Senior Hunters
Pennsylvania
I would like to see all senior licensed hunters ,in Pennsylvania, be able to use the old antler regulations with no restrictions. They could shoot any size buck 3" spike or larger. I am just talking Senior Hunters, a lot of them can not walk back into the deep woods anymore. They are committed to staying close to home or camp.
Just go back to the 3" spike across the board and forget all this AR crap!
I would of got a real nice six point this year and had to pass on some really nice 4 points in the past. I'd be happy if they lifted the antler restriction for second season to kill off some of those scruffy bucks for flintlock and archery.
Do you feel that lifting ar for seniors would make better use of the resource or simply make it better for you?
I personally put antler restrictions on myself 25 years ago. I do not need to shoot anymore spikes. I would like to have more personal discretion to shoot a mature buck which not everyone can do. I guess it would be nice if they did not have to legislate it. I think antler restrictions are serving the purpose they were intended for. I have met more than a few older guys who got a buck of a lifetime because of antler restrictions that did not see to mind anymore.
You can still kill a basket racked buck. If you dont like ARs then Let the bigger bucks walk. Simple:)
This is some really amazing thinking.. Do you guys, no matter what the age really want to go back to killing spikes and Y bucks? Really? Me thinks your just angry over the fact the dumb ones who rarely wander 200 yards from the roads and aint seen 2 seasons yet are just really easy to kill. when they get another year under their belt and the shooting starts and you have to actually sit for more than a half hour to shoot your spike, your squirming... Man, shooting spikes again just to make it easy is laughable...
Personally I like AR as it is and think on public land there should be some mechanism to allow most bucks to reach age 2 or 3. Whether that is hunter quotas, AR, or whatever. AR seems the most palatable. Private land I think there is a good argument to let the landowners decide.
On the other hand while I like chasing better bucks that AR provides, it's hard for me to project my belief system on someone else. Personally criticizing someone for wanting to shoot a spike or forkie is beyond pathetic.
Elk... how long have AR been in place? And they still want to go back to the good old days of seeing 50 doe in a herd and not a buck on the mountain? Have we not been on AR long enough for the argument over shooting spikes to end? Not a knock but do people really want to regress?
AR and HR are two different concepts for one.
I hunted hard all season. Certainly more than the average weekend warrior. And I didn't have a shot at a legal buck until November 10. And he was a beauty and I killed him. Most years I pass at least 2 or 3 legal ones. This was an odd year. But I completely understand if a guy just wanted a buck, being frustrated by AR. I had a couple nice chunky 4 points walk by that would have been mighty tasty. I like AR, I'm just saying I can understand why someone would not.
HR & AR are two concepts but they go hand in hand. In order to see the mature bucks you need to limit the doe population in order to make the big boys work for their piece of tail. The good old days enabled big bucks the leasure of staying put, outside of human contact where hunters don’t go because the ladies were in an abundance right in the bucks living room. Now they need to travel & compete with other bucks to get some because the ladies aren’t around like they used to be. AR’s have increased the age structure of bucks giving them the opportunity to sport some pretty good head gear, HR’s have made those mature bucks less elusive by making the ladies play hard to get, particularly during the rut which in turn benefits us hunters. Both concepts have achieved their goal and in turn have benefited all hunters. The rules will never go back to how they were, complaining about them at this point is pointless, adjust your strategy or sit back & watch those that do harvest some really ice bucks.
I had 2 nice plump 4 points by me , would of shot 1 of them if we had no ar, there are trophy hunters that put there own restrictions on the bucks they shoot. Those same 4 points I saw could get hit by a car.or die if disease.
Yea, I hunted 3 days a week all archery sEason mostly evenings after work, saw 1 legal buck, saw 1 spike, and 2 four points and a 3 point. Maby total of 9 morning hunts. Maby a total of 22 deer seen all archery season , my feelings after gun season comes in and another decent harvest next year where I've hunted , numbers could be bad.
Funny how a forkie can either be 'plump' or 'scrawny' depending on whether the person describing it likes AR or not.
Yea dont like antler restrictions, havnt really seen that many big bucks since it started many years ago, I'd go back to the old days tommrow now that was hunting. My son has no interest in hunting, and if I took him out to hunt for days at a time he would get bored, took my nephew out last year hunted the last 3 days of rifle season saw like 4 deer. We did see a legal buck but his first year hunting did not get a shot. He said you need to find new place to hunt I told him we saw a deer every day we could of easily saw nothing, 1 of my buddys hunted all 2nd week everyday no deer sighted at all.
If you took me out to deer hunt for days at a time I'd get bored. Take kids small game hunting, let them walk, explore, move. Give em a .410 and go squirrel hunting. Jump on a few brush piles looking for rabbits or pheasants. Sitting in one place staring at trees is a recipe for a kid to hate hunting.
My $.02 and I'll get off this soapbox now.:)
I guess it all depends on where you hunt. Around my place there are many very nice bucks, way more nicer bucks than years ago.
So I say AR is working here. I'm not a horn hunter, never was. Fact is does tastes much better than bucks in the rut.
Less deer total, but the herd is healthy. In the past, there were too many deer here.
So if you are not seeing any deer, it's time to scout out another area to hunt. I also agree on taking the kids small game hunting.
Why is it so important to some to shoot a buck that they wish AR didn't exist? Make spikes and Y's legal just so we can shoot them legally. Why is shooting a buck so important? I'm being serious. I like to get a buck as much as the next guy, but I don't want the rules changed just so its easier. I don't get my buck every year either. This year was first buck with bow since 2010. But I'd never wish for the pre AR days.
I agree with RC's last post. If you aren't seeing deer or legal bucks, find a new spot. There is a lot of them out there this year.
Let the old geezers shoot what they want..................................................most of 'em won't be able to see well enough to hit it anyway! ;-)
For what I've seen I've got a camp up North where a 15 inch wide 4 point was a trophy years ago, I think the antler restrictions are workin better up there ,lots of big woods where you can't get a lot of pressure on those deer, and when I can hunt up there if I've got time off work, not many hunters up there neither, and 1st day of buck alot of hunters hunt till noon and there done for the day.
I'm a senior, things are fine they are! If your old enough to be a senior, you should understand & have more patience. Greed!
Is it more greedy to want to kill a 4-point or to want someone else to pass up a 4-point so that you might have a chance at him when he's older? I'd say the greed sure enough runs both ways.
This reminds me of the old yarns spun around the fire in deer camps... "Once a spike always a spike", "do not shoot a doe your killing next years buck", and on and on it goes.. AR is here to stay.. If your not seeing legal deer to shoot, maybe find a new place to hunt? Thanks Gary Alt... Should have done it 30 years earlier.
Greed. Some guys want there to be less deer overall just so an older buck with a bigger set of antlers has to travel more to breed, hoping that will bring it by their stand, making their trophy hunting easier. So less deer hunting opportunity for everyone, so it's easier for you. Real nice. Real sportsmanlike.
And what's all this spike bs? That isn't how it was where I hunt prior to AR. I've shot a grand total of 1 spike in 40 years of hunting. It was the only chance I ever had at one. Contrary to what some here are saying, there were lots of big bucks around here prior to the AR change.
They have it pretty screwed up here now. I drove around what was once prime hunting area on the first two days of the season and to be completely honest, you wouldn't even know deer season was in. In travels where I would have seen several dozen vehicles, I saw one car on Monday, and two on tues. And even with all that snow, not a single deer, even in the protected areas of Moraine S.P. What the heck?
All the hunters must have went 'somewhere else'. Yeah, they're at home, they quit.
With AR's came No Hunting posters. Landowners posted up quick when they found out they could make a buck from trophy hunters. In my local area there's only about a tenth of the available land there was before AR's. Find another place to hunt? Yeah, OK, I'll get right on that.
We saw way more deer back then. Imbalanced? Unhealthy? Hardly! Hunting was fun too. Everyone hunted, it was a lifestyle. Not now, and I don't see it ever coming back.
As far as lifting AR's for seniors......if grandpa can't count he shouldn't be walking around with a rifle. Same goes for juniors.
Jeff, maybe they all just hunt squirrels and only TALK about the actual hunting of deer. Squirrel season is out, so they are at home or just driving around, lookin at cars, thinkin about how they have everything figured out....
I'm a senior, will be 73 in January, and don't think I need any special regulations because I was lucky enough to get this old. Besides, I'm probably in better shape than half the 40 year old hunters out there.
Yup, ole red is getting a little chunky:)
To go back to days when 85-90% of all bucks killed were only 1.5 years old, is at best laughable, and at worst just plain stupid.
No, BC, you got it wrong...e’rybody stayin home now cuz they cant shoot a 3 point...and that makes it easier for you to kill your buck, thats why ur lazy, greedy behind wants it that way.... Ummmm, yeah, ur right, now that i say that out loud, that is laughable.
Stick.... I’m pickin’ up what your puttin’ down. There’s one thing though. I’m neither lazy nor greedy, as was stated in a previous post. It takes work, and a lot of it. I’ve learned over the years, most are not willing to put forth the effort.
I quit bow hunting cause I refuse to share the woods with compounds and crossbows! :)
Hell RC, I don’t care what ppl hunt with. Hunt how you want, that’s what makes this a great sport. But to infer that ppl quit hunting because of AR’s is just BS. Is it perfect? Not by any means. I do know it’s better than it was. And I’ve been doing this over 40 years, and in more states, than I care to remember. It has put the hunt, back in hunting. And that’s why I love it. And if some ppl have quit hunting because of AR’s, I gotta question why they were doing it in the first place.
AR's have led to alot of posted property around me. My deer syndrome. Some of us was/Are satisfied shooting a buck that never used to be followed by a hundred number. And just for the record I seen just as many big bucks before this happened. Took alot of leg work back then though.
My Dad is now 85 hunted on opening day with iron sights on a 44 pistol and stayed out all day in that rain. Had the local pope and young 4 point at thirty yards and couldn't shoot, would have loved to seen him get that deer.
Some of you guys watch way to many hunting shows.
BINGO BC 173.
Ppl not respecting property or property lines is the reason for posted property. Not ARs
And what do u mean u used to see big bucks and it took a lot of “legwork” back then? Are u saying it doesnt take any legwork now? If thats true, then why are u having a problem passing up the tiny bucks? Pending where ur at, u dont need a buck with a hundred number following it, all u need is 3 on a side.....
For the record, i wouldnt have an issue at all with your 85 year old dad or any other senior being able to shoot any buck. I do want ARs, but just as i like a junior being able to shoot any legal buck id be ok with seniors being able to.
I just get tired of hearing ppl whine about it and using ARs as excuses for other BS. Hunter numbers are declining, yup. Because ppl are becoming increasingly lazier. And there is lots of posted property, yup. Because ppl are becoming increasingly more disrespectful to what they dont own feeling they are entitled to do as they wish wherever they wanna do it. Its not MY deer, but its MY land. I cant set up my beach chair, lather up in suntan lotion and use your pool. If i did, you’d sure as heck put up posted signs to keep me out, wouldnt ya?
Hawkeye.... like I said, it’s not perfect. I agree with a lot of what you said. Up to 16 and after 70, would probably work. However, you know what that would lead to.
And for the record, I do not watch any hunting shows at all.
Hawkeye...you have two different mindsets here, hornhunters and deerhunters. Genetics are the same in a 1 1/2 year old deer as they are in a 4 1/2 year old deer. But the 2 1/2 or 3 1/2 year old 4 point that I saw the last day of archery is hurting the herd.
A 2-1/2 or 3-1/2 year old 4 point is clearly an anomaly. To say leaving them has nearly as much effect on the deer herd as taking them as well as tons of other 4 or less point bucks would be like saying bowhunters are poachers, because there are a few that have poached deer...
You guys are forgetting one thing. A large healthy doe has more to do with producing a "trophy buck" than the buck that bred her.
I live and hunt in 2C. One thing we all noticed since AR and HR were implemented is the lack of spikes and forkies. They are getting whacked as button bucks. Overall buck population is down. No noticeable increase of racked bucks at all. We always had some nice bucks around, AND a whole lot of young bucks. Not so now.
Yes, I'd like to see the whole thing go back to the way it was. We never had hungry, unbalanced, unhealthy deer herds in the first place. AND we had way more places to hunt.
Yesterday in the neighbor's field there were fifteen deer before daylight when he was getting ready for work. He saw seven more in the field a quarter mile from his house as he was driving to work. They were likely somewhere in the daytime as well. Every year in July over ten bucks (this year 13) show up together in the field across the road. In two weeks they are gone and you don't see them anymore. Guys won't climb that ridge that we used to climb to look for bucks back in the 60's...70's, etc. Next year there will be that same batch of bucks in that field, minus a few and plus a few, and very few are under 6 points except the yearlings and some are past 18" inside...one or two bigger than that. A few bucks will be killed off that mountain, but likely not more than three or four.
The genes are being spread because those big bucks show up every single year at about the same time in the neighbor's alfalfa fields. The smallest number was 8 and this year was the largest gathering of 13. We don't have a lack of deer or bucks in our ridges down here, but we do have a lack of people hunting them. You rarely see more than one or two vehicles in bow season at the local game lands and it encompasses near 11,000 acres. This photo was taken in July and no on has taken this big boy, and he will likely be over there again next year.
Same field same day same time.
Again, just up the field a little further.
I'll be right over George! :)
Quads and trailcams have eliminated the leg work from yesteryear. And we're not going to agree on the posted property not having a relationship with AR's.
AR's was implemented to make bigger racks for more license sales along with the revenue that it would generate. And that dollar figure is not working out for various reasons.
Quads are not an option, if you hunt SGL’s, like I do.
Hawkeye, If you keep talking in blanket statements, you will probably be a little right. A little....
I guess we just forgot we can't have intelligent conversation here. Our bad.
You can, but to want things to go back to "the good ol days" it isnt happening. Shooting spikes and Y bucks just because you want to make it easier for you? Well, maybe RC does have some valid points.
Red I'm sure if you took a half hour drive over to George's place, he could show you where those big bucks live.
He could show you 1,000's of acres of state game lands too, with DEER living in them!
"Hawkeye, If you keep talking in blanket statements, you will probably be a little right. A little...." Justin...which of Hawkeye's statements are not accurate? There is no science behind todays AR's. Why do they cull mediocre bucks on managed properties on a regular basis. To get them out of the gene pools. AR's are about egos.
Getting deep now.... All the guys who didn't get a deer gotta blame it on the PGC policy. LOL
In my opinion(which is all any of this is, nobody is completely right), all of it. There is zero scientific evidence that what hes saying is true. Its just blanket statements of opinion that of course are gonna have a case of truth somewhere along the line, so thats what it is... JimBob over yonder posted his ground n leased it out to a couple guys for hunting. Yeah, well, there have been leases here for a lot longer than ARs. And there are states full of leases without ARs.
1— As BC said, u cant run quads on state ground. Cams... the guys who ONLY use cameras to get intell on the deer they hunt aint killin much regardless.
2— Again, property gets posted because the ppl that pay for it dont want others on it. Some because they want it for themselves, whether its a pressure free place to hunt or for any other reason they wanted to own it and some because idiots trespass or didnt treat it right when they had permission to be on it. Ive lost more private property to that, ive never lost private property because of ARs
3— ARs are to help get bucks to a higher age. Higher age equals bigger racks by default.
Where he’s right is im not gonna convince him of nothin. And thats okay. We will have to agree to disagree. I can handle that.
Shoot Three Fingers Under, peg leg.....:)
I will tell u one thing that cant be restricted...the amount of love here. Its palpable...;^)
LMBO!
Well, I’m gonna give my opinion. The last few years I have been hunting 3 very different parts of the state. 1) Farms in WMU 5C 2) public land in the Poconos (WMU 3D) And 3) A former farm(most of the fields are not planted) in Clarion Co(WMU 2D)
From what I am seeing, AR’s and HR are working well! No debate- you’d have to be blind not to see it.
Now, I do believe there are some areas where they may not be working as well. But just talk to the butchers and taxidermists around the state- the vast majority will tell you they ARE working! In fact, I just watched one of the local outdoor shows that featured a butcher in our area. Their assessment was that the bucks are bigger and healthier than ever. The last few years they (and our other cable tv out door show) have had other butchers and taxidermists on their shows who were of the same opinion.
Click on the video in the link
Things haven't changed much on here have they? I haven't been on this page for probably 10 years. LOL, how's everyone doing? I hate antler restrictions.
The date in the picture has been changed to protect the innocent. Na, I'm just to lazy to program the right date in......
Antler restrictions suck!
Dear John...
Good to see you here.
How ya been?
Yup AR works.
Little John, good to hear from you.
George, How close is to the DMA #2 are those deer? For some reason I couldn't down load the latest PGC DMA map for unit two.
And I'm going to make a attempt to rephrase my AR dislikes. And I could show you some enormous bucks that have been taken. Most, if not all, have been shot on private property. Quite a few of them shot on private property that there is no permission for. Have several neighbors that posters were torn down so a ladder tree stand could go up on the only good tree in the fence row. The PGC doesn't want to get involved in survey lines. One of my other neighbors house got shot two years ago, land posted. A lot of this seems to be what some of you private land owners are talking about. These bucks are going to the taxidermist, so yes it proves the AR's are working. Once these guys get the picture of the big one on their trail camera the chase is on. These wise old bucks know how to survive and many take refuge in the comfort of safety zones, or private property, which doesn't matter to these guys. So yes AR's have made some bigger racks along with a lot more posted land in my area.
Little John- welcome back! And LOL! I take it those are 2 different bucks? Just wonder what county are you in?
hawkeye- just curious- what county are you in?
Take a look at the public land thread.
Let me set up a little scenario here:
A big doe, that same “plump” 4 point, that was described earlier, and just a dandy stud buck are all within 20 yds. of your tree stand, at the same time. Now, I don’t know which one will hit the ground last, but I sure as hell know which one will hit the ground first. That stud buck is gettin’ shot first, every damn time. Even by the ppl who don’t like AR’s.
You guys crack my ass up!!
Hey Stick... I hear ya bud, the love here is palpable!!
I like your comment Jeff. Sounds about right , ar are good and bad, but I think the doe are to far shot off, just my opinion.
I've taken nice mountain bucks and so has my family before ar, lots of places for them to hide in those big woods. Plus alot less hunters hunting them.
Jim- you are assuming that the doe and/or forkie don't "pick you off first!" ;-)
Bow hunter s.... in some areas I agree, the does are mighty thin. Could be a lot of reasons for it though. Too many being killed, pressure, moving to a different food source on posted land. I hunt SGL’s mixed with a lot of private and it don’t take long for them to disappear.
From: RC
04-Dec-18
Take a look at the public land thread.
I did- that's why I am asking. Didn't see anything about what part of the state he was in.
Hey, RC....
Hey, RC....
AR’s sure worked there.
I hear ya Rut
Do the "special permit" people need to follow AR's? If not, the seniors that cannot make it back far, the ones that the OP seems to be referring to, can get the permit and AR's wouldn't apply. Speaking for myself, my Dad is 70 and there is no need to do anything special in regards to AR's for him. He gets around just fine.
If your into shooting "any" deer and are not seeing what you think you should, knock on some doors for those red tag farms....
Jim posted...."You guys crack my ass up!!" Kinda strange buddy, but the scenario you presented would have played out pre ARs. You know what cracks my ass up? Dumb posts! I general, I got no problem following ARs. And HR was and in some cases continues to be absolutely necessary. However, letting a 12 inch spike like folks see every year or a huge 4 point pollute the gene pool is not good management.
Gowaty...how the heck are you?
Like I said Bob, genetics can’t be controlled in a wild free ranging herd. Science proves that. For years and years, 90% of all bucks killed were 1.5 years old, consisting of spikes, 4 pts. and the like. Now,if that didnt clean up the gene pool, shooting a spike now, sure as heck isn’t going to.
But your right about one thing though, I don’t like dumb posts either.
2016 archery harvest in Pa.
Total 109,250
Bucks 59,550
Does 49,700
Someone knows where and how to hunt....
I propose Pa institutes a DINK BUCK TAG to silence the I gotta kill ah buck whiners!
Like I said Bob, genetics can’t be controlled in a wild free ranging herd. Science proves that. For years and years, 90% of all bucks killed were 1.5 years old, consisting of spikes, 4 pts. and the like. Now,if that didnt clean up the gene pool, shooting a spike now, sure as heck isn’t going to.
Now whadda ya gonna say Boooby?:)
Big bucks were once little bucks and spikes. Do they change genes every spring :) No need for a license increase with the Dink tag!
Jim...I can't argue your point there. Maybe even on a couple points you just made:^) As with most guys on this site, I see inferior and good bucks every year. Unfortunately Joe Average would be content to take a 1.5 y.o. 5 or 6 point any day. Those are the deer that need to walk.
RC...I liked you better when you drank...:^P XO
I was talking with a group of hunters at the bull chitters convention in Meyersdale, Pa last night.
They said a spike will always be a spike.
One dude, think his name was Dave something. Said he shot a spike 4 years ago and had it mounted, but he said it's still a spike today.
So I dunno anymore...
Bc173 I hear you those deer are not dumb, my brother has some private land behind his house we hunt and there mite be 5 people with permission to hunt it and most of the time there is nobody on it , look out his window you can see 10 doe ,go hunt it you mite not see nothing . No one moving thw deer around, good for archery season.
RC, your the best fisherman I ever did see.
I enjoy a good debate though. And the best part of this thread is that not one person was wrong. It’s all been in good fun.
Hell Jim, ya don't even need bait in here:)
He is a baiting master....;^)
Almost 3 months now, Bobby:)
ROFLMAO.
Congrats on the 3 months RC.
Dang! You boys been busy this evening! : )
Red Beastmaster...Dave, you know you are always welcome here and the invitation is open. I'll even give you good spots to hunt...Scotty can tell you how well that works as long as your bow isn't leaning against a tree, just out of reach. ;)
George you are a good man..
I see the dozer tracks under the back bumper.Hope he didn't mark the paint with the tow chain.
Shoot Three Fingers Under:)
They use straps now Bob. ;-)
I see where you wanna go with this Justin, but I'm not gonna argue with you. I hope the squirrels you're obsessed with come rabidly for your nuts in your dreams. Lol. Nice to see I got in your head and stayed there all those years. There's obviously not going to be an open minded rational discussion with you about responsible management. You are now thoroughly and irreversibly brainwashed. Congrats on your 'closure'.
I disagree with you, you with me. I see it one way, thru my experience in the woods and what hunting is to me. You see it another way, i would assume thru your experience and what hunting is to you. Now, we live in complete different parts of the state, so even IF what we believed the deer herd should look like meshed with eachother, we could come to the table with completely different opinions on how things are going anyway. I dont much care at all whether someone is anti-AR. In fact, i can see that side of things at times, i really do. But the fact of the matter is, ARs are here and here to stay, and ive noticed a very positive difference from the ARs so therefore, i like them. You can tell me you dont like them and im cool with that, im completely open minded to ppl having different thoughts and opinions. But where my mind closes, is when ppl try to tell me im wrong because they think they know my experiences and what im seeing in the woods better than i do and/or to blame anything they can on ARs(example-decling hunter numbers). As far as closure, i believe what i believe because of what ive seen/experienced. That could change if what i see/experience changes. I see more and more good bucks each year and both my butcher friend and taxidermy friend says the deer are looking super healthy. I dont know what else i am supposed to believe about the state of the deer herd in my neck of the woods. But maybe they are brainwashing me....
I want to congratulate you as well Jeff, on one of the finest mushroom seasons ive ever seen anybody have...;^)
Ah way to go Justin B...
Now Jeff is gonna get fired up and write a 1,000 word essay:)
LMBO Justin! Maybe we'll see him in the next issue of Mushrooms and Mushroom Hunting magazine! ;-)
Are MR's soon to be put on the table????
Is there a size limit to them mushrooms?
When you take the high road, you can never be a loser.
Well done, Justin
They only live 1 yr, so I don't think there's any "restrictions" on Mushrooms, Jim! ;-)
There should be a 5 pound limit of mushrooms per year, combined species. Each pound has to be tagged and reported within 24 hours. You can apply for an additional 5 pounds in a designated WMU of your choice as long as you fill out a pink envelope with checks payable to the County Treasurer. You need to harvest them with a fixed blade knife and not a folder :)
Seriously, I hunt the NE corner of the state and ARs have made a huge difference from what I have seen. Deer sightings are fewer than before ARs, but the population was severely out of balance. Some years I seem to see more spikes and forks which I don't have a problem passing, especially since there are enough legal bucks running around.
I can't explain why AR's work in certain areas and not in other areas.
But around my place there has been a huge difference in the quality of bucks I see compared to 15 years ago or longer.
And the doe population here has been reduced.
15 years ago there would be 50 deer in the field below my house.
That's a bit too many I think.
Now there are more like 15 seen at night.
Well, Hec..
Where ya been?:)
Roy, it’s the same where I hunt in Bedford County. One year before ARs there were 13 bucks killed in gun season at the farm I hunted. Eleven were spikes or 3 points. That was more than usual but not atypical. We would see herds of 20 or more deer regularly. After ARs and herd reduction the number of deer is way down but the size of the antlers is way up. Now it’s rare to see spikes.
Yup Phil.
I hunt the mountains south of Marienville every year for buck season. There are some really big bucks taken up there now.
I'm not a trophy hunter by no means.
But the AR's tell me the program is working.
However take Dave and George for instance.
They live about 20 miles apart.
George sees all kinds of deer and nice bucks while Dave sees hardly anything?
I saw 2 spikes, 2 little 4 points in archery this year. The only legal buck I saw in 1 of my places I hunt this year was killed on the road close to Halloween , go figure.
15 deer in 1 field , you got a hotspot.
I know this is a bowhunting forumn but first Saturday of rifle I saw a herd of 6 doe biggest herd I've seen for years , could not even say how many I'd say 10 12 years at least.and no I did not shoot any of them.
I love AR. The thing is in my neck of the woods I'm see way less spikes and and y's than before AR I pass up small 8 points now, but didn't before AR.
Now I see both sides to this. But I think that a senior Hunter has just about as good of chance to kill a 6 or 8 points as I do. Would like to really know how many small bucks would be killed if they we're allowed to kill any buck. But if it's just about the meat, that's what doe tags are for. Would really like to know how many senior Hunters we have.. I know a few senior hunters that love AR's. I know AR was implemented for more than just big deer. But with the more dominant bucks doing most of the breeding,and the forest being I better condition, I truly believe that is why I'm seeing less smaller racks on year and half old deer.
I don't think that the dwindling Hunter numbers in PA has anything to do with AR. As states the don't have AR is seeing the same dwindling of hunters numbers.
But I would keep an open mine to know of all the y and spikes out there and I truly believe there is less. What percentage would be killed by senior Hunters. Also when AR was being considered I believe the reason AR was implemented on senior Hunters was because the senior Hunters actually were for it and requesting AR for themselves. Ed
Are you guys that are into the big racks finding rubs on 4-6" trees? , or larger. The biggest I've found this year is maybe 2.5" and they were scarce. I can drive a five miles and see the big racks in late summer, but can not hunt them.
Was out this past Friday sneak hunting and see a 3" spike, a 8" curved spike, a 3 point and the P&Y 4 point. Along with 9 does, the 3" spike and 3 point was interested in one of the small does.
AR is working. As a side note, regardless of what everyone was taught- a spike does not remain a spike..
A spike used to remain a spike. USED to. Now that they arent getting shot, they turn into something other than spikes... ;^)
Stick, and that is a good thing. If we had AR 50 years ago, imagine the spikes and Y's with all that potential, getting snuffed out in their second year... Ah, what might have been some booners, a little age is all they needed, not the "brown it's down" Pennsyltucky mentality.
8 to 10 years ago I told everybody half the deer I saw were bucks, including buttons, but they were bucks. Half were also legal (for 2 d). The ratio has swung a bit in favor of the does lately because we are not shooting enough of them. My Amish neighbor even agreed with that.
Used to see over 100 deer in the big woods on opening day of rifle season 50 years ago and only a couple year and a half olds. Nicer racks now and better ratio.
Venison filets on the right. Steelhead Trout in the middle. Ckicken-of-the-woods on the left.
It depends who you are, Justin! ;-)
Dang McQuacker! You makin’ me HUNGRY! : )
Guess what's slow-cooking while I'm working?
Never seen a mushroom like that..
Fat ass? I think not, I lost 60 lbs and weigh in at 195.
Homemade mozzarella and tomatoes from indoor garden.
Tomatoes, mozzarella, mushrooms in olive oil vinegar and water with Italian seasonings.
I agree with you jeff Durnell, I live 15 minutes from moraine state park, use to be fabulous hunting there and everywhere, pretty greedy they want mature bucks to have to roam in search of a doe, the lack of hunters is terrible , and people say antler restrictions did not cause people to quit hunting is b.s., that 4 point restriction in the beginning was real b.s.. that's why everyone shot does they knew it was a prayer to see 4 points on one side if they wanted deer meat. Then you have those guys that say hey I got 3 more doe tags I got to fill really you eat deer meat every day, I know some guys that will shoot 3 to 4 doe a year come on that's greed. Yea pa is very screwed up right now and it's not going to get much better.
I need 4 deer a year in order to have a little meat left over when the next season rolls around. Its me, my wife, and 8 yr old and 5 yr old daughters. I dont buy beef and im proud of that. We do get busy often throughout the year, so sometimes we may only have a home cooked meal once or twice in a week...we eat venison at least once a week those times. Others we may eat 3-5 meals of venison a week. But thanks for letting me know that im just greedy...If you have any other tips on any other terrible characteristics i have, please dont hesitate to let me know. You are obviously just chocked full of wisdom....
I heard too much wild meat can make you testy.
Or make your testes sore:)
Eat more chicken!
It might. So does the end of the year where work gets insane because we have a TON of work but lose a lot of install days to holidays/vacation days and all the customers are callin and complaining because their job is more important than anybody else’s and i havent scheduled them in front of jobs we already had. And then of course, there are the times where someone talks out of their hind-end because something is a certain way in THEIR world so thats how it must be for everybody. But, Im just happy that i’ve avoided the getting testy and/or the getting sore testes from any of it ;^)
Ahhhhhh, i feel a lot better now. Like my grandma told me as a young boy, when ur feelin a touch of gloom, just post a picture of a mushroom.... ;^)
I still say there otta be a limit on ‘shrooms. Prolly would need a license too. When I read some of these posts it makes me think you guys are using “shrooms” for more reasons than eating.
If Moraine SP.is the only place you hunt, I’d say it’s time to re-locate. Come on bow hunter s, don’t let ppl tell you how to think. Get out. Drive, knock on a couple doors, there are many SGL’s that hardly see a hunter during season. Believe me, I know. Life is certainly not that bad at all.
And as far as bucks having to move, to locate does, that is the natural order of things. They are born 1/1. That should explain a lot, right there.
Yeah Jim, all these guys just loading up on as many shrooms as they can and they even hunt them on Sundays!
Bc173 know one tells me how to think , I've been hunting for over 35 years , I have venison in my freezer every year, I hunt hard from Sept to jan. Comon . Every family is different mine is good with 1 deer. I pass on shots.
Hey Justin... yep. Need a license and a limit. ;). And to be able to hunt them on Sunday is down right just plain crazy. They should at least get one day to rest.
RC... gotta keepem’ on their toes. :)
find edible shrooms & you'll find the deer.
