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Confronting Amish Trespassers Part 2
I'm sure you all remember the thread from the fall. The good news is my confrontation worked, the trespassing stopped on my property. Unfortunately it simply moved to my neighbors. Not with coon hunting this time, but with shed hunting.
Two weeks ago I got pics of the same Amish family walking up to my border from one of my neighbors property. They were obviously shed hunting. They spotted my moultrie mobile camera and were goofing around in front of it - but they never crossed my fence. They continued to trespass on the one neighbor whom I do not know.
This week they were caught looking for sheds on my east neighbor's property whom I know quite well. He leaves his cell cams up all winter - like I do. But this time, not only did he get them trespassing, they came back to mess with the camera, perhaps to take the chip? Fortunately for Jeff, he was getting all of it in real-time.
So today he paid the father of this family a visit. It didn't go well. The father got an attitude. He told Jeff he "can't control that his boys roam around" and that he "thought it was a free country?" Complained they have 'nowhere to hunt and nowhere to farm any more.' His reaction explains a lot about why these boys feel entitled to go anywhere they want and disregard posted signs. Not how I would have responded since I brought my kids up to respect the rules and respect private property.
Like me, Jeff wanted to handle it man to man. No cops, no game wardens, just a face to face visit. Unfortunately, there's a cultural entitlement that seems to be in ingrained with this particular family. We'll see what happens from this point, but at least they know we're not going to tolerate it.
If there was ever a reason to own cell cams, this is it. They have become a significant deterrent to trespassers and we have all the proof we need if, and when the time comes for us to get law enforcement involved.
Ugh. Lose-lose situation for you guys. Sorry man. But yes, cell cameras are a huge deterrent. I placed 3 cameras on a field edge property line. 2 cell cams and one regular. The regular went missing, the two cell cams stayed untouched. At the price they've come down to I literally use them because they have that added theft deterrent as a guy doesn't know whether the pic has transmitted or not yet. They don't know most of mine can't transmit due to lack of service lol.
Most Mennonites in KY know their neighbors farms better than their own. If you had a stock pond with catfish and bream it was not otters who cleaned you out. They wait for generations to buy up land here and have pre-made out maps of land data, owner databases, etc. They will forage for everything from walnuts to black snakes, arrowheads to acorns.
Sounds like they reached the three strike rule..
Gotta go with consistent documentation of wrong doing shared with the authorities...when they start feeling the financial repercussions they will change their actions. The man to man talk should happen once, any discussions thereafter are a waste of his time.
Sounds like you have done all you can personally, the next time, call the Sheriff. We have owned a farm in an adjoining county for the last 7 years. I took a different stance than you did initially. The first time I caught someone trespassing, it was opening day of Spring Turkey season. I wanted to send a statement to the trespassers as well as the rest of their friends who have been traipsing on that farm for years. I called the Sheriff immediately and they came out and gave the guy a warning while I was present and I told them both that this is the last "warning" that he or anyone else would get. I haven't had any more trouble since that time.
People have no respect anymore. Everyone is entitled. Hopefully it gets resolved.
It would be interesting to see, even with photo evidence, if law enforcement did anything more than give them a slap on the wrist. Your neighbor should start the process as the trespassing probably won't cease.
Seems like there are just too many humans on this ole rock?
Did you guys read the MeatEater article about the guy reporting poachers and getting his deer camp burned down? smh...
Gotta agree with KYeyebrow, catch one and warn them with the law and then let them know it's for real from here on out. No mercy whatsoever, take no prisoners. The attitude of entitlement is f- in ridiculous, buy the land if you want to use, if not stay the F out. Make sure your insurance is paid up and cameras , cameras, cameras. One other way you might think of, put a double wide or build a small cabin, find an honest local and let them live on the property free of charge and in return they watch the property and keep trespassers off, call cops whenever spotted.
"Unfortunately, there's a cultural entitlement that seems to be in ingrained with this particular family."
It's not that particular family. It's a way of life. I have personally witnessed their behavior in south central PA quite often. So much so, that I no longer hunt the state forests in that area. They would show up in passenger vans and yellow school buses. Groups of 30, 40, sometimes 50 in a drive. They would line up from top to bottom and sweep the mountain. Across private ground, it didn't matter. 2016 was the last year I hunted there. My son and I were hunting about half way up the mountain. We got caught in the shit show. We saw them driving past on the road down below. I figured they were going to loop around. Nope. They went about 1/4 mile past us and unloaded to start their strip mining operation. We got as low to the ground as we could till the assholes went past. And we left. Haven't been back there in four seasons. And until the PGC puts an end to their antics I won't be back. Landowners have complained about the busloads of trespassers brought in, but it falls on deaf ears.
Bowbender, our game commission is a joke on several levels. Did u know we have a quail season? How many populations of quail have you seen during ur time in the SC PA woods, ket alone a hunt-able population??...
Sick deer, they will get out as soon as they can, which is not anytime soon...but dont u dare put the deer down.
Few years back, Father and son huntin the neighbors property on first day if rifle, kid shoots a deer, we think cool, the young fella got a deer. My buddy heads back to the cabin at lunch, there is a pickup truck load of apples on the ground 15 yards off the property line, 20 yards in front of the stand. I call the PGC, lady says that because my buddy didn't actually see the deer go down, they will put it on their list of things to get to instead of coming right out because “its the first day of rifle season, lots going on”. I said “ma’am with all due respect, shy of somebody being shot what is hugher on the priority list than a poacher teaching a kid to be a poacher?” They got out the next day and luckily they could see the evidence of the dead deer just over the hill from the stand and were able to put a case together to nail the dad.
Trespassing is as common as anything around here, NEVER hear of ppl getting busted fir it. Yet they will check everything they possibly can on you and your children in a parking lot trying to keep going til they can peg u for something. Im not generally one that rails against authority, but the more i see the less i have faith in our game commission....
It’s very good news for you that another land owner is involved. One man is nothing compared to several banded together. You should ask the neighbor if he knows the neighbor on the other side of you and if he thinks that guy would be concerned about them trespassing too. If so go have a chat. Then once you’re all on the same page involve the law next time and have everyone show up.
How much land do they own? I would rally the troops and go "wander" their farm and see how they like it.
Sounds like the dad’s attitude basically leaves you guys with only one choice, and that seems to be getting the law involved and prosecute to the fullest extent. It’s obvious that reasoning with him ain’t gonna work.
The only other solution might be to refer to Midwest’s suggestion from the first thread........He knows a guy!
They are no different than other people. Just treat them the same. Book em Danno.
The Church pretty much has say over everything plain folk do. Sometimes approaching a church elder can help solve the problem. If that doesn't work, there is always the "English" laws. I have worked with Amish and Mennonites for years and find them to be a lot like everyone else. There are some I call friends and others I would, just as not, never see again.
Mule power. All four landowners are aligned and now we’ve all had run ins with them. The good news is they do respond after being confronted and they do not like those cameras. That’s how they ended up at Jeff’s place because they are avoiding my ground and the other two neighbors.
Thankfully they are not deer hunters.
Pat, I'd get it reported. You never know which flavor of crazy your dealing with. These people are the type that will "get hurt" while trespassing on your property and sue you or something crazy like that. You need a record of all of this and it needs to be documented with action. There are some serious wacko's out there. Dealing with a set of them myself right now. What a hassle, hope it ends well.
You don’t want them. Your neighbors don’t want them. Why do you all continue to let them roam/trespass?
my son in law has delt with them as neighbors & it's not good even when face to face encounters.. We have some stories. Good luck.
What’s the difference if it’s Amish trespassers or anyone else ? What makes you and your neighbors give them a break ? My neighbor had a guy pull into his ranch, park and walk into the National Forrest he called the law and a deputy and a CO showed up and waited 3 hours for the guy to come back to his truck...problem solved. Go hunt turkeys on the Amish guys land this spring and see what he says about that.
Well if the Amish have land and they are trespassing on others, That would tell me the game on thier property is sparse. But, it would be interesting to gather up 20-30 guys and go on the Amish land, see what happens.
LB, what's interesting is the Amish were trespassing on Jeff's land which is only 38 acres. The Amish family own 80 and he was complaining they have nowhere to hunt. So what about Jeff? Is he supposed to let them hunt his 38? The attitude displayed by that father is hard to comprehend.
For all those that say we should have prosecuted, If they were on my land that's what would have happened. But they are avoiding my land since my confrontation. Seems their MO is to trespass until they get caught then they move on to another property until they get caught. They are running out of landowners who will tolerate this behavior and hopefully they will get the message. Next call is to the police and CO where we have lots of photo evidence and can document discussions with this family if we need to go down that route.
I now know many Amish in this area now and the majority are very decent people who are respectful.
they have a reputation for a reason,hypocrites hiding behind their "religion".Handle it the same way you would handle it if they were anyone else.Prepare for payback.
Cameras are great for catching trespassers. I have caught several, all hunters, no Amish.
Confronting Amish Trespassers Part 3 can't be to far in the future.
Photos would be nice. next blood trail challenge could be interesting.
many Amish have a bad attitude when confronted. You do not want them for a neighbor. A bunch of phony Christians if you ask me .
Be careful out there you never know what you're dealing with. Investigation Discovery FEAR THY NEIGHBOR
Let the Amish Mafia know. They can take care of their own apparently! :)
Pat, I agree with you. Be it two acres of 1000 acres, if it's not your land stay off. Prosecute trespassers each and every time. I also agree with you as to majority of Amish are good people, but just like every human you a Have your share of A-holes.
Pat, I do not know what the best method to solve this problem but I like your escalation of force concept. It looks very much like a first responders EoF protocol! I think that this will bid you well down the road. Especially, if it escalates to the next level or even worse if it ends up in court.
It’s rolling into hog hunting season down here(mostly kids with dogs) you talk about dealing with trespassing, I hate it.
I lived around the Amish and Mennonite for several years near Lancaster. I've always tried to not lump a group of people into a big basket but based on my personal experiences with the Amish and Mennonites, I don't trust them or care for them much. Total disregard for any and all fish and game laws and a lot of shady things hidden behind "religion". Your opinion may vary but that's mine and I'm glad I don't have them for neighbors anymore.
No easy solution when you're dealing with "entitled" people. I think you've handled it fine. Now, I'd say it's time for the local Sheriff to have a crack at it.
Hey Pat, shoot to kill!! But if you don't mind, hold off on that for a while longer just in case the guy trespassing on your property is the same Amish dude I just hired yesterday to put a new roof on my house. Thanks, and best of luck.
You’ve dealt with it well till now Pat. I’d say it’s time to get the local sheriff involved for sure.
More cameras, to most Amish it is forbidden to have a picture taken then shown, tell em your gonna have picture posted in local paper, worth a try
We don’t have Amish here but we have many trespassing poachers. At least law enforcement is an option for you. Here it’s not, they don’t view it as a real crime and the DA won’t prosecute . So, use that option and end it.
What a terrible situation. I had something similar happen on an 80 acre piece I owned. The former owners son was a meth head and he would trespass to find sheds, poach deer, and he even set up a Meth lab. It was a nightmare. He threatened to kill a few people too. All the local celebrity hunters were terrified of the dude. He was bad news.
And once you lose your piece of mind it’s hard to enjoy the property because you feel like you’re always looking over your shoulder.
It helps to understand Amish mentality. Their's is one of being left alone to live as they wish. They don't like attention and prefer to not be in the public spotlight. The community abhors negative attention. You can use this to your advantage if push comes to shove.
I've known a good number of 'rogue' Amish who refuse to be constrained by their local community or the bishop's directives. The young men sometimes drink and smoke. Divorces happen. Tax dodging is rampant. Some are ripoff artists posing as builders or craftsmen.
When I lived in Ohio some friends gave a "very nice Amish neighbor" permission to hunt their land. Their intention was that only he would be doing that. Well, he interpreted it as him and 42 of his cousins. They had a hard time rescinding the permission.
That being said, the only loggers that anyone would hire there were the Amish, because they would come in with horses instead of the big tractors that would tear up the land. They always did a very good and very neat job for us. TMBB
Hate to see the thread title with "Amish" in it. I live about 10 miles from Intercourse, PA. I try to do business with the Amish as much as I can. Around here they are more business people rather than farmers, as farming land is getting scarce. So I imagine they are more familiar dealing with us "English", and have better people skills. Sounds to me, like the father of these children is the problem. Much like the problem children of other races or nationalities. No father, or a bad father.
Don't like they're pictures taken? Keep posting their pictures in the local stores asking for information/identification of trespassers. Don't bother leaving your number or info, just keep posting pictures and maybe they won't like it enough to stop or at least slow them down. ;-)
I would definitely have a record of complaints on file. I wouldn't be surprised if some trespasser getting hurt on your land then trying to sue.
Really???!, your name is Woody and you live by Intercourse, PA!!!!
Hahaha! I would make a Beavis and Butthead joke about Woody from Intercourse, except our favorite liberal bigot from KS might label me as some sort of "phobe" or "ist"..
No need Lou. The joke pretty much wrote itself for us normal folk.
Buy up every broken trail cam you can find and put one on every border tree and again 30 yards inside the border. When they sided my cabin in NE PA I took some pictures and they would hide when the camera came out.
The Amish are all multi millionaires so the "nowhere to hunt or fish" is completely BS, then can buy 1000 acres for cash without batting an eye. I do not think they pay taxes either but not sure on that. The good ole days of a shotgun and rock salt are looong gone......
I have a relative that has delt with this for some time also. There comes a time when "being nice & understanding" MUST STOP.. Nothing else will work.
Rut Nut's Link
I would get law enforcement involved. He tried the diplomatic way, next step needed. Get a history established that this family has no intention of abiding by trespassing laws, and no regard for private property.
Don, not sure who you know, but I grew up in the Pa Dutch Country and most of the Amish around there were far from Millionaires! Most were farmers although some were carpenters or furniture makers. And they DO pay taxes, however not Social Security or Medicare/Medicaid because they don’t collect any benefits.
And interestingly, they DO pay school taxes even though their kids do NOT attend public schools.
Take em to the train station Pat...…..
Just kidding for all of you who have no sense of humor
Hell I've got 2 brand new cameras I'll donate to the cause just need film for them lol