HuntStand Hunting App
AZ bonus point changes
Elk
Contributors to this thread:
creed 25-Sep-21
BOHNTR 25-Sep-21
creed 25-Sep-21
Tilzbow 25-Sep-21
sticksender 25-Sep-21
Knothead 25-Sep-21
Beendare 25-Sep-21
Scott/IL 25-Sep-21
Scoot 25-Sep-21
BTM 25-Sep-21
Trial153 25-Sep-21
Z Barebow 25-Sep-21
Tilzbow 25-Sep-21
midwest 26-Sep-21
JL 26-Sep-21
Don K 26-Sep-21
Zim 26-Sep-21
creed 26-Sep-21
kentuckbowhnter 26-Sep-21
Bill in MI 26-Sep-21
huntingdad 26-Sep-21
pav 26-Sep-21
TEmbry 27-Sep-21
MQQSE 27-Sep-21
Tejas 27-Sep-21
txhunter58 10-Oct-21
SDHNTR(home) 10-Oct-21
Scoot 10-Oct-21
SDHNTR(home) 10-Oct-21
SteveB 11-Oct-21
Tilzbow 11-Oct-21
Whip 11-Oct-21
SDHNTR(home) 11-Oct-21
Tilzbow 11-Oct-21
DonVathome 12-Oct-21
creed 12-Oct-21
BOWUNTR 12-Oct-21
Whip 12-Oct-21
Whip 12-Oct-21
Whip 12-Oct-21
WapitiBob 12-Oct-21
WapitiBob 12-Oct-21
Willieboat 12-Oct-21
pav 13-Oct-21
WapitiBob 15-Oct-21
SDHNTR(home) 16-Oct-21
SDHNTR(home) 16-Oct-21
BOHNTR 17-Oct-21
creed 17-Oct-21
SDHNTR(home) 17-Oct-21
WapitiBob 17-Oct-21
Huntcell 17-Oct-21
SDHNTR(home) 18-Oct-21
BOWUNTR 18-Oct-21
Tilzbow 18-Oct-21
JDECK 18-Oct-21
SDHNTR(home) 18-Oct-21
From: creed
25-Sep-21

creed's Link
some of you might find this interesting

From: BOHNTR
25-Sep-21
Doesn’t really affect those who already have the HE BP…….basically makes it easier for NR’s to get a permanent point?

From: creed
25-Sep-21
That’s how I read it. Pay your money, take the course and unless I missed something it’s all online.

From: Tilzbow
25-Sep-21
Yep, all online vs the current course which requires in person attendance for part of it. I’ll pay it simply because so many others will do the same and not doing so will put you even further back.

Good revenue generator for AZ.

Once I burn my deer and elk points in AZ I’m bailing out of my annual donations….

From: sticksender
25-Sep-21
After reading that, it sounds like they're looking at this as another revenue stream. The HE bonus point is unique to AZ and 100% of their own creation, originally intended merely to incentivize more people to take in-person HE. Justifying this change by citing point cost in other states is a non-sequitur. Now the program morphs into a revenue booster, parading as HE.

Next step....maybe just outright sell extra points per "genus". Perhaps 500.00 each for ressies and 1000.00 each for NR's? It's an absolute certainty they'd sell thousands of them. Note: the previous statement is sarcasm!

From: Knothead
25-Sep-21
You have to admit they are creative at finding ways to raise money. Arizona must lead all other states in that regard. At the same time they never, in no way improve the quality of habitat or improve big game numbers. Although we are unable to hunt them, G&F is doing a fine job increasing the Mexican Gray wolf population.

From: Beendare
25-Sep-21
Wow, $300 for a non res.

I took it the first year offered…I think it was $25

From: Scott/IL
25-Sep-21
Looks like my wife just lost out on a mini vacation to Arizona so I could attend a class.

$300 is steep, but so are the draw odds for non-resident elk in Arizona.

From: Scoot
25-Sep-21
$300 is steep, but how's that compare to airfare, vehicle rental, hotel, restaurants, etc?

From: BTM
25-Sep-21
"Once I burn my deer and elk points in AZ I’m bailing out of my annual donations…." Amen to that, Tilzbow! I'm done getting the non-res screwing by so many states.

From: Trial153
25-Sep-21
Every year states give me more and more reasons to go hunt Canada

From: Z Barebow
25-Sep-21

Z Barebow's embedded Photo
Z Barebow's embedded Photo
Scoot-Online is definitely cheaper.

From: Tilzbow
25-Sep-21
BTM,

As a NV resident, I don’t see Western draws as screwing non-residents. The trophy quality is great in AZ, NV, UT and New Mexico but the opportunity is limited and odds are steep, even as a resident. As a NV resident, I’m in double digit points for nearly every species and over 20 points for sheep and goats. I’ve drawn plenty of deer and antelope tags, one sheep tag and one elk and I’ve been applying here for 44 years. I know I’ll draw a few more resident elk tags another sheep tag all and the annual costs to aren’t too bad. BUT I don’t draw many tags and average 3 years between hunts - AS A RESIDENT. I’m not bitching, just informing that as aeven a resident of a trophy western state it ain’t easy to draw.

Long story short, I’m done with AZ and UT after I finally draw because trophies don’t mea as much anymore and more importantly my money can be better spent on fine whiskey!!!

From: midwest
26-Sep-21
The HE point is now a virtually worthless advantage because anyone who is even remotely interested in hunting AZ will just buy it vs. having to actually travel to AZ to take the course.

Well played AZGFD, well played.

From: JL
26-Sep-21
"Every year states give me more and more reasons to go hunt Canada"

If you're time limited....ie...older.....that would be a true sentiment.

From: Don K
26-Sep-21
Another devalued point system.............

From: Zim
26-Sep-21
No surprise at all. Saw this coming long ago. At least I had a great winter break there and got to use my point for ten years. Actually assured me of drawing three Kaibab deer tags during that time. Plus I didn’t pay the new high fee. Who’s next to devalue NR points? I’m still bankin on Nevada squared house of cards, but not counting out WY & CO.

With the cognitively impaired Biden’s clown show distracting every taxpayer in America, now is the perfect time for these three contestants to slide through their point devaluation schemes unnoticed.

From: creed
26-Sep-21
There's likely going to be a window before the numbers getting the point will flood the system and make bonus points worthless. I would guess this year and maybe two more? With the growth explosion in AZ there are already more applicants and it doesn't show any signs of slowing down.

26-Sep-21
for 300 bucks i will just try to live another year, if i dont it wont matter.

From: Bill in MI
26-Sep-21
Way to dilute the pool and the value of the in person investment…thx AZ

From: huntingdad
26-Sep-21
I like the fee structure.( insert sarcastic grin). As a hunter ed instructor, we had to jump through hoops and document expenses just to charge $5 per person. It's all about the $$$$

From: pav
26-Sep-21
Crap, my AZ draw odds just got worse....again!

From: TEmbry
27-Sep-21
Those in Arizona, was there actually a problem with the stated intent of this change ( full classes being taken up by those seeking points vs those actually needing/benefiting from a Hunter education course?)

I’ll take the class, $300 is cheaper than burning 25k airline miles from Alaska, hotel, car rental, etc. That said we plan to visit in January anyway so if a live class is open that week I may sign up anyway.

From: MQQSE
27-Sep-21
Crazy. I’m supposed to fly out doe the class in a week. May have to cancel that trip.

From: Tejas
27-Sep-21
Anyone know when this course will be available?

From: txhunter58
10-Oct-21
Good thread

From: SDHNTR(home)
10-Oct-21
Another money grab, but I’ll probably fall for it.

At least it’s not a bad as AZGFD whoring out to SM influencers to pimp OTC tag sales! That’s happening and it makes me want to puke.

From: Scoot
10-Oct-21
When will this money grab become available?

From: SDHNTR(home)
10-Oct-21
When does this go into effect? I don’t see anything on the AZGFD website about it? Just the normal HE course that requires an in person field day.

From: SteveB
11-Oct-21
If done this fall does it get a point toward next year?

From: Tilzbow
11-Oct-21
Steve B,

Short answer is yes, based on what I remember. I do know the detail is covered in the information accessible via the link in the first post. If I remembered exactly what it was I’d post it but I don’t.

From: Whip
11-Oct-21
Yep. My chances of ever drawing the tag over been chasing just got worse. Invested the times and money to go to AZ, play their game and take the stupid course was a complete waste of time. A whole pool of people will be jumping up a year to join me in competing for the tag over been waiting so long for. At age 66 I don't have much longer to keep playing their stupid con games. This is bull shit.

From: SDHNTR(home)
11-Oct-21
The link says nothing official, its just from another hunting website. And for the life of me I cant find anything on the matter on the AZGFD website. Nothing on the when and how... Guess it's still too early yet.

From: Tilzbow
11-Oct-21
^^^ Yep, I think Nate’s correct that this is not yet official ^^^

After 30 years in corporate America (pretty similar to gov’t) this appears to be a copy of an internal AZ Dept of Wildlife presentation proposing this addition that someone on another forum got passed to them by a AZ employee.

From: DonVathome
12-Oct-21
I will take it for sure. $$$$ is what all states are turning too, WY led the way. It sad but I am over stressing about it. I was lucky to start the game 21 years ago - and I have drawn a lot of good tags, and have a lot more in my near future.

From: creed
12-Oct-21

creed's Link
Here's a link to Sept 24th G&F commission meeting where it was addressed. It passed unanimously. You can pick it up around the 3:40 mark. There is about a 10 minute discussion.

From: BOWUNTR
12-Oct-21
Two accomplishments here... 1) point creep 2) more money/less work for F&G. Next... Ed F

From: Whip
12-Oct-21
I get that states are looking to increase ways of raising money. And I get that this will free up classrooms for kids and new hunters that really need asked benefit from Hunter Ed. That's fine. What bugs me is it punishes those of us who went through the expense and trouble to play by the old rules asked gained our point that way.

This will not really increase your chance of drawing the tag you're chasing. Most everyone in your point pool is going to move up right along with you. You will only be leaving behind those in your pool that already had their point but moving into a new pool with those that already had their point and are still there. It's effectively a wash for those that take the new course. You will be competing with the about same number of people. Point creep takes another jump and the only ones that are really affected are those that already had their HE point.

It would suck, but I'd pay the $300 too keep my place in line.

From: Whip
12-Oct-21
I'd be curious to know what percentage of NR applicants already have a HE point.

From: Whip
12-Oct-21
I'd be curious to know what percentage of NR applicants already have a HE point.

From: WapitiBob
12-Oct-21

From: WapitiBob
12-Oct-21

WapitiBob's embedded Photo
WapitiBob's embedded Photo

From: Willieboat
12-Oct-21
Glad I got my Hunter Ed point 26 years ago was well worth the trip to Arizona.

From: pav
13-Oct-21
Earned my hunter ed point in 2015 during the P&Y Convention...along with a bus full of other P&Y members. It was a good day!

From: WapitiBob
15-Oct-21

WapitiBob's Link
Ethical hunter info

https://www.hunter-ed.com/ethically-hunting-arizona/faq/

From: SDHNTR(home)
16-Oct-21
Disregard

From: SDHNTR(home)
16-Oct-21
So I completed the course. But now what? There's no instructions. Do I need to send my certificate to the AZGFD, or upload to my portal, or does the AZGFD automatically get notice of my completion.

From: BOHNTR
17-Oct-21
Did you pay?

From: creed
17-Oct-21
I got a reply email from AZGFD Hunting and Shooting Sports Program Director stating this program has not gone live so as of right now nothing can be done until it does.

From: SDHNTR(home)
17-Oct-21
Yes I paid. Or at least I put in my credit card on the Kalcomey site and everything seemed to go through. I don’t think I would have been able to progress through the course, take the exam, and get the certificate without paying. Yet where do I stand now? How does this get linked to AZGFD? I can’t be the only guinea pig here!

From: WapitiBob
17-Oct-21
Maybe they spent some time on the Internet and decided to round file your test.

From: Huntcell
17-Oct-21
Perhaps Az next money maker could be a fee for point transfer upon death.

Crazy you say….Wisconsin currently allows the deceased points to be transferred at no cost , which is a missed revenue opportunity on their part.

:::::: A surviving spouse, personal representative, guardian or trustee (designee) may authorize a transfer of awarded permits, harvest authorizations or accumulated preference points/preference category from a deceased individual to a minor.:::::

::::: Note: There is no limit to the number of times a minor may receive a transfer of permits or preference points under this authority. Applicants are limited to one permit (awarded or transferred) per year.:::::

From: SDHNTR(home)
18-Oct-21
Well I called the AZGFD today. The nice lady that answered the phone knew of the class, but had no idea as to the procedure upon completion. She transferred me to the phone line that addresses hunter ed questions. Of course this was just a recording with a message on various HE related topics. No way to speak to a real person, and no info on the new "Ethically Hunting in AZ" course. I left a message but we all know what happens when you leave any government entity a message... So yes, apparently I am the guinea pig here, a $300 one. My advice is to not be over eager like me and instead let them work out the kinks before taking this class.

From: BOWUNTR
18-Oct-21
It's encouraging to know that they outsourced it to Kalcomey... a private company that has their shit together. I would wager that the problem is within the bureaucracy of the AZGF. BTW did they have any questions about the use of radios/electronic communication or spotlights during the ethics portion of the exam? Ed F

From: Tilzbow
18-Oct-21
Kalkomey manages NV’s draw and in my opinion has done an excellent job with the interface. It’d be really cool if AZ transitions their draw to Kalkomey, because I think AZ’s draw system is the worst in the west.

From: JDECK
18-Oct-21
The bonus point will be applied to your AZGFD customer portal account within two weeks of completing the course.

This is stated when you sign up for the course. It also says AZGFD will be notified when you pass the course.

From: SDHNTR(home)
18-Oct-21
Ed, not that I recall.

JDeck, if that's the case, I missed it. That language should be repeated at the conclusion of the test. Or in the email they send you upon completion. Or on the Hunter Ed part of the AZGFD webpage that mentions the course.

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