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Question Wyoming Landowners
Elk
Contributors to this thread:
RK 27-Dec-22
[email protected] 27-Dec-22
wyobullshooter 27-Dec-22
Tracker 27-Dec-22
wildwilderness 27-Dec-22
Cheesehead Mike 27-Dec-22
Aspen Ghost 27-Dec-22
PushCoArcher 27-Dec-22
DanaC 28-Dec-22
[email protected] 28-Dec-22
PushCoArcher 28-Dec-22
RK 28-Dec-22
Inshart 28-Dec-22
Tracker 28-Dec-22
wytex 28-Dec-22
PushCoArcher 28-Dec-22
air leak 28-Dec-22
Grey Ghost 28-Dec-22
Grasshopper 28-Dec-22
Mule Power 28-Dec-22
Grasshopper 28-Dec-22
Grasshopper 28-Dec-22
Grey Ghost 28-Dec-22
grasshopper 28-Dec-22
From: RK
27-Dec-22
Question is.

If someone owned a large ranch in Wyoming and wanted to one kill an elk for them self and two have a guest or two shoot an Elk, what is the process

27-Dec-22
Question is: If someone owned a large ranch in Wyoming and wanted to, 1. kill an elk for themselves and, 2. have a guest or two, shoot an Elk; what is the process? :)

27-Dec-22
Here’s the process as outlined in the Wyoming Game and Fish Regulations, Chapter 44, Section 9.

Section 9. Landowner Licenses. Landowner licenses shall only be issued to those landowners who own land which provides habitat for antelope, deer, elk or wild turkeys and meets the requirements as set forth in this section. Any lands purchased or subdivided for the primary purpose of obtaining landowner licenses shall not be eligible for landowner licenses. The Wyoming Game and Fish Commission authorizes the issuance of landowner licenses in order to provide the opportunity for a landowner applicant or member of the landowner applicant’s immediate family to hunt antelope, deer, elk or wild turkey on the landowner’s property in the case where licenses for a hunt area have been limited in number and only available through a competitive drawing. (a) In order to qualify for a license issued under this section, the deeded land qualifying the landowner applicant shall be located in the hunt area for which applied, shall consist of a minimum of one hundred sixty (160) contiguous acres and shall be utilized by the type of big game or wild turkeys for which the applicant applied to the extent the land provides food, cover and water. The landowner applicant shall demonstrate that the species of wildlife for which the license application has been made utilized the described land for a minimum of two thousand (2,000) days of use during the twelve (12) month period immediately preceding the date of application. In no case shall more than two (2) big game licenses per species or more than two (2) spring wild turkey or no more than two (2) fall wild turkey licenses be issued for a parcel of deeded land meeting the above qualifications in a calendar year. (b) Resident or nonresident landowner applicants that own land in Wyoming or members of the landowner applicant’s immediate family may be issued licenses upon application and payment of the specified fee. Licenses shall be issued to landowners without participating in a competitive drawing unless the number of landowner license applications exceeds the number of licenses authorized for the hunt area by the Commission. In such cases, a competitive drawing shall be utilized to determine successful landowner license applicants. Landowner license applications shall be drawn first in each respective resident and nonresident initial drawing and shall be drawn against the total quota available in each respective hunt area. (c) As a condition of eligibility for licenses issued to landowners, landowner applicants shall provide on and with the application for a license issued to landowners, documentation that substantiates in which capacity the individual qualifies as a landowner applicant under the definition of a landowner applicant or landowner’s immediate family in this Chapter. Documentation shall include the completion of the landowner license application form provided by the Department, and any attachments required by the Department to determine eligibility of the applicant. The Department shall consider the eligibility of the applicant based on the requirements in this regulation and documentation provided by the landowner. (d) In the case of resident license availability, no full price landowner licenses shall be authorized if hunting with a general license is allowed at any time during the hunting season, unless the general license is valid for antlerless deer or antlerless elk hunting only. (e) In the case where a nonresident landowner qualifies for a landowner license in a hunt area where the current hunting season provides for both limited quota and general license 44-23

hunting during the established hunting season for the species applied for, the nonresident landowner may apply as a nonresident applicant for either the limited quota license for the area in which the applicant is qualified, or a general license in the initial drawing. If the nonresident landowner is unsuccessful in obtaining a limited quota license in the nonresident drawing, the nonresident landowner may subsequently apply to the Department for the issuance of a general license. (f) Landowner licenses shall be designated by the landowner and applied for by a landowner applicant, or a member of the landowner applicant’s immediate family. (i) An individual landowner applicant may apply for or receive: (A) No more than one (1) full price elk and one (1) limited quota reduced price elk landowner license in a calendar year. (B) No more than one (1) full price antelope or up to two (2) limited quota reduced price antelope landowner licenses in a calendar year. (C) No more than one (1) full price deer or up to two (2) limited quota reduced price deer landowner licenses in a calendar year. (D) No more than one (1) spring wild turkey landowner license and one (1) fall wild turkey landowner license in a calendar year. (ii) A maximum of two (2) licenses for antelope, deer and elk may be allowed to a landowner applicant regardless of the number of landholdings in which the landowner applicant holds an interest. (iii) Regardless of a change in ownership of a particular parcel of land, no more than two (2) landowner licenses for each big game species (antelope, deer, and elk) shall be issued in any calendar year on the basis of the qualification of the particular parcel. (iv) Regardless of a change in ownership of a particular parcel of land, no more than two (2) spring wild turkey and two (2) fall wild turkey landowner licenses shall be issued in any calendar year on the basis of the qualification of the particular parcel. (g) Landowners shall submit applications for landowner licenses as listed in Section 20 of this regulation.

From: Tracker
27-Dec-22
??

27-Dec-22
Short answer-

1. Landowner has to apply to the state to be allotted a tag- certain criteria apply.

2. ONLY direct family members can use the Landowner tag. So guests not related would have to draw a tag in the normal draw process for the unit the land was located in.

27-Dec-22
"The landowner applicant shall demonstrate that the species of wildlife for which the license application has been made utilized the described land for a minimum of two thousand (2,000) days of use during the twelve (12) month period immediately preceding the date of application.”

2,000 days in a 12 month period. That's gonna be tough to demonstrate!

From: Aspen Ghost
27-Dec-22
That will indeed be a challenge Cheesehead Mike. I also liked "Any lands purchased or subdivided for the primary purpose of obtaining landowner licenses shall not be eligible for landowner licenses."

So if I hit the lottery and buy a ranch so I can elk hunt, I can't get a landowner license. How will they know why I bought the ranch? I guess if I apply for a license it's proof that's why I bought it and if I don't apply then I can get one.

From: PushCoArcher
27-Dec-22
1 antelope stays on your land all year that's 365 days 10 antelope all year 3650 day's.

From: DanaC
28-Dec-22
Got 160 acres that will support ten antelope/deer/elk? Is 40 animals/square mile a realistic standard?

How many landowner tags does WY issue every year?

28-Dec-22
Who is the largest landowner in Wyoming? 1. Stan Kroenke. Owner of Q Creek Ranch, the biggest ranch in all of the Rocky Mountains. It is a mind-blowing 550,000 acres belonging to Kroenke, in addition to other ranches in Arizona, Montana and Texas.Nov 14, 2022How many landowner tags are in Wyoming?

More info: Each landowner applicant is limited to 2 tags per species, regardless of the total number of parcels owned by that individual. It is also important to note that of the 2 tags, only one can be applied for as a full price tag in any calendar year. Additional tag must be reduced price (doe or cow tag).Oct 12, 202

From: PushCoArcher
28-Dec-22
DanaC their not giving tags to guys with 160 acres very much if ever. That amount of land in areas around Casper wouldn't support 2 antelope much less 40 year round. Don't know how many landowner tags are given out but WYG&F is one of the few game agencies in the country I trust to put their wildlife before their pocket book. Hopefully they keep the standards high and only those who have significantly helped manage and expand the resource will be issued tags. If not for those standards you'd have a bunch of guys with 80 acre lots outside of Casper that could barely support a antelope fart just so they could have x tag every year. I wish landowner tags worked like this everywhere the orginal intent of these tags was so landowners or their families could hunt their land, even if that land was located in hard to draw units, not commercialize wildlife resources by then selling those tags to the highest bidder (looking at you New Mexico).

From: RK
28-Dec-22
Interesting read. Thanks for the information

So how does a guy like Kroenke manage the wildlife on all of those 1/2 million acres?

From: Inshart
28-Dec-22
Pushco.......""WYG&F is one of the few game agencies in the country I trust to put their wildlife before their pocket book.""

I respectfully disagree with that statement.

From: Tracker
28-Dec-22
He leases it to an outfitter I would suspect.

From: wytex
28-Dec-22
It really doesn't take long for even 160 A to get a LO elk tag in the right areas. Inshart I respectfully disagree with your statement too. For the most part wildlife comes first but the outfitters have a large say too.

Some areas are limited in LO licenses and some areas LO take almost all of the alloted licenses for some species.

Buy your ranch in elk area 6 to get access for your friends, cow tags are readily available. I know LO that might sell for the right price in 6, he has elk, mule deer, wt, and bighorn sheep. Turkeys showed back up this year too.

From: PushCoArcher
28-Dec-22
Inshart everyone's entitled to their own opinion but would you care to explain why you feel that way? Wyoming doesn't allow unlimited OTC archery elk/antelope or unlimited OTC rifle elk in it's general units(like Colorado) they use yearly surveys to set quotas often lowering them from previous year's just a couple of examples of putting their wildlife before their pocket book. Also cutting the quota on NR sheep and moose will cost them money not just on licenses sales but lost revenue on point sales as even less sucker's will buy a increasingly worthless preference point. These cuts are coming to antelope, elk, and deer sooner than later more of a putting resident hunters before their pocket book then wildlife but still nice to see a game agencies making decisions not solely based on the almighty dollar. I'm not suggesting WYG& F is perfect or completely unconcerned with revenue. For instance they've already passed a price hike in the special starting in 2024 and I'm sure more price increases are coming certainly a effort to make the reduced tag sales from lowered quotas revenue neutral. Without including the reasons for why you feel that way how am I or anyone to know if yours is a informed opinion or if you're just one of those angry guy's who now has 18-20 worthless moose points hollering abou lawsuits?

From: air leak
28-Dec-22
Just looked up Stan Kroenke. He owns a total of 849,000 acres of working ranches.. Which is 1,313 sq miles..

From: Grey Ghost
28-Dec-22
FYI, here are the Wyoming Wildlife Taskforce's recommended changes to the landowner license system as presented to the WGFC on Nov.21, 2022.

Wyoming Wildlife Taskforce

November 21, 2022

Wyoming Game and Fish Commission 5400 Bishop Blvd Cheyenne, WY 82006

Dear Commissioners,

The Wyoming Wildlife Taskforce’s (Taskforce) charge is to study top-priority wildlife policy issues facing the state related to the allocation of hunting opportunity, sportsperson access and other issues, and to make recommendations to the proper decision making body regarding solutions to these issues. We present to you the following recommendations, voted on at the September 16, 2022 meeting of the Taskforce:

The Taskforce recommends that the Wyoming Game and Fish Commission adopt the following regarding landowner license issuance in Chapter 44 of the Wyoming Game and Fish Commission regulations.

1. “Landowner Applicant” means an individual, or a member of the “Landowner Applicant’s Immediate Family” who either owns real property solely or jointly with other individuals or who holds a “Significant Interest” in a corporation, partnership, trust or limited liability company, which owns real property. “Significant Interest” means ownership of Twenty Percent (20%) or more of a corporation, partnership, or limited liability company.”

The Taskforce thoroughly discussed this recommendation and received public comment through a variety of methods including public testimony and written comments. The Taskforce recognized that the adoption of the recommendations and specifically the required level of ownership of twenty percent is solely at the discretion of the Commission. The Taskforce recognized the Commission may consider a lower level of ownership to qualify as a significant interest.

2. “Lands purchased or subdivided for the primary purpose of obtaining landowner licenses means: a. Real property previously used for the primary purpose of grazing and production of livestock or agricultural crops, and which has been subdivided into parcels, or b. Real property transferred to a new owner which was used prior to the transfer to a new owner for the primary purpose of grazing and the production of livestock or agricultural crops is such real property is not used by the new owner after transfer for the primary purpose of grazing and production of livestock or agricultural crops.”

Through significant discussion and consideration of public testimony and information presented, the Taskforce drafted this recommendation with the intent to bolster existing regulatory language specific to prohibiting subdividing or selling land solely for the purpose of obtaining landowner licenses. The Taskforce felt the additional language would make the existing Commission intent more enforceable.

3. “Resident or nonresident landowner applicants that own land in Wyoming or members of the landowner applicant’s immediate family may be issued licenses upon application and payment of the specified fee. Licenses shall be issued to landowners without participating in a competitive drawing unless the number of landowner license applications exceeds twenty percent (20%) of the number of licenses authorized for the hunt area by the Commission. If the Commission determines that any hunt area is over objective for the type of landowner license requested, landowner licenses shall be issued without regard to the quota established by the Commission and shall be in addition to the quota set by the Commission.”

As was the case in other Taskforce recommendations, information presented along with public comment were considered in deliberations. This particular recommendation aimed to address increases in demand by sportsmen and women for hunting opportunity and decreases in license availability in much of the state.

4. “As a condition of eligibility for licenses issued to landowners, landowner applicants shall provide on and with the application for a license issued to landowners, documentation that substantiates the big game or wild turkey usage days and in which capacity the individual qualifies as a landowner applicant under the definition of a landowner applicant or landowner’s immediate family in this Chapter. Documentation shall include the completion of the landowner license application form provided by the Department, and any attachments required by the Department to determine eligibility of the applicant. The Department shall consider the eligibility of the applicant based on the requirements in this regulation and documentation provided by the landowner. The Department shall investigate and determine that each landowner and landowner applicant meet all requirements to obtain a landowner license at least every five years. The landowner must establish, at the sole discretion of the Department and the Commission, that the landowner and landowner applicant qualify for landowner’s license(s) each year an application is made.”

Taskforce discussion regarding minimum acreage size, animal use day requirements and the provision of wildlife habitat on private land was thorough and contemplated significant input. This recommendation aims to strengthen accountability for animal use day requirements and to provide landowners more involvement in the establishment of their property landowner license qualification.

5. The final landowner license related Taskforce recommendations deals specifically with the Department’s efforts to re-establish landowner license qualification in a more structured and formalized manner. The Taskforce heard testimony that in most cases, once a landowner qualifies for landowner licenses, his/her animal use days are not re-evaluated. The Taskforce recommends that the Commission establish Department policy or regulation that directs the Department to re-verify landowner license qualification at least once every 5 years.

The Taskforce votes on these recommendations are recorded as follows:

Yes - Tony Lehner, Duaine Hagen, Jamie Flitner, Adam Teten, Joe Schaffer, Rusty Bell, Sy Gilliland, Ogden Driskill, Larry Hicks, Liisa Anselmi-Dalton, Jen Scoggin, Lee Livingston, Josh Coursey, Pat Crank, Pete Dube, and Brian Nesvik

No – None

Absent – 2 members

The Taskforce is forwarding you this recommendation for your review and consideration. Thank you for the opportunity to provide this recommendation. Sincerely,.

Matt

From: Grasshopper
28-Dec-22
What's a little weird to me about their system is if you buy some land that was used for grazing, as an investment or as recreational property, and you don't graze it because you don't own livestock, you could then be disqualified form the landowner license program. I mean if your not putting a thousand sheep in the pasture, doesn't that benefit the wildlife and increase the herd by means of more forage? Obviously, a thousand sheep on 160 would eliminate any forage and you would in theory never hit 2,000 days but....

Also, maybe if you put a conservation easement to sacrifice development on it or enrolled in the public hunter access program that would be good criteria too.

That said, it is what it is. You can always lease grazing rights, and boom your in.

From: Mule Power
28-Dec-22
If you owned enough property to be eligible and there wasn’t enough game on it to substantiate the license why would you want to hunt there anyway?

I support there are cases where the elk or deer don’t really spend time on some properties until hunting pressure pushes them there.

From: Grasshopper
28-Dec-22
I think a landowner tag is good unit wide, isn't it?

There was a parcel I was looking at on muddy mountain, 800 acres, listed at 1.2M, seasonal access. It qualified, unit 19 has a ton of elk. Some doctor type bought it, and immediately relisted it for 2M. Not sure if it ever sold at the inflated price.

If a guy buys something like that, you either hunt it, lease it to an outfitter who shoots every animal off the place, or subdivide it and try to earn a profit.

While I get the system is designed to not proliferate tags, and drive the real estate market - it currently isn't doing much for the habitat, herd or hunter access. It also doesn't recognize the reality that recreational sales are paying more then sheep and cattle. Sellers will sell to the highest bidder.

From: Grasshopper
28-Dec-22

Grasshopper's Link
Who wants in, 4 guys, 194 acres each.

From: Grey Ghost
28-Dec-22
As I see it, the recommended changes to the landowner license system makes is possible for residents and NRs to invest in a minority position (20%) in private property in Wyoming to insure they will qualify for a guaranteed tag every year, as long as the property remains dedicated to ranching and farming operations. It's just another ploy to benefit rich hunters under the guise of private landownership.

Matt

From: grasshopper
28-Dec-22
One bull or buck a year for 2000 animals days, compared to New Mexico it could be alot worse.

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