GIFT HORSE!!!!!
General Topic
Contributors to this thread:
Paul@thefort 24-Apr-24
Empty Freezer 24-Apr-24
RonP 24-Apr-24
BC 24-Apr-24
wyobullshooter 24-Apr-24
scentman 24-Apr-24
Missouribreaks 24-Apr-24
Will 24-Apr-24
TMac 24-Apr-24
Grey Ghost 24-Apr-24
sticksender 24-Apr-24
BOWNBIRDHNTR 24-Apr-24
Ken 24-Apr-24
Shiloh 24-Apr-24
Mint 24-Apr-24
Supernaut 24-Apr-24
deerhunter72 24-Apr-24
WV Mountaineer 24-Apr-24
Charlie Rehor 24-Apr-24
4nolz@work 24-Apr-24
4nolz@work 24-Apr-24
WV Mountaineer 24-Apr-24
cnelk 24-Apr-24
Zbone 24-Apr-24
badbull 24-Apr-24
Insheart 24-Apr-24
beemann 24-Apr-24
KSflatlander 24-Apr-24
Nomad 25-Apr-24
DanaC 25-Apr-24
fuzzy 25-Apr-24
BC173 25-Apr-24
Lewis 25-Apr-24
Jim Moore 25-Apr-24
Rgiesey 25-Apr-24
drycreek 25-Apr-24
WV Mountaineer 26-Apr-24
Buffalo1 26-Apr-24
JB 26-Apr-24
Zbone 26-Apr-24
JB 27-Apr-24
Basil 27-Apr-24
txhunter58 27-Apr-24
70lbDraw 28-Apr-24
BoggsBowhunts 29-Apr-24
12yards 29-Apr-24
APauls 29-Apr-24
spike buck 29-Apr-24
Zbone 29-Apr-24
Chattahoochee 30-Apr-24
txhunter58 01-May-24
fuzzy 09-May-24
TMac 10-May-24
Zbone 10-May-24
From: Paul@thefort
24-Apr-24
"Don't look a gift horse in the mouth", this saying comes to my mind when I read the responses to "Is Bowsite slipping?" I am surely not an IT guy and do not understand all of the ramifications of developing and maintaining this site, but I surely appreciate the effort that Pat has, from the very beginning in the mid 1990s and when I first discovered Bowsite.com.

I would suggest that many of you read the History of Bowsite that was presented a few weeks ago and learn of the dreams, the effort, the complexities , the realities, of developing and maintaining this site, yes a profitable site so it can still live on.

Has Bowsite's "life" changed, you bet and I was critical of that change when guns were allowed to show up, when the political garbage started to show up, when the personal attacked started to show up and I swore I would leave Bowsite forever. But then a REALITY CHECK, almost like a flash bulb going of before my eyes, Bowsite is a free gift and I should appreciate that fact through thick or thin.

My best, Paul an 84 year old guy who still speaks, Yes Ma'am and Yes Sir and gets wet eyes when I see the American Flag flying.

24-Apr-24
Couldn't agree more. Everybody i have met from Bowsite is a friend for life. (Maybe its a good thing i haven't met that many) I check into Bowsite every day to hopefully pick up little tidbits that will make me a better bowhunter. The politics and the bitchin aside, i will continue to read what i want to make it a better day for me. I too Love my Flag and as they say, "Don't Tread On Me M#$%@*&^^"... Semper Fi

From: RonP
24-Apr-24
wisdom and perspective right there. like sense, it is not common anymore. thanks paul.

From: BC
24-Apr-24
Amen Paul. Great post.

24-Apr-24
Agree with what you said Paul. However, just like your kids, you can love and appreciate something and still be highly disappointed in some of their actions. I think that’s what most are trying to convey.

From: scentman
24-Apr-24
And that's what Bowsite is all about Charlie Brown... Paul I have long awaited something like that from you sir. Thank you. scentman

24-Apr-24
I agree, great thread topic.

From: Will
24-Apr-24
That is very true, Paul. Very True.

From: TMac
24-Apr-24
Well said and I agree. Many things in life change. We can adjust, bitch and moan or move on. I have adjusted here on bowsite and pick and choose what to read but still visit daily.

From: Grey Ghost
24-Apr-24
I have 3 horses I'd love to "gift" to someone. ;)

From: sticksender
24-Apr-24
Good points made Paul. And I'll give some props to the WebMaster here for letting that other thread carry on. I might not have been able to exhibit that much patience.

From: BOWNBIRDHNTR
24-Apr-24
Paul, you are wise beyond your years! In my answers to the question, "Has Bowsite slipped" I probably came across as complaining. I still enjoy Bowsite and 99% of the members every day. I do believe that Bowsite has "changed". Some will say for the worse and some will say for the better....that's just the truth about "change". I will continue to be the thankful for being able to enjoy Bowsite and do my best to keep my complaints to myself. Pat, Thanks for providing me with the only website I visit every day and all of the great threads I have enjoyed for many years!

From: Ken
24-Apr-24
Thanks Paul. If everyone's posts were as respectful, positive and well thought out as yours usually are, there wouldn't be a "Has Bowsite Slipped" thread.

From: Shiloh
24-Apr-24
I feel the same as you Paul........

From: Mint
24-Apr-24
I totally agree Paul. I posted a thread the other day asking for advice on snake boots. Three guys were kind enough and posted a reply which I REALLY appreciated. But I'm sure there are a thousand Bowsiters that have an opinion about snake boots but will never post a reply. If you are complaining about the political threads being so popular get involved by posting to make this site lean to what you think it should be. I'm a traditional shooter but I do check out the Bowsite since it has some topics I'm interested in. For all we know Pat got rid of the Community Forum to boost traffic on Bowsite since participation has gone down.

From: Supernaut
24-Apr-24
Excellent post Paul, thanks sir!

From: deerhunter72
24-Apr-24
Well said Paul!

24-Apr-24
I appreciate the perspective and opinion of Paul. Always have and always will. But, to me, Free or not it’s become a dumpster fire where politics is ruining the contributions. Because a good bit stopped putting up with it and don’t contribute anymore?

It’s Pats to do with as he see fit. But, maintaining the best online bowhunting forum to continue to be the best means 10 people don’t run from thread to thread slowly tweaking the subject to what politics they don’t like.

Here a news flash, all but a just a few agree with common sense. So, that means we all basically align the same fundamentally. And don’t need to or want to put up with it on nearly EVERY thread. Yes, this post isn’t bow hunting related. It’s bowsite related. And, that’s the current state of bowsite. I don’t have to come. I don’t have to post. And, just like everyone on this site with the exception of coffee house debaters, both are happening less and less. Sooner or later it simply won’t offer me anything except the same political crap posted by the same people. I’m not alone as the threads reminiscing about the way it used to be prove that. It is what it is and, it’ll run its course however it works out.

24-Apr-24
Well said Paul. I get sooo much from Bowsite every day.

From: 4nolz@work
24-Apr-24
People who have frequented and contributed to a forum for years feel invested in it and feel entitled to opinions(maybe rightly so).When a site founder or moderator gets too opinionated or dictatorial it is the beginning of the end for a site imo.Pats obviously not going to stop political posts hell the moderator participates in them.There is no need for hero worship nor is there a need for demands by users.The thread topics are obvious and times change.Its up to the users to post content so post content to make it the way you want it to be.

From: 4nolz@work
24-Apr-24
Dang double clutch, PS my post is not directed at anyone personally

24-Apr-24
Mike, I stand corrected. That’s as obvious as it gets once it’s pointed out. Thank you. 109% correct.

From: cnelk
24-Apr-24
YOU CAN ALWAYS TELL WHEN PAUL POSTS

From: Zbone
24-Apr-24
Bravo Paul, Bravo!!!

From: badbull
24-Apr-24
Paul, Good thread and post. I really like the ending sentence of your post!!

From: Insheart
24-Apr-24
Well said Paul, and a couple others.

When I posted on the "is it slipping" thread, I took a cheap shot at Pat.

Pat, I sincerely apologize for that snide and unjust comment.

I've been coming to Bowsite for a long, long time and am grateful to all the cordial posters, and although I have only met one bowsiter in person, there are quite a few on here that I truly would enjoy sharing a camp fire with.

A few have graciously helped me and I've helped a few. That is thanks to "THE GIFT HORSE"!!!!!

A t

From: beemann
24-Apr-24
Ill say it again when I grow up I wanna be like Paul. Paul your the best!

From: KSflatlander
24-Apr-24
Well put Paul.

From: Nomad
25-Apr-24
As they say "down under", "Good on ya Paul"!

From: DanaC
25-Apr-24
" Bowsite is a free gift and I should appreciate that fact through thick or thin. "

Yes, sir. It's too easy to take things for granted.

From: fuzzy
25-Apr-24
I'm afraid I may be a stray jackass mixed in with the gift horse remuda

From: BC173
25-Apr-24
I hear ya, Paul. And right as usual.

From: Lewis
25-Apr-24
Very cool post Paul well said Lewis

From: Jim Moore
25-Apr-24
Paul is right. The Bowsite is a gift. Many forums here that cover the spectrum for the most part. As a denizen of the BS since its beginning, I've watched lots, posted little at first. Was more involved with the Leatherwall side of things than the Bowsite. I've gleaned much info and laughs, prayed for some, shook my head at others. We've lost a few over the last 3 decades. Like a community.

The thing about the BS "back then" was the fun I had reading really smart guys from all sides if the political spectrum argue their points, but for the most part they had respect for each other's opinion. It got contentious at times but would usually ride off into the sunset to be replaced by another topic. Things are much different now. New breed of politics out there and this "forum" often times reflects this.

My thing is, hunting in and of itself has been political since the printed word. Hunting is constantly under attack. Hunters trying to garner support from non-hunters, antis the same. It's a daily battle trying to preserve our culture. Information shared here could be information needed. We've got antis, gaining support BTW, getting onto game commissions. Need to know stuff. There are more organizations out there, heavily funded, that are against us than for us. Too many to list. Let's stay savvy about this, the BS is one of many vehicles we use to stay informed. Just my rambling thoughts.

From: Rgiesey
25-Apr-24
And over night Paul was wise! Good post Paul!

From: drycreek
25-Apr-24
What fuzzy said !

26-Apr-24

Ricky The Cabel Guy's Link
"The thing about the BS "back then" was the fun I had reading really smart guys from all sides if the political spectrum argue their points, but for the most part they had respect for each other's opinion. It got contentious at times but would usually ride off into the sunset to be replaced by another topic. Things are much different now. New breed of politics out there and this "forum" often times reflects this."

couldnt agree more jim. whether we want to admit it or not...political "discussions" have always existed on bs.

as a matter of fact...in pats own chronology of the first 20 years of bowsite (see link)...it is obvious that political activism played a significant role since its genesis.

i agree that there has been a shift in how people speak to each other but as you said...that is societal shift.

"My thing is, hunting in and of itself has been political since the printed word. Hunting is constantly under attack. Hunters trying to garner support from non-hunters, antis the same. It's a daily battle trying to preserve our culture. Information shared here could be information needed. We've got antis, gaining support BTW, getting onto game commissions. Need to know stuff. There are more organizations out there, heavily funded, that are against us than for us. Too many to list. Let's stay savvy about this, the BS is one of many vehicles we use to stay informed. Just my rambling thoughts."

again...i couldnt agree more. anyone who doesnt think partisan politics plays a significant role in hunting is in denial.

26-Apr-24
No one is doing that. Everyone agrees it plays a role. It’s you and people like you that post politics not related to hunting that everyone is referring to.

From: Buffalo1
26-Apr-24
Very well spoken. “You get it !!”

From: JB
26-Apr-24
I hear you Paul! So maybe Pat can weigh in on the political BS. I NEVER went on the community forum and avoid a lot of threads based on their title. Was it a good idea to eliminate the community forum?

From: Zbone
26-Apr-24
Don't know the whole story when Community forum was closed, and don't want to say, but heard confidentially from another there was a decision to shut it down, I just wish you guys would lay off Pat and just enjoy the privilege he gives us to post here for free... Take it as is and quit complaining... As Paul says, don't look a gift horse in the mouth...

27-Apr-24
"I just wish you guys would lay off Pat and just enjoy the privilege he gives us to post here for free..."

another thing that has changed societally is that there is currency in victimhood. its not enough to just avoid the things you dont like...but those things must change to suit the "victim."

From: JB
27-Apr-24
From what I have seen, Pat has pretty thick skin. Simply asking the question.

From: Basil
27-Apr-24
Refreshing to have someone whose perspective is spot on on all issues. Keep on trucking Paul!

From: txhunter58
27-Apr-24
I left. Prob 6 months ago. Just came back today for another look see, because this place has been great in the past. On the surface, it seems to have headed back in the right direction. The reason I left was so much discussion that had zero to do with any form of hunting. Gonna give it another try and see what happens.

From: 70lbDraw
28-Apr-24
Interesting how this thread has dominated the upper echelon for a minute!

29-Apr-24
"No one is doing that. Everyone agrees it plays a role. It’s you and people like you that post politics not related to hunting that everyone is referring to."

thats what many people dont understand...all partisan politics are related to hunting.

29-Apr-24
Ricky is right just as he always is…. Absolutely everything is directly related to bowhunting, I too was mad at the fact that a thread related to trans swimmers dominated the top-5 threads, but then... I was bowhunting a local lake that had some good whitetail sign. I thought I had bushwhacked far enough that I would be outside the typical public land pressure ring of the parking lots. Just as I got settled into my stand I looked out across the water and what do ya know? A trans-swimmer in full camo! That SOB swam over and hung a treestand up not 50 yards from me, ruined my whole hunt! I then gained a great admiration and respect for every single one of those 1000 posts on that thread.

I typed out a long response the first day this thread was up but just couldn’t get the wording right. I agree with wyobullshooter to a T. We can be frustrated at the completely unrelated political nonsense that ruins this site (like the transswimmer nonsense) and expressing that disgruntlement doesn’t mean we don’t care about the site or that we take it for granted. I wouldn’t have stuck around bowsite for ten years if I didn’t appreciate the platform and thoroughly enjoy this gift horse. I can hold that admiration for the site and its developers while also publicly calling out those that are ruining it. It’s not out of disrespect or ungratefulness that most do this I don’t think, it’s because they want to nip the cancer in the bud before it takes over and 100% of threads are Ricky and Timex instead of the current 95%… A 1 Timothy 5:20 approach to confronting those who break the unwritten code of keeping the site focused on its goal of bowhunting conversation.

Don’t look a gift horse in the mouth - I agree, but take it to the farrier every once in a while and feed it some high quality hay. The number of high quality posters mentioned in the “Who Do You Miss?” thread that left due to the nonsense is proof enough that something is awry.

In short, some things aren’t worth complaining about in life and an Internet forum is likely one, but expressing discontent with something you truly care about in hopes of preserving it doesn’t necessarily = disrespect or lack of appreciation, in fact possibly just the opposite.

29-Apr-24
"We can be frustrated at the completely unrelated political nonsense that ruins this site (like the transswimmer nonsense)..."

funny you didnt feel that way when you were posting about your vaccine issues. were they ruining the site? were those directly related to bow hunting?

at the end of the day...its human nature to think that nothing is important until its important to me.

thats why having the ability to not post on a given topic is as important as the ability to post on it. i appreciate having the opportunity to do both.

From: 12yards
29-Apr-24
I love bowhunting and Bowsite!

From: APauls
29-Apr-24
I love Paul and about anything he posts. The above is no different. Great message!

The only thing that isn't quite correct is the free thing. Financially yes, but just like Facebook, Instagram or Tik Tok YOU (we) are the product. While we are all users, we are also the product. Our conversations are what drive the clicks which in turn gives the site value to be used by advertisers. We pay with our time and ideas. Without them, the site doesn't exist. That's a double edged sword. It doesn't exists for us to enjoy, nor does it exist for Pat to earn revenue. So I don't think it's completely irrational for those investing their time and ideas to ask about a certain change. Is it their choice? Absolutely not. We are in no position of authority here, that belongs to Pat. As do the ramifications of any decisions he makes. I should just add that we flocked here because of the beautiful thing he designed.

From: spike buck
29-Apr-24

spike buck's embedded Photo
spike buck's embedded Photo
This pic is dedicated to you Paul@thefort!!

From: Zbone
29-Apr-24
Great photo...

30-Apr-24
"The only thing that isn't quite correct is the free thing. Financially yes, but just like Facebook, Instagram or Tik Tok YOU (we) are the product. While we are all users, we are also the product. Our conversations are what drive the clicks which in turn gives the site value to be used by advertisers. We pay with our time and ideas. Without them, the site doesn't exist. That's a double edged sword. It doesn't exists for us to enjoy, nor does it exist for Pat to earn revenue."

good points but i disagree with the part about bowsite not existing for pat to earn revenue.

pat said himself that when he started bowsite his "first, and primary motivation was economic."

in my opinion...thats not a bad thing...its a great thing.

30-Apr-24
Well said Paul. Easy to go negative, but it takes character to see past the inevitable internet garbage and provide a platform / community for education, fellowship and betterment of the sport.....Thank you Pat.

From: txhunter58
01-May-24
Obviously any “business” has to make a profit. Pat can’t do this out of the goodness of his heart. But if 30% of the posts on a bow-site are about O’bidenomics, Deja Vu, ect, I will be taking my internet hunting “business”elsewhere. As I have for the last 6 months. I’m back for now but if it hasn’t improved overall, “I/we” can leave. And every guy that actually wants to discuss bow subjects and hunting that leaves is a loss for the business

Chatt: Not negative. But I come to places like this to forget about the problems of the world and talk about something really important: hunting. If I can’t get away from that here, I will go elsewhere.

From: fuzzy
09-May-24

fuzzy's embedded Photo
fuzzy's embedded Photo
Me, back when Bowsite and I were both young, and all about bowhunting.

From: TMac
10-May-24
TMI fuzzy lol

From: Zbone
10-May-24
Barnyard chicken hunting...8^))) Kristi Noem would have freaked...8^)

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