Are the Duck Mountains over hunted?
Bears
Recently finished a unsuccesful spring bear hunt. Their advertisement boasts "Hunt big....hunt color....hunt here". We saw niether....couple of nights there between the guys in our group nothing shootable was even seen. Thgis is not to rag on the outfitter but ...man, something has to be said about advertising and absolutely nothing lining up. Too many guys in camp for the 'guides' (if you can call them that) and the outfitter running around just to keep the operation afloat instead of helping his clients connect with the bears of thier dreams or what was simply advertised. I'm starting to wonder if places like the Duck Mountains has gone the way of other over advertised areas and simply not what it used to be. Lastly- how can an outfitter take your money and not even research what you are truly after and expecting until the last day or 2 of the hunt? We simply concluded that the bears aren't what they used to be.
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One of my really good friends outfits in the ducks and the bears they see and kill are insane. I am sorry but you are definitely wrong. Look up Stickflingers, they have a camp in the Ducks as well. Used to be just the Porcupine Mountain area but they expanded. Overhunted is about the last thing that the Ducks are. As an outfitter they are given an allocation for an area where no other outfitters are allowed inside. The allocation they have I don't know if they've even seen a resident hunt there. There are few things in North America that are less pressured than their allocation in the Ducks to be honest. I don't think their website is very up to date because their repeat clientele is so steady and word of mouth that keeps them booked up.
A few of us just got back from Manitoba. Not the Ducks but close. Overhunting in a bear concession isnnt even worth condideration IMO. As APauls said, they are given a specific amount of tags for the outfitting area. They can kill no more bears than allocated tags allow for, and most residents arent travelling several hours several times a week to bait for a bear. From what Ive seen and had conversations about with the outfitters I have hunted with, the government is very conservative with the number of tags for a given area.
Timing of a bear hunt can be the biggest factor, and big bears dont get big by cooperating for a hunter every day. Throw color phase into the mix and it gets exponentially harder. Number of baits is also a consideration based on numbers of hunters for the whole season. If the outfitter has10 baits, and 10 hunters coming, I would look elsewhere.
Genetics play a role in it also, but that wouldnt be a problem where you were. The Ducks have good genetics.
Outfitters arent created equal, and a shooter for someone else may not be a shooter for you. Colored bears tend to get shot as younger bears, solely based on their color.
We all see pictures of bears online with a posted weight. Pictures of a scale tend to be more accurate than pictures without. If big bears are what you are looking for, then ask your outfitter if they weigh their bears. Most dont.
See the other thread asking people what their guess was on the weight. The guesses are all over the place.Said bear was never weighed, and it doesnt seem to be a problem for that hunter, just a conversation piece for discussion. Albeit a very good bear that most guys wouldnt think twice about shooting, self included. ( not calling you out Shug, just using it as an example)
Sometimes a person knows the answer to a problem, but refuses to acknowledge it.
From reading your description of the outfitter, how could you not rag on the outfitter?
Depending on the outfitter and number of baits by this late in the spring his baits were probably over hunted.
"Sometimes a person knows the answer to a problem"
I think I might know where the problem lay....
You have to keep in mind this year it went from winter to summer in Manitoba the bears have a lot of grasses and what ever else they eat they r not after the bait like other years in the spring ,that would of play a bit of a roll in your experience.
The truth of the matter is....and I hesitate to say this ....that it becomes "all about the money". This particular outfitter prided himself on his high standard of ethics. I think guys start out with great ideals but the money wins them over.
An outfitter cannot be ok with guys going home empty handed (unless you are a trophy bear hunter). A first time bear hunter in our group went home empty handed. We wont be back.
I hunted with Canadian Wilderness Outfitter last spring and had a great hunt. I saw numerous bears each day with the high being 13. I shot a big brown bear that went over 20". My buddy shot a 19+. It was good enough for me to book a return trip.
I don't think it's a problem with the area. Either your outfitter wasn't properly prepared, or conditions played a role.
After reading some of these responses it confirms more than ever that maybe it was the outfitter we were with.
Sounds like it was bad timing for your group. Sucks every single guy didn’t shoot a giant, but that isn’t how it works. I certainly have no details (from both sides) about your hunt, but I have no idea why you would expect your 1st time hunter friend to be guaranteed a bear or a return hunt. Give me a break. I’ve been on successful and unsuccessful hunts all over the world. Sometimes you get them sometimes you don’t, I NEVER expect an offer for a return trip (or whatever compensation you are suggesting he is entitled to).
Sound like you guys didn’t get the hunt you expected for whatever reasons and now you are unhappy. And unfortunately it is about money, it’s how he pays his bills and feeds his family, it’s called a business, but to you it’s pleasure, it can be hard to separate those from the “hunters” side of the fence. Sorry things didn’t work out, but it is what it is, it’s called hunting.
—jim
it has been a while but i have spring bear hunted a few times in idaho along the st. joe river. at one point i was running my own baits for me and a buddy, or at least trying to.
my first thought when i read the original post was the bears have simply moved on to other food sources. we have resident deer around home and even they stop raiding the bird feeder once green-up starts. they prefer the natural grasses and whatever else they like and is starting to grow.
The western edge of Manitoba has some of the best genetics in the world for black bears. It's an insane bear factory.
Sorry about your experience but you should learn from this. It is time well spent to do your due diligence and minimize the risk of an “unsuccessful” hunt.
I hunted bears last spring with an Alberta outfitter that is very active here on bowsite and didn’t get a bear. It happens. Wasn’t mad about it. Didn’t go after the guy.
What I did do was book two more hunts with the same outfit. I did this because I know the potential.
Thank you for all of the responses.....I think the thing that bothers me the most is that our experience there didn't match the advertisement and the promotions....and those are the very things that sold us.
Definitely been a learning experience for me.
I'll also say I know Todd and his family, flat out great people. I was shocked to read this review really was. I also know I've hunted prime baits that no one else gets to hunt and never saw a "shooter." Now my expectations were a 7' sq 19.5" plus. But even on an awesome bait a kill isn't guaranteed. I'm sorry you had a bad experience or it didn't line up with your expectations, but as you know it's still hunting, if it was guaranteed I don't think we'd like it nearly as much.
People get paid to advertise and promote things. Beyond that it is up to us to sift through it and figure out what is made up, true, or somewhere in between.
Sounds like you didnt talk to previous hunters, or your outfitter before shelling out the coin. Unsuccessful hunts do happen, and I have been on plenty, but with the right expectations and comfort level going in, coming home empty doesnt feel as bad when you, the outfitter, and guides tried your hardest and the quarry you sought after won. It happens, and it happens alot.
The outfitter review section here is for just exactly this type of homework, but it is only one piece to the puzzle. Due diligence is up to us.
Don’t conflate hope with expectations or you will be bummed. Have high hopes. Have moderate expectations. Things seldom go as great as we hope nor as bad as they could have. Life is in the middle other than the occasional peak or valley.
Hunting is not a video game. We deal with reality and its nature. We control much les than we don’t. What we fully control…… and control 100%……is our attitude.
Calbruse. May I ask? How many bear hunts have you been on? Just curious. Thanks
I agree with Alex, RJ and Boubound. Great comments.
I hunt near the Ducks with Stickflingers and they have more bears than you can shake a stick at. You can take a big one home if you're pateint and Artemis favors you.
Sorry you had a bad experience but after COVID and the 2 year break the bears had that area should be putting giants on the ground regularly. The area is filthy with bears!
I hunted in the porcupines in spring 2019 and had 2 bear weight 223 each in camp. That outfitter sold most of his tags to Stickflingers and some to another outfitter. In fall of 2021 I hunted with the smaller outfitter and had 40+ bear come to bait the first night I actually passed up 2 huge bear the first night not wanting to end the fun. I ended up taking the chocolate one the last night. weighed 505 lbs. After I shot it the other big black came in. It was shot 2 weeks later and went 510 lbs Mine netted 20 2/16 and the black went just under 21. We went back in Spring of 22 which was a late spring with a lot of winter kill in the woods. Deer, Elk and even saw a moose Caucasus so hunting was slow. One bear we got went 440 with skull just under 21. The outfitter has one down this year so far at 410.
The area is so big and has produced big bear for years. It's as they say a bear factory.
I don't know anything about the Ducks, or the outfitter, or you, and I haven't done a lot of guided hunts, but I think it should be up to YOU to discuss your expectations with the outfitter and with references. I don't think it's the outfitters job to manage your expectations.
If you had certain expectations, I would have asked the outfitter if those expectations were reasonable for his hunts and I would have discussed that with his references as well. I would also have communicated that prior to booking that you were hunting for a certain class of animal, if that was the case.
Just remember that no outfitter can control the weather, and that has a lot more to do with many hunts than most guys realize or are willing to admit. Some years are just tougher than others.
“All outfitters are not created equal” is the best advice here. I just got back from a week in the Duck Mountains. They are definitely not overhunted.
I think it varies by the outfitter, lots of changes with Covid also especially if outfitters didn't keep or skimped on baits during the pandemic. I've always been very happy with Stickflingers who outfits in that area
What and how much bait were they using?
Sounds like the hunters weren't the best to have in camp, to say the very least.
