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CT Bans bowfishing !!
Connecticut
Contributors to this thread:
skipmaster1 28-Feb-18
skipmaster1 28-Feb-18
skipmaster1 28-Feb-18
soapdish 28-Feb-18
bb 28-Feb-18
notme 01-Mar-18
Wayniac 01-Mar-18
kent 01-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 01-Mar-18
skipmaster1 01-Mar-18
kent 01-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 01-Mar-18
Toonces 01-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 01-Mar-18
steve 01-Mar-18
Toonces 01-Mar-18
Providerrick 01-Mar-18
Will 01-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 01-Mar-18
Toonces 01-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 01-Mar-18
Toonces 01-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 01-Mar-18
Toonces 01-Mar-18
SILVERADO 01-Mar-18
notme 01-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 01-Mar-18
spike78 01-Mar-18
SILVERADO 01-Mar-18
SILVERADO 01-Mar-18
SILVERADO 01-Mar-18
Jmill 01-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 01-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 01-Mar-18
skipmaster1 01-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 02-Mar-18
Deep Cut 02-Mar-18
bb 02-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 02-Mar-18
SILVERADO 02-Mar-18
bb 02-Mar-18
kent 02-Mar-18
jax2009r 02-Mar-18
bb 02-Mar-18
bigbuckbob 02-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 02-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 02-Mar-18
Bowtech 02-Mar-18
nehunter 02-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 03-Mar-18
Smoothdraw 03-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 03-Mar-18
Bloodtrail 03-Mar-18
bowhuntersr 03-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 03-Mar-18
jax2009r 03-Mar-18
BrunoBows 03-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 03-Mar-18
Bloodtrail 03-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 03-Mar-18
CCRider 03-Mar-18
Bloodtrail 03-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 03-Mar-18
Ace 03-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 03-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 03-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 04-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 04-Mar-18
Smoothdraw 04-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 04-Mar-18
Smoothdraw 04-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 04-Mar-18
Smoothdraw 04-Mar-18
Ace 04-Mar-18
Smoothdraw 04-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 04-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 04-Mar-18
Smoothdraw 04-Mar-18
Jmill 04-Mar-18
bigbuckbob 04-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 04-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 04-Mar-18
Ace 05-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 05-Mar-18
Ace 05-Mar-18
Toonces 05-Mar-18
notme 05-Mar-18
kent 05-Mar-18
Trapper Ed 05-Mar-18
Brian M. 05-Mar-18
tompolaris 05-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 05-Mar-18
Toonces 05-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 05-Mar-18
Toonces 05-Mar-18
spike78 05-Mar-18
notme 05-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 05-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 05-Mar-18
Dr. Williams 05-Mar-18
Ace 05-Mar-18
Smoothdraw 05-Mar-18
notme 06-Mar-18
Smoothdraw 06-Mar-18
notme 06-Mar-18
spike78 06-Mar-18
N8tureBoy 07-Mar-18
Bigbuckbob 07-Mar-18
ctbowhunter203 08-Mar-18
From: skipmaster1
28-Feb-18
This is absolutely ridiculous. I thought NY was stupid for having a season, but this is so much worse. I just commented on the FB post and will be firing off some emails tonight

From: skipmaster1
28-Feb-18
Pat, it doesn't specify, is there any chance that is just for rod and reel fishing?

From: skipmaster1
28-Feb-18
I know. A few of the question FB addressed it for bowfishing too. I just called Bill Terry and he said you already got to him last night. He's going to reach out to some folks too.

From: soapdish
28-Feb-18
Certainly some big carp in the CT river for sure....

From: bb
28-Feb-18
What's next a trophy Eel fishery?

From: notme
01-Mar-18
Asians have the eel market locked up...i say a trophy chub class then we can all say ,hey look at my chub, without breaking any pc rules..lol

From: Wayniac
01-Mar-18
Ridiculous...

let me know if you are looking for more representation on the Conservation Council as well...

From: kent
01-Mar-18
Typical CT just like protecting illegal immigrants. Pat this is just as stupid when they told me no use of crossbows with fish rigs and the use of a spear OK but did not know how to address the use of my atlatl for the same purpose. Also they stock many polluted rivers with trout that are perfect breeding habitat for carp so that makes those waters off limits----again RIDICULOUS-- beyond any reason--Kent

From: Dr. Williams
01-Mar-18

Dr. Williams's embedded Photo
Dr. Williams's embedded Photo
10:04. Perhaps I am mistaken, but there is nothing to indicate that CT is banning bow fishing. Just reducing take on carp. Do you mean that that effectively kills bowfishing in the CT River? Now, it has to be a typo in the FB post. So as written, you can take 5 carp in any waters with no more than one exceeding 30”. But in Trophy Carp Waters you can only take one not to exceed 26”? That just does not make sense. You can take bigger carp outside of Trophy Waters? Someone messed this up and it needs to be clarified. Maybe it is supposed to be a minimum length of 26” in Trophy Waters? Again, I see that bowfishing is permitted in all lakes and ponds and on stream sections that are not stocked with trout. Also, it would seem that the CT River is vast enough that it can continue to support carp take of more than one per day. I would have to believe this is going to be overturned.

From: skipmaster1
01-Mar-18
I believe the "Trophy waters" are geared to the new surge of catch and release fly fisherman. Allowing only 1 smaller fish gives them a greater chance at landing a trophy. While bowfishing wasn't banned, it effectively is. No one is going to invest the time and money to go out and shoot 1 fish in 3 minutes on the river. Even with the 5 limit. That's an hour in a good spot. You can go out every night and see 100 or more fish without a problem and that's with no limits at all in place. It's not like the population is declining. Most other states have tournaments where there kill 1000's in a weekend on a lake, on top of the normal bowfishing... and they do it every year with no real dents in population

From: kent
01-Mar-18
Give this regulation 5 years and there will be no need to stock any waters in CT with trout as all the natural habitat that could hold them for more than a week will be destroyed. I'm 60 and can remember looking forward to the spring run of carp and suckers a ritual that many families young and old took part in for not only fun but a source of fertilizer for our gardens. Right up their with picken fiddleheads and opening day of small game season in the fall. This liberal state has gotten so lost within itself. Pat at least your close to Mass with that rig !!---Oh wait lets go down to the river a shoot our 1 carp !!! Great!!

From: Dr. Williams
01-Mar-18
I stand corrected. It is written correctly on the FB post. They are protecting big fish in Trophy areas. Catch and release for the fly fishing hipsters I guess....

From: Toonces
01-Mar-18
I like the idea of the DEEP highlighting and putting more value on self sustaining species instead of spending a lot of resources in the put and take trout stocking program in waters that cannot support trout. That said, this seems silly to me. I can't imagine that bow fishing for carp and fly-fishing catch and release for carp can't co-exist without these regulations. I would be curious to know the rationale for this decision.

From: Bigbuckbob
01-Mar-18
I'm betting they'll come out with a carp tag system attached to a fee if you want to go back to the old regs. I'm kidding,....I think.

Some states do have a higher tag fee for say trophy elk, so maybe that's where CT is getting ideas. After all they're legalizing sports betting. Does that mean Pete Rose gets into the Hall of Fame?

From: steve
01-Mar-18
SHOOT AND THROW BACK

From: Toonces
01-Mar-18
Reading the FB comments it does appear that CT has in essence banned bow fishing for carp. Short sighted and dumb. Really dumb, even by CT standards.

The DEEP rep said that "Common Carp are one of CT's largest freshwater fish and over the years CT has become a destination fishery for these incredibly large fish (worldwide). Protecting the largest of these fish is providing a super unique fishery for many."

Great, and if true CT has grown to become a carp destination fishery right along side of bow fishing. If bow fishing is so detrimental to carp, how did CT become a destination fishery in the first place?

These people are morons.

You have a resource that people like and pastimes (bow fishing and fly fishing) that seem to be growing organically and the state thinks that regulating the F*ck out of it is going to make it better.

It is just so typical.

01-Mar-18

Providerrick 's embedded Photo
Providerrick 's embedded Photo
This is ridiculous! That is a ban on bow fishing, which doesn’t surprise me in Ct. I’m relatively new to bow fishing but have learned the hard way in Florida where I’m just now leaving to head back to Ct. I was looking forward to trying some carp this year but you can’t bother with those rules. In Florida they treat bowfishing like fishing and I walk banks and spot and stalk sheepshead. No trash fish there. Limit 15. Usually a 20 ft shot, 4-6’ Deep. Took awhile then started to hit some.

From: Will
01-Mar-18
I noted this on Pat's main page thread on this... But as a fly fishing nerd who see's carp as a hell of a challenge, I can say that this is really weird. All I can think, is that in making the law there is so little bowfishing/spearing that occurs, that it literally slipped peoples minds. In all seriousness, how many people bowfish in CT? a dozen? The idea that people should stop shooting carp is so over the top it feels insane. I cant imagine the pressure from bowfishermen on carp negatively impacts the population anywhere in the state of CT. Ooph. Heck, even in Carp fly rodding "meccas" like Denver and some cities in the south, you never (at least I never have despite reading a lot of fly fishing blogs and what not) hear of "banning bow fishing". Crazy!

From: Dr. Williams
01-Mar-18
I have to reiterate that bowfishing is not being banned. But there are now take restrictions on carp, no matter how they are harvested.

From: Toonces
01-Mar-18
When burdensome regulations outweigh the benefit of the act, the act is essentially banned. That is what it appears the DEEP did.

If golfers were limited to playing one hole per outing, not many people are going to invest in clubs.

From: Dr. Williams
01-Mar-18
Be that as it may, to imply DEEP is banning bowfishing is disingenuous.

From: Toonces
01-Mar-18
Full disclosure I don't bow fish, never have, probably never will, but it is pretty obvious the whole intent is a lot of volume shooting during what is mostly considered an off season for archery hunting.

You take away the volume you take away the point of the activity. That is a ban.

The state could lower the take limits on crows to one annually. Would that be a ban on crow hunting? For all realistic purposes, yes.

From: Dr. Williams
01-Mar-18
Yes. A one crow limit per year effectively bans crow hunting. But given the new carp regs, bow anglers can take 5 carp a day, 365 days a year, or 1,825 carp each year. That does not seem to me a ban on bowfishing.

When they put a 5 trout limit out there, did guys complain that they were banning trout fishing?

From: Toonces
01-Mar-18
It is pretty obvious that is an ill conceived marketing ploy by DEEP.

CT is in trouble. We are broke, overtaxed, over regulated and a lot of people are leaving. DEEP along with the other CT agencies have likely been tasked to sell CT whenever they can.

Look at the language they are using - "destination fishery", "super unique fishery". Only marketing people talk like that.

I bet someone at DEEP saw an opportunity to market CT as a trophy carp fly fishing destination and these ridiculous regulations help justify it, because as we all know if the government isn't regulating it, it can't possibly be legit.

All they did was screw up a good thing.

From: SILVERADO
01-Mar-18
More reasons to hate this state.

From: notme
01-Mar-18
We have a crow..once we had 2 crows..i think the first crow knocked off the second crow but now the first crow is mia...i dunno i was never into counting crows..

From: Dr. Williams
01-Mar-18
Hey Pat. I can read the regs. The regs now say on non-trophy waters, bow fishers can take 5 carp a day, 365 days of the year. Or over 1,800 carp/year. I'm sure you are upset by the change, but it doesn't mean the state banned bow fishing or that I "do not know what I am talking about." I'm guessing your haunt was the CT River. So the state effectively eliminated your bowfishing routine. It's not banned, you are just going to have to adjust to stay within the law. Sucks, but clearly big carp are more valuable to other anglers from the DEEPs perspective.

From: spike78
01-Mar-18
Pat, we don't mind you coming to the CT River in MA to shoot unlimited carp. But hey at least AR's are still legal in CT somewhat!

From: SILVERADO
01-Mar-18
Spike for now. Pat I’ve been going to Jersey for the last few years. Already have a few trips planned for this season. Good size and numbers of fish. Few different kinds of carp, cats, goldfish and snakeheads.

From: SILVERADO
01-Mar-18

SILVERADO's embedded Photo
SILVERADO's embedded Photo

From: SILVERADO
01-Mar-18

SILVERADO's embedded Photo
SILVERADO's embedded Photo

From: Jmill
01-Mar-18
What do you guys do with the carp?

From: Dr. Williams
01-Mar-18
I think Jmill hit the nail on the head. From DEEP's perspective, a 40" carp is far more valuable for 10 different guys to catch and release than to wind up as fertilizer in one guy's vegetable garden.

That said, I find it hard to believe there are only 4 waters in state that are suitable for bowfishing that are now effectively closed.

From: Bigbuckbob
01-Mar-18
Pat, Doc doesn't bow hunt nor does he bow fish so just ignore his posts. He thinks we all need his doctorial insight when what we really want is for him to go away. If the state said I could shoot 10 small bucks a year but not mature bucks I'd sell my equipment or hunt in another state.

From: skipmaster1
01-Mar-18
Fish make great bait for trapping fur and baiting bears(in states that allow it)

The bottom line is from what I can tell, this decision was made without studies and without public comments. I would guess there are far more guys chasing Carp with bows than with rods. I haven't heard of anyone seeing less Carp on their trips than they did years ago. Carp populations are in no danger of crashing.

From: Dr. Williams
02-Mar-18
Bob, my doctoral insight tells me that your comparative example stinks. Comparing a garbage fish to a buck.... Give us a break.

From: Deep Cut
02-Mar-18
If it is a garbage fish, then there should be no restrictions.

From: bb
02-Mar-18
Might as well bring swans back and finish off the CT River for good.

From: Dr. Williams
02-Mar-18
There were no restrictions on this garbage fish until Tuesday. No shortage of swans of the CT River! The Hadlyme Ferry operators couldn't figure out why they just started to see dead ones floating by Gillette Castle the 2nd week in October......

From: SILVERADO
02-Mar-18
Where I fish in NJ there is a raptor conservatory and the fish are donated as food for them.

From: bb
02-Mar-18
No shortage but the numbers are certainly down. no point in letting all that hard work go to waste, keep those numbers up.

From: kent
02-Mar-18
Dr. Williams You seem to be up on habitat issues. Tell us some of your experience with some of the back waters along the Quinnipiac river or others for that matter. Carp turn these into stagnant mud ponds lacking oxygen and any type of aquatic growth except algae creating habitat that even geese won't tolerate. I've seen yellow perch dead by the hundreds and yet the carp still survive and thrive in these cesspools

From: jax2009r
02-Mar-18
the state of CT hates sportsmen...I am not surprised

From: bb
02-Mar-18
"The Hadlyme Ferry operators couldn't figure out why they just started to see dead ones floating by Gillette Castle the 2nd week in October......"

Lightning I believe

From: bigbuckbob
02-Mar-18
BB - no that's not it. They see dead ones floating because they don't sink, and when you tie a rock to them it sometimes falls off, I mean IF someone tied a rock,.........never mind.

From: Bigbuckbob
02-Mar-18
Good luck Pat! Let us know what happens.

From: Dr. Williams
02-Mar-18
Hi Kent. I think you are misunderstanding me. I am saying that there are plenty of places to bowhunt carp even with the new regs. I am saying (like you) they are junk fish that inhabit poor aquatic habitat like portions of the Quinnipiac River. I am also saying that DEEP is not banning bow fishing as the title of this thread would lead people to believe (see image for proposed regulation changes). I am also saying there are more places than just the 4 trophy waters listed with the new one fish limit to continue to bow fish. You just suggested the Quinnipiac River. Perfect, that is not one of the 4 trophy waters listed. How about Dooley Pond in Middletown? How about the Housatonic River? How about the Naugatuck? Candlewood Lake? Lake Zoar? These are all non-trophy waters on which bow fishing is still permitted with a limit of 5 fish, one over 30” per day. With the new regulations, bow anglers can still take over 1,800 carp/year each. Is that not enough? I truly do not know, but any more than that annually seems excessive.

From: Bowtech
02-Mar-18
I bowfish and we use the carp to bait coyotes.

From: nehunter
02-Mar-18
In Utah we shoot them for Bear Bait. Really smell nice after 5 days in the hot sun.

From: Dr. Williams
03-Mar-18

Dr. Williams's embedded Photo
Dr. Williams's embedded Photo

From: Smoothdraw
03-Mar-18
Doc is right! 1800 is plenty. I shot 1750 last season. I bowfished all year long. During the winter I’d drill holes in the ice and launch arrows. For a challenge I would stand 20 yards away from the hole. Maybe next year they’ll stock seals.

From: Dr. Williams
03-Mar-18
My point was that the opportunity to take 1,825 carp/year is hardly a ban on bowfishing. I would agree it is effectively banned on those 4 trophy waters, but not statewide.

From: Bloodtrail
03-Mar-18
You can’t bowfish for carp where they stock trout.

From: bowhuntersr
03-Mar-18
The state thinks they will bring rod anglers into CT to fish for Carp with this new regulation. All the surrounding states also have Carp. Gas and hotels are more expensive here than anywhere else so why would anyone want to fish here for Carp. Looks like the state threw us bowfishermen under the bus. I wonder if there will be a special class to teach us how to determine the length of the fish when it's in 3 feet of water.

From: Dr. Williams
03-Mar-18

Dr. Williams's embedded Photo
Dr. Williams's embedded Photo
Bloodtrail, more specifically in streams where they stock. Rivers, lakes, and ponds are fair game.

From: jax2009r
03-Mar-18
I really wonder the thought process

From: BrunoBows
03-Mar-18

BrunoBows's embedded Photo
BrunoBows's embedded Photo
I just caught word of this proposal, not surprised but seriously pissed. Bow Fishing is the only fishing I do, I have thousands of dollars invested in equipment and I spend every weekend evening from March to July on CT waters impaling scales. Pat I hope your all over this, please don't let this go into effect, if there's something more we can do besides complain here, please let us know. A creel limit on Carp makes about as much sense as a bag limit on cockroaches, does the State seriously think these creatures need to be protected with limits? This is just going to force me to practice Catch and Decease, I hope the anglers and swimmers enjoy the floating carcasses.

From: Dr. Williams
03-Mar-18
Looks like DEP is cracking down on this wanton waste fishery. No one has answered what they do with dead CT carp. So what is the point in killing them? To see if you can? Clearly big live carp are valuable to DEP and CT anglers, else these regulations would not have gone into effect. I'm sure in Pat's meeting with DEP Fisheries, they are going to tell him the same thing I have been writing here. And arrowing and leaving carcasses to float downstream is a great way to win further support from the public and DEP.

From: Bloodtrail
03-Mar-18
Really? Why are you the antagonist?? How bout the deer you posted on here that you killed “with your .243”. Just so you could get pictures of critters eating them in your backyard??

Please, some people have tolerated you. Many have been polite to you, because that’s what you’re supposed to do. You contribute nothing positive here related to bowhunting.

Pat has done more for us in CT than you can imagine. He’s passionate about potentially losing a resource that he and many others enjoy.

From: Dr. Williams
03-Mar-18
Hardly being antagonistic. Just telling it how it is. Pat has done a lot, yes we can all agree. But the "resource" is not being lost. One could counter argue that bow fishing is what is causing the loss of the resource. There are now take restrictions on carp. No, bow fishing is not being banned. And yes, you can bow fish where they stock trout. You just need to interpret the regulations as they are written. You guys are making up your own narrative that is just not correct. Just like suggesting I killed a deer to put a camera over it. Give me a break. Like I said, DEP is going to tell him the same thing I am, because it's based on facts, not emotions.

From: CCRider
03-Mar-18
I had a boss once that insisted everyone called him Dr. just because he had a PHD. He thought he knew everything. Not a bad dude, just terribly insecure and always needing to show everyone how smart he was. He was fired, nobody missed him.

From: Bloodtrail
03-Mar-18
I told you that you are tolerated here. You contribute nothing but antigonistic jibes. You always talk rhetoric about the other side.

And there was a post a while ago about game camera pictures where you bragged and posted pictures of eagles and other critters eating two whole deer that you told everyone you killed with your rifle. So please don’t worry about a lousy carp being thrown away or used for fertilizer or whatever else a carp fisherman wants to do with it. You offer nothing.

From: Bigbuckbob
03-Mar-18
Ah yes! Now DAD (dumb ass doc) is carping about bow fishing, yet another activity that he doesn't participate in but is an expert when it comes to what bow fishermen enjoy and expect when they go out.

And I do remember the pictures of dead deer being left to rot at the hand of DAD. At least he's not a bow hunter so he won't be associated with the rest of us.

And some of us who received higher degrees don't demand that others call us Doctor, unless of course you have no friends and it's the only way to have complete strangers not refer to you as "Hi dumbass"

From: Ace
03-Mar-18
My money is on Pat, and on a carve out regulation for bowfishing.

This was put in at the request/ insistence of one guy who thinks CT can be a Trophy Carp Fishing destination. When people act in their own self interest and fail to take into account an entire group who has been contributing to the economy in a fairly substantial way, their elected representatives can help bring about reasonable solutions that are equitable to all stakeholders.

From: Dr. Williams
03-Mar-18
Listen, you guys are complaining openly on a public website about DEP and you are making things up to slap each other's backs. Banning bowfishing? Not being able to bowfish where trout are stocked? Neither statements are even remotely close to being true. If you want to get anywhere with DEP, first you are going to have to be honest about the regs. DEP is going to write you off if you go at them with this narrative because it's plain as day lies as I have shown here and they are just going to point to the regs to show you that you're wrong. I'm sure you guys aren't happy about the changes, tell them that. Don't spread lies that are so easily proven wrong. It weakens your case and greatly lessens your credibility. You can attack me for being the messenger, or you can take a step back and listen to what I have to say. Cause, I just might know these guys and know what I'm talking about....

From: Dr. Williams
03-Mar-18
Bloodtrail, I get that you guys want to vent and complain, but you are doing it very publicly here. This is not a private chat room. And I'm not feeding you rhetoric from the other side, I'm just reading the regs as they are written and refuting the emotional lies you guys are spreading. It's all written right there.

From: Bigbuckbob
04-Mar-18
First of all Doc it's not the DEP, it's the DEEP, so if you're going to set us straight you should at least know what the hell you're talking about. Secondly, go aways.

From: Dr. Williams
04-Mar-18
Another good one Bob. I love that me reading the regs and showing them to you guys is me being an antagonist and is considered "rhetoric" from the other side. It's not rhetoric when it's fact. Just because it doesn't confirm your argument doesn't mean it's not true.

From: Smoothdraw
04-Mar-18
You have to buy a permit for almost every individual fishing and hunting activity. DEEP should establish a $10 permit for bowfishing. In doing that you can determine how many bow fisherman CT actually has and then set up regulations accordingly.

From: Dr. Williams
04-Mar-18
Ok. Now we are getting constructive. Instead of charging, DEEP does a lot of survey work so I would presume that they had an idea of the ratio of carp anglers to carp bow fishers before they made the regulation change. Pat can confirm this. This regulation change is likely DEEP responding to the voices of the public use of the resource and bow fishermen got the short straw. I have difficulty believing this is the result of one guy's suggestion...

From: Smoothdraw
04-Mar-18
Pat, I don’t really like the idea of extra fees either. I don’t really want to suddenly pay for a trout stamp. But how do you approach the DEEP about your concerns? Ask them to get rid of the carp bag limits entirely or have them establish separate bowfishing regulations? When you go to the meeting have a plan or suggestions. You’ll probably have to meet them halfway. Good luck!

From: Bigbuckbob
04-Mar-18
Wait! So in CT we're going to pay a toll to drive to the fishing hole, pay a new, higher gas tax to fill the gas tank on the boat, pay more to register the boat, pay for the boater safety course, pay a higher sales tax and now someone is suggesting we be forced to buy a carp stamp? And Doc thinks this is a good idea, right? What's next, only Tony D from WB can call carp?

From: Smoothdraw
04-Mar-18
BBB, Bottomline Pat wants to shoot 10-20 carp per outing on the CT River. DEEP has already put out these carp regulations. How do you make it happen? What would you say in that meeting that would actually have some effect. I would suggest a bowfishing permit and a 15 fish per outing limit with a season limit. If people are willing to pay for a trout stamp then I don’t think a bowfishing permit is a big deal. And if they refuse to buy the permit then I’m sure they’ll risk getting caught with a boatload of arrowed carp. And please don’t team me up with Dr. kill all the deer Williams.

From: Ace
04-Mar-18
I already bought my fishing license for 2018. If they are taking away something I was able to do when I paid for the license, don't they owe me a partial refund?

From: Smoothdraw
04-Mar-18
I’ve never even caught a carp but I really hope it all works out for you and that it’s an oversight. It does suck that DEEP is trying to nickel and dime us on everything but we’re at their mercy. We’re not going to give up the things we love to do.

From: Bigbuckbob
04-Mar-18
Smooth, my sincere apologies for linking you with Doc, I lost my head. No deserves that.

From: Dr. Williams
04-Mar-18
Bob, your reading comprehension stinks. I never mentioned a carp stamp. I suggested DEEP likely has an estimate on the number of bowfishers based on survey work. Pat disagrees. I hope Pat shares the results of his meeting with us. Be sure to say hello to Pete the Inland Fisheries Director from me.

From: Smoothdraw
04-Mar-18
Thanks BBB! :)

From: Jmill
04-Mar-18
I've never fished for carp and probably never will. I've also never bowfished , but this conversation has tweaked my imagination. My rational mind tells me that DEEP must have neglected to realize there is a population of carp bowfisherman. Because how on God's green earth could they put a size limit responsibility on something being killed through 3 feet of water. Makes 0 sense.

From: bigbuckbob
04-Mar-18
Doc - your reading comprehension is the problem, mine is fine. I never said that you suggested a carp stamp, that was smoothdraw, not you. Little defensive aren't we, but that's understandable, you're used to having people disagree with anything you say. You see Doc, like you I know nothing about the sport of bow fishing, so I don't provide any words of wisdom on the topic. You, however, would argue rocket science with NASA and think you have the upper hand. I know why you don't bow hunt now. Your head is too big so your anchor point is pushed forward and it limits your draw length to 16". I'm guessing you have a custom stock on your guns to move the sights forward :)

From: Dr. Williams
04-Mar-18
This could be about changing the regs around baiting, replacement antlerless tags, bow poundage, woodchuck take limits, or minimum size requirements for trout. It's about the regulatory process of the public resource. Making up lies to try to argue your point is a strategy that will fail every time. Particularly lying about the regulations to the very agency who instituted them. Not the best strategy, no matter how adept one is at bowfishing.

From: Bigbuckbob
04-Mar-18
Ah, I see Doc. I forgot that you are an expert on all of the items you listed and far be it for anyone else to have a different opinion as to the impact a new regulation has on way they participate in the sport. Because you see, this thread is not about the letter of the law but rather how that regulation would impact this person. So go back to counting ticks because there's a lot of them out there.

From: Ace
05-Mar-18
Perhaps the expert on all things can explain to us why and how this regulation change was made.

We’re all ears.

From: Dr. Williams
05-Mar-18
8:19. Right. The regulation would impact this person, actually, all persons who choose to engage in this activity, but it is not being “banned” as suggested by the person who started the thread. I do not know why the regulation change was made, but I can imagine that a 40” live carp, that can be caught and released multiple times by multiple anglers, is going to sell more fishing licenses and be more valuable to more members of the public than a dead, arrowed 40” carp rotting in one guy’s compost pile. Seems DEEP's intent it to protect larger fish likely both for enjoyment and for breeding stock. As you guys always say “follow the money…..” In this case, it would seem DEEP likely feels that a catch and release carp fishery is more valuable to the majority of the CT public than is a wanton waste fishery. Maybe Pat can share with us what DEEP's logic was behind the regulation change after his meeting.

From: Ace
05-Mar-18

Ace's Link
Follow the money indeed.

Does anyone think that there has ever been one fisherman who has purchased and outfitted a boat solely or primarily to fish for Carp by hook and line? There are several right here on this thread who have done just that for the purposes of Bowfishing. After buying the boat, and a motor and a trailer and lights, they pay to register that boat, buy gas for that boat, and contribute to the economy in a much more substantial way than the guy fishing with dough balls from the banks of a river. He buys a license, and maybe a loaf of wonderbread.

From: Toonces
05-Mar-18
Good Luck Pat! Let us know how it goes.

From: notme
05-Mar-18
Ace,The link she no open ...

deep probably has seen the last couple of years all the guys catching carp on light tackle on the naugy in ansonia behind bj's and figured theres gold in dar fish....

A destination for carp, thats funny..kinda like when they drained Beardsley pond to make it a small mouth destination..that didnt pan out so they loaded it with catfish in hopes itll be on the catfish circut..

From: kent
05-Mar-18
Intent to protect BREEDING STOCK !!! Of what purpose does supporting an invasive species do for the native species or support of natural habitat----Try applying that thinking across the board with all invasive species !!

From: Trapper Ed
05-Mar-18
I just got Bill Terry message, I will pass on the tradition of BowFishing, I started bow fishing 1980 and there was plenty of carb, and now as of 2017 season there is plenty of carb,

From: Brian M.
05-Mar-18
Maybe it's a health issue? DEEP doesn't want CT Asians to consume too much carp meat. I don't say that in a bigoted way, it's just I've never seen anyone but an Asian keep it for consumption.

How many on this thread eat it? I've always thought carp were invasive, therefor no limits were in place. I don't even know anyone that intentionally fishes for them, except for bow-fishers. Seems akin to putting a regulation on starlings, sparrows or pigeons.

From: tompolaris
05-Mar-18
I have only kept one carp in my life. I caught it on 4lb test in the Farmington river . I weighed around 10-12 lb's. I took it and put it on the side of Salmon brook in Granby in a shallow area. The local bait shop ( Ding Robblets) had people going into his shop for a week or so and telling him of the monster the found on the side of the brook!

From: Dr. Williams
05-Mar-18
Hey again Kent. DEEP considers common carp naturalized, not invasive. I am guessing as to their logic and hope Pat reports what it actually is in terms of the new take restrictions. Game fish are pretty much all alien species in CT if not the Northeast. Brook trout, chain pickerel, redfin pickerel, yellow perch, bullhead, white sucker, dace, and eels are pretty much the only native freshwater fish to CT. Brown trout, rainbows, tiger trout (hybrid), largemouths, smallmouths, northern pike, channel cats, walleye, calico bass, rock bass, bluegill, white perch, bowfin etc. were all introduced since the 1800s, are too considered naturalized, and are some of the most prized freshwater game fish in state.

Brian has a point. No one here has said what they do with carp after arrowing them. Dead rotting carp are super tough to catch on a breadball fly...

From: Toonces
05-Mar-18
Logic is simple in my opinion. The state is banking on people being suckers for regulations and marketing. (we used to call carp "suckers" when I was a kid by the way).

State A and B have equally good carp fishing.

State A has no regulations governing the taking of Carp.

State B has designated Carp a "Trophy Fish", decided to start calling places where they live as "super unique fisheries" and backed up their marketing campaign with idiotic regulations to demonstrate how serious they are about selling carp.

State B thinks it has now created an advantage over State A because of their campaign and regulations to attract anglers/money.

That and I am pretty sure the state hates hunters. Fly fishing is much more politically correct.

What this absolutely nothing to do with is habitat, science or the health of carp as species. Otherwise they would be showing studies backing up how un regulated bow fishing is wiping out the carp populations or somehow damaging the environment.

From: Bigbuckbob
05-Mar-18
Suckers are not the same as carp, are they?

From: Toonces
05-Mar-18
No Idea, as kids when we were fishing, it was pretty much a generic term for anything with down turned mouth that was a bottom feeder.

From: spike78
05-Mar-18
I have tried to catch a carp a few times but no success. Only because I never caught one.

From: notme
05-Mar-18
Carp are overgrown gold fish...i once worked with a bunch of polish guys that would fish for them somewhere in wallingford..they would bake them, but ive also seen them fry and eat a flat of bunker..YUK!!!

From: Dr. Williams
05-Mar-18
Yes. Carp and suckers are different fish but were regulated, or not regulated, the same way, until now....

From: Dr. Williams
05-Mar-18

Dr. Williams's embedded Photo
Dr. Williams's embedded Photo
Common carp

From: Dr. Williams
05-Mar-18

Dr. Williams's embedded Photo
Dr. Williams's embedded Photo
Sucker

From: Ace
05-Mar-18
I can’t even imagine eating bunker V, after you use them for bait it takes days to get the smell out of your hands.

From: Smoothdraw
05-Mar-18
Ace, Notme has had plenty of experience with that!

From: notme
06-Mar-18
Nothin a little kerosene and scotch brite cant fix..lol

From: Smoothdraw
06-Mar-18
Toonces is right. I can see why DEEP wants to make a big deal about carp fishing. I googled it. Some of these guys spend alot of cash on their equipment and take it seriously. I watched an On the Water episode of carp fishing on the CT River. They catch some bigguns. There was a tourney in 2015 offering 100k to anyone that could beat the state record. All that said I’m not going to go out and buy any carp fishing equipment anytime soon. I’ll stick to stripers. Notme, that was one “p”.

From: notme
06-Mar-18
Yawzee!!!

From: spike78
06-Mar-18
Check out the thread on the big game forum ,"Pat CT new regs" fricken hilarious.

From: N8tureBoy
07-Mar-18

N8tureBoy's Link
Here it is...

From: Bigbuckbob
07-Mar-18
It was funny as hell

08-Mar-18
bow fishing is my favorite summer hobby and i dont see the point. do they really think that bow fishing can possibly even put a dent in the carp population? Ive seen hundreds in a night bow fishing and only put 1-5 on the deck.. some nights better than others obviously but no way no how can the population be dropped by bow fishing there is just too many of them... were doing the environment a favor by removing a few. and i doubt there is going to an influx of foreigners flocking to ct in drones buying fishing licenses to catch a friggen carp! their everywhere! and bow fisherman will far outnumber the amount of licences sold than a few guys that target carp for recreation.

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