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Gillingham and Douglas dropped by BT
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Contributors to this thread:
midwest 18-Oct-23
Bowfreak 18-Oct-23
JTreeman 18-Oct-23
Bou'bound 18-Oct-23
Bowfreak 18-Oct-23
JTreeman 18-Oct-23
Charlie Rehor 18-Oct-23
Dino 18-Oct-23
JTreeman 18-Oct-23
Murph 18-Oct-23
midwest 18-Oct-23
Will 18-Oct-23
JTreeman 18-Oct-23
rattling_junkie 18-Oct-23
Dino 18-Oct-23
Corax_latrans 18-Oct-23
Brotsky 18-Oct-23
midwest 18-Oct-23
KHNC 18-Oct-23
t-roy 18-Oct-23
No Mercy 18-Oct-23
Bowfreak 18-Oct-23
HDE 18-Oct-23
WapitiBob 18-Oct-23
PECO2 18-Oct-23
PECO2 18-Oct-23
Will 18-Oct-23
Michael 18-Oct-23
Bowfreak 18-Oct-23
WhattheFOC 19-Oct-23
Will 19-Oct-23
Beendare 19-Oct-23
Ambush 19-Oct-23
Corax_latrans 19-Oct-23
From: midwest
18-Oct-23

midwest's embedded Photo
midwest's embedded Photo
Got this news from Native Okie.

Anyone who follows professional archery at all probably knows the incredible achievements of Tim Gillingham and Kyle Douglas. Pretty shocking news!

From: Bowfreak
18-Oct-23
I saw it. It won't take those guys long to have a contract. I assume Mathews, like everyone else in competitive archery.

From: JTreeman
18-Oct-23
I’m just a dummie, and certainly have no knowledge of the cost of their contracts, but I personally wonder how companies measure/justify their return on that spend.

I personally buy bows fairly often (not every year) and kinda sorta keep up with companies offerings and “advancements”, and it makes absolutely no difference to me who their staff shooters are, zero, none. I’m kinda a Levi fan, but his shooting Mathew’s has absolutely no bearing on what I buy. Maybe it does for some guys.

To be quite honest I don’t know that I’ve ever heard of Kyle, and only vaguely know of Tim. I mean, if the contracts are a few thousand dollars I guess whatever, but I suspect for top name guys they are significantly more. How many bows they gotta sell to pay a guy say $100k a year? I think I heard once that Mathew’s paid Levi $1mill a year (I could be completely wrong). They obviously think it’s money well spent, I just wonder… can anyone enlighten me?

Edit: according to google Levi’s contract with Mathew’s was estimated to be $1mill over 10 years, so basically $100k a year. Make more sense to me I guess, but seems like gotta sell a bunch of bows to cover that…

—Jim

From: Bou'bound
18-Oct-23
Never heard of them but I never heard to Corey jinks either

From: Bowfreak
18-Oct-23
Jim,

I think your question is one a lot of people ask. I am not sure how they measure their ROI, but when thinking about these target guys it is also important to think that a lot of people shoot target archery internationally. I am not sure how this makes sense to Bowtech as they have almost no target archery presence, but for someone like Hoyt I can see it. Hoyt dominates international sales and it would make sense to me that they would have large target archery marketing pushes. I, like you, still don't see the big picture because while Hoyt has this large international presence they still decided to dial their paid shooting staff way back a few years ago.

I do think that over time people like Chris Bee or the Hushin guy (it makes me puke to talk about the Hush guys) types are where the future is. The manufacturer sends a guy a few bows, maybe even some cash too, and those guys do a bunch of free advertising on their social media accounts with their huge followings.

From: JTreeman
18-Oct-23
BF- good point, I guess I don’t really think international ;).

I don’t even know who Chris Bee or the Hushn guy is either, I guess I live under a rock. But agree in general, dishing out some free bows and swag to “influencers” is probably the way of the future.

—Jim

18-Oct-23
Yes, but you do know “Bigpizzaman”.

From: Dino
18-Oct-23
And he also “knows” Joel Turner.

From: JTreeman
18-Oct-23
Actually Joel knows ME! LOL

—Jim

From: Murph
18-Oct-23
Wow that’s crazy news, those guys were winning everything especially Tim in the senior pro from a marketing standpoint I can’t think of 2 guys you would want on your prostaff more…

From: midwest
18-Oct-23
Dino, You mean Joel Turner "knows" Jim Treeman. ;-)

Bowhunting and Target archery are two different realms. Probably a small percentage of bowhunters that would recognize any of the pro archer names. Levi is well known by bowhunters because of his hunting show and due to him being the best of the best in 3D archery. Gillingham and Douglas aren't selling hunting bows.

From: Will
18-Oct-23
I'm not a big follower of competitive archery... Ill watch some vegas or Lancaster just to be amazed, but it's not "must see" for me. I'm in the boat of a few others above... What a pro shoots has zero impact on me shooting a bow. Then again, I'm still happily shooting a 2008, so I'm a bad customer!

That said, I feel for the two guys who were dropped. Sponsors in pro sports can be cutthroat and tough to get. Losing them, no matter how good you are or how quick another may come, is a hurdle. Hope those guys navigate it ok.

From: JTreeman
18-Oct-23
Wait, there are bows that aren’t for hunting!?!?!?

—jim

18-Oct-23
Gillingham is awesome and like to hunt. That sucks they let him go.

From: Dino
18-Oct-23
Midwest, to quote Daniel Day Lewis from the Crucible, without drawing any parallels or covert meanings, I believe one or the other has Known that man. :)

18-Oct-23
“The manufacturer sends a guy a few bows, maybe even some cash too, and those guys do a bunch of free advertising on their social media accounts with their huge followings.”

You’re not kidding. I saw one positive mention of a $100 item drive sales of 500 or 600 of them overnight. Normal volume was maybe 5-10 units in a week. I’m sure that’s why the tree-saddle fan-boys are apparently acting like recently converted religious zealots… they’ve gotta be on the payroll one way or another….

From: Brotsky
18-Oct-23
Influencers are the way. Just go post some truth on a Bowmar thread. I can't believe how many guys can type that fast with one hand on the keyboard and the other hand on Josh's junk.

From: midwest
18-Oct-23
Kyle Douglas is quite the western hunter as well. He’s killed some slammer bucks and bulls in the backcountry on his own in Utah.

From: KHNC
18-Oct-23
Bowtech is in the heart of lib country as well.

From: t-roy
18-Oct-23
The bigger question is, will Joel admit to knowing Jim.

From: No Mercy
18-Oct-23
Bwaahaaahaaaa Brotsky-well stated!

From: Bowfreak
18-Oct-23
Spot on Brotsky. Those jerks have a huge following online.

From: HDE
18-Oct-23
Josh who?

From: WapitiBob
18-Oct-23
Paige made close to $200,000 just in contingency in 2023, sells far more bows than Gillingham and Douglas, and across multiple disciplines. I suspect the marketing guy got called into the bosses office after they totaled up what was spent on all 3 contracts and decided Douglas and Gillingham's money could be spent in better places.

From: PECO2
18-Oct-23
"Then again, I'm still happily shooting a 2008, so I'm a bad customer!" Same here.

"Bowtech is in the heart of lib country as well." ? Lib as in liberal?

I don't know who the woman is they retained. So I checked out her fb page. She posted a giraffe video. Frontal shot. She got a lot of hate for that. Skimming the comments, it sounds like you want a frontal for a giraffe? I didn't know that.

From: PECO2
18-Oct-23
I don't know who the other guys are either.

From: Will
18-Oct-23
Peco, fist bump for the old bow. Nice. Brotsky - Amen man!

From: Michael
18-Oct-23
If I remember right Gillingham took Douglas under his wing in the 3D archery world.

Both of them shoot a release with an index finger trigger. Both are command shooters. No surprise release with them two.

Kyle us almost unstoppable in the the knownpro. If you made it to a shoot off with him you better be punching rings to have a chance at beating him.

From: Bowfreak
18-Oct-23
Kyle command shoots a thumb button not in index finger release like Gillingham does.

From: WhattheFOC
19-Oct-23
Kind of ironic that both these guys got released by surprise.

From: Will
19-Oct-23
WhattheFOC wins Bowsite for today! ha ha ha! Well done, very well done!

From: Beendare
19-Oct-23
I'm with JTreeman.

The company decided there weren't getting much return on their investment and either they are pulling in their horns due to potentially less bow sales or they are going a different route in their marketing.

There are so many wannabe Pro Staff guys that will sing their praises for almost nothing, it might make sense to go that route.

From: Ambush
19-Oct-23
Heck, all you need is one well respected and admired shooter to come on Bowsite once a year and shout "Game Changer!! Just what I was hoping for!!! Those other junk, toy bows makers are done!"

19-Oct-23
I wonder how bad a hurt the crossbow adoption rate has put on BowTech? Or have they jumped into that game too? But you know that crossbow shooters aren’t going to be upgrading every couple years the way that compound shooters do, so the repeat sales revenue stream just isn’t gonna be there.

I don’t follow any of these social media celebrities, but I do recall some gal making national headlines for having shot a giraffe and the impression I was left with was not good for hunting… I don’t usually pay any attention to celebrity spokespeople when making a buying decision— I’m usually 100% about quality and value — but with hunting under attack the way it is, we really need those public faces to keep their noses squeaky clean. And their sponsors are in a good position to demand it. So by extension, it may be necessary for the manufacturers to lose some sales…

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