Anything tougher than a WT to recover?
Contributors to this thread:Whitetail Deer
From: Cazador
28-Nov-23
Going off the thread “when should I recover this deer” it brings be to believe WT deer are just plain unforgiving when it comes to shot placement being just a little off. Their toughness, and the places they inhabit can make recovery challenging on a good shot.
Feet about 12 feet up, deer 9 yds out, how far is this deer going? (Not actual deer)
From: Missouribreaks
28-Nov-23
No two shots are exactly alike in what anatomical structures they sever, although they may appear that way. Be careful making generalizations.
From: Cazador
28-Nov-23
After shot, deer runs about 60lyds, staring at the doe he was tailing. Looks wobbly but it’s been 30-40 seconds and he’s still on his feet.
From: Willieboat
28-Nov-23
I think sometimes they are so jacked up on testosterone that that becomes a factor?
From: Cazador
28-Nov-23
About a minute passed out comes another buck, runs right at the doe, the buck already shot goes into defense mode and chases him 60-70 yds, but pulls up watching the buck and doe move off into a slough.
Buck looks like he bedded, but three minutes later I seen movement and see the buck walking back along a tree line. Once out of sight, I get down and back out.
Next move?
From: BlacktailBob
28-Nov-23
I think all deer except, moose, are tough. Even those little Coues bucks can be tough as nails. Only thing tougher are Mountain Goats.
From: Brotsky
28-Nov-23
Next move? Watch the video, because you didn't hit him where you thought :)
From: badlander
28-Nov-23
I can’t say I’ve ever hit a deer there on a reasonably broadside shot with a sharp broadhead and ever had it run more than 60-70y. Add a bit of quarter to, or a steep quarter away and that’s a totally different story.
Still dead but may not be quick.
From: Cazador
28-Nov-23
Arrow 4 hours later. Questioning where I hit him.
Deer is on his feet for 5 minutes after initial shot.
From: Corax_latrans
28-Nov-23
“ Feet about 12 feet up, deer 9 yds out, how far is this deer going?”
Depends on where he was standing when the arrow got there.
Next move? If possible, give a good 45 minutes or an hour just watching, then go look for blood/hair at site of the initial hit and figure out where you DID hit him vs where you planned to.
I have bumped animals from their beds and only once did it conclude promptly thereafter. But after the scenario presented, we know that something substantial has Gone Wrong.
FWIW, at that height and range, I would have held for a shade higher and a bit farther back. Bigger target.
I don’t know that whitetails are any tougher than anything else, and I know they’re nowhere near as tough as a squirrel. They’re just not all that big, and it’s easy to be off by “just enough”.
From: bowyer45
28-Nov-23
If you hunt thick woods and swamps. Tracking is more important than how good you shoot , speaking only about lung shot whitetails. imho
From: fuzzy
28-Nov-23
A bad hit hog in thick cover is tough
From: Corax_latrans
28-Nov-23
One of these shots would likely have been a less-than-10% chance at recovery — high, single-lung — and the other dropped her in her tracks. The first skimmed just over the spine (between the processes) and the second just under, clipping the descending aorta.
Even when you know what you saw, you don’t always know exactly what you’re looking at.
From: BOHNTR
28-Nov-23
Elk
From: Bou'bound
28-Nov-23
Bears are tougher to recover. not tougher to kill, but where they live is a lot thicker than where deer live and they don't bleed much. I'd take a marginal hit on a deer in a woodlot any day over a marginal hit on a fat bear is some dark dense forest or swamp. they both may die, but that bear is hiding a lot better.
From: deerhunter72
28-Nov-23
Never hunted another species, but I've seen WT deer do things that defy belief and logic. In October, I shot a doe through both lungs and watched her run 400 yards across an open field. 2 weeks ago my son shot a buck through the heart with a 20ga slug and he ran over 80 yards. Adrenaline and the will to live are incredible in deer!
From: Cazador
28-Nov-23
Where deer was standing for 3+ minutes after chasing the other buck. Left pool is entry, right is exit using a Rage +P 1.5 inch cut. At that point I was wishing I used a Trypan or Spitfire and it was deja vu all over again from a couple years back.
From: Michael
28-Nov-23
It’s really hard to tell exactly from a picture but that blood looks darker than what lung blood would be.
From: Grey Ghost
28-Nov-23
A few years ago, I did a "How Far How Long Challenge" thread. I showed pics of the entrance and exit wounds on a buck I killed, and I asked folks to guess how far he ran and how long did he take to die. The majority of guesses were he ran under 50 yards and died in less than a minute. Nobody was even in the correct ballpark. The actual answer was he ran 7 yards, bedded down, and took a full hour to die.
My point is, there are no absolutes when it comes to shot placement and recoveries, IMO.
Matt
From: TREESTANDWOLF
28-Nov-23
It’s cliche but inches are inches on these animals.
I believe we often are surprised at the recovery or when dressing one out. It not often where we thought.
Hope you find him.
From: Cazador
28-Nov-23
Blood at shot looked pretty bright, but I don’t like animals that stand around after being arrowed. Especially big WT bucks.
So, how far do you think he went? BH was a Rage. Entry.
From: Grey Ghost
28-Nov-23
Let's see the exit wound.
From: Dale06
28-Nov-23
Elk
From: Cazador
28-Nov-23
Exit
From: Grey Ghost
28-Nov-23
I have no clue how far he went, but nice shot!! It appears he was quartering towards you, slightly. Congrats! Let''s see the hero pic.
Matt
From: Hancock West
28-Nov-23
75yards
From: Treeline
28-Nov-23
A couple of inches to the right of your dot (or the angle being slightly off) and you have a gut shot deer… Stomach is a lot further forward than most would think…
Whitetails can definitely be tough. But so can anything if the shot placement is a little off…
From: Mint
28-Nov-23
Looks like you only hit one lung which sure keeps them alive a lot longer.
I hit a doe quartering away lower than I thought from a tree stand with the arrow hitting the off leg and i missed both lungs and the heart it seemed. She went 240 yards and i found her in her bed.
From: Mint
28-Nov-23
I think a big hog is pretty tough especially when they are in a group since they will stick with the group and try to keep up until they die on their feet instead of bedding.
From: x-man
28-Nov-23
Arrow deflected on entry (common with a Rage). Only one lung, 800 yards or 8 hours, whichever comes first.
From: Treeline
28-Nov-23
Based on the pictures, that’s stomach. Just behind the heart.
Probably went 200 yards or so but likely within 100 yards of the initial shot.
From: Michael
28-Nov-23
I am guessing one lung and guts with the entry and exit holes. They can go a long way on that.
From: huntnmuleys
28-Nov-23
Sometimes for whatever reason, they can cover a lot of ground on a perfect shot. I helped a buddy track a Mule deer this year that he had shot, and we found it. 450 yards dot to dot on gps from where he shot it, I don’t know what it went, including the zigzagging.
Cleaning it out showed a perfect broadhead hole through both lungs. Shot was perfect. They can go along ways.
From: Bowaddict
28-Nov-23
Near side low lung(maybe), offside low liver. Both a little low for close treestand shot. 150yds
From: Cazador
28-Nov-23
I think Xman hit the nail on the head. The deer was broadside, no quarter at all, the arrow had to deflect upon entry.. I ended up on my knees for over 80 yds following tracks and pin drops here and there as in pin drops on your knees looking sideways. It wasn’t t until he got into a massive cattail slough did the track become easy between the sparse blood and the mud. Distance travelled 300ish yds. Stiff when I found him. Lung hit on one side, no liver, no guts on the other.
I left him for over 4 hours after the shot as all that on his feet stuff had me worried. I do think that buck charging out at the doe amped him up again.
From: Stekewood
28-Nov-23
The other thing to keep in mind is that the deer will pretty much always react to the sound of the shot, which can change the path of the arrow through the deer significantly. A deer that is broadside is often no longer broadside when the arrow impacts, even at close range.
From: Cazador
28-Nov-23
No doubt, about that, but I’m done with those +p Rage heads for deer. Three animals now, all shitty blood trails with them.
From: Starfire
28-Nov-23
Turkey in full strut can be pretty deceptive.
From: Treeline
28-Nov-23
Glad you recovered him. Sounds like a darn tough blood trail. Congratulations!
From: Bowaddict
28-Nov-23
Congrats! Tried a rage a long time ago on whitetail and had it snap in half. Did recover the deer and I’m sure they are much better now than they were then. At 60 pounds on the bow now, they aren’t for me.
From: RT
28-Nov-23
Do you have a pic of the entry side shoulder blade?
From: butcherboy
28-Nov-23
I was going to say it looks like a deflection but others beat me to it. Any broadhead can deflect but in all the years of processing WG I saw more half spoiled and spoiled animals come in because of deflection from mechanical broadheads. A good majority of those were rage broadheads. The best mechanicals are those that have swept back blades but that’s just one guys opinion! Lol
From: Pop-r
28-Nov-23
WT's are a very fragile animal compared to elk. You could shoot a wt in the hoof and it will die and shoot an elk through a lung and it live.
From: t-roy
28-Nov-23
^^^^We have a winner!!
Dumbest post of the day!
From: WV Mountaineer
28-Nov-23
Yep.
From: Cazador
29-Nov-23
The Rage +P 1.5 is a very swept back head. Way different than the standard rage. I’m not going away from mechanical heads on deer and bears as I like the pin point accuracy.
No pics of shoulder but the arrow didn’t hit it.
From: B2K
29-Nov-23
The whitetail deer has the fastest acting adrenaline system of all mammals. That sure aids in their toughness.
From: x-man
29-Nov-23
I had a nearly identical shot on a buck last year Thanksgiving weekend. I watched the lighted nock enter in the exact spot yours entered, from a ground level blind. After my standard 30 minute wait following a slam dunk hit, I went to find the arrow and blood. He had bedded just 50 yards from where I hit him. He jumped up as I was looking for a place to cross a fence. I watched him through the binocs and saw the exit low and back from the entry. We gave him an overnight wait and found him the next morning, STILL WARM. Which is the reason I gave the 8 hours or 800 yards comment. Had we pushed him, he could have easily covered 800 yards. As it was, he traveled about 200 yards, circling back to about 50 yards from the first blood. We found three bloody beds along that 200 yards, which means he almost gave up three times but then got up and continued on... probably after a hot doe...
From: W
29-Nov-23
I’ve killed four does with the Megameat. That’s an impressive mechanical. Big holes and all pass throughs. Lots of blood on the ground.
From: APauls
29-Nov-23
Jackrabbit is toughest animal for my vote. You can shoot a leg clean off and they'll still do mach 3 you'd never know they've been hit. Years of going out every Saturday and shooting 30 jacks/weekend you see some crazy stuff.
From: 12yards
29-Nov-23
I lost a doe last year on the same shot but I was higher. I hit exactly where I wanted to but my aim point should have been higher. I believe I got one lung. She bounded off and stood for 5 minutes, then bedded. I stayed in stand for half an hour till dark and snuck out. I was expecting her to die within a minute of the shot. I came back 4 hours later and she was gone, no blood. The next day I put on 6 miles on this 40 acre woods looking for her. The landowner found her the next day on the edge of his pond off a steep bank in the pond. I walked past that spot twice and never saw her. She was pretty much devoured by wolves. Birds gave away her location. I believe if you shot a bit higher he would have gone 100 yards or less and died quickly.
From: Grey Ghost
29-Nov-23
A young man, who I taught to bow hunt, killed this buck on my place yesterday morning using a Rage Extreme. It was a complete pass-thru, and the holes were HUGE. The head was undamaged. The blood trail looked like it was sprayed from a garden hose. The buck went 30 yards and was dead in seconds. I've always been an advocate of fixed blades, but after seeing the damage that Rage caused, I may have to re-think it.
Matt
From: Beendare
29-Nov-23
I’ve had mech heads deflect like that…but I still say it wasn’t the BH.
From an elevated position, the shot was too low. Hey, it happens. You knew you missed getting both lungs when he was still on his feet chasing that other buck.
I like that lower 1/3rd shot while on the ground….but from a treestand….I aim for where I want the exit hole.
From: W
29-Nov-23
I’ve killed four does with the Megameat. That’s an impressive mechanical. Big holes and all pass throughs. Lots of blood on the ground.
From: 12yards
29-Nov-23
BTW, the doe I lost was with a four blade 125 grain Magnus Stinger. I don't think the head is the culprit. A Rage +P is plenty capable of killing as good as any head. IMVHO.
From: MichaelArnette
29-Nov-23
100 percent! Elk for sure
From: Bowfreak
29-Nov-23
Looks to me like a shot that exited through the stomach. Sometimes deer run a long way on perfect hits. It is not a perfect science. The good news is you recovered him.
It reminds me of a Bone Collector episode when one of the guys shoots a buck in Texas just a little back of the heart. The other guy killed it later a long ways away from the original shot. Deer don't just pack it in and die, but they aren't invincible either.
From: DonVathome
29-Nov-23
I agree with cazador. Generally speaking whitetails are the hardest thing to recover of all the big game animals I have hunted.
They're also tons and tons of threads the pictures were people think they hit a deer. Often they're just a little off or the deer was angled slightly differently than they thought. This has happened to me several times. It's almost like your mind wants to put your arrows slightly better than it was!
Mechanical broadheads are the greatest invention in Bow Hunting since the compound bow in my opinion.
From: Kurt
29-Nov-23
I've had fixed blade head deflect on ribs when I used them in the past.
Once did a test with small hardwood dowels set in holes drilled in a 2x4 on 1" centers and set it in front of my archery target. Zwickey 4-blade Eskimo (or maybe it was Delta) fixed blade heads deflected as much as 30* off perpendicular going into the target on 20 yard shots. Arrows were 23-15 aluminum fletched with 4 @ 5" helical feathers that stabilized very fast and flew perfectly into the target without the "ribs" in front of it.
No doubt mechanicals can deflect as much or even more than the Zwickey's did in my test and on a few animals....out of many shot with them.
From: Jim McNamara
29-Nov-23
I can usually tell a rage hit buck when it comes in to be mounted. Massive holes.
From: Mule Power
29-Nov-23
Elk for sure. Tougher than a deer for obvious reasons but add steep mountains and it can be a daunting task.
From: ahunter55
29-Nov-23
I have been blessed to have arrowed a wide variety of Biggame. Any critter can be hard to recover depending on the shot, we all know that.. For me with Elk, Whitetails, Wild Hogs & Bears with the identical hit. #1 for me is the Hog. Tough arse critters, period... My favorite hit is of course a double lung, pass through into the ground or beyond. 2 stories on this also. Ling read but true.#1-I had a double lung pass through on a 4x5 Elk at about 25 yds. I watched him run about 100 yds where he disappeared into thicker timber. My arrow was soaked & I could see the blood had come out both sides & could see it easy. I just sat down & still waited a full hour. I needed to settle down from the excitement for sure. I just walked along following the trail there was so much. I get into the timber & maybe 40 yds from my last sight I see him. Still ALIVE. He gets up & starts to walk (yes, hes near done). I put another through both lungs he he tumbles & done.. So, Double lung pass thru, Basically no blood left inside & an hour + was still ale to get up. #2 Hog. I arrow this boar at 20 yds, pass thru but arrow stops at fletch. I watch him run & lay down in some high crp grass about 50 yds. I wait a half hour & again, the blood trial is one a blind person could follow. Get to the spot & a few yds away is a huge pool of blood but no hog. I then follow to a frozen creek with high banks. A friend with me & a pistol (357 if I remember right). He goes over the bank on the frozen creek & I walk the top of the creek bank. He is following the blood. All of a sudden this hog charges him from some brush on the side of the bank. He slips on the ice & fired at the hog, missing him. He charges up past me at about 10 yds & I miss. I watch him run at least 80 yds into this gully full of brambles. Like he's not even hurt & my arrow is gone. We walk t the gully & my friend walks on the one bank edge (maybe 4 feet up) & I'm walking in the gully. I get in about 30 yds & I see him backed into the brambles, facing toward me, just waiting. I tell my buddy he's right below him but it's so thick & straight down he cannot see him. Then boom, he charges & my 2nd arrow enters through the back & he rolls over about 10 yds from me.. I gut this guy & there is not ONE drop of blood inside him & his lungs, center punched are pure bleach white. I have seen some excellent hits & some damn poor by many bowhunters & unbelievable results at the end of the trail. Like people, some give up easy & others will never die.
From: Cazador
29-Nov-23
I’ve just had a black cloud over me when it comes to big WT bucks and hits that I thought were money only to be on my flipping knees wondering WTH.
I want pinpoint accuracy and big holes to make up for any errors and mechanicals give you that.
Many people will say Mountain Goats are the toughest there is, you hear it over and over again, but my limited experience (3) has been all but positive and short recoveries. I don’t think any of my goats made it 30 yds after the shot. This last one was dead in steps. WT just make you pay! For me it isn’t over until I have my hands on them no matter how the shot looked.
From: cnelk
29-Nov-23
Ive killed over a hundred WTs through the years (bow/ML/rifle) and they are definitely not the toughest to recover
From: RT
30-Nov-23
Nice goat
From: Brun
30-Nov-23
Elk, mostly because of their size. I don't know if they are any tougher, but the bones are bigger and much harder to penetrate, hide is thicker, it takes more blood loss, they can travel further on longer legs. It's also harder to get a pass through, which results in smaller blood trails.
From: redquebec
30-Nov-23
"WT just make you pay! For me it isn’t over until I have my hands on them no matter how the shot looked."
That's exactly how I feel about WT recovery Cazador.
From: Cazador
30-Nov-23
Of the species I’ve killed, elk have been the easiest without a doubt as far as recovery goes, and I have a pretty good sample size.
Big targets, Leave all kinds of sign, Areas they live are normally not that thick, Hit well, normally see then fall or hear them crash.
It’s Been a long time since I’ve “tracked” and elk that’s for sure.
From: DL
02-Dec-23
I shot an elk broadside at 30 yards. Arrow close behind shoulder looked like about 6-8” up and was red immediately at that shot it ran into some trees and stood there. I waited and waited. It then went off into a herd nearby and gone. I went over to my arrow and knew immediately this was not good. It was only a couple feet from where the elk was shot sticking almost straight up in the ground. The arrow had just minimal blood and muscle on it. It must have hit a rib and deflected straight down.
From: kscowboy
03-Dec-23
African animals are like saltwater fish. It’s a totally different level of fight/survival.
From: csalem
03-Dec-23
Kscowboy. Exactly right African and Asia game are way tougher than European and America game
From: drycreek
03-Dec-23
As fuzzy said, a hog is a tough mofo and you had better hit him right or you are in for a track. They don’t bleed much and if it’s a big stinky boar he may try to extract a little retribution at the end of it, depending on how good or bad your shot was. I personally witnessd one shot 600 yards away from me, (as the crow flies), arrowed through one lung, broadhead lodged in offside shoulder. He came in front of me and I shot him through both lungs with a 6.8 SPC 115 grain bullet and he still went 75 yards before he died. He was a medium sized hog, probably weighed 130/140 lb.
From: RK
03-Dec-23
Hogs are way tougher than white tails.
From: Mule Power
03-Dec-23
It’s not just about how tough the animal is. It’s about where they live too. That’s a big part of the equation when it comes to elk. That might not be the case if you hunt elk on open plains or private ranches. But in steep mountains with thick dark timber if you don’t make at least close to a perfect shot, you better say your prayers.
From: Deebz
04-Dec-23
This was the first blood sign I found just past impact site
This was the first blood sign I found just past impact site
Entrance side... I promise she was just barely quartered to me
Entrance side... I promise she was just barely quartered to me
I shot a doe last year with a Swacker 100gr. She was between 10 and 15 yards away, and I was maybe 10 feet above her when I shot. She was very slightly quartered to. Shot looked perfect to me, and I could see my arrow lying on the ground so I knew I had a complete pass through. She jumped at the shot, then walked off through the thicket and up to the field edge. I waited 30 minutes and checked for blood. What I saw made me sick and was very confusing... there was literal corn in the blood at first sign. I tracked about 10 yards and found another little pile of bloody corn. I backed out and waited 6 hours. Took me 10 minutes to follow the massive blood trail that opened up in the cut corn and find her laying dead about 200 yards from the shot. I took out center of the left lung, the back of the right, and sliced the front of the stomach wide open. I'm certain my broadhead hit a rib on the way in, causing it to deflect and exit as if it were an extreme quartered to shot angle... Craziest shot I've ever had on a deer.
From: Deebz
04-Dec-23
Exit side... I have pics of the ribs that show I clipped half a rib on the way in, and 3 ribs on the way out
Exit side... I have pics of the ribs that show I clipped half a rib on the way in, and 3 ribs on the way out
From: Buffalo1
04-Dec-23
I would submit a misplaced shot on a hog ( wild or warthog).
From: Deebz
04-Dec-23
Exit side... I have pics of the ribs that show I clipped half a rib on the way in, and 3 ribs on the way out
Exit side... I have pics of the ribs that show I clipped half a rib on the way in, and 3 ribs on the way out
From: Thornton
04-Dec-23
Been numerous bucks on the Kansas Deer Recovery site this year that looked to be shot correctly and they survived to show back up on the corn pile a week or two later. I tracked one with my hound and gave up due to lack of blood. The hunter's son shot it a month later and it was confirmed a lung was deflated by the first arrow prior.
From: gil_wy
07-Dec-23
I think the width and the swept back blades of the Trypan are the ticket… this was my elk a couple years ago…
