Trump's Tax Returns
General Topic
Contributors to this thread:
sundowner 22-Nov-22
fdp 22-Nov-22
Matt 22-Nov-22
70lbDraw 22-Nov-22
fdp 22-Nov-22
Brotsky 22-Nov-22
Stix 22-Nov-22
fdp 22-Nov-22
TGbow 22-Nov-22
Matt 22-Nov-22
Iowa booner hunter 22-Nov-22
bigswivle 22-Nov-22
DanaC 22-Nov-22
fdp 22-Nov-22
bowhunt 22-Nov-22
bowhunt 22-Nov-22
TPjeep 22-Nov-22
TGbow 22-Nov-22
HDE 22-Nov-22
Matt 22-Nov-22
fdp 22-Nov-22
midwest 22-Nov-22
LOSTNwoods 22-Nov-22
LOSTNwoods 22-Nov-22
sundowner 22-Nov-22
LOSTNwoods 22-Nov-22
Shuteye 22-Nov-22
fdp 22-Nov-22
Matt 22-Nov-22
Stix 22-Nov-22
bowhunt 22-Nov-22
annonymouse 22-Nov-22
fdp 22-Nov-22
Recurve Man 23-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
fdp 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
sundowner 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
BowSniper 23-Nov-22
fdp 23-Nov-22
sundowner 23-Nov-22
Bob H in NH 23-Nov-22
Stix 23-Nov-22
Recurve Man 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 23-Nov-22
Iowa booner hunter 23-Nov-22
greg simon 23-Nov-22
70lbDraw 23-Nov-22
Will 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
Tilzbow 23-Nov-22
Will tell 23-Nov-22
fdp 23-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 23-Nov-22
grossklw 23-Nov-22
DanaC 23-Nov-22
Shaft2Long 23-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 23-Nov-22
gflight 23-Nov-22
sundowner 23-Nov-22
DanaC 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
DanaC 23-Nov-22
Matt 23-Nov-22
fdp 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
Matt 23-Nov-22
KHNC 23-Nov-22
stealthycat 23-Nov-22
sundowner 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
TonyBear 23-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
bigeasygator 23-Nov-22
Iowa booner hunter 23-Nov-22
sundowner 23-Nov-22
DanaC 23-Nov-22
fdp 23-Nov-22
Matt 23-Nov-22
Stix 23-Nov-22
RK 23-Nov-22
Tilzbow 23-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
sundowner 23-Nov-22
Rocky D 23-Nov-22
Rocky D 23-Nov-22
Grey Ghost 23-Nov-22
Recurve Man 23-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 23-Nov-22
KSflatlander 23-Nov-22
Matt 23-Nov-22
DanaC 24-Nov-22
70lbDraw 24-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 24-Nov-22
Rocky D 24-Nov-22
Rocky D 24-Nov-22
shade mt 24-Nov-22
RonP 24-Nov-22
KSflatlander 24-Nov-22
KSflatlander 24-Nov-22
sundowner 24-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 24-Nov-22
70lbDraw 24-Nov-22
fdp 24-Nov-22
Grey Ghost 24-Nov-22
Shaft2Long 25-Nov-22
shade mt 25-Nov-22
Shaft2Long 25-Nov-22
Shaft2Long 25-Nov-22
TGbow 25-Nov-22
Matt 26-Nov-22
DanaC 26-Nov-22
WV Mountaineer 26-Nov-22
DanaC 26-Nov-22
DanaC 26-Nov-22
TrapperKayak 26-Nov-22
blacktail 26-Nov-22
TrapperKayak 27-Nov-22
fuzzy 27-Nov-22
DanaC 27-Nov-22
Rocky D 27-Nov-22
DanaC 27-Nov-22
DConcrete 27-Nov-22
Southern draw 27-Nov-22
Rocky D 27-Nov-22
Rocky D 27-Nov-22
sundowner 27-Nov-22
Rocky D 27-Nov-22
Rocky D 27-Nov-22
bobbinhood 27-Nov-22
2Wild Bill 27-Nov-22
TrapperKayak 27-Nov-22
sundowner 27-Nov-22
HDE 29-Nov-22
From: sundowner
22-Nov-22
Supreme Court orders Trump's tax returns to be turned over to House Democrats.

It would not surprise me at all to learn that Trump's tax records clearly show that he has paid all taxes owed, and without any illegitimate deductions. It may be that his returns show that he actually over paid.

This would be so typical of the way Trump makes complete fools of leftists.......fight tooth and nail in the courts against the release, only for Dems to find NOTHING. The harder he fights them, the more they believe they've finally got something that will stick.

Wouldn't surprise me at all. Trump is that much smarter than these rabid fools.

From: fdp
22-Nov-22
"This would be so typical of the way Trump makes complete fools of leftists."......he has NEVER accomplished that, at all.

From: Matt
22-Nov-22
Rabid fools, heh heh.

From: 70lbDraw
22-Nov-22
"This would be so typical of the way Trump makes complete fools of leftists."......”he has NEVER accomplished that, at all.”

Except when he beat Hillary in 2016! I remember seeing liberals crying over that one!!! Lol!

From: fdp
22-Nov-22
"Except when he beat Hillary in 2016! I remember seeing liberals crying over that one!!! Lol!"......kinda' no the same thing at all. But Ok. Lots of "conservatives" cried when he got beat in 2020 as well!!! LOL! But again...not the same thing.

From: Brotsky
22-Nov-22
I think they will find that he legally paid no taxes at all or very few....exposing some of the huge problems with our tax code. Flat tax for all!

From: Stix
22-Nov-22
A guy with his legal team better have impeccable tax documents. I believe he used his tax documents as a diversion.

From: fdp
22-Nov-22
That could be. Makes one wonder though why in the early days of his bid for the Republican nomination and then during his presidential race he initially said that he would turn over his returns. Then that he couldn't because he was being audited, and then just flat refused. Been going on now for 7 years at the very least.

From: TGbow
22-Nov-22
Nobody has to make a fool of leftist, they do a good job of that on their own

From: Matt
22-Nov-22

Matt's Link
Trump's former CFO has already plead guilty to tax fraud and has agreed to testify against the Trump org in its tax fraud case, so there is that. The associated tax savings would trickle up to Trump's personal return, so it appears that he very likely has not paid all taxes owed.

"Weisselberg pleaded guilty in August to avoiding taxes on $1.76 million in income and helping engineer tax fraud. His plea agreement requires him to testify in exchange for a five-month jail sentence."

22-Nov-22
National sales tax fixes all the problems with the tax code but it eliminates the need to lobby the political establishment for favorable tax policy, which is why it will never be seriously considered. Read “ The Fair Tax” by Neil Boortz. It covers everything including eliminating all taxes for poor people and no social security tax for every worker. Corporations would pay no tax on profits but pay sales tax on what they buy to make the products. Right now corporations don’t pay taxes at all, it is worked into the price and the consumer pays it. The USA would be booming if they implemented it

From: bigswivle
22-Nov-22
Almost got him!!!!!

From: DanaC
22-Nov-22
Iowa, is there an example of a country with that system in place, and doing well?

From: fdp
22-Nov-22
The rightist's do a pretty effective job of making themselves look silly as well let's not forget.

22-Nov-22
Anyone that thinks the IRS, hasn’t already dug into his taxes for the last 6 yrs at the pleasure of the Dems, and the FBI is very naive.

From: bowhunt
22-Nov-22
I still have a standing bet for dinner at Morton Steakhouse that he won’t ever be convicted of a crime and thrown in.

Every since 2016 my buddy would text me every other day about some news story and how I was goi g to be buying him that steak dinner.

6 years later I still haven’t bought him that steak dinner at Morton’s.

Maybe this is the one! :)

22-Nov-22
Somalia and Syria, traditionally the most corrupt nations in the world. Are probably relieved to now see the U.S. government as their peer. Our slime balls are just a little more sophisticated and have better attorneys.

It’s a Very sad state we are in

From: bowhunt
22-Nov-22
I forgot to add he quit texting with excitement all the time about some new story on the news after 2-3 years

I guess he figured out most “news” isn’t all that reliable for a source of information.

From: TPjeep
22-Nov-22
Well, Hillary had 2.9 million more votes than Trump in 2016, odd democracy, just sayin

From: TGbow
22-Nov-22
True, the right makes a fool of themselves since nobody can tell where they stand on issues...other than big government

From: HDE
22-Nov-22
"...he has NEVER accomplished that, at all."

Living under a rock? (Question mark added for KSFlat so he's not confused).

From: Matt
22-Nov-22
"Maybe this is the one! :)"

That is like proof the 2020 election was stolen, but we are only 2 years into that one.

From: fdp
22-Nov-22
Nope, nope no rock roof here.

From: midwest
22-Nov-22
I've read that book, Iowa booner and I think it would be an excellent solution. Even crooks would be paying taxes and no reason for people to hide money in overseas accounts bringing all that money back into the states.

From: LOSTNwoods
22-Nov-22
Get over yourselves. TRUMP will win again in 2024.

From: LOSTNwoods
22-Nov-22
Get over yourselves. TRUMP will win again in 2024.

From: sundowner
22-Nov-22
"Get over yourselves. TRUMP will win again in 2024."

You can say that again. And I hope you're right. We need him now more than ever.

From: LOSTNwoods
22-Nov-22
Get over yourselves. TRUMP will win again in 2024.

From: Shuteye
22-Nov-22
The IRS has already audited Trump's tax returns and found nothing. I guess democrats in congress know more about taxes than the IRS.

From: fdp
22-Nov-22
Lol!

From: Matt
22-Nov-22
“ The IRS has already audited Trump's tax returns and found nothing. I guess democrats in congress know more about taxes than the IRS.”

Trump’s ex-CFO knows more about Trump’s tax situation than both, and he cut a deal to testify against him.

From: Stix
22-Nov-22

From: bowhunt
22-Nov-22
On a bowhunting related note, I’m hoping to have time over the weekend to start a thread about the mule deer hunt I just wrapped up.

I had a tag, and hunted with 2 Others that had tags as well.

The tag took 22 years to draw.

From: annonymouse
22-Nov-22

annonymouse's Link
Another OMB fishing expedition...but then there is actual data when it comes to the Biden Crime Family.

From: fdp
22-Nov-22
I'll be looking for the mule deer thread.

23-Nov-22
not that it excuses anything illegal...or suggests that he isnt ultimately responsible...the notion that any of you think that trump has much...if any input whatsoever on the contents of his tax return is laughable. its not like hes doing his own return on turbotax and coming up with his own deductions and expenses. what do you think you would find if you had teams of people picking apart jeff bezos return...or bill gates return...or paul pelosis return? this is nothing more than another attempt to sully him in some way. hell...even i rely on my accountant to take everything i am entitled to and i sign where he tells me to sign...thats what i pay him for.

From: Recurve Man
23-Nov-22
RTCG is exactly right. If anyone does any time it will be those in charge of the books. Anyone with a brain would know that. Everyone wants to see Trump pay by doing time for his intelligence. He surrounds himself with very intelligent people and out smarts every idiot in politics. That goes for both sides. Those who wanna see him burn are those idiots im referring to.

When he runs in 24 he'll have my vote. I like to see people with common sense and good business sence hold our politicians and foreign countries accountable.

From: 2Wild Bill
23-Nov-22
Political candidate tax returns are just pious claptrap.

People do things before God that they wouldn't do in front of other people.

"For the L O V E of money is the root of all evil:" 1Timothy 6:10

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
“not that it excuses anything illegal...or suggests that he isnt ultimately responsible...the notion that any of you think that trump has much...if any input whatsoever on the contents of his tax return is laughable.”

So his accountant is the one who comes up with the value of Trumps properties? Nah. We are all responsible for our own tax filings (as you stated) as we sign them. I don’t think when he goes to court the “my accountant did it” is going to work. Mostly because his accountant is testifying for the state.

If he cheated then he should pay and go to jail like the rest of us. Left or right, D or R. Regardless, he gets his day in court to defend himself.

From: fdp
23-Nov-22
"by doing time for his intelligence. He surrounds himself with very intelligent people and out smarts every idiot in politics. ".......that's just a little misguided. He hasn't outsmarted anybody but a particular demographic of the American peopple.

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
“He surrounds himself with very intelligent people and out smarts every idiot in politics.”

Yeah LMAO. Most of them are writing and selling books right now that say how unfit he is for office.

I honestly don’t get it. Cheney, Desantis, and a few others have the exact same conservative policies and win in 2024 in a landslide. Some right wing nuts worship Trump as a false idle and I don’t think it has a damn thing to do with his politics and policies. It’s his dog whistles, negativity, bullying, and holding others down that they wallow in the most.

From: sundowner
23-Nov-22
"So his accountant is the one who comes up with the value of Trumps properties?"

No. Appraisers, property tax valuations, minus depreciation, plus appreciation......all establish real estate values.

But you know that, right?

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
Sundowner- setting up excuses for your demagogue lol. That will all come out in court.

From: BowSniper
23-Nov-22
I don't like the idea that the opposing political party can search tax documents 'looking' for a crime. And if those tax documents had in fact already been audited, is there some double-jeopardy protection if already cleared?

Does this open the door for House Republicans to pull tax records for the Clinton foundation, to look for any pay to play access bribes? And to pull the Pelosi tax documents to begin investigating insider stock trading from top to bottom??

From: fdp
23-Nov-22
"Does this open the door for House republicans to pull tax records for the Clinton foundation,"....they already did that during the Whitewater investigations years ago. The committee isn't looking to see if he (Donald Trump) did or didn't pay taxes. The details of tax returns contain a lot more information than that.

From: sundowner
23-Nov-22
"Does this open the door for House republicans to pull tax records for the Clinton foundation, to look for any pay to play acess bribes? "

It should, if House Republicans want to stand with Trump and help defend him. But that's doubtful.

From: Bob H in NH
23-Nov-22
There doesn't have to be anything wrong in his taxes, they will simply release a few numbers like "income:billions, tax paid$0"

Then let people scream

From: Stix
23-Nov-22

23-Nov-22
"So his accountant is the one who comes up with the value of Trumps properties? Nah."

that argument is a joke and you know it...if you dont...nobody should take anything you say on this matter seriously. first of all...assuming he inflated his property value, what is illegal about that? if i claim my hunting property is worth ten times what it actually is...what part of that is illegal? if a bank lends me money on what i claim my property is worth...that is on them...not me...i have done nothing illegal. if you go to sell your home, do you base the asking price on what the tax assessment is or do you base it on something else? if the bank lends money based on what a property owner thinks their property is worth, they deserve to go out of business...that is why the bank does their own independent appraisal. this tax return thing is all about trying to make trump look bad and because you dont like him...youre perfectly fine with it. i dont personally like him either...and i hope he is not the republican nominee...the difference is im honest enough to recognize what this sideshow is all about...muddying up trump enough to disqualify him from running again. if you were honest at all you would admit that if you examine the tax returns of any billionaire...or multimillionare for that matter...there would be things in there...whether they actually know about them or not... that you could use to make them look bad to the public.

From: Recurve Man
23-Nov-22
The reall issue is all the Tax loop holes. Anyone who owns a business and has anything to do with a little tax knowledge knows you can pay minimal tax because our government has created so many deductions you can use and are all legal if you have a good accountant. Trump has publically made this comment before. The people who pay their fair of taxes are the working men and women. The tax laws are set up that way so the country can run. The big companies pay minimal tax because it's legal. Our government has created this. If our government wated to really go after anyone maybe it should be the politicians who started out with a net worth of a 4 or 500k and 10 to 20 years later are multi millionaires. They weren't great investors they are corrupt politicians. What's your 401k look like after 25 years of working for a living.

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
“if i claim my hunting property is worth ten times what it actually is...what part of that is illegal?”

I don’t know. Why don’t you try that come tax season and see what happens.

I think you’re confusing the Supreme Court decision with the NY tax fraud case. I was talking about his NY tax case.Trump is accused of purposely devaluing property then inflating the value for loans. I don’t know much about either one and don’t really follow them. I don’t know NY tax law but something is amiss if his accountant is pleading guilty and testifying for the state. If he cheated on his taxes or committed bank fraud then he should be held accountable. No different than me or you. He also gets his day in court where lying and bullying don’t fly. Personally, I don’t care about either situation. But it seems you always have and excuses to make Trump the victim. He’s no victim.

That’s my stance and it’s the same as my first post on this thread.

From: 2Wild Bill
23-Nov-22
KS,

"Personally, I don’t care about either situation."

Do you really expect anyone on Bowsite to believe that statement?

Show me a political thread where you are not on the same page as Stix regarding Trump.

23-Nov-22
DanaC- there is no place where that system is in place and doing well. That doesn’t mean it wouldn’t work though. It would eliminate the IRS also, accounting jobs would be greatly curtailed and tax return companies would be gone. No need to file taxes, April 15th is just another day. Read the book

From: greg simon
23-Nov-22
All this back and forth is really rather ridiculous. No matter which camp you are trying to defend the results are going to be the same. Unless someone can provide me with a list of former US Presidents who have done jail time... At most there will be a scapegoat or two.

From: 70lbDraw
23-Nov-22
“ The IRS has already audited Trump's tax returns and found nothing. I guess democrats in congress know more about taxes than the IRS.”

No, but all they have to do is tell the liberal sheep that they found the holy grail of evil Trumpism. Doesn’t matter if it’s true, they’ll eat it up. Then they’ll start another bogus investigation. It’ll last until just before the election. I guarantee it’ll be labeled as a disqualifying event.

From: Will
23-Nov-22
It's easy to confuse what it's about, to many possible situations to ponder.

The best part though is Trumps declaring the supreme court just another political machine for the democrats. That's a level of laughable even for him.

It is interesting that he's the only President in modern times to refuse to share those documents.

As for the SDNY... If HIS business inflated asset price to gain more loan money, while depressing asset evaluation to reduce tax burden, that would not be a real good choice. If I did that with my little business, and said the accountant did it, the judge would still punish me, because it's MY business. Ultimate responsibility falls on me.

But Trump likes to openly note that he doesnt take responsibility for anything he decides is bad. So if any defense in these cases is essentially finger pointing from team Trump, that would make sense to me.

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
Wild Bill- no offense but I don’t care what you believe. No doubt that I think Trump is a national embarrassment and an international disgrace. He is not leader and IMO he and his cult followers (not his voters but the people at Jan6 and QAnon idiots) are a threat to our republic. But I don’t care about his taxes. That’s for the courts to decide with the powers grated to them by the constitution.

I don’t like trump and you’re right about that. But I can be objective and say that he did some things I applaud. Build the wall (partially), trade with China, Great American Outdoors Act, Operation Warp Speed are some things he deserves credit for. However, I’m not trading any of those things for our republic and constitution.

The guy has no morals or ethics. You know as well as I do that the Bible holds no quarter for anyone who thinks the ends justify the means.

Turn about is fair play so it’s hard for me to believe your statements on the constitution and God when you support a person who doesn’t put much value in either based on his actions. The ends doesn’t justify the means.

From: Tilzbow
23-Nov-22
“it should be the politicians who started out with a net worth of a 4 or 500k and 10 to 20 years later are multi millionaires. They weren't great investors they are corrupt politicians. What's your 401k look like after 25 years of working for a living.”

If someone can’t grow 4 or 500K into at least $2M after 20 years they’re horrible at investing.

23-Nov-22
"I don’t know. Why don’t you try that come tax season and see what happens."

what i claim my property is worth has no bearing on my taxes...neither my real estate or income taxes take into account what I think the value is.

as to whether or not trump is a victim...he most certain was/is. he was a victim of a relentless 4 year russian collusion hoax...among a whole host of other false accusations. whether or not you or i happen to like him does not change that. the difference between you an me is that i don't let my personal opinion of him cloud the facts.

From: Will tell
23-Nov-22
Anyone running for public office should have to turn over their tax returns for at least five years. No exceptions…… if you don’t like it than don’t run.

From: fdp
23-Nov-22
"Anyone running for public office should have to turn over their tax returns for at least five years. No exceptions…… if you don’t like it than don’t run."...absolutely.

From: 2Wild Bill
23-Nov-22
Turn about is fair play so it’s hard for me to believe your statements on the constitution and God when you support a person who doesn’t put much value in either based on his actions.

Please copy and paste my support of his person.

23-Nov-22
"Anyone running for public office should have to turn over their tax returns for at least five years. No exceptions…… if you don’t like it than don’t run."

i disagree. there is no legal requirement to do so...nor should there be. they are private and privileged and protected under federal law. if a candidate wants to volunteer them thats fine, and if they dont thats fine too...and if the public thinks they are attempting to hide something by not disclosing them they can vote accordingly.

From: grossklw
23-Nov-22
I just have to kind of chuckle; I have little doubt on why he doesn't want them released. I invest a lot in real estate (rentals mostly), I pay no taxes on that income legally and in fact I show a rather significant loss (I can't offset my normal W2 income with this, but I'll be able to access it someday).

I'd be surprised if he's paid a cent in taxes, like any decent real estate investor I'm sure his team of CPA's and lawyers have taken every cent of depreciation and bonus depreciation with cost segregation studies and I'm guessing he not only hasn't paid any taxes but has showed a significant loss as well.

I'm not saying this is right or wrong, I'm just telling you the tax code is written to favor certain asset classes, and real estate is one of them (maybe the best). Bonus depreciation is getting phased out starting this year, but I'm guessing once this comes to light there will be some more reform on the horizon that will negatively affect real estate investors. Everyday people have no idea how much money is sheltered with depreciation legally.

From: DanaC
23-Nov-22
Bill, supporting his being in power, or his return to it, is far WORSE than merely supporting 'his person'. Ignoring 'his person' and trusting him with power is not merely wishful thinking, ("oh, he'll act right!") it is a danger to the republic.

From: Shaft2Long
23-Nov-22
“Well, Hillary had 2.9 million more votes than Trump in 2016, odd democracy, just sayin“

This statement is why you guys fail. You don’t even have the most basic understanding of how those elections are conducted.

From: 2Wild Bill
23-Nov-22
DanaC,

Butt out, the accusation was supporting his person. Leave it to you to misstate matters and coming from a declared godless person, I'm not surprised.

From: gflight
23-Nov-22
Got him this time ;^)

From: sundowner
23-Nov-22
KS: "I don’t like trump and you’re right about that. But I can be objective and say that he did some things I applaud. Build the wall (partially), trade with China, Great American Outdoors Act, Operation Warp Speed are some things he deserves credit for. However, I’m not trading any of those things for our republic and constitution."

Please let us know what Trump did that harmed the republic or the Constitution. Decreased taxes on working folks? Lowest unemployment rates in history for every category? U.S. energy independence (net exporter of oil and natural gas)? Booming stock market? Rebuilt our military from years of neglect by Obama? Major cuts in government regulations on businesses and individuals? Built the southwest border wall reducing illegal immigration? Pro American international trade agreements? Fair tariffs on imports? Forcing NATO partners to pay their share of the cost of their own defense? Eliminating ISIS as a threat? Increased global respect for the US?

Which of those harmed the republic or the Constitution?

From: DanaC
23-Nov-22
And MY accusation was supporting his power-lust. Which imo is 8 times worse.

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
Wild Bill- did you vote for Trump? And don’t give me that “I vote for policy and not the person.”

From: DanaC
23-Nov-22
Now bleat about how "I only support his *policies*" - as if his policy was ever anything but "how does this benefit *me*?"

PS far better to serve no god than a false one, which the Cult of Trump clearly does.

From: Matt
23-Nov-22
"not that it excuses anything illegal...or suggests that he isnt ultimately responsible...the notion that any of you think that trump has much...if any input whatsoever on the contents of his tax return is laughable."

While I agree that Trump does not prepare his own tax returns, what would your thoughts be if, as alleged, he was aware of/complicit in a tax fraud scheme at the Trump Organization and then signed his personal return (which would include scheduled amounts that flowed from the Trump Org return) affirming that its contents were true and correct to the best of his knowledge under penalty of perjury?

From: fdp
23-Nov-22
"Decreased taxes on working folks? "....not at my house.

"Lowest unemployment rates in history for all categories"...actually Harry Truman had the lowest average unemployment rate to date.

"U.S. energy independence (net exporter of oil and natural gas)? "....as of October 6th of this year we still produce more oil than we consume which is the very definition of "energy independence".

"Booming stock market?"...nothing that he did.

"Major cuts in government regulations on businesses and individuals?"...could be viewed as good or bad.

" Built the southwest border wall reducing illegal immigration? "...didn't actually "build" enough border wall to make a difference but did have workable immigration policy. Hard to actually track "illegal immigration" since folks who are doing things illegally don't tell you.

"Pro American international trade agreements?"....ehhhh, give the details of 2 that actually wortked.

"Fair tariffs on imports?"....as above.

"Forcing NATO partners to pay their share of the cost of their own defense?"..don't know that he "forced" any country to do that, but it happened. So we'll give him that.

"Eliminating ISIS as a threat?".....uhhhh, no, they still exist and always will.

"Increased global respect for the US?".....who said?.

23-Nov-22
"I just have to kind of chuckle; I have little doubt on why he doesn't want them released. I invest a lot in real estate (rentals mostly), I pay no taxes on that income legally and in fact I show a rather significant loss (I can't offset my normal W2 income with this, but I'll be able to access it someday). I'd be surprised if he's paid a cent in taxes, like any decent real estate investor I'm sure his team of CPA's and lawyers have taken every cent of depreciation and bonus depreciation with cost segregation studies and I'm guessing he not only hasn't paid any taxes but has showed a significant loss as well.

I'm not saying this is right or wrong..."

i am...it's right. the tax code is written to encourage certain behaviors and to discourage others. anyone who doesnt take advantage of every legal deduction is an idiot.

23-Nov-22
"While I agree that Trump does not prepare his own tax returns, what would your thoughts be if, as alleged, he was aware of/complicit in a tax fraud scheme at the Trump Organization and then signed his personal return (which would include scheduled amounts that flowed from the Trump Org return) affirming that its contents were true and correct to the best of his knowledge under penalty of perjury?"

good luck...if it can be proven that he was aware, he should be held responsible....otherwise, tax preparers can and often are held legally and financially responsible for errors both intentional and unintentional.

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
“Please let us know what Trump did that harmed the republic or the Constitution“

He tried to stop the certification of an election as directed by the Constitution. Remember January 6 and “I just need 11,000 votes. C’mon give me a break.” If that not enough then maybe the fake elector scheme with falsified documents on fake state letterhead rings a bell. No…I didn’t think it mattered to you. I’m sure you can justify anything for your false idle. Excuses plenty.

From: Matt
23-Nov-22
"No. Appraisers, property tax valuations, minus depreciation, plus appreciation......all establish real estate values."

There is so much wrong about that statement it makes my head hurt.

Based on my professional experience, it is not uncommon for there to be differences between borrower-reported property values and appraised values. These differences are typically not that significant and are due to differences in the underlying assumptions (e.g. $/SF, income assumptions, cap rate).

From what I have read on the values provided by the Trump Org, they were often complete BS. In one instance, Trump had a property appraised and in the same timeframe reported it as being worth ~3x more on his financial statement. In many cases, the assumptions that resulted in the significant over-valuations were falsehoods (e.g. inflating values due to unsold lots that did not exist or for unbuilt property types that were more valuable than what they were allowed to build). Typical Trump stuff.

Having said that, the NY civil case seems a stretch to me. Trump was dealing with large, sophisticated financial institutions, and if they did in fact rely on his inflated values they did so at their own peril (in my career, we would never do that and in many cases were regulatorily precluded from doing so). I also understand that there were no credit losses suffered by any banks related to those lines of credit, so a bit of a victimless crime in that regard. Banks and insurers may have been taking more risk than they thought they were and not getting paid for it, but it seems like it would be ignorance on their part if that was the case.

23-Nov-22
"As for the SDNY... If HIS business inflated asset price to gain more loan money, while depressing asset evaluation to reduce tax burden..."

how exactly would he do that? the owner or purchaser of a property doesnt dictate how much a bank will loan on it, or how much it is assessed for taxes. in order to do that, the lender and the taxing authority would have to be complicit in the fraud. if a bank lends more money that a property or project is worth, that is their fault. if a property is assessed for less than it is worth, that is taxing authority's fault. it is not trumps fault if either one does not do their due diligence.

23-Nov-22
"He tried to stop the certification of an election as directed by the Constitution."

even if he did just that, the operative word would be tried. do you really want to discuss what other politicians (like biden) have tried to do that is unconstitutional? if bidens student loan forgiveness sham, is found to be unconstitutional...did that harm the republic? should he be barred from running again?

From: KHNC
23-Nov-22
Anyone want to buy a slightly used copy of obama's birth certificate?

From: stealthycat
23-Nov-22
so we know what his accounts did, how much he earned and paid

so what ?

From: sundowner
23-Nov-22
"He tried to stop the certification of an election as directed by the Constitution."

Here is whatTrump said:

"I know that everyone here will soon be marching over to the Capitol building to peacefully and patriotically make your voices heard."

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
You left out this part:

"We fight like hell. And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore.”

Evidently they the insurrectionist idiots didn’t hear the peaceful part. He also didn’t try to stop the riots until hours after they started.

Just more excuses.

From: TonyBear
23-Nov-22
On the flip side it's doubtful that Joe, Jim or Hunter Biden paid the appropriate taxes on their ill-gotten gains in wealth and prosperity. Open up their records as soon as the new House of Representatives take over. No, it wouldn't be retribution for the Trump investigation(s) but it's warranted all on its own. That is something the Dems just don't get. The time will come when there will be no more deflecting to Trump or the Republican Party as the Dems actions warrant investigation. In fact, they already have, time to act on it. No more two-tier legal system.

From: 2Wild Bill
23-Nov-22
KS, SHOW ME THE COPY AND PASTE.

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
Did you vote for Trump or not?

From: bigeasygator
23-Nov-22
I'm not saying this is right or wrong, I'm just telling you the tax code is written to favor certain asset classes, and real estate is one of them (maybe the best).

100% grossklw. And as you point out, it’s completely legal. I never understood why some people get so upset with “government handouts” to lower income individuals, but don’t care one bit about the MASSIVE tax breaks that only highly wealthy people get to enjoy. For the record, I’d love to see ALL individuals pay lower taxes and for the government footprint to shrink. But that doesn’t mean I’m blind to the hypocrisy of so many.

23-Nov-22
I would think that the democrats have already looked at and scrutinized his taxes

From: sundowner
23-Nov-22
"He also didn’t try to stop the riots until hours after they started."

He offered days before to provide National Guard troops to secure the Capitol, but Nancy Pelosi refused. She wanted the protest to happen.

From: DanaC
23-Nov-22
"She wanted the protest to happen. "

She was okay with a peaceful 'protest' - not a violent riot.

From: fdp
23-Nov-22
"He offered days before to provide National Guard troops to secure the Capitol, but Nancy Pelosi refused. " there is no evidence at all to indicate that ever happened. And even IF Nancy Pelosi "wanted" the riot to happen does that change ANYTHING?

From: Matt
23-Nov-22

Matt's Link
"I would think that the democrats have already looked at and scrutinized his taxes"

Since the Supreme Court didn't rule against blocking the release of Trump's personal tax returns to the House Ways and Means committee until today, just how do you think they would have accomplished that?

From: Stix
23-Nov-22
Also left out from Guilianni:

We're gonna have a trial at the capitol,... A TRIAL BY FIRE

From: RK
23-Nov-22
OOOOO. it was soooo scary

Crowds trying to overthrow the most powerful country in the world with Flags and signs. Of course they had the ultimate weapon, a Confederate navel Jack flag A flag that has defeated countries worldwide

And the Only person to die was a female veteran shot by an obviously poorly trained racist capital policeman

The perfect insurrection!!

From: Tilzbow
23-Nov-22
I’m impressed! You guys keep debating the same thing for months (or has it been years?) and I’ve got to wonder if you’re actually expecting to change the other person’s mind or if you just like to argue.

From: 2Wild Bill
23-Nov-22
KS, "it’s hard for me to believe your statements on the constitution and God" I don't believe you ever have. Were there any that interested you?

It is quite clear to me that you do not believe in the American standard of presuming innocence until proven guilty. That's how they murdered accused witches in Salem, you know, right?

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
It’s a yes or no question. Why are you so afraid to answer it? It’s not a trick question. Based on your various posts over the years it appears that you voted for Trump? So in fairness I’m giving you a chance to answer and set the record straight so I’m not accusing you of something you did not do. Did you vote for Trump? If yes, then you support him (the person) for President.

From: sundowner
23-Nov-22
Tilzbow, There is not much chance of changing liberal's minds. "There is none so blind as he who will not see".

But you cannot let their lies stand. You have to refute them with the facts.

And it's important because radical liberalism, if left unchecked, will destroy our history, culture, and Constitution......indeed our way of life. They hate traditional American values, so they cannot be allowed to rule our lives.

I know the political debates get old to folks who come here to discuss bowhunting, but liberals are here......some completely looney (probably paid operatives and activists, and you have to point out their lies where ever they are.

It may be that KSflatlander is one of a few, if not the only honestly confused, non- malicious liberal on this site. He probably actually believes his viewpoints.

From: Rocky D
23-Nov-22
If you want Joe Biden and the Democratic Socialist then the problem is not Trump, it’s you!

Turn your eyes away from the obvious corruption with Hunter and spend seven years going after Trump!

How damn dumb do you honestly have to be!

From: Rocky D
23-Nov-22

From: Grey Ghost
23-Nov-22
I want someone to represent my right of center values. Trump isn’t even close. I’d vote for DeSantis.

Matt

23-Nov-22
"I want someone to represent my right of center values. Trump isn’t even close."

so if it was trump v biden again...who would you vote for? all other things set aside...which one of those two are closer to your right of center values.

From: Recurve Man
23-Nov-22
I agree with sundowner. I am amazed at the people on a hunting site that simply cannot see through the idiotic bullshit this country is going through because of everyone's feelings getting hurt because of a smartass we had for a President. Who cares what he tweets. He ran the country and held foreign countries accountable. Now we have an idiot who everything he touches or does turns to a [email protected]! pile.

KSflat can you name anymore things Trump upset you about other than the Jan 6th set up by the Dem scam. The FBI and the Capitol police were involved. Its embarrassing what the Trump family has had to endure because of idiots through out our government.

From: 2Wild Bill
23-Nov-22
KS, "It’s not a trick question." - Oh but it is. You see, I'm not gullible. You haven't believed anything I've written, then suddenly should I say no I haven't voted for Trump, you will then believe me? You are gullible and have proven it by believing the main stream media.

"He probably actually believes his viewpoints." - Sundowner, who credits you as non-malicious. I'll give you a "maybe" on that point.

"so if it was trump v biden again...who would you vote for?" - Ricky's question Yeah, KS, I suppose you would get up on the high horse of righteousness and say some libertarian or what ever, that still amounts to a vote for Biden.

It is never a case of the ends justify the means, as you follow the ungodly DanaC into his error. It is the lesser of evils. I'd vote for a sinner over a self-righteous idiot any time of the day, because, Romans 3:23. If your God wouldn't touch Trump with a ten foot pole, he's too small to be my God.

From: KSflatlander
23-Nov-22
Recurve Man- yes I could name more things I dislike about Trump and his policies…but I won’t. I won’t because is easy to tell by the way you use loaded language in your question (and subsequent statements) that you don’t really care to know the answers.

Wild Bill- that’s a cop out. I do think you’re an honest person and you have honor. However, it seems contradictory that you hold dear the Constitution if you voted for Trump because he stepped all over it with trying to circumvent the certification of the electoral votes. And with the Trump photo op with the Bible in front of that church…c’mon man. The Bible has a lot to say about that situation.

Gullible lol whatever. That’s your opinion. Fine. I don’t take anything I hear on tv regarding opinions. I look at the footage myself and/or research what is being said and decide for myself. And yes I do believe my viewpoints. If I post an opinion or state a fact I often post a link to credible sources so anyone can challenge my stance. It’s a good way to help reduce my own bias or put a check on my own bubble. I’ve been wrong many times just ask my wife. I was wrong in my statement about you wanting prayer in school and I owned up to it. Posting sources in threads is more than most do who start the political threads like sundowner, Beendare, and others who incessantly start political threads. They often just regurgitate what they heard someone said and obviously didn’t research it for themselves. Notice that I have only started 1 political thread that I can recall in the 25 or so years I’ve been on Bowsite. That was the January 6th thread back in January 2022. I do post more than most on political threads but it’s usually in response to something that false or mis/disinformation. Then it just snowballs to other tangents.

“"so if it was trump v biden again...who would you vote for?" - Ricky's question Yeah, KS, I suppose you would get up on the high horse of righteousness and say some libertarian or what ever, that still amounts to a vote for Biden.“

I would absolutely vote for Biden in that situation and I’ve stated that before. I’m not afraid to say it because it’s my right to vote for whoever I want for my own reasons. Trump vs Biden is likely the only way I’d vote for Biden again. I’d vote for him because I think he is much less of a threat to our republic and constitution. I seriously dread Biden running again because I likely will not vote for him. He’s no leader but he’s also not a threat IMO. The BS he pulled with the afghan withdrawal was an embarrassment and as commander in chief he failed his soldiers. I also would like to see a transparent investigation into Hunter Biden and any involvement with the President. But I don’t decide who I will vote for until after the debates and I watch all of them including the primaries for both sides. Many of you (in general and not specific to you personally) know who you will vote for in 2024, 2028, and every major election until you pass on. It’s the Republican regardless of who they are or who the other candidate is. I’ll vote for who I think is the best candidate and who is looking out for me and my families interest. Yet, those same “Republicans always voters” will call me a sheep. Really…seriously? And for the record I have voted Republican.

Lastly, most of Trumps actions and words are counter to morals and ethics that were given to me by my parents and God. I take that to heart and I’m not compromising them for anyone or anything regardless of how that makes you or anyone else feel. The golden rule meant something in my house growing up and I’m sticking to it. Sometimes I fall short but I try to learn and do better. Trump’s relationship with God is between him and the almighty and none of my business. I do know that Trump lies (says things I know are not true because I seen it or have personal experience), is narcissistic, and marginalizes people. That’s not how I was raised and he has no personal characteristics of a leader IMO.

James 2:14-18

“What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith but does not have works? Can that faith save him? If a brother or sister is poorly clothed and lacking in daily food, and one of you says to them, “Go in peace, be warmed and filled,” without giving them the things needed for the body, what good is that? So also faith by itself, if it does not have works, is dead. But someone will say, “You have faith and I have works.” Show me your faith apart from your works, and I will show you my faith by my works.“

I have not seen Trumps works.

You know, for a guy that doesn’t like others making assumptions about him…you sure make assumptions about me.

From: Matt
23-Nov-22
"If you want Joe Biden and the Democratic Socialist then the problem is not Trump,"

If the republican party nominates Trump, we will likely get 4 more years of Biden. Just like last time. Is that what Trumpers want?

From: DanaC
24-Nov-22

DanaC's embedded Photo
DanaC's embedded Photo
"the ungodly DanaC"

LMAO! maybe I'll have tee shirts printed. >;-)

From: 70lbDraw
24-Nov-22
“..didn't actually "build" enough border wall to make a difference but did have workable immigration policy.”

I’m curious, what was it that prevented him from completing it?

From: 2Wild Bill
24-Nov-22
KS,

Moses was a murder, and the Apostle Paul consented to the stoning of Stephen and then persecuted Christ himself, and you think Trump is worse than them as leader material?

"I’d vote for him(Biden) because I think he is much less of a threat to our republic and constitution." Get real, you're not voting for Uncle Joe. It's his handlers you are putting in office. So, you are for gender manipulation of kids, murder of the unborn, an open border flooding our country with drugs and, etc., etc.? That's quite a list of works there on your behalf.

Gullible and misinformed = a danger to any constitutional republic, however, a good comrade for socialism.

I understand your pride is at stake over the Jan6 hoax.

From: Rocky D
24-Nov-22
The election is not against Biden and Trump but is about two different views for America!

So for me it’s an easy choice…

A long time ago I was taught the OODA loop or Boyd’s cycle of decision making.

Observe, orient, decide, act is most used in chaotic situations to make heads or tails of the situation and then to take action quickly and decisively.

Running down issue after issue and being misinformed much of time you have to look at what you as truth and make a determination of how to respond!

For me CRT, equity (continued discrimination in the name of justice), freedom of speech, and the second amendment are no brainers!

So regardless of all the other issues and arguments on the board it’s conservative for me.

I am not making abortion, LGBTQ, the cabal of global warming override issues that change my opinion!

These are emotional arguments that women and children get caught up in!

As far as global warming I don’t want to hear that we are improving when we are a terminal path to failure.

From: Rocky D
24-Nov-22

From: shade mt
24-Nov-22
I don't know why i even bother posting on these political discussions ?

Lets just all get off the hero worship....whether it be Trump......or Biden, or whoever. Them boys put their pants on just like everyone else, except maybe Biden he probably needs help.

People are so easily turned into people worshippers.....women scream for joy when their favorite musician steps out on stage....big deal, the guy can play a guitar and sing like a canary..... politicians?....its turned into one big soap opera, in a "me" first push to the top, dog eat dog, slander when you can , dig up as much dirt, heck even lie if you have to world. And they drag society into it and we hang on to every word.

Where is wisdom?....where is integrity?.....We have men in Gov't office dressing like women, WHERE IS THE WISDOM AND INTEGRITY IN THAT !!.....

Where is wisdom?....We have grown men, and women in office that act like children.

Where is wisdom ?, when our president gives billions of dollars to other country's, yet a single girl employed as a CNN, and working her butt off, right here in THIS COUNTRY !! can't afford to put fuel oil in her tank to heat her home!!!......keep spouting off..."NO more drilling"......idiot

Where is wisdom,? when you fail to secure our borders and the country already struggling, now has to carry the load of all these illegal immigrants?

where is wisdom, when the greatest nation on earth that COULD be far more independent, rely's on other countries, some of which despise us.?

Where is Wisdom, when we begin to put more trust in mere man, and what he thinks and says....rather than, "In GOD we trust".

what a freak show,.

24-Nov-22
"I would absolutely vote for Biden in that situation and I’ve stated that before. I’m not afraid to say it because it’s my right to vote for whoever I want for my own reasons. Trump vs Biden is likely the only way I’d vote for Biden again. I’d vote for him because I think he is much less of a threat to our republic and constitution. I seriously dread Biden running again because I likely will not vote for him. He’s no leader but he’s also not a threat IMO."

you dont seem to understand how the founding fathers set up a system of checks and balances in this country. no president can be any more of a threat to the republic or the constitution than the legislative branch and the judicial branch allow him to be...executive actions can and do come can go. trump was no more of a threat to the constitution or the republic than any other president. every president has done things that have been slapped back by the other branches of government based on the constitution. whether you want to admit it or not, trump did nothing illegal or unconstitutional on jan6. a bunch of violent idiots sure did...but if youre willing to hang their actions on trump you must also be willing to hang the actions of the 2020 rioters on the democrats who stoked those flames...or threats against supreme court justices that were stoked by schumer.

if you want to talk about actual threats to the republic and constitution...lets talk about open borders...elimination of the electoral college...packing the supreme court...eliminating the filibuster...forcing citizens under penalty of law to buy a product or take a vaccine...eliminating the debts of a certain class of people...forcing citizens under penalty of law to act contrary to their religious beliefs...passing laws that are in clear violation of the second amendment...as well as refusing to enforce laws that are clearly constitutional. sorry but if you want to play the threat to the republic and constitution card, you are clearly on the wrong side of that argument.

From: RonP
24-Nov-22
good post shade.

to add to it, we have a scotus justice that during her confirmation hearing pretends not to know basic biology, and others throughout all-levels starting at local school boards who think men can get pregnant. then when it comes to covid, vaccines, and a mask, they say that we must follow the science.

we are well past a freak show. this is a sh*t show that won't end well.

From: KSflatlander
24-Nov-22
Wild Bill- Wow, I guess your hypocrisy knows no bounds. Play out your hypocrisy with the ends justifying the means. The devil himself could run for office and you could justify voting for him. Just wow. Moses and Paul repented and their behavior changed.

You’re a prime example of faith gone awry and that’s exactly why the founding fathers didn’t want to mix religion with government. Some Christian fundamentalists can justify anything like burning of “witches” or stealing of money from congregations, or having extra marital affairs. Seems there is nothing you can’t justify.

“So, you are for gender manipulation of kids“

Absolutely if they are born with both sexes or it’s done for medical reasons as recommended by a physician.

“murder of the unborn”

Nope but I am for the morning after pill, exceptions for rape/incest, contraception, and sex education in school.

“open border flooding our country with drugs and, etc., etc.?”

Nope but I am for asylum seekers and immigration. I’m empathetic to migrants who are seeking a better life for their family. I’d do the same. I’m not for demonizing them. I’m also for a wall.

I’m comfortable for my list of works thus far. I’m ready today to meet me maker.

“Gullible and misinformed = a danger to any constitutional republic”

That’s exactly right and authoritarians must have these ingredients to make fascism. That’s why right wing extremists like you rail against education no matter what you say.

“I understand your pride is at stake over the Jan6 hoax”

Lol look at the fundamental Christian and his hypocrisy on full display. It happened. I’ll never forget seeing a Trumper beat a cop with a blue lives matter flag and American flags. It’s got nothing to do with pride. It’s got everything to do with supporting the constitution.

Forget what I said about you and honor. I’m beginning to believe you’re the worse of us and a twisted up follower of a false idle. But happy thanksgiving to you.

From: KSflatlander
24-Nov-22
“if you want to talk about actual threats to the republic and constitution...lets talk about open borders...elimination of the electoral college...packing the supreme court...eliminating the filibuster...forcing citizens under penalty of law to buy a product or take a vaccine...eliminating the debts of a certain class of people...forcing citizens under penalty of law to act contrary to their religious beliefs...passing laws that are in clear violation of the second amendment...as well as refusing to enforce laws that are clearly constitutional. sorry but if you want to play the threat to the republic and constitution card, you are clearly on the wrong side of that argument.”

Why do you fear all these things when there are checks and balances? You walked right into that one.

24-Nov-22
"The devil himself could run for office and you could justify voting for him."

i dont vote for anyone based on their personal religious beliefs...granted...those with similar religious beliefs often correspond with my beliefs on other things but i vote based on their belief that my own personal religious beliefs...as well as everyone elses... will be protected...as well as every other constitutional right. so yes...if i felt the devil himself would be more apt to do that...i would vote for him...i have no problem separating my personal religious beliefs from what my government was founded on...and what i want it to do.

24-Nov-22
"Why do you fear all these things when there are checks and balances? You walked right into that one."

i didnt say i feared them...you did...if anyone walked into anything it was you. i trust that the constitution and the republic...as well as the electorate...is more than capable of eventually slapping back any of those attempts by individual politicians. it might take decades like it did in the case of roe v wade...but i believe our constitution will eventually win out. the constitution and the republic is a hell of a lot bigger than trump or biden.

From: sundowner
24-Nov-22
KSflatlander:

"You’re a prime example of faith gone awry and that’s exactly why the founding fathers didn’t want to mix religion with government. Some Christian fundamentalists can justify anything like burning of “witches” or stealing of money from congregations, or having extra marital affairs. Seems there is nothing you can’t justify."

The hate and vitriol in that are disgusting. I mistakenly thought you were just an ignorant bigoted tool of the left. Like a confused sheep following the Judas goat. I was wrong. You ARE the goat. As malicious and dishonest as any other radical.

How did a good place like Kansas produce this? If in fact that's where you are. Liberals are liars by nature.......you're more likely in Massachusetts.

From: 2Wild Bill
24-Nov-22
"Freedom is the natural condition of the human race in which the Almighty intended men to live. Those who fight the purpose of the Almighty will not succeed. They always have been, they always will be beaten." - Abraham Lincoln, pre-Civil War at the 1861 Peace Convention of States. It was also before he became a saved Christian.

Please remember he was also cast as a tyrant.

KS, "Why do you fear all these things when there are checks and balances?" What checks and balances are you talking about? The border is naked unrestraint and Americans are dying from the drugs flowing over and overflowing. How compassionate is that? And human trafficking, aka, slaves, sex or otherwise. Yeah I see how compassionate that is.

"Nope but I am for the morning after pill, exceptions for rape/incest" Just a little killing, it isn't that much God. You voted for baby killers and then suggest I would vote for Satan? Dude, you're self righteous and NOT prepared to meet the God of the Bible. "Those who fight the purpose of the Almighty will not succeed." He's talking about you and your leftist buddies.

24-Nov-22
"Dude, you're self righteous and NOT prepared to meet the God of the Bible. "Those who fight the purpose of the Almighty will not succeed." He's talking about you and your leftist buddies."

...and he has every right to feel that way...whether you or i or anyone else agrees with it or not. thats what the constitution says...and thats all that matters. whether or not he or anyone else will have to ultimately face the judgement of a higher power is completely irrelevant. we need to vote for people who are committed to protecting those rights...regardless of their personal failings.

From: 70lbDraw
24-Nov-22
“Why do you fear all these things when there are checks and balances? You walked right into that one.”

There’s a difference between fearing something and choosing not to agree or participate in it. I don’t fear COVID. I don’t fear the mask. I choose not to wear it I do that for me. I don’t expect you to worry about my health, therefore I don’t worry about yours because I presume you’re able to take care of yourself.

I don’t fear illegal aliens. I just don’t have the resources or interest to help support them, I’m too busy keeping my self and family above water.

Just because liberals fear everything doesn’t mean that EVERYONE is afraid of everything!

From: fdp
24-Nov-22
Happy Thanksgiving everybody.

From: Grey Ghost
24-Nov-22
Shawn, that’s a dink compared to the buck KS killed this year with his bow.

Matt

From: Shaft2Long
25-Nov-22
I hope his tax returns show he manipulated a pile of loopholes. I hope they show how he avoided paying, insert Trump voice, “million and millions” of dollars.

I then hope Trump comes about and says hell yeah I used those loopholes. Then I hope he tells us which members of government created the loop hole and maybe some insight into how much those elected members avoided paying in taxes as well.

Liz Cheney made something like 34 million dollars in 6 years as a Senator. How much of that was paid in taxes?

From: shade mt
25-Nov-22
lets face it, politicians have learned how to use the system and make money. Then they try and dig up dirt about each other so they can get votes.

just about that simple.

From: Shaft2Long
25-Nov-22
I hope his tax returns show he manipulated a pile of loopholes. I hope they show how he avoided paying, insert Trump voice, “million and millions” of dollars.

I then hope Trump comes about and says hell yeah I used those loopholes. Then I hope he tells us which members of government created the loop hole and maybe some insight into how much those elected members avoided paying in taxes as well.

Liz Cheney made something like 34 million dollars in 6 years as a Senator. How much of that was paid in taxes?

25-Nov-22
"lets face it, politicians have learned how to use the system and make money."

anyone...politician or not...who doesnt take advantage of every deduction and tax saving strategy that the tax code allows for is just giving their money away...there is a big difference between avoiding taxes and evading taxes. a tax deduction is like a coupon for dish soap...if you have one and dont use it at the checkout...youre just not very smart. trump didnt write the tax code...he only exploited it. good for him and anyone else who does it.

From: Shaft2Long
25-Nov-22
We fight like hell. And if you don't fight like hell, you're not going to have a country anymore“

You’re seriously using that as the ignition point for an insurrection? That’s just F’n stupid. Really, really stupid.

There are way more hardcore things said at halftime youth football games than that.

“Gorsich, Cauvenaugh. You have unleashed the whirlwind. You have no idea what will hit you if proceed with these bad ideas”

That’s your boy, the dumbass crooked bastard that is Chuck Shumer. What do you have to say about that?

How bout Maxine waters telling followers to physically confront and intimidate republicans?

How bout members of the squad saying “people who voted for trump need to pay for their crimes.” What!? The simple act of voting is now a crime if not done their way?

How bout Ilhan Omar saying the real problem with the Country is white men and we all need to be monitored?

I could go on and on. All of this is way worse and more likely to incite violence than what Trump said.

From: TGbow
25-Nov-22
We really should quit calling leftist Liberals, and calling Facsist conservatives.

True Liberals love freedom just as true conservatives of constitutional rights.

In case anyone hasn't noticed we've ended up with less liberties and bigger government from both parties where both leftist n Fascist politicians rule.

From: Matt
26-Nov-22
“ anyone...politician or not...who doesnt take advantage of every deduction and tax saving strategy that the tax code allows for is just giving their money away.”

Preach brother. Never could find the box on my return to pay more than I owed (not that I looked that hard).

From: DanaC
26-Nov-22
But do you pay lobbyists to write your very own pet tax breaks into law? And contribute $$ to campaign funds to 'convince' your pet representatives to pass them into law?

26-Nov-22
It’s sad that Americans get all snail trailed over the thought that someone else’s tax business is a subject to be debated. And, get giddy when talking of a fellow American paying taxes.

Jesus said give Caesar his due. But, Caesar has long over taken his due. And, we get wet pants commie Americans who get giddy over another’s tax es?

What’s a crime is the lack of taxes not paid by illegal immigrants. And the taxes that are paid by the American citizen. They’ve got to where they are literally taxing the air we breath, while openly inviting those that live off the system. Tax free on the federal end. It’s a crime and Americans just keep turning their backs and allowing it. That’s sad. Add in Americans that stand behind the big machine fleecing everyone and it becomes tragic.

26-Nov-22
"But do you pay lobbyists to write your very own pet tax breaks into law? And contribute $$ to campaign funds to 'convince' your pet representatives to pass them into law?"

yes...and so has anyone else that has ever contributed to...campaigned for...or even voted for any national or state congressional candidate. we support the candidates that promise to do certain things if elected...that is the way a representative republic works.

From: DanaC
26-Nov-22
Sorry Ricky, but politicians pay way more attention to that banking industry lobbyist with a million-dollar check in his hand than to you or me. Or the lobbyists from Big Oil, Pig Pharma, Big Retail...

26-Nov-22
of course they do...and they should...but a politician that doesnt get elected isnt much good to any constituent.

From: DanaC
26-Nov-22
Nor is a politician who is beholden to big business rather than the common consumer.

From: TrapperKayak
26-Nov-22

TrapperKayak's embedded Photo
TrapperKayak's embedded Photo
Trump is awesome, for this reason alone:

From: blacktail
26-Nov-22
No doubt when you put it that way. Best president ever Trapper K.

From: TrapperKayak
27-Nov-22
Amen!

From: fuzzy
27-Nov-22
Do his tax documents reveal any hunting related expenses, donations to wildlife management causes, or other hunting related content?

27-Nov-22
"Nor is a politician who is beholden to big business rather than the common consumer."

you act as if large corporations are monolithic behemoths and that tax incentives that benefit them arent also beneficial to the tens of millions of people who work at those corporations...buy and benefit from their products...or actually own them. its easy to vilify big businesses...as long as you deny that those big business are actually you and me. thats what libs, leftists, and socialists do.

From: DanaC
27-Nov-22
Big businesses are NOT 'you and me' - they're executives and major stockholders. You know, those people who hire tax specialists as well as lobbyists. Who vote themselves stock options and huge bonuses to go with their tax breaks.

From: Rocky D
27-Nov-22
“ Big businesses are NOT 'you and me' - they're executives and major stockholders. You know, those people who hire tax specialists as well as lobbyists. Who vote themselves stock options and huge bonuses to go with their tax breaks.”

Why is this the discussion, I see corporate America falling in line supporting the Dems.

It’s not like Pelosi, Feinstein, Schumer, and the Clinton’s haven’t raked in millions and most didn’t have wealth when they arrived on Capitol Hill!

DanaC, you can use the same tax breaks, stocks, and be one of those people!

What did you do to invest in your future, what risk did you take, and what discipline did you exercise over your lifetime that makes you so bitter towards those that achieved success.

Have you stayed in good enough physical condition to even attempt a Dall sheep hunt?

If you haven’t figured it out, you have to be both physically and fiscally able to do these types of adventures!

Keyboard princesses do exactly that while others are making it happen!

I may not be the wealthy but I’m damn sure not bitter!

From: DanaC
27-Nov-22
Rocky, I'm not 'bitter' but when Mitt Romney ran for POTUS it was revealed that his tax rate was lower than mine. I thought then, and still think, that that is bullshit.

PS I invested enough in an IRA and 401-k so my retirement is pretty stress-free. Not wealthy but not weeping either.

From: DConcrete
27-Nov-22
I think it’s bullshit too Dana!!!

But I also happen to think income taxes are total horse shit too!!!!

So….for me, I’d say, remove your’s and his!!

And yes that’s how I feel.

27-Nov-22
"Rocky, I'm not 'bitter' but when Mitt Romney ran for POTUS it was revealed that his tax rate was lower than mine. "

thats because the vast majority of romneys income was capital gains...not ordinary income. his capital gains rate is exactly the same as your capital gains rate. you have fallen for liberal class envy hype.

"Big businesses are NOT 'you and me' - they're executives and major stockholders. You know, those people who hire tax specialists as well as lobbyists. Who vote themselves stock options and huge bonuses to go with their tax breaks."

"PS I invested enough in an IRA and 401-k so my retirement is pretty stress-free."

hypocrisy much?

27-Nov-22
...and by the way...iras and 401k are actually tax breaks that some greedy ass lobbyists and politicians had a hand in creating. i guess your stress free retirement should be thanking them for that.

27-Nov-22
Trapper great one!

From: Rocky D
27-Nov-22
DanaC, have you ever figured your actual tax rate?

I remember when Obama had problems naming cabinet members and czars because many had issues with the IRS.

Amor fati

From: Rocky D
27-Nov-22

From: sundowner
27-Nov-22
Trump's next greatest accomplishment was putting 3 conservative justices on the SCOTUS.

From: Rocky D
27-Nov-22
“ The Abraham Accords are a series of joint normalization statements between Israel, the United Arab Emirates, and Bahrain, effective since September 15, 2020.[1] Mediated by the United States, the initial announcement of August 13, 2020, concerned only Israel and the United Arab Emirates before the announcement of a follow-up agreement between Israel and Bahrain on September 11, 2020. On September 15, 2020, the official signing ceremony for the Abraham Accords was hosted by the United States at the White House.[2] As part of the dual agreements, both the United Arab Emirates and Bahrain recognized Israel's sovereignty, enabling the establishment of full diplomatic relations.” WIKI

This was an epic achievement that doesn’t even get mentioned!

From: Rocky D
27-Nov-22

From: bobbinhood
27-Nov-22
IT'S FUNNY! TRUMP Serves his term and DONATES his wages You can BET that FUKHEAD BIDEN would NEVER THINK of THAT! He's to STUPID!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! TRUMP 2024!!!!!!!!!!

From: 2Wild Bill
27-Nov-22
B I G DanaC,

There you go, happy now Dana?

It's called covetousness, and you got it.

From: TrapperKayak
27-Nov-22
Trump had more positive accomplishments for the US and our allies that all the other presidents combined since Reagan and before that from JFK until Reagan. I don't give a damn about his style, his taxes, or his mouth. He made huge beneficial change to this country and the countries we deal with and now its all washed away by these GD fools called Liberals. The sick part is there are so many of these brainwashed fools in this country that votes these IDIOTS IN. Its appalling and the work of evil, period. BIDEN and Libs et.al. is/are the devil's puppet(s). Please God, let us vote them out in '24. AMEN! TK

From: sundowner
27-Nov-22
TrapperKayak: "Trump had more positive accomplishments for the US and our allies that all the other presidents combined since Reagan and before that from JFK until Reagan. I don't give a damn about his style, his taxes, or his mouth. He made huge beneficial change to this country and the countries we deal with and now its all washed away by these GD fools called Liberals. The sick part is there are so many of these brainwashed fools in this country that votes these IDIOTS IN. Its appalling and the work of evil, period. BIDEN and Libs et.al. is/are the devil's puppet(s). Please God, let us vote them out in '24. AMEN! TK"

Amen again, Sir!

29-Nov-22
"It's called covetousness, and you got it."

the politics of envy is a tool of the left...theyve been stoking those flames for generations.

From: HDE
29-Nov-22
Evidently they the "insurrectionist idiots didn’t hear the peaceful part. He also didn’t try to stop the riots until hours after they started.

Just more excuses."

"I've thought a lot about blowing up the Whitehouse". Who's the insurrectionists? Seems like it's the donkey party to me...

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