Oklahoma to OK air 'bows'
General Topic
So, how long before the manufacturers push to include it during BOW seasons?
Oklahoma Set to Legalize Airbows for Big Game
"It looks like another state is going to allow the use of airbows for hunting big game. In Oklahoma, Senate Bill 1571, currently awaiting action in the legislative body, would permit the use of airbows for hunting during any rifle season."
Good idea during rifle seasons, exactly where the scoped and cocked long range modern crossbows should be.
Step #1 = Get a foot in the door....
Unfortunately Missouribreaks, OK already allows crossbows during our archery season. I suspect the air gun that shoots arrows will ultimately get into archery season too. Why? OK archery season is 3 1/2 months long and rifle season is roughly 2 weeks!
Found this interesting in the link: “They are not technically classified as firearms and they are not technically classified as archery equipment.” As such, they are not subject to the federal excise tax. So, Jager said, to offset the loss of department revenue, Oklahoma hunters would have to buy a $20 permit to use the equipment for big-game hunting if it is legalized.
Oklahoma needs to drop the bag limit on bucks to ONE and up the cost for NR’s.
Agree 100% with Embry but Okla G&F "manages" deer for maximum opportunity both resident and non-resident. Why else would you allow rifle hunting to overlap with the rut?
Whats the difference between the scoped and cocked crossbows and compounds? They shoot the same distance, and have triggers, and sights.
I agree with Embry as well, I think “airbows” are the least of our problems. Honestly, if you would have asked me I would have assumed it was already legal in rifle seasons. I defiantly believe the 2 main factors are multiple buck tags and rifle season timing. I see very little chance that rifle dates will change and don’t see much chance of tag numbers decreasing either. It kinda is what it is, they make no bones about it, they manage for “opportunity” not quality, and I see no indication that will change either.
—jim
Ohhh Dean, don't go where Angels won't tread... you must be new here ;0)
I think this was posted on the general forum to create awareness in all states, otherwise it would have been on the Oklahoma forum. Think big!
What's the difference between cocked and not cocked?
Define "cocked"
Embry hit the nail on the head.
To be fair to the ODWC their job is to hold wildlife in trust for the public of that state. The majority of hunters in the state want two buck and rifle season right when it is. As long as deer populations are healthy it makes no sense to cater to the minority (bowhunters and QDMA types). I can understand why a guy who only bow hunts wouldn't want rifle season during the rut. I can also understand why a guy who only wants to shoot 160 inch plus deer would want a one buck limit. I'm also not so naive as to think the only reason they want that is because it's sound management practices. Now I'm all for some NR price hikes lord knows no state I hunt is as cheap Oklahoma. As for the airgun in rifle season super unconcerned. Even if it made it in to archery I know very few okies shelling out $2000 for a airgun when they can run to Wally world and get a $200 crossbow.
"What's the difference between cocked and not cocked? Define "cocked""
There's a joke in there somewhere.
Not enough people are gonna use air bows for you to ever notice the difference.
Why in the world would it NOT be legal in a rifle season? It's a neutered rifle...
Kodiak: Yes, there is a sizeable helping of double entendre in my previous post!
Mach, what do you mean is the difference you put one to your shoulder and one you draw,one has a scope and one doesn't one is accurate out past 100 yards with no practice one isn't thats why it's called a cross gun,trigger,safety,forearm,butt stock,
I agree with Embry. Oklahoma has only cared about license/tag sales for too long. The deer and turkey herds in western Oklahoma have been hurting for ten years. Time to think about management and not license sales.
PushCo the deer herd numbers in Western OK are so pathetic I feel bad letting my kids shoot a doe here and there. Numbers might be healthy on the eastern side of the state that didn’t go through the 2 year drought we had ten years ago. Our numbers still aren’t 60% of what they were pre 2010. Now we are in another drought that if it doesn’t break pretty quick does will start sloughing fawns and not producing enough milk to raise them like they did 10 years ago. If that happens our numbers will go from poor to terrible quickly. In a state this diverse I don’t know why management is uniform throughout. Do it county by county or at least divide the state in quarters or half’s east/west. I could harvest 6 doe and two bucks a year if I chose to. There is no reason doe harvest shouldn’t be limited to 1 per youth and none for adults for the foreseeable future in NW OK.
All of the states are only concerned with the money aspect of it. If it's a way to generate more revenue they'll do it good idea or not.
Link I agree there needs to be more regional management and the odwc needs to be more proactive in general. Also agree doe tags should be cut. But nobody said that it was let's make it one buck. I'd think we'd start at cutting the doe tags first if it was about management and herd growth. I would support a limit of 1 buck and 2 does across the state. But one buck while still allowing 4 does seems like forced QDM.
As usual, PushCoArcher makes excellent points, and I agree way all. I would also highly support curing the state into 2-3-4 (whatever) game management units.
—jim
Jim, am I correct in understanding that all of OK is managed as a single unit? What do the state biologists think of that?
I'd be ALL for 2 does and 1 buck as well. Also, dividing it up as LINK said is a GREAT idea. As far as ODWC being proactive... well, you see how long it took them to FINALLY move the turkey season back and remove the liberal bag limits to (1) bird. That should've been done 7-10 years ago. So, I wouldn't hold my breath on them dividing the state up into regions for deer.
Look to KS for ideas on how to decimate the herd quality in short order.
As said above, Airbows are a non-factor.
Gentlemen (Okla guys), to the defense of the OWD we do have 10 antlerless zones. The bags limits for buck and does certainly need some "tweeking".
To be fair I completely agree my personal goals don’t necessarily align with the ODWC’s. I want more big deer, they want more dead deer, I get it.
As canepole stated there are apparently 10 antlerless zones (which I didn’t realize). Which seems like a start, but they are certainly IMO slow to react and take measure to issues that seem kinda obvious to many of us. Like the turkeys. They did limit some of the turkey bag limit for the s/e area previously to be fair. But the sudden knee jerk reaction this year to bag/dates seemed kinda odd and rushed from my view point, but I lack first hand knowledge, so will try to hold my speculative opinions on that.
But yes, In my view the state in many ways seems to be managed as a whole, not in regions or zones. There are certainly exceptions (s/e Turkey thing I previously eluded to). But also to be fair the ODWC is a fairly small department with limited funds/support in very large and geographically diverse state. I certainly understand some of the difficulties, so I do try to cut them some slack.
—jim
Antlerless zones have been around as long as the extra holiday antlerless seasons. In the NW they just as well do away with that as we can kill our normal 4 several other times a year. No reason to offer 2 more does where numbers are low anyways.
The department may be small. But when they allow all of a hunters bag limit to be harvested either black powder or modern firearms, I think it is about money not management. And to be honest I participate in all the seasons with the weapon of that season. However as Link stated the numbers of does are not as high as they are made out to be. It was an easy way to get money when the bag limits were changed.
In college when I was young and naive all I wanted to be was a wildlife biologist. My junior and senior year(2010-2011) I had a internship with the ODWC. It didn't take me long to figure out income not management was the driving force. The ODWC is one of the few state agencies that actually makes more money than it takes to run. Fun fact that excess goes back into the state treasury at the end of the year (when I was there it was north of $400,000). The director knows the state expects that money at least the same amount as last year preferably more and won't approve any big budget management projects especially if they can't see a quick profit in it. I know a small game biologist who in 2011 was told they didn't have the funds ($40,000) to approve a study on to quail numbers and habitat in western Oklahoma. The quail faded for year's with nothing being done now the turkeys. And while it's nice the odwc finally cut bag limits but ask them if they're doing any field work, transplanting birds, or spending big money on studying the problem. My guess none of that's happening. Shocked they cut the tags and loss the extra revenue guess it got so bad they had to do something. But cutting tags is probably going to be the only thing they'll do to help matters out. Don't get me wrong I met some great people that worked there who genuinely cared but they seemed to have no actual support from the director or wildlife committee.
Push: is it true that the commission makes recommendations but the legislature (politics) actually makes decisions? I've heard some stories about commission studies when bear hunting was first being considered and the legislature canned it (for a while).
Lost Arra yes that's correct any actual changes to regulations or seasons go through the legislature. But the wildlife committee is appointed by the governor and Senate and the wildlife director is appointed by the committee. So it's just a bunch of "yes men" who understand the rules they're expected to play by. From my understanding the committee and director could approve the spending of the excess budget without the approval of the legislature. What a novel idea the wildlife department spending "OUR" money on wildlife management. Although if they did that I'm sure they'd be replaced quickly. The outcome of letting politics and wildlife management mingle. Unfortunately it's hard to get many to care even in the sportsmen community much less outside of it especially when people are struggling to buy groceries and gas.
Wow, we're starting sound like _____ deer hunters. Our deer herds may be lower than they were 10 years ago but the quality seems to be improving. 2020-2021 set an all time harvest record and it appears there are as many quality bucks as ever. Maybe the hunters in the know, do take a doe and let young bucks go have taken hold? I remember when it was said crossbow hunting would ruin our bow season here in Okla. The same with electronic deer harvest reporting would lead to all kinds of abuse. I could be wrong but all air bows do is keep a hunter from using another wepon (at least at the same time). There have been numerous articles that rank Okla as a top 10 deer state. Other that our two Division One college teams, we don't positively rank very high in much else. Yes, if we aren't as worried about young hunters, the folks that help to feed their families, or just the occasional guy that gets out with his kid or a work buddy then yes let's manage the herd for trophy deer and not maximize opportunities.
