No-Peep sights
Massachusetts
Contributors to this thread:
After reading the "bowsights" thread and seeing a few people proclaiming the virtues of going peepless I decided I want more info on this subject and thought it may be better to start a separate thread on it. Mostly because I'm lazy and don't want to sift through the other thread to pick out the peepless posts.
I'd like to make the switch to a peepless sight this year so I'd really like some recommendations from anyone who has used one. I need a single pin (preferably vertical) because my eyes go berserk when I try to use multiple pins, and I would really like the built in correctiveness (is that even a word?) that the IQ and others might have.
Very personal. I tried switching and absolutely hated it. I do shoot an IQ sight and love it but I need a peep with it. I have been told by every pro shop ive gone into that I absolutely should be using a peep. The whole reason I tried switching to peepless was for better visibility at low light. What I got was worse visibility at all times of the day with a slight improvement at night. Doesn't hurt to try and find out for yourself. Some people swear by it, its just not for me.
I think its worth noting I only shoot with one eye open (which I know isn't the best way to shoot) but this could be why I don't like the no-peep.
Back in the day I used no peep and it was ok. Probably better with the peep for less error on shooting left right
For anchor I'm doing knuckle in the same spot on my ear, lean my head so my nose touches the string, take a finger to push my glasses closer to my face so I can see over the bridge of my nose. At that point where ever my pin is that's where the arrow is going to go.
When I was using a peep it was the same. which made me wonder why I needed it. When I close my eyes, and set my anchor, open my eyes - peep or no peep, my arrow is going where the pin is (relative to distance and if I don't torque the bow).
Then once my peep twisted on a nice buck, and another time after I started using the rubber tube it snapped and slapped me. And aside from enjoying the abuse, I swore off peeps forever. That was years ago, and I ain't never goin' back!
I bought a peep designed for low light it is great,.. look for them. It has two shades of "see through" open and see through yellow,.... and a huge opening,.. hard to explain. Google it.
Agreed with Bowman. A big peep is easy to see through even in low light but you may need to train your eye/brain to center your pin circle in the peep circle.
I painted the sight-pins outer ring (housing) with white paint to make this "centering" easy to do and I don't think about it anymore.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hN-jpXXqJs&disable_polymer=true
Very happy with this
Belchertown Bowman's Link
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hN-jpXXqJs&disable_polymer=true
Very happy with this
So you can see how it sits. Some guys used to put it in front of the riser, claiming the further away it was the greater the precision.
So you can see how it sits. Some guys used to put it in front of the riser, claiming the further away it was the greater the precision.
Not sure how easy it is to see here, but this things awesome. It's the old Timberline NoPeep. Its a little black machined metal thing that attaches to a bracket you put under the sight bracket (could probably attach over it as well). You draw to anchor, line up the two dots inside, put your pin on the target and hit it.
If you can find one on Ebay or something, it's worth a shot. Just found this via google, not sure its live, but it's the same device: http://www.fsdiscountarchery.com/browseproducts/Timberline---No-Peep-.HTML
There was another one that used a red dot with a black ring - same idea, just different colors and look. Google save, its the "Anchor site". I know a few folks who have used these and liked them: https://archeryinnovations.com/
There are others that used cross hair style set ups (tried a Hindsight but didnt like it) and others that almost look like the back end of a rifles "open sight". I have played with those, but really like the "tube" style, just works for me.
IQ basically uses the same system just built into their sight's housing. If I went multi pin I'd go that way for sure, if I got a new single pin I'd consider that one Moons noted on the other thread... http://www.lancasterarchery.com/iq-pro-one-bowsight.html
Last cool thing about the timberline system... The low light visibility of that system (ditto my HHA sight) is insane. I could shoot easily before or after shooting light with this set up. NO, I'm not suggesting that, normally I'm done 10-15' after sunset at the latest because I cant see sticks and what not to shoot safely. Point being, you eliminate any potential peep sight issues be they twist, light, added string weight etc...
I knew Will would chime in on this one, he loves his old no peep! :-) Like bigwoods, I just cant shoot with both eyes open, which I would imagine makes it tough. I think with any sight it's just a matter of repetition , the biggest thing for me is not overthinking the shot. I did take Will's advice on the kisser button, and it just adds another anchor to the knuckle and nose on the string, works great. Good luck with it, and in the upcoming season!
Eastie, I still remember you guys shooting turkey heads at 70 yards. I'd say whatever you are doing certainly works for you.
Ditto Bruce - if you can hit turkey heads at 70, I'd leave everything alone :)
Odd thing about the no peep, I can shoot both open or one open. Cant do no eyes open. That's tough :)! Dominant eye takes over and it doesnt matter if you have 1 or 2 open because you are not looking through anything.
Again though, if you can essentially hit softball's at 70, change NOTHING :)
How's life Eastie? I was just thinking this morning that I should txt you, hadn't seen you on in a while. Hope all is good.
Well you guys done did it just bought a hindsight to try out. I found the worst part of my target panic is when I look through the peep and it clouds me all up and I have trouble getting the pin to stay on the bull. When I aim to the slight left of the string I can hold steady so after reading up I hope this is the key to getting my accuracy back we shall see.
Looking forward to hearing how you like it Spike. I found it ok, but definitely not my favorite. That said, going peepless, and with a system that helps end variations in bow torque, it can work great!
Will, I wish I asked if you shot the Hindsight as I read reviews on ALL the no peep sights so hopefully it works. Yeah my main goal is shooting accurate as for some reason lining the peep up is rough and I have no way to explain what I mean not sure if it is my eyes or cocking my head or what but I’ve been uncomfortable for years I honestly struggle to even make out a bull at 30 yards not sure why. Like I said if I draw back and look to left of string I have no issues holding but as soon as I look through the peep I struggle. So I guess I am trying out the sight for completely different reasons then what people buy them for being torque or low light conditions. The sight I have on now helps immensely with torque but I have bigger issues. I actually read that other people have issues with peep sights as well so at least I’m normal somewhat lol.
Spike, it's a good system. Historically I stink at shooting open sights. So the little optical tube versions just "click" in my brain better. It definitely killed torque issues. I some guys who love them, the timberline option just worked better for me.
At worst you will get a sense of if the concept is better for you than a peep. Then you can experiment if you want to...
Do you aim through the string or just to the side?
Must be to the side spike. Honestly, I'm not sure I've thought about it. Could probably do through with both eyes open, but my set up seems to work equally either way, so my right eye has to be to the side of the string. Which side, I dont know :)!
Go out and shoot one and let me know lol
Spike in shoot rights and my eye looks on the left side of the string. If I knew you wanted a Hind sight I could have given you mine. I didn't like it either.
What didn’t you guys like about it? What is better about the IQ?
Spike, I was just reading through your comments. To me it sounds like the way you anchor is probably the culprit leading toward your issue. I have been use the Timberline No Peep for a long time. Every once in a while, usually on one or two targets when we shoot our club's field course, the string is in the way of my vision. This is caused by a slight change in where I am anchored. I have to move my head around and reset.
So I wonder if you were to maybe anchor on the left side of your nose, things would shift. I do not use a kisser button or a nock to help anchor. Just use my nose and knuckle behind the ear. The no-peep then fine tunes my anchor, usually requiring the slightest up or down adjustment (or not if I anchored perfectly).
I have a stupid question for you. You would not happen to be left eye dominant? Not sure if that would have anything to do with your challenges, but tossing it out there.
Pete
Pete, no I am definitely right eye dominant. I started off with long ATA bows back in the day and shot very well but from what I’m reading with a short draw length some people have issues shooting short ATA bows and looking through the string. For me to shoot I have to tilt my head a good amount to get behind the peep and the field of view is not good so it is hard for me to hold the pin on the bull so for many years I’ve been doing a drive by with the pin and punching the trigger. I used to shoot fingers and had a solid anchor point with my knuckle but ever since using the release it just does not seem natural for me. I’m using a kisser button at the moment but honestly I wish I never changed my old ways. I’m hoping the no peep will solve this problem.
Spike, what I like about the system on the IQ, and the Timberline one I use now (or similar options) is that it has nothing to do with the sight. Zero. It's all about bow torque and anchor consistency. You can draw, everything is "good" but the bow is a little torqued in your grip, even a hair, and the pin looks perfect, level looks perfect, but you shoot off in some direction. The hindsight helps reduce the odds by giving you a rear check. You can look through a torqued peep, but if the riser is torqued, the hindsight will show you. It's just that it's got to be in your field of view through the pins to the target. So it sort of clutters that up. And if you use multiple pins, you have to base it off one of them for consistency - I'm not good enough to remember that when hunting :).
With the IQ or similar, it's out of the sight window, and not about the target, it's solely about how you are anchored and set. if things are good, the little circles line up and you are not torquing or looking funny.
Like I noted above, a buddy with a several inches longer draw shot a bow of mine with it, and despite no actual anchor - it was inches in front of his face - by lining up the dots, it represented "what I see" when shooting, and thus, was spot on for him too. If I'm in a tree all contorted at full draw, if those circles line up, the arrow goes where the pin is placed... But, all that happens OUT of my field of view. So when I look at the pin, I just see that one little dot and nothing else to put on the deer.
It just cleans up the sight window. You are in Granby right? Ill probably hit the swift in Belchertown to fish in the next couple weeks. Ill PM you if I can, and if your around Ill bring my bow so you can take a look. the draw would be long (29.5") but you may be able to get a sense of the difference.
Then again, you may love the hindsight, I know guys who do! It just wasnt for me.
"If I'm in a tree all contorted at full draw, if those circles line up, the arrow goes where the pin is placed..."
So this statement makes me wonder, will this also correct for dropping the arm instead of bending the waist. Meaning, if you drop the arm but still manage to line up the circles, will the shot be good or will it still be high? Part of me thinks it will still be high but I'm not sure, I need input from someone smarter than me.
I think I've asked something similar before but I can't remember the answer (age related phenomenon).
Bruce, regrettably, no. You will still go high if you drop the arm which regrettably you can do while keeping the little circles lined up - I've experienced that phenomenon.
However, if you have to twist around the tree, or around the seat of your climber or what not, you are good. The "fix" is mostly bow torque related I believe. If you dont bend at the waist, you change the line of sight to your pin which creates the high hit... Which reminds me of something Ill start another thread on.
I remember my first deer I was in a hemlock and had to kneel down on the platform and shoot under a limb and it made my string hit my sleeve and kicked the arrow up and right into its jugular only went 20 yards worked out lol. Another shot in NJ I had to twist around the tree and shoot but hit low so always getting crazy shots.
Spike I love my IQ, didn't like the Hind Sight.
Will, I would think if you dropped your arm but the green dot was lined up it would still be accurate.
mrw I’m glad things are working out well for you. In my own case, my IQ has been a real limitation.
Mark, maybe you can go climb a tree, drop your bow arm, and test that out for us :-)
MRW - I'd think so, but so far, for me, it seems to still go high. Unless I'm just blowing it on yardages - which, point blank, is entirely possible!
I'll test it - after my arm heals up a bit!