Mathews Inc.
Arizona deer sellout!
Whitetail Deer
Contributors to this thread:
[email protected] 27-Dec-22
PushCoArcher 27-Dec-22
BOHNTR 27-Dec-22
wildwilderness 27-Dec-22
Buglmin 28-Dec-22
BOHNTR 28-Dec-22
StickFlicker 28-Dec-22
StickFlicker 28-Dec-22
smarba 28-Dec-22
StickFlicker 28-Dec-22
Beendare 28-Dec-22
StickFlicker 28-Dec-22
BOWUNTR 28-Dec-22
MichaelArnette 28-Dec-22
cnelk 28-Dec-22
BOWUNTR 29-Dec-22
Boris 29-Dec-22
azelkhntr 29-Dec-22
Grey Ghost 29-Dec-22
creed 30-Dec-22
smarba 30-Dec-22
EMTTGT06 30-Dec-22
Jaquomo 30-Dec-22
Beendare 30-Dec-22
Z Barebow 30-Dec-22
smarba 30-Dec-22
Jaquomo 30-Dec-22
Z Barebow 30-Dec-22
BOWUNTR 30-Dec-22
27-Dec-22
I have had the pleasure, as a non resident, to hunt deer in Arizona 9 different years with an OTC license and I knew months ago nonresident licensing, was going to change. I just read but I knew, that the Game and Fish department placed a cap on non resident deer license, the cap being nearly 3000 license and they went on sale, via, the AZ internet system in early December of this year.

They all sold out in 3 days! I have no issue how a state decides to allocate their big game license, as we all know other states as well as here in Colorado are facing the non resident big game hunter license allocations issue. ie, here in Colorado, OTC licenses and changing the current 65/35 resident/nonresident draw license allocations to 75/35 or even 80/20.

I am sure more changes will be fore coming across the mid west and west. My best, Paul

From: PushCoArcher
27-Dec-22
Same thing happened in Idaho OTC sold out in no time. Colorado and Wyoming changing their allocations a price hike in the special in Wyoming starting in 2024 and probably more changes in that state coming. I guess the only thing certain is change.

From: BOHNTR
27-Dec-22
They actually didn’t sell out in three days…..they put out an email a couple weeks ago that 108 tags were still available to NR’s??? Not sure where they’re at now.

27-Dec-22
I’m surprised it’s taking so long to sell out ;)

From: Buglmin
28-Dec-22
The first 2800 tags did sell out in under three days. I grabbed one asap. I'm wondering if the January 2023 units will still be going by the 2022 quota. A lot of the otc units were closed by September, and several have 2 and 3 left in the quota. The 108 otc tags were sold out within hours two weeks ago. Where the addition tags came from is a mystery.

From: BOHNTR
28-Dec-22
Many of the units already closed were never offered by in Dec/Jan anyways. Only a few traditional units have closed early for this time of year.

From: StickFlicker
28-Dec-22
There aren't technically 2022 and 2023 quotas. Yes, January will be going by the 2022 quotas because the one year long quotas don't follow a calendar year, they begin in August each year.

From: StickFlicker
28-Dec-22
The annual quota amount of NR OTC permits available for 2033 was based on the average number of NR OTC permits that have been sold over the last few years. Therefore, there should have been enough for everyone that really wanted or needed one just like in past years. But simply by announcing there was now a limited, fixed number of them available caused people to panic and buy all of them immediately.

From: smarba
28-Dec-22
Totally agree StickFlicker. We had a species in NM that was Over The Counter OTC for years, unlimited tags. Average number of tags sold per year was ~1200. It went to a draw with 1200 tags and within 2 years draw odds were under 50% and been falling every year.

So help me understand. I thought the tags that were just sold are for Jan 1, 2023 through Dec 31, 2023? Doesn't that mean you could potentially hunt Jan, Aug/Sept and Dec 2023 depending on the unit? Or do the tags that were just sold not begin until Aug? Been years since I've hunted AZ, so I haven't looked into the details thx.

From: StickFlicker
28-Dec-22
Starbase you are correct. The TAGS do follow a calendar year, so those just sold are fir calendar year 2023. However, the annual unit hunt quotas are for the Aug-Sept AND the Dec-Jan hunts, not a calendar year.

From: Beendare
28-Dec-22
Crazy amount of demand for Western Deer and elk hunts.

Keep in mind, that Deer tag you buy a year in advance; those units have a cap on the deer harvest you have to pay attention to....if the quota is filled, you need to find another unit.

Its a buyer beware scenario.....not a problem now but things are changing quickly. I think it was Unit 27 and 1 hit the quota early last year. Many units didn't hit the quota...but that might change....leaving you sitting with a deer tag for the late season you cannot use in your chosen unit and they will not give you a refund.

From: StickFlicker
28-Dec-22
Beendare, you are technically correct, and certainly, buyers should beware of whether the unit(s) they want to hunt is still open. But as BOHNTR stated above, most of the units that closed back in the early Aug-Sept season were never scheduled to have a Dec-Jan season in the first place, such as both of the units (27 and 1) that you mentioned as examples. The mule deer hunts in those units did indeed close in August, but they have not historically been open during that time of year and were not scheduled to be open in the winter this year either. Unit 27 does, however, have a Coues' hunt open in Dec-Jan. and the quota remains open.

From: BOWUNTR
28-Dec-22
Well... 8 units closed TODAY for mule deer. Several more will probably close next week. January 1st opens the gates for resident and non resident hunters to flood the few units that remain open. Gonna be a shitshow... I'll be getting a crossbow permit and radios ASAP. Ed F

28-Dec-22
Turns out when the average bowhunter with decent equipment can shoot mule deer at 60-70 yards we can't have the traditional bow seasons which we have enjoyed. I don't think there is another species that is as vulnerable to compound bow technologies as the mule deer. Although most western species certainly are at some level.

From: cnelk
28-Dec-22
One could only hope that Colorado does something similar with capping NonRes

From: BOWUNTR
29-Dec-22
I'm a problem solver... two things would solve this problem.

1) Allow only one deer tag. If you buy an OTC archery tag you don’t get to put in for the draw. This would eliminate all the casual January bowhunters who would rather draw a fall rifle tag.

2) Outlaw the use of radios. This single thing would prevent most quotas being filled. The culture here, especially with outfitters, is that you can't kill a deer without someone talking you in. When you buy a bow in a pro shop... you also buy a set of radios.

Ed F

From: Boris
29-Dec-22
Here in Penna. they are supposed to go to OTC Doe licenses. For the Unit that I hunt they allocate 30,000 - 33,000 per year. This should be interesting. Plus, they are looking at going back to the Monday opener for gun season. It has always been the first Monday after Thanksgiving. Would have off thursday thru monday go back to work on tuesday. When they went to Saturday opener, the numbers dropped off big time. So, we will see.

From: azelkhntr
29-Dec-22
You can't call yourself an ethical fair-chase hunter if you need to use radios to get close to big game.

From: Grey Ghost
29-Dec-22
"Outlaw the use of radios. This single thing would prevent most quotas being filled."

I agree. The same should apply for any big game species. Not too long ago, I started a thread about the use of cell phones and radios to guide sheep and mountain goat hunters to their kills. Sadly, the consensus of the responses was "Hey, if it's legal, go for it". I was disappointed by that.

Matt

From: creed
30-Dec-22
I would like to see AZ make the tag and seasons a calendar year. At least for the desert units. That would almost guarantee a rut hunt. This year due to the rainfall I would think most desert units will stay open through January but when we get our typical dry years they are going to shut down early. Guys will sit water and fill quotas quickly.

From: smarba
30-Dec-22
Be careful what you wish for, before you know it they'll break the hunts into separate tags for Sept or Jan like they did here in NM...

From: EMTTGT06
30-Dec-22
I got in on all this too dang late. Finally decided a month ago I’m done waiting so I started researching. Sure wish I would’ve pulled the trigger on this stuff several years ago. Maybe I’ll just plan a javelina hunt every year. I just want to head somewhere in Dec/Jan set up camp and hunt something for a week. I was silly thinking that would be easy.

From: Jaquomo
30-Dec-22
There are Colorado tags that sell out before they even go on sale, with our mysterious system.

From: Beendare
30-Dec-22
No radios would kill the outfitters….I like it. …but guys would just use their cell.

We mostly hunt solo…but when hunting with a spotter we use a flag and hand signals…works as good as a radio.

Regarding the Tags selling out; The more these hunts are promoted on the internet, the worse it gets- look at Elk. .

Maybe since these deer hunts are very low success and pretty boring really….hopefully the Youtube guys won’t wreck these hunts. Crawling along in the desert for 3 hours over cactus, rocks, scorpions, etc on a stalk trying to get a shot at a deer doesn’t have the appeal to most guys- inc myself. My neck was sore for a week after my last blown stalk.

From: Z Barebow
30-Dec-22
Beendare- Outlaw electronic 2 way communication devices. ( and add definition) that way they don’t lump GPS into the mix.

From: smarba
30-Dec-22
Many states do already outlaw electronic 2-way communication. The main issue is actually enforcing it.

From: Jaquomo
30-Dec-22
The (now retired) Game Warden for our area in N. CO used to drive around during season with a FRS/GMRS scanner, listening for guys doing funny stuff.

Once I was working a high ridge a couple miles from the road, and a friend was on the opposite ridge. We checked in to monitor each other's progress and make a plan to meet for lunch. Then a familiar voice broke in and asked, "Lou, is that you?" He recognized my voice on his scanner, and we had a nice little talk about what I was seeing, what he was seeing, etc..

Radios are great for checking in, summoning help, etc. But the potential for abuse in fair chase hunting is huge.

From: Z Barebow
30-Dec-22

From: BOWUNTR
30-Dec-22
Outfitters would have to completly stop using them. Few clients would knowingly pay to break the law. Everyone else... yeah, that's a problem. They outlawed trail cameras on the premise of fair chase... yet they allow radio/electronic communication and spotlight scouting.... hypocrisy. Ed F

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