Is this the next step in e-bikes?
Elk
Saw this post and thought back to the old e-bike threads. Will something like this fall into the same guidelines as an e bike?
Only difference would be the power rating.
These things are going to be the end of the North American Model.
Once no place in the backcountry is out of reach of the average lardass, all of the wildlife will be down on private, getting hammered on depredation permits.
Game Over.
More of an electric motorcycle.
Saw that, too. Not going to be allowed anywhere a dirt bike isn't allowed. Would be way less intrusive than a dirt bike.
Unless you've ever ridden on two wheels on a rough trail or single track with a pack and a bow, you have no idea how hard it is. Downright dangerous. I wouldn't worry about the lard-asses taking over the backcountry.
Nick, Reality sometimes isn’t a strong point in GF’s world.
Fat hunters wrestling an ebike up a trail they could ride a CRF450 legally on will not likely end hunting.
A couple generations of kids being raised indoors will likely be a bigger factor.
So what about 4-wheels? You think those are far behind?
I used to ride MTB about 150 miles/week around Denver & Summit County, so I have a pretty good idea what’s involved in riding technical single track from 5,000 to 11,000 feet…. And I spent an awful lot of time with nobody else on the trails. 95% of the people I did see were making down-hill runs on trails that I was climbing.
If you want to believe that the bulk of the effort goes into managing the bike and not into propulsion, you can go right on deluding yourself. Even on a trail that’s been completely boulevarded, you get to 11k and it’s brutal just managing enough speed to keep a bike upright, but that same trail can lead right up to the edge of a wilderness area.
My regular ride back then took me up the ridge snd back down in an hour an 10 minutes. An hour up and 10 down. About a 1500 foot climb. And now “EMTB” riders have built ramps, jumps, berms and all manner of stupid shit in that area, and the Elk are all living 5 miles downstream, stacked up on Private so that they don’t have to get bumped several times a day.
Nobody did that before e-bikes because it was too damn much work.
I dont think ebikes are legal on non-motorized trails. At least not on a large scale.
[email protected], that doesnt seem to matter in CO. The area i was in last year is off limits but that didnt stop them. I know a few guys who called and complained but nothing was done
Often true but that's a behavior/enforcement issue and it's dangerous to blame objects for people misusing them. That leads to things like gun control no plastic straws.
Corax you sound like a pretty awesome mountain biker? Did you win any medals or races? Sounds like you should have.
These will be great on trails that authorize motorized vehicles. And to be honest I would like a bunch of these in place of ATVs and 2 stroke dirt bikes.
I love the fat and lard ass argument. If someone who is in this category is even able to control a bike to get into your elk hunting area. They still have to get off said bike and walk to hunt and then be able to pack their elk out to their bike. I don’t see that happening. I used to ride a lot in my younger days but haven’t ridden in close to 25 years. Tried it once behind a locked gate on a well maintained gravel road and did it once and that’s it. About 2 years ago I road my BIL’s bike down a well maintained dirt road and fought like hell to control that thing steering and speed. That was a “oh, HELL NO!” Moment for me. LOL
Corax nailed it. "Everyone" said e-bikes were just a fringe, not enough to matter, no big deal, on and on. It's just going to continue to get worse. I've stated many times, I have NO problem with them being allowed where motorized vehicles are allowed, but they are NOT the same as a leg-powered mountain bike. Not even close.
I’m with Midwest… unless you’ve never tried riding mountain trails with a load you have no idea. I’d rather walk if a horse wasn’t an option. Priority one is don’t get hurt and any 2 wheeler in the mountains with a pack and a weapon is risky. In areas with gated roads or easy trails this stuff does make access too easy. Working to get to an area is what makes it a good area.
I got one and its pretty impressive with power and range
One more guy 5 miles in is one less guy 1/2 mile in.
Its a motorcycle thats electric instead of gas..... Dont see why this would change those that currently can buy a gas motorcycle not doing so but running out and buying a electric one
Pedaling a low powered assist bike IS easier than pedaling an old fashioned bike when going uphill. Can't argue that. But controlling one while wearing a pack and carrying a bow is not any easier.
That said, electric motorcycles are not pedal assist bikes in any way, shape, or form.
2 years ago I elk hunted in one of Colorado's most coveted limited draw units. It's also one of the units that is most conducive to using an e-bike...relatively flat BLM with 2-tracks everywhere. I didn't see another e-bike in 28 days of hunting. There were plenty of game spooking ATVs and UTVs, though.
The truth is, the vast majority of hunters will always use the easiest and most comfortable mode of transportation they can. Only a tiny fraction of hunters will use e-bikes to access difficult to reach backcountry. Anyone who claims an e-bike enables a lard-ass to access backcountry that he normally wouldn't be able to simply has never ridden one on a rough steep and rocky trail with a pack and bow on their back.
Matt
Why in the hell can’t we just call any bike with ANY type of motor on it, a MOTOR BIKE?
What, and close the loopholes?
Same reason we call a technologically-engineered, mechanical contraption with 90% letoff and laser rangefinding sights that propels an arrow 400 fps a "bow".
Because the laws dictate what is and what isn't.
Sorry, but there are 1000 more threats to the future of bowhunting than pedal-assist bicycles.
@Quinn - Never thought about it. I was a Hammer, to be sure. Not sure that I ever had the technical skills to be competitive, but by that point in my life I was too old (30s - lol) to believe that I couldn’t get hurt doing it. Racing does not favor those who grasp their own mortality.
But for me, it was an awesome way to cover many miles in rough country. Not a great way to move your camp, but if you can roll along at several TIMES the pace of a fit hiker, you don’t NEED to haul your camp. You can always bomb back down to the truck for pack frames and meat bags, and you only have to walk in after you’ve punched your tag.
And to be clear - it’s not just e-bike use during hunting season that has caused the problems we’ve seen in our area; it’s the traffic that starts showing up back in Mud, pressuring the Elk all through calving season. Fat tires make it possible to ride that much earlier.
It’s not good for the resource to deprive the animals of their sanctuary areas.
Sounds like Corax needs an e-bike to me, but won’t admit it.
Matt
So, Matt…. Can you show me ANYBODY who was in great shape 25 years ago who hasn’t lost a step??
I had my chance to hunt the High, Lonesome Country in my day. Maybe I still can. But those who are willing and able to get to those places under their own power shouldn’t have to share that country with those who can’t or won’t. JMO, Solitude is a privilege for those who earn it, and even the mightiest herd bull’s days are numbered. Not everyone can be Paul.
Everyone should aspire to be Paul. E-bikes have nothing to him. You made the claim that e-bikes would be “the end of the North American model”. That’s dumb, and you know it.
Matt
The power of the lobbyist.
I’ve seen countless guys lament against technology up until they get old enough to truly benefit from it. Then the tone changes. And then it’s, “well do you build your own bow? Then what’s the difference if I use a pedal assist.”
As e-bikes, etc become more mainstream, the harder the push will be to let them on “non-motorized trails.” It wont be hunters having the strongest voice in that, but they sure will benefit from it. And then the snowball picks up speed as it rolls down the mountainside. Is it the death of hunting? No, it’s not. But it does make a guy chuckle.
That electric motorcycle will be available later this year. That was an early prototype. Bakcou make great products and this one should be great. Although I don't see it being widely adopted by hunters. Maybe scouting on motorized trails, or a wider offroad use but not really hunting.
I don't think hunters need to worry about these motorcycles. No doubts because of the power and top speed they will need to be registered in most if not all states. And they would need to respect the motorized trails regulations.
Beautiful elk Grey Ghost, congrats!
Did you use the bike to pack out the meat? If so, how did you do it, saddlebags or? How far was your pack out/ride?
We were parked at a gate this last fall, the old logging road was terribly overgrown in a few spots with alder brush (just the way we like it to keep others at bay) on our return later that day i thought the walking was easy... realized that someone was up there cutting brush back... We had a visitor in camp that evening with two ebikes in the back of the truck... He asked what we saw up there today and I was nice enough to share.. Then it was my turn for a question so I asked if it was him up there trimming.. he said what if it was?? Thought that was funny. These types even go as far as moving boulders that the forest service put down to keep motors out..
x2 cbfromnd these types abound in the lincoln national forest in new mexico. blocked gates and no motorized vehicles signs mean nothing to them again just another version of the fat lazy man bike
Electric dirt bikes will be allowed where dirtbikes are allowed. So everywhere you currently get to listen to a dirt bike chasing elk off onto private maybe now you'll be lucky enough to have a quiet dirt bike frequenting the same area and not chasing them off with that loud 2-stroke whine. This would only be a good thing for public lands. Not every advancement is negative.
It's funny that the ebike users on here all try to imply that their ebike gives them no advantage over a regular bike or on foot. Yeah, sure, you' dropped all that cash to make your hunt more challenging. Right.
Maybe it identifies as a pedal bike??
#pedalandsweat #mybikespronouns
Interesting you say that Aspen. I would have said the opposite. I've heard nothing but praise from ebike users about the advantages they have with them. Because like you say, otherwise there would be no reason to have one. And reviews have been incredibly positive.
I've heard the same as Aspen Ghost. Guys spewing how it really doesn't help much. Basically they are loathe to admit that it's helping them a lot (I'm talking about mountain bikers, not hunters on e-bikes). I've had a handful of guys claim "it really doesn't help much, it just allows me to ride longer"...so that means it helps, right? One guy went on to explain that his particular bike level 1 provided something like 100 watts, "just enough to make up for the extra weight of the bike". Level 2 provided something like 200 watts, "enough to help a little on the hills". Level 3 only provided about 400 watts, "enough to help him go on longer rides". But that it wasn't significant. Yeah, right. Why is it a pro cyclist can put out in the 400 watt range for only a short period of time like a sprint. The pros put out about 100 watts per hour for longer races.
I only use my e-bike to get around my hunting properties, but the advantages are obvious.
I'm curious to see the list price on the e-motorbike. I bet it's salty. Also interested in the realistic battery life and range, plus the power differential when going up hills or off-terrain. If allowed on public property, it will definitely create more access pressure - as if it wasn't bad enough!.
“If allowed on public property, it will definitely create more access pressure - as if it wasn't bad enough!.”
Maybe it’s True when Pat says it???
The battery off an ebike started a 4 alarm fire this weekend
Maybe we can get them banned during high fire danger periods??
ROFL. But hey, a guy can always hope!!
As Pat said, the advantages of an e-bike are obvious. Never heard anyone claim differently.
What I dispute are the claims that an e-bike suddenly turns a lard-ass into a mountain scaling beast capable of going anywhere in the backcountry. And that e-bikes will "be the end of the North American model." That's simply ridiculous.
Matt
May sound ridiculous to you, but you haven’t had your favorite wilderness area Elk herd completely run outta the drainage. They’re all down on private now.
I suspect they're all down on private now because it's the middle of winter and that's where the winter range is? What wilderness area was this, that someone rode in there many miles on a rutted horse trail to scare your elk? And did you report them?
Just a tiny little area that used to have Elk pouring in from adjacent National Forest; one of the neighbors who used to hunt the drainage with us went Realtor and sold a ranch to some Dude… And he said they were looking at 350-400 head in SEPTEMBER; new owner said they’d been lounging there all Summer. I checked the area on Google Earth and you can see a half-dozen or so people who all appear to be on bicycles on a trail that had been no wider than one Elk needed to keep from tipping over and is now 3-4 feet wide with berms on the turns and a regular amusement park put in back up through the meadows & glades where we used to see game.
When guys forsake hunting an area they know intimately and which they can pack into from their back door to go hunt elsewhere, what more do you need to know??
So it wasn't a "wilderness area"? And you saw a half dozen guys on the screen shot who were all on ebikes? Hmmm.
How about if we start a list of all the technological advancements in the past 30 years that have supposedly made hunting "easier". Then make a list of all the super badass studs on Bowsite who have never used ANY of them. Might be really enlightening..
It’s a SMALL wilderness area, and the herd used to spend Spring and Summer utilizing a mix of NF & WA, up & down on a daily basis.
I won’t pretend to be able to spot an e-bike on Google Earth, but those fuzzy dots on the trail are too large to be pedestrians - but not too big to be the backs of riders stretched out over a bike- and the stretch that they’re on is too steep (or above a section too steep) to be a tempting ride for virtually anyone under 100% self-power. I’ve done it, and it’s brutal. And you know damn well that the people who went after that trail with picks and shovels to remove the rocks and build up the berms weren’t carting their tools up there under human power.
So let’s be real clear - it doesn’t have to be Hunters on the e-bikes; there are plenty of weekend warriors out there to stress the snot out of the Elk year-round. It’s just that collectively, they have been so effective that what used to be an almost impenetrable sanctuary with at least a couple of good bulls in it every year is now devoid of Elk.
As to technology…. I have nothing for which to apologize. I did hunt a few days one year with a compound and that MoFo cost me an Elk. Never again - at least not until infirmity gives me no choice, at which point I’ll probably just hunt with my .54… Roundball and Goex. Beyond that, yes, I wear appropriate footwear and clothing and yes, I use binoculars. That’s as high tech as I get. I’m not embarrassed.
There are no "small" wilderness areas with a "couple good bulls".
GF, I have an electric shovel if you need to borrow it to keep digging...
E-bikes are like compounds. For the lazy....
