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Who switched from compound to X-Bow?
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Contributors to this thread:
Don T. Lewis 27-Nov-22
drycreek 27-Nov-22
Cheesehead Mike 27-Nov-22
Don T. Lewis 27-Nov-22
BowJunkie 27-Nov-22
Woods Walker 27-Nov-22
Don T. Lewis 27-Nov-22
Don T. Lewis 27-Nov-22
Don T. Lewis 27-Nov-22
sundowner 27-Nov-22
Bigdog 21 27-Nov-22
Cheesehead Mike 27-Nov-22
[email protected] 27-Nov-22
bowhunt 27-Nov-22
bghunter 28-Nov-22
Bigdog 21 28-Nov-22
timex 28-Nov-22
x-man 28-Nov-22
Missouribreaks 28-Nov-22
sticksender 28-Nov-22
Jebediah 28-Nov-22
Catscratch 28-Nov-22
Beendare 28-Nov-22
Missouribreaks 28-Nov-22
Don T. Lewis 28-Nov-22
Brotsky 28-Nov-22
Missouribreaks 28-Nov-22
Live2Hunt 28-Nov-22
Bowbender 28-Nov-22
BoggsBowhunts 28-Nov-22
WhattheFOC 28-Nov-22
Live2Hunt 28-Nov-22
Mint 28-Nov-22
Brian M. 28-Nov-22
PECO2 28-Nov-22
DanaC 28-Nov-22
APauls 28-Nov-22
WhattheFOC 28-Nov-22
deerhunter72 28-Nov-22
Shuteye 28-Nov-22
DanaC 28-Nov-22
Bake 28-Nov-22
Missouribreaks 28-Nov-22
PECO2 28-Nov-22
Live2Hunt 28-Nov-22
PECO2 28-Nov-22
Gun 28-Nov-22
Shuteye 28-Nov-22
Bigdog 21 28-Nov-22
WhattheFOC 28-Nov-22
Mule Power 28-Nov-22
midwest 28-Nov-22
WhattheFOC 28-Nov-22
[email protected] 28-Nov-22
Inshart 28-Nov-22
buckhammer 28-Nov-22
dnovo 28-Nov-22
Zim 29-Nov-22
Boris 30-Nov-22
Blood 30-Nov-22
carcus 30-Nov-22
Bowbender 30-Nov-22
Brotsky 30-Nov-22
[email protected] 30-Nov-22
Live2Hunt 30-Nov-22
WhattheFOC 30-Nov-22
Jethro 30-Nov-22
KHNC 30-Nov-22
Bowbender 30-Nov-22
Jethro 30-Nov-22
LUNG$HOT 30-Nov-22
Bowbender 30-Nov-22
Jethro 30-Nov-22
Live2Hunt 30-Nov-22
Bowbender 30-Nov-22
deerhunter72 30-Nov-22
Live2Hunt 30-Nov-22
deerhunter72 30-Nov-22
Missouribreaks 30-Nov-22
x-man 30-Nov-22
SteveB 30-Nov-22
GDx 30-Nov-22
Missouribreaks 30-Nov-22
[email protected] 30-Nov-22
Machino 30-Nov-22
Don T. Lewis 30-Nov-22
Groundhunter 30-Nov-22
WhattheFOC 01-Dec-22
Live2Hunt 01-Dec-22
70lbDraw 01-Dec-22
Live2Hunt 01-Dec-22
wyobullshooter 01-Dec-22
Don T. Lewis 03-Dec-22
shade mt 05-Dec-22
Cornpone 05-Dec-22
Sapper1980 05-Dec-22
shade mt 05-Dec-22
Live2Hunt 05-Dec-22
Rocky D 05-Dec-22
Sapper1980 05-Dec-22
jjs 05-Dec-22
x-man 05-Dec-22
Live2Hunt 05-Dec-22
Missouribreaks 05-Dec-22
Slate 05-Dec-22
Missouribreaks 05-Dec-22
greenmountain 05-Dec-22
[email protected] 05-Dec-22
x-man 05-Dec-22
Live2Hunt 05-Dec-22
x-man 05-Dec-22
shade mt 05-Dec-22
12yards 05-Dec-22
Corax_latrans 05-Dec-22
Rocky D 05-Dec-22
shade mt 05-Dec-22
Live2Hunt 06-Dec-22
Archer Ontario 09-Dec-22
wyobullshooter 09-Dec-22
Live2Hunt 09-Dec-22
Missouribreaks 09-Dec-22
x-man 09-Dec-22
Bowbender 09-Dec-22
[email protected] 09-Dec-22
Bowfreak 09-Dec-22
x-man 09-Dec-22
Michael 09-Dec-22
[email protected] 09-Dec-22
Bowbender 09-Dec-22
shade mt 09-Dec-22
Archer Ontario 10-Dec-22
Bigdog 21 10-Dec-22
shade mt 10-Dec-22
shade mt 10-Dec-22
[email protected] 10-Dec-22
LBshooter 15-Dec-22
wyobullshooter 15-Dec-22
shade mt 15-Dec-22
[email protected] 15-Dec-22
deerhunter72 15-Dec-22
Missouribreaks 15-Dec-22
Live2Hunt 15-Dec-22
Screwball 15-Dec-22
WhattheFOC 15-Dec-22
8point 15-Dec-22
deerhunter72 15-Dec-22
[email protected] 15-Dec-22
Dikndirt 15-Dec-22
Dikndirt 15-Dec-22
LBshooter 16-Dec-22
Quinn @work 16-Dec-22
wyobullshooter 16-Dec-22
DanaC 16-Dec-22
Rocky D 16-Dec-22
Missouribreaks 16-Dec-22
Missouribreaks 16-Dec-22
DanaC 16-Dec-22
WhattheFOC 16-Dec-22
Missouribreaks 16-Dec-22
Live2Hunt 16-Dec-22
[email protected] 16-Dec-22
Missouribreaks 16-Dec-22
Bowfreak 16-Dec-22
WhattheFOC 16-Dec-22
Dikndirt 16-Dec-22
WhattheFOC 16-Dec-22
WhattheFOC 16-Dec-22
From: Don T. Lewis
27-Nov-22
And doesn’t plan on going back to the compound. Tell us why you like the X- Bow better. And what one you have. And what broad head you like to shoot off it.

From: drycreek
27-Nov-22
Probably no help here but I stopped bowhunting with a compound when I became unable to hold the bow steady enough to group tight enough to suit myself. . I bought a crossbow, killed a turkey with it, kept it a year or two and sold it. I just couldn’t drag that thing through the woods. Good luck to you whatever you decide to do.

27-Nov-22
Who switched from Bowsite to X-Bowsite and doesn't plan on going back?

From: Don T. Lewis
27-Nov-22
dry creek Nothing wrong with carrying a camera or a hiking stick. Enjoying the scenery never gets old. Wish you the best of luck too.

From: BowJunkie
27-Nov-22
Crossgun? Never have, never will.

From: Woods Walker
27-Nov-22
I switched from a compgun to a stickbow, does that count? ;-)

From: Don T. Lewis
27-Nov-22
A lot of switching going on woodswalker. Yes that counts!;)

From: Don T. Lewis
27-Nov-22
A lot of switching going on woodswalker. Yes that counts!;)

From: Don T. Lewis
27-Nov-22
Bowjunkie, what’s the difference what hunting tool you use. Some guys like to hunt with a 3030 Winchester;)

From: sundowner
27-Nov-22
I switched for a while when I fell from a ladder and badly dislocated my right shoulder. Six months of rehab and back to 55lb Elite compound.

I used a Mission xbow with 175 lbs draw weight. Wasp JakHammer 100 grain three blade heads on Mission bolts. Lighted nocks. Thermal night vision scope.

Had a blast killing Texas hogs with that thing.

From: Bigdog 21
27-Nov-22
I ask same thing when compounds came out. Anyone shooting one of them contractions. Then in late 90s bought one and about 15 more since then. Last year got my first deer with x bow yes I will use again. When I am not using my Black widow are hoyt.

27-Nov-22
I think the difference is this is Bowsite and for the 23 years I've been here it's been geared toward vertical bows. There hasn't been a lot of threads geared toward rifles, shotguns, spears, atlatls, air guns, crossbows, etc.

27-Nov-22
Probably won't find many that switched for good. That means they don't bowhunt so probably aren't hanging around here. Obviously a ton of people have switched, they just probably don't hang around a bowhunting site any more.

Plenty of nonbowhunting topics here but most posters still bowhunt even if discussing rifles, trucks, politics or fishing.

From: bowhunt
27-Nov-22
Mike….

You come to bowsite to discuss bowhunting?

With a bow and arrow?

Just joking, me too!

From: bghunter
28-Nov-22
Very interesting thread. I had corneal transplant in Feb. Well long story short, not sure I can shoot a compound anymore, due the fact that no one makes pins large enough for me to see. I am going to try some options to hopefully stay with my compound. However if not may have to go to Xbow or not archery hunt. Only time will tell.

From: Bigdog 21
28-Nov-22
BG hunter always bare bow pretty simple ones you get use to it no sites and finger release. Its how I hunt. And can shoot out to 40 and 50 yards, it is easier done with a longer bow 40" works good . But nothing wrong with going x bow.

From: timex
28-Nov-22
I moved to an 800 acre farm in the mid 90s. Deer were everywhere. I gave up gun hunting. Then in 2000 went trad bow only. Then after a heart attack in 2010 went back to a compound then in 2012 got permission on a place that requires me to kill a minimum of 20 does per season so went back to gun hunting. I say do whatever ya damn well want to do and myself personally could care less what others think. A freezer full of venison is my priority and which weapon was used to put it there really doesn't matter to me.

From: x-man
28-Nov-22
Well, this stopped being "bow"site when Pat allowed all the stupid political threads.

To me, crossbow threads are a refreshing change...

28-Nov-22
Where legal for all, using a scoped and cocked crossbow during archery seasons is something many do, but will not readily admit. The Wisconsin forum is a common place for crossbow hunters and enablers to pose as bow and arrow hunters.

From: sticksender
28-Nov-22
My local archery dealer told me he was shocked at how many former archery hunters quit bow-hunting and picked up the scoped crossbow, as soon as they were legalized here a few years back. I had assumed it would be mainly the former gun-only hunters who would adopt the crossbow, due to the favorable hunt season dates that were opened up to them. But they weren't the only ones apparently. And it continues still. He has always been an outspoken critic of having them used in our archery deer seasons here. But basically for business reasons, he made the decision to cave and sell/service them, due to the extreme demand, and to the loss of business that would occur if he did not.

From: Jebediah
28-Nov-22
I chase down my prey and kill it with my teeth. Projectile hunting is for sissies.

From: Catscratch
28-Nov-22
It's been interesting to watch; stick-n-string were the main group at first but then the compound came out and took over. Still lots of traditional guys but they are no longer the mainstream... they are the fringe, the extreme, the minority. They segregate themselves from "bowhunters" and the majority with their own sites like the leatherwall. Now the same is happening to the compound guys. The new majority is the crossbow and it isn't going to shift back. The compound guys will (already starting to do it) segregate themselves and create groups specific towards themselves while alienating out of the mainstream. I suppose this cycle happens in a lot of aspects of life, just interesting to watch it happen to something you pay attention to.

From: Beendare
28-Nov-22
Hopefully…my body holds out to where I never have to go to a crossbow.

28-Nov-22
I am sure this thread is NOT about those with medical issues using a crossbow. It is more about those with a choice, laying down their compound bow for the more efficient and longer ranged scoped crossbow. It is normal for humans to seek the company of like minded individuals, including hunters.

From: Don T. Lewis
28-Nov-22
Well there you go. Some guys are liking this thread and some guys don’t. I started out with a political thread and it got pulled;) And it was just to show just how really silly they are. Some guys don’t know politics at all. But when they come here they are experts!;). Me personally I don’t care what you use. Atlatal, Speer,self bow ,Long bow, compound, X-bow air rifle or gun. To put venison in your freezers. As long as it’s legal. There are a lot less hunters now then I was a kid. So what ever you hunt with. Try and be positive about it. And pass it on to a youngster and keep hunting around for the up coming generations. Keep them sharp and shoot straight.

From: Brotsky
28-Nov-22
On a similar note...who has switched from women to men?

28-Nov-22
Whatever, as long as it is legal.

From: Live2Hunt
28-Nov-22
I am one that switched back to traditional from a compound and will never go back. I would recommend that for any archer. Now, this thread should read "who quit bowhunting and started xgun hunting"? One is not a bow and should never be associated with archery/bowhunting. Legal? yes, should it have been? No. So, I don't care when people say it's legal, let them use it. I'm saying it should have never been legal. Here in WI they did it. It is 2 separate entities on one tag. They need to reduce the length of the xgun season here to only October and get them out of the main rut.

From: Bowbender
28-Nov-22
"Tell us why you like the X- Bow better."

I dunno... But ask the additional 125K "bowhunters" PA has added since they were legalized in 2009. One of the biggest reasons cited on the FB groups is "I'm so busy, I don't have time to practice". So basically it's for those that wanna be bowhunters, without the effort. And given the exponetial increase on those pages for assistance with tracking dogs, "Made a great shot, good blood for the first 800 yards..." it would appear they suck with a xbow as well.

28-Nov-22
Lol Brotsky, I got a good chuckle out of that one

From: WhattheFOC
28-Nov-22
Brotsky - coffee came out my nose. Thanks and good morning!

From: Live2Hunt
28-Nov-22
You know Brotski, I quit watching mainstream TV for that very reason years ago. I don't need to get into that type of discussion here now!!! Funny though.

From: Mint
28-Nov-22
there was an article on Filed & Stream magazine website from the VP of PSE saying how he regrets pushing the crossbow to be allowed in regular archery seasons since it did the exact opposite of what they expected. It didn't pull the gun hunters into archery but actually had compound hunters switch to crossbow. What really concerned him was that the average compound bow hunter buys a bunch of gadgets for the bow and buys a new bow about every three years along with new arrows chasing better accuracy and more speed while the crossbow hunter buys one crossbow and a dozen arrows and won't by another for ten years. They are like the average gun hunter that will take it out before the season site it in and are done. He is now all for a separate crossbow season instead of full inclusion to the archery season.

From: Brian M.
28-Nov-22
In 2005, after 18 years of using a compound, I bought a Bear Super Kodiak recurve. My shots have always been under twenty yards so I thought I could do that with a stick. After missing a buck at 12 yards, I went back to my compound for three years. 2009 was first full year of traditional. 2010 had shoulder surgery, doc said no recurve but I could use compound. After healing up, I've been using trad ever since. Added a longbow too. I gave my compound to a friend around 8 years ago.

I didn't like all the gadgetry of the compound either, and when I dropped it out of a tree and it exploded, I had to bring it to a shop to put it back together. I won't go back to to the pulley bow, and hopefully won't need a crossbow. If low on meat, I just take the rifle.

From: PECO2
28-Nov-22
I hunted with a crossbow in Michigan, I don't care for it. Crossbow/gun is heavy, bulky, clumsy, noisy, pain in the ass to cock and decock, etc. I have said I will never get another and that if I can no longer hunt with a real bow then I will just gun hunt. I like guns.

From: DanaC
28-Nov-22
Switched from compound to recurves in late 90's, no plans to switch. When I can't draw a bow I'm done.

From: APauls
28-Nov-22
Much rather read this thread with semi-interest than all the political/russian crap.

From: WhattheFOC
28-Nov-22
Dana - I just completed the perfect bowhunt for guys who can’t draw their bow anymore. 2 of us, 10 days each in the treestand here in SK … and I didn’t have to draw once.

So when you can’t draw your bow anymore, no need to quit - just hunt with me!

From: deerhunter72
28-Nov-22
Don, bold thread choice but still much better than any political thread. I've used compounds and crossbows and now looking into getting a recurve for next year. I've killed deer with shotguns and pistols. If it's legal and it makes you happy then I won't look down my nose at anyone's choice of weapon.

From: Shuteye
28-Nov-22
Switched when I got old. I have a Ravin crossbow and it sends the bolt to the deer at 425 FPS. Haven't had a bolt stay in a deer yet, even the one I shot facing me. Went in the front and out the back. I use 100 grain Jak Hammers just like I did with my compound bow. Have killed deer with the Ravin from tree stand, ground blind and still hunting. Have shot deer at 50 yards and could probably do it at 100 yards with no problem. I love it. Have killed lots of deer with a recurve, starting in the 50's and over 100 with a compound bow. 72 of the deer were shot with Jak Hammers.

From: DanaC
28-Nov-22
Trevor, just did one of my famous no-see-um hunts this morning. ;-)

From: Bake
28-Nov-22
My momma taught me that if I didn't have anything nice to say, that I shouldn't say anything at all :)

28-Nov-22
I have used longbows, flatbows and recurves for 56 hunting seasons. When I can no longer draw a stickbow, I am done hunting during archery seasons.

From: PECO2
28-Nov-22
"Have shot deer at 50 yards and could probably do it at 100 yards with no problem. " I guess that is OK, 100 plus yard kill shots in archery season? So why stop there? Any weapon for all seasons, that is where we are heading.

From: Live2Hunt
28-Nov-22
Shuteye seems to have answered the question as to why they need to limit season lengths for xguns.

From: PECO2
28-Nov-22
Booo hooooo for PSE and the rest of the companies pushing for crossbows in archery season. They pushed for it because they are greedy. They made a lot of money fast, and now they aren't selling anything. Tough shit, make your bed, lay in it you get no sympathy from me.

From: Gun
28-Nov-22
I don't look at "Bow"site much but this caught my eye. I started with a Recurve in the 60's. Switched to a Compound in the 70's when they became the "thing". Blew three of them up over two years and went back to a Recurve. I don't consider a Compound a Bow. That's just me, I don't care what everyone else does.

I've had nerve issues in my right shoulder, neck arm and hand for the last four years. Neurologists can't figure it out. I switched to lefty. Then two years ago I slipped on some ice and tore two tendons (one complete) on the same shoulder. While waiting for surgery I taught myself to shoot right handed again using a mouth tab. I shot three deer last year.

I had to wait a year for surgery, with tendon repair and total rotator cuff reconstruction and a cadaver graft. Had my surgery in March. Two months in a braced sling. Still doing Rehab. I shot my best Mule Deer Buck this year and a 3 yr old Bull Moose using a Bear TD @ 40#.

I'm starting to pull normal right handed again just stretching my muscles. I should be somewhat back to a decent hunting weight by spring. Praise the Lord.

As has been said, when I can't hunt trad anymore, I'm done. There's always fishing.

From: Shuteye
28-Nov-22

Shuteye's embedded Photo
Shuteye's embedded Photo
Where I live the limit is 15 does and two bucks so what difference does it make what weapon you use. Farmers get permits to shoot deer after the season closes and shoot lots of deer. They are really hard on the soybean farmers and eat acres of soy beans. Look in my back yard yesterday during a pouring rain in the middle of the day. BTW, there were more deer behind the shed to the left. That is the cover crop in my back yard garden.

From: Bigdog 21
28-Nov-22
It's all archery arches a arrow to a target just new technology added. Just like when the compound came along and trail and cell cams. Release, fiber optic lighted sites it will never end. Carbon arrows mechanical heads. And xbow does a better job . Are you wouldn't be crying about it.

From: WhattheFOC
28-Nov-22
Sounds like someone meant to log in to crossbowsite.com

Damned spellcheck

From: Mule Power
28-Nov-22
Brotsky I always figured you’d be fun to party with but now I’m having second thoughts!

From: midwest
28-Nov-22
Brotsky, I told you I was considering going bi. Chances of getting laid automatically double.

From: WhattheFOC
28-Nov-22
If you don’t swing both ways, you’re missing half the action.

28-Nov-22
I don't have any interest on hunting with compounds or crossbows. My buddy who is 30 years my senior has an unrepairable rotator cuff issue and is down into the high 30s/low 40s with his longbow. He's in a stand on the river right now. I'll bowhunt as long as I can with trad gear during bow season. I enjoy an occasional rifle, muzzleloader or handgun hunt as well so maybe do that some more when the day comes.

From: Inshart
28-Nov-22
Bake, my mother taught me the same lesson. To each their own, use what is legal and makes you happy.

From: buckhammer
28-Nov-22
When the day comes that I am no longer physically able to hunt with a recurve/compound will be the day I go afield carrying only a camera.

From: dnovo
28-Nov-22
For the guys who switched because they don't have time to practice, it's all about priorities. I started my own construction business, we raised 4 boys playing all kinds of sports and I worked my farm. I always found time to shoot my bow. I grew up shooting a recurve, switched to a compound for 3 years from 1977-1980, sold the compound and have used a longbow since. Shooting a longbow requires practice, a lot of it to maintain form and muscles. If you're dedicated to bowhunting, it's easy to do. When I can't shoot my longbow, I might get a flintlock or just go fishing.

From: Zim
29-Nov-22
I am seriously debating buying a crossgun next year, but only because I am hunting an earn-a-buck property and am tired of glassing heads for BB’s. It would strictly be for my doe, then I’d switch back to my vertical. Having an xgun with decent scope would eliminate the binocular fumbling. Otherwise, I am adamantly against corrupt politician Jerry Costello’s crapification of Illinois. Under the old regs I would have been eligible anyway as I just turned 63. I want to buck hunt ASAP. Sick of watching xgun packin dudes from Mississippi, Louisiana, Michigan & Pennsylvania buck hunting on day two while I’m fumbling with glass for a week+. Never again.

From: Boris
30-Nov-22
I am retired. Worked 30 years in nursing. DON'T ever say never. I've seen the best of the best and the worst of the worst.

From: Blood
30-Nov-22
Yeah. You won’t find guys that come on this thread and are proud to use a cross bow over a pile of corn and tout it. But they’ll post up a pic of their buck they killed with no info on how they got it…..and people will say “congrats. Awesome. Way to go” That’s how it is in CT. There are more cross bow guys than regular bow guys now. :(

From: carcus
30-Nov-22
My father switched over about 8 years ago when he couldn't draw his compound anymore, he has a new 10 point, very nice xbow, I'll switch over when I have to, IMO they seem like a lesser weapon, only advantage is you don't have to draw. I would have never gotten my buck this year with one as it required a quick second shot, which isn't happening with a xbow

From: Bowbender
30-Nov-22
"IMO they seem like a lesser weapon, only advantage is you don't have to draw."

Ya, it's such a lesser weapon that PA has added 50% more bowhunters AND doubled their buck harvest since they were legalized in 2009. Make no mistake, a cocked, tripod mounted, scoped xbow is NOT a lesser weapon.

From: Brotsky
30-Nov-22
Bowbender, technically I guess they are a lesser weapon. They do make you a lesser man if you use one outside of being physically unable to use a vertical bow, then you do what you gotta do to stay in the game.

30-Nov-22
PA didn't add 50% more bowhunters. They added 50% more hunters to bow season. Less people bowhunt PA now. Only a third of the people in archery season are bowhunters now.

From: Live2Hunt
30-Nov-22
"I would have never gotten my buck this year with one as it required a quick second shot, which isn't happening with a xbow" Perhaps you have not seen the new 2 shot xgun on the market.

From: WhattheFOC
30-Nov-22
A buddy showed up at the house a couple years ago to show me his new ‘bow’. He knew I was in to archery and wanted some pointers. To my surprise, he pulls out a crossbow - and 4 shots later, he is drilling the bullseye at 20.

He has permission to hunt some great property in a bowzone (xbows allowed). He kills a big buck every year, despite not hunting much. He waits for cell-cam pics while laying on the couch. He puts a nice euro mount on the wall every year. He won’t eat venison, so he takes the buck to the food bank - at least when the coyotes don’t get it first. Pictures posted on FaceBook of the buck killed with ‘bow’, but the xbow not in the frame.

I’d be lying if I said this doesn’t rub me the wrong way. Does this make me a camo-Karen? (ps - my question is rhetorical … that means I don’t give a shit what you think :)

From: Jethro
30-Nov-22
PA's overall buck harvest hasn't doubled either.

From: KHNC
30-Nov-22
I do what I want now that im not on a factory archery team. First thing I did when I didnt renew my contract was buy a Ravin R26. I also gun hunt. SC has a long season. August to January. If i want to go out and kill one with my Muzzle loader, I will. Sometimes I take the Ravin. My target buck I just killed, I did it with my Revolt X Compound. My huge elk I shot in the elbow in September, I did it with my Revolt X. Crossbow is legal in Wyoming. If i could do that one over , you can damn sure bet Id have my Ravin in my hand for it. Very likely Id have a dead 320" class bull elk. This year I have killed two bucks with Crossbow, 1 with Muzzleloader and 1 with Compound. Killed one doe with Compound and 1 with a suppressed rifle. (7mm-08)

I guess im a full time crossbow guy now. :)

From: Bowbender
30-Nov-22
"PA's overall buck harvest hasn't doubled either."

Actually it did.

"Bowhunters accounted for over a third of Pennsylvania’s 2020-21 overall deer harvest taking 160,480 deer (80,130 bucks and 80,350 antlerless deer) with either bows or crossbows. The 2019-20 archery harvest was 145,908 (74,190 bucks and 71,718 antlerless deer)."

Note the ~80K archery buck buck kill.

https://www.media.pa.gov/pages/game-commission-details.aspx?newsid=459

Harvest data from 2010-11 is from the map. Still looking for the actual report. Found it before when this sh!t comes up. The TOTAL buck kill in 2010-11 was ~123K. Given that approx 1/3 of our buck kill comes during archery, well 1/3 of 123K is ~41K. Like I said, doubled. As soon as I find the actual PGC breakdown, I'll post it.

Link to news article that referenced PGC harvest data for 2010-11. The archery harvest is broken down in article. Bottom line? Bowhunters killed ~36K buck in 2010-11. Pretty sure 80K is more than double than that.

https://www.mcall.com/sports/penn-state/mc-xpm-2011-03-08-pa-deer-harvest-2010-11-20110308-story.html

From: Jethro
30-Nov-22
Overall buck harvest is taken by all weapons. It hasn't doubled.

From: LUNG$HOT
30-Nov-22
What’s an “X-bow”? ;-)

From: Bowbender
30-Nov-22
The overall all buck harvest HAS increased and the archery buck kill HAS doubled. Saying it hasn't doesn't make it so. The data is right there. I can't understand it for you.

Overall buck harvest in 2020-2021 was 174,780. Overall buck harvest in 2010-2011 was 122,930. 174,780 is bigger than 122,930. That means it increased. By 42%

From: Jethro
30-Nov-22
Thanks for understanding it for me. You've shown the overall buck harvest has not doubled. Just what I said.

From: Live2Hunt
30-Nov-22
Have they been made legal in states for archery season? Yes. Should they have been in the archery season? No. Legal, fine, just remember if that is what you are using you are no longer a bow hunter. If you are an able bodied, non-elderly person that wants the easy way out, without the original challenge of using bow and arrow as was allowed, so be it. But again, don't call yourselves bowhunters.

From: Bowbender
30-Nov-22
"You've shown the overall buck harvest has not doubled. Just what I said."

And you've shown you're reading comprehension still needs work. I never said the overall harvest increased. I stated that the archery buck kill doubled. Which it did. Since we were discussing xbows/archery seasons and I referenced the increase in bowhunters with an increase in archery buck harvest, it should have been clear it was refering to archery harvests. Oh, well some see being obtuse as a virtue.

From: deerhunter72
30-Nov-22
I guess now your choice of weapon defines your status as a man. That's quite a stretch. To me, being a man has little to do with your hunting prowess. Society in general has moved on from having to hunt to provide basic needs. Just my opinion, but a man should first fear God and then provide for, protect and serve his family. If I had to hunt in order to provide daily food for my family, then I wouldn't be too picky about what weapon I used to get the job done.

From: Live2Hunt
30-Nov-22
"I guess now your choice of weapon defines your status as a man." If your referring to my statement, wrong, did not come close to saying that.

From: deerhunter72
30-Nov-22
No, it was an earlier post.

30-Nov-22
In any event, bowhunter numbers are declining, while those hunting with a scoped and cocked long range crossbow are significantly increasing.

From: x-man
30-Nov-22
42% is less than half of "doubled" just saying...

From: SteveB
30-Nov-22
I don't use crossbow (yet), but have no issue at all with those who do. Lots of self-righteous here who don't have an issue with using technology on their own compound bows, but for some reason think they are purists. Not even close.....just ask a trad shooter. Some here even use releases, drop away rests and adjustable sights if you can imagine! Even mechanical broadheads! Geez!! What's this world coming to??

Shoot whatever you want as long as it's legal. The older you get and the more life happens to you, the less they will judge. And the less you will care what they think. Just keep hunting!

From: GDx
30-Nov-22
everyone in michigan seems to have switched. sad

30-Nov-22
Yes, very few bowhunters left in the once great bowhunting state of Michigan. Far more bolts than arrows being used, far more.

30-Nov-22
"Shoot whatever you want as long as it's legal"

Amen. And if its not legal, lobby politicians until you force your way into a season you want to hunt.

From: Machino
30-Nov-22
Whoever deleted my thread you still need to ask yourself. How is my compound different than an x-bow? Its really not. The sights and releases and triggers and rubber gadgets with plastic arrows with dumb broadheads…. Its not archery. You should be in the same season as x-bows. The people with real bows can have archery season back. To hell with your long shots and seldom practice. Make Archery Great Again. Get closer. Shoot traditional. Compounds aren’t archery and neither is bowsite.

From: Don T. Lewis
30-Nov-22
I wonder how many will switch back again or maybe try a stickbow

From: Groundhunter
30-Nov-22
I was injured on Oct 20th. I went from.long bow to a Ravin r10 crossbow. I thsnk God everyday I can enjoy our world. I am 73 and so far have 25 percent of my right arm. Doctors tomorrow again. With a little luck in maybe a year I will be able to pull a bow again. What many of you worry about is amazing

From: WhattheFOC
01-Dec-22
Machino - the biggest difference between a crossbow and vertical bows is that verticals have to be drawn in the presence of the animal. To me that’s the biggest challenge in bowhunting and there’s a clear line between the two. Did I ‘change your mind’ ??

We all choose to draw that line in different spots. There’s probably a longbow guy somewhere snubbing his nose at those newfangled recurves.

I have nothing but respect for the trad guys. I will probably go trad after I retire - lots of time to practice while yelling at kids to get off my grass.

From: Live2Hunt
01-Dec-22
So, in simple terms, a compound/recurve/longbow are drawn to shoot. An Xgun is shot like a what?

From: 70lbDraw
01-Dec-22
“If you are an able bodied, non-elderly person that wants the easy way out, without the original challenge of using bow and arrow as was allowed, so be it. But again, don't call yourselves bowhunters.”

“To hell with your long shots and seldom practice. Make Archery Great Again. Get closer. Shoot traditional. Compounds aren’t archery and neither is bowsite.”

Lol! So, what you’re really saying is, If you don’t Bowhunt like me…you’re not a Bowhunter???

Judgmental much?!?!

Talk like that is no better than the political threads. Y’all piss n moan about the topics that are discussed, yet you have no problem in giving a verbal beat down to people that don’t meet your personal standards of outdoor recreation.

That’s an excellent retention strategy for keeping folks interested in hunting and contributing to the sport we all enjoy.

From: Live2Hunt
01-Dec-22
70LB, keeping into hunting? yes, this is a BOWSITE though. We want to keep BOWHUNTING strong with a BOW!!!

01-Dec-22

wyobullshooter's embedded Photo
wyobullshooter's embedded Photo
“So, in simple terms, a compound/recurve/longbow are drawn to shoot. An Xgun is shot like a what?”

I’ve yet to see anything other than crossbow marketing touting “Meet Your Next Rifle”.

From: Don T. Lewis
03-Dec-22
Thanks everyone for all the input. I found this thread to be very interesting;)

From: shade mt
05-Dec-22
might as well put some simple truths out here....like it or lump it, its the truth.

First lets get one thing straight, today's modern archer, is a long way from What once was.

WE have morphed from Fred Bear, surplus camo, and Bear kodiak recurve to what we are today.

truth hurts don't it.

We started down this path a long time ago folks, how do you end up with ravin crossbows in archery season?...little bit at a time, one step at a time.

Now that the truth is out....So what? What is the problem?.....Guns are ok but crossbows are not? no i don't think that is it......the problem here is frankly, and truthfully no....they are not a bow plain and simple, not by any stretch of the imagination.

A "bow" in its truest form is a recurve or longbow, a "one stringer".....in time we added wheels and cables and gadgets, and still label it as a "bow".....when in truth the only thing really in common is you still draw it to launch an arrow, but its hardly the same.

But.........it is also not a crossbow.

Anything wrong with crossbows?, nope not a thing. Use one if you please, but there should be limits, and limits are what we don't like in our "me first" society, we want what we want, regardless of the good of all. truthfully i doubt you will see them go away, we should have nipped it in the butt before we opened this door, like many other things in society. Don't let it get a foothold and you won't have a problem. crossbows in archery season are here to stay, best thing we could do is limit the season for them, if we do not, will the gun hunters then cry foul and want more time also? guess we will see. One thing is for certain, we can be our own worst enemies....And while all things might be "lawful"....not all things are good for us. And that goes for archery season and what defines it as well.

From: Cornpone
05-Dec-22
I fell hard on my left shoulder the beginning of June...heard it crunch and knew that wasn't good. Couldn't draw my compound and already had a pronghorn hunt booked. I had offers to loan me a crossbow for the hunt but opted to purchase a Draw-Loc instead. Draw-Loc worked well and now, thankfully, I can shoot my compound again. Draw-Loc waiting in the wings if/when I can't draw my compound in the future.

From: Sapper1980
05-Dec-22
Maybe throw the xguns in with the muzzleloader season.

From: shade mt
05-Dec-22
i doubt to many of us would fault a guy for using a crossbow, when he can't draw his bow back.

The differences here are, When have we crossed the line?...when is it no longer bowhunting? or a bow?

Those of you that switched to crossbows, yea we get it, why not?...sure they are effective, and yea easier, don't bother arguing otherwise that's just stupid.

And No...it's not a bow, why not just come to grips with that and admit it?

Would i hunt with a crossbow?...well sure, same as a gun, a muzzleloader, shotgun, compound, or recurve or longbow.

What i don't do though, is expect to have the same opportunity using various weapons of choice during the archery season right along side the bowhunters....its not a bow, just that simple.

If your a youth, use one, or elderly or disabled, use one. If your a healthy capable adult, sure use one, but i think we need to keep the "bow"....in bow hunting.

Our officials seem to be pretty good at catering to things that are not good as a whole. But that does not mean we have to cave into it....

So when its archery season take the time to practice, it was originally set aside for archers, so be a archer. ... When Taking the easy road we often, miss out and cheat ourselves out of a sense of accomplishment and achievement.

nobody here, has alienated crossbow hunters from archery, we didn't have to.....you did that yourself, when you put away the bow.....

From: Live2Hunt
05-Dec-22
Good words Shade

From: Rocky D
05-Dec-22
Shade, would you be so quick to determine that a compound is not a bow?

A compound is far superior to a long bow and you can effectively shoot the same distances as a crossbow.

These trad bow guys are a helluva lot nicer than I am.

Imagine carrying a stick bow on a Dall Sheep or a spot and stalk mule deer hunt!

I have killed animals with a recurve but I am not a trad guy.

From: Sapper1980
05-Dec-22

Sapper1980's embedded Photo
Sapper1980's embedded Photo

From: jjs
05-Dec-22
Shade, couldn't say it better.

The Bow (recurve/longbow) hunt was never set up by the Game Commission or DNR as a game management tool, unfortunately it has do to the advance or technology in killing success and now with the shoulder, scope, bolt weapon it has push the kill % even more.

Personally, I will not cross the line for a bolt thrower but would use my cap & ball smoke pole.

From: x-man
05-Dec-22
All hunting regardless of the weapon is a privilege not a right. A privilege granted to those who qualify by each state for the sole purpose of game management. Let me repeat that, "for the sole purpose of game management".

The lobbyists who push for herd reduction (mostly Insurance companies) don't care about sport or recreation, they want the animals reduced.

The states only care about revenue and keeping the squeaky wheel greased. The state agencies that set up hunting regulations will do whatever they can to 1. - Increase revenue. 2. - keep the lobbyists off their back. 3. - remember to bring home bread & milk. 4-9. - misc issues. 10. - worry about bow hunters that complain about xbows.

Complaining on a public forum does almost as much good as complaining to your spouse.

From: Live2Hunt
05-Dec-22
x-man, you would be surprised at who reads these forums. Bow hunting was first allowed in WI because of the limited kill that would happen, not a game management tool. The gun seasons were allowed during the time of a deer's life to allow them to reproduce. In WI, that was and is the last week of Nov. Some years you can catch the end of the rut, but most years it is the worst times to hunt deer. Bow hunting was allowed for sport, and a growing number of people wanting to challenge themselves with hunting with a bow. Only recent years it has been called a game management tool mainly for use in metro areas.

05-Dec-22
And, in Wisconsin and Michigan most who now hunt the archery season are not bow hunters at all, they are scoped and cocked long range crossbow hunters. Huge change in dynamics and ease of harvest.

From: Slate
05-Dec-22
Crossbows are here to stay and that’s where the market has gone. It’s what most hunters want. Ain’t nothing going to change that. There is only so much time to hunt so crossbow season runs with most bow seasons. Many seasons overlap. Hunt with what weapon you want and be happy.

05-Dec-22
Yes, scoped crossbows are here to stay. Where legal for all, their use is growing by leaps and bounds. Declining bow hunter numbers in these areas.

05-Dec-22
I have a crossbow. Some body issues don't heal they way you want. I sure do miss my vertical bow. One major pain with the crossbow is it can't legally be transported cocked. I have a decocking bolt that I shoot into a stump at the end of the day. With a vertical bow you simply place your arrow back in your quiver at the end of the day. Since 98 % of my time in the woods is waiting for an animal to come into range there is not a lot of difference. I like to hunt and this tool is one way I can still hunt.

05-Dec-22
The important thing about bow season is to make it as easy as possible. It's what has made bow seasons great.

From: x-man
05-Dec-22
All big game hunting became game management when hunting seasons became a thing. I believe around 150 years ago. You'd be foolish to think they care about the "sport" of it.

From: Live2Hunt
05-Dec-22
X-man, read the history of bowhunting in Wisconsin by Bill Mcarry.

From: x-man
05-Dec-22

x-man's Link

From: shade mt
05-Dec-22
greenmountain....I'm with ya....By all means keep hunting, and yea use a crossbow.

Rocky D...yes i agree compounds do have advantages over recurves longbows etc...and yes in the right hands they certainly have a range advantage. I hunt with longbows and recurves, this season was tough, on two occasions i had really nice mature buck just out of range for me...35 yds, just to far for me. Lots of compound shooters would have filled their tag on those buck. As it was i shot a buck not as nice, on the 2nd to last day, 20 yds give or take.

But a compound must still be drawn. A crossbow on the other hand, you can use a rest, no need to draw, just flip off the safety, line up the crosshair, and pull the trigger.

My biggest pieve, is not actually the crossbow, but the mentality behind it. Just as compounds took over archery, will crossbows now also become the new norm?....will compounds become the new "trad" ?......that is sad. How far will we go until one day we lose the definition of "archery" ? Will "archers" become a thing of the past, forever lost, ?

Not in this household, crossbows are here to stay i agree. But long live the "archer"

From: 12yards
05-Dec-22
I could probably qualify for a disability crossbow permit. My bow shoulder is a mess. I'm often in my tree and if its cold sit and wonder if I'll get drawn back if a shooter comes by me. But I'll keep going down in draw weight and pick my shots accordingly before I use a crossbow. Just wouldn't be the same to me. I've got friends that have switched to crossbows as it's now legal in MN if you are 60+ years old. In fact I'll be eligible next fall. But I have no desire. I'll keep vertical and have my shoulder replaced before I give up. Then I don't know what I'd do. Maybe just hunt gun seasons and fish in the fall. Or maybe I'd give one a try. Don't know. But I don't think my deer hunting desire would be as high going to a crossbow.

05-Dec-22
Shocking, isn’t it? Very clearly, the majority of participants in “archery” seasons were participating opportunistically, and really only there for the extra days and tags. Now that they have been offered an easier way to participate, they are simply seeking the path of least resistance.

And guess what? Most compound shooters seem resent the intrusion on “their” BOW season….

No irony there.

From: Rocky D
05-Dec-22
“ Will "archers" become a thing of the past, forever lost, ?”

Hunters numbers have been going down so I can only assume that bowhunters will do likewise.

I wished that hunting organizations would team up with manufacturers and try to promote archery and hunting as a lifestyle.

From: shade mt
05-Dec-22
I agree with that Rocky, and at least here in our family it is a lifestyle. Not just a sport, not a hobby, but a way of life.

From: Live2Hunt
06-Dec-22
And guess what? Most compound shooters seem resent the intrusion on “their” BOW season…. At least they are using a BOW!!!!. So, what if I take my recurve, put a high dollar sight on it, a drop away rest, a D-loop and used a release, is it still a bow? Shoot like a bow? Can I shoot it like my compound? Accurate? Both operate the same don't they. Now, my guns well you shoot them like a gun, I don't and never will have a xgun, but do they shoot like a bow or a gun? Well, a gun because they have a gun stock. Yes, it was set up as a BOW season, not a GUN season.

09-Dec-22
I have bowhunted ever since I was 14 I’m 50 now I was a sponsored shooter and an active 3 D shooter I was a guide I have harvested Moose Bear Deer Caribou Turkey Coyotes All with my compound , I have had health issues and had to switch to a crossbow I can’t believe how ignorant people are don’t put yourself on a high horse because you shoot a compound , it’s unbelievable I physically can’t pull a bow back anymore So I enjoy hunting with a crossbow What upsets me even more is a website I loved and religiously followed now belittles me because I have to shoot a crossbow ? And wonder why we are losing battles to the antis we are too busy telling everyone what to shoot ?

09-Dec-22
Ontario, I’ve yet to see anyone criticize or belittle someone for using a crossbow because they’re physically unable to hunt with a compound. Ever. It’s been made very clear that any criticism is directed at those that are completely capable of shooting a compound yet choose to shoot a crossbow during archery season.

From: Live2Hunt
09-Dec-22
wyobull X2

09-Dec-22
I have never seen anyone belittled for using a crossbow because of legitimate health reasons.

From: x-man
09-Dec-22
I've had both shoulders surgically repaired in the last five years. I couldn't find a crossbow to "borrow" so I bought one. I've shot four deer with it. They are not really an advantage for the style of hunting I do. They are awkward, heavy, loud and worst of all, I can't tell where I hit the deer. Three of the four died within sight.

The fourth (buck) was a perfect entry as it turned out but, the bolt deflected on a rib and exited out just behind the ribcage on the off-side. Only one lung and the liver. When we found him the next morning he was still warm.

Even with lighted nocks I was only able to find three of the four bolts. Too much speed and power IMO. The one that I did find was 95% under ground. I hunt from the ground so I don't have the advantage of a downward angle.

Here in MN, you need to have a medical reason or be over 60. I'll be old enough for the 2024 season. Even so, I'll continue to use my regular bow because in my experience, and where & how I hunt, a compound bow is more efficient.

That's my answer to the OP's original question... sort of, as I'll be going back to a compound. I just don't see any experienced bow hunters ever switching because it's "easier". My worry is the "new" bow hunter choosing a crossbow because they're lazy. Those hunters already lack moral high-ground and would likely push the limits and wound animals no matter the weapon.

From: Bowbender
09-Dec-22
x-man

"I just don't see any experienced bow hunters ever switching because it's "easier". My worry is the "new" bow hunter choosing a crossbow because they're lazy. Those hunters already lack moral high-ground and would likely push the limits and wound animals no matter the weapon."

PA has gained a significant number of bowhunters since xbows were legalized in 2009. Our numbers have grown from ~250K to ~375K. That's a 50% increase. Additionally it's estimated that ~65-70% of bowhunters are using xbows. That's ~245K using xbows. I'd say a significant amount of "experienced" bowhunters made the switch. Why? I'm sure some are due to health reasons (legitimate). Majority? Because it IS easier.

09-Dec-22
Wouldn't bother me a bit if disabled folks hunted with a 300 Win mag during bow season. Having to change careers or maybe unable to split firewood or throw a football for their kids or grandkids or carry a ladder out and clean the gutters, cast a fly rod or change a flat tire is enough to deal with.

The number one thing reducing the number of bowhunters while also increasing the number of people in the woods during archery season in whitetail states, is full inclusion of crossbows into what was bow season. Whatever benefits come from full inclusion, it is a negative to the sport, lifestyle, business and future of hunting with bows.

It's not surprising that on a site dedicated to bowhunting, one of the biggest detriments to bowhunting as a whole isn't popular.

Becoming competent and sealing the deal with a bow can be hard. If we keep ignoring that the hard part is the key to what makes it great and the key to why bow season has all the benefits it does, we lose.

From: Bowfreak
09-Dec-22
I hate them. They are clunky and are easy street for a capable person. I want nothing to do with them. I am glad that they are available for people who need them due to a disability but I hate the fact they are included in regular archery seasons for those capable of hunting with a vertical bow.

When I can no longer draw a bow, I will become a rifle hunter.

From: x-man
09-Dec-22
"PA has gained a significant number of bowhunters since xbows were legalized in 2009. Our numbers have grown from ~250K to ~375K. That's a 50% increase. Additionally it's estimated that ~65-70% of bowhunters are using xbows. That's ~245K using xbows. I'd say a significant amount of "experienced" bowhunters made the switch. Why? I'm sure some are due to health reasons (legitimate). Majority? Because it IS easier."

At least you did the math right this time. :) I'm curious where you got the 65-70% numbers from. Are there actual statistics behind that or is that just your gut feeling?

I'm sure there are experienced hunters switching because they think it will be easier. Most will conclude as I have that it's really not. Perhaps I should amend my statement to experienced, "successful" bow hunters.

Until/unless they make a 5lb crossbow that is as quiet as a compound and doesn't require a stupid clunky scope to aim with, I truly believe they are a fad that will slowly die off like the solo-cam bow.

From: Michael
09-Dec-22
For the most part I don’t care what people hunt with. They can do them and I will do me.

The selfish part of me doesn’t like how bow hunting has grown over the years. Back in the 80’s and 90’s it was a lot easier to get permission to hunt land for archery season.

There are 2 reasons I started bowhunting. Easier to gain permission and longer season. It eventually grew into a love affair.

The only way I would take up a crossbow is if I couldn’t draw my bow back. I would rather hunt with a crossbow than not hunt at all. Until that day comes I will still carry my compound bow because I love to hunt with it.

09-Dec-22
PA lost bowhunters since 2009. They gained hunters during archery season.

From: Bowbender
09-Dec-22
"At least you did the math right this time. :) I'm curious where you got the 65-70% numbers from. Are there actual statistics behind that or is that just your gut feeling?"

Not sure what your math comment refers to, but in this thread it's been spot on. The actual statistics can be gathered from PGC's website and some digging. No gut feeling. I posted links previously. Feel free to do your own work.

From: shade mt
09-Dec-22
ya know one thing about baloney.......it don't matter how thin you slice it....its still baloney.

And crossbows?.........anyway you look at it.....it's not a bow. really hard to argue against that simple truth.

And archery season, was for archers, plain and simple.

10-Dec-22

Archer Ontario's embedded Photo
Archer Ontario's embedded Photo
This is what happened to me It was late season I was in my tree stand I had been there since daybreak and at 230 pm a nice 8 point walked out and was working his way to me I stood up attached my release to the string as the 8 point came into range I began to draw I felt like a knife was being shoved in my shoulder as well as my thumb of my draw arm I had to call my wife to help me pull my deer out I sat there in my recliner for about 6 months after my wife said why don’t you get a crossbow , I told her I’m not sure I can I don’t think it would be the same , She said let’s go for a drive Well we ended up at an archery store and she surprised me with a crossbow for my birthday Later that month my dr told me my shoulder is done and shooting archery would not be wise , Ever since that decision was made for me I started hunting hard again And I harvested my first animal with a crossbow , It all felt the same I was excited I enjoyed any time time I get out in the woods There are some advantages and disadvantages for both but I’ve enjoyed it and am happy I can still bowhunt I just see the comments on here making fun of crossbows and I think that needs to change , What I would give to be able to shoot a bow again Ide love to buy a Odieda bow and hunt with it !

From: Bigdog 21
10-Dec-22
It's kinda comical. The guys complaining about new technology (x bow). That need technology them selfs. (Lighted sights, release, 80% let off . Trail Camera's. To funny. And I do shoot everything self bow, recurve,compound, x bow.

From: shade mt
10-Dec-22
I think crossbows have a place, especially for those that can no longer shoot a bow, youth etc... What i don't like is the thought of them taking over archery, just like compounds took over real bows, meaning longbows recurves etc...

Bigdog...crossbows are not just new technology, they been around longer than compounds.

But archery season was intended for archers, and originally crossbows were allowed to be used by those that could no longer shoot a bow.

No problem...

crossbows taking over archery, will eventually be a problem. Sometimes we are our own worst enemy.

And for the record....I am a traditional archer, always was, always will be.

I enjoy ALL types of weapons.....but when its archery, i think "bow"....naturally.

"archery" -"archer" -""bow" kinda makes sense heh?

From: shade mt
10-Dec-22
and something else just to set the record straight.....the term "archery" and "archer" is nothing new. Most certainly it dates back long, LONG before Matthews, long before bow tech, Hoyt, and the era of wheels and cables.

If you study back in history, you will note reference made to "archers", longbowmen...etc...especially english longbowmen etc....trained archers etc...etc...etc.. You will also note reference to "crossbows" and "crossbowmen"....to my knowledge, i've never seen them lumped together and called archers....Why?.....because they are not a bow. plain and simple.

10-Dec-22
When I worked in the archery industry I met three different guys who shot with one arm and a mouth tab. All were very accurate. The two that had no use of one arm were slower loading an arrow but still faster than loading and cocking a crossbow. I tried one of their setups and was surprised at how well it worked.

From: LBshooter
15-Dec-22
So for the guys who claim they will stop hunting vs using a xbow then the question is, what are you doing in the woods ? Are you there to Hunt or kill? If you are a hunter then it wouldn't matter how you take your game, because we all know that the "kill" is a small part of the hunt. So if a eye injury or shoulder injury prevents you from using a compgun and the only weapon is a xbow you'd stop? If that's true then I submit you were not a hunter but a killer, the act of the kill is what made you hunt. Because if your a hunter and beit old age or injury prevents you from shooting a vertical bow why wouldn't you use a xbow if it means your able to hunt. One day I'm sure I will be unable to shoot my longbows or recurves and when that day comes I will pickup whatever weapon that allows me to hunt.

15-Dec-22
I’ll play. I’m in the woods for many reasons, and yes, filling my tag is the most important one. It’s certainly not the only one, but it’s the main reason I’m there. Otherwise I might as well just go on a camping trip. If I were simply a “killer “, then I most certainly would use a crossbow because it wouldn’t matter what weapon I use. However, what I use IS important to me. That’s why I haven’t rifle hunted since I first shot a bow. Killing an animal with my bow gives me a satisfaction and sense of accomplishment that I never felt when I rifle hunted, and certainly wouldn’t feel if I used a crossbow. That’s why I can say with 100% certainty that when I can no longer hunt with my bow, the only thing I’ll hunt is birds. Does that make me any less of a hunter? No, regardless of what some keyboard knucklehead wants to label me or anyone else.

From: shade mt
15-Dec-22

shade mt's embedded Photo
shade mt's embedded Photo
LB shooter....i agree with that, for sure.

I will be the first one to claim a crossbow is not a bow, well duh...some revelation huh?

but there is NO way i'd sit at home and not hunt, if i couldn't draw a bow, hunting is not a hobby for me, not even a sport, but a way of life.

can't relate to that?...don't matter, that's the way it is for me.

People, including myself can be very opinionated, that's ok, long as you realize the world don't revolve around your opinion.

The problem is though, we get to thinking our opinion is fact, or the way everybody ought to think. Aside from Truth and right and wrong, and moral issues.....( heck people are dumb enough to even think that's just opinion) there are allowable differences.

Truth?...no a crossbow is not a bow, (now that we are all nodding our heads in agreement)....here is another truth you might not smile about........neither is a compound really.

like the old virginia slims cigarette ad...."Youv'e come a long ways baby.".....

15-Dec-22
If I can't bowhunt anymore, I will still hunt. It just won't be in bow season.

From: deerhunter72
15-Dec-22
Great posts LBshooter and shade mt. I can't believe that a true hunter will just give up if they can't pull the old "compgun" or longbow anymore. Use a different weapon, hunt a different season or animal but keep getting out there if you still have the desire! The only label you have to worry about is the one you give yourself.

15-Dec-22
Nothing wrong with scoped crossbows. However, I would rather be a stickbow bowhunter than a scoped crossbow hunter. They are two vastly different types of hunting and shooting, one difficult, one very easy. Easy is not my type of hunting and killing.

From: Live2Hunt
15-Dec-22
The simple answer is, if you switch you are no longer using a bow to hunt. So, you are no longer a bow hunter. The granting of us to use bow and arrows to hunt with was special. It was geared toward archery equipment that was to be bow and arrow drawn by your strength. Adding xguns to an archery season was and is wrong and should have never happened except for elderly and handicapped. Those of us who chose to learn to shoot a bow effectively enough to kill game embraced this way of hunting. Xguns just threw all that work and effort away and slapped us in the face. This is a bowsite and started out with bowhunters discussing everything bowhunting. Why does Pat not have xguns in here? Think about that.

From: Screwball
15-Dec-22
Had neck fusion June 16, if not cleared would not bow hunt this fall. When the time comes for whatever the reason a crossgun is not an option. I'll be done Bow Hunting.

From: WhattheFOC
15-Dec-22
I’ve seen the posts of guys who say they won’t use an xbow in archery season when they get too old to pull their vertical. I don’t think they should be called out for that stance. Hunt vs kill bla bla bla.

The way I see it, Xbows barged in to a party that they were never invited to - some of us have strong views on that. I’d never look down on an old or disabled guy who is in the bush with his xbow during archery season. But when a guy says that he will NOT pick up a xbow in archery season - even if he meets the ‘old or disabled’ criteria - he has my respect. This is a person who makes the decision based not on what you or I think - they make the decision based on their principles, and they apply the same principles regardless of who is on the short end. I respect that.

When the day comes, I will leave September for the vertical guys. I’d be an hypocrite not to. Come October 1 I’ll be out there with either an xbow or a muzzleloader.

From: 8point
15-Dec-22
I won an Xbow about 6 years ago. I didn't shoot it for a coupe of years, but then had issues with my shoulders, two rotator cuff operations, one of which didn't turn out so well, and I dislocated the other, and it hasn't been right since. When Xbow season rolled around, about 5 weeks into regular bow, I got the Xbow out, and had to go on line to see how to cock the darn thing. First time in the stand, I got a nice 8 point, shot him at 18 yards, well within my compound range. I've since bought a Bear youth bow and shoot 40#'s. I've never killed a deer with the Bear bow, but I've never killed another deer with the Xbow either. I've have had some close calls with both weapons, but come up empty. I'm a horn hunter, so I don't shoot rag horns, and I've got maybe 12 or 14 compound bucks and a few does under my belt, so I feel I'm not just incapable, but no matter what you shoot, if it isn't there, it isn't there. My question is, have the naysayers been adversely affected by Xbows, or are they just against the concept?

From: deerhunter72
15-Dec-22
8point, my take on it is that the naysayers have the same argument that traditional shooters had when the compounds came out. It's different, too easy, you can shoot too far etc. The world didn't end then and it won't end now.

15-Dec-22
If crossbows have as big of an impact as compounds did, opportunitues will change dramatically.

From: Dikndirt
15-Dec-22
I have torn bicep tendons in both arms and A torn labrum in my right shoulder along with a rotator cuff that’s really beyond repair. I can still pull my bow set at 55 lbs through shear grit and determination and will continue to do so until I am physically unable to. I am 68 and have had a great run bow hunting for 50 plus years. Never thought about converting to a gun bow and never will. Just couldn’t do it, not bow hunting in my mind. But to each his own.

From: Dikndirt
15-Dec-22

From: LBshooter
16-Dec-22
Hey more power to the guy who wants to sit at home and not be in the woods because he refuses to adapt to a weapon. there is nothing that I won't do to be in the woods during bow season on the hunt. If your unable to use a weapon that allows you to continue to hunt such awesome animals, then that is your loss. To me I would never allow my ego to get in the way of hunting. And for those who say xbows were a univuted guests? Wrong, the guest list was written by the manufacturers and they invited the xbow to the party. It will ultimately bite them in the ass when they see sales fall off because let's face it, when you have a weapon that shoots 400 fps not much need to trading it in and buying new. As I have mentioned in the past I hunt a lot of public and none guy who hunts with a xbow is toting around a bow he paid 4 k for, not much chance he's getting rid of that any time soon. Maybe the crossbow is a Lessing in disguise, the guys who refuse to use them when they are unable to shoot a verticle bow will ultimately make more room in e woods for me lol.

From: Quinn @work
16-Dec-22
If you physically can't use a vertical bow because of a medical condition then you should be able to apply with documentation to use an x-gun during archery season. Many people legitimately have this circumstance.

X-guns shouldn't be allowed in any "archery" season otherwise. The only reason they are is because big money x-gun manufacturers lobby'd to get it.

I'm proud of how Colorado has handled the assault to get x-guns approved for archery season. If you have a medical condition yes, if not no. If you want to use an x-gun in CO use it during the gun season. There's plenty of them and they are now less crowded than our archery season which is now over run by non-residents who didn't draw a tag in any other state.

16-Dec-22
LBshooter, who the hell said anything about staying home? For someone that has a whole lot of “I”s and “me”s in your post, funny you should talk about anyone else’s ego, as if anyone else gives a damn about what you would do.

From: DanaC
16-Dec-22
re Glunt - "If crossbows have as big of an impact as compounds did, opportunitues will change dramatically. "

And that is what I fear. Biologists watching the herd and calculating harvest goals once considered the bow season kill as negligible. Since compounds came out it's more a important number, *but* still less than gun kills. Change that and you might end up with shorter bow seasons. When I started we had a 3 week bow season, now it's 6 weeks. Druther not lose what we've gained. (And yes, gun seasons were lengthened too.)

From: Rocky D
16-Dec-22
“And that is what I fear.”

DanaC, don’t worry this thread is filled with fear.

“ I'm proud of how Colorado has handled the assault to get x-guns approved for archery season. If you have a medical condition yes, if not no. If you want to use an x-gun in CO use it during the gun season.”

Quinn, I am glad that Colorado threw their bowhunters a bone because there is no state that has whored out their resident’s resources more than Colorado.

“ Becoming competent and sealing the deal with a bow can be hard. If we keep ignoring that the hard part is the key to what makes it great and the key to why bow season has all the benefits it does, we lose.”

Glunt, is that really the truth with a compound? Now a stickbow is a whole different story and I fully agree but most hunters can easily transition to a compound and be killing animals their first season.

The stickbow guys lost the argument to the compound because their argument was self serving as is the argument against Xbows!

The game managers and politicians don’t really care how much skill is required with certain weapon they are focused on pleasing the mob while quietly accomplishing their own agenda.

If anyone got screwed in this whole deal it was the stickbow guy but then again they were totally ineffective as a management tool and to small in numbers to make a difference politically.

I keep hearing about encroachment on public lands and this may be true out west but in the states that I hunt public pressure is down!

I have trout fished for the last three days and I have had competition with one 82 year old man and I have not been bumped one time while hunting public land.

We hunters and fishermen are a dying breed because it’s much easier to sleep in, get meat from the grocery store, and men don’t have to demand time from their relationships!

As for hunting with a crossbow I will hunt with whatever I am physically capable of and is legal to do so.

16-Dec-22
I enjoy bowhunting too much to switch and become scoped and cocked crossbow hunter. Even though I am now in the minority during archery seasons, I still enjoy the challenge of bow and arrow hunting with my stickbow. Join the minority, join Comptons today.

16-Dec-22
the sooner we all realize that modern hunting only exists to manage game populations the better off we will all be...its about killing enough game to keep them from overpopulation...spreading diseases...and damaging habitat and property. the idea that bowhunting was meant to be this or that is just plain bs. thats like saying that travel was meant to be done on a horse. how a person chooses to kill an animal is up to them and the dude on the next forty with a xbow or a compound has no effect on me with my recurve...unless im pissed because i think he might have a better chance of shooting a buck that i think i deserve. seasons for weapons that throw arrows and seasons for weapons that fire bullets are separated for safety reasons.

16-Dec-22
Wolves help control populations, why are so many hunters against them?

From: DanaC
16-Dec-22
Because we ain't sharks, or lawyers ;-)

16-Dec-22
"Wolves help control populations, why are so many hunters against them?"

same reason i mentioned before...a lot of hunters dont like predators because they dont want them killing game before they have the chance to. if predators only killed possums porkies skunks and rodents...nobody would give a damn.

From: WhattheFOC
16-Dec-22
LB - when a disabled hunter chooses not to use a xbow during archery, that is a decision based upon principles - not ego. Some people can’t grasp the concept.

16-Dec-22
I agree, some here are confusing bowhunting principles with ego, two totally different concepts.

16-Dec-22
in my opinion, calling a choice of legal weapon a principle is a stretch. i see principles as systems of beliefs or codes of conduct. in my opinion a choice of legal weapon is a preference not a principle. even if you do make the leap from preference to principle...thats an individual thing...not something that is the same for everyone. ego is not necessarily a negative thing...your ego is your conscience mind and sense of self...big difference between ego and egotistical.

From: Live2Hunt
16-Dec-22
Why are you talking about xguns on a bowsite, it is not a bow?

16-Dec-22
I don't see choosing a crossbow as any ding on someone's character. It's just not bowhunting and I would like to see bowhunting thrive. Having a bow season is/was a huge reason bowhunting thrived.

Crossbow inclusion has proven to increase hunter numbers during what was bow season and decrease the number of bowhunters in primarily whitetail states. That's not good for bowhunting.

16-Dec-22
Yes Glunt, where crossbows are legal for all, there are far fewer bowhunters, and declining every year.

From: Bowfreak
16-Dec-22
Whenever crossbows come up someone always mentions that when the compound came on the scene that those that stuck with longbows and recurves said that it was not bowhunting. The difference is that all of those bows are drawn and held by hand. Crossbows are not.

From: WhattheFOC
16-Dec-22
Cable guy … the scenario being referred to was specifically that of a bowhunter who has always been opposed to Xbows in archery season - and is now ‘eligible’ (either by law or by public opinion) to use one - but he chooses not to. Sticking to your beliefs - especially when it is at your own detriment … that’s a principled decision.

From: Dikndirt
16-Dec-22

Dikndirt's embedded Photo
Wyoming bull
Dikndirt's embedded Photo
Wyoming bull
LB I hope I don’t come across as a guy who has an ego. I never said I would not hunt if I couldn’t shoot my bow I just stated I could never convert to hunting with a crossbow so maybe you misunderstood my post. I did state to each his own and I mean that, if you want to hunt with a crossbow more power to you. I am still shooting and hunting with a vertical bow and will continue to do so as long as I possibly can. Pushing 70 and still able to get it done.

From: WhattheFOC
16-Dec-22
Nice work dikndirt. I hope I’m still gettin it done at 70.

16-Dec-22
like i said before whatthefoc...in my opinion what you call principles...i consider a preferences. principles would have more to do with a hunters ethics than the legal equipment they choose. i know people who hunt with a crossbow that have the highest of principles...i know others who hunt with a selfbow that are lacking in that area.

what is more principled...a hunter that hunts with a crossbow and makes nothing but quick clean kills...or a hunter who hunts with a longbow and wounds multiple animals every year? believe me...i know both.

From: WhattheFOC
16-Dec-22
I think you’re missing the point - but that’s ok.

17-Dec-22
i get your point...i just dont happen to agree with it...but thats ok...i think were still allowed to do that.

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