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Looked at all of the new bows this year, and I guess speed is what everyone wants? Bowtech is the only one with a flagship bow with a 7" brace height, so I ordered a Solution SS. Given my shots are seldom over 15 yards because of timber/brush, a slightly slower bow is fine by me. a 7" brace height has always proved to be what I shoot best, admittedly I am not a gifted archer.

Just curious if most of you are happier with the lower brace heights and faster speeds or think the bow companies are missing out not offering a more forgiving bow along with the speed demons.

BTW, the two Defiants are different in ata but have the same brace height. I shoot them equally well out to 35 yards, which I have not shot game that far in more than a decade. For me at least, it is not length but brace height.

Thanks.

Matt

Speaking of the Hoyt Defiant, I had one of the original Fast Flight Defiants back in the mid-90s. I loved that bow. I foolishly sold it when solo-cams became all the rage.

LOL, I wish I never gave my Q2XL to my BiL. One of the best shooting bows I ever owned, I thought it would help him embrace the sport. Instead, he tried it twice and bought a crossbow. Never liked the guy;-)

Blood, the only test to me that matters is what happens when I shoot. Maybe it is just being overly convinced it matters, but the 7" brace height makes a difference to me. Like others, I just don't have perfect form, not even close probably.

Speed isn't as sought after as much today as it was in 2014 when the Throttle was introduced. Everyone went to easier cams that give smooth draw cycles and higher let-off.

Speed might be making a comeback though.

As far as brace height 7in plus or shorter? Honestly I feel it is more ata for me. 33in on up is more forgiving no matter what brace height is. Once I go 32 and shorter I find them harder, but I'm a 29.5in draw. Short ata bows at that draw length have sharp string angles and that for me is harder to be accurate with. I move to a larger peep to see and my accuracy is reduced. That said my target bow is a PSE Shootdown and on most days I can beat my score with it vs the Full Throttle. But it is a much easier bow to shoot. Easier cams, longer brace height, way longet ata and target stabilizers. On a good day my scores are really close. And on a 3D coarse where a targets are unknown distance where I'm guessing, the Throttle is the bow. It fast enough to be forgiving when my range estimate could be off. It shoots very flat and my pin gap is very small.

I'm using PSE bows for reference, but same would be true with any for me. I used to be concerned about brace height and optioned for longer, but today not so much. I want speed with a comfortable draw cycle and a civil string angle at full draw.

That is good info. I wish I could try shorter brace height and see if it works for me with the newest limbs and such, but honestly a few shots at the shop is not going to convince me. I want to have one for a month or so, and even try it hunting.

Pro shops might think about "renting" bows for such "research".

I'm not a gifted archer with a 30" draw, either, but 6" vs. 7" brace doesn't seem to make any difference in my accuracy on the newer bows and I'll gladly take the extra speed.

Put a slippery cotton glove on your bow hand and see how much if any it slips while you draw. Any amount that you slippery bow hand moves while drawing is torque that would be induced with your bare hand.

I see Hoyt just released their lineup. That RX7 Ultra looks nice.

Has anyone tried the Mathews TRX line of bows? How'd they shoot?

Matt

Like Midwest and some others have said, it makes almost zero effect on your shootability on the new bows. Go google it. Many tests have been performed. I guess it comes down to if you would rather launch a nice heavy arrow faster with a shorter brace height over a slower heavy arrow with a longer brace height. Always tune your bow the best you can as well. Good luck and shoot straight. Always.

I don’t doubt you, you can tell I am no expert.

But most of those tests are done by machines, and I am just not that steady. All things equal, doesn’t a longer brace height mean the arrow is clear from contact with the bow quicker which means less chance for human movement?

Maybe drop aways nullify this to some extent, but it is still quiver off the string. My last bow I did go with a WB so the contact issue is still there?

Is it just me mentally that I am convinced I will shoot a 7” BH better?

Could you explain what's different about the "new designs" that changes the basic physics of shooting archery equipment? As Xman said, "This much is a fact though...the shorter the BH, the more likely you are to torque the bow while drawing.". I think that is undeniable. It's also undeniable that the longer an arrow stays in contact with the bow and string, the more likely the shooter will adversely affect the accuracy of the shot after release. One more fact is that a longer ATA allows for a steadier aim. These truths have been known in the competitive archery circles for years.

Admittedly, I've been out of competition archery for several years. So what has changed with these magical "new designs"?

Matt

If you notice each year the axles are closer together than the length of the riser. ATA is no longer the proper measurement for those designs.

Some MFGs still have shorter risers and the axles and cam, string angles are from the longer ATA so your statement stands for those older designs.

I wasn’t trying to start a pissing match. I was just saying that it doesn’t matter to most of us what the BH is. Go find a bow you shoot well, and you like. Don’t pigeon hole your choices into a category that doesn’t mean much any more.

At one time I thought BH was a factor. But the more I’ve read about it lately, the more I’ve bought into that it won’t have one iota of an effect on an average or above shooter. If you’re shouting competitively and you need that advantage to win on the circuit, then yes, those bows that are built for that are long ATA and low BH. But for a hunter…..

The second torque type is induced by the shooter's bow hand/grip. This is best described by your bow hand twisting/torqueing the bow in a manner that is not in a straight line with the arrows intended path. As the bowstring is drawn, the draw weight will "temporarily undo" that torque as you line up the shot. Then, immediately when the release lets go of the string, the bow will return to the twisted position you put into it with your hand. THIS, is the torque that short brace heights can increase and longer brace heights can help reduce. The closer your two hands are together when you start the draw, the harder it is to start the draw without that hand torque.

I see guys with hand torque problems every time I go to the range. It's very easy to spot, and inevitably it's a shooter with a low BH bow, but not always. All you need to do is look at the position of the bow on the follow thru immediately ofter the shot. If it's pointing in any direction other than straight at the target, then the shooter is introducing hand torque.

The most common problem I see is guys shooting too much draw length, causing their bow arm to be fully extended at full draw, instead of a slight bend at the elbow. That will almost always introduce torque and poor follow-thru problems.

Matt

I had an Ultra and an Ultra 38, great bows.

But, I like to hang and hunt, so my “fresh” locations are not usually well trimmed out. Being only 5’8” tall, the shorter ata bows have given me more maneuverability around twigs and leaves etc.

I am learning a lot here, thanks all!