Contributors to this thread:
Wish I had enough does to consider it. Since I don't, nope.
Same as previous doe only weekends, I head to the u.p. for last of their m.l. season. Still have a 3 pt or better Michigan APR tag in my pocket. Looks like a good weekend to break out the snow camo and orange vest to still hunt.
Nope, we have a descent amount of does, I want to keep it that way. I also shot a buck with bow, that's enough venison for my family.
Yep, just Saturday afternoon. I was invited to a place in central Waupaca county for 1 shot / 1 kill.
Nope.....in Vernon Co around my property I believe we have hurt the population the last few years. There are more bucks then does which can be worse thinking of CWD.
Absolutely. Will be killing those as many as possible of worthless bald heads. They are nothing more than a vessel to carry a potential big racked buck and they eat alot more of the forrest than bucks do.
Yes. Several of the properties I manage have too many does and I will go fill my doe tag somewhere.
That being said, I am not a fan of the four day hunt.
I did not get a deer this year or last year. I am out of venison. So I am going to try and get up to get a fat yearling doe for the freezer. I don't believe anyone else in my group will be hunting.
I may be, but not on our land. Our area in Pierce county is decimated. Too many doe tags and large gun and single shot rifle groups that shoot multiple antlerless, but CDAC knows best. I do have some friends and relatives in other counties that want me to go. I just have to find the time, story of my life. It's either time or money I'm always short on;)
I'm pretty pissed about it! I have not shot a buck this year in Wisconsin and I just realized that because of the antlerless hunt I can't hunt bucks this weekend. But what's worse, because Polk County is included in the Holiday hunt I can't hunt bucks the entire time from December 24th to January 1st. I'll have some time off to hunt during the Holidays and I can't even hunt for a buck with my bow on my property. What a bunch of Bull$hit! Deer hunting in WI is so F'd up!
I'll be out Saturday and Sunday hoping to fill my doe tag. Plenty of them from what I've seen during bow season this year, but didn't see much of anything during the gun season.
"Deer hunting in WI is so F'd up!"
You got that right Mike.
So if I understand it correctly, you can hunt does with a rifle Dec. 7-10 and Dec. 24-Jan1 during the Holiday Hunt?
Nothing like putting pressure on the does, 13 more days to hunt them with a gun, not to mention ML season!
Yes, Mike. That is correct. One of the reasons I'm glad my unit doesn't have a holiday hunt.
I don't necessarily care for it and prefer not to be limited on what I can shoot. That said, I'm going out in the woods anyway. Only so much time left in the season. Probably make some wood for next year earlier in the day Saturday and go out in the afternoon. Basically, scout for late season. Got a couple of standing cornfields I want to watch.
Dbl Lung, interesting comment on Vernon County, my partner and I have the land sw of Hillsborso,,,, 4 doe tags issued for free,,,,,, WHY? Again no experience there for myself, but my partner saw nothing but bucks, and only 3 does, in 3 weeks of bowhunting and 3 days of gun season
My old co worker called today and invited my son to come out to his spot and try and kill a doe. He saw 11 of them last sat so collin should have a good chance. I offered to buy him a gun tag but he declined. We will be out sat and Sunday afternoon.
Mike, do you at least get the extra month of Metro season in areas of holiday hunt? I haven't even looked into holiday hunt areas
Yes. Might hunt squirrels instead, we'll see.
No doe hunting for me this yr. More bucks than does/fawns in my area as well.
northbound,
No, I'm not in the metro hunt area. Polk County is not a metro area but apparently they decided we have too many does so they implemented the Holiday Hunt. Personally I don't see it...
Hard to believe that Polk county is in it but Shawano county isn't. Drive through Tigerton area at dusk once. I'm GLAD THE DEER ARE GETTING SPARED THERE.
Trapper that show at Jons is an auction,,,,, if they are going to have other over the counter sales, you will have to call them,,,,, I have never been to their Christmas Auction, but thinking of going this Saturday,,,, could be a big bust also,,,, but now that I can drive, have to get out of the house,,,,
GH, I quit patronizing him after he tried to weigh a 3 day old stringer of dead walleyes at a tournament.
thanks, I think I will pass
50% of this "does" are buck fawns. I know it's just semantics but I wish people, especially hunters would call it by it's proper name antlerless hunt.
Mike that's your CDAC at work for you.
Yeah and wasn't it the CDAC that recommended all the antlerless tags in Bayfield County? I've been hunting out of state a lot the past few years and it looks like that will continue...
No late season doe for me ever. Going bobcat hunting anyway.
I'm going to try to go at least one day, haven't got a deer yet this year, plenty of does (antlerless) in our area and we really would like some venison
Yep Mike. Only one vote for maintaining present herd, the rest on CDAC voted to DECREASE Bayfield herd. This is a three year recommendation. If the winter stays fairly tame, I'm sure they'll want some more does shot.
Yep Mike. Only one vote for maintaining present herd, the rest on CDAC voted to DECREASE Bayfield herd. This is a three year recommendation. If the winter stays fairly tame, I'm sure they'll want some more does shot.
Cheesehead - Get on the CDAC committee. You'd be a good addition!
If you only had one day to hunt(Saturday or Sunday), which day would it be?
The biologist for Lincoln County wanted a higher doe quota for public land tags than what our CDAC Committee voted on and approved. I don’t recall what the balance was between public and private but she stated that the private wouldn’t sell out and last I looked she was correct.
Doe Hunt For those who choose to hunt it shoot a adult doe. And you just harvested 5 deer on a severe winter then you wonder where all the deer went the next year, shoot a Doe she’s carrying 2. And mentoring the fawns on a bad year the fawns don’t survive Take a fawn. And you harvested 1 deer For those who survive on deer for survival maybe a second job would be a option
If it is a hard winter what would those extra mouths eat?
Aren't the numbers based on carrying capacity?
Tweed for the win. The idea that you can stockpile deer makes zero sense. Objectives are set to try and satisfactory hunter/recreational goals, allow for forest and vegetative regeneration, and minimize agricultural losses on a landscape level. A nearly impossible balance. Throw a winter like either of the two we suffered through recently in the mix and everything starts over. Mother Nature trumps all.
Wife was dead on tonight and punched her tag (really?), on a huge doe this afternoon - I went out with her, took another stand and never saw a deer.
While she was gutting her deer, a buck walks up on her and then she finishing cleaning the deer and four more deer walk into the cornfield....
Finally, some venison. Guess it took the wife to do it.
I agree you can not stock pile deer in the far north, but either can you kill everything that walks and crawls, as Bayfield CDAC, showed they wanted,,,,
Deer numbers are held far below true carrying capacity.
Hunted Marquette Co. all day Thursday and Friday - dark to dark. Did not see a deer and did not hear a shot. Driving to/from is see deer so there are plenty left but nocturnal around there. Done for the this year.
rough weather weekend, but when it breaks on Monday, nice stretch to bowhunt
Sure you can't stockpile deer. But there is nowhere in the north that is even close to carrying capacity. Hunters are accused of not making sound biological decisions when it comes to the deer herd. Yet the CDAC can make decisions based on their interest only and that's fine? But yeah, we are supposed to trust and support CDAC.
There have periods up north where the browse was hit hard. My understanding is that it does not come back next year like alfalfa. Is there a time range known for cedar and other browse to replenish?
I've heard enough bashing of CDAC units in this State -
It's the best thing since "canned soup" and I will tell you why.
For YEARS sportsmen in WI have had there arms raised in defeat because they thought the WDNR was not listening to them. For years they whined and cried that the WDNR is full of shit and never listened or wanted to hear from us hunters.... Well guess what folks...
NOW, we have what we wanted. An ADVISORY committee that ADVISES the WDNR on particular areas through out the State and what they feel are the number of deer on the landscape and what the carry capacity is for that area of the State.
Still not good enough for some folks....WE are now involved as we can - YES, you can sit on one committee OR, you can attend the meeting and voice your concerns.
Our CDAC is very informal and we try to get to hear from everyone....We even...hard to believe...go over the 3 minute time period on some folks! WOW!!
So yes, Rut...support and work with CDAC. Here's a better thought JOIN the CDAC and get in on the ground floor!!
The funny thing is CDAC is a volunteer group of people who give freely of their time and effort to make this State a better world for Whitetails and Hunters alike. CDAC members DO NOT see a dime at the end of the day, with few if any Thanks to them!!
Pitching a bitch here does ZERO to help your area. You need to get involved, if it's so damn important to you, the hunter!
Blood trail- from county to county it's the good, the bad, and the ugly. Speaking of ugly, Bayfield Co. CDAC decided to reduce the deer herd even more this fall and I highly doubt the DNR would have done that this year if CDAC was not the Management tool. The mood of the north is ugly and I bet the DNR would permit a few more deer on the landscape presently. Now of course the DNR will rubberstamp CDAC's three-year recommendation. CDAC varies from county to county with many doing a good job, but Bayfield County CDAC dropped the ball in the other teams end zone.
Interesting that hunters harvested such a large number of does in Bayfield county if its all doom and gloom up there. The last time I looked it was just under 1600.
you do realize the 40 you hunt is how it is for the whole county
The 4 day doe hunt is a joke. There are not nearly as many deer as there were back when the “t-zone” hunts were established. Now about 15 years later the Dnr is telling everyone there are the same amount of deer. The state continues to hand out ag tags like there are 50 deer hitting every ag field. Then they wonder why tag sales are down. They wonder why hunters are complaining. What we need is a 9 day gun season like back in the 80s. If you want to use a muzzleloader use it then. Late bow season should run through the first Sunday in January. When will the CDAC get their head out of there xxx and recommend the right thing.
I see plenty of deer. But every year the numbers are going down. I can not imagine how disappointed I will be when I see as few as some of you guys. But the day is right around the corner as long as we have a bunch of bozos running the show.
dbl lung,,,, the law is changed, goes into affect Feb 1 2018 officially, but bow season will end on the first sunday in January, as well as pheasant hunting
Retro-10-11 deer per sq. Mile is not a number that warrants further herd reduction.
If thats true, I guess it shows that there's a lot of hunters out there who show no restraint when it comes to the resource. Kind of like wolves.....
You're right about hunter restraint. You do know the wolves are way over carrying capacity, right?
Retro still flaunting his ignorance?
Im all for sensible management of wolves. But I wonder how many of the hunters who shot the 1600 does will sit and complain for the next year, about how the herd cant recover because of the wolves?
Capt Intellect, This is a discussion about northern Wisconsin. Have you ever seen snow?
It’s a real shame hunters in WI. Don’t know how good they have it and how great it could be with a little effort.
We have the CC and the CDAC to make and or change policy when it comes to wildlife and conservation. NO other states in the nation gives the public a voice like WI. does.
I’m on the CC and was Alt. Chair on Lincoln Counties CDAC Committee. Unfortunately work got in the way of the last position and had to step down.
I am so sick of the bashing of both groups by hunters and fishermen that offer nothing but. Step up to the plate to help or shut up and get out of the way.
It's a real shame that some are such puppets of the system that they just go with the status quo and question nothing. If it weren't for people that wanted change, there never would be any. Not that those changes always end up being for the good.
DT... I respect anyone, who gives of there time, and I have a cdac question for you, since you are on your county board..... I also realize, not all counties are created equal in deer mgt thinking......
15 guys show up for a meeting,,,, they ask for 2 changes,,, one change the cdac understands what they are asking for, but still can not make a decision, table it for 3 years, and can not explain why.........
They ask for another change, which the dnr gives the hunters, and their is no biological reason not to make the change, except the board does not want it, and says, well others do not want it.... My friend than says, well than they should be at the meetings, which they are not, what qualifies you as a board member to deny the request, but no answer.......
I realize you can not get everything you want, but if the dnr has no problem with it, but the board just does not like it, the board wins,,,,,, I do not think, it should work that way.......
I told my friend flood the next meeting, with more guys, and keep asking,,,,, they were also told to go to the WCC meeting and submit a resolution.... why would you want the whole state, voting on a local issue, that they have no idea of what they are voting on,,,,,,, I forgot, that is how the WCC works........
the whole reason for the cdac (which I support), is to get to the issues, at hand, and not have to do it the old way......
Archery season will end the first Sunday in January (starting 2018) for the whole state or are the metro units excluded thus ending January 31st?
The other thing that needs to end is the extended gun hunts in the metro areas. Not only are there fewer deer I believe that the number of hunters not using their heads around housing developments is increasing. The worst law change to hunting over the last few years is being able to use a rifle in the metro units. CAN YOU SAY DANGEROUS!!!! But it was a state change which does not allow the municipalities to have their own ordinance protecting home owners. And it is all to kill more deer::))).
Like I said as long as we have bozos running the show we will have stupid laws allowing for many complaints.
Mike, I would only be speculating what and why not being in attendance for your meetings. Perhaps send an email to Kevin and see if he can help you. He’s the director for the CDAC Committees. Wish I could help you further. I will PM you his contact information.
the metro units will continue archery to the 31st, and amendment was written,,,,
Ahhh....amendments. There is always a loophole.
Ground hunter-I also can't speculate on your two issues because I have no idea what they are or where you are but I would be happy to discuss them if you want to message me.
Two things to keep in mind. While in person attendance is strongly encouraged because face to face communication is the most effective and it allows people to ask questions and see/hear more information, the opinions of those that attend don't have any more weight than those that are communicated via phone calls, emails, or the online questionnaire. Some may not be able to attend, want to attend more than one meeting, or live a long way from the County they hunt in.
Second just because the people at the meeting have one opinion, it doesn't mean they are correct. For example there is one County that nearly everyone that attends would never allow any antlerless tags on public land and very few on private land. It wouldn't matter how high the population is. Obviously this is not a sound basis to make decisions on.
Skook, there are also counties where the CDAC refuses to listen to the landowners. So it really goes both ways. I really was excited about CDAC at first. But now that I've seen that it's really just more blowing smoke. I have no faith.
The CDAC and Spring Hearings, where as long as you vote how they want you to, you are listened to and "have a voice". When you don't well.......you get a crossbow season.....or threats of no buck hunting.
Considering that in the history of deer hunting no one has ever counted accurately its likely the current process involving the CDAC is a useless exercise . More than that it has already ben decided that the deer herd and the hunt needs to be long and for everyone regardless of recommendations. That alone is a enough to stay away. I personally have found the endless concern over how many deer seen and to how big they are to be draining and actually a bore for me . The high and more enjoyable experience in the bush happens when how many is never mentioned or even considered . The how big and how many is never talked about and the mention of it has no value in anyway . Having your experience lessened by a deer or lack of seems to cry for the need of something artificial like a committee meeting to help decide how many tags you will get . For me targeting doe in Dec with a gun says yes to all of this .
Rut-what counties and what were landowners asking for?
Pierce county and Bayfield. Landowners in Bayfield wanted another year or so of buck only or in the least not an antlerless free for all. Pierce landowners wanted reduced antlerless and no extra doe hunt. CDAC ignored them at both. I will say that I heard but can not confirm that hunters wanted more antlerless tags here in Chippewa county and the CDAC chose to be cautious. I wasn't at last years CDAC meeting for Chippewa county so I don't know if it's accurate or not.
The doe hunt isn't optional, so that isn't a CDAC issue. I am not familiar with Pierce County's Dynamics but I can do some research. Bayfield I know a little more about and know they are having significant issues with forest regeneration in parts of the County and that was one factor. I actually know several foresters who toured the area and were shocked at how much browse pressure there was. I also have a good friend that spent much of the summer at his cabin there and said he couldn't remember seeing so many deer in his life. He's 48 and had had the cabin since he was very little. I realize that is anecdotal but it's one piece of information. I went up to cut a tree for him on Friday of gun season and didn't see any deer driving but saw quite a bit of sign around their place. I am not trying to say there aren't places that don't have deer, just sharing some things I have seen/heard.
ltl Jim, leave the does alone and target a bush.
Camp-do you mean how many members voted for the quota recommendation? All of the members voted in favor. Each member had very similar recommendations when they went around the table. I was actually surprised that there very few people that were opposed because there are a fair number of people in Rusk County that essentially oppose shooting does ever.
If that wasn't your question, let me know.
There are plenty of places in the County that needed some does shot on public land. Typically moreso on open MFL than County land but some of those too.
An interesting item was that all of the crop damage tags issued in the County were from your area north and west of Bruce.
I do know I am being a bit harsh on the CDAC's and DNR as Walker has taken pretty much all management away from them and given it to the legislature. But after the DNR over used EAB and T-zones. I guess something had to be done. However I think this is probably worse.
My opinion is that the DNR was given a flawed system by the legislature in the SAK and that created mistakes in quotas.
Didn't make it out for the antlerless hunt, or muzzleloader season. Life happens and we just have to live with it. I might get out before the Holiday Hunt. Taking some kids for that, and hope to get a sit or 2 in before the end of the season. Not that I need any more venison, but I like to sit this time of year.
The continuous gun hunt for 23 straight days has lost it's luster and with crossbows being available for all the herd is taking a beating. Not just on private land, but on all land. I hear of able bodied hunters spending 40 to 50 days a year hunting and complaining that they aren't seeing deer this week during the muzzleloader season. Complaining that their group didn't fill all their buck tags and wasting them. Selfish idiots if you ask me. We also need to do something about the current crossbow law. A lot of able bodied people are using them and buck harvest is way above archery and rifle. We are walking a thin line and it can easily be where we become a one buck state.
You can not continually hunt the same stands over and over and expect to see deer. We all know they get nocturnal with pressure.
SAK was one hell of a lot better than what we have today. No tracking of any kills what so ever. Heck, I am thinking that some people didn't bother to even purchase licenses, let alone register the deer the shot....
Sorry about the rant....Cabin fever is already setting in.
Rut - If you were "so excited" about CDAC, instead of offering lip service - why don't you get off your duff and grab a seat on the CDAC?
Rut says: "It's a real shame that some are such puppets of the system that they just go with the status quo and question nothing. If it weren't for people that wanted change, there never would be any. Not that those changes always end up being for the good.
You seem to know allot Rut - What would be a better "system" than we have now be? - This appears to be a typical person that complained when we had no voice with the WDNR - now that we do...we complain again?
CDAC ONLY offers a SUGGESTION on herd numbers and subsequent quota numbers to the WDNR - NOTHING etched into stone. They are simply "Advisory" but, I am very happy to say they have been listening in my home county and we have a great relationship with hunters/biologists and the WDNR!!
People that complain should do something to get on board and talk the talk!
I think something will be coming down the line, on the crossbows,,,, season wise,,,,,,
I like the ML season, wish it was later, in the month though,,,,
I think CDAC is a good idea, to get hunters and others involved, and some counties are big enough and diverse enough to support their own group,,,, however its over micro management in some areas, and I think you could combine a few, but not that , it is going to happen.....
Problem is the change in politics, and DNR personnel, and our trust, that the DNR can manage the herd correctly.... I realize they made mistakes and went off the radar in the late 90's early 2000, but that was then and this is now,,,,, I like to see the legislators stay out of it...........
If the DNR wants more support, than they have to communicate with the public, as to what they need, what is working and what is not, because for the life of me, you never hear from them,,,,,,,,,
The new boss of the DNR, needs to hear from you, that we need to hear from them,,,,
Skookumjt....What part of Bayfield County does your friend have his cabin at? I would like to know where all these deer are at. No acorns this year in parts of Bayfield County will always have a affect on the browse but I don't see any over browsing conditions when the population is this low. Even the great deer yards of the past with hundreds of deer frequently these areas all winter long the food source regenerated year after year. At this point and time the doe tags in Bayfield County especially on public lands was and is a joke.
I would also like to know where all these deer are in Bayfield County. In the northern part where I hunt (hunted) they are logging and clear-cutting thousands of acres of land and there is browse everywhere and nearly no deer.
I'll repeat what I said before, shooting does in Bayfield County at this point is totally irresponsible, the wolves are already killing too many!
And retro, just because 1600 people shot the one doe that came to their bait pile does not mean there are a lot of deer...
I had the same question that MF did, where? I do know that Durkin had written an article about how the deer were seriously threatening the oaks in the north and references Bayfield Co. foresters. The Bayfield County forester who Durkin mentions had similar things to say as Skook mentioned. The word "shock" was used by foresters to describe over browsing. I guess I don't see it like the experts do. And unlike Durkin's statement, CDAC is not a hunter-run committee. It is a minority component of it.
As far as those posters complaining about all the "complaining" going on here; Bowsite would dry up and blow away if not for complaining! LOL!
Yes, not all of "us" complainers are on CDAC, but this site is a good public forum to discuss what we think is going well and not so well in the management of deer. And there is a lot of room for improvement in management with lots of serious issues present or on the horizon threatening the future of this sport. Hopefully, CDAC is a step in the right direction. But we have the right to ask if our county's CDAC has served the best interest of the hunter.
Somewhere down the line I have a feeling the CDAC created a job for someone. I do understand most are volunteers but it would seem like it being it is in every county someone is being paid another govt salary for running.
Mike.......there are even 1600 less now??. Incredibly sad!
CM, Never made a population estimate. Just made an observation (based on the antlerless harvest) that the wolves didnt eat all the deer, and that apparently there are quite a few hunters up there that still found deer to harvest. Again, I find that harvest total interesting given all the wolf doom and gloom........
His place is near the Pioneer Fire Hall. He is an avid bicyclist and motorcycle rider so he spends a lot of time just cruising around. When we went up we left Clam Lake and went out the old railroad grade then up past the Pioneer Bar. On the way home we went to Cable and then Seely. Never saw a hunter but saw deer tracks at his place and crossing the roads.
See BT, it's not just me;)
But what areas are the shocked foresters referring to?
Putting the doe Kill aside. Looking at the Buck harvest it’s up across the board for all seasons and in the past this was an indicator of a higher deer population. (SAK)
Simply put you can’t kill what’s not there. What is the goal for Bayfield? Increase, maintain, or decrease?
I don't think anyone is saying that the herd is not up with some rebuilding due to easy winters and buck only seasons. The buck kill should be up (10%) and a good sign. Not sure how variables such as opening weekend weather, etc., factor in when comparing the past two gun seasons.
Bayfield Co. goal is to decrease herd. CDAC was given a fall population of 22 deer per square mile. Estimated fall population seems extremely high.
Now let’s take it to the next step. What was the breakdown for doe tags public vs. private? Did all the tags sell out? I think many are looking at total numbers and not the breakdown. I’m sure there are pockets of deer on private that need thinning and where a bulk of the harvest took place.
As I stated before in Lincoln our biologist and forestry wanted a higher quota and more tags for public than what we voted on and passed.
Bayfield Co. goal is to decrease herd. CDAC was given a fall population of 22 deer per square mile. 22 deer per square mile.... I don't even know how to express myself on this one, what a bold face lie. Are they sure there not looking at the early 90s data? MuskyBuck... you & I know that's the furthest from the truth!
MF, Why do you think they are so far off on the population estimate? Whats causing the error? Just asking.....
"I’m sure there are pockets of deer on private that need thinning and where a bulk of the harvest took place" I believe there are on private but why would the Bayfield Co. CDAC be given an estimate on 22 per square mile for all of Bayfield County?
MF-As you know, there are quite a few guys on this site who hunt Bayfield and are serious hunters and have decades of experience up by you. I think we are all scratching our heads about the 22 deer per square mile estimate that CDAC used to formulate their recommendation. That's a lot of deer!
To answer Drop Tines question about doe tags: DNR issued 2,725 public land does tags and 4.425 private land doe tags. It would be interesting to see the harvest breakdown of public versus private with the 1,600 does harvested during gun.
I don’t know Mike. There is roughly 1478 square miles in the county. That would put the population at 32,500 deer to get the 22 per sq. Mike. Seems to be an unrealistic number to me.
But saying that our Biologist here has been 88% accurate in population estimates the last five years leading up to this season. The numbers and facts have verified that.
That's the problem with CDAC when the area includes diverse habitat, unlike an Iowa or Illinois where units would be much more uniform in habitat. The habitat diversity in deer hunting that we love about Wisconsin makes management much more challenging.
DT-Your math is spot on. Estimate is about 33,000?? deer in Bayfield Co.
I saw 53 deer on Saturday in Portage County on the 10 acre parcel I hunt and the surrounding neighbor's property. They were mostly grouped together and I believe some of them could have been seen previously during the morning sit. I managed to shoot a younger doe, but I think that based on the sightings it's possible that a few more need to be harvested to bring them down to manageable level.
How can every square mile of land be suitable deer habitat?
You're right about some of the land being unsuitable habitat for deer. But that is the math that they use to calculate the county deer population on the WDNR website.
Retro, your making to much sense. Stop it. ;)
