Ivermectin
General Topic
Contributors to this thread:
ND String Puller 10-Sep-21
WYOelker 10-Sep-21
LINK 10-Sep-21
Shuteye 10-Sep-21
greg simon 10-Sep-21
DanaC 10-Sep-21
Ambush 10-Sep-21
Will 10-Sep-21
HDE 10-Sep-21
DanaC 10-Sep-21
LINK 10-Sep-21
DanaC 10-Sep-21
Habitat 10-Sep-21
bigswivle 10-Sep-21
drycreek 10-Sep-21
jjs 10-Sep-21
Franklin 10-Sep-21
RK 10-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 10-Sep-21
DanaC 10-Sep-21
DanaC 10-Sep-21
Franklin 10-Sep-21
spike78 10-Sep-21
t-roy 10-Sep-21
bigswivle 10-Sep-21
DanaC 10-Sep-21
[email protected] 10-Sep-21
RK 10-Sep-21
t-roy 10-Sep-21
TGbow 10-Sep-21
DanaC 10-Sep-21
[email protected] 10-Sep-21
DanaC 10-Sep-21
RK 10-Sep-21
DanaC 10-Sep-21
[email protected] 10-Sep-21
[email protected] 10-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 11-Sep-21
LINK 11-Sep-21
Al Dente Laptop 11-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 11-Sep-21
Nemophilist 11-Sep-21
Franklin 11-Sep-21
Al Dente Laptop 11-Sep-21
bigeasygator 11-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 11-Sep-21
Kilroy66 11-Sep-21
bigeasygator 11-Sep-21
Franklin 11-Sep-21
bigeasygator 11-Sep-21
Al Dente Laptop 11-Sep-21
bigeasygator 11-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 11-Sep-21
Franklin 11-Sep-21
bigeasygator 11-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 11-Sep-21
ND String Puller 11-Sep-21
Dave 12-Sep-21
Stix 12-Sep-21
DanaC 12-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 12-Sep-21
TGbow 12-Sep-21
spike78 12-Sep-21
DanaC 12-Sep-21
Nemophilist 12-Sep-21
spike78 12-Sep-21
Grunter 12-Sep-21
DanaC 12-Sep-21
Matt 12-Sep-21
RK 12-Sep-21
Matt 13-Sep-21
spike78 13-Sep-21
TGbow 13-Sep-21
DanaC 13-Sep-21
TGbow 13-Sep-21
Dave 13-Sep-21
DanaC 13-Sep-21
Dave 13-Sep-21
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[email protected] 13-Sep-21
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WV Mountaineer 13-Sep-21
DanaC 13-Sep-21
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Tracker 13-Sep-21
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TGbow 13-Sep-21
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Treeline 13-Sep-21
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TGbow 13-Sep-21
spike78 13-Sep-21
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Matt 13-Sep-21
Matt 13-Sep-21
TGbow 13-Sep-21
trophyhill 13-Sep-21
TGbow 13-Sep-21
trophyhill 13-Sep-21
TGbow 13-Sep-21
trophyhill 13-Sep-21
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Grey Ghost 13-Sep-21
Matt 13-Sep-21
trophyhill 13-Sep-21
Matt 13-Sep-21
trophyhill 13-Sep-21
TGbow 13-Sep-21
[email protected] 13-Sep-21
smarba 13-Sep-21
trophyhill 13-Sep-21
TGbow 13-Sep-21
Matt 13-Sep-21
Thornton 13-Sep-21
Grunter 13-Sep-21
DanaC 14-Sep-21
TGbow 14-Sep-21
Dave 14-Sep-21
DanaC 14-Sep-21
Dave 14-Sep-21
Dave 14-Sep-21
KSflatlander 14-Sep-21
Dave 14-Sep-21
Dave 14-Sep-21
Huntskifishcook 14-Sep-21
Dave 14-Sep-21
Jeff Durnell 14-Sep-21
TGbow 14-Sep-21
bigeasygator 14-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 14-Sep-21
bigeasygator 14-Sep-21
bigeasygator 14-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 14-Sep-21
TGbow 14-Sep-21
bigeasygator 14-Sep-21
TGbow 14-Sep-21
Treeline 14-Sep-21
bigeasygator 14-Sep-21
Dave 14-Sep-21
bigeasygator 14-Sep-21
Dave 14-Sep-21
bigeasygator 14-Sep-21
DanaC 14-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 14-Sep-21
Thornton 14-Sep-21
KSflatlander 15-Sep-21
[email protected] 15-Sep-21
jjs 15-Sep-21
KSflatlander 15-Sep-21
Bowaddict 15-Sep-21
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KSflatlander 15-Sep-21
spike78 15-Sep-21
Thornton 15-Sep-21
bigeasygator 16-Sep-21
spike78 16-Sep-21
Huntiam 16-Sep-21
LINK 16-Sep-21
spike78 16-Sep-21
RK 16-Sep-21
chillkill 16-Sep-21
spike78 16-Sep-21
Thornton 17-Sep-21
TGbow 17-Sep-21
Treeline 18-Sep-21
Grey Ghost 18-Sep-21
Treeline 18-Sep-21
Dave 18-Sep-21
Eagle_eye_Andy 18-Sep-21
Treeline 18-Sep-21
Treeline 18-Sep-21
Treeline 18-Sep-21
bigeasygator 18-Sep-21
bigeasygator 18-Sep-21
Alexis Desjardins 18-Sep-21
Eagle_eye_Andy 18-Sep-21
TGbow 18-Sep-21
Eagle_eye_Andy 18-Sep-21
Dave 19-Sep-21
Treeline 19-Sep-21
DanaC 19-Sep-21
bigeasygator 19-Sep-21
Dave 20-Sep-21
Dave 20-Sep-21
bigeasygator 20-Sep-21
Kannuck 20-Sep-21
bigeasygator 20-Sep-21
Grasshopper 20-Sep-21
10-Sep-21

ND String Puller's Link
Here’s an article about Ivermectin I found interesting. A lot more to it than horse wormer. Most interesting is the anti-cancer properties. Stay Safe !

From: WYOelker
10-Sep-21
My neighbor and I were discussing this last night. He couldn’t wrap his head around the idea that a medicine can have multiple uses. That the approved use may not be its only use…

I pointed out how in Bet med we have all sorts of liberty for off label use. But regulations prevent such issues on humans.

One thing is for certain, we still do not know hardly anything about the damn mess. The data is being manipulated all the time, and corruption will likely prevent us from ever really knowing…

From: LINK
10-Sep-21
There’s no money in ivermectin….. move along.

From: Shuteye
10-Sep-21
People being brought out of Afghanistan were given Ivermectin.

From: greg simon
10-Sep-21
Makes perfect sense to treat people in Afghanistan with dewormer.

From: DanaC
10-Sep-21

DanaC's embedded Photo
DanaC's embedded Photo

From: Ambush
10-Sep-21
Hope dana doesn't use penicillin then. Or any of the hundreds of treatments used on both animals and people.

Gaslighting is the best way to blow your cover and prove you don't actually have an argument of your own.

From: Will
10-Sep-21
If you think Ivermectin works well to stop COVID, you should see this insanely amazing thing with fewer side effects that works infinitely better. But I know vaccines are scary so I wont talk about it.

From: HDE
10-Sep-21
"One thing is for certain, we still do not know hardly anything about the damn mess. The data is being manipulated all the time..."

That's because it's easy to figure out if you completed a basic high school education. Sorry doc's, you're not the only ones that can process and understand the data...

From: DanaC
10-Sep-21
Will, apparently a lot of people would rather 'treat' than 'prevent'.

From: LINK
10-Sep-21
I didn’t know they had a preventative yet. All I’ve heard about is a shot the puts money in Fauci’s coffer and still allows you to get and transmit the disease. Who’s the sheep Dana. Ohh and that’s not a question. ;)

From: DanaC
10-Sep-21
"I didn’t know they had a preventative yet. "

Do you even grasp the *concept* of 'vaccination' ? Or is the static too loud?

From: Habitat
10-Sep-21
Take it,may be a form of natural herd thinning for the not so bright.Or it may just make them start mooing

From: bigswivle
10-Sep-21
There’s no money in ivermectin….. move along.

This

From: drycreek
10-Sep-21
DanaC, tell that to the folks that have been vaxxed and have gotten covid. Surely you aren’t that dumb.

From: jjs
10-Sep-21
Ivermectin works like HQZ in reducing the the symptoms of Covid, it doesn't prevent it but must be used in the early stages of the virus. Big Pharma doesn't make their big dollars off this. Has far as using vet Rx, I have been using some sinceI was a little kid, my mother worked for a vet and the dr would give her some Rx to help with some infections and sprains, saved a few dollars vs from basically from buying the same Rx for humans. The only side effects is when walking by a fire hydrant I have to raise my leg.

From: Franklin
10-Sep-21
Ivermectin is a "preventative".....there is a prophylactic regiment of taking Ivermectin either monthly or bi-weekly. Been using it along with Vitamin D, C and Zinc for the past 8 months.

I don`t wear masks, don`t practice the mythical/ridiculous 6' social distance rule....so far so good.

This so called shot is NOT a vaccine.....mRNA using a synthetic to initiate an immune response does not meet the definition of a "vaccine". Why else would the CDC change the definition of "vaccine" last week. Don`t even get me started on which "not a vaccine" was actually approved by the FDA.

What happened to the left`s mantra....."my body my choice"?

From: RK
10-Sep-21
Drycreek. Surely Danac is that dumb, but he sure does like to hear himself talk. Lmao!

From: Grey Ghost
10-Sep-21
"What happened to the left`s mantra....."my body my choice"?

Nothing. It's just become a popular mantra for the right now. Irony is beautiful.

Matt

From: DanaC
10-Sep-21
The number of so-called 'breakthrough' cases is a tiny fraction of cases among the non-vaxxed. Likewise, Covid deaths. But hey, it ain't *perfect* so it doesn't work at all, right?

You call people 'sheep' but who are the lemmings following the anti-vax preachers off a cliff? Happy landings!

From: DanaC
10-Sep-21
"

“Approximately 97% of people with severe disease from the delta variant are unvaccinated,” she says. “That gives you an idea of how effective these vaccines are. I think that number is a point that cannot be overemphasized.” "

https://uihc.org/news/vaccinated-vs-unvaccinated-how-sick-can-you-get

From: Franklin
10-Sep-21
Is that link from the same people that claimed that Covid came from bat soup?

I`m just glad you admit it`s not a vaccine. When was the last time you heard of someone having a mild case of Polio or Smallpox....or your dog having a mild case of rabies?

You got the jab now you have a monkey on your back for life....well done.

From: spike78
10-Sep-21
Dana, that BS is only true IF the government is truthful. Yeah because the government is truthful lol. We call other countries sadistic but yet we’ve invaded and killed more people then any other country. I’m sure the government cares about you as they send thousands of soldiers to their deaths throughout the years. All they care about is that you keep working and paying taxes. You do realize that the government came out with the brilliant idea of SS because they think your too stupid to handle your own finances but yet SS will run out in the few coming years? Yeah I have complete faith in our government. Just listen to Pelosi for one minute and it makes you go hmm.

From: t-roy
10-Sep-21

t-roy's embedded Photo
t-roy's embedded Photo
I’m a little nervous about how big the needle is gonna be for third shot!…..At least you will get a discount.

From: bigswivle
10-Sep-21
Nothing. It's just become a popular mantra for the right now. Irony is beautiful.

Gosh dang it Matt, I’ve had to many bud lights to argue about irony tonight

From: DanaC
10-Sep-21
Spike, I do NOT worry about Social Sec. because the government will simply print the money to cover it. Yeah, inflation, I get it.

Here's the thing - anyone who does not get vaxxed, and dies from covid, well, the Democrats figure that's one less vote for the Republicans. (I would love to see how covid deaths break down per party affiliation...) And *they* are sitting there looking all serious while they laugh up their sleeves.

10-Sep-21

Glunt@work's embedded Photo
Glunt@work's embedded Photo
No doubt the right is probably less into the vax but some minority groups aren't as well and they would lean left. This is something interesting I saw.

From: RK
10-Sep-21
Well Dana. Deaths on the Democratic side of COVID are 3 to 1. Dream on Your communist party is doing well so far.

From: t-roy
10-Sep-21
Unfortunately, that doesn’t keep them from voting, RK.

From: TGbow
10-Sep-21
Social Security is a prime example of how poorly the government can run amuck. Handle somebodys money like that in the private sector and you will be sitting in prison. Democrat or Republican..doesnt matter. They've both done a great job at stripping away our freedoms. Honestly, I hadn't figured out what the Republican leadership stands for, at least with the Democrats I know they have a Marxist agenda. Covid is a serious thing no doubt..I do take it seriously. When I , my wife n 17 yr old daughter had it last month, it was concerning for sure. My son is 35 but still in the reserves, they will force him to get the vax Im sure.

From: DanaC
10-Sep-21
"Well Dana. Deaths on the Democratic side of COVID are 3 to 1. Dream on Your communist party is doing well so far. "

Got data to back that?

10-Sep-21
Black folks are the largest unvaccinated subgroup.Going to fire them? Turn them away?

From: DanaC
10-Sep-21
"Honestly, I hadn't figured out what the Republican leadership stands for...":

Really? BOTH sides want POWER. Both sides know HOW to get it - MONEY. And the money is in military spending. If you were paying attention last week, BOTH sides were pushing for MORE spending. Defense contractors get rich, they kick back a percentage to RE-election PACs, (yes, on BOTH sides), defense contracts get parcelled out to 'friendly' congressional districts, rinse and repeat.

Did you ever look at how many states make parts for that POS F-35?

Ike warned us about this bullshit. January 1961, Eisenhower's Farewell Address. Probably the most important document in modern history, and bet your ass it is NOT being taught in schools, regardless of which way the district swings.

Democrats. Republicans. Whores of Mammon, every one of them.

From: RK
10-Sep-21
Well Dana. Deaths on the Democratic side of COVID are 3 to 1. Dream on Your communist party is doing well so far.

From: DanaC
10-Sep-21
Again, got data? Or are we playing Big Lie Bingo?

10-Sep-21
DanaC you are right,the industrial Military Complex.I have a best childhood friend that retired last year as a 3 star general.Now he has 4 corporations where he is the only employee.Basically he is a lobbyist with Pentagon connections.

$$$$$$$$

10-Sep-21
RK figure black folks in that state.They have learned by experience not to trust any Government

From: Grey Ghost
11-Sep-21
"Black folks are the largest unvaccinated subgroup."

That speaks volumes on this subject.

Matt

From: LINK
11-Sep-21
Grey Ghost I imagine it has a lot to do with them not wanting to say yes sir master Faucci sir. Yet so many caucasians are willing to be institutionalized.

11-Sep-21
First, the "vaccine" is NOT approved. On the August 23rd, the FDA merely extended the EUA for it, as they have done several times since they first recommended it. Also on August 23rd, the FDA gave approval for the licensing of the name of the "vaccine", again, NOT approval of it, but for the name of it. Lastly, as part of the licensing approval, the FDA gave them clear instructions as to what they must have on EVERY piece of printed material regarding it. In a nutshell, "All printed, promotional, and media related material must clearly and conspicuously state that this vaccine does not FDA approval..." The Pfizer and Moderna utilize mRNA to create protein stands of the virus, not the real virus. The creator of the mRNA technology, Robert Malone has stated on multiple occasions that he does not recommend it's use for this purpose. The J & J, is the "old school" way, where dead virus cells will trigger your body into creating it's own immunity to fight it. To be clear, NONE of them are even close to getting FDA approval, if that is, the FDA follows it's own standards and protocols. That is between 5-10 years of 3 separate clinical trials. Just ask yourself, how did they compress 5-10 years of research and clinical trials into 14 months? You don't need to a mathematician to figure that out. The the Biden/Fauci money trail. Only 2 dots need to be connected here. Trump went after Big Pharma because of their staggering price increase. Epi-Pen, Insulin, and basically any drug manufactured here is sold CHEAPER in Canada and Mexico are a few examples. Big Pharma mad at mean orange man in Whitehouse. Enter Biden and Fauci. Fauci continues to recommend vaccines for all, even though the "virus" has a 99.7% recovery rate" and only 6% of all deaths attributed to COVID came purely from COVID, the other 94% of those who died during the SCAMdemic had 2.6 underlying serious conditions. Check the CDC website for yourself. Then Biden purchased on 2 separate deals, 300 million doses of the vaccine for the government to distribute. If the Whitehouse is saying that 47% of the US population, which is at around 330 million, is already vaccinated, why purchase that ridiculous amount? Oh, and the Big Pharma execs made over $30 million in salary last year. Hydroxychloriquine works and has been is use for over 70 years. Ivermectin works also, but it's use is not as widespread as HCQ. Regeneron and other monoclonal antibody infusions also help. You can also boost you own immune system with diet and supplements. Zinc, Vitamin D coupled with Potassium and Magnesium Asparate, buffered Vitamin C, Kombucha and other probiotics for a healthy gut biome, Garlic, Ginger, Echinacea, and Manuka Honey all will boost your immune system. I live in the NYC metropolitan area have been working in NYC during the entire SCAMdemic. I have been on the trains commuting into Midtown, and my jobsite has over 700 tradesmen from 4 different states. Not I of anyone in my family has gotten it, that we know of, if we did, we had no symptoms. And those that I know that did have it, which I was EXPOSED to as well, either had no symptoms or mild symptoms for a day or 2 at the most. If you to get the vaccine or all 3 for that matter, go ahead, but don't attempt to instill your fear in me. Douse yourself with rubbing alcohol, bleach, Tile-X, burn your laundry after wearing it, leave your food in the garage for 3 days, burn your lawn, kill off every form of bacteria within your home, but don't tell me that I must do the same , or tell me that because I refuse to, that I causing the variants to spread and killing people. Wake up Sheeple, Comrade Joe has the blackshirts ready!!!!

From: Grey Ghost
11-Sep-21

Grey Ghost's Link
"First, the "vaccine" is NOT approved."

Nonsense. Per the FDA (see link for the official announcement): "Today, the U.S. Food and Drug Administration approved the first COVID-19 vaccine. The vaccine has been known as the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine, and will now be marketed as Comirnaty (koe-mir’-na-tee), for the prevention of COVID-19 disease in individuals 16 years of age and older."

" The creator of the mRNA technology, Robert Malone...."

More nonsense. Malone is just one of hundreds who contributed to the development of mRNA vaccines over decades of research.

I didn't read the the rest of your rambling post, since you missed badly on your first 2 points.

Matt

From: Nemophilist
11-Sep-21
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/09/members-congress-aides-exempt-bidens-vax-mandate/

From: Franklin
11-Sep-21
Matt you also "missed badly". Not a single drop or dose of "Cominarty" has been produced. The "non-vaccines" that are being issued are still BioNTech still fall under EUA and still offer limited liability to the makers.

Why are liability protections still in place for an approved "vaccine". "Cominarty" is not expected to be produced until late 2022-2023.

There have been legal scholars and large law firms that looked into the legal ease of the "approval" and it appears "legally" the citizens have been hoodwinked again.

11-Sep-21
FDA approval really came into the spotlight because of a morning sickness drug called Thalidomide. Pregnant women who were prescribed the drug during the 1960's saw a large increase in babies being born with partial or missing limbs, or fused fingers and toes (lobster boy). Because of that, any drug then had to go through 7 years of clinical testing on animals, followed by 7 years of clinical testing on humans. The standards and protocols have evolved into the 3 stage clinical trials today, but it is still between 5-10 years of trials. You can believe what you want, but it is impossible to compress 60-120 months into 14. My points are on target.

From: bigeasygator
11-Sep-21

bigeasygator's Link
Matt you also "missed badly". Not a single drop or dose of "Cominarty" has been produced.

Well, that’s straight up wrong.

It is an identical product with the same formulation. To suggest Cominarty has never been manufactured is misleading at a minimum. It’s the same vaccine. The only meaningful differences are how it is legally treated and how it is being marketed.

“Comirnaty has the same formulation as the FDA-authorized Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 vaccine and can be used interchangeably to provide the COVID-19 vaccination series without presenting any safety or effectiveness concerns. The products are legally distinct with certain differences that do not impact safety or effectiveness.”

Furthermore, since it is an identical product chemically speaking, it has been produced and studied extensively.

“Follow-up data from this ongoing clinical trial was analyzed by FDA to determine the safety and effectiveness of Comirnaty. The updated analysis to determine effectiveness for individuals 16 years of age and older included approximately 20,000 Comirnaty and 20,000 placebo recipients who did not have evidence of SARS-CoV-2 infection through seven days after the second dose. Overall, the vaccine was 91% effective, with 77 cases of COVID-19 occurring in the vaccine group and 833 COVID-19 cases in the placebo group.

The safety was evaluated in approximately 22,000 Comirnaty and 22,000 placebo recipients 16 years of age and older. More than half of the vaccine and placebo recipients were followed for safety for at least four months after the second dose. After issuance of the EUA, participants were unblinded in a phased manner over a period of months to offer placebo participants Comirnaty. Overall, in blinded and unblinded follow-up, approximately 12,000 Comirnaty recipients have been followed for at least 6 months.”

From: Grey Ghost
11-Sep-21
BEG,

It blows me away how misinformed some Bowsiters can be. Even after our own experts, like Ike and Mike in CT, have taken time to explain the facts, they still cling to their misinformation. And worse, they try to spread it.

Matt

From: Kilroy66
11-Sep-21
As a covid survivor my biggest disappointment was the lack of therapeutics offered to boost your bodies defenses. I asked my doctor for something, H2Q, and was flatly denied. It was only when I couldn't speak without coughing that I was prescribed a Z-pack and coughing pills that I began to improve. Early intervention can only help, why wait until your in need of a ventilator is the lunacy of it all. Treat early, treat quickly but the act of doing nothing can kill you. Throw everything you can at it. By the way, I am looking for a new doctor.

From: bigeasygator
11-Sep-21
It blows me away how misinformed some Bowsiters can be. Even after our own experts, like Ike and Mike in CT, have taken time to explain the facts, they still cling to their misinformation. And worse, they try to spread it.

I’d say I’m shocked, but unfortunately I’m not surprised. It reinforces how real the struggle is, though, when people do not even get the most basic of facts.

From: Franklin
11-Sep-21
See Matt...you`re one of the "hoodwinked". BioNTech is a product....Cominarty is a separate product LEGALLY. That`s the point you aren`t understanding.

The shots being given ARE NOT Cominarty, they are BioNTech.....the term "interchangeable" is not a legal term.

The shots being given still fall under EUA and the makers are still under liability protection. Somehow you think that`s a small point. Large law firms have gone through this with a fine tooth comb in preparation for possible litigation. The name change from BioNTech which actually sounds like a medicine to Cominarty.....sounds like a candy bar....should tell you everything you need to know. You have been played.

It`s sad our citizenry isn`t more informed and so easily misled.

From: bigeasygator
11-Sep-21
See Matt...you`re one of the "hoodwinked". BioNTech is a product

No, it isn’t. Again, people not understanding basic facts. BioNTech is a company, not a product.

It`s sad our citizenry isn`t more informed and so easily misled.

Coming from someone who doesn’t even understand BioNTech is a company that developed the vaccine with Pfizer, this is one of the most ironic of statements I’ve read.

11-Sep-21
Franklin, you are exactly right. EUA is NOT FDA approval. Anyone can check for themselves to see what must transpire for FDA approval. 5-10 years, not 14 months of a fear mongering agenda SCAMdemic. Anyone can read that is was granted an extension of the EUA. Anyone can read that Cominarty was only given licensing approval, and not BioNTech. And again, anyone can read where any printed material must say "This product has not been granted FDA approval."

From: bigeasygator
11-Sep-21
Anyone can read that Cominarty was only given licensing approval, and not BioNTech.

Where to begin. BioNTech is the name of a company, and not a product. Too many of you seem to be misunderstanding this very basic point.

The whole point behind rebranding the vaccine developed by Pfizer and BioNTech and giving it a name is the fact that it can now be legally marketed and advertised.

Continuing the EUA has everything to do about inventory management and vaccine distribution, and nothing to do with trying to pull one over on the American public.

As someone once said, “It`s sad our citizenry isn`t more informed and so easily misled.”

From: Grey Ghost
11-Sep-21
Franklin,

If you change the name of an apple, it's still an apple. Cominarty and the Pfizer vaccine are the SAME formulation, and can be used interchangably, per the FDA.

As for your liability concerns, you can thank GW Bush for that one. He signed the PREP Act into law that allows the federal government to provide liability immunity to drug manufactures in circumstances like these. Which, btw, is probably why the vaccines are free to everyone.

You see, unlike you apparently, I don't have an inherent distrust for our government, nor our medical community. I applauded Trump when he rolled out Operation Warp Speed to streamline the development, manufacturing, and distribution of the COVID vaccines. I honestly think that the record short timeline that it took to bring us the vaccines will go down as one of our medical community's greatest achievements in the last few decades.

Matt

From: Franklin
11-Sep-21
BioNTech product has not been FDA approved and is the only Pfizer product being distributed. There has not been a single drop or dose of the approved Cominarty approved "non-vaccine" produced or administered.

I stand by my statement of people being "hoodwinked" and "uninformed".

The FDA receives 45% of it`s funding from fees from Big Pharma.....65% of the fees from human use medical drugs fund the FDA. Do a quick search of how many FDA officials leave the FDA and are now working for Big Pharma.

This so called "vaccine" doesn`t even have the actual virus in it....it`s a synthetic and doesn`t meet the definition of a "vaccine".

You are correct about one thing.....no I do not trust the government that funded and help create the virus that killed millions. By the time it`s all said and done, the US government will have a hand in Hitleresque death tallies. So no I do not "trust" big government.

But you probably still believe it was bat soup that created this virus...so....

From: bigeasygator
11-Sep-21
BioNTech product has not been FDA approved and is the only Pfizer product being distributed

They are the SAME product. The “Pfizer” vaccine was developed in conjunction with the company BioNTech. It has been produced, administered, and tested and this vaccine is now fully approved by the FDA. It has now been rebranded as the product Cominarty after extensive testing in human beings - just because the name changed doesn’t mean that it is something “different” in all the ways that matter medically speaking. This really isn’t that hard.

And yes it is a vaccine. The overall definition of what a vaccine is has not changed. It is a still a “substance used to stimulate the production of antibodies and provide immunity against one or several diseases.”

Stop with the misinformation and get your damn facts right. This is just sad.

From: Grey Ghost
11-Sep-21
Apparently it is hard for some, BEG.

Matt

11-Sep-21

ND String Puller's Link
This video may change your mind about our government.

From: Dave
12-Sep-21
Wow! The level of ignorance by some in this thread is astounding and disturbing. Dana and GG, you need to start getting your information from somewhere other than CNN because both of you are 100% wrong on many counts. I'd try to set you straight but my experience with guys like you is that you're too ignorant and stubborn to listen to the truth. Instead, you choose to remain ignorant and stubborn and are a large part of the problem in this country right now.

From: Stix
12-Sep-21
More from the infectious disease specialists of Bowsite.

From: DanaC
12-Sep-21
Dave, I don't watch TV and don't follow CNN. Or FOX. (And if anyone actually believes that Rupert Murdoch is an America-first guy, well, I got bridges for sale...)

From: Grey Ghost
12-Sep-21
Dave says I’m ignorant and “100% wrong on many counts”, but he can’t name a single one. How cute.

Matt

From: TGbow
12-Sep-21
I dont trust Fox News either. 90% of the media are bias. Im not anti vax myself, but I damn sure dont trust the government, especially the administration we have now. Its hard to figure out what the truth is as far as info on Covid. Vaccinations can be a good thing but it should be a persons choice..if they want to get vaccinated or whether they want Ivermectin. I believe the people in the labs developing vaccines have the best intentions and want to help us but its the CDC and politicians that I don't trust as far as telling us the whole story.

12-Sep-21
think of it this way. before a baby is born, it has no official or legal name. When the baby is born, and an official birth certificate is completed, the baby now has an official legal name. same with the pfizer vaccine before and after fda approval. its the same damn baby...now it has a name.

From: spike78
12-Sep-21
Dave, you didn’t know that the liberals know everything and what they say is how it should be?

From: DanaC
12-Sep-21
Ricky, some people think 'ibuprofen' and 'Advil' are two different things ;-)

Spike, I see the same thing on both sides. I tend to believe whoever comes in with hard data. Not bluster, not arguments 'ad hominem'.

12-Sep-21
"Ricky, some people think 'ibuprofen' and 'Advil' are two different things"

it's even worse. advil and ibuprofen can be and often are manufactured by different companies. in this case its the same company, same vaccine, they just gave it a legal name. ...same damn parents...same damn baby...now it has a legal name.

From: Nemophilist
12-Sep-21
https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/09/members-congress-aides-exempt-bidens-vax-mandate/

From: spike78
12-Sep-21
Dana, the difference is that conservatives don’t care what liberals do with their life but liberals get involved with ours on every aspect. Examples such as gun control, anti hunting, mandates, helmets for motorcyclists, banning menthol cigarettes, you have no right to defend yourself with a handgun in the city, etc.

From: Grunter
12-Sep-21
Exactly!! ^^^^

From: DanaC
12-Sep-21
Go peddle that to the women in Texas.

From: Matt
12-Sep-21
"Dana, the difference is that conservatives don’t care what liberals do with their life but liberals get involved with ours on every aspect."

Haha, the current attempts at restricting abortion and voting suggests otherwise.

From: RK
12-Sep-21
Dana and matt. Have you read any of those bills or are you just listening to you sides talking points

Make it easy. How are voting rights being restricted in Texas Facts only please, based on what was passed as law?

From: Matt
13-Sep-21
"Dana and matt. Have you read any of those bills or are you just listening to you sides talking points Make it easy. How are voting rights being restricted in Texas Facts only please, based on what was passed as law?"

Make it easy by twisting the discussion to limit it only to bills that have been passed, only bills that relate to voting rights, and then only those passed in Texas? Given the previous comments to which we were responding , that seems to be a really intellectually dishonest question.

The GOP exists outside of Texas, the things they desire to do are not fully embodied in passed legislation, and those desires extend beyond voting rights.

Let's talk about the abortion law that Texas recently passed which, as I understand it, bans abortions after 6 weeks of pregnancy (which is sooner than many women learn they are pregnant), so it could be construed as a de facto abortion ban. While I am generally pro-life, the COVID/vaccine discussion has opened my eyes to how important it is to let people to make personal decisions that affect the lives of others. As such - and I am sure you are on the same page - people should be allowed to make healthcare decisions personally without consideration of how they impact others (in this case, an unborn fetus).

Tangentially, I find it ironic that conservatives are generally both pro-life and anti-welfare - so in many cases they both want to force women to have babies they do not want/cannot afford and then desire to eliminate the social safety net that they would need.

On the voting front, the grand irony is that most legislative changes were initiated by people who have bought into Trumps lies surrounding the 2020 presidential election having been fixed (of which I have seen 0 evidence). That is flatly stupid.

Since the election, GOPD politicians in 43 states have proposed ~250 laws to change the voting process. Much of this legislation was designed to limit mail in ballots, limit early in-person and election day voting and impose stricter voter ID requirements. While I am on board with ID requirements, from an outsider's perspective much of the other proposed legislation appears to be designed to limit access to low income/minority voters. In my opinion, that is flatly un-Americans.

One only has to look at some of the aspects of Georgia's voter law that subtly makes it more difficult for some people to vote and also makes the process of evaluating any contested ballots more subject to a partisan process. Again, that seems patently un-American.

If it makes you fell better, I think Biden's comments about these efforts being "Jim Crow 2.0" are hyperbolic and inflammatory, but I think that in a subtle way he is directionally correct as to their intent.

From: spike78
13-Sep-21
“While I am generally pro-life, the COVID/vaccine discussion has opened my eyes to how important it is to let people to make personal decisions that affect the lives of others. As such - and I am sure you are on the same page - people should be allowed to make healthcare decisions personally without consideration of how they impact others (in this case, an unborn fetus).“ HaHa could have fooled me with your vaccine rants!

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
What happened in Texas should be commended. Anytime life is protected, that is a good thing

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
What happened in Texas proves that 'conservatives' who pay lip service to libertarian ideals are full of crap.

"We support important freedoms", like the right to smoke menthol cigarettes and bike without helmets. Lah dee dah. When the _hard_ choices come down you're as authoritarian as the Taliban.

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
Dana, your statement shows how twisted the left is. If life isnt sacred enough to be protected then none of us are safe.

Put religious beliefs aside..a child in the womb is a person unto themselves. ..real science proves that. You have no argument other than the fact you believe we have a right to decide what class of people have no rights. Kinda like the pro slavery crowd declaring black people were not human and equal to the white race. Whether you are a Christian, athiest or whetever, natural law tells us certain things are wrong. You just dont wantvto accept it

From: Dave
13-Sep-21
"Dave says I’m ignorant and “100% wrong on many counts”, but he can’t name a single one. How cute. Matt"

I could easily do that but you're clearly one of those guys who is too stupid to recognize how stupid you are. Let's start with two easy ones. First, the vaccine was not approved by the FDA through proper channels. This is a shell game by the FDA and CDC. Vaccines can not be approved without years of clinical trials and completing "stages" of testing that have been conveniently scrubbed from the FDA and CDC websites so people won't question why they are not following their own protocol which has been in place for years. The vaccine that was magically approved is not one and the same as the one being given currently. They just want you to think it is so ignorant people will think it's safe to get the unapproved vaccines now, even though they are far from safe.

Second, Robert Malone did indeed invent mRNA technology. The only people claiming he didn't are liberal media outlets, you know the ones you get your "facts" from.

You'll still cling to your ignorant and incorrect assertions, claiming them as "fact" when they are anything but. You do not have the ability to think critically and are the real problem with our nation right now as you blindly trust our government, the media, and other agencies who have corrupt and sinister agendas and who lie every time they open their mouth. Thankfully, it appears that the majority on this thread are far more intelligent than you and recognize the truth. Darwin was talking about people like you. Take the shot.

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
TGBow, have you ever noticed that in discussion of the life of the fetus, the rights of the woman are *immediately dismissed* ?

This is why I won't debate it. You can not be for 'rights' when you casually dismiss the rights of half the population. And sorry, all the arguments you will make -next- about sex will be based on religious beliefs. So...

Not impressed when 'conservatives' adopt and then abandon libertarian principles to suit their needs.

From: Dave
13-Sep-21
You mean those same rights that we all have in regards to the vaccine?????

Hypocrisy, as usual.

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
Dave, *IF* I agree that vaccination should be *by choice* will you agree that women have the right to control their own reproductive status? (And not just by 'crossing their legs'?)

Because while I strongly support vaccination, I prefer shaming those who oppose it to mandating it. And while I support 'abortion rights' I strongly prefer shaming women who fail to use proper birth control.

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
PS the real heck of it is, the 'new' McConnell dream team Supreme Court has openly shown that it may break with the precedent of Roe v Wade. If they do, bet on it that Biden will 'pack' the court with 5 hard-left liberals. And then *all* our rights will be in jeopardy. Mandatory vaccinations will be the least of it.

Be careful what you wish for.

13-Sep-21
What is "generally pro life"

Unless it's your daughter? Downs?

13-Sep-21
Voter Bills/Laws were proposed/enacted due to the flagrant disregard of DEMONcratic controlled states election amendment regs. DEMONcratic Governors bypassed their state's legislatures and forced the new regs onto their citizens on their own. ANY amendment to voting regs should have been presented to and voted upon by the state's legislatures. Mail-in ballots are wrought with fraud, as they have been proven to be stolen, falsified, and in the worst case, fake. Myself and my wife each received 3 from my district. What is wrong with voter ID and a signature check at the polling sites? You cannot board a plane, go the doctor, enter a government building, purchase a fishing license, open a checking account, collect unemployment, etc.., without showing ID, but to vote, no problem. How did some states show 100%, or even 106% of voter turn out!!!! Every citizen, including those below voting age and more turned out to vote. I guess, like Stalin said; "It doesn't matter who votes, it's who counts the votes that matters." And what, no comments on the FDA protocols and time table (3 stages of clinical trials, which take between 5-10 years) for REAL FDA approval? Keep on drinking the Kool Aid Comrades, just make sure it's the RED one, you don't want upset China!

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
Dana. ..the child, scientifically, is a person unto themselves. The pro abortion crowd cant deny that. BTW, there are many people that are not religious at all that recognize abortion is wrong. The simple truth is, the pro abortion are condoning murder. Why do you think the abolitionist fought slavery so hard? Because they understood that black people are equal and should not be enslaved. Its a slippery slope when a nation starts deciding who has the right to live and who dont. Biden is pro death...this whole mandated vax movement is about control..they could care less about our rights. I think a person is probably better off getting the vaccine but it should never be forced. The problem with tne left is they have no common sense logic to engage right n wrong issues, whether they be Democrat or Republicrat

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
TGBOW, again, you dismiss the rights of women without a backward glance. Just remember, they vote too.

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
Dana, what gives the gov the authority to decide which human beings live? You have no argument. Only thing you can say is one life is more important than another.

13-Sep-21
The politics that both parties want, is eating away at the populace. It’s insane to argue over which party best aligns with individual rights and, adherence to the constitution to keep the guberment in check. It’s a no brainer. No sense in arguing over it.

The law defining right versus wrong is written in the Ten Commandments. End of story. No interpretation needed.

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
"You have no argument. Only thing you can say is one life is more important than another. "

EXACTLY what YOU are doing, putting the unborn against the already-living. And disenfranchising HER.

From: LINK
13-Sep-21
I would hate to be on the side that tries to argue that the termination (murder) of an unborn or in some instances born child is a right of someone else. This is the same party that would or will one day support senicide and enforce 1 child policies like China.

From: Tracker
13-Sep-21
That article reads like an advertisement.

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
Dana, the point is both lives have value..believe what you want..you have that right to have faulty, humanistic opinions

From: bigeasygator
13-Sep-21
First, the vaccine was not approved by the FDA through proper channels. This is a shell game by the FDA and CDC. Vaccines can not be approved without years of clinical trials and completing "stages" of testing that have been conveniently scrubbed from the FDA and CDC websites so people won't question why they are not following their own protocol which has been in place for years. The vaccine that was magically approved is not one and the same as the one being given currently. They just want you to think it is so ignorant people will think it's safe to get the unapproved vaccines now, even though they are far from safe.

This whole statement is demonstrably false. Medicines, vaccines or otherwise, do not all require "years" of testing, and the fully approved Pfizer vaccine went through all the normal FDA processes, including the three phases of clinical trials.

Second, Robert Malone did indeed invent mRNA technology. The only people claiming he didn't are liberal media outlets, you know the ones you get your "facts" from.

He was one of the first and one of many, but there are others who the scientific community (not the liberal media outlets) give more credit to with respect to mRNA vaccine technology. As GG rightly points out, there were multiple players involved and he was but one.

So you might want to look in the mirror when you discuss "ignorant" and "incorrect" assertions, Dave.

13-Sep-21
LINK, the DEMONcratic party's own "Dementia Joe" already has a prominent member on their COVID-19 Task Force who promotes people dying at age 75. Ezekiel Emanuel, brother of Rahm Emanuel, has stated that he himself hopes to die by 75, and will not seek to prolong his life past that age if he lives. "Society, families, and you will be better off if nature takes it's course swiftly and promptly." Read the article he wrote for the Atlantic. Sick and twisted mentality. As far as choices go, first did anyone of these pro-choice folks ever once consider if their own mother decided to terminate the parasite (as they refer to an embryo) growing inside her womb, or that every man and woman does has a choice, to use or insist on birth control, or not and roll the dice. Abortion has evolved to become the new birth control. ZERO responsibility on the parties involved, except the one who doesn't have a voice doesn't have a choice.

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
Al, but they say the Leftist in DC are not Marxist, Communist, ect...but yet we have over 100 yrs of history to reflect back on, and its these type of governments that are guilty of dehumanizing certain sects of people. Lime I told my inlaws...dont complain to me when the time comes and the gov has total control of every aspect of your life and they decide who is worthy to live and who is not. Biden is not the first to over step his boundaries nor is this the first over reach of congress. Loncoln, Woodrow, Teddy and many more did it. One of the reasons they pushed for courts to quit looking to the constitution for their rulings , and refer to "past cases" that previous judegs ruled on...So that eventually you can make it up as you go..enter activist judges.

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
"Dana, what gives the gov the authority to decide which human beings live?"

What gives the gov't of Texas the authority to decide?

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
The gov of Texas is not deciding who gets murdered, they are attempting to protect innocent lives. Your position on the other hand os pro murder..whether you want to admit it or not

From: Treeline
13-Sep-21
The Constitution contains no Right to abortion.

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
The gov't of Texas is attempting to criminalize and/or enslave pregnant women. Your position is pro-slavery whether you admit it or not.

Look. Abortion sucks. It is not the easy choice the religious right makes it out to be. (Ask a women's health counselor about that.) But when the option of providing all women (and all men) with easy access to birth control is brought up, the religious right either comes out as anti-sex (good luck with that!) or they trot out the 'socialist medicine!' play. Either way, they get to feel good about themselves without putting any money up. I don't know which is worse, the phony piety or the plain damn cheapness.

You want to cut down on abortions? Pony up. (And sorry, no, poor women will not stop having sex with or without protection, just because it pleases you.)

From: bigeasygator
13-Sep-21
The Constitution contains no Right to abortion.

The Constitution is also not an enumeration of all of the rights to which we have been endowed. And the SCOTUS has ruled that the Constitution does protect the right to an abortion (citing the 9th and 14th Amendments).

From: LINK
13-Sep-21
Dana I don’t expect people to not fornicate. But once they make the decision to create life there should be no option to destroy it. People have been having sex and creating children outside of marriage since the beginning of time. Killing a baby in the womb is the problem not people having sex. Talking about enslaving women….The black race is the biggest victim of abortion. I think you’re racist and you just want to exterminate as many minorities as possible.

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
Just because the SC rules that abortion is legal doesn't mean it matches up with the constitution..yes , its legal in that sense but so are a lot of other laws. The question with any legislation, executive order, and even amendments...does it contradict core principals layed down in the constitution? If the SC court ruled that its ok to have sex with a child does that mean its ok? The problem is we have people in all branches of gov that dont care about the right to life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness..and unfortunately we have enough people that apparently don't care either. What the hell good is a constitution that lays down your rights if the gov can step all over them

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
"I think you’re racist and you just want to exterminate as many minorities as possible. "

Wow. I think you're a racist and want to deny minorities the right to vote and affordable health care.

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
"Just because the SC rules that abortion is legal doesn't mean it matches up with the constitution.."

A lot of things don't 'match up with the Constitution'. that's the same silly argument anti-gunners use about the 2nd and 'assault rifles.' The Constitution and BoR was never intended to be a *comprehensive* list of the rights we enjoy. The Ninth Amendment, reads as follows: The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people. Hence the 'right to privacy' - and hence abortion - affirmed by SCOTUS in Roe v wade.

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
PS as I said earlier - if this court doesn't re-affirm Roe, Biden *will* pack the court and then we are all truly f*ed.

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
All I can say is Im glad that Dana wasnt makin the decision for me when I was inside tje womb and Im glad somebody chose the right to life for all of us here on this site

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
So am I !!! Not *my* call - and not yours either.

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
You would probably have a different opinion if it were you and your could speak to yourself from the womb. Nothing but genocide

From: spike78
13-Sep-21
Honestly I do think the Dems are racist and want to kill minority babies hence pro choice.

From: DanaC
13-Sep-21
Yeah, because minorities overwhelmingly vote Republican, right? Sheesh.

From: Matt
13-Sep-21
"What happened in Texas should be commended. Anytime life is protected, that is a good thing"

So you are supportive of mask and vaccine mandates?

From: Matt
13-Sep-21

Matt's Link
"Grey Ghost I imagine it has a lot to do with them not wanting to say yes sir master Faucci sir. Yet so many caucasians are willing to be institutionalized."

It has a lot to do with them having been treated like lab rats by our government in the Tuskegee syphilis experiments and others.

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
Matt..you cant be serious. Im talkin about murder..unbelievable.

No wonder this country is such piss poor condition.

13-Sep-21
I figured since there is so much expertise on the subject, I should ask here. Is it true that clinical trials of these vaccines involve aborted fetus cells?

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
David , this is from Nebraska Medicine.

"No, the COVID-19 vaccines do not contain any aborted fetal cells. However, fetal cell lines – cells grown in a laboratory based on aborted fetal cells collected generations ago – were used in testing during research and development of the mRNA vaccines, and during production of the Johnson & Johnson vaccine. "

13-Sep-21
Thanks TG. Ok so the origins come from aborted fetuses? Whether current or from the 60’s, people are supposed to be ok with that?

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
David , sounds like something from Nazi Germany

13-Sep-21
Yes tell me about it. Considering the death rate on the China flu is so small, I don’t get the Pom Pom girls who are helping push the vaccine agenda. Especially when so little is known on long term effects. Just shows how easy many are brainwashed and manipulated........

From: Grey Ghost
13-Sep-21
"Is it true that clinical trials of these vaccines involve aborted fetus cells?"

From my understanding, no, it's not true. They use lab grown stem cell clones that descend from fetal cells collected 50 years ago. They are called "fetal cell lines". Basically, it's like keeping a heirloom tomato strain going. The specific fetal cell line used in testing the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines is called HEK 293.

Disclaimer, I'm not a scientist, doctor, nor a contagious virus expert. But, I can search and read articles from reputable sources to educate myself.

Matt

From: Grey Ghost
13-Sep-21
"Thanks TG. Ok so the origins come from aborted fetuses? Whether current or from the 60’s, people are supposed to be ok with that?"

So, I guess you're against the vaccines for smallpox, rubella, Hepatitis A, and rabies, too, eh? They were all tested on viruses grown on fetal cells.

The obvious reason they test vaccines using lab grown fetal cells is because the viruses being targeted affect human cells, and not necessarily animal cells.

Matt

From: Matt
13-Sep-21

Matt's Link
"Yes tell me about it. Considering the death rate on the China flu is so small, I don’t get the Pom Pom girls who are helping push the vaccine agenda. Especially when so little is known on long term effects. Just shows how easy many are brainwashed and manipulated........"

Speaking of brain washed and manipulated, what leads you to believe that long-terms side effects are likely from a 1 or 2 dose vaccine? We are not talking about a daily medication that builds in the body over time. Vaccine side effects generally present within ~6 weeks of being administered. There have been almost 6B doses given worldwide, so there is robust data on which side effects have been observed and their relative frequency.

In fact, I recently read an article from someone in the medical field saying that we have a more robust data set for the COVID vaccines given their broad-based administration than we get from the clinical trials done to support FDA approval of other drugs.

Just another straw man....

13-Sep-21
Thanks Pom Pom girl. I am against anything to do with abortion thank you very much. And it’s funny how “my body my choice” only applies to abortion. But I digress. Anytime you have tyrants like the president in thief, a guy like Fauci who has been involved with the Wuhan lab for many years even warning of a coming pandemic in the early 2000 teens, and then lying about his involvement, and guys like Bill Gates, Fauci and Soros profiting from these vaccines and paying for the mainstream media to push the agenda, yea I am just a little bit skeptical. On top of it all you have an Israeli study that blows the narrative out of the water in terms of if you’ve had the Rona and whether you should get the vaccine anyway. And on top of it all guys like you still believe that the Rona jumped from a bat to a human naturally. No thanks. I’ll take my chances at living or dying when God determines it’s my time. Neither you or any of the rest of the Pom Pom girls will decide that for me. You’re just another sucker spewing what crooked politicians and bureaucrats are telling you to say........

From: Matt
13-Sep-21
"Thanks Pom Pom girl. I am against anything to do with abortion thank you very much. And it’s funny how “my body my choice” only applies to abortion."

Who is saying "my body, my choice" only applies to abortion? If one approaches both COVID vaccination and abortion from the overarching perspective that life is sacred and should be protected, they should be logically consistent and apply that to both (or neither). Invoking it on their own behalf but rejecting other's ability to do so comes off as massively hypocritical.

13-Sep-21
I reject abortion (which by its own nature is racist when you look at the demographic mostly affected when it was out in place by progressive, racist Democrats at its inception) and vaccines that come from it and I reject tyranny. What is so hypocritical about that?

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
David, you're waiting your time. You are using logic, some people cant deal with that

13-Sep-21
There is a fairly safe pharmaceutical way to prevent unwanted pregnancies from happening but I wouldn't support it being mandatory.

From: smarba
13-Sep-21
While I agree with TG and others that it's a waste of time trying to use logic....

"Who is saying "my body, my choice" only applies to abortion? If one approaches both COVID vaccination and abortion from the overarching perspective that life is sacred and should be protected, they should be logically consistent and apply that to both (or neither). Invoking it on their own behalf but rejecting other's ability to do so comes off as massively hypocritical. "

My body my choice for abortion in fact ends up killing 50% of the people involved in the activity. It's my body I can do what I want.

Yet when it's my body and I don't want to get a forced vaccination, you're telling me I can't do what I want...despite virus killing far less than 50% of the people involved. Like less than 1%...

13-Sep-21
Yes Clay there are a host of things that are deeply disturbing in play here. And I don’t want to minimize the unhealthy who fight for their lives when they contract this plague that China unleashed on the world. What pisses me off is guys like both Matt’s and several others on here want me to give up my freedom because they are willing to give theirs up because they’ve bought in hook line and sinker. They are also quick to “follow the science” as long as it fits the narrative, while quickly dismissing other possible treatments, and making fun of those just like CNN does, when other successful outcomes happen. They are purposely pushing the narrative that no one is allowed to question. And why do you suppose that is? Since when as a free people are we not supposed to question questionable mandates from elected officials and demand accountability instead of a half lost former Vice President making a speech and then walking off confused and not taking questions. I’m supposed to believe this clown has the best interest of the United States of America at heart? Yeah right. And don’t get me started on bureaucrats dictating what’s good for us. And the Pom Pom girls right there egging it on. I don’t know about most of you, but this dictatorship running rampant, shutting businesses down, bending a knee to China, calling riots peaceful protests, and mostly peaceful protests with a few agitators mixed in insurrections when no weapons found or looting taking place, all being supported by progressives like the guys here pushing the narrative. It’s just mind boggling that this crap is allowed to happen in a free country........

From: TGbow
13-Sep-21
Dave..thats it in a nutshell. Well said!

From: Matt
13-Sep-21
"What pisses me off is guys like both Matt’s and several others on here want me to give up my freedom because they are willing to give theirs up because they’ve bought in hook line and sinker.:

Hah, that couldn't be further from the truth. I just wish you would be logically consistent, keep up with the news if you are going to post up conspiracy theories on breaking news that pretty much everyone else knew about 3 months ago, and brush up on your math skills.

From: Thornton
13-Sep-21
You all do whatever you want, I dont care. But I will tell you this new variety is a special sort of demon. I'm working two ERs in Kansas now, and I am seeing critical covid patients almost daily. I know multiple people 40 and under that have recently died, and several more that barely made it. I'm seeing survivors daily that have permanent heart and lung damage. I'm still seeing quite a few vaccinated patients, but they are not quite as bad. Not sure what the answer is, but you're an idiot if you think you're invincible.

From: Grunter
13-Sep-21
Were the under 40 people obese or smokers? Any underlying conditions?

From: DanaC
14-Sep-21
"I reject abortion... and I reject tyranny. What is so hypocritical about that? "

Do you support the paid-informant, legal-harrassment system that Texas has put into law? Because that crap is straight out of the KGB playbook. Or the Stasi. Tyranny at its damnedest.

The people from Texas that I've 'met' on the internet here and elsewhere are good folks, but they have started a culture war that I fear is going to burn them badly. I hope I'm wrong, both for them and because it might spread worse than any physical disease.

From: TGbow
14-Sep-21
Dana, the SC already started a war 48 yrs ago on the unborn. Sad thing in America when all life is not valued and protected. Pure evil is all it is any way you cut it.

From: Dave
14-Sep-21
"This whole statement is demonstrably false. Medicines, vaccines or otherwise, do not all require "years" of testing, and the fully approved Pfizer vaccine went through all the normal FDA processes, including the three phases of clinical trials."

OMG!! Once again, ignorance shining bright. You are 100% WRONG on this. You might wanna spend some time investigating the truth rather than watching CNN. Do tell, where do you get your "facts?" Straight out of your a$$??? This is the problem in this country today. People as ignorant and uninformed as you are making decisions by casting a ballot that affect those of us with intelligence. Second, while Malone may have been "one of many" who were instrumental in development of mRNA technology, he was certainly one of the most influential. So, your claims of otherwise just show your ignorance and incapacity for critical thinking and exploring the truth. Typical libtard, use baseless arguments and false information to defend your position when it does anything but and generally shows your lack of intelligence.

You are actually the one spreading misinformation. Why don't you tell us Mr. KNOW-IT-ALL what the phases of vaccine testing and approval are. Then, explain how it's possible that any vaccine could magically get approval in less than a yr when following the FDA's own long and established guidelines. Then explain to us what your "qualifications" are, aside from being able to regurgitate propaganda that you get from Google and Facebook.

From: DanaC
14-Sep-21
Dave, rather than repeating that CNN shibboleth, why not post YOUR sources, countering what has been presented. If YOU have spent 'some time investigating the truth', that shouldn't be difficult.

From: Dave
14-Sep-21
Which sources for the truth would you like references to? I'll happily provide them.

Here's one for you. NONE of this was done under proper scrutiny or duration, BTW, for the COVID vaccines.

https://www.fda.gov/vaccines-blood-biologics/development-approval-process-cber/vaccine-development-101

From: Dave
14-Sep-21
Here's another for you. https://thevaccinereaction.org/2021/09/robert-malone-md-on-the-availability-of-comirnaty/

https://journal-neo.org/2021/08/30/scandal-behind-the-fda-fake-approval-of-pfizer-jab/

From: KSflatlander
14-Sep-21
Dave- why don’t you back your statements up because thus far you have not.

From: Dave
14-Sep-21
Apparently, you can't read because the links above provide ample proof of the truth.

From: Dave
14-Sep-21
Here's some more for ya.

https://www.pnas.org/content/86/16/6077

https://www.science.org/doi/abs/10.1126/science.1690918

14-Sep-21
What's with all the emphasis on FDA approval anyway? Our government has backed and recommended all sorts of nonsense such as, use of glyphosate on our food, oxycontin (heroin prescribed by a doc) and the food pyramid which recommended 6-11 servings of processed carbs a day. I believe the vaccine to be safe based on ample evidence that has not originated from our government.

From: Dave
14-Sep-21
Now, let's clear up the facts surrounding Ivermectin since that's what this thread was started as.

First, Ivermectin is not simply horse-paste. It was developed nearly 50 yrs ago as an anti-parasitic and also has been found to have significant anti-viral properties. It has a very long and SAFE track history in treating a variety of conditions in HUMANS as well as animals. Like HCQ, it has an excellent safety profile and is very effective and inexpensive at treating and PREVENTING COVID. Many physicians with integrity know this and have been treating COVID patients now for months with excellent results. What's that you say, you didn't know that because CNN FB, and Twitter didn't tell you that??? Fraudci and the NIH don't want people to know this or use it because THEY'RE NOT GONNA MAKE ANY MONEY OFF IT!! They are sinister and corrupt and the sooner some of you recognize this, the better off we'll all be. Fraudci, the CDC, NIH, and FDA ARE NOT YOUR FRIEND, despite what many naive people would like to believe.

From: Jeff Durnell
14-Sep-21
Exactly right

From: TGbow
14-Sep-21
I trust Fauci and the FDA about as much as I trust Bill Clinton. Fauci is a joke..and a bad one at that

From: bigeasygator
14-Sep-21

bigeasygator's Link
NONE of this was done under proper scrutiny or duration, BTW, for the COVID vaccines.

Again, straight up wrong. Directly from the FDA website (which is hilarious that you linked to because if you spent any time looking at what was done you'd realize how far off base you are).

FDA-approved vaccines undergo the agency’s standard process for reviewing the quality, safety and effectiveness of medical products. For all vaccines, the FDA evaluates data and information included in the manufacturer’s submission of a biologics license application (BLA). A BLA is a comprehensive document that is submitted to the agency providing very specific requirements. For Comirnaty, the BLA builds on the extensive data and information previously submitted that supported the EUA, such as preclinical and clinical data and information, as well as details of the manufacturing process, vaccine testing results to ensure vaccine quality, and inspections of the sites where the vaccine is made. The agency conducts its own analyses of the information in the BLA to make sure the vaccine is safe and effective and meets the FDA’s standards for approval.

...

The first EUA, issued Dec. 11, for the Pfizer-BioNTech COVID-19 Vaccine for individuals 16 years of age and older was based on safety and effectiveness data from a randomized, controlled, blinded ongoing clinical trial of thousands of individuals.

To support the FDA’s approval decision today, the FDA reviewed updated data from the clinical trial which supported the EUA and included a longer duration of follow-up in a larger clinical trial population.

Specifically, in the FDA’s review for approval, the agency analyzed effectiveness data from approximately 20,000 vaccine and 20,000 placebo recipients ages 16 and older who did not have evidence of the COVID-19 virus infection within a week of receiving the second dose. The safety of Comirnaty was evaluated in approximately 22,000 people who received the vaccine and 22,000 people who received a placebo 16 years of age and older.

Based on results from the clinical trial, the vaccine was 91% effective in preventing COVID-19 disease.

More than half of the clinical trial participants were followed for safety outcomes for at least four months after the second dose. Overall, approximately 12,000 recipients have been followed for at least 6 months.

You provide a link to the steps necessary to obtain vaccine approval, all of which were followed as required as it pertains to the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine. The other links you provided are nothing more than opinion pieces, from some mighty dubious sources I may add (the New Eastern Outlook? LOL).

But I'll give you another chance and ask the same question others have, what specifically was done outside of the FDA guidelines/requirements as it pertained to the approval of the Pfizer/BioNTech vaccine? Posting a link to all the steps that were actually followed doesn't really help your case.

From: Grey Ghost
14-Sep-21
Dave,

Mike in CT, who has 30 years of experience in the infectious virus field, has already explained, in depth, how the usual FDA approval process was streamlined, largely due to Trump's multi-billion dollar Project Warp Speed, to make Covid vaccines available in record time. I'm sure you'd be praising those efforts, if he were still in office.

After decades of research and development by hundreds of scientists around the world, If you still think Robert Malone was the sole inventor of the mRNA technology, there's not much I can do but shake my head and ignore you.

Matt

From: bigeasygator
14-Sep-21

bigeasygator's Link
I also do like how you posted the link to the quote from Malone on the Bannon show saying the following:

"[Comirnaty] is absolutely not available. So the little trick that they have done here, is [the U.S. Food and Drug Administration] issued two separate letters for two separate vaccines. The Pfizer vaccine, which is what currently available is still under Emergency Use Authorization…

The product that’s licensed [by the FDA] is the BioNTech product, which is substantially similar but not necessarily identical. It’s called Comirnaty. And it’s not yet available. They haven’t started manufacturing it or labeling it."

You do realize he's walked back that statement right? He admitted he was completely wrong. Now you can go ahead and do the same. We're waiting.

"Malone quickly conceded his statement on the Bannon show was wrong. “When one is doing rapid analysis on the fly, one does not always get everything right,” he told The Fact Checker. “On this particular legal liability issue I did not hunt down the details myself, and relied on comments from a third party lawyer which were not fully correct.” He said the statements we received from Pfizer and HHS “are consistent with my current understanding.”

From: bigeasygator
14-Sep-21
Mike in CT, who has 30 years of experience in the infectious virus field, has already explained, in depth, how the usual FDA approval process was streamlined, largely due to Trump's multi-billion dollar Project Warp Speed, to make Covid vaccines available in record time. I'm sure you'd be praising those efforts, if he were still in office.

What was streamlined was essentially the procurement and manufacturing aspects related to vaccine rollout.

In addition, some of the testing was done in parallel steps, not sequentially as would have been typical. None of these steps related to testing or clinical trials were bypassed or shortened prior to full-FDA approval.

From: Grey Ghost
14-Sep-21
You are correct, Jason, and your comments reflect exactly what Mike in CT told us a few months ago. Obviously, guys like Dave would rather believe sources like the Russian-controlled New Eastern Outlook, then our own resident experts who are also some of the most respected members we have on Bowsite. That's sad.

Matt

From: TGbow
14-Sep-21
The ground work for the vaccines was already layed out. A lot of people understand that the people in the labs doing research are trying to do their best. The problem a lot of people have ,including myself, they dont trust Fauci or the CDC or FDA to be forthcoming with all the facts. It shouldn't be a surprise that a lot of folks dont trust the government. Most of all they dont want to be told they have to be vaccinated.. I lean to the opinion that most people are probably better off getting vaxed..but they should also have the choice if they choose to use another form of treatment. Then to add fuel to the fire there is misinformation on both sides of the coin

From: bigeasygator
14-Sep-21
Obviously, guys like Dave would rather believe sources like the Russian-controlled New Eastern Outlook, then our own resident experts who are also some of the most respected members we have on Bowsite. That's sad.

If I'm keeping track, the "proof" that Dave provided that we are wrong and ignorant is:

- a quote from Dr. Malone that he walked back and admitted was wrong

- a list of the steps required to obtain vaccine approval, all of which were followed by Pfizer/BioNTech

- opinion pieces published by Russian media outlets

Sad indeed.

From: TGbow
14-Sep-21
Whats sad is the sheep we have in this nation

From: Treeline
14-Sep-21
With any safe, effective alternative treatments available there is no longer a need for the EUA.

Nor is there a need for EUA of injections if the disease is not as deadly as they claim it to be… 94% of “Covid deaths” died with it versus the 6% that died from it.

Not to mention the PCR test being run twice as many iterations as the standard test procedure and on a mixed sample baseline that doesn’t even include an isolated SARS2 (COVID-19) virus…

Suppression and censorship of information to slant the narrative and push the FEAR. Power… and Money.

From: bigeasygator
14-Sep-21
Nor is there a need for EUA of injections if the disease is not as deadly as they claim it to be… 94% of “Covid deaths” died with it versus the 6% that died from it.

This statement falls somewhere on the spectrum between: "gross misrepresentation" to "patently false."

From: Dave
14-Sep-21
BEG, GG, and Dana, as well as possibly Mike in CT as I haven't read his post, are all living proof that you "Can't fix stupid." People like you are so gullible and naive that you refuse to explore facts and information on your own but rather believe dishonest narratives pushed by corrupt agencies. As I stated earlier, guys like you can't be helped or reasoned with because you're too ignorant to accept reality. Funny thing is you all "dispute" my evidence while at the same time, come on here WITHOUT A SHRED OF EVIDENCE OF YOUR OWN EXCEPT THE SMOKE YOU BLOW OUT OF YOUR ASS and call it gospel.

For those truly keeping track:

a quote from Dr. Malone that he walked back and admitted was wrong NO HE DIDN'T

- a list of the steps required to obtain vaccine approval, all of which were followed by Pfizer/BioNTech NO THEY WEREN'T

- opinion pieces published by Russian media outlets AND, NO IT ISN'T.

SO CRAWL BACK IN YOUR HOLE AND BRING SOME LEGITIMATE FACTS AND INFORMATION BECAUSE YOU'RE CLEARLY AN IDIOT.

And for those of you with an open mind and an ability to research truth and credibility, do a simple search regarding this clown's assertions above and you'll see they're demonstrably false. After that, you can surmise as to the credibility of the rest of his ludicrous claims.

From: bigeasygator
14-Sep-21
a quote from Dr. Malone that he walked back and admitted was wrong NO HE DIDN'T

LOL!!! Yes, he did. He literally said the following when pressed on his statements regarding Cominarty being some separate vaccine and somehow playing a trick on the public.

“When one is doing rapid analysis on the fly, one does not always get everything right,” he told The Fact Checker. “On this particular legal liability issue I did not hunt down the details myself, and relied on comments from a third party lawyer which were not fully correct.” He said the statements we received from Pfizer and HHS “are consistent with my current understanding.

Here are the statements that Dr. Malone ADMITTED was correct.

From Pfizer: “The statement that the products are ‘legally distinct with certain differences’ refers to the differences in manufacturing information included in the respective regulatory submissions,” said Pfizer spokesperson Sharon J. Castillo in an email. “Specifically, while the products are manufactured using the same processes, they may have been manufactured at different sites or using raw materials from different approved suppliers. FDA closely reviews all manufacturing steps, and has found explicitly that the EUA and BLA [biologics license application] products are equivalent.”

“The liability protections afforded under the PREP Act are tied to the declared public health emergency and not whether the vaccine is sold under an EUA,” Castillo said. “Therefore, both Comirnaty and the Pfizer-BioNTech covid-19 vaccine receive the same liability protections as medical countermeasures against covid-19.”

From the HHS: “There are no liability or compensation differences between a countermeasure approved under an EUA or one that has received full FDA approval,” confirmed an HHS spokesperson."

Again, he was wrong. And he admitted it. Your links and "proof" have been debunked by the very source you are citing. Not sure why you're sticking to this story when "ya boy" Malone admitted it was BS.

a list of the steps required to obtain vaccine approval, all of which were followed by Pfizer/BioNTech NO THEY WEREN'T

Yes, they did. But I'll ask for the third time, what steps were not followed?

opinion pieces published by Russian media outlets AND, NO IT ISN'T.

The lesson here is to not cite unknown sources. I'll help you out with this one..."New Eastern Outlook, NEO, is an English-language website, managed by the Russian Academy of Science’s Institute for Oriental Studies." LOL!!

SO CRAWL BACK IN YOUR HOLE AND BRING SOME LEGITIMATE FACTS AND INFORMATION BECAUSE YOU'RE CLEARLY AN IDIOT.

See above.

From: Dave
14-Sep-21
You really need to stop getting your facts from corrupt Pharmaceutical companies and HHS. They lie every time they open their mouth. First, the liability and compensation differences for EUA and FDA have NOTHING to do with the structure, sequencing and make-up of the "vaccine." Nice play on words though in an attempt at confusing those who are following and questioning your credibility(as they should). Second, the FDA has conveniently removed the timelines from their online description of the phases of vaccine testing because it clearly showed that there was no way that the vaccines could be tested and receive FDA clearance within a year. Even Fraudci and countless other bureaucrats were saying this all along until they needed to change their narrative. Warpspeed did nothing to change this. The author of the article in the NEO is a Princeton educated writer( I guess he's a Russian plant) and there are countless facts supporting his claims that can be easily confirmed in the article itself. That is, if you're capable of reading comprehension which obviously you are not. For those with the ability to use a search engine other than Google, there are also other countless references to support the allegation. There's really only two explanations for people like you. Either you're completely ignorant or completely corrupt. Which one is it????

For now, I'm done here. I'm going hunting. You should try and do the same rather than continue to spread lies and misinformation. Luckily, the majority see you for what you are.

From: bigeasygator
14-Sep-21
You really need to stop getting your facts from corrupt Pharmaceutical companies and HHS. They lie every time they open their mouth. First, the liability and compensation differences for EUA and FDA have NOTHING to do with the structure, sequencing and make-up of the "vaccine."

I'm not just listening to pharmaceutical companies or HHS. The FDA has been pretty clear that, as it pertains to "structure, sequencing, and make-up" of the vaccines, these are equivalent products. Straight from the FDA: "Comirnaty has the same formulation as the EUA vaccine and is administered as a series of two doses, three weeks apart." So, again, you're wrong, however you want to slice it.

Suggesting these are two separate vaccines as you are doing and that they are also subject to different legal protections has been debunked on both accounts - they are the same medically speaking, and thanks to the PREP Act, they are subject to the same legal protections. Again, your hero Dr. Malone has admitted to this fact and that he was wrong.

Second, the FDA has conveniently removed the timelines from their online description of the phases of vaccine testing because it clearly showed that there was no way that the vaccines could be tested and receive FDA clearance within a year. Even Fraudci and countless other bureaucrats were saying this all along until they needed to change their narrative. Warpspeed did nothing to change this

Hard to remove something that never existed. There are rules of thumb regarding how long vaccine development takes, but there is nothing set in stone. The FDA may give some timeframes, but they have this to say on clinical trials, "As long as clinical trials are thoughtfully designed, reflect what developers know about a product, safeguard participants, and otherwise meet Federal standards, FDA allows wide latitude in clinical trial design."

Furthermore, Faucci and others were quoting what was typical, not what was capable of being done in a pandemic where there is significant federal help available. Clinical trial phases were combined, allowing for accelerated Phase I, II, and III trials. There was a multitude of case data to assess vaccine efficacy thanks to the pandemic. Lastly, manufacturing capacity was scaled up during the clinical trials because the financial risk was mitigated by federal funding thanks to Operation Warpspeed. These are undisputable FACTS, and it is indeed what allowed for an accelerated timeline of vaccine development and approval. No steps were skipped. Steps that were taken in series were taken in parallel. This is what was done, and this is what Operation Warprspeed helped enable. No steps were skipped, no corners were cut.

Again, you're flat out wrong and you show a fundamental lack of understanding around what the vaccine is, what the approval process is, and what Trump's Operation Warpspeed did to accelerate the timeline.

As far as people like me...I'm not ignorant or corrupt. I'm right.

From: DanaC
14-Sep-21
So Dave, government is corrupt, Big Pharma is corrupt, media is corrupt. So who is *not* corrupt in your mind?

From: Grey Ghost
14-Sep-21
Jason,

I'm often reminded of the words of a smart man when I read these threads. He said, "never argue with a fool; onlookers may not be able to tell the difference."

What's even more disturbing than how people, like Dave, cling to their misinformation is how few people are willing to call them out on it. I don't give a rat's ass what political jersey you wear. But, if you deliberately let misinformation slide just because it's coming from someone on your side of the isle, you are a complete worthless disgrace to me.

Matt

From: Thornton
14-Sep-21
To the guys trying to beat around the bush by blaming a covid death on underlying conditions or past medical history, you can stop now. Those certainly contributed, but I am now seeing bad cases with no underlying conditions or past medical history. Last year's covid was hard on geriatrics, colored ethnicities, and overweight with comorbidities. This year's variety infects with no rhyme or reason. A few weeks ago, I had 4 patients in a row between the ages of 19 and 36 with no PMH. All conspiracy theories and bullshit aside, I would implore all of you to wash your hands frequently and social distance at the very least. We are seeing so many covid patients in Kansas now, they just leave them in the ER waiting room, exposing everyone else. Administration claims once the patient checks in, the hospital is responsible for them and we can no longer send them back to their vehicles until a room is available. Negative pressure rooms were maxed out months ago, so covid patients are placed in regular rooms and even hall beds now. My ER manager in Wichita lost her brother to covid 2 days ago and he was an active guy in his 40's. He lived in Idaho. To you conspiracy guys that doubt me, I'm a Trump supporter, I own more guns than I can remember to count, and I think the virus was released by the Chinese to thin the herd due to their large geriatric population and hence the rescinding of their decades old, one child per family restriction.

From: KSflatlander
15-Sep-21
I don’t think that exchange went quite the way Dave played it out in his head lol.

15-Sep-21
Paying attention to India. Very different than the US for many reasons but they are reporting massive drops in Covid in some states.

From: jjs
15-Sep-21
12 mg of ivermectin has been working very well in the largest population in India , Gateway Pundit for information.

From: KSflatlander
15-Sep-21

KSflatlander's Link
Gateway Pundit for medical information? Any information for that matter lol. Why not look at and post a paper from a peer-reviewed medical journal?

From: Bowaddict
15-Sep-21
You guys on the hard left do realize that this drug won a Nobel prize for its use in humans right? It’s a piece of the puzzle that has some early signs of success, much like another well known drug used to battle this that was ridiculed by the left early on! It’s not all the vaccines or nothing, that has been the big problem IMHO from early on! And much of it due to politics and lining the pockets of bureaucrats!!

From: Bowaddict
15-Sep-21
If you have a hard time finding info like that, try using a search engine that doesn’t censor and manipulate such info. You’re big boys and girls, you can handle what you find, and obviously so smart you don’t have to worry about being fooled by opinion based articles. You’ll figure it out!! Try duck duck go and Ditch google!! They don’t censor or manipulate searches, could be scary for you though . All the opposing ideas and discussions you’ll find!

From: KSflatlander
15-Sep-21
I can’t speak for everyone but I hope that ivermectin is a viable treatment for COVID. We need all options to fight this virus. The CDC and FDA are currently conducting scientific studies/medical trials to determine if it works. I hope it does but until there is medical proof (and not just anecdotal statements) it’s not proven viable.

By the way, the Nobel prize was not for treatment of COVID.

I think Mike in CT said something about ivermectin preventing virus replication but you have to take it early in the infection. Earlier than you have symptoms. And that it might not be effective after symptoms and that’s the issue? Maybe Mike will jump in here.

From: spike78
15-Sep-21
I don’t think the government wants any elderly people to survive except for themselves. They gotta fix the Social Security system somehow and what better way to do it!

From: Thornton
15-Sep-21
I've had a hard time following this thread, but Dave has some valid points. I took Ivermectin after I got covid and I was well in a day and a half. My fellow colleagues made fun of me, then some of them took it with the same results after they were infected. Kerp in mind, we treat covid patients daily now. I was actually told about the ivermectin study by an ER physician I work with, and he indicated it looked promising. In ER, we use UpToDate for our medical references and they recently had a podcast detailing the positive outcomes from early administration of ivermectin. The Journal of Therapeutics also has an article showing an over 40% decrease in death from covid with early administration of ivermectin.

From: bigeasygator
16-Sep-21
I've had a hard time following this thread, but Dave has some valid points

Dave also thinks Cominarty and the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine are separate drugs, so…

From: spike78
16-Sep-21
Thornton has some proof Ivermectin works but the Libs on here will keep bashing it. Thornton is the Ivermectin for horses the same stuff just way higher dose?

From: Huntiam
16-Sep-21
Shew it’s deer season guys damn..some of y’all no more aboit Covid than Bowhunting maybe you should ready a different thread… it’s here to stay get over it under it around it whatever … bunch of girls arguing back and fourth the same problem our country has going on here…ever thread aboit Corona should be deleted .. this is bow Hunter and bow Hunter showcase or it used to be damn guys

From: LINK
16-Sep-21
Spike I think it’s the same active ingredient. Everything I’ve seen talks about the 1% injectable. That’s what my brother used and several guys in town think saved their lives after remdezevere did nothing. 3/4 cc per 100# in a glass of water. You won’t taste it. Can’t say the same for the horse paste on a cracker.

From: spike78
16-Sep-21
Link, stop talking that non sense about it saving lives. Everything I hear on the news says Ivermectin doesn’t work and should not be used :). In fact, what you don’t hear is what actually might work. Oh my bad they do push the vaccine my apologies.

From: RK
16-Sep-21
Link

My friends that used it did 1cc per hundred pounds, zinc, vit. D, Zpac , B12 and a steroid. Recovery was very fast. I only know about 9 people that did that but it worked for them. Probably need to expand the sample group :)

16-Sep-21
some people didn't trust the vaccine because it wasn't sufficiently tested and it wasn't fda approved. some of the same people dont seem to have much of an issue using a drug that hasn't been sufficiently tested or approved by the fda to treat covid.

am i getting that right?

From: chillkill
16-Sep-21
Of course ivomectin works, just look at india and the results they have been getting.. Also data around zinc and the death rates for people with low levels.. This whole covid pandemic has been hijacked by politicians world wide, all allegedly, democratic countries by the way.. If your vaccine is so good why is it losing its potency against covid, as well as more and more breakthrough cases world wide.. Look at Israel and whats happening..

From: spike78
16-Sep-21
I read a funny news article yesterday. It stated that the vaccinated in the hospitals with Covid were mostly a symptomatic or had a very mild case. Ummm why would they be in the hospital?

From: Thornton
17-Sep-21
Spike78- I have no idea. I used the livestock Ivermax on myself. I have yet to even see it in Pyxis in either ER that I work, I have yet to give it to a single patient.

From: TGbow
17-Sep-21
Jason, I appreciate people like you in the healthcare field. You seem to be after the facts where ever that may lead. Most of us just wish the CDC and Fauci would do the same. Thank you

From: Treeline
18-Sep-21

Treeline's Link
Interesting article that indicates it to be very effective in India.

If there is an effective treatment, the Emergency Use Authorization for the injections will no longer be valid.

There appears to be a number of safe, effective prophylactics and treatments including vitamins, ivermectin, HCQ, and monoclonal antibody treatments. All being suppressed by the MSM and social media. Hell, have heard that pharmacists have refused to fill doctor’s prescriptions for ivermectin and HCQ even when they have it.

The current administration has, in the last week, precluded distribution of monoclonal antibody drugs for treatment to Red States like Texas and Florida where they have been used for treatment of both vaxed and un-vaxed.

The injections are getting pushed for reasons that do not pertain to any individual’s or group’s health…

From: Grey Ghost
18-Sep-21
"If there is an effective treatment, the Emergency Use Authorization for the injections will no longer be valid."

Tavis, can you show your source for this information? Thanks.

Matt

From: Treeline
18-Sep-21

Treeline's Link
BEG,

From your above statement:

“This statement falls somewhere on the spectrum between: "gross misrepresentation" to "patently false."”

The CDC provided the data. From their own report:

“For 6% of the deaths, COVID-19 was the only cause mentioned. For deaths with conditions or causes in addition to COVID-19, on average, there were 2.9 additional conditions or causes per death. The number of deaths with each condition or cause is shown for all deaths and by age groups. Values in the table represent number of deaths that mention the condition listed and 94% of deaths mention more than one condition.”

Is this source of data on Covid wrong?

From: Dave
18-Sep-21
OMG!!! Now that I'm back and can devote some time to exposing the idiot also known as BEG, allow me to provide the facts. First off, why don't you tell us your qualifications so we can determine the angle you're coming from. Are you merely an ignorant Kool-aid drinker incapable of researching the truth and simply regurgitating the lies and false narrative that the left is spinning or are you part of the corruption by being connected to one of the pharmaceutical companies or hospital organizations that are willfully and negligently killing people for money?? I suspect I know but I want to hear it from you.

Now, on to dispelling your idiocy. Unfortunately, the possibilities are vast and I'm not sure where to begin. I think I'll start with the vaccine fraud.

Let's assume you are correct in that the FDA did indeed approve Cominarty and that it is one and the same as the EUA(and that remains to be proven), your lies about timelines never existing is a complete and utter lie and just proves your ignorance regarding medicine and pharmaceuticals. While there may not be an "exact" timeline in the sense of months, years days etc for when a trail phase is complete, there are parameters which were not followed even closely with regards to the current vaccine testing. https://www.historyofvaccines.org/content/articles/vaccine-development-testing-and-regulation

Anyone with half a brain could read this and look at the phases of vaccine approval and research and see there's no possible way these parameters and phases were followed.

https://www.health.ny.gov/prevention/immunization/vaccine_safety/science.htm

Additionally, please explain to us why the placebo arm of the trial was discontinued early on when there was no rational reason for doing so other than to fast-track the approval and make the vaccine appear to be effective when it isn't. For those interested in the truth, pay particular attention as well to Phase 3 testing which is geared toward proving that the vaccine PREVENTS infection with the pathogen(which this one DOESN'T) and whether it is safe(which this one IS NOT). Even the vastly underreported VAERS data showed well over 400,000 serious adverse events including over 7000 deaths after taking this vaccine. This is more than there were for all 70 other vaccines for 30 yrs combined and yet this vaccine gets magical fast-track approval???? These are only the adverse events REPORTED. There are far more that have not been reported. We also know that the vaccine DOES NOT prevent infection. In fact, this vaccine is the sole reason for the continued development and spread of variants through Antibody Dependent Enhancement. Not only is it leading to the development of mutations and variants, but those "vaccinated" but not truly protected from the virus are actually the primary spreaders. This was confirmed a few wks ago in a study out of Oxford which showed that VACCINATED health care workers carried 251 times the viral load as unvaccinated workers in nasal swabs. It is also a lie that the vaccinated are not ending up in hospitals and/or dying. This is the corrupt CDC and hospitals manipulating numbers again by claiming that someone who was recently vaccinated for COVID and ended up dying, died of COVID itself rather than the vaccine. What is most disturbing about this whole thing is that people are being denied effective, cheap, and life-saving therapeutics in order to perpetuate fear and the pandemic to make money. Ivermectin, HCQ and other therapeutics have been PROVEN effective at treating COVID and yet they are being denied by corrupt hospitals and the FDA for none other than corrupt and sinister reasons.

https://rumble.com/vlqdpo-dr-peter-mccullough-lecture-on-the-state-of-covid-treatment..html

Dana, the answer to your question is simple--the thousands of physicians who recognize the fraud and are trying diligently to inform the people and treat them appropriately despite the censorship and narrative being perpetuated by clowns such as BEG and GG.

I'll let you in on a secret of the medical industry. The FDA, CDC, and NIH have always been corrupt and those physicians with any firsthand experience with them have known this for years. They are not looking out for the best interests of mankind. They are a political organization with only one objective--MONEY.

18-Sep-21
The prescription I finally was able to get filled for ivermectin at a local pharmacy was for 3mg tablets. Without insurance it was $141/25 tablets. With insurance it was $10. My recommended dose was 5 tablets per day.

From: Treeline
18-Sep-21
It is a lot cheaper at the feed store and is the same stuff, Eagle_eye_Andy. Easiest is the injectable and just mix the right dosage in water. The horse apple flavored paste works too, but tastes bitter.

From: Treeline
18-Sep-21

Treeline's Link
GG:

From the FDA "Emergency Use Authorization for Vaccines Explained"

"Under an EUA, FDA may allow the use of unapproved medical products, or unapproved uses of approved medical products in an emergency to diagnose, treat, or prevent serious or life-threatening diseases or conditions when certain statutory criteria have been met, including that there are no adequate, approved, and available alternatives."

That last part is important about no adequate, approved and available alternatives.

It appears that there are a number of adequate and available alternatives. The FDA has not approved them. Think it might be about money?

Many doctor's accounts and medical papers stating that there are alternative safe and effective preventative and treatment measures.

The mRNA injections have, thus far, proven to be ineffective in preventing people from catching, transmitting, being hospitalized, or dying of Covid. There have been more deaths reported from these injections than for all other vaccines since 1990. Over 675,600 adverse effects reported in the US to the VAERS system run by the CDC. And, based on a Harvard study, "Electronic Support for Public Health-Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System", less than 0.3% of all adverse drug events and 1-13% of serious events are reported to VAERS.

From: Treeline
18-Sep-21

Treeline's embedded Photo
Treeline's embedded Photo

From: bigeasygator
18-Sep-21
Is this source of data on Covid wrong?

No, the data is correct. Concluding from the data that people died “with” COVID and not “from” COVID is what is somewhere between grossly misrepresented to flat out false. The reality is had these people not caught COVID, they wouldn’t have died when they did. That is why COVID is listed as what killed them.

From: bigeasygator
18-Sep-21
Let's assume you are correct in that the FDA did indeed approve Cominarty and that it is one and the same as the EUA(and that remains to be proven), your lies about timelines never existing is a complete and utter lie and just proves your ignorance regarding medicine and pharmaceuticals.

There is no need to assume anything. I am correct.

While there may not be an "exact" timeline in the sense of months, years days etc for when a trail phase is complete, there are parameters which were not followed even closely with regards to the current vaccine testing…Anyone with half a brain could read this and look at the phases of vaccine approval and research and see there's no possible way these parameters and phases were followed.

I’ve asked you five times now to tell what parameters have not been followed. All of the clinical trial information associated with Comirnaty approval is publicly available, as is information on the broader approval timeline. You keep saying steps weren’t followed but have failed five times now to enumerate a single requirement that were skipped or single instance in which a corner was cut.

The parameters were followed. The information is out there. Case closed.

Ivermectin, HCQ and other therapeutics have been PROVEN effective at treating COVID and yet they are being denied by corrupt hospitals and the FDA for none other than corrupt and sinister reasons.

This statement here might just take the cake for the funniest of all your points. Outside of poorly designed studies and anecdotal information, there is no proof regarding ivermectin, HCQ, etc being effective in treating COVID. Clinical trials are underway for ivermectin, but are not complete. So, unlike say Comirnaty which has been tested for effectiveness for COVID and approved as such by the FDA, any “proof” of ivermectin’s effectiveness has not been validated by robust clinical trials and is akin to old wives’ tales at this stage.

Like Matt said earlier, I should be careful when engaging with idiots as outsiders may struggle to tell the difference. You’ve had ample time to provide proof to back up your wildly incorrect assertions. You haven’t. Engaging with you further is not worth the time.

18-Sep-21
What has happened is when the governments signed an aggreement with big pharma for the covid vaccine big pharma said if u find a cheap cure for covid u can not use it which makes scents why there muzzled on it ,this was on day star tv interviewing 2000 strong front line doctors and scientists. When people test positive for covid the send them home tell them come back when your really sick by the time they go back to the hospital they have phnemonia and it’s to late for ventilater for most. Follow the money trail evil at its best.

18-Sep-21
Alexis ^^^ Exactly right. The “confidential” contracts that have been leaked prove this.

From: TGbow
18-Sep-21
we can trust big government though, especially Democrats...right

18-Sep-21
Alexis ^^^ Exactly right. The “confidential” contracts that have been leaked prove this.

From: Dave
19-Sep-21
I'm done pointing out your idiocy BEG. As is typical for most libtard morons, you come on here and make claims without a shred of credible evidence to support your claims. You sidestep the questions because you know you can't answer them and claim you're "right" when all the evidence proves otherwise. As I said earlier, you are living proof that you can't fix "stupid." Your ignorance leaves no bounds. Thankfully, the smart people in the country see you guys for the idiots that you are. You should take the shot. The world needs less people like you.

https://www.thegatewaypundit.com/2021/09/fda-hearing-doctors-experts-testify-government-data-demonstrates-covid-shots-dangerous-may-kill-save-video/

19-Sep-21
"What has happened is when the governments signed an aggreement with big pharma for the covid vaccine big pharma said if u find a cheap cure for covid u can not use it which makes scents..."

...and the "scents" that it makes is that of pure horse manure.

From: Treeline
19-Sep-21

Treeline's Link
Project Veritas is doing a big one:

Covidvaxexposed.com

Could be interesting….

From: DanaC
19-Sep-21
Project Veritas? Now there's an example of objective reporting. (Irony.) And a fine history of doctored videos and other BS misinformation.

Honestly, you'd be better off just putting another bumper sticker on your Subaru. ;-)

From: bigeasygator
19-Sep-21
As is typical for most libtard morons, you come on here and make claims without a shred of credible evidence to support your claims

That’s rich. I’ve asked you multiple times to layout what parameters were not followed. You haven’t. I told you all of the Pfizer approval information is out there publicly available for BNT162b2, the vaccine now known as Comirnaty, but not surprisingly you won’t speak to it.

IND Application

https://cdn.pfizer.com/pfizercom/2020-11/C4591001_Clinical_Protocol_Nov2020.pdf

Phase I preliminary results upon which EUA was granted. Further clinical trial details available as well at the link.

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-share-positive-early-data-lead-mrna

Phase II/III results which were the basis of full FDA approval.

https://www.pfizer.com/news/press-release/press-release-detail/pfizer-and-biontech-confirm-high-efficacy-and-no-serious

Summary basis for regulatory action upon which FDA full approval was granted, which includes summary of the above clinical trial phases.

https://www.fda.gov/media/151733/download

All steps complete, all required parameters met. You are confusing vaccine approval during normal time periods with what can happen during a pandemic whereby there are significant more cases available to test the safety and efficacy of these vaccines. This leads to a much faster assessment process as loads more data is available on a much faster timeline.

I should apologize for pushing you on providing proof that these steps weren’t followed. That is impossible to do because that proof doesn’t exist. I thought maybe you’d take the chance, like your buddy Dr. Malone, to admit you’re wrong. I see I gave you too much credit.

From: Dave
20-Sep-21
Rich indeed. Clearly, reading comprehension is not one of your strong points. If you had half a brain and didn't work for Pfizer and weren't corrupt, you'd acknowledge that these phases of testing could not and WOULD not have ever passed and been approved knowing the amount of DOCUMENTED adverse reactions. Seriously??? Your idea of "proof" is the documents published by corrupt Pfizer??? That paper is GARBAGE and not worth the tree that was killed to print it. There are SO MANY LIES in that paper that it would take me hours to point them out. Do tell us how no other vaccine has ever been approved in less than 4 yrs and yet somehow this one is approved in less than 1. There is NO WAY that the parameters meeting testing can be adequately completed in less than a yr. How do you possibly evaluate for birth defects, effects on pregnancy, long-term effects not readily identifiable in less than a yr of testing? Simple. YOU CAN'T!!!

For those interested in the truth:

Proof of PCR Fraud:

https://public.clouthub.com/video/4e4e924b-ff58-4848-981d-bb1867978f6f

Proof of the vaccine side effects:

https://public.clouthub.com/video/88915ca8-23dc-4044-81ae-64e62858cbad

Ivermectin Truth:

https://public.clouthub.com/video/b934a34a-54be-408a-95c9-8dc22d6ba57b

For those keeping track, I've produced at least 10 links to truthful, factual, and VERIFIABLE information proving what a lying imbecile BEG is. Meanwhile, he has yet to provide a single one, other than quotes taken out of context or likely made-up, documents from a corrupt pharmaceutical company, and the smoke that blows out of his ass.

From: Dave
20-Sep-21
Why Cominarty and BionTech are likely not one and the same:

https://silview.media/2021/08/25/clarifications-on-the-pfizer-fda-approval/

From: bigeasygator
20-Sep-21
If you had half a brain and didn't work for Pfizer and weren't corrupt, you'd acknowledge that these phases of testing could not and WOULD not have ever passed and been approved knowing the amount of DOCUMENTED adverse reactions. Seriously??? Your idea of "proof" is the documents published by corrupt Pfizer??? That paper is GARBAGE and not worth the tree that was killed to print it.

My proof is the clinical trials conducted on tens of thousands of people, followed by the literal billions of people now being monitored as part of the vaccine rollout. It's all there in the documents. Your argument seems to be "Pfizer is lying" or "Pfizer is making up data," which again you've provided no proof to back-up (beyond unconfirmed, unsubstantiated wives' tales from questionable sources).

Do tell us how no other vaccine has ever been approved in less than 4 yrs and yet somehow this one is approved in less than 1. There is NO WAY that the parameters meeting testing can be adequately completed in less than a yr. How do you possibly evaluate for birth defects, effects on pregnancy, long-term effects not readily identifiable in less than a yr of testing? Simple. YOU CAN'T!!!

I told you, but you're too dense to comprehend. You can throw typical timelines out of the window for COVID vaccine development. Development typically takes so long because you need to ensure you have a robust data set to evaluate the efficacy and safety of a vaccine. When you are in the midst of a global pandemic with literally 100s of millions of cases occurring a year, it's A LOT easier to generate the appropriate dataset to do so. This can't be done outside of the context of a global pandemic and it's one of the main reasons they can evaluate the safety and effectiveness of the vaccine so rapidly

As for testing for long term effects, it isn't necessary for a vaccine that leaves your system in 72 hours. What remains is the antibodies, not the vaccine. Long term effects result from long term drug usage. Use smoking as an example - the risk of lung disease, etc comes from smoking cigarettes day-in, day-out for a long period of time. If you smoke a cigarette and then smoke a second cigarette a month later, you don't have to worry about contracting lung disease 50 years from now.

Worrying about long term side effects from a vaccine taken a few times over the span of months shows a fundamental lack of understanding of how medicine and our bodies work.

Why Cominarty and BionTech are likely not one and the same

Again, BioNTech is a company, not a drug. Beyond that, that link shows a fundamental misunderstanding of the vaccines being developed as well as how the clinical trials have progressed (which, again, is all contained within the links I posted). Multiple versions of the BNT162 mRNA vaccine were developed. BNT162b1 encodes a trimerized, secreted version of the SARS-CoV-2 spike glycoprotein, whereas BNT162b2, encodes a prefusion stabilized, full-length SARS-CoV-2 spike protein. The version carried into Phase III trials was BNT162b2, which involved ~44,000 participants. This is what is now known as Comirnaty. The link you posted on this is an absolute joke. There is no secret there were multiple versions of BNT162; no, clinical trial data was not cherry-picked; and the appropriate regulatory requirements and thresholds were met for full approval of BNT162b2 (aka, Comirnaty).

For those keeping track, I've produced at least 10 links to truthful, factual, and VERIFIABLE information proving what a lying imbecile BEG is

Well, when those links include vaccine development steps that were met, clearly false statements from so called experts who later admit they were wrong, and flawed and biased arguments coming from joke sources like "Silview Media" and random posters on "Clouthub" it doesn't really help your case. It's definitely verifiable information - verifiably false.

From: Kannuck
20-Sep-21
Dave,

I would love to hear your credentials.

Aside from "Flat-Earther"

From: bigeasygator
20-Sep-21
Dave, I would love to hear your credentials.

Aside from "Flat-Earther"

Seeing some of the sources he cites and links he posts, this makes a lot of sense.

From: Grasshopper
20-Sep-21

Grasshopper's embedded Photo
Grasshopper's embedded Photo
I was going through things the other day due to an upcoming move and came across these gems.

Taking offers, will consider trades for moose or brown bear hunt. I know what I've got, low balls will be ignored. Beef or liver flavor.

  • Sitka Gear