High end arrows
Contributors to this thread:Equipment
From: Pat Lefemine
15-Mar-23
Im thinking of trying some new arrows. I shot carbon express reds for years but got sick of pruning out 4-5/12 shafts that would not fly right.
Last year I tried Victory VAP elites. They were way better than CX, but I found that the outserts were breaking off at the carbon shafts just beyond the glue line when I hit any resistance on animals.
So I’m in the market for something new. I don’t want the .166 shafts any more, I’m looking at the .204 where I can use real inserts.
This is for a hunting setup with fixed blade heads and I’m gonna try 4-fletch Tac vanes with a 2degree offset.
I’m thinking about trying the GT Airstrike arrows, or the Victory TKO elite shafts but am open to trying any of the higher end shafts.
Curious in your opinion.
Thanks
From: Bowboy
15-Mar-23
I’m a fan of the Easton Axis Match Grade arrows. Lots of choices available
From: BowHiker
15-Mar-23
Easton Axis, you won't go back to anything else after that.
From: ILbowhntr
15-Mar-23
Easton Axis or FMJ. No complaints about either.
From: MnM
15-Mar-23
Sirius Archery
From: Gus
15-Mar-23
I went through what you stated above more than a few years ago. I shot a bunch of the different ones out there. I choose Easton Axis 5 mm Match grade and have been happy with them. They are a tough and accurate arrow.
From: JTreeman
15-Mar-23
I‘ve been shooting Day Six for 3-4 years now. I like them, and particularly their component system. They have been pretty tough and reliable for me, but certainly not indestructible. However they are .166, so may not meet your criteria
—Jim
From: Coondog
15-Mar-23
Easton Axis. Most durable and best flying .204 arrow on the market. Do not waste your time with RIP TKO’s; they are incredibly weak because of the thin carbon weave walls.
From: EmptyFreezer
15-Mar-23
I saw an ad from Iron Will that he is making Easton arrows for his broadheads. got his own vanes as well. They are 5MM which is hat your looking for. Just an idea. Good Luck
From: Oryx35
15-Mar-23
They might be larger than what you are looking for, but I like the Gold Tip Hunter Pro arrows. I shot Axis for years. It's a solid arrow, but they can do some funny things as they get older/ or if they take a hard hit. It's something to watch out for. Tim Gillingham has YouTube videos going into more detail on the phenomenon.
From: Bigdog 21
15-Mar-23
I shoot the Easton 6.5 bowhunters there the old Beeman hunters. No problems
From: Pyrannah
15-Mar-23
axis for me for last few years
From: sticksender
15-Mar-23
Gold Tip Kinetic Kaos have served me well and I’ve never had a single flyer shaft I’m at least 10 dozen I’ve gone through. They are well worth the cost IMO. Switched from Axis several years ago due to having to cull a couple of flyers out of every dozen shafts.
From: Bowaddict
15-Mar-23
Tried Vaps few years ago and not happy with outserts and what you have to do to make them consistent. Loved how .166 arrows flew but wasn’t worth trouble for me. Went back to the arrow that’s killed more game than anything else for me, the axis 5mm. And now they have the match grade! I got caught up in the new .166 and outsert craze, but I’m back with the axis and glad I am.
From: kota-man
15-Mar-23
I just switched from Victory VAP TKO back to Match Grade 5mm Easton Axis. Tough to beat the 5mm Axis if you’re looking for .204.
From: BIGERN
16-Mar-23
If money's no object go to Iron Will for one stop shopping. They offer the Axis in Match grade. Tough, straight arrow.
From: Bowbender
16-Mar-23
Axis since 2007.
From: mattandersen
16-Mar-23
Can't go wrong with Gold Tips been using them for 15 years! Don't fix if it's not broke!
From: butcherboy
16-Mar-23
I’ve shot easton axis or fmj’s for years. GT are great as well but I have never shot them. I really liked the fmj’s but they bend easily when you miss a target.
From: carcus
16-Mar-23
Easton axis or fmj match grade, affordable and as good as anything if not better
From: MA-PAdeerslayer
16-Mar-23
Axis 5mm
From: Murph
16-Mar-23
Gold Tip in any variation for me, easy to tune and shoot great for me have some shafts that have taken a half a dozen animals with and still going strong refletch and away you go my analogy would be like buying lapua brass for reloading, tried axis years ago wasn’t impressed with the durability..
From: WV Mountaineer
16-Mar-23
I switched over to the Easton 6.5 match last year. They are bigger than the .204 but, all in all a great arrow. I bought precut footings from sapcut for them and run a normal insert instead of the shoulder orange one that comes with them. I glue them on flush with the insert. Best collar going for protecting the integrity of the arrow. A 265 fps, 450 grain arrow with a blunt bounces right off of steel. Doesn’t mushroom the tip either. Just something to consider.
From: 12yards
16-Mar-23
What inserts would you use with the .204 shafts? Most have outserts as well. The Axis have internal HIT inserts but it seems they get conflicting reviews. Is there a standard insert other than HITs out there for .204 shafts? I use standard shafts as I'm not convinced there are any advantages to the slightly smaller diameter .204 size. The "penetration" advantage to me is a bunch of bunk.
From: Mad Trapper
16-Mar-23
I use match grade axis and FMJ's. I have been able to get them to fly well with fixed blades out to 100 and hit with field points. I have taken just about all of the North American Species with these arrows.
From: Joe Holden
16-Mar-23
I'm bouncing between some Nexxus (.166) and Victory RIP TKO (.204) at the moment. Ditched the Victory insert in favor of a HIT with a VPA collar.
Once I actually run low on current inventory, the Easton Sonic looks promising. Think they're calling it a 6mm, unsure if that means .224 like the BE Spartan. Gives you the option to use a full flanged standard insert or upgrade to a 75/50 brass insert. Mirrors the same GPI as the Victory's I'm shooting as well (300 / 8.8 gpi).
From: 12yards
16-Mar-23
I have friends that love the RIP TKOs. But they are using the SS outserts.
From: Mark Watkins
16-Mar-23
Went to Victory RIP TKO .204 in the 300 spine when they came out. Accurate, tough as nails and so is the insert/outsert. They come pre fletched with helical and fly like darts.
And lighted nocks don’t break off in the like the .166
Mark
From: Pat Lefemine
16-Mar-23
Appreciate all the comments. I will admit I’ve not used Easton arrows since I retired aluminums. I miss my aluminum arrows! I’ve never used a carbon that matches their consistency.
I tried FMJ’s and didn’t like how they can set a bend so not interested.
I may try those Axis 5mm with HITs, however. I did a bit of research on them last night and the marketing sounds good, but not sure if the reality matches the marketing. For example: they claim the manufacturing process weaves the carbon instead of wrapping it in layers. They claim this results in an arrow with no spine index. I’m really anal about that so if true, that’s a compelling feature. The downside is I’m not crazy about the HIT inserts. I remember them being tricky to deal with when I shot FMJs.
Thanks for the opinions. I’m in tinkering mode right now.
From: Julius Koenig
16-Mar-23
I have been using axis or Fmj for ten years. Build all from scratch. Never had a problem with the hit- when using the supplied epoxy and leaving them on a level table.
I have never bent an Fmj. Broken a couple. But if you pull them straight out of the target it should be a non issue. I have though never used them for stump shooting.
From: LBshooter
16-Mar-23
Why not go back that you love?
From: yeager
16-Mar-23
Since 2014 I have been using Easton FMJ’s, and the last three years with TAC Driver 2.75’s in a four fletch configuration. This has been my best setup yet and do not see changing any time soon.
From: Blood
16-Mar-23
Pat, the Axis have a fiberglass “weave” mixed into their carbon. And yes it’s true about the spine on them. They are very good if you do the HIT properly with some strength to help. There are options out there if you want something that will stay intact upon hard hits.
From: LBshooter
16-Mar-23
Why not go back that you love?
From: Julius Koenig
16-Mar-23
I have been using axis or Fmj for ten years. Build all from scratch. Never had a problem with the hit- when using the supplied epoxy and leaving them on a level table.
I have never bent an Fmj. Broken a couple. But if you pull them straight out of the target it should be a non issue. I have though never used them for stump shooting.
From: Kurt
16-Mar-23
Easton Carbon Injexions (4mm diameter but now discontinued) have served me very well the past decade. I despise the Deep6 insert system though....so use an outsert with standard threads, but still install the stainless steel D-6 insert in the shaft at the standard location. It is put in for an additional 22 gr of weight, but also for internal reinforcing of the shaft. I've not had a single broken shaft at the point end ever with this system, including a spined black bear rolling over onto the shaft and snapping off the broadhead shank at the base of the head. The arrow was perfect.
I'd look at doing something similar with 5mm Axis shafts, either the insert/outsert system described above or at least a collar to reinforce the end of the shaft. Good luck with it!
From: Bowfreak
16-Mar-23
Victory RIP TKO or Axis Match Grade with Iron Will or HIT components. Both of those would be great options. Since I know you don't care to pay for good equipment I would use whichever arrow suited you and add Iron Will components.
From: Coondog
16-Mar-23
Match the HIT inserts with some sort of collar similar to that of Iron Will’s impact collars and that will greatly strengthen the end of your arrow. What you read about not needing to spine index with Axis is correct. Because of how they make them with one piece carbon, there is no seam on the shafts. I think you’ll really like the performance of the Axis.
From: x-man
16-Mar-23
It's true that the weave has a better spine consistency than the traditional wrap. Carbon Tech makes all their shafts that way for that reason. The main issue with the weave is that it leaves an orangepeel-like surface. Most shaft makers grind that smooth and "paint" or wrap the shaft afterwards. Carbon Tech doesn't grind the shafts smooth. When I was a CT dealer I had Rick McKinney on the phone one day(he's actually the one who answered the phone that day), he explained how grinding the shaft smooth actually created possible weak spots in the spine.
CT makes the Lynx which is a .204" shaft but, I would recommend the gold-standard Whitetail XP at .243". You won't find a better grouping dozen arrows at any price than the CT Whitetail XP.
From: butcherboy
16-Mar-23
I was skeptical of the HIT inserts at first as well but I really like them now. I don’t use epoxy to put them in. Use a low heat hot melt glue. If the more brittle one is used then the inserts will pull out. Using the hot melt allows you to change insert weights easily. I usually use the 50/75 grain brass inserts in both my compound and longbow.
From: wacem
16-Mar-23
Gold Tip Pro Hunters for me, I have used the same 1 dozen to kill many deer.
From: LUNG$HOT
16-Mar-23
Easton Axis 5mm for this guy. I also use the weighted 50/75 grain HIT brass inserts. Have traditionally used blazers over a wrap but thinking of going with a different vane in a 4 fletch this year.
From: Mad Trapper
16-Mar-23
Fmj’s can bend, but I have backpacked with them and been on horseback with them with no issues. They can bend however when pulling them from a target if you are not careful though.
From: Bill V - Iron Will
16-Mar-23
Bill V - Iron Will 's Link
Pat, there are a lot of good arrows out there, but I do think Easton Axis shafts are inherently more spine consistent circumferentially with their pultrusion process. Most others cut a rectangular strip out of a carbon fiber sheet and wrap it around a mandrel, so there is a seam with different mechanical properties. We are using Axis shafts along with a new Hybrid Hunter vane on our new Iron Will arrows. I just posted another thread giving more details on these and a video here.
From: westgak
16-Mar-23
I’m on the same camp as a few others regarding the Easton Axis shafts. In my experience they are the most durable arrow I’ve used so far. Shot the Easton Fmj for a few years and they seemed very durable as well. Changed to the axis after a goat hunt, had my bow strapped to my pack and took a nasty spill landing on my bow. After checking equipment, noticed a slight wobble in two of my arrows.
From: GFL
16-Mar-23
Finally very satisfied with my arrow build. All Iron Will components with 204 arrow. We’ve had zero broke shafts on bulls since we switched components.
From: wildwilderness
16-Mar-23
Easton Axis. I don't like GT- vanes and inserts don't stay on/in for me.
From: smarba
16-Mar-23
I'm with X-man; been using Carbon Tech for decades, no reason to go with anything else. I've NEVER had to cull arrows or rotate nocks or monkey around with trying to get them to group together.
From: wyobullshooter
16-Mar-23
Axis 5mm for me as well.
From: ahunter76
16-Mar-23
Pat, Been a Bowsiter for awhile now in Archery/bowhunting since 1956. So I know your not a newbie either. Save yourself a ton of cash when in comes to your shaft, no more culling a new Dz to get 6 or whatever "good ones". No outserts & LESS damaged arrows in your future. A shaft with better tolerances the 99% of the Carbons out there at 4,5,6 times the cost. GET yourself an Aluminum shaft & put any tip you want on it. With an Aluminum you can probably use 2, 3 different sizes that will tune great to get the desired "weight" you want. How do I know? Because I've done it for over 6 decades. I did Carbons 2 years & it was one of the worst things I ever tried. I was NEVER satisfied with various things & for sure, an Aluminum was like a thousand times better for tolerances. I know, I'm just an old timer jabbering away but yea know, I might be onto something.. I get crap all the time competing from the Carbon boys but it's shameful when a 80 yr old with failing eyes whips that 50 yr olds arse on the range. I'm guessing you can keep them all in the target practicing so you would see a "big" drop in piddly damage like in Carbons..
From: Teeton
16-Mar-23
For quite a few year I shot victory vforce Elite also know as the V1 with .001 straightness. After shooting a new set for, say 25 times I ran them on my old aluminum arrow straightener and realized they weren't .001 anymore. Now this was just target practice. So I try to see how straight some of my other friend arrow ( can't remember what they were) were, but they were not as straight as factory claimed after being shot a bunch of times. So the next time I ordered shalfs I ordered Victory gamers also know as v3 for .003 straightness. Out of box they were .003 straight, after shooting awhile not anymore. But were just about the same as my old Elite shalfs. So checked a friends out of box arrows (not victory) and they did the same thing after being shot. I can't remember the costs difference right now but if I end up with the same result, why pay a lot more from the out of box straighter shafts. I do a lot of 3D league and most times I'm in the up 5%. So I'm happy with that. I just looked at Lancaster archery and Victory VForce gamer bare shafts are $7.50 a shaft. So I'm shooting a 350, which has a OD of .298.. My 28 inch, 350 with a 22gr insert, 3 inch wrap, with three 2 inch blazer, stock nock, 100gr head weighs in at about 414 gr. Biggest things taken so far with great penetration has been Elk and Bear. Ed
From: Tradmike
16-Mar-23
I like sirus shafts. They fly well and are well made.
From: Lewis
16-Mar-23
I remember getting several CT s from Xman back in the day and they grouped extremely well and I still have some left. I think they left the US but now are back.Good luck Pat
From: nchunter
16-Mar-23
I use Victory VF TKO 350 arrows. I use a 75 grain ethics archery insert. They weigh about 460gr using a 125 broadhead. They are a .246 diameter but for my setup they are perfect.
From: Tilzbow
17-Mar-23
Black Eagle Spartan. Black Eagle shafts have excellent spine consistency in my experience and with the Spartan shaft you can use a regular insert.
From: WhattheFOC
17-Mar-23
I’m shootimg Sirius Apollo. They give the most reliable blood spatter.
From: RD in WI
17-Mar-23
The best arrow is the Victory VAP Elite .166 with the stainless steel insert, either the 95 grain Shok taper lock or the older VAP Penetrator. If they are breaking, it is because they are not flying straight and the problem lies in a poor tuning job, not the arrow/insert combination.
From: x-man
18-Mar-23
It's interesting to see the plugs for the VAP's. I couldn't give mine away fast enough. I bought them to use for outdoor target 900, FITA and Field rounds because of the small OD offering less wind resistance. There were so many "Fliers" that I had trouble getting more than 4 or 5 out of a dozen to group in a 4" circle at 60 in perfect conditions out of a shooting machine.
From: Ironbow
18-Mar-23
I would be careful of the GT Airstrikes. I have a friend that spent an unreal amount of money on 2 dz. Out of the 2 dz, there were 5 straight shafts! We put them on my arrow straightener AFTER he had cut both ends and fletched them. He couldn’t get a 12” group at 50 yds and he is a good shot. He was telling me about it and we checked every arrow. They were terrible.
He called GT and sent them videos spinning the shafts. Some were as far as .025 out for an arrow advertised as .001! The ICE coating was wearing very quickly as well. They sent him 5 new shafts and they were just as bad!
He switched to Easton Axis and problems were gone.
From: Blood
18-Mar-23
XMan, x’s 2. Those arrows are fragile. Weak. Pat was looking for some good solid arrows with integrity to withstand hard impacts. I think he’s all set for now.
From: TODDY
18-Mar-23
Lots of mixed reviews on the Victory's. They now have the VAP SS arrows. Wondering if that helped fix the "fragile" piece that a few have mentioned. I am in the market for new arrows as well for this fall so I'm paying attention to all of the reviews. TODDY
From: MA-PAdeerslayer
18-Mar-23
So whatcha gonna go with Pat
From: Bill V - Iron Will
18-Mar-23
Pat, If you decide to go with Axis or another .204 arrow with a HIT insert, consider adding Impact Collars. They really strengthen the end for hard impacts.
From: Hunts_with_stick
19-Mar-23
Gold tip hunter here! Been using for the last 10+ years
From: Fran
20-Mar-23
I have been shooting the vap ss and so far have never broken one. I have been using them since they came out and am still on my first dozen and all spun true with no flyers.
From: SaddleReaper
20-Mar-23
RIP TKO elite shafts with the 75gr taper lok insert (stainless insert/ aluminum collar) for me. I switched from .166 GT Pierce Platinums to those and don't see myself going back. I was going to go with ethics components but found the runout, and ultimately fall-out, wasn't bad with the few dozen I built up with factory components. No matter what meticulous build process I went through from cutting both ends, squaring, prepping etc., and even trying ethics components, I always seemed to have at least 50% fall-out after checking runout with the GT's. So many wobbly, expensive arrows.
The 5mm axis was high on my list as well when I was looking to switch. Can't remember for sure why I went Victory, but it was probably partly the gpi to spine rating, allowing me to build a high FOC arrow at a reasonable weight. So far they seem tough after a few target misses - one into dirt, one into a tree, and 4 through deer. All spun well enough to keep using.
I'd be hesitant to run TAC vanes though... No personal experience with them, but I've heard from buddies they are stiff to the point of being brittle in the cold. No thanks.
From: SaddleReaper
20-Mar-23
Dang I didn't even realize Carbon Tech was still in business. Those arrows look intriguing.... little lighter than the Axis per given spine. Probably a tough arrow with the multi directional layup.
From: smarba
21-Mar-23
SaddleReaper, yeah I've always found it intriguing that Carbon Tech never really garnered the attention they seem to be due. They were making consistent-spine arrows nearly from the beginning, and as far as I know they're still making the same arrows today. They did move overseas for a while, then came back.
From: Brotsky
21-Mar-23
Axis 5 mm with the brass HIT and impact collars. Finally found my perfect set-up for FOC, strength, and durability.
From: 12yards
21-Mar-23
Brotsky, do you use them as 50 or 75 grain inserts?
From: LUNG$HOT
21-Mar-23
Brotsky- I use the same brass insert but have never used the impact collars. Worth it? I was thinking about trying out the 25gr Iron Will collar’s and using the brass inserts at 50 gr instead of 75. I really like the weight up front with a 125 gr head. Gives excellent balance and great consistency on my shots.
From: Brotsky
21-Mar-23
12 yards...I used to use 75 but after adding a collar I went to 50, total weight is the same up front with the collar and the 50 as it was prior with the 75.
Ethic's Archery has collars as well that are a bit more affordable than IW if interested. A few other people sell them too.
From: Pat Lefemine
21-Mar-23
This has been a great discussion. Thanks everyone.
I ended up with the axis 340 match grade arrows, 4” wraps, Q2i 2.1 vanes, Iron Will 25g collars, and Iron Will 25gr HIT inserts. Looking forward to the build process and giving this a try.
From: Brotsky
21-Mar-23
Joe, I can't say if it's worth it or not. I didn't break any off before the collars or after. It makes me feel better though so there's that! Ha!
From: MA-PAdeerslayer
21-Mar-23
3 fletch or 4 pat?
From: Pat Lefemine
21-Mar-23
4-fletch
From: Stoneman
21-Mar-23
Pat, curious which broadheads and weight will you be flying with this set up?
From: MA-PAdeerslayer
21-Mar-23
Sweet!
From: 12yards
21-Mar-23
Just ordered some Easton Sonics to try this year out of my Elite Enkore. Going to fletch them up with 3" parabolic Gateway barred orange feathers on a 5.5" wrap. Going to hunt with a 125 grain head. I've never hunted with a sub 400 grain arrow. I'm going to give it a shot. Will be 382 grains with 14.7% FOC.
From: Blood
21-Mar-23
12 lol. I’d be shooting 350 fps with that arrow. My bow might blow up. :)
From: Scoot
21-Mar-23
Pat- curious as to why the 25 grain collars plus the 25 grain HIT inserts vs. just going with a 50 grain collar? Doesn't really matter either way, just curious...
My guess is you'll love that setup!
From: Blood
21-Mar-23
Scoot, IW doesn’t make an impact collar that big.
From: 12yards
21-Mar-23
Well Blood, I'm only pulling 52#s. Don't think I'll touch 350??.
From: Scoot
21-Mar-23
Blood, I swear I saw they had 10 or 50 grain options. Am I losing my mind? I very well may be..
From: Matt
21-Mar-23
Easton Axis here, but I shot CarbonTech for years and sometimes wonder why I tried something different. Probably to try something different.
Before that I shot GoldTip and their spine consistency was crap, but that was a long time ago. I shot a while dozen CT's into a smaller group than I averaged with 3 of GT's premium shafts the only time I tried.
