Contributors to this thread:
Fentanyl is NOT a problem
Here we have an article that totally debunks the dangers of fentanyl and where it comes from.
We hear the stories of overdose deaths. I know people that have lost teenagers to it. But, in true liberal fashion, they go to great lengths to convince their flock that there is no problem. They should all be thrown in jail…to bad they’re shutting those down as well.
For those that voted to kill American from within…I hope you suffer before the rest of us!
Link does not work for me.
I think that got it. It’s an interesting read. Really shows the ignorance of our coveted TV quacks.
“ For those that voted to kill American from within…I hope you suffer before the rest of us!”
I hope that you find something to do!
Who exactly is saying fentanyl is not a problem? That notion is contrary to literally every headline I have read regardless of news outlet’s political leanings. In fact, most cite it as the most dangerous illicit drug in circulation due to its potency.
“I hope that you find something to do!”
Care to elaborate?
ingredients from China, manufactured in Mexico, walked unimpeded into the USA.China has declared War on the USA with Covid and now fentanyl and we are so busy fighting amongst ourselves to notice.Nowadays you are a racist bigot if you want a secure border.
Link doesn't work, but the comments you made are pure idiocy. I administer IV Fentanyl 3 days a week, multiple times per shift. It is given in micrograms, which is a tiny dose. Too much, and it paralyzes the diaphragm muscle, and you suffocate. These people addicted to it, buying it on the street, have zero idea of the actual dose. It could be micrograms,milligrams, or even grams. I had a pt last year that is hooked on it. He said he runs a gas station that dealers use regularly and they told him the Chinese are manufacturing it, and slipping it in the US via Mexico cartels. He said they buy flats and press their own pills, or just buy the pills. We usually start out with a tiny dose of 50 mcgs, or if they're obese and in severe pain, 100 mcgs. If you know someone hooked on Fentanyl, there is an extremely high chance they will end up dead. Narcan will reverse OD, but the patient needs to be in a critical care environment for airway and hemodynamic monitoring. Narcan has a fast half life, and multiple doses often need to be given to keep the pt alive until they get to an ambulance and then ER.
Idiocy is the theme on this clown show of a forum.
Did you guys even read the article?
Just 2 weeks ago in Albuquerque the Feds busted Surenos gang members with over a million fentanyl pills and several million in cash. Albuquerque had a 900% increase in fentanyl busts from 2020 to 2021 and this isn't because the DEA just got better. A good friend of mine is a local DEA agent and he says they estimate that they only catch 10% of the drugs that come through.
The border is secure Sherman Potter would call that horse hockey!
Big pharma started the opioid epidemic and it has devastated the white American population in my area. That’s not the cartels fault. It came from within first and the cartels are simply capitalizing on the desire created by our healthcare board members who knew what would happen from the very beginning.
I invite you to come to my town and try to find a viable, middle aged white male to show up and work everyday. I pay above top dollar for my area and haven’t found a worthwhile American yet. I need those borders to stay soft so I can keep my business running. I tried going the traditional route and it’s just not viable. I have 17 employees at the moment and not one of them was born here. I treat them well and with the respect they deserve. They work hard for me and my customers love them.
The people using fentanyl are the problem, the drug is harmless otherwise. Why are we a drug craving society?
Pops, Drugs as a recreational pastime is the cause of the epidemic. Decriminalization of drugs is the cause of the epidemic. The plot to destroy America from within is the cause of the epidemic. Your lack of morality and virtue in hiring illegals is the cause of American decline. On the one hand you blame pharmaceutical companies and on the other you support Perversion On Parade, yeah, you know the drill.
Everyone on this thread is saying the same thing. The original post was criticizing an article that was slanted and cited no data. This is a nasty problem.
Wild bill, what’s my alternative? Shut down a popular and successful business and become homeless? I need employees who show up everyday, work hard and won’t steal from my customers. My customers need me to provide workers they can trust to be sober and do a good job.
Would you rather I show up to work on your house with a van full of Hispanic folks or a van full of drug addicts?
That’s my reality and those are my options. As a small business owner, I have to adapt to what works. I tried really hard to form a team of natural born Americans but they’ve all sucked. Big pharma pushing pain pills on already struggling southern economies is the single biggest contributing factor to my employee issue now.
“I need those borders to stay soft so I can keep my business running.”
So each of your employees has probably smuggled a load or two of contraband to get here in an effort to work for you?! Not really wise to brag about. But It’s a matter of perspective. Perhaps you could move to their native country and open your business there. In the mean time you’re contributing to the problem.
I find it interesting that so many are quick to blame the evil big pharma companies. These pain killers are tightly controlled and require a prescription. Where are they getting their prescriptions? That’s right, from your local health care providers. Why no blame directed to them for over prescribing pain killers?
Fentanyl is deadly. As a retired scientist in the public health sector, I refused to work with it because it requires extreme lab safety procedures to safely handle it. First responders and law enforcement have died by unknowingly coming in contact with it.
Pops, big pharma didn’t prescribe the pills. Prescribers didn’t make individuals abuse it either. And, neither the doctor or big pharma made any one abuse them.
Therein is an example of dumb and dumber. Blame big pharma or anything except the individual who hooked themselves on the pills.
What part do you not agree with? My father was prescribed fentanyl patches, (it’s easily absorbed thru the skin) I was with him when they prescribed them, and Dr told us in no uncertain terms, DO NOT DISPOSE IN THE TRASH. People dig in the trash in an effort to find them for a cheap high and end up overdosing. In addition, the health care industry allowed him to switch between hydrocodone and oxycodone, every time he complained about pain. The day before he passed, they gave him enough morphine to sedate a blue whale. When he passed away, I could have made a sweet dollar by selling everything we had leftover. So yeah, big pharma didn’t give it to my dad, but they didn’t seem to mind when the healthcare providers over prescribe him on their expensive opioids.
“Therein is an example of dumb and dumber. Blame big pharma or anything except the individual who hooked themselves on the pills.”
Are you sure they hooked themselves, or were they “recruited”?
It’s no secret that the way that the Medical view of pain management has drastically changed over the past 30 years or so. I had a friend whose father dealt with chronic pain patients - he knew who the addicts were and would not supply them - but was “investigated“ for “over prescribing“ (and was required to reimburse the organization which investigated him for the cost of the investigation, despite being “cleared”)…. And then it got to where I would go to the ER for some relatively minor thing, and they would give me a prescription for enough of that stuff to take it 3-4 times/day for a week or more. And it’s no secret that there were “physicians“ who were basically dispensing that stuff free for the asking and would have lines wrapped around the building. Then they would write up the “office visit” and get paid. A guy I knew from another Board told me there’s a whole Generation lost to that stuff from around VA and on down south.
I could probably buy myself a nice custom bow with the street price of all of the pills I’ve dropped off at the police station in the past 25 years. Maybe several.
Maybe a good, used pick-up.
It’s also no secret that “Big Pharma” knew damn well how much more of that stuff they were selling and didn’t stop to question it because Profits.
Plenty of reasons that epidemic took off; Fentanyl somehow “not” being incredibly dangerous when misused/abused is not on the list.
Fentanyl patches have an extremely high fentanyl content, and they are used with a special liquid that promotes absorption thru the skin. It's almost impossible to overdose by simply touching a fentanyl pill or powder. Obviously, you don't want to rub your fingers in it, then lick them clean.
FYI, I'm certainly not advocating the abuse of fentanyl, or any pain-killing drugs. I've had family members ruin their lives by becoming addicted to the stuff. That said, I understand how it can happen.
When I busted 5 ribs and punctured a lung, they had to stick a tube in my chest to drain the blood and fluid buildup. They put me under for that procedure with Ketamine. I NEVER want to experience that dreadful drug, again. 4 days later, when they removed the tube, they gave me fentanyl for that procedure. Up to that point, I could barely rise to a sitting position in my bed. It was excruciating just to breath. After the fentanyl kicked in, and they pulled the tube, I felt like the injury had never happened, I showered, dressed, and began packing my bag to leave. The nurse came in and warned me that feeling wouldn't last, and she was correct.. A few hours later I was miserable again, and wishing they'd give me another one of those magic pills. I'm glad they didn't, but I can certainly see how someone in extreme constant pain could get addicted to the stuff.
“Therein is an example of dumb and dumber. Blame big pharma or anything except the individual who hooked themselves on the pills.“
Pretty broad brush there WV. Maybe with people that purposely abuse them. My old man lived thru the pain for 30 years, when he reached his 80s he chose to accept the painkillers. All the while he was concerned about addiction and was adamant about missing a dose now and then for safe measure. Low and behold, not long before his passing, he told my sister that he feared he had become addicted. At that point he never missed a dose, and was sure to take it RIGHT on time every time. Although he was concerned about addiction, it happened before he even realized it.
For some, the alternative is pain.
I live in a town of less than 10,000. We have more pain management clinics than bars. Those parking lots are always full. I know for certain that the pharmaceutical companies flooded small southern markets on purpose and gave kickbacks to drs who would overprescribe because it’s all public record. They admitted it. Towns that were once safe places to raise children died because half the population became addicts over the course of just a few years. That wasn’t an accident and it’s not some urban legend.
People need to toughen up and learn to endure some pain. Only advanced cases of severe pain should receive a prescription for such meds. Many of the deaths however are recreational users, druggies by choice.
Corax, unless someone held them down and made them take them, they hooked themselves.
Any other reasoning is kinda like arguing if you hold your hand over a hot grill, it’s Bobby Flay’s fault when you get burned.
70, I’ve had cancer, been run over, fell off roofs, three acl repairs and the stuff that goes with it. All told, I’ve went under the knife for 13 surgeries. I hurt every single day. Bad.
I’m not judging your dad. I can relate. However, I’ve never gotten hooked on anything.
Broad brush or not, it’s a choice to take pain meds. I’m not being mean. I’m being honest.
I know when a person is in pain, they are mighty nice.
“I’m not judging your dad. I can relate. However, I’ve never gotten hooked on anything.”
Congratulations on that! I’ve never taken opioids for any reason, therefore I have no real idea what it’s like. I’ve always had allergies, one time I used nasal spray so much, my doctor said I was addicted to it. Not in the sense of wanting or craving more, but because it didn’t seem to be working, so I kept using more and more until it was completely ineffective. I never thought I’d be considered a nasal spray junkie.
Let's just ignore big pharma which got a lot of america hooked on opoids through no fault of there own. Imagine going in for a routine surgery, taking medicine as prescribed and then becoming addicted and an addict
There is a definite genetic component that goes along with addiction. One person can be prescribed opiates and when the prescription runs out, they never think about it again. Another person might feel as though they can't believe they lived a day of their life without opiates and are convinced they can't move forward without them. I don't have enough fingers and toes to count the number of competent, wonderful people I know who have died from overdose over the last decade. No one chooses to be an addict. It is one of the more miserable existences a person can experience. That is not to say that someone addicted is not responsible for every action they take, they are, but a person in the thick of it is unable to see that they have a choice not to use. That stuff ravages person's soul and holds them captive from the inside out in a way that words can't describe and unless a person has experienced it first-hand it's impossible for words to explain the helplessness that accompanies addiction.
The current Democrat regime is willing to look the other way on Fentanyl, drugs, violent criminals, terrorists or whomever into the US through our southern border to increase Dem voter roles and keep them in power.
That pretty much tells us what they think about keeping Americans safe.
Missouribreaks-you have zero clue on what you are talking about. Addiction is a disease. Although I am a conservative, your idiocy gleams daily in the stupid posts you make and I am embarrassed to see what you post.
Fentanyl overdose is the leading cause of death among young Americans today. Not covid nor accidents come even close to the body count. Pure fentanyl is coming into the USA via the China pipeline. All it takes to kill is ingesting or absorbing an amount not much bigger than *.
So if I go to a party tonight and decide to take some fentanyl, did I do that because I have a disease, or did I simply make that choice? I think there is more to the story than simply getting addicted to a doctor prescribed pain medication. That is mostly not what is being sold on the street for recreational drug use.
LSD with Disney characters.
Fentanyl in different colors.
How is it really marketing to kids?
The dealer at the school is marketing to kids.
Politicians make laws like prohibition and they have the same results.
They create a black market and drug dealers make money.
Politicians get more votes to fix it.
How much have we spent on the War on Drugs?
We sometimes print out warnings on our ER discharge instructions that states you can become addicted to opiates in as little as 4 pills.
Dope Sick is a pretty good show on Hulu that shows what Perdue Pharma did to the Appalachia area with pain killers. Definitely worth checking out
Missouri, that is a choice that could lead to developing a disease. Take a look at the pictures in the link Dana provided. Fentanyl is commonly pressed into pill form that is identical to prescription medication to fool people into thinking they know what they are using. In the case of Dana's article the pills being mimicked are 30mg Percocet. All that being said, you are correct that there is more going on, the opiate epidemic is extraordinarily complex.
A stanford student dies from smoking a joint unbeknown to him it was laced with Fentanyl.
What a bunch of you guys don’t realize is you don’t know what is in those illegal drugs.
I tend to agree that some of these addicts deserve what they get….. But there’s just too many kids that are experimenting getting caught up in this.
No the latest on the border it turns out Venezuela is shipping all of their violent criminals up to the US border. This is shades of what Fidel Castro did back in the 60s/70s.
And there are a bunch of others who take the pills legally, by their choice as some have pointed out, to deal with chronic pain, become addicted and their life unravels.
I’ve had lots of injuries and surgeries and have chosen to take pain pills a few times. One time while dealing with neck and lower back injuries I took them too long and became dependent on the drugs after 8 or 10 months but I’m lucky that I recognized I had a problem 6 weeks after neck surgery and quit on my own. That did help me understand how it could happen and I’m lucky I’m strong willed, recognized the dependency and quit. This was 20 years ago and before there was widespread recognition of the possibility of easy addiction. I took them one more time for a couple days after another surgery a few years ago and really paid attention to the affect they had both physically and mentally and found they really make you mentally numb. It was then that I really understood how people could get addicted to that feeling and the drug if their life wasn’t going real well. I personally don’t like the feeling of being on the stuff, plus you can’t hardly take a crap!
"I live in a town of less than 10,000. We have more pain management clinics than bars. Those parking lots are always full. I know for certain that the pharmaceutical companies flooded small southern markets on purpose and gave kickbacks to drs who would overprescribe because it’s all public record. They admitted it. Towns that were once safe places to raise children died because half the population became addicts over the course of just a few years. That wasn’t an accident and it’s not some urban legend. "
Right there says all the proof you need to understand the border crisis. Dope up the boarder population so employers "need a soft boarder" there bye creating allies in their open boarder policies. The open boarder has one goal......to undermine America.
President Trump had it right. Build the wall! Just another reason the swamp hates him & will do anything to prevent him from succeeding going forward.
Not a person in this country that doesn't know cigarettes can cause health problems. But it wasn't too long ago that cigarettes were touted as healthy by the people selling them.
Not a person in this country that doesn't know meth is devastating. Yet people get hooked every day.
I suspect pain meds are somewhere in between those two examples at the moment. Between being touted as miracle drugs by big pharma and full fledge knowledge that it will devastate your life.
Everybody has their demons. Most people are in a pretty low spot when they start an addiction, where any short term relief outways long term health. With our economy getting worse and our leadership ignoring big problems or taking ineffective measures against them I don't see addictions going down. It's unfortunate.
Why are so many people these days driving to pain clinics to get prescribed these medications? It is a complex issue, but individual people do have some choices.
People get addicted when recovering from medical issues. Their prescription ends but the "pain"/ addiction doesnt. That forces them to go to the street. 1 in 4 people who were prescribed long term opiods struggle with addiction.
Nobody is forced to take an opioid.
Open mouth. Insert pill. Addicted is a choice they made.
I love beer. I love the taste of it. Most all of it as long as it isn’t an IPA. For over 10 years of my life, I drank beer everyday. Lots of it. About a 12 pack.
I no longer due that. I know what addiction is. I know why I got addicted. It wasn’t the beer producers fault. It was mine.
Addiction is a choice. For whatever reason, people choose it. Just like I chose my beer. It is a decision no matter who says differently.
Don’t blame anyone except the abuser.
^this. Addiction is addiction, not a disease. My 56yr old mother in law died of brain cancer, that is a disease.
"Nobody is forced to take an opioid. "
Ever had *major* surgery? Like, 'we're taking out chunks of you' ? You wake up and it doesn't hurt because of the opioids in your system. Three days later they cut the drugs, then, damn! 'Oh, here's some Tylenol.' Doesn't quite cut it...
I know people who got hooked because of chronic pain due to botched surgery. Addiction might have been a 'choice', but screaming in pain and not being able to sleep wasn't much of an option.
There are two problems here (actually more) - medically induced reliance/addiction and 'recreational' use/addiction. And there are suppliers taking advantage of both. Even if the doctors cut a patient off, the 'recreational' dealers are happy to supply those in actual or perceived pain.
" There are two problems here (actually more) - medically induced reliance/addiction and 'recreational' use/addiction. And there are suppliers taking advantage of both. Even if the doctors cut a patient off, the 'recreational' dealers are happy to supply those in actual or perceived pain."
I agree with this, but why blame the pharma company for producing a medication for use after major surgery, isn't that what patients want ? If not, nobody is forcing them to take opioid medications, that is a choice.
WV, consider yourself blessed. And maybe you have exceptional will power. Maybe you don't have the genetic components to facilitate true addiction. The majority of my social circle are those who are in recovery for many years after being completely and utterly addicted to drugs/alcohol, not a single one of us has a quitting experience as cut and dry as the one you describe. Hell, my little brother had an exorcism from a Priest before he was able to get sober. I'm not a religious guy, but if sometime in the future a scientific study showed that addiction was the manifestation of an actual demon, I wouldn't be surprised.
WV, consider yourself lucky that you clearly have no idea how real addiction works. I guess in your case, ignorance really is bliss.
I agree with WV, you cannot blame the beer producer for what may be a genetic predisposition for addiction. I would blame the genetics.
I agree with WV, you cannot blame the beer producer for what may be a genetic predisposition for addiction. I would blame the genetics.
Mizzou, pre surgery they didn't *ask* me if I wanted the drugs. They know the knife-work hurts. Nor did they ask me to go 'cold turkey' three days later. I'm glad they did both, in hindsight, but it was a bitch at the time.
That said, there's short-term and long-term pain, and some people don't deal well with the latter. Pain tolerance is an individual thing. I live with a sore knee and manage it with nsaids, some people would be screaming for a replacement. Some would be taking nsaids every day, a few may be using stronger stuff. And getting 'hooked'. I don't judge people as a class, each case is different.
This thread reminds me of the good old days before Covid when the left didn't blindly trust big pharma.
“I agree with WV, you cannot blame the beer producer for what may be a genetic predisposition for addiction. I would blame the genetics.”
Why not? Some folks blame the gun when someone shoots someone else. Mental health status hardly ever gets the blame. Addiction is no different. It’s a mental health issue.
Blame, blame, blame, blame, that is the name of the game. Do not ever accept any personal responsibility, for anything !
Missouri, it's interesting that you continue to try formatting the conversation to make it look as though some of us are trying to blame others for addiction being a thing that exists within humanity. My point has always been that it is far easier to fall into and far more difficult to climb out of addiction than most think. There is no one to blame for addiction, it is just a thing that exists.
If you review this thread from the beginning, it did not take long for a poster to blame " big pharma ", hence the context of my posts.
It is laughable how holier than thou this website is.
“If you review this thread from the beginning, it did not take long for a poster to blame " big pharma ", hence the context of my posts.”
If you don’t think big pharma is complicit, and isn’t happy to reap the rewards of addiction, you’re as ignorant as they come.
Philip Morris execs testified that they don’t believe cigarettes are harmful, knowing full well it was a lie. Why would they possibly do that?!!
people die and kill others under the influence of alcohol all the time. But you don’t see the booze vendors setting limits on how much one person can purchase at one time. I can’t imagine why that is either!?
I think you mean 'complicit' and yeah, they are. Even if they're not still making and pushing it, where are the black-marketeers getting their raw materials?
“I think you mean 'complicit' “
Fixed. Thanks for the heads up!
Huntfishcook, I am a remarkably blessed man. I asked God to help me change my life. And, the instant I did and meant it, he answered my prayer. Every single addict alive could do the same. Not my opinion either. It’s Gods word.
Pops, you are too irrelevant to even deserve a thoughtful reply.
WV, You don’t have enough brain cells left to formulate a thoughtful reply. God must’ve taken them at the same time he cured your addiction.
Wow. What a great answer butthurt.
Well since you’ve got everything figured out, why don’t you enlighten us with what I’m missing concerning addiction.
I know I’m a bigot, racists, homophobic, white male. And, I have zero understanding of anybody that agrees with a pedophile reading to young children. However, I’m not all bad. I’m open to new outlooks. So, teach me how addiction is something a previous addict knows nothing about.
Im glad you were able to kick it, WV. Parts of my reply to you read a little sharper today than they did yesterday. I get a little fired up about this topic. Happy hunting this year.