #40 limbs will pick up maybe 10% from being put on the Long riser... and you can add a couple pounds by cranking down the limb bolts.... and your longer DL will add a couple more pounds per inch of draw... so those “#40” limbs could add up to closer to #50 or more off of your fingers....
So you’ll probably want to think that through with somebody who is really familiar with ILF.... and if you do go with long limbs for your practice/form bow (and really no reason not to, at your DL) you MIGHT want to go with shorter limbs for hunting, which could affect what nominal weight limbs you choose. So do the math!
Net #45 is certainly adequate for deer hunting, especially with your longer DL and at typical whitetail hunting distances. A dedicated Elk rig certainly could go higher.
Most of my bows give me #52-#53 at my DL; I also have one at #45, one at #48, and one at about #62. The plan is to shoot the #62 just about enough to know that my first shot with that one is going to be as good as my first with any other (just to save wear & tear) and the lighter two are part of my retirement plan, but I think I’ll be shooting the #48 a lot more this year... Save a little wear & tear...
Like stared above, the satori riser is heavy. If you can, find one with the wood grip, it just feels better then the plastic one and has a smaller throat in the grip area. Hoyt limbs are decent, not the best, not the worst. They are built bomb proof and can take the abuse.
Trad PA-. Thanks for the advice. I like unpopular opinions.
There were two new choices I have to make after I thought I was all set with the bow decision.
#1. I'm going with Easton axis traditional shafts but which insert? I have four choices the original aluminum hit insert a half outsert or the 50 or 75 grain brass hit insert. So many choices.
#2. Split finger or three fingers under. My man crush fred eichler shoots split but the archery shop is a proponent of three under... Fred is way better looking than the archery shop guy, so I think split is going to win.
For the win!
Here’s the difference between the two: 3-Under is considerably easier to pick up because it’s ridiculously easy to make sure that your eyeball is aligned directly above your arrow. If you look from your nock to your target and line up the point of the arrow in between, you’re down to form & tuning as potential causes of a miss.
Shooting split, your nock starts much farther below your eyeball, so it’s harder to be as certain that the nock is on the same vertical line as the pupil of your dominant eyeball, but if you look down the length of your arrow at a vertical line down the middle of the target, then you just need to confirm that the line of the shaft and the line on the target form a straight line.
Just imagine a clock face with the the point of your arrow as the center shaft of the clock; you just need your shaft as the hour hand and the stripe on the target is the minute hand. Keep everything pointing at exactly 6:00, and you’re good to go.
Just be aware that if you choose to shoot split and you check your alignment on each shot, there will be hordes of 3-U “instinctive” shooters standing in line to deride you for being an Aimer/Gapper instead of a truly Righteous “instinctive” shooter like them....
Yes. It IS a load of crap.
And at right about 20 yards, 3-U is typically more accurate because you are close to your point-on distance, where you can float the point of your arrow at about a 6:00 hold .
Split comes into its own at longer distances, but between 15 and 20 or so, it’s difficult to convince yourself to get your bowhand as low as it needs to go. That’s why so many guys shoot over on deer.
Arrows - I shoot the Easton Axis trads at full length. Originally shot split but, moved to 3 under. 3 under with full length gives me point on @37ish yds. Started shooting instinctive, had some bad misses. Learned gap. Now shoot a hybrid aiming strategy (instinctive but I'm subconsciously aware of gaps).
I think you could be just as successful with a variety of ILF or similar setups though. Find something that speaks to you. The satori spoke to me.
Shop said it could be 2 to ???? Weeks to get it in.
I can't wait to get it into my hands and shoot it.
Went with buckskin riser and maple limbs.
I listened to my guy at the shop who will be setting up the bow. Any guesses as to what he suggested for riser and limbs?
But bigdog’s guess is probably the best bet.
It’ll be interesting to see what spine/length/insert/point he recommended to go with whatever limb.
I called the bow shop this week and they said they never get any notifications on orders. They said stuff usually just shows up.
I was going to hopefully have enough arrows through it to take it hog hunting in mid April but that doesn't look like it's going to happen now.
I wonder if I'll get it before fall deer season rolls around?!
Better you should agree with this guy....
Hopefully next week I'll be shooting my new Hoyt after 70 plus days of waiting.
And next month I'm going to kill a hog with my new bow shooting traditional for the first time ever.
Just maybe don’t set too firm a date for when you’ll be ready to hunt. You’ll get there, but it takes a little while to dial in your tune & your release, etc.
Less than a month is not much time to get up to Hunting Grade proficiency.
I went with the 21" riser and long limbs. And shooting three fingers under.
My groups have consistently shrunk over time as I've become more comfortable with the draw weight and getting a good anchor.
I'm learning/ experimenting how to set the brace height consistently.
Looks like you’re picking it up pretty quick. And no reason not to if you’re not overbowed and you don’t get too caught up in the “instinctive” mumbo-jumbo.... which you don’t appear to have done.
And FWIW, if I were you, I would either back up some, or cut down the number of arrows in your groups before this gets expensive! You probably also want to work on random, mixed distances.
Looks like you have room for tennis balls and Judo points.
How is everybody else's summer practicing going?