THE LAST CROSSBOW THREAD
Wisconsin
After 2 years of observing 2 years of the introduction of the crossbow I can offer the following opinion .
In 1972 ? 4 of us were at the Ojibwa bowclub practicing for a major tournament . All 4 of us were using Bear Super Kodiak Magnums .
We were taking a break ( having a cold one ) when a Ford Torreno wagon pulled up . A guy got out & started to hand out these white bows with white wheels & cables . He gave each of us 3 arrows , said our arrows would not hold up in his bow . He told us that he was tipped off that we were the best shooters in the club so he asked us to shoot these weird bows . We fired about 25 arrows each . He drove off headed to another club .
We laughed & felt sorry for him . It was clear to us " pros " that that bow would be a complete failure . Heavy . very hard pull the 1st 8 inches . Noise ? Sounded like a a base Guitar . This would fail .
After 2 years of infighting , shooters quitting the club, bar fights , & a few clubs falling apart . The compounds were allowed in the clubs with seperate rules & awards . Total peace took about 5 years .
The Crossbows entering the hunt has been MUCH smoother than the compound . I am done bitching .
Heres a scary tbought , what will the next generations " bow " look like & perform .
Time for all to get along .
And what were those compounds pushing....170 fps if that. Look how far just the compound has come. Back then you would call the modern compound a vertical crossbow. Any one remember that draw locking device or the arrow tube on the compounds that never took hold.
Like Ruger says....."divide and conquer" will be our death knell.
Ruger, I have a similar memory and have been thinking this same thing recently. My hope is that the increase in crossbow success does not shorten my archery season. Time will tell.
This will be far from the last crossbow thread. Heck it might not be the only one today.
There are still a fundamental differences between vertical bows and crossbows. Having to draw and old a bow is always going to be a night and day difference.
Modern compounds are indeed easier to master than recurves/long bows however they can't be mastered in one shot. A crossbow can be given to literally anyone with a functioning finger and eye and be shot accurately the first time.
Anyone who doesn't see the huge advantage of the crossbow over the vertical bow is fooling themselves.
When you come up with a cure for greed and laziness, then the circus will leave town. Good luck with that.....
Funny stuff, retro. On other threads you bitch about too many hunters and over-crowded hunting areas. Chewed up or expensive land, blah, blah, blah. Are you looking to cure your own greed? Pot, meet kettle.
Many of you are finally coming around.
See that’s why I hunt only private land, I couldn’t go out here and hunt public lay because the first time some Mickey Mouse idiot comes up to me talking about how I should hunt that a crossbow is not right, boo hoo a gun should not be used and all that blah blah dumb crap we will have problems, why can’t u just accept the fact that times change, accept the fact what u hunt with makes u no better hunter than the rest, unless someone is poaching or running deer off of u then what good does it do to complain? I killed more deer than u can say grace over but big deal who cares , I’ve killed big bucks for many years with a bow but big deal, and I’ve killed deer with a gun and muzzle loader but big deal, I’ve had hunters shoot big bucks I had on camera 2 Miles away from me with a gun I didn’t care I was proud of them, that’s what’s wrong with this world now days everyone wants to be right, if a bow or crossbow or gun or a missle is not affecting your hunt, not running deer away from you, stopping your kill ratio , and if it’s not hurting the deer were we hunt what difference does it make, there is plenty of deer not everyone hunts like me or you, your way is no better than mine, hell I’ve traveled all over the United States hunting got different views and u know what everyone of them thousands of people I met along the way all had different views but all agreed that it makes no difference as long as there hunting and enjoying there selves and doing it legally why complain about it, just get along enjoy your hunt kill a big buck with your bow or crossbow or gun and congratulate your friends or neighbor if they kill a big buck or doe, but my views your views we all have them but it doesn’t mean were right God Bless keep it safe
Sorry split but it isn't okay to say who cares accept it etc. That's why we are where we are. A divided nation as well as a divided hunting group. Money will always win.
By the way - stop letting your children watch Rudolph the Red Nose Reindeer. It's now offensive says the news.
well good look in trying to change it, as long as I do my thing it really is none of my business, if they ban bows, crossbows, guns or whatever I will find a way to hunt legal maybe go into spearing never done that lol
That is an award winning run-on sentence split toe! Awesomeness!
Well Pete-pec Whew thank u I knew I was awesome at something
Most of us believe 65+ or disabled should be allowed to use xguns. We are against xguns for ALL during the archery season. To whoever says xguns are no different than compounds, go get your melon examined.
Of course crossbows are different, much like a compound bow manufactured 15 years ago is different than one manufactured today.
I'm afraid some of you are just going to have to get used to sharing the woods with other hunters and knowing someone is doing it differently than you are, and yes, someone else might just shoot your buck with a crossbow.
X Guns are definitely a controversial topic her in MN as well. I had someone who is a XGun hunter tell me that if they had a separate/shorter/etc. season for Xguns then that season should also include compound bows and leave the Trads to have their own season. So he was actually including Xguns with Compounds in the same category. I wholeheartedly disagree but really thought it was an interesting perspective. FWIW - I agree with those that believe Xguns should be restricted to age/disability use and not included in the standard archery season. I am not against them entirely as i feel they have their place and use. It can lengthen the hunting time for hunters who are older and or have limited use but i can't agree that Xguns are the same as conventional archery equipment. I just can't. I will go down with the ship on this one.
MN_Bow_, the MDHA is still holding against from mainstreaming it along with baiting. After living 21 yrs in Wi. it has been good to see common sense haven't left the building here in Mn. Went to every Spring CC hearings and there was nothing that was propose or pass to restrict the method of killing deer, except Monroe Co. majority did vote no on the x-bow in 2005 which was surprising. Ruger1022 remember well in 73 when a gent came in the bow shop with a Allan compound and ask people to try it and after doing it I said why, heavy, noisy and went against the normal form, 3 yrs later there were not any recurves hanging on the wall.
Capt, We are talking about fair chase hunting. If the subject of high fence hunting comes up, we'll be sure to call you and get an experts opinion.... Until then, why dont you retreat back to the liquor cabinet and do what you do best....
Ahh retro, no intelligent response but too stupid to keep your mouth shut. At least you are consistent.
Guys were the 1% of the 1%. Embrace change and expect excellence from everyone, even those that choose other methods. Hold each other to high standards, not because you expect it but because the animals we hunt deserve nothing less. Share information readily, be fair, be respectful.... Oh that's the conversation I had with my kids this year sorry...
For me the even money on an unbiased opinion lies with Case, he has studied this far more than we have. If anyone here were to tell me I'm backwards on this (and me listen to it) it would be him. What says you Case?
Capt, Intelligence goes over your head, so I brought it down to your level so you feel like you fit in.... You seem grouchy? Was the enclosure low on targets this year? Tell me you didnt get lost again? :>)
Oh boy here we go again. Better make some popcorn. First off I will admit that 4 years ago I bought a crossbow and hunted with it for one year. I did shoot a doe with it but I ended up hating everything about it. I hated the way it carried. I hated how noisy it was and it just felt like I wasn't bow hunting anymore. Sold it after 1 year and went back to my z7 extreme. To each their own. Anybody wanna want to take bets on the over under on the number of posts for this thread. LOL!
Defender + Anyone Else, don't place an over/under bet,...I don't think this discussion will ever end! Just like the contentious introduction of compounds in the early seventies,...there are still those who debate the issue. Argue with someone on the other side of that or this issue and you may do more harm than good, they may just dig their heels in deeper and no one will ever change their mind. As stated, oftentimes debates such as this are never ending.
I was asked so I'll place my ideas on the chopping block and will make a few comments regarding crossbow use in our WI hunting seasons. Note, what follows is my opinion and is not meant to represent the position of any organization or other person.
First of all, I accept and agree with the desire of deer hunters to hunt with different weapons. As far as I know the legal weapons for deer hunting in WI are: rifle, shotgun, muzzle loader, pistol, crossbow, compound bow, recurve bow, and longbow. I do feel that these weapons require different levels of skill and commitment to be successful on a continual basis (heck, anyone can get lucky their first time out or once, but it requires more than luck for the long haul). As an aside, IMO, the more primitive the weapon used, the more respect I tend to have for the hunter.
So how do crossbows fit into this?
First of all, IMO, a crossbow is not a bow and arrow. IMO, crossbows are not archery tackle and should not be considered such.
I feel crossbows are a legitimate hunting weapon and if a fellows wishes to hunt with one he should be allowed to do so as long as he follows (like everyone should) the applicable game laws. Crossbows are no more nor any less of a legitimate hunting weapon than any of the others mentioned above. I do feel they should be licensed and regulated on their own, plus their harvest data should be recorded and judged independently and not comingled with that from other weapons. Someone wanting to hunt with a crossbow should have to purchase a crossbow specific hunting license and should have to follow normal and crossbow specific hunting regulations (this would include a separate but perhaps coincidental season).
If a crossbow hunter wants to hunt in WI, let him do so but let him do it with his own license, his own regulations, his own season (perhaps coincidental with another), and generate his own separate harvest data. When all this happens, and it has not happened yet, the crossbow hunter will be regulated separately by the DNR and the DNR will be able to adjust the entire crossbow experience to make success rates compatible and comparable with the firearms and archery seasons. If and when this happens I believe much of the disagreement and contentiousness of our present situation will disappear. I hope we all hope for this, if this does not happen, then who knows where we will end up?
FYI, and for the record: I do not and have not ever hunted with a crossbow. Maybe someday when I get old (I'm only 74) I'll have to, but I'm not ready yet.
This is my $.02 worth. Probably disappointed and angered a few folks. All I can say is, we all are different. Probably too provided a few with lots of opposing ammo, reckon I'll have to put on my flak jacket......
Lol id bet better than 100, defender!
Lol this conversation goes on every year in every state that allows crossbow, I had to go to crossbow for this year and maybe next year but I still have my Matthews bow , but until then whatever your using make a ethical shot and enjoy, my ground blind is set up to make sure I don’t have over a 30 yard shot, and even whith my bow I never shot farther than 25 never felt comfortable about it anyway just be thankful to be hunting because last year at December I got shut down because of a serious health issue, so be thankful and enjoy because trust me it only takes one sickness to halt us all, God Bless
Captain makes a lot of sense, always enjoy his posts.
Oooo... squirrel.... Quick chase it Missouri
Chief, read your above post about being respectful.
"it has been good to see common sense haven't left the building here in Mn."
You mean other than opening gun season the first weekend in November, right?
What I noticed so far - A footed wood arrow shaft looks really good . What I recently tasted - I went to my local butcher and orderd a 6 lb ham . I drove there in my new truck and picked up the ham . Than I ate the ham . The ham was very tasty some of the best I ever had . Than I shot my bow in my back yard actually pulled a one string bow back with my fingers and watched the arrow fly . After that I smoked cigar to celebrate a great day . Who cares about the cross bow If I ever need to kill a deer that bad please sign me up for therapy. What does it say if you need to kill a deer ?
At this stage of the game...I guess I'll revert to the ole' "as long as it's legal" way of looking at things.
No amount of bitching, pissing and moaning is going to change anything.
I have a good friend who smoked a nice buck with his crossbow, he's over 60 and tickled pink.
Have another friend who's 70 plus and he hates them....course I cannot remember the last time he's shot a deer with his bow.
To each their own I guess....whatever gets ya in the woods.
Sigh....
But its funny how you stick up for him, when I consistently stick up for you, and he cuts everyone down... Guess your a west of the Mississippi guy too
Why can't we all just get along??? Because x bows were put into the archery season. They are not archery equipment. If you don't agree with that you are wrong. Ha. It's only around 4 months till the CC meetings. Could get a lot of posts by then. Unless they do away with the meetings. (just threw that one in for DT as I haven't offended him in a while)
No I am not. I see a few guys giving him a hard time for doing nothing more than posting a link to a published article. I’d stick up for you also if they did that to you.
Why can't we all get along ?....Well because we have Conservatives and Liberals here on the forum. Liberals are voting for people who are out to limit, eliminate hunting, or simply take the easy way through life. Sounds a little bit like some describe crossbow shooters. Liberals feel entitled to a deer, with minimal hunting and effort.
How can any hunter or trapper vote Liberal? Talk about divisive, Liberals hate the hunters way of life. If you vote democratic, you are against hunting, trapping, logical predator control, and my way of life. We will never get along, different values.
I like the fact crossbows have their own license and basically what is their own season which happens to run concurrent with the archery season - at this time. This forward thinking should allow for changes in the future if deemed necessary.
While the overall kill numbers (all weapons combined) are still mirroring past history, I will not be concerned about xbow hunters. There are plenty of deer for everyone given these stats. I will not judge a person based on their weapon of choice in what amounts to a hobby. Just my choice there. If the numbers start to shift and show impacts on the herd, I will hope the Legislature is in a position to modify the xbow season and will do so accordingly.
The divisiveness of bowhunters in particular is so alarming. Hunters as a whole need to join forces. I don't think this is a left vs right issue. I personally feel lots of people switched sides on the Guv vote this year due to their opinions on the state of changes made to deer hunting over the years. I feel lots of people switched sides on the Guv recall vote in the opposite direction due to their opinions of private versus public retirement and insurance contributions as well as unions. Let's all remember that our righty Guv, who I voted for every time, is the one who signed xbows in via the pressure and monies from the NRA. All politicians suck. Time will tell what Evers does. I have extremely low expectations and think he'll put hunting and the outdoors very low on his list. The usage of xbows and political views are not mutually inclusive at all IMHO.
Enjoy your time in the woods whether it is alone or with family and friends. You never know when it will be your last.
I agree with happy.
The more personal thought I put into this the softer my stance becomes. I’ll still continue to hunt the way I like but I no longer care how the guy next to me hunts as long as it’s legal.
FWIW, I’m an independent but have always voted republican. I will vote republican unless an independent candidate (that I agree with) comes along that actually has a chance of being elected.
https://qz.com/1379045/i-wanted-to-understand-americas-obsession-with-guns-so-i-learned-to-hunt/
Crossbows in the archery season are accepted by guys who never had a real passion for archery in the first place... And thats exactly what we have left making up our ranks. Just a bunch of license buyers who are simply out there to kill another deer the easiest way allowed....
Your bow hunting passion is no more special than a gun hunters passion or bow hunters passion, hell I don’t know about u but when I get in the woods am there to kill, if I want to say am just there to enjoy nature I will go on a nature walk, it takes all kind of hunters to balance it out I’ve been a hardcore bow hunter for many many years but my passion is no more better than the hardcore gun hunters or crossbow hunters , again if it’s not affecting your hunting why whine about it? Get along and be blessed u can hunt just be happy it’s not hard
I beg to differ on that splitoe, I think alot of gun hunters hunt because of tradition, not passion. I think most crossbow hunters, hunt for the kill,(I could be wrong on that), but I dont think I am. As far as "hardcore" hunters go, there is probobly not much difference between the two. The big difference is the "percentage" of people that are very passionate about their choice of hunt. I hunt north, so I really cant judge what goes on farther south of me, but alot of what I see up here in gun season is not a passion. Alot of guys just like to get away and cut loose,(nothing wrong with that), but that is not a hunting passion. I dont know of any bars that have stripers during the rut of bow season, but there are plenty that do during gun season, and again (nothing wrong with that if its your cup of tea). I dont see the parking lots of bars packed at 2pm during bow season, but they are during gun season. I know there are tons more gun hunters than bow hunters, but again Im talking percentages. As far as crossbows go, I have a few people I know that shoot them, or have shot them. They dont care for the hunt but they like their chances of getting meat easier. It was stated on another thread by someone that said"they never see crossbow hunters in the woods". Neither do I, and I believe its because, I dont hunt where most crossbow hunters hunt. I dont hunt food plots, or ag fields from a tower, or over a homemade water hole, (again nothing wrong with that) if thats your cup of tea. Last but not least, I think most bow hunters are very selective about what they shoot. With the exception of the "hardcore" group, and physically challenged group, I dont think there is any comparision between bow, gun and x-gun. As far as getting in the woods to kill, I think most bow hunters have taking what they consider a trophy at the top of the list, with the second spot being, enjoying the outdoors. The difference is that area between first and second is much smaller for bow hunters, and in many cases equally important. Hell, if you want meat for the family you you surely wouldnt bow hunt for it, unless it was a passion. Just my 2 cents worth.
wow, that was a long one....sorry... I guess my passion took over.
I don’t know how the gun hunters up here look at there hunting because to be honest I know very few hunters, but the ones I’ve met over 50 years in different states live and breath there hunting, there not drinking are going to bars, there to tired at the end of the day to drink or go to bars, I wasn’t trying to step on someone feet just expressing that some of the best hunters I know are gun hunters and match anyone in the woods from reading sighn to scouting to navigate through 58 thousand acres of woods and come out the same place they went in, I can do the same thing when I say I live and breath hunting I mean just that and I’ve been like that all my life, from the beginning of dove season till the last day of bow hunting I was some were hunting, ive never been up north I have no idea how they hunt but I believe what u say, and I agree that is not passion and by no means was I speaking of people like that, I only speak of the people I do know I know this was long to lol whew like writing a book , God Bless
I AM passionate about MY way of bowhunting. My way provides me with happy memories and gives the deer I want to kill a fair chance at survival.
I don’t give a shit about someone else’s passion and why should I? If you are super hardcore or just heading out to take a nap in a tree that’s your story and who the hell am I to judge you for how you choose to do something? The beauty of being a hunter in WI is that we all have the choice to make it what we want. You judging someone else only hurts you and makes the person you’re judging more likely to tell you to go pound sand.
I know we wont ever all agree. Being a Republican it was Unfortunate that Walker is a Jackwagon. Yes, you can have him call me. lol He did enough damage. Plus I had issues with him in other areas. He really screwed over the Unions & my retirement. Then he even tried to privatize it so his buddies could screw it up more. I could go on but it would make a whole new argument. I have seen quite a few x bowers In the Southern part of the state. A lot getting their bow cocked at the road before they go in, a few trespassing mostly on camera and then we have the issue of a certain group of people that start driving the public with x bows on opening day of bow. I usually get to see their aftermath. At least they don't trespass as much as they used too since the shooting up North & having some ticketed. But hey, as long as it's legal.
It was said many years ago on here that “there is not a deadlier hunter in the woods than a bow hunter with a rifle in his hands”
It goes to show that no matter the weapon there will be those that take their hunts seariously and those that just want to be one of the boys. Celebrate the hunt!
"hell I don’t know about u but when I get in the woods am there to kill".
Exactly! This is exactly the statement that describes the license buyers we have. Im a passionate bowhunter. I dont care what someone else does until their actions threaten the passion I have. Technology is destroying the sport of "bowhunting". I entered the sport which use to be about using a limited range weapon which in turn allowed for minimal effect on the resource thus giving the enjoyment of having a long season. It never was about "killing" as you mentioned. Of course that went out the window because todays license buyer has to be coddled with technology in order to get them to participate. And of course its all about the number of licenses in the field because the more participants the more money there is for manufacturers to make. Crossbows belong in the gun season along with in-lines. Plain and simple. As it stands now, crossbows are "welfare" during the bow season for guys who dont want to work...
Hell fella I crossbow hunt I have to now but not because am lazy, am covered more grown and crossed more creeks and low water rivers, waded swamps and walked up to 4 Miles to get away from other hunters including bow hunters, trust me unless your wiping your ass with grizzly claws , made your bow and arrows , your hunting just like the rest of us, your buying the latest compound bow and arrows, and most everyone does to, does it mean there lazy? I think not, how many mature 4 or 5 or 6 year old bucks have u killed? How did u kill it? If it was with a bow at 20 yards that is something to brag about, if u shot it with a gun 200 yards away it might have not been as exciting but to that gun hunter or crossbow hunter is was, there free roaming game nobody has there stamp on them or tagged them yet, before someone starts calling someone lazy u better check your facts and be able to back it up, get pissed throw a fit I don’t care I don’t look for approval from nobody, I got enough common sense to mind my own business and let people hunt how they want to hunt, I don’t buy there license or buy there gas, am not there care taker , like my daddy always said if people would mind there own business this world would run a little smoother, come hunting with me come scout with me see how lazy I am lol you better bring a few sandwiches and some water and Gatorade, and am sure there is plenty of hunters on here that are not lazy and scout and hunt hard, get mad at this thread makes me no never mind am a grown ass man and I’ve killed my fare share of mature bucks and I didn’t kill them being lazy, killed with a Mathew Q32 ok rant over let the good times roll!!!
If someone tells me to pound sand because of my opinion that is their problem. I believe all xgunners that arnt disabled or 65+ are lazy and want to kill deer easier. I've never heard them tell me different besides they say "its cool". Lol. If I said " oh that's ok snowflake, do whatever, its legal" I wouldn't be doing my part at attempting to make things better and right. Xguns in the bow season isn't right, period.
"Crossbows in the archery season are accepted by guys who never had a real passion for archery in the first place..." Winner, winner!
"Your bow hunting passion is no more special than a gun hunters passion or bow hunters passion..." That may be but this is a BOW hunting site.
"wow, that was a long one....sorry... I guess my passion took over." And it was spot on!
"I don’t give a shit about someone else’s passion and why should I?" Because others will impose their will on you. Being proactive is not for everyone but being apathetic is putting your future completely in someone else's hands.
I was going to leave this thread alone now but......My oldest son was talking a year ago about getting his (10yr old daughter at the time,almost 12 now), a cross bow because she wants to bow hunt. He called me today and is talking about getting her a bow for x-mas. They were in a store today and he showed her the x-bow and a regular youth bow. He asked her if she ever got to buy one which would it be. She said the regular bow. He asked her why and she said and I quote, " I already have a gun to hunt with, I want a bow like you have dad, you know, to bow hunt with".
Priceless.
yea You right capt it’s a bow hunting sight my ass want be commenting on here no more, the human race has always destroyed anything good and they will again, just keep it up , I hope I kill a passel of big bucks with my crossbow and I know I will, sorry didn’t mean to ruffle u ladies panties
Well, I'm sitting in my gun stand with my ML and read through these. Same old thing I guess. I will stick to my feelings. It's not a bow and arrow, you don't have to physicaly draw, hold and aim while an animal is close. So why was it put into the archery season??? It should be with your gun tag and a shorter season. It will cause an issue when they decide to shorten the season for archery because too many of the old bucks are killed, probably not even recovered with all can use joke.
"yea You right capt it’s a bow hunting sight my ass want be commenting on here no more..." Can only speak for myself but I won't be missing you. Reading your posts takes too much energy as I never learned ebonics.
Good hoss probably need hooked on phonics to read anyway u whinny ass cry baby, people like u hoss is a waist of good oxygen, tell u what though I will invite u over for coffee let’s see if u understand me then, punk ass wouldn’t make a pimple on a hunters ass just a whiner
"I think not, how many mature 4 or 5 or 6 year old bucks have u killed?"
Again another perfect example of the attitude that license buyers have today. Bowhunting was never meant to be a competition about who gets the most 4, 5, or 6 year old bucks.... Thats what its been reduced to now that we have coddled the masses into the sport by allowing technology to take the challenge out of it.
Your not a bowhunter. Your a license buyer that is in a competition to kill more old deer than the next guy, and you applaud any technology in any season that makes it easier for you to gain the lead. Yawn...... Guys like you are a dime a dozen....
Heres hoping the bench rest in your heated condo stand helps you take the lead in killing the most big bucks ever.... by anyone....
Good luck guys, am gone gramma police out, Did mean to offend nobody but oh well I don’t have the temper for this lol am headed back to the bayou soon peace out , hope y’all get it all lined out
LOL! Thanks for proving my point.
Your very welcome captain God Bless u hoss
Retro, son u don’t know me it’s probably best u don’t, don’t be mad because I can’t kill big deer partner just put the extra work into if u know how, which from this site I would bet u don’t,I buy my license just like u do how I plan to hunt or pass on deer is my business not yours or nobody else’s , your just another big mouth that knows nothing, hell u could smoke a cigarette and use the left over paper to write down what u know about hunting I would bet a thousand dollars on that
The OP asked "what will the next generations "bow" look like and perform"?
That bow is already here, It's the "air bow". When it's included in the archery season how many who now accept the xbow are going to crawl in that tent?
Count me out.
You just missed my point completely, I kill my meat early , then I hunt for bigger bucks, all my big bucks came from Missouri not Wisconsin, they was killed with a Matthews Q32, I was lucky to have a place like that, I don’t care what people kill, how they kill it, again none of my business, was just pointing out that even if it’s killed with a bow, a gun , or crossbow, it’s exciting, especially if it’s a mature buck,I didn’t say u had to kill a big buck to get excited, I said if u out smart a mature buck it’s a little more exciting that’s all I was saying, calm down I was not trying to start a argument, I know everyone has there own beliefs and opinions, I was not saying mine was the only one right I was just stating my opinion good grief lol
My stance has absolutely nothing to do with apathy. My stance is directly attributed to my belief that I don’t have any right to tell someone else how they should do things. My stance is directly attributed to the fact that it’s not my job to judge whether someone is lazy or not passionate enough. I simply choose the path of live and let live. It costs me more to be a judge mental asshole than it does to simply accept that my neighbor wants to do it differently than me. I don’t need to know if he’s doing it because it’s easier or he’s lazy or too weak to pull a bow back or has already killed enough deer with a real bow that he now wants a change. Frankly, it’s none of my business why my neighbor wants to use an xgun. His choice. Get off your high horse. It’s here now so get over it or continue to stew about it. Either way, I dgaf. I’ll continue to happily hunt how I like to hunt.
Very well put crusader dad I agree 100 percent
Crusader I mean no disrespect to you although it may not matter to you.
One of the worst statements I repeatedly hear is " I don't care what someone does"
Everything everyone does has an impact on everyone some way, some how and not only in the hunting world. Everything.... speeding, stealing, hunting, fishing, raking leaves, eating, everything!
The word JUDGE is todays buzz word. "its not up to me to judge how my neighbor hunts" You are correct but it is okay to share your feelings or position in a professional respectful way given the chance.(if you don't like something) Whether it does anything to change something, who knows but it may.
PS- your use of cuss words in your threads and open use of weed on threads offends me. but who am I to judge... lol
pss - crossbows don't belong in archery
My wifes New Jeep Renegade is delivered to the house a few months ago . She starts chewing me out , she says , " Theres no CD PLAYER in the Jeep " . The salesmen explains that they no longer have CD players & starts telling us about the other options we have for music now .
He laughs & says " wait til you see where the movie industry is going in the next 3 years " .
Its all changing . Last Tues at Walmart we counted 26 people with a white piece of paper & a pencil picking food to be picked up Or delivered . It all changing & thats includes BOWHUNTING. .
As I said in my 1st post , What will be the next weapon in the archery season ?
I get the fact that you guys arent passionate about bowhunting. Doesnt suprise me one bit.... You guys are in the majority for sure. No doubt. If being on ones "high horse" is sticking up for and believing in something, than so be it.... You guys are in luck. Technology will continue its march, and soon it will all blend into one season because there will no longer be any noticeable difference between the efficiency of weapons. Again if you were never passionate in the first place, you will not have a problem when this happens. Im glad I got to hunt for many years before the circus came to town. I feel sorry for any younger guys who actually have a passion for archery. Make sure you invest in a bunch of blaze orange, your going to need it for opening day....
Pasq, you’re not going to offend me. You’re perfectly entitled to your opinion and I can accept and respect that it’s different from mine.
The way I type is the same way I talk in real life. If my use of words offends you then that is your issue. I choose my words carefully so when I use a word you consider offensive just remember I chose to use that word on purpose.
If my open use of marijuana bothers you then again, that’s your issue. It has allowed me to continue working in a field that destroys my back, neck and shoulders. The small amount of relief I feel from taking a few puffs of a natural plant means that I don’t have to resort to prescription narcotics.
Here’s my real stance. If it were up for a vote, I’d vote for over 65 or disabled.
The reality is that it’s already here so I can either accept it or allow it to negatively affect my serenity. I choose to accept it. I no longer allow things that are out of my control to bother me. When I say that I don’t care what my neighbor does it means that I’m not his daddy and it’s not my place to tell him what he should or shouldn’t do. When I say that it’s not my place to judge my neighbor it means that I accept that we are all individuals with differing viewpoints on different issues. The lifestyle that I’ve adopted over the past year allows me the ability to forgive quickly, to accept that we are different and still have a genuine desire to be of service if possible. It’s brought me serenity and allowed me to become less selfish. Being less selfish helps me realize that I’m not in charge and all I can do is deal with the cards I’m dealt. I’ve been able to pretty much eliminate anger and deal quickly with frustration. I am able to fully accept you for you and even if we are on complete opposite sides of the fence I will still genuinely root for your personal well being. That’s how I’ve chosen to look at an xgunner. We hunt differently but I can now genuinely root for them to feel the same excitement I feel when I encounter a deer.
I am passionate about my way of bowhunting. Nobody here would want me to tell them that they can’t use a tree stand just because I like to hunt from the ground.
CD, have you ever given any thought as to why it (crossbow) is here now? It is here now because too many vertical hunters were apathetic (or lazy) about their season. They gave it no thought, no consideration, regards a more efficient weapon in a more primitive season. It may not have affected you yet but if and when it does, you can confidently look in the mirror and tell yourself that you are to blame. Do you know the definition of apathy? It is; having a lack of interest, enthusiasm or concern. Every facet of your life is guided by rules and laws that others have made. If you are completely happy living under the rules of others, that makes you a sheep or apathetic. Use whatever clichés or sayings you like, such as "live and let live" but the reality is that is your feel-good definition of apathy.
"If my use of words offends you then that is your issue."
So you could care less what anyone else thinks or feels? If the majority would say "please stop using profanity" you would say tough sh** I don't care ? Or would you try to curtail it?
I guess back on topic... what was topic?
Anyway, Im not sure how old you are Crusader but purity of weed? Seriously? Todays crap isn't pure at all and is genetically altered crap. I smoked and sold tractor trailer loads full in the 70's. That was pure and I'm dead against its legality including medical use. People fake health issues including my son.
Sorry to hijack thread, good "hunting" to all.
PS - I know you and Blood broke bread together on a few threads awhile ago. Are you guys still buds??? Even with weed consumption?
PSSS - Crossbow shouldn't be in archery season.
Since the x-bow has it own season that runs concurrent with the regular bow season and with the buck kill up from it should be logical for WBH,WTA, Conservation Congress to appeal to the DNR, St. Reps to reduce the season or move the season to muzzleloader slot or late season. The hard fought archery season in the past should not be reduce to a generic season, bow season here in Mn is over the first week of Nov and then the gun takes over and that can happen without strong push back from the majority of bowhunters. When I first join WBH in 85 I think it had about 17000 members and now it is about 1/3, the voice has grown silent, remember the ban x-bow buttons.
Cap, read what I wrote. It’s here now. I simply choose to accept it. That doesn’t mean I lack interest or enthusiasm. The powers that be didn’t put it up for a public vote that I know of and if they did, I never heard about it. Had I known about a public vote on the issue at the time, I would have made the time to vote against it. If you and others hate it so much why have I not seen one Bowsite post trying to “gather the troops” and actually do something about it. What are you personally doing to change it? My guess is nothing because you and I both know if you posted it on here you would have a lot of support. So who’s apathetic, me, who simply decided that those who choose to hunt differently from me deserve that right or you who comes on here to complain but does nothing? If this same subject comes up for a public vote in the future, I will make the time to vote for what I feel is right. I’m not a politician or a lawmaker so I have no choice but to accept what laws are passed or rules enacted. My only option is to vote when I have the opportunity and I do vote when that opportunity presents itself.
JJS - I can't help but think its because people have the same thinking or thought process as Crusader displays- "doesn't affect me"
I wish more wold try traditional hunting. It is contagious. Of course unless you have a need to kill.
Everyone is OK with cross bows on crop damage hunts year round, right?
Pasq, the crap from the 70s was garbage. I wouldn’t touch that seed filled ditch weed if you gave me a truckload for free. I know where mine comes from and it’s 100% organic. You scrape cedar houses and roll 20ft ceilings along with hanging drywall every day for 20 years and tell me you still have cartilage in your shoulders. You do my job for 20 years and tell me you don’t have neck and back issues. You come and do what I do for one day and try to tell me you’re not sore all over. I do it everyday all year long. I workout daily, I eat healthy and I choose to use a plant rather than a narcotic to manage the kind of pain that would make most give up. Again, if you have an issue with that, your problem.
As far as bloodtrail and I being cool with one another, ask him. My guess would be that as long as I’m not smoking it in front of him, it’s not his problem. I don’t agree with BT on a few issues but that doesn’t diminish my respect for him. I would think he feels the same about me but only he can answer that.
In regards to the words I use, again, I think before I type or talk. I would use the same words if we were having this conversation in person. I choose not to get offended or be bothered by things other people say. If you don’t have that same mental serenity, in the words my wife would use, “tough poop”.
jjs, with all due respect, in 1985 the WBH had 9,527 members. In 1988 the WBH had 11,393 members, the highest ever. In 2017 the WBH membership was slightly below 5,000.
Anything classified as archery equipment by the DNR doesn't bother me, I've said this before I hunt with vert and crossbow... I come here seeking the knowledge of gentlemen who know how to pursue whitetail deer effectively... I could be using laser eyeballs to kill them.... Its the "ART" I'm seeking not the mechanical know how.... I do shoot a cross bow but its not about the weapon .... Just out smarting the deer I pursue... Inside 20 yards and I feel like I've won, shooting or not just getting close to this animal is important. Ill leave me comments off from now on because most of the advice that has gotten me there in the last 2 years has come from you gentlemen. Thank you.
Thats called the Hooray for me the hell with you syndrome. Don't confuse that with the " its not my issue" you spoke of. But that could be the genitacaly altered "organic" weed you toke making confusion. I spent lots of time in Denver when they made it legal. Lots of organics there too.
You chose your profession or was it forced on you?
I ran scrapers for operating engineers for 9 years before I realized my back was getting trashed and changed my profession. Now I work 12 hours a day in warehousing.
Now Pasq lighten up . Or should I say " lite Up " . HEH HEH . I smoked a Bale or 2 in the 70's & 80's . Better than booze anytime . For the record , NEVER while hunting .
CD, I've done more than my fair share regarding the crossbow issue. I have large files of notes, documents and rough draft bills that I played a hand in writing. No, I did not do it all by myself, nor was I the lead person on the issue. But, make no mistake, I've done far more than my fair share on more than just the crossbow issue.
Now I am going to ask you to think a bit deeper. You say you are willing to vote if an issue comes up for a vote. Do you have any idea the work that goes into getting an issue brought up for a vote or keeping an issue from being voted on? Do you think it is only legislators (politicians) who play a hand in that?
Pasq, it’s called the live and let live lifestyle. How you choose to live your life is your choice. I choose not to allow your lifestyle choices to bother me. If my lifestyle choices bother you, well too bad. The fact of the matter is I’m honest, loyal,caring and dependable. Me smoking pot doesn’t diminish my character or integrity and that’s what’s actually important. You see, it doesn’t matter that we have different opinions, I’d still do anything in my power to help you (and anyone else on this site) if you needed it. Would you do the same for me? Are you living an altruistic lifestyle or one that allows you to go to bed feeling good about judging someone else? I’m not even close to perfect but I try my hardest to just be nice and do the next right thing while owning my mistakes.
As far as my career, I was a teenage father who chose the only job I could get that paid higher than minimum wage. I worked my ass off and was great at my job. The money followed so I stayed until I started my own business doing the same thing. It’s taken it’s toll on my body but has allowed me provide a comfortable life for my wife and kids. I’m now in college and will graduate when I turn 40 with a degree in civil engineering/water sciences.
Hahaha! Unfortunately I did while hunting a time or two Ruger! Not so much whitetail hunting but in the mountains with the blue tick and walkers chasing coon... was a different story.
very impressive thread, especially for only a day and a half on here. I don't like 'em either but from Rugers opening post it makes sense what the more "experienced" bowsiters here went thru w/ the first wheelies. And Pasquinell, I really like the fire
Wausa I am not a jerk, just a guy who is nervous about our future. I live bow hunting in its purest form. True bowhunting in its purest form. This is after embracing technology and suddenly not liking where it was heading after years of embracing it.
" From: Pasquinell 01-Dec-18
Wausa I am not a jerk, just a guy who is nervous about our future. I live bow hunting in its purest form. True bowhunting in its purest form. This is after embracing technology and suddenly not liking where it was heading after years of embracing it. "
So you are stick bow only?
YEP... are you setting me up for a rebuttal??? I started with a Bear Whitetail hunter in the 70's (while stoned Cusader dad lol) and then a PSE and then a Mathews Switchback for years before I realized it was kinda getting easier to kill em. I even have pics of me with a 21 pointer I wish I had let walk. Think about the threads on here... heater vests and jackets... cameras... atv's.. golden nugget usage... all advantage the hunter, wouldn't you agree???
Lets stop the fight, I'm guilty of it just like everyone else, but fighting each other over who loves deer more is silly, we all do and you will never convince anyone one here that you love them more. Lets agree to disagree, share good info and grow the next generation regardless of what they shoot
Ruger was just kidding guys....this really isn`t "the last crossbow thread"....you didn`t have to get it ALL off your chests.....you could of saved some for later....lol
It is nice to see that everyone is at least TRYING to get along. Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year everyone.
no xbow use in late season in the UP................
no xbow use in late season in the UP
Definitely forward thinking by the MDNR. If I'm not mistaken, they are not even allowed in the smoke pole season in the UP. For those curious, the reason stated by the MDNR is because they are superior weapons that can be utilized more easily on deer yards.
You xgunners are right, it's your choice and it's legal. I have friends and family who have switched to xguns. Heck my own brother uses one now. I dont belittle them but I do give my opinion. I realize the majority will always want something to be easier. It's all politics and about the $$. Problem is the same lazy hunters are going to accept the next "cool" weapon. Landowners need to be strict and keep these weapons from being used on their land.
Do you use a compound bow because it is easier or legal ?
I still shoot my old Martin compound. 70lbs and not much let off. It’s cool watching my arrows arc when I get to 50,60 yds and my bros are still pretty flat. It makes me feel good using that old bow. It does have a nice 3way capture rest and 4 pin true glow sight along with a loop for my release so I’m not totally old school compound. I personally am drawn to the older things. I was dead set on using my self made yumi for hunting this year but I can’t hit anything with it and don’t have enough time to practice so I can’t possibly justify hunting with it. I asked for a recurve for Christmas so we’ll see what Santa comes up with.
With that being said, who am I to judge those that are naturally drawn to the technology? That’s what they like. They can’t help it any more than me liking the old stuff. Is their way easier? Sure but why should that bother me? Why should I look down my nose at another hunter for doing things their way? I’m not God and neither are any of you. I haven’t met an xgunner yet who snubs their nose a t trad guy so what right does the trad guy have to do that to the xgunner? In reality it just proves that the trad guy is an elitist snob and that is a far bigger detriment to our sport than any xgunner just going out there doing it the way they like. FWIW, I was also that elitist snob not too long ago, I am truly greatful that I no longer feel that way.
"In reality it just proves that the trad guy is an elitist snob and that is a far bigger detriment to our sport than any xgunner just going out there doing it the way they like.
Man you have one warped sense of reality. Trad hunters arent going to be the cause for your bowhunting season to be shortened. Trad hunters arent going to be the cause of your bag limits reduced. Whos the threat to everyones season again????? Good grief. Of course we already covered the fact that your not a passionate bowhunter, so you could care less about the effect crossguns will have on our bow seasons....
Heck theres bigger problems than the Crossbow in the future .
Talked to a gunny a few months ago . He is designing an arrow with powder & primer that will fit into single shot shotguns . He's also tinkering with compressed air in stead of gun powder . like I said " whats the next archery weapon gonna be .
Retro, the season is separated just for that reason. They will shorten xgun before changing anything else. Good grief! Stop being so paranoid.
Exactly Shane!!!
Retro, why aren’t you all over the guys here that want to go to one buck? Your complaining about reduced bag limits. Where was your voice when some voices to give up the either or tag for bow and just went to a buck tag?
Why do you think the subject of going to 1 buck a year is brought up in the first place? The thought process behind it wouldnt have anything to do with the pressure technology is putting on the resource would it?
Nope, we’re not shooting more overall. There are no record kills and the overall kill has been relatively flat the last ten years.
Right now when we buy our bow license we are issued a buck tag only. In my case being in the northern zone if I’m not lucky enough to BUY a doe tag before they are sold out it forces me to shoot a buck if I want meat. How many others are in the same boat as I in being forced to shoot bucks??
If the bow license was either or a lot of guys would shoot a doe and move on to hunting other game. Odd as it may seem. Not everyone hunts for horns.
So you want bow tags to be either or again in the north because having them buck only is putting to much pressure on bucks?
Anyone know what the success rate for bucks with a crossbow was as compared to vertical archers?
How accurate are the kill #'s . Really ? Some of The Billy Bob's in my county think its great that they can bring a deer home with out Tags or Reg's & cut it up .
Cool, This thread got pretty far. I sure wish those two ding dong out of staters from the last time were here to help us do things their way. I just cant understand why we even vote on things. If it is legal leave it alone if it's not legal, smoke it. We need no right or left, no dems or republicans. Just sit back & take it in the shorts. Not my way of thinking. If it is broke....FIX IT. If you can't fix it at least stand up & be counted. Capt. when we are privileged to get that info it will most likely be tainted like last time.They could again count all the patrons as x bow hunters to wash down their true success percentage. Maybe wait till a couple days before the CC hearings. AGAIN. It is unfortunate that sometimes the fight gets ugly. I really hate to see friends become enimies but it is very easy to see the mentality of the x bowers & the watchers. It is an up hill battle but the real hunters will win. Evil & greed never win. Even the devil will lay down his x bow. (or was that his fidel)
Talking about success rate. I wonder how much the success rate went up when compound bows entered the bow season. All those newbies entering the woods and shooting our deer. Sounds pretty similar does it not. That everyone turns a blind eye to. I am willing to bet the success rate jumped more than when crossbows entered in it.
WI data only...………….
In 1965 there were 63,964 licensed bowhunters in WI and they killed 4,995 deer yielding a success % of 7.8.
The compound bow began being used in the late 1960s and early 1970s.
In 1970 there were 101,573 licensed bowhunters in WI and they killed 6,520 deer yielding a success % of 6.4.
In 1975 there were 133,775 licensed bowhunters in WI and they killed 13,588deer yielding a success % of 10.1.
In 1980 there were 155,386 licensed bowhunters in WI and they killed 20,954 deer yielding a success % of 13.4.
As is evident the bowhunter success rate more than doubled from 1970 to 1980. This was due, in part, to the introduction and increased use of the compound bow. The introduction and adoption of the tree stand and mechanical release during this same time period also served to increase the bowhunter success rate.
So far this is nothing more than preaching to the choir or just venting. I haven`t heard a single cogent argument that is going to convince a politician....who just wants $$$$ and dead deer....to change anything or even listen.
No sense in beating each other up about it....you have your work cut out for you to get these rules changed. Screaming at each other won`t help.
Jake I think u might have just dropped the mike on it all, I agree
Look guys, we all enjoy hunting. What we hunt with is ones personal choice. It was a huge change when compounds came out and now there is another huge change. It really is as simple as that unless you drop greed into the mix. We as hunters have to stick together
Jake did nothing but drop his same old unfounded talking point from past discussions. The current issue has nothing to do with compound bows. Jake does not focus well. His question could be answered (in part Case did so) but because it has no bearing on the crossbow issue, I will not waste any energy doing so. But Jake, tell us why a Michigan crossbow hunter like yourself is interested in what happens in WI?
Franklin, you partially answered your own point. Legislators care about two things. Money and votes. They care nothing about dead deer, that comes from middle management, lifetime employee DNR people.
I agree all hunters have to stick together been saying this for many years, be happy and count your blessings, we all love to hunt and put meat in our freezers or a big buck on our wall, be happy for everyone, I know am blessed I came very close to losing my life last December and it made me see things a lot different, I use to get upset over crossbow hunters and look at me now I have to hunt with one just so I can hunt, I had to eat crow, am new to this site and I live in Wisconsin now am not from here so am still trying to learn the people and there ways, because we’re i come from in the Deep South the cultures are different, but were all human no need to fuss or get mad I got mad the other day like a fool and that wasn’t right , I apologize for that I hope and pray everyone gets along and enjoy the hunting and have a Blessed year!!!
You guys want to know why so called 'bow hunting' is dying- its threads like these.
You guys want to know why so called 'bow hunting' is dying- its threads like these.
Sorry Capt, born and raised in Wi. in Manitowoc co. Eaton Township. And that fellow hunters is a divider fed by greed, oh and booze. LOL Yes, I mean Capt.
Comprehension Jakey. I did not ask where you were born. Booze? Sure, send me a good bottle for X-Mas.
One thing we all have to understand is our outdoor government agencies are being taken over by College educated youth. The Wardens that used to be your old hunting buddy or Forest Service guy is slowly going away. These "newcomers" do not think along the same lines as you and I.
You are now going up against Insurance lobbyist....Farm and Crop lobbyist and even Homeowner Associations in suburban areas. We have by our OWN reporting, declining hunter numbers....so what do you think the powers to be will do....issue fewer hunters more tags? That has NEVER worked. IMO nobody has a compelling argument to change their minds about this issue.
It`s not OUR minds you have to change it`s THEIRS. Good luck with that if this is an example of your message.
In due time, it seems like all bowhunting threads become personal attacks versus people just giving their $0.02 and accepting others have differing opinions. I've been in that group many times. What a divided group of people hunters are. I think the Legislature, Guv, and antis would get a real chuckle over most things here.
if you have Capt as your spokesperson you will always have conflict. You might say that it is job security for him. Well, and it strokes his ego. At times like this we need unity. Hoping that sounder minds prevail. As for hunting we have late season coming up as soon as the deer settle down from all the bang bang. Good luck to all.
Jake, you seem to be avoiding the question. Why do you, a MI resident, care so much about a WI season? Some here may have forgot you joined and became vocal on this forum directly related to the crossbow issue. No shame in that, just admit your motives so your opinion can be taken in context. I have never hidden from my motive which is to keep and maintain the archery season as it currently is. Greed? You bet, time for you to admit yours. Congrats Bowsiters, it seems we might have enough on this forum to go caroling this Christmas. Lots singing Kum By Ya.
I have no idea why you think that I am a Michigan resident. Like I said I was born and raised in wi. and lived there all my life. Go to Excalibur crossbow site or Archertalk.com and check my profile. Other than that I owe you no further information on me. Your as usual blowing smoke. Where do you reside Capt. My guess is in a bottle but if that is what vertical hunters want as their spokesperson well it says a lot.
Forgot to mention, my handle on the other sites mentioned above is Agingcrossbower
Bowhunting is dying because people are quitting hunting with bows and arrows, period. Strange some cannot comprehend the bow and arrow concept.
Missouri, if your talking stick and string I wholeheartedly agree. If you are lumping compounds into the mix then that is just wrong. Crossbows are to compounds what compounds were to stick and string. Some just cannot comprehend that concept. Look at Casekiska's numbers and how the hunters numbers went way up when the compound came to be. That happened because the compound was much easier to master. It is called evolution of the sport. Not realizing that is just hypocritical when condemning crossbows. They to are the evolution of the sport. It is greed that we are talking about. If your want pure sport go back to stick and string. That is YOUR choice.
The comparison of X-guns to compounds isn't even close. They are two totally different things as far as shooting them. Why do people try to make them out the same? Yes, Compounds are easy to master and are a very accurate weapon to use if you learn to shoot it properly. But, you still have to physically draw and aim while the animal is close. STOP comparing the two!!! There is no comparison, two different weapons totally!!! And I am a Recurve hunter.
Anybody else just tired of the way CaptMike has to lash out at anyone that doesn't agree with his way of thinking? "Jakey" seriously Capt? Reminds me of the playground bully. What a sad existence we would all live if everyone followed his way of life. Yes I say life because i guarantee this guy thinks he knows the most in every topic of life. Just one of those guys that has to argue. Just look at almost all of his posts. Typically trying to humiliate the hunters post just before his. I think we all enjoy a good debate on this site,,,hell, that's part of the deal. It's the few that can't handle someone else's thought process and feels the need to tell them how nuts they are that takes me back to a good Field & Stream when I look for an outdoor read.
Live2hunt the comparison of a stick bow and a compound bow is well not comparable at all. Look at them side by side. Look at what the risers are made of and the rest that are used. Look at all the cable and wheels on it. Check out the stabilizers and the noise dampening devices. YES, they are drawn and held but that is what the similarities end. When you drawn a compound it is hard at first and then the huge let-off. When it is held their is very little to hold. They both drawn and hold but only in words. The reason that I keep bring this up is because it is the same old argument stick bow going to compound as compound going to crossbow. Nobody like change but many here are just being hypocritical when crying change. This has all been done before.
Well Pete Shepley now from PSE has second thoughts on their full inclusion,,, see that on the main forum
Don't blame Pete. He has made a lot of money off of compounds. Could just be seeing more profit on them. He has every right to his opinion.
Pete was one of the early people pushing for inclusion of crossbows and was one of the early crossbow manufacturers. He saw that hunting was going to continue to decline and thought that crossbows would help bring new hunters into the sport. He now realizes that wasn't true and that it has done the opposite.
Kat, we are still looking for a falsetto for Kum By Ya.
Capt were u live at? I would like to sit down man to man and let’s talk and compare your thoughts and mine, compare our deer kills, tracking just whatever topic u want to talk about am willing and able to travel, I’ve got to see the guy that knows everything in his own way of thinking but knows so little, we call that big on mouth and short on ear, quit trying to belittle people hoss act like a adult, if u can’t act like a adult just read the comments and sip on some cocoa and go get a hug I bet it makes u feel better, and u can take that dried up knowledge of yours and drop it off at Disney Land were fairy tales are made real!!!!
Jake, my issue with it all is that they included it full on like it is archery gear. It's not and could/will impact what bowhunters fought for and got for seasons, tags, etc. They should have included it on your gun tag. It ticks me off because I buy a CP licence and I have to have a dumb X-gun licence associated with me and I for one do not want any association with them.
skook, I use to follow Pete's PSE vertical bows way back. To pricey for me. I also was in his house in Vegas once. He had a room full of trophies from all over the world. Back then he also owned a painting business. I know nothing of his crossbow line but PSE never comes up on Crossbow forums. Is it under another name?
Split, I have no desire to try and talk with a person who cannot perform basic spelling. It does not give me any hope that talking in person would be any easier. Tell you what, "Hoss." If you have the mentality that you need to compare deer kills, you are far too simple for me. I do not need to brag about my kills or my hunts, although I am pretty certain they far exceed yours. As for the rest of your post, the simplicity is evident.
Pete has lived in Tucson since he moved PSE there from IL in the late 70's (maybe early 80's) PSE and Proline were the first really common crossbows that were any good starting in the 80's. Barnett was around too but they were nowhere near the quality/performance. They came out with a crossbow that would mount on a lower for an AR 15 that was expensive but incredibly accurate. We could hit a can at 100 yards even back then.
PSE has pretty much always had value oriented bows. Until the Machine 6 era in the 90's anyways. Even then, you couldn't find more bow for the money than PSE offered. There's never been a better value than the forged riser fire flite express with synergy wheels.
where is RC when you need him?
Capt ok then son keep your smart ass comments to yourself , u cant run that mouth in person mr gramma police than keep it shut because unlike u I can back my mouth up and willing to do it, had enough of your smart mouth because people don’t agree with u, you are right as well u are not on my level nor will u ever hoss fly , now go cry because someone spelled something wrong or u can’t understand common sense punk!!!!
skook, he did have a house in Vegas but maybe it was just one of his houses. Real nice guy that sure could tell a story. I did not start in crossbows until 2005 when I went on disability so I have very little knowledge of the crossbow before that. Interest stuff. Thanks for sharing.
Split, you threatening me? You don't like what I type, don't read it. But, you can "back it up" yet you need to use a crossbow? LOL at the hypocrisy of all crossbow users.
Splittoe, don't waste your time with Capt, Anyone that has to brag and cut down people constantly really has nothing going for him of any substance. Odd that compound shooters have him for a representative. No class at all.
Yea your right Jake u know it’s people like Capt that should keep there mouth shut and be thought of as a fool , than to open it and leave no doubt, your right Jake I will leave him alone
God I certainly hope "Capt Mike" isn`t our representative....for anything.
Franklin, I have never claimed to be anyone's representative other than my own. If you are proactive and take the time, you are your own representative. If you are not and do not, I just might be! :)
Lots of closet crossbow users, they are slowly being dredged up.
I don’t agree with Capt. on a lot but he’s is correct with his last post.
I agree with Capt most of the time, including his last post.
"From: CaptMike 03-Dec-18Private Reply" "Franklin, I have never claimed to be anyone's representative other than my own."
Does that include representing organizations that were/are opposed to crossbow inclusion in Wisconsin?
Old, you are conflating "were" and "are." Three years ago I did represent SCI on the crossbow issue. I also represented my own perspective at that time. Since then, I have attended no meetings nor made any votes other than on my own behalf.
Nice post Gene . Hunter numbers continue to go down Nationwide & worldwide . 15 years from now we'll need every hunter left to stand along side each other . OR ELSE .
Pasq. Never hunted & " smoked " at the same time . But I have lit up & Fly fished. have a 9 inch Brookie on in fast mtn water & it feels like Mobey Dick .
Whewwww…..thank God....for a moment there I was getting worried. I was thinking how the hell did crossbow hunting go from 0 - 60 in a flash without some people caving to certain pressures.
Usually these new "ideas" get slowly introduced....not crossbow hunting.
Why do people continue bringing up the crossbow topic? Do you enjoy banging your head against the wall repeatedly? Go look at any other crossbow posts and they essentially say the same thing. Some one needs to change the record because this one keeps skipping and then repeating. Another crossbow thread expecting different results. SMDH!
Some people like them, some people don't! I think we've established this eleventy nine million times already. For those of you who listen to or read Tom Haudricourt I borrowed this from him.
EXACTLY....."brew". The dead horse is not getting up. I just come for the laughs.
Some just come for the laughs......That is exactly the point. Some are very concerned about what could happen to the archery, season. Others got the easy ticket and could care less. I keep hearing "I am disabled" well if that is the case this has nothing to do with you. Disabled and over 65 were always able to use an x-gun. Why is it only x-gunners that are having their feeling hurt. Entitlement?.. I dont know. Dry your tears and get over it. It will never change until the season is reduced or moved to an appropriate season. You can come up with what ever excuses and comparrisions you want, its still a superior weapon for the season.
A compound bow is a superior weapon compared to a stick and string yet they share the same season. I am disabled and you make a point of calling a crossbow an Xgun. That is insulting to me and I am sure others who carry a crossbow. To me the newbie on the block is the compound bow whereas the stick bows and crossbows have been going on for thousands of years. I think that compound shooters have a sense of entitlement and enjoyed in their short time on the scene a great deal of success compared to stick shooters. Look how the ranks shot up. That did not happen because they are harder to shoot than the stickbow. Spoiled yes, hypocritical much.
xtroutx- is crossbow really that big of a problem to you? There not gonna change nothing because as much as u would like to think in your own mind that it belongs in a different time frame, why? If there that much of a threat to you go buy one, I get tired of people going round beating on there chest wiping there butts with bear claws saying look at me look at me am shooting a bow boo hoo he is shooting a crossbow he is not playing fair, grow the hell up and quit whining, walk around like you own the deer and how u would change this or that. Well I got news for you there Hollywood you ain’t that important yet, so keep on hunting or keep on whining, and I don’t mean to offend no one, but if I did offend you then u could dang well bet I meant it
Like I said Jake.... make all the excuses you want. Its still a far too superior weapon for bow season. By the way Jake... I am disabled too, have been since 2004, and like I said if you are disabled these comments are not for you. Anyone 65 or disabled has always had the right to use one if they choose. I have no problem with that. I choose not to and that is my choice.
Splittoes,Your talk about getting along with others is a joke. Your posts are rude and rediculous. You post on here, like your, Gods gift to hunters. Seems anytime someone has a different opinion than yours, you try to belittle them. I said nothing to any offense to a paticular person in any of my posts. I am about as far from "Hollywood" as one could possibly be. I am just a normal person who believes he has the right to speak what he thinks and believes. You are a nobody to me and you sure wont keep me silent. I have alot of respect for alot of people on this forum, but unfortunatly you are not one of them Until someone proves to me it is not a supeior weapon to the compound my opinion will stay the same.. If you are offended by this, you can dang well bet I also meant it.
xtroutx, just because I am disabled and there are many different disabilities I might add mine being no choice but crossbow, does not disqualify me from having an opinion. My opinion is that a crossbow and not a xgun. It would be like calling a compound a stick bow. Just go on being divisive. That will surely help all the bowhunters, right? Comparing a stick bow to a compound is like comparing a sickle to a combine.
Buddy am not looking for your respect u have me confused with someone that cares, and no you want to talk your crap but when someone else’s speaks up there rude, am no hypocrite I call it like I see it, you don’t like me that’s your business but I can stand on my two feet and say I’ve never hurt or did anyone wrong, but I do defend myself am nothing but a crumb on a table am no body , nor am I trying to be, I just can’t understand why people have to keep whining over something that makes no difference , am not rude I just speak my mind,
Jake,See there we go again..... this thread had nothing to do with comparing a stick bow to a compound. It has to do with putting x-gun in bow season. The compound issue was hashed out years ago, some like it, some dont. X-gun is todays issue. And for the 3rd or 4th time, i will repeat myself..... If disabled you have always had the right to use an x-gun and I still don't have a problem with that. I have a problem with "todays" superior weapon is a bow season. I am sure Ruger is right and the airbow or something else will be next.If I call it a mechanical devise, plased on a gun stock, to shot bolts, would you still be offeended?
Like he said " they are not going to change nothing ". Oh well, I understand, even with the pitiful sentence.
Again, this is a crossbow thread not a xgun thread. I was comparing stick bow and compound because the compound is a superior piece of equipment. When you cry about crossbows being superior the point was to show you that your being a hypocrite. Obviously you can see that and it is a sore spot. As for me I like the sickle combine comparison. (Grin)
Missouribreak there you go pouring kerosene on a fire, am so sorry commen sense missed you, y’all want to try to run over people and get pissed when they speak there mind, your partner there little Rosie xtroutx wants to pop that mouth about saying I act like am the best deer hunter , why hell I might be I don’t know lol I get along with everyone am a good ole boy and I don’t have a problem with people and there opinions but when u start knocking other hunters and how they hunt I have a problem with that, before I got disabled I worked my butt off each year managing deer herds , 12 to 14 hours some day, your not going to call me lazy because I shoot a crossbow, I don’t care if I kill another deer but I do care for others and my opinion probably means nothing to anyone but I have a right as well as you do to speak it
Jake - You might have to explain to some on here what a sickle is.
CaptMike." Three years ago I did represent SCI on the crossbow issue."
So, are you saying that SCI was opposed to crossbow inclusion in Wisconsin? How exactly did you represent SCI on the crossbow issues?
Splittoe, you absolutly have the right to voice your opinion as do I. I have yet to call anyone lazy nor have I knocked how they hunt. Go back and read all my posts. I have been respectful in my opinion. I dont need to belittle others to make my point. Again, its my point and my beliefs, doesnt make it right or wrong. I am sorry you disagree with it so strongly, that you have to resort to name calliing to post a response. So much for respectful debate in this world we now live in. Your true nature is shinning through.
Jake, its not a sore spot, Its an issue that was settled long ago. I have shot both recurve and compound, Recurve, some 40 yrs ago. there is no comparision between the difference of a recurve and compound, and the difference of a compound and cocked,mechanical, scoped device mounted on a gun stock. See I didnt use the term X-gun. I am aware now of your feelings :).
Jake- I know what u meant about the sickle combine lol
Jake you make money by the crossbow business too don't you?
Pas; Are you trying to connect Pete Scheple's business to the stocks I make? Wow, that is a reach. LOL Yes, I have made roughly 30 stocks over 8 or 10 years. Have not made one in 3Years. LOL Big business , that is why I talk for them. Seriously Pas, I find it interesting that compound shooters think that they are getting screwed over by having crossbows in THEIR season when they totally ran over the stick bow shooters. Jeeze Pas, step out of the haze and take a good look around.
I’m not disabled and I throughly enjoyed shooting my buck this year with a crossbow after bowhunting for 27yrs. Lots of bowhunters should be crossbow hunters, there are a lot of times hear from neighbors and people I meet that tell me they started practicing a few days before they hit the woods and then wonder why they wound deer. I got to a point with having small kids and not having time to prepare and be ready for the season where it was either time to hang it up, go into the woods under prepared, or go with a crossbow. I felt that I owed it to the deer I shoot to make the cleanest, quickest kill I can. I honestly am more excited about killing more deer during late season with the crossbow than I have been in years of bowhunting. I was totally against crossbows when the law was passed but have obviously softened in the past year or so.
Crossbows are legal, they aren’t going anywhere, and once you get into it, it’s kinda fun. People can think what they want but when I look at how much money I have tied up in property taxes, equipment, and vacation time, don’t be offended when I tell you where to stick it when you tell me what way I should hunt.
Crossgun nation must have been alerted. Thanks for stopping by.
My guess would be Acherytalk. Crossbow nation is to laid back for this crowd.
So many reasons to use the crossbow!
I would rather bow hunt with a bow and arrow. Hunt hard, hunt close, and give the animals a bow hunters chance.........
"It has to do with putting x-gun in bow season."
If you're referring to crossbows, from what I understand they were NOT put in "bow" season but instead have their own season (a magical "separate") season. You should talk to CaptMorgan (Captmike) he can tell you all about it I remember him saying he helped create this crossbow season and was very proud of himself for his involvement. He can explain how you have nothing to worry about thanks to him for his forward thinking (and greatness.)
"People can think what they want but when I look at how much money I have tied up in property taxes, equipment, and vacation time, don’t be offended when I tell you where to stick it when you tell me what way I should hunt. "
+1
The x-gun is not in the bow season or considered on this site as a bow, so why is it here. It is the transgender of want-to-be bowhunters, heard the same rational in the mid- late 70s with the compound but it has developed into a vertical x-gun in many ways. As Lawboy explained the same verbiage that I heard before on the compound, the cap & ball season should be concurrent with the x-gun season to make it fair, what would it matter any way since the airgun-arrow/bolt is coming next. Frick, I use to get deleted off this site not long ago for even mentioning the x-gun, how far have we fallen as bowhunters and not fighting this pos from mainstreaming and yes the x-gun can be stick in the darkest hole where the sun won't shine. Enjoy the hunt, I'm done my AARP mag came in to read.
Why all the fuss? We need RC here to get us the facts, or is he here?
LawboyTom- it takes about 10 minutes every other day to shoot a few months before the season with a compound. Your telling us you dont have time? I bet you have time to go to the bar, watch tv, etc. Basically what I hear is excuses to shoot a superior weapon, a x-gun.
Hunterrrrr, u are correckt. Dey have a sepret seesin. Lol! Just keeping it easy for you and your lazy crossgun user buddies to read!
Happy again I stand corrected. I should have said concurrent with bow season.
Crossgun users certainly seem to have a never ending supply of excuses for their laziness and I cannot understand why. Embrace it! Hug it! Cherish your easy button, compliments the NRA.
Somebody, quick start a new crossbow thread please... I can't get enough.....
Who has the most lame physical(including mental) excuse for using a crossbow? Here is your chance to win.
Missouri I think RC is sitting on a corn pile with a flashlight hunting. Wink
RC was the most informed contributor here, I think he still exists but most do not know it. By the looks of the gas stations, someone is sitting on a pile of corn. Really dumb to ban baiting, private wins again over public land hunters.
I think that he is more like a Zorro. He appears when most needed and carries a huge sword. LOL
Them naughty naughty crossbow hunters, why there lazy, they should all be banned, them crossbow have them magical powers, if you hunt with one the deer just run to it to die, you don’t have to aim or anything the deer see it and bam there dead, and we that shoot them are the mean ole evil ones, why nobody should have rights but a bow hunter, well unless your disabled and 65 years and older,right? Lol after reading half of this bs crap some of you have no business even hunting nor speaking for hunters your a pure disgrace to the sport, am not speaking for everyone just a few , for God’s sake quit spreading the ignorance, because it’s people like you that think your really speaking up when in reality your destroying the sport you claim you love, nothing I say will matter am sure the grammar police will be out whining boo hoo I couldn’t read this, Again your style of hunting is no more superior than anyone else’s , buy a crossbow u will kill more deer maybe ,,can u hear me now? What about now? And now? Lol peace!!!!
Yup, pretty much! Drop Tine +1
I went to a crossbow to be a more effective killer in the limited time I have in the woods. I just think it’s funny how people get so worked up over something that is really so unimportant.
Just for the record, I haven’t been in a bar in years and I’d dare anyone to come work with me on our farm for a week and call me lazy. In our house, meat doesn’t come from the store, we raise, kill, and butcher everything ourselves. Our garden is substantial and feeds us much of the year. The farm is in addition to full time jobs for my wife and I and teaching our kids hard work and life won’t just give you something for showing up. I could easily sit here on a high horse and question why people aren’t leading the same lifestyle we are. It’s not for everyone and I don’t force my values on anyone.
I keep trying to teach my 5yr old not to worry about what others are doing as long as it isn’t hurting anyone or against the rules/laws. He’s finally getting it, many here should follow suit.
Split, when you said “bam there dead” was that because you think they are so much like a gun? Lol, even you cannot help but compare the crossbow to a gun! ;)
Very serious question.....What are the real reasons people use crossbows? I read a lot about being lazy, can someone please enlighten me as to what that means?
Capt? Capt? Don’t expect you to follow it, I get it , it went over your head, just leads me back to the saying, common sense can take u a long way if you use it right, I have found out one thing about reading comments on this site, am not the smartest man in the world but am sure not the dumbest, good grief I’ve read a lot of silly crap in my life, but never seen so much whining over a crossbow, u need a hug or something or change professions, am done arguing over this dumb crap , I will keep hunting and doing my thing until God calls me home, stay out of the way I hunt and I will stay out of your way ,
Missouribreak, for one thing I don’t get were the lazy part comes in, that doesn’t even make sense, to call someone lazy for shooting a crossbow? I shoot mine because for one I have to know because of being disabled at no fault of my own, I shoot them because I can be in the woods longer and none of my shots are farther than 25 yards, but they are fun to shoot, there accurate, and since I have to hunt out of a ground blind there easier to shoot from one, I can’t speak for everyone else, but I use to be against them up until this year but then again I didn’t know nothing about a crossbow, but am glad I got one because they are fun to shoot, I still try to shoot my bow but very little back muscle want allow me to, but in all honesty I like them now, has nothing to do with being lazy that’s just dumb to keep saying that.
If you call a crossbow shooter lazy...what then would a man that uses a firearm be? Would he be just as "lazy" or would he be more "lazy"... All this bickering is exhausting...
Hunt like me or your a piece of garbage mentality! Hunt like me because "I" do it right!!
God, it's tiring!
This is the Wisconsin state forum.....would you expect anything less.
Capt, I think that your trying to connect BAM with BANG. If all you got out of Splits post was that, then you are truly well screwed up.LOL If your what a compound hunter has evolved into then I am glad that I carry a crossbow. You have become part of the problem because nobody wants to be you or even around you. Try reading the rest of Split's post and let it sink in. Mercy!
Ya know, I find it so odd that if a person goes to Canada bear hunting they care less if you shoot it with a gun, bow, crossbow, spear or a club. And here we are bickering like this. Maybe it is the combination of cheese and beer that is warping us. Just a thought.
I know Pas you have a bad habit of telling people what to do. Frankly I don't take advice from a pothead, They usually have waste way to many brain cells.
I know Pas you have a bad habit of telling people what to do. Frankly I don't take advice from a pothead, They usually have wasted way to many brain cells. But then again Pot is now legal in Canada. Hint, HINT
Your grammer and usage of it is bad Jake. Sorry to tell you, it's a bad habit of mine.
Heres whats comical. Crossgun hunters coming on a site dedicated to vertical bow hunting and complaining about not getting a group hug. You guys wouldnt be on here if you didnt like the bitching and fighting just as much. Makes one wonder why you dont start your own website dedicated to your chosen way? There wont be any group hug coming anytime soon here. SO if you choose to stay the bitching and fighting is on you because you enjoy it....
Catholic grade school upbringing. LOl Can your remember grade school Pas or is that all fuzzy. If you missed it on my first attempt, I blame your condition on you being a Pothead and hinted that in Canada it is legal. Man, against our State hunting laws and illegally smokes pot. That is a great moral compass that you have. I know the gAmmer. LOL
retro, I am a compound hunter, who also shoots a crossbow, I enjoy taking both to the range because I enjoy shooting both, just wanted to get that out of the way. I come on here to learn, share, laugh, and just shake my head, just like I did at your last comment, its not the crossbow hunters complaining UNTIL us compound hunters start complaining about crossbow hunting and crossbows in general, and I also here a lot of complaining as to why crossbow hunters are even on this site, well maybe just maybe they are here for the same reasons I am, learn, share and laugh, after all I dint know venison tasted different when shoot with a compound, or that the tactics used to shoot a deer are different, yes the weapon of choice is different but all else I believe is the same.
Carl
Nobody asking for a damn hug there Retro , it should have been a common sense thread, were people talk like adults , but big bad I only shoot bows big mouths had to turn into who is best , what is best blah blah blah, nobody wants a hug to be honest there is only a few on here I would hunt with the rest I wouldn’t give u a nickel worth of monkey piss for there knowledge or there companionship, but I like Jake, crusaderdad, Chief, am sure there is others but these guys have common sense, but I don’t have time to belch and bottle feed a bunch of snot nose babies that don’t get there way during hunting season, piss down both sides of there legs because a crossbow hunter , hunts in November, Mommy them crossbow hunters are hunting in November go ground them, lol u might need a hug but what I need is a bunch of cry babies to stay on there side I will stay on my side , and I will say it to your face , state law lol
Retro x1 - good bye Jake. Good luck with the wooden cross gun stocks you sell and be careful of the lacquer fumes. Seem to be taking a toll on ya.
Jake you know when you get to them when the panty waist grammar police come out, they have to correct a person grammar because that’s all they got
Split please put a dot called a period at the end of your run on sentences. That way we know you're done writing. Something we look forward to most times.
PS - they ( meaning xgun ) don't belong in the archery season.
Time for Jake and Spittoe to go back to xgun nation or wherever. Just not here.
Pasquinell? Pansy ? Whatever your name is mr grammar boy, u better keep your butt were your at because it’s people like you that don’t get to contribute very long in this world, somebody will slap the taste out of that smart ass mouth I bet you want correct there grammar again, trust me that day will come if u got the backbone to say it to there face, which I doubt u do....... is that better Rosie?? Keep it up u will need a pen and paper to communicate!!!!!
I'm willing to bet this is really not the last crossbow thread.
RJN- see Jake you just call them out they fold, we call that lack of backbone, hell RJN u can have your site trust me nobody is fighting to hear all the whining, you and your pals are the worst thing for the sport of deer hunting, but u will find that out later in life, but you better find a different speaker for y’all because what y’all believe and think is nothing more than a joke, and people will laugh at you and say come back when u get more knowledge, kick me off here I don’t give a rat piss , boo hoo Jake and splitoe hurt my feelings.......
Split, such tough talk from a disabled hunter. You throw physical threats around to all, yet you have to use a crossbow because you are disabled? I agree with who ever said it above, go back to Crossbow Nation.
Wow, x-gunners must have a conscious thing going on using those things. Splittoe, now your physically threatening people on here? Go see your anger management shrink. You guys come on here knowing it is a BOWHUNTING site and now want to get violent? Go away!!!
Live2 Hunt I didn’t threaten nobody better read my post again, but don’t worry I want post again, yea my anger management said stay off this site , so I will stay off here , people know it’s a bow site , they get butt hurt because people have different opinions, u try to stomp on me I promise u one thing am gonna defend myself, this ole boy don’t have no run in him , I was brought up to respect everyone, but don’t let people stomp on u, so peace out guys, have to go see my anger management I offended someone, lol
Don't post much here anymore,,, but I just have to.. I was at the crossgun hearing in Madison and gave testimony To keep the current law we had at that time. ( and it was a good one ) One of the BIG issues the crossgunners harped on was being labeled with a disability under the current law at that time. I brought up the fact that I'll bet that the some of the crossgunners with a disability hang their permit on their mirror and take that parking spot from some that really needs to use it so they only have a 50 yd walk into Walmart. That same disabiled crossgunner has no problem walking 100's of yards in the woods to get to his/her stand but can't walk 75 plus yds at Walmart and doesn't mind being labeled to get the close parking. We had a good law that covered EVERY person that want to use a crossgun weather they needed to use a crossgun or not. The law change wasn't about promoting hunting it was about MONEY....
Capt lol what a joke again u better read my post I didn’t threaten nobody, I said if he keeps correcting someone grammar somebody will correct him , I didn’t threat nobody Capt better learn to read, am sure u do want me off here and am gone , y’all try to bully people then get offended when someone don’t put up with that crap lol
Capt lol what a joke again u better read my post I didn’t threaten nobody, I said if he keeps correcting someone grammar somebody will correct him , I didn’t threat nobody Capt better learn to read, am sure u do want me off here and am gone , y’all try to bully people then get offended when someone don’t put up with that crap lol
"Keep it up u will need a pen and paper to communicate!!!!!"
Live2hunt yea that’s what I said but did I say it was me that was going to do that? No like a liberal y’all like to put words in people mouths, in my younger days I would have threatened maybe but I didn’t threaten nobody,
“See, you just call them out and they fold.” Lol!
Capt? Capt? Raise your hand if u got something to say. Or was that a threat? Did I offend u? Lol
Ok am getting off here lol yea you right it’s a bow site , I didn’t come here to argue and fight with no one, I was just trying to read what people was seeing and killing, I let my emotions get to me, yea I have a bad temper I have to quit letting my emotions ride on my sleeve, didn’t mean to offend no one but I know I did , Jake crusader , Chief , you guys are good people trust me u can hunt with me anytime, again didn’t mean to get mad but am leaving now God Bless, have respect for all hunters guys makes no difference what they hunt with
Split, your embarrassing yourself and coming across as an illiterate hillbilly. Makes your stance seem inconsequential. (without meaning or credibility)
Elk- you don’t know me I don’t know you, I come from the bayou of Louisiana, maybe I am a hillbilly to you and others, different culture, now I tried to apologize because I let my emotions ride on my sleeve, but don’t push me ok? Mind your business I will mind mine , if you’re wanting to start something I can oblige you, disabled or not, but am wanting to apologize and let it be, Have a Blessed day Elk
There's a lot of good people from south of here but only a few that came on this BOW hunting site for the one reason of starting trouble. Your idle threats don't intimate anyone. You said you were done here so be a man of your word.
PS. Don't try to intimidate Pasq, he is a rather accomplished martial arts expert who also works for the CIA. I tried that with him once and learned my lesson!
Elk- lol sorry there partner but I didn’t threat nobody, u think I care what u are anyone has to say? Nobody was trying to start trouble I was speaking my mind and opinions like everyone else, I wasn’t trying to intimidate no one have no idea were u got that from, I must have got your panties in a wad or hurt your feelings, yea I doubt many people from the south are on here but good try.
Ps there Elk I don’t care if pasq is martial arts the cia , Bruce lee, u might have got punked but am not you, let me say this right so u understand, nothing scares me nobody or nothing , keep in mind I don’t want no trouble I don’t bother no body, I mind my business and as long as am left alone I leave people alone , but trust me NOTHING or Nobody scares me ELK!!!!!!
FTWAC, You can do all the things you mentioned on a crossgun site and have nothing but like minded people to share your thoughts with. Im not interested what people kill with their crossbow. Thats why Im on a VERTICAL BOW SITE!!!!!!! Im not interested in what you kill with your rifle. Thats why Im on a VERTICAL BOW SITE!!!! If I was interested in either of those things, I would search out a crossbow or gun hunting site. Its not that hard of a concept. Your choice, but if you continue to come here and preach crossbows, dont complain that everyone just doesnt roll over and except your choice to change the sport.....
WoW, step away for a while and things go in the gutter. What a circus.LOL
retro, I would love for you to show me where I preach about crossbows, please enlighten me.
Carl
retro, I would love for you to show me where I preach about crossbows, please enlighten me.
Carl
Carl-www.crossbownation.com
I disagree with retro on many things but I totally agree with his last post.
"Elk".....your embarrassing yourself....."martial arts and the CIA".....LMAO. Like anyone cares.
retro- couldn't said it best!!
retro, you are correct about the info on a crossbow site, so maybe its a Wi thing, not really sure, or maybe they love to be humored as I do, I cannot speak for someone else as to why they are here, I can only give my opinions.
Carl
Carl, Your here on a vertical bow site talking crossbows, and you just admitted your here because you like to be humored. So be it..... No problem. I already knew that....:>) Ill do my best to help keep you entertained....
retro, I can tell you why I am here. I noticed the crossbow thread and offered my opinions. You would think that everyone agreeing with each other makes for a dull conversation. I find much humor in some people's views on here. I just enjoy it.
Jake, Im always amazed at the differences of opinion that guys have on a whole host of subjects. Ill admit, theres a LOT of times that I scratch my head because I cant figure out where a guy is coming from..... So be it. If I have a belief I voice it, popular or not. I do care about bowhunting and worry about the direction its taken. I want my grand kids to still have a bowhunting season to participate in if they so chose. Im not optimistic right now..... Time will tell if the sport will survive the never ending march of technology.....
I don’t believe bow hunting will ever be hurt, to many people that bow hunt, wish I still could, there might be something up here that might be a cause of concern but bow hunting is here to stay, yes there is a lot of crossbow hunters I reckon I don’t know, but bow hunters are strong in numbers, I been trying to keep up for years on it , and it’s true bow hunters turned to crossbow, but I know a lot more true bow hunters than crossbow hunters, just my 2 cents, I hope nothing ever affects bow hunting because for 33 years it was a passion of mine
I agree Splittoe, there will likely be bow and arrow hunters, for the foreseeable future anyway. What is most likely to happen over the next ten years is more and more hunters and manufacturers will leave compound bow hunting and manufacturing for the scoped crossbow markets. The stickbow hunters are unique in their own sense and have already resisted the compound technology temptation. The kill is not as important to the stickbow hunters as is the quality of the hunt, they will go on. The apparent strength of the Compton Archery group appears to be an ongoing success, at least for the near term. Good hunting to everyone and have a great Holiday Season.
retro, I to worry about technology. When I had to stop using compounds my bow shot a sizzling 220fps and I shot fingers. The vertical has been redefined greatly since then. Now the crossbow made great gains to. In 2005 I bought a tenpoint crossbow in shot around 300 fps. Now they are pushing 450fps. There is just no need for that kind of speed to hunt with. I agrue plenty on crossbow forums about losing the ARCH in archery. The purpose for them is to shoot as flat as possible to be more accurate. I hate to see us going in that direction but the bench shooting paper guys just keep pushing the limits. I to fear for the sport. To me the stickbow is and always will be the supreme challenge and what is true bowhunting. Sorry but the compound is a HUGE advantage and the crossbow just followed the same path as the compound. What I mean by that is less time to master and far more accurate. These people today have less time or just will not give up the time it takes to master a stick bow so it evolves. Retro I worry and like I said I argue the point but I doubt is it can be stopped. It will eventually ruin the sport. They have no idea what they are missing.
Missourri If they can somehow put a collar on that speed then there is hope. As they say speed truly does kill.
Missouribreak I agree , I have a lot of friends that are true compound bow hunters, and only 2 that shoot stick and string, but they say they will never give up there bows to crossbow hunting,
there is nothing wrong by being passionate about what you shoot. It is when people start demanding to do it there way or you are so much less is when there is conflict. It is like that on every forum. Hell be passionate but respectful of others views. I love archery. When I see a gun kill it really means nothing to me. I use to gun hunt but lost interest in it because I felt I was cheating the animal out of a great cat and mouse game. You know the one where you rarely win? My most memorable hunts are the ones where the stalk went perfect and THEN you know.
Hey guys good luck the rest of the year, hope y’all have a merry Christmas and happy new year, and if your still hunting I hope you get one, Keep safe and God Bless .
retro, please go back and count the number of posts I have on this topic compared to the number you have. I gave an opinion to something you said and that must have rustled some feathers, so right away I must be here stirring the pot and talking crossbows, yep theirs the humor, I also said I am a c o m p o u n d hunter, but enjoy shooting my crossbow, not hunting with it, yet, and just because you don't shoot a crossbow does not mean you are the only person who cares about the future of the sport or the animals in which we hunt.
Carl
It is not speed. The ease of use comes from not having to draw and hold like real bow hunters do. It is the lack of needed movement and the ability to hold a shoulder fired weapon while sighting through a magnified scope. But, you already knew that.
Thanks Capt, you never disappoint. What a divider you are.
I agree Jake. I use to shoot a compound. Long story short, as they evolved I simply became bored with them and lost my drive to hunt. I picked up a stick bow and never looked back. I could kick myself now for not finding trad bows earlier on. They are so much more fun! I absolutely love shooting them. I hope some of you high tech guys consider giving it a try sometime. I promise you in the beginning a big piece of humble pie....:>) One things for sure, you have to be able to get past the need to shoot a "trophy" every year, thats for sure. Once you have that licked your in for the most enjoyable archery of your life.... I just hope we always have an archery season and that this technology doesnt blur everything into one season. Can we at least all agree that would be a shame?
Captain is right. And,..... the truth does not make him a divider. The truth is simply...... the truth. What the truth does is not important, it is reality.
Carl, I hope you do care about preserving an archery season for the future. If you do, we at least have something in common.....
Missourri I will bite. Truth is crossbow do not have to be drawn and held. It is also true that by using a crossbow you will only get one shot. Compare that with a compound shooter with a raft of arrows in his quiver. Now compare the compound to the "as the divider would call it" a real bow the stick bow and the draw and hold are far and away different. The stick bow is drawn with your FINGERS and held with the full poundage of the bow. That only takes sometimes a lifetime to get right. Now the anchor is quick and usually instinctive meaning NO SIGHTS. The release is again fingers and the range is close. Forgot one more thing. When the stickbow is shot their is considerable hand shock. NOW, the compound bow is drawn, Hard at first then 10 or 20 percent hold. The hold is mechanical release. Dare I say a trigger, HINT gun. Far and away easier to hold for long periods and a great release compared to fingers. The hold can be long and give the shooter all the opportunity to predrawn and wait the animal out till the shot. Also the compound has sights. Magnified sights whereas most stick bows are instinctive. The release is near shock proof because the limbs have been altered to the point where they compress up and down so no forward jolt.
OK so it is true that compounds are drawn and it is true that there is a hold. BUT in reality they are NOTHING like a stick bow that can take a lifetime to master and are very close rang weapons whereas compound shoot way out there.
Now what I am getting is compound shooters always bring up the draw and hold. But everything the compound is about gets them away from a stickbow draw and hold. Yes damn near everything. So if you want to hang your ego on that then in truth your right but in reality your a fake compared to the stickbow.
retro, we most certain agree on that, with a ton of passion.
Same for me retro. Sold the switchback and never looked back.
The point is... We are all considered hunters... Fighting each other gets none of us further here... Standing together on our basic principles keeps some political nerd with a PETA agenda from taking away our happiness... But yeah lets keep being asshats in a place were no one wins high five
"Hunterrrrr, u are correckt. Dey have a sepret seesin. Lol! Just keeping it easy for you and your lazy crossgun user buddies to read!"
CaptPrick (I heard it's not name calling if it's true) I don't use a crossbow I use a compound that btw I don't find to be as impossible to pull back when a deer is in range as some of the folks here do. Of course, maybe I'm just extra skilled and most people really do struggle with it.
So tell us more about this separate season that you were so proud of yourself for creating, how come you hate it now? Why do you feel the need to slam everyone who takes part in the crossbow season? I mean really, you made it all happen right? Seems hypocritical.
"Lack of movement"......lets ban groundblinds….it`s not fair if the deer can`t see you.
Retro and pasq, like you I picked that stick up again and I have never enjoyed archery as much as I do now. I challenge all shooters to try it, you won't want to put it down.
Runterrrrr, get a set of regs and understand them. I'd say read them but reading and understanding are two different concepts, particularly for an extra skilled drawer such as yourself. There were lots of people involved in getting the seasons set as they currently are so unfortunately, I cannot take all the credit. But, the real credit for the crossbow season goes to all the apathetic bow hunters.
From: Franklin 05-Dec-18 Private Reply "Lack of movement"......lets ban groundblinds….it`s not fair if the deer can`t see you.
Franklin, if you are going to quote something, cut and paste. Then you will not get it wrong. Otherwise you look the fool by attempting to use something out of context.
Guess I am not the only one who feels this way.
How do you delete a thread?
PSE is very well known for it's vertical bows. Pete is a leader in that respect. I have never----------ever heard his crossbow or PSE mentioned on any forum ever. The norm is Ten Point, Excalibur, Mission and so on but from all the years on crossbow forum I have never heard PSE or Pete's name mentioned. I have the upmost respect for Pete BUT he did not leave a mark on the industry for making crossbows. I fact I am willing to bet that PSE's bread and butter are it's Vertical bows and crossbows have become his competition. Can anyone show a recent link to a PSE crossbow so that I can see one? This is very interesting that Capt hangs his hat on that when nobody on the crossbow forum speaks of them. Something is not right here. My guess is that Pete is protecting his brand and the vertical crowd is using his name for their crusade against crossbows.
But, the real credit for the crossbow season goes to all the apathetic bow hunters.
I have to disagree there Mike. The voters voted against xbows and multiple times at that. Shortly after that last spring vote, the Legislature then voted 96-0 in favor of them and our Guv signed them in as they sit today. I don't see how the public could do anything more when the politicians were going to pad their pockets financially regardless. Our politicians caved to the monies of the NRA.
Jake Pete designed the CrossFire, early intro that did not seem to go anywhere..... you can check that out, on line
Happy, you may be correct. All that I know is that there was no real pressure put on the legislators to keep the crossbow out. Legislators get very few calls and letters on most subjects and this one was no different. Yes, the power (money) if the NRA played a huge role in it. Edit: the votes you refer to I believe were done at the Spring Hearings. The pressure I refer to is through direct contact to our legislators, along with attending hearings and speaking at those hearings.
Ground, I did google the bow. I think Pete is pushing the business that he is good at and that is vertical bows. Like I said earlier, good guy but he to has a family to feed.
PSE got into the market decades before TenPoint, Mission, Excalibur, etc. even existed. As the article said, Pete was an early promoter and hoped it would help increase hunter participation. They have realized it didn't help. They still make crossbows but it is not a priority.
Mike, this question is not intended to antagonize in any way. Could the results have been different if you, Brust, Kaz, and the other constituents would have stayed with your "no" votes? What would the ramifications of been or would your votes have been overridden by the Legislature and Guv anyway?
I personally feel that the money was going to win no matter what. The 96-0 vote after that spring hearing was a real eye opener and I think the writing was on the wall no matter what but that is pure speculation.
CWD and herd reduction made the timing perfect to introduce crossbows to the masses. In heavy whitetail deer regions, and reduced hunter participation, what can scoped crossbows really hurt? I am not an advocate, but there is some logical support.
Happy, no problem and glad to answer. We went into the negotiations hell bent on trying to keep any crossbow season from coming to fruition. We were holding our own but faced an uphill battle. Our SCI chapter (me & Kaz) wrote a letter in an effort to present our position to the public. We tried getting it in WON but Dean Bortz refused to publish it as an article or letter to the editor. We were forced to pay WON $1,400,00 to get that letter published, and only after he ok’d it. To me that was a definite sign that we had an uphill fight on our hands. We paid the money and had it published. My contact info was at the end of that letter, along with my name. I only remember getting one email in support while getting a dozen or so against. At any rate, we had Terry Moulton and another senator (cannot remember his name) firmly on our side. We attended many meetings in Madison, with Geitz doing most of the work. Initially it was the WI Bear Hunters leading the opposition but then their lobbyist, Scott Meyer brought in the WI NRA rep who pushed very hard for a crossbow season. The back and forth negotiations continued but with the NRA backing the crossbow season, more and more legislators began to favor a season for the crossbow. Eventually we were faced with absolute opposition or we could fight to get anything that might give us a glimmer of hope. It was at that point that we chose to push for a separate season. In our minds, this would at least insulate our current season from the crossbow season. Getting that separate season mandated the department to keep separate record keeping regards participation, numbers killed and success rate. This way we do not have crossbow kills lumped together with the vertical kill numbers. Of course this is a very shortened version of the course of events and the time frame involved.
Thank you Captain, nice post.
So u didn’t want any crossbow season? Am I reading that right?
I don’t get why people are against crossbows.. for one it helps introducing kids into hunting. My 10 year old son practices with his compound youth bow but I feel for now I’d rather him shooting x bow instead of compound. They can go out when it’s nice out and see a lot more deer than gun hunting. Plus I get how many big bucks are shot with cross bows during the rut, but how many big bucks never get found or you see them limping.. my son will use a compound when time right. Get over yourself. It’s about the animal isn’t.
Thanks Capt. Terry Moulton owns an archery shop in town. I am glad to hear but then again surprised to hear that he was against xguns because they sell a lot of them.
Beer, I'm willing to bet more un-found deer with these from stupid shots, hey ya, theyre good for 100+ yrds!!!
Lol I guarantee there are just as many wounded deer from compound bows as there is crossbow, and anybody shooting at a deer 100 yards with a bow or crossbow shouldn’t be hunting .
Yeah if idiots shoot that far.. just like idiots shooting at deer running 200+ yards away. I’m just saying what we do .
He’s getting good.. shooting squirrels from tree stand with x bow.
Wow.. no comments cause he shot it earlier with 22. But would using cross bow make it easier, less challenging??
I do think that the old policy of deleting x-bow off this site needs to come back asp, to shun it is the best method. Where is the mod to get this done? Splittoe, when the x-gun became its own season a good friend found 2 does and 1 buck in a area with bolts in them where he hunts public, first time in yrs he has ever came across this, so very careful about the wounding crap you are exploiting.
Beer that is just special. The son has a pretty good Dad.
I think it was already stated in another thread that pictures of crossbow kills were ok on bowsite . Not sure what the policy is on crossbows. There will not be many bowhunters in another ten years.. so maybe there is an evolution. Clearly, many here are closet crossbow users and enablers.
no fan of the xbow, for regular season, except by the old rules however I do not believe or worry about 100 yard shots in the woods,,,,, I doubt most shots are over 40 on a regular basis.......
This may have been mentioned in older replies or maybe I'm wrong about the site. But I feel that crossbow threads/topics should be deleted from this site. Compounds,recurves,longbows etc for bowhunting is what the site should be . If I need info etc about a car, I don't go to a site about clothes, lumber etc. Isn't that why the difference in sites? You want to promote or ask questions etc, about the crossbow go to a respective site that is about them. This is supposed to be a BOW site not a crossbow site, correct? Can we agree on this recommendation?
75+ yards shots are common with compounds in the west.
Beer that’s a good picture and that squirrel will be tasty, your son looks happy that’s all that matters congratulations on that squirrel young man.
I believe the topic of the thread explains what it is about. The question should be why are there compound users on a crossbow thread? Nobody is forcing anyone to post.
I just said. Law changed so can carry my compound and son have his crossbow.. was you can only have 1 weapon
If nothing else this thread has pumped this part of bowsite up. 300 plus posts is nothing to sneeze at. Apparently somebody wants to talk about it.
I’ll post a of doe I abhor tonight with x bow rather than gun
Makes sense Beer, it is a gun season.
Live2, it might sound odd that guys like Moulton and Kaz were opposed to crossbows but they were. Some here did not/do not believe it but I suspect those are guys who will put money ahead of their beliefs and values. Yes, they sell them now but they most certainly were against them.
Thanks for that explanation Captain.
The only problem "Jake" it was the same 8 guys making 300 posts....lol
Pasq, Missouri and Happy, I am glad to give an explanation with a little bit of the perspective we held at the time.
Capt, I would like to thank you for responding like a mature adult at the end of all this. I never before saw that side of you. Good hunting to all. Until the next crossbow thread so long. Franklin, that is so true.LOL +1
Ya,.... there are not many bowhunters left in Wisconsin, even fewer bow and arrow hunters on this forum. It stays pretty dead until the crossbow enthusiasts show up.
Maybe it stays dead because the crossbow hunters are the real hunters , ever think of that? If there is not many stick and string hunters don’t blame crossbow hunters, gun hunters, that sounds like a liberal blaming a conservative for everything, busy world we live in here , hard working people that don’t have 40 hour jobs they work 60 hours a week or more, they love to hunt and at any means will get it done, there not stepping on your toes. , trespassing, stealing, or nothing they just want to hunt, when u start bashing and start trying to take hunting rights, or saying what people can hunt with, you sound like you want a one world government, that rules everything you do, blame the crossbow hunters, blame the gun hunters because every time u complain it just give peta and the government one more reason to get involved in everyone business, it takes one time and this new generation don’t care anything about hunting there looking for reasons to ban all types of hunting, they don’t care if you gun hunt, stick and arrow hunt , they want to ban it, your not gonna change people minds, what they want to hunt with they will,but if all hunters don’t start working together we want have to worry about hunting threads, if you care about hunting then go complain and write letters to the senators trying to ban deer pens , because if we don’t pay attention in 5 years the deer herds will be wipeout not by CWD but by our DNR, looking for a reason to slaughter deer, have a good day, just my opinion ,u know I remember when people complained the didn’t see enough deer, never heard anyone complain that one certain weapon was hurting deer population,ok am done lol
I was responding to the point there were " only eight guys making 300 posts ". It is fact that Wisconsin (and likely Michigan) have already lost around 50% of there bow and arrow hunters. That puts pressure on organizations (and perhaps bowsite) who cater to bow and arrow hunters, and not scoped crossbow hunters. Bow and arrow hunters are in a rapid decline, in part due to the scoped crossbow revolution and increases. As such, bow and arrow hunting manufactures, clubs, forums etc have to adjust to declining bow hunter numbers, and bow hunter revenue over the upcoming years. Good Bye to any organization or business who expects to grow and prosper totally on bow and arrow hunters and the associated culture. Better diversify, or remain in a smaller niche market. Bow and arrow hunting will not go away entirely, it will simply be a shadow of it's former self. Stickbow hunting likely has a more steady course. Nothing good, nothing bad, just the facts.
Missouribreak I agree that’s exactly right.
Missouribreaks
Dammit it, if you would have said that 300 some odd posts ago...this thread would have been a whooping 5 posts long. Sigh*
I`m still trying to figure out how Misery Breaks speaks about Wisconsin bowhunting from Montana? Do you ever hunt in Wisconsin....have you ever bought a tag here....do you own land here? Please enlighten us that live here.
Those of us who follow along know that Missouri hunts here.
Thank you Captain. I have hunted Wisconsin for about 43 consecutive years, as well as several other states on an annual basis. Not sure what difference it makes to the rookies, we are all entitled to our opinion.
Just wondering if you pay taxes here or if you are just an out of state hunter. Or just Capt. Mike`s boyfriend.
It's no wonder we are losing good, contributing members on this forum. The tantrums and name calling is ridiculous. It's disappointing to see good people driven away. It's also disappointing to see good men get sucked into the back and forth and the name calling.
Maybe you`re buying into Misery Breaks sky is falling BS. It`s important to understand people agendas here and the reason for pushing them. Misery Breaks makes a post....2 posts later Capt. Mike strokes him....then Capt. Mike makes a post and Misery breaks strokes him.
Hell.....Capt. Mike even is answering posts FOR Misery Breaks. So lets get it all out in the open....once in for all. So we all know where we are all coming from.
No Franklin your the one that is calling people names and throwing the tantrum here. This is the reason that bowhunting numbers are dropping. The rest of us are wondering where your coming from. Please explain in a respectful way if you can. I'd like to add that Missouri adds a lot to this thread and I would hate to see him leave. Good contributor
Jake x2, because I am also wondering where you are coming from and why.
Sorry Franklin, I am going to try to stay away from the sarcastic remarks, as easy as it would be with you.
Jake, you assume I (and maybe others) hunt with a compound but that is only partially true. I started hunting with a recurve 45 years ago and still use one to this day, on occasion. They both sit in my bedroom and I never know which I will take. Hunting from a tree stand, some of my stands are better suited for the recurve use than are others. The wind determines where I will sit and in turn, that influences which bow I will take. Regardless, and as a user of both vertical bows, I do not share your perspective about crossbow use. And once again I will state, I have no issue with a truly physically handicapped person using one.
Jake, I am so glad you asked, I also went through all the stages from stick and string to compound, but would disagree with your comment about compound shooters, well not all compound shooters anyways.
I enjoy the knowledge on the site, reading about others success or failures, the Wi theme always gets me, and yes the back and forth can be entertaining, not a fan of the name calling though, I general seems to be some good hunters that are willing to share when they can, so the door to learning is always open.
Carl
P.S. Jake my comment as to where you are coming from was to franklin, but did enjoy your response lol.
No tantrum here Jake....the "tantrum" was 340 posts about total nonsense!!! Hey.....I`m just trying to figure out Capt. Mike`s and Misery`s "Martin and Lewis" act. If Misery does not own property here then the resource (deer) doesn`t belong to him. Also if he is a non-resident hunter who lives in a state like Montana...that cost $500 for a non-res. deer tag and takes YEARS to get....he shouldn`t be complaining about ANYTHING being done by Wisconsin hunters.
How does a guy....Misery...go on multiple forums on this site and JUST post gibberish about CWD and "hunter numbers declining".....and then use such highly regarded media sites such as the Lacrosse Times or the world reknowned Racine Gazzette articles written by a journalist fresh out of high school as his back up. He even posted an article about the decline of "hunters". The article was about the huge drop in "Sportsman Licenses" purchases. The article showed the decline in deer hunters at a measly 5%. That has to do with our population aging and gender makeup.
How does that same guy post a thread calling for deer eradication then say that "hopefully women and wives educate themselves on CWD before letting venison into their home" or that "to control deer herds they should be eradicated using all weapons available all season long" then turn around and whine about a Wisconsin hunter who uses a crossbow. So lets "eradicate" the herd "by all means neccesary" BUT crossbows....WTF.
I also would like to understand how hunting in a man made hut/blind in a arid climate/drought conditions like Africa....sitting over a man made water hole, which a animal MUST drink to survive in a preserve is "hunting" but using a crossbow on free range deer in Wisconsin is not.
While we are at it....how is sitting over a bucket of "bad" but planting a field full of "cotton candy" for deer. Or hunting bears over jelly donuts, marshmellows and popcorn smeared with Log Cabin pancake syrup OK but a bucket of corn not.
I could go on and on but you get the picture. My bitch is the HYPOCRISY being exhibited by some of these "members" and just how ridiculous some of these arguments are. Not one of us are "pure" hunters and we all have the right to do as we see fit as long as it`s legal. We all also have a right to our opinion but we also have a right to call "bullshit" on those that are being hypocritical in that opinion. Not to mention bullying someone because they aren`t as articulate on as a computer as you are....nothing more petty than a "grammar cop" on a forum.
Well I don’t care what u shoot, but I know if I ever loose that feeling of when a buck or doe come in on me, the butterflies in my stomach, the shaken , if I ever lose that I will quit hunting, I come here to learn something different because it makes no difference how much u hunt or think you know there is still plenty to learn. Am gonna support you no matter what your weapon of choice is, the main thing is we all enjoy hunting, God Bless.
Petty? Tough to beat someone who claims no tantrum, only to proceed with one of the biggest tantrums ever posted on these pages. Yes, the HYPOCRISY is real.
Who said I did not pay taxes in Wisconsin?
If it was a "tantrum" it would of been in bold letters....look who`s back....the "butt brothers". You two don`t disappoint....always within 2 posts of each other.
How about we make a deal....next time you want to make complete asses out of yourselves and embarrass the entire bowhunting community....how about posting a "disclaimer".....like....."The opinions of a few intolerant slobs on here do not reflect the opinions of the Wisconsin bowhunting community".
Feel free to cut and paste if you would like.
"The opinions of a few intolerant slobs on here do not reflect the opinions of the Wisconsin bowhunting community." I would agree. I do not believe too many people give your ranting much credence. BTW, thanks for permission. I did cut and paste a bit of your drivel, just for posterity sake.
Remember... the bow hunting community does not include crossbow shooters, they belong to the crossbow community.
I belong to the hunting community, don’t care what season or what weapon am a hunter first.
Now that I can agree with! Life would be better if the xbow shooters went to their xbow site & the vertical bow hunters stayed in the bow site. I'm sure that is why it is set up that way.
There are plenty of general hunting community forums. Why encroach on those who choose to hunt the harder way, limit themselves so to speak?
Of course part of posting is just gratification and entertainment. Is anything really productive going to come out of these threads? Have a nice Holiday season Jake.
I have hunted with a compound for 20 years. I am in search of a recurve and also considering a xbow. I’m not sure where that leaves me on bowsite but I sure have learned a lot in a short time on this site. I love hunting, but weapon choice isn’t important to me. Thanks guys!
P.s. I’m terrible with punctuation and grammar please excuse me
Peter Shepley was on the Outdoor Channel this am, with his new add on his new cross bow. He touted the 100 yard capability, and stated most hunters hunt out of blinds of some sort, anyways............................ man he sure does not live in my world
There “management” deer are also once in life time for most of once
Franklin did make some valid points over what hunting is. I can see both sides of the coin on that one. One can really make an argument that those guys out west who spot and stalk and then have to get within close range of their animals, are really hunters. I can see how they'd snicker at those who sit in a stand/blind and simply wait for deer to come to them. Add a food source to that, and I can really see how they'd snicker. The guys who spot and stalk sheep in those mountains are really hunting.
I love bear hunting but to me, Franklin is right there. We either shoot them out of a tree after dogs put them there or we shoot them when they have their heads buried in a box of Crispy Kremes. Is that really hunting or is that just shooting? How do the antis view a bear being killed with their head buried in a box of donuts? The guys who spot and stalk them in places like Alaska have to work for their reward.
There are surely lots of opinions on this topic and I guess it falls in line with the weapon of choice topic because there appears to be a hard way and an easy way. Yet, another topic hunters are divided on.
What really is hunting? Does it have to be hard for someone to be a hunter? We are judged as a hunter on whether our approach is considered to be hard or easy. That has happened in this thread. Should we care what others think? What if someone stalks tough terrain for days and then finally gets within 15 yards of a bull elk and shoots them with an xbow - is that hunting? What if someone sits in a ground blind over 2 gallons of corn, waits for a deer to come to the bait and then shoots a deer with a recurve - is that hunting? If I add Ozonics to my blind to mechanically hide my human scent versus those who stalk would the weapon of choice determine if I was a hunter at that point? Sounds like another thread that could generate hundreds of replies.
Sounds like Pete Shepley lives in the world of the majority of modern archery season hunters. Most are former bow and arrow hunters, now going to the scoped 100+ yard ultra modern crossbow. What great weapons are being developed, the big buck will be all yours if you snipe him before the neighbor does.
What problem? I do not see any problem, just differing opinions.
Here's the deal, no one on here ever had any issues with using one the way it was, at all. We chose to bowhunt because of the mystique and the ability to take an animal close with a bow and arrow. We emerged ourselves in learning to shoot, to be dedicated enough with one to make clean shots and how to get close to game to get that clean shot with a short ranged weapon. We had a longer season to hunt and we were able to hunt all phases of the rut. Anyone who wanted to make the effort to learn to shoot could do this. A lot of hunters just did not want to take this time and did not want to put that much effort into something with a low percentage payback. The ability to get all this was from years of dedicated bowhunters to get these seasons as long as the x-gun wasn't involved except for people who were medically enable to draw a bow. Us that chose to dedicate ourselves put in a lot of time, work and effort to succeed. The full inclusion just erased all that work and effort that past organizations and hunters worked for. It was basically saying F you, that's a waste of time. Well to me, that is a lot of time and memories lost when they forced this inclusion down our throats. I only hope that the few kids I have met that said this isn't right, that want the thrill of shooting a bow instead of hitting the easy button grows. If a compound is no different than a x-gun, why did we need to give full inclusion? Because they are a lot different, that's why. I don't care what people hunt with either, but this was wrong and now they are realizing it after its too late.
happygolucky, great post, makes you kinda think.
Carl
Live2Hunt, congrats on a very well worded post. Certainly the crossbow is different. I think the crossbow users make that point best by not wanting to be differentiated from the vertical archers.
Jakeaxx, you are saying that bowhunters are not allowed to discuss x guns. I wish you knew how unintelligent you sound on here. Very nice L2H, Yes the xgunners got it all handed to them on a Silver platter. A lot of true hunters worked very hard to get the seasons & laws adjusted & in place. Yes the compound is easier than the Traditional equipment but the rules & adjustments were made around that. The current stats & rules are from the last 50 years of compound & Trad hunters combined. If the compound was that easy it would show that by now. These rules were not made for using a gun type weapon during the archery season.
I still like happygolucky's post, take the weapon out of it, and what makes you a hunter, what makes you different than anyone else??
Carl
FTWAC, I too agree with Happy's post, from a purely idealistic perspective. The problem is that management needs to be added to the mix. That means regulated seasons, regulated animal numbers and in some cases, regulated opportunity.
Jake, you continue to argue a moot point. Keep beating the horse but he was dead long ago. As Albino points out, the ramifications of compound bows are well documented over a long period of time. While the results from crossbow hunting are still in their infancy, the trend is for a larger deer kill from them, particularly on legal bucks.
Jake, reread my post. It did say compounds are easier than Trad equipment. We are going by the stats of the last 50 + years of the BETTER compound & Trad equipment together. Take your blinders off boy. Quit bring your BMW to the classic car show. We don't want it.
That`s really the point Happy....why are we arguing with each other. We could nitpick all day long about the way each of us hunt. It`s just doesn`t make any sense to beat on each other.....if it`s legal....just hunt. Save your arguments for the powers to be to change a law you don`t like.
Bashing each other is not the way.
Franklin, its nice to see a post from you in which I agree, with that being said it is human behavior, as long as different weapons are legal their will always be people who will disagree, because of ego, jealousy, wealth, etc. after all can you imagine a world where we all got along or one in which we all felt the same way towards something, being different does not make us bad, just makes us different.
Carl
I don't think this thread title was accurate. Let's unite WI hunters and get multiple concurrent xbow threads over 500 posts each and break a bowsite record.
Easy to do as most here are really scoped crossbow users, enablers and sympathizers.
And those that arent make ridiculous comments that never further the discussion I.e. Missouri but at least he's good for a laugh if nothing else
Can someone tell me if bowhunting is declining in WI? There has to be at least one person on Bowsite who would know this. I know this is crazy, but my son and I, both compound bowhunters really enjoy our time in the woods. Perhaps we are out of touch with how we should be feeling. That or we are just lucky.
Do not confuse bow and arrow hunter numbers with all hunters now hunting in the archery seasons. One group is down, but overall numbers in the archery seasons likely are expanding.
Likely? Would like to see actual numbers not guesses.
All one has to do is review the archery season combined license sales, and add in the special seasons.
The report will be presented to the NRB this week but the numbers almost certainly will be flat or slightly down. We had two artificial increases when we lowered (eliminated) hunting ages and when gun hunters started hunting with crossbows. Going forward hunter numbers will continue to decline.
All I can say is get your kids and grandkids to put down the video games and phones and get in the woods... You might see the numbers increase just a thought
I think with the investment many have made, no way those on private land are not going to use the xbow, no matter what,,,,, I believe that
There are now 3 active xbow threads. Come on WI, let's get them all over 500 posts. We can do it!
Just goes to show there is a problem.
ttt - don't let this classic die off when the other current xbow threads are making a comeback. Surely someone has something new to state about xbows that hasn't been ad nauseum.
Happy - go search via google or youtube for "2019 ATA crossbow" or "2019 Shotshow". That should add a few logs to the fire. Crazy stuff coming down the pipline.
OOppps - too late. Tweed added one to the other thread.
No Jake, we will simply report you for breaking the law, then rest easy knowing we have taken a lawbreaking crossbow hunter from the woods.
For $3, one can skew results. A person does not even need to kill an animal to do so anymore. Given how passionate some are on both sides of the xbow argument, I can definitely see $3 being worth it to many. If you have a handful of tags, you can skew it quite a bit. Please note, I am not advocating this approach. I bet it is happening though.
I don’t doubt it happens on both sides. No matter, I think it will be s negligible number. Exactly even, probably not. I think crossbow users would be more prone to do it when they realize it is their season that is being set.
If u know of anyone doing this you should turn them in. I would.
Guess we should alert them that Jake is promoting it.
ttt - Perhaps not allowing the purchase of both tags should be considered.
Happy, that suggestion makes much sense. Having been there when this law was being considered, it was vertical archers looking for something to fallback on if their vertical season was not going so well. They were a minority but vocal, and had the WI Bear Hunters, legislator Mary Czaja (since married and I do not remember her new name) the NRA and manufacturers on their side. It was the height of greed.
Thanks for the insight Mike. It does sound of greed. One would think a person is either a vertical bowhunter or a crossbow hunter. Seeing one can't get 2 sets of tags, making a person choose would surely help with stats. If a person is marked in the system as a bowhunter, they could not claim an xbow kill or vice versa.
I know this is about crossbow vs everything but I see jakes point. In my opinion the gap between stick bow and a 2019 Matthews is incomparable. But yet they share the same season and are commonly lumped together for regulations. If season limits were all based on success rates and other stats shouldn’t the compound have a separate (shorter)season than trad archery equip?
Hopefully for the bigger picture and the good of the sport of hunting, all deer hunters can unite finally after the crossbow season is finalized. So the real fight can be fought with anti crowd.
One can hope
If you crossbow guys would learn to cant your bow when shooting, the compound guys would accept you...:>)
Are you saying the whisker biscuit could bring us all together?
whisker biscuit ? That is what I used to call a girl friend !!
ttt - Keep 'em all going. Which one wins?
From 2011-2013 Wisconsin began to allow rifles state wide during gun season saying they are safer but also knowing rifles are much more effective and have greater range than shotguns. How many of you guys that gun hunt kept using their shotguns because it’s more of a challenge? I will guarantee you that there have been more bucks and large bucks bagged because of state wide rife inclusion than crossbow inclusion. Outrage? Bitching? Pissing and moaning? Why doesn’t anyone bring this up as another thing to fight about?
"From 2011-2013 Wisconsin began to allow rifles state wide during gun season saying they are safer but also knowing rifles are much more effective and have greater range than shotguns. How many of you guys that gun hunt kept using their shotguns because it’s more of a challenge? I will guarantee you that there have been more bucks and large bucks bagged because of state wide rife inclusion than crossbow inclusion. Outrage? Bitching? Pissing and moaning? Why doesn’t anyone bring this up as another thing to fight about?"
Excellent point, after all these years of a superior weapon like a rifle being allowed and so many lazy hunters using it as crutch and killing so many more bucks, I personally haven't heard of any areas that the bucks are nearly extinct which apparently will happen if crossbows continue to have their current season structure. Definitely something to ponder....
Ignorance runs deep here.
What ignorance? Someone has a valid point and now I’m ignorant?
Maybe the 6000 extra bucks killed are due to the higher recovery rate of crossbows. QDMA did a study showing Hunters using crossbows recover 6% more of the deer they shot. A lot of the hunters that switched to crossbows are the ones that should have and didn’t put the time or effort into practice with a vertical. I’m guessing that at least half of the 6000 extra bucks would have been killed in bow season but just wouldn’t have been recovered by lazy bowhunters. I’d rather have deer killed and recovered than wounded, suffering, or rotting.
Ignorance is using extinction as a talking point.
I have to laugh,,, Slicer you are in the state, of the xbow wars,,,,,,,
I was going to say....."who is the wise guy that resuscitated the horse"....lol
I'm going to go ahead and assume Joel Dirtman is a resurrected troll.
Wisconsin is now primarily a crossbow state during archery seasons. Real bow and arrow hunting continues to decline every year. For multiple reasons, (but mainly the crossbow legalization for all) there are far fewer bowhunters left in Wisconsin when compared to 10 years ago. Over 50% fewer by most etimates and recent license sales. The real bowhunting culture is in a serious and non reversible decline, mostly a thing of the past in the Wisconsin and Michigan areas. Join Comptons Archery today.
I knew this post would bring out Missouri,,,,,,, hope your well Missouri
Some hunters still start bow and arrow hunting, but far fewer today than ten years ago. Most are starting to become scoped crossbow hunters. The number of Wisconsin and Michigan real bow and arrow hunter numbers has declined by over 50%. The personal experience and satisfaction for those still willing to bow and arrow hunt..... remains at 100% .
How many here have purchased a scoped crossbow for themselves, or another able bodied immediate family member within the last five years?
Not me... Grandkids all have real bows and can only start bowhunting when they become accurate enough to do so. Oldest (16),will begin this year, and 13 yr grand daughter should be ready next year hopefully. Youngest at 10, just likes to shoot her bow but doesn't want to hunt as of yet. Those are the 3 of 6 that seem interested.
The personal experience and satisfaction for those still willing to bow and arrow hunt..... remains at 100% .
In the big scheme of life and the hobby of hunting, that is all that matters to me. I could care less what my neighbors hunt with. As long as my son and I enjoy our time in the woods, we're golden. So far, the xbow hunters have not killed every deer around where we hunt.
Scoped crossbow hunters will not kill every deer, elk, bear or any other big game animal. We have restrictions on licenses and license drawings to prevent that. As killing becomes easier there will simply be less licenses available to the general hunting public, shorter seasons etc. This has already happened with many species in the form of point creep, limited drawings, quota seasons and fewer available antlerless tags.
In the midwest, since many hunters (despite weapons advancements) claim there will always be enough whitetail deer to go around they should not be complaining about Native American seasons and increasing their available territory to hunt upon. Funny how hunters complain the Natives may ruin hunting opportunity, but the white man has no difficulty making hunting easier and more efficient for them.
It comes down to if your going to be a bowhunter and enjoy archery use a bow. If you do not want to be a bowhunter don't use a bow then to hunt with. It angers a lot of bowhunters, me included, when they tried to say they are the same thing. Not even close.
In the midwest, since many hunters (despite weapons advancements) claim there will always be enough whitetail deer to go around they should not be complaining about Native American seasons and increasing their available territory to hunt upon. Funny how hunters complain the Natives may ruin hunting opportunity, but the white man has no difficulty making hunting easier and more efficient for them.
Please point us to a link where people have complained about Natives and deer hunting. I can't recall seeing one at all. I've seen it with them spearing fish and killing elk but not hunting deer. The thing with the Natives is that they seem to struggle to follow rules. They killed elk before the DNR said go and did it multiple times. They like to kill deer over baited lighted sites at night with rifles while that option is not offered to the non-Natives but that is within their rights on their land.
Poaching is not limited to the Native Americans, nor is it representative of the entire Native population. Unfortunately, there are plenty of poachers in the general population.
By the way, the scoped crossbow is the ultimate and silent after legal shooting hours poaching weapon. One has to wonder how well it works on bait piles about 20 minutes after legal shooting hours,.... anybody know?
Missouri, so you don't have a link where people are complaining about Natives and deer hunting as you eluded to? Does that mean you just made that up for some reason? I still can't tell what that has to do with xbows either.
"As long as it's a legal practice, no one has the right to pass judgement on another, whether you personally agree with the practice or not. (FREE COUNTRY MANY HAVE DIED FOR)."
Actually we do have the right to have an opinion one way or the other. Kind of ironic that you are preaching about freedoms. But only want to silence those that don't agree with you. But that is the liberal way.
Why are we doing this again, the only thing that happens is people get riled up over nothing that they can change
The past Native issues of expanding ceded territory and hunting rights at night was highly controversial and publicized. Please do your own homework if these issues somehow passed you by.
Slicer, your evidently not a bowhunter, and got upset that people were bashing your choice of weapons. It is deeper than weapon choice, it's the matter of classifying a gun in with a bow and then putting it into the same season like it is the same thing.
Sometime big tent theorists gloss over an issue so they can stick it to others. Not all, but there are lots of examples. Ethics are personal, as are opinions. Sportsman have to police themselves. Sometimes that leads to disagreements. Poor policy is poor policy. Call it like it is, or how you feel. But pressure to comform is no different in either direction. It's called debate. Nothing wrong with that.
The past Native issues of expanding ceded territory and hunting rights at night was highly controversial and publicized. Please do your own homework if these issues somehow passed you by.
It wasn't on this site but nice try anyway. Once again, it has ZERO to do with xbows (you know, what this thread is about) so I still don't get what your tact was. BTW, I was the one who mentioned their hunting rights at night so I therefore know all about it but it has nothing to do with xbows.
Missouri. Your perceived issues of Native American hunting has nothing to do with what the thread or ANYBODY here is taking about. Just stick with the sky is falling and the world is ending because of crossbow themes. It’s served you, and all of us, SO well is the past...
"I can shoot a compound at 40 yards just as well as a crossbow at 40, no difference."
Either you are a terrible shot with both, or your full of it. I do see why many are switching to crossbows though. They are much easier. They are cheaper and super easy to set up and maintain. In a way bow manufacturers and archery shops have brought this on themselves. Bow and accessory prices are out of hand. Tuning and set up on a vertical bow can be very intimidating for some. Crossbows are a simple, easy set it and forget it tool for the most part.
Some of you do not understand how "impacts" on harvest does alter opportunity. You talk as if game, especially whitetail deer, are unlimited so technology to increase the ease of killing is fine.... "as long as it is legal" ( which is a really, really dumb statement if you think about it). Similarly, if deer are unlimited and too many anyway, then who cares if the Natives harvest a bunch more? It has been all over this site that Natives should be forced to hunt and fish their old way, with original techniques and weapons, if they want expanding opportunity. Why them, but not the general hunting public?
I am sorry some of you do not have the ability to look at big picture issues and comprehend the hypocrisy. No wonder hunters are viewed by many voters as a non intelligent group, we have earned that reputation.
It has been all over this site that Natives should be forced to hunt and fish their old way, with original techniques and weapons, if they want expanding opportunity.
No it hasn't been all over this site with Natives and hunting. You have yet to provide a single link showing it and that is because you are simply making it up to try to prove some point that has nothing to do with xbows. Your doom and gloom is getting old. It seems to anger you that some people still really enjoy bowhunting and don't see the doom and gloom you preach on a daily basis and across many boards on Bowsite. I guess I should thank my lucky stars every time I see a deer. What I do instead is thank God for the beauty in it all and for allowing me to have great times with my son. Bowhunting is alive and well. I recommend you do a little yourself and enjoy it for what it is.
Well I'm no expert but can't indigenous peoples hunt regular crossbow season if they wanted not sure what your saying makes any sense. They are citizens with equal rights? Unless I missed some memo. Also isn't the DNR biologists and other folks responsible for monitoring the health of whitetail herds (some would argue this point) so really the weapon doesn't matter just overall harvest authorizations. Technically they wouldn't sell more tags than harvest requirements dictate and there has never been a season that I know of where every deer tag in the state has been filled.
To Missouri not you happy
Comprehension is a real problem here. Do your own searches Happy,..... and yes it has been posted on this site that Natives should have to hunt and fish with their old methods. Been stated here multiple times.
Even if it was stated here (I never saw it) can you give me a link to an example? I just want to see the logic of the argument since indigenous people are U.S. citizens
If the voters saw your posts on here Missouri, they would think much worse of us. Do you even hunt?
Slicer, the one good thing that came out of the x-gun thing is that it pushed me back into the traditional group. I got older and went to a recurve and will never go back now.
Yes, when voters read my posts they will be disappointed in hunters. That is unfortunate. But, since what I write is true, where lies the problem?
well after this afternoons news, from the doctor, looks like that is where I am going,,,,,
no complaints, had a good run with the bows,,,,,,,,, need to get a 30 to 40lb limbs for my Hoyt, do not even know if they make them, that low
"What is the best value on a good bow out there?"
If you are talking crossbows. Check out the CamX 330. It's not as "sexy" looking as a 2000.00 overpriced Ravin. But it's well made, quiet for a cb, and light and carries well. I no longer own one but hunted with one all last season. It was pretty nice for a crossbow.
Whatever you find that shoots good and is in your price range Jake +1
Tons of great scoped crossbows out there.
Scoped crossbows keep crossbow hunting growing, they have nothing to do with bow and arrow hunting. Two completely different games, each with their own merit, culture and crowd. Both legal, one far more challenging.
X-bow has it own season that is not in bow hunting except for the decline in bowhunting or shorter season. The xbow is not my brother's keeper just another weapon in the demise of bow hunting nothing more.
Don't buy into what Missouri and slicer are selling, he's the same person and and anti hunter that is trying to drive the wedge between people as deep as possible
Just stop responding. I’m done biting.
Definitely not the same person. MO uses fact and common sense, the dirty one, not so much.
Slicer, I think you need a bigger stick to more thoroughly stir the pot.
I opened this thread expecting an update that the crossbow season was shortened, I should have known that the small group of crossbow haters that reside here simply could not resist talking about them, again, lol. I'm starting to wonder if maybe these so called crossbow haters actually are secretly crossbow lovers and enablers, possibly even crossbow users.
It appears that at least for the upcoming deer hunting seasons that the crossbow season will not be shortened. I imagine a few of you are hating life, knowing that the guy next door might very well be killing your deer with his crossbow instead of being required to kill it with one of those super hard to use compound bows. Life is so not fair :-(
Slicer- I cant find data to support your latest statement. Perhaps you could provide a link to it, please?
Slicer we've all been down this road I'm guessing your the Weinstein poster from 2 gun seasons ago am I right?
(Its like a whose waldo puzzle)
It doesn’t help. That’s your opinion. Can you show me the data that tracks dates and time of kill along with weapon type, please? That would be great to dig through. Common sense would be making a statement like yours above, obviously with facts to validate that statement.
Thanks for your opinion, Slicer. Unfortunately, that’s all you’ve got without facts or logic. You also call this basic math. Please try to explain how anything you spoken about is related to mathematics. At all.
Opinions made without fact and basis only illustrate a person’s ignorance.
What simple math calculations? Please explain. What’s next? The liar liar pants on fire theory? Where are you from again, Slicer?
Bring up ignorance and Jake appears. Any coincidence?? LOL!
Jakey, you hunt with a crossbow, therefore you do not even have any self respect.
Not bad mouthing, just a report . A friend asked me what crossbow should he buy . Hes wealthy & a serious hunter . Been hunting with a Mathews for many years .
We settled on a Ravin for $1800 . I cleaned up the trigger , checked it over , sited it in at 50 yards .
Within an hour he was shooting 6 inch groups at 100 yards. Its very lite & "small " compared to the other Crossbows .
Truth be told it shoots like a rifle with a different kind of bullet, it belongs in gun season .
Ruger x 2
they absolutely belong in gun season is spot on.
Now we will hear from someone saying something about how the trad guys felt when compounds hit the woods. Problem with his statement besides being not true is that Compounds are bows crossbows are not.
Yes Jake I let the crossbows shoot deer for me. 500 yet??
It will be a small circle jerk, Jake and the dirty dirt guy.
Jake, you can't preach inclusiveness and practice divisiveness and expect people to take you seriously.
Users and abusers throughout all walks of life. Jake, do you use the HOV lane when driving by yourself? You park in handicapped spots without being handicapped? You skip lines in the airport without waiting your turn? Claim mileage on your taxes you are not entitled to? People find all kinds of ways to take advantage, just as you do with your crossbow during the archery season. Enjoy it now, it will be shortened.
Michigan is looking at the cross bow now....... One issue is they do not want to lose revenue or hunters, but there is some rumbling, about its use for those 15 and under, and those over the age of 62, or disability, etc........ nothing solid though on it.......
Any move would have to go thru the NRC,,,,,,,,, they are not allowed by anyone, for the late season, in the UP,,,,,,
True bowhunters are sticking together !!!
Like normal you dont know what your talking about. I shoot a recurve and a compound.
Jake you are something else. Probably a nice guy but you are stating things that aren't true and have said things about people without any knowledge of said person or persons including me. We get it, you are passionate about the use of crossbows. You have made some nice works of art with the stocks you made. They are called stocks, correct?
Many have googled your name and seen the accolades you have gotten from fellow crossbow users on their stocks you made.
Dear instigator- please explain betterment of the sport?
And after the word "community" in your pot stirring response you forgot the end parentheses. Something they taught me in class after watching Geoerge Washington cross the river.
Betterment of sport?
Parentheses are in the past or what's in the past?
Dirty boy, I hope you are there also. Before I explain, you the passer or the receiver?
slicer,,,, you are spot on with your statement " we all need to stick together in the archery brotherhood no matter what weapon is chosen. The day will come when all bow types will unite and have great times together."
The Confusion you have is Xguns are not Archery. Just because a weapon ( Xgun )is allowed in the Archery season that doesn't make it or define it as Archery equipment and fall under the Brotherhood of Archery. Unfortunately now days the season name doesn't define the weapon that can be used. Now people want to define and justify their weapon ( xgun ) To fit the season because of their lack of dedication to the TRUE art of Archery and or Bowhunting. All "True Bow types" have come together and understand the mechanics to use a " True Bow ".
Real bow and arrow hunters should stick together. Scoped crossbow hunters are not real bow and arrow hunters and should stick together too.
All hunters should stick together.
"" All hunters should stick together."" I agree but what we have now is the xgun hunters NOT realizing the advantage or not wanting to realize the advantage xguns have vs the length of the season and time of year. We had a good law that allowed every and anyone to use a xgun that wanted to. The more efficient the weapon is the more restrictions you have to have to protect the resource . If that isn't true then run the gun season from sept. to Jan.
We need you agitators to leave.
Jake You Are those xgun hunters NOT realizing the advantage or not wanting to realize the advantage xguns have vs the length of the season and time of year. You have neglected to point out that long bows, stick bows, recurves and compounds ALL have the SAME body mechanics of the shooter to use/shoot them. UNLIKE XGUNS.......Huge Difference. Sorry but your argument that they are the same (Xguns) is like pissing on an electric fence....... It will Bite you,,,,,,
arrow1 waste of time to even acknowledgethese guys.
How many compound or traditional shooters put a stock in their armpits to shoot.
How many crossbow hunters pull back the string with fingers.?
How many compounds or trad guys walk the woods at full draw?
Jake your statement " The hold is with fingers which most compounds today are mechanical releases. The release leaves very little hand shock compared to a stick bow that has in all." Tells me A LOT about your knowledge of vertical bows, Releases have nothing to do with ""Hand Shock""
I tried to stay out of this, but... Jake's tired old diatribe about compound/traditional just pulls me out. Plus I am done working for the day and I'm a little bored. Jake, yes compounds are easier than a trad bow. But there is still a TON more skill involved shooting a compound than a crossbow. There is no way to track this other than talking to people as I have. But 3 different shop owners have told me they have lost count of the guys that are successful with a cb that rarely killed with a bow. The other big one they talk about is success on shots 30-50 yards. Yes Jake we all know it can be done with a compound. But spend a little time at ranges/shoots and watch the average archer that practices little. Knows his/her equipment poorly, and should not shoot over 20 yards. That is a big area that crossbows have an advantage. Add to that the fact that WI seems to be doing nothing about limiting cb speed/technology. It's a cluster that was rammed through because of money.
That all said, I'm done giving a shit what others hunt with. I'm sick of being called a bow snob or elitist. Crossbow hunters whined about inclusiveness. But forced their way into a season that was already very inclusive. But like a bunch of whiny liberals, they said we have to do it our way. The old ways are bad and if that's what you like/ believe in, you are against all hunters. Funny because I don't see any crossbow groups/orgs doing the things that WBH, local archery clubs, P&Y and others do to promote hunting and the outdoors. After the rush of the initial money grab, any org affiliated with crossbows went POOF.
"The release leaves very little hand shock compared to a stick bow that has in all." . . Jake must never shot a Mathews;)
Jake, you will always speak awkwardly when you have no fact or reason behind your opinion.
Jake, did you forget to use your other handle?
You +1 yourself?????
I challenge all real bow hunters on this site to let this thread die and don't fall for the liberal bait anymore
Here i will give Jake props....Jake + 5
waaaaa waaaaaa you old timers need a wambulance!!! jesus who gives a crap what people use to hunt with....try embracing change for once....instead of being so bullheaded/stubborn... Here's to the 2019 CrossBow/Archery season!!!! Less than 2 months away!!!
All good points, however no need to band together with those out to destroy bow and arrow hunting. It is too late to save real bow and arrow hunting by the majority, only a minority will remain bow and arrow hunters.
Sorry dirty one. You march to a different drummer.
"It must be too hot for you old duffers to go outside today"
I'll bite on this one. Although at 47 I don't know if I'm an official old duffer. I worked from 5 AM until noon in this heat today. I decided to knock off early, as the boss I can do that. I also worked 14 hours yesterday and will average 10 hours a day Weds, Thursday. Friday late afternoon - Sunday afternoon I will put in 30+ hours at my weekend job. All this is outside work. So tell me again how it's too hot for us old duffers.
We had traditional only once, bowhunters did not want it any longer. A similar fate came to the primitive muzzleloading season concept.
The season pre compound invention, I hunted personally hunted it.
But.... for the most part there was also no such thing as very limited draws on elk and bear, point creep, quota seasons, and licenses were cheap. Additionally, hunting was not as commercialized and permission widely granted. Everything the compound, inlines and increased hunters brought us was not positive.
Our lost bow and arrow heritage helped fuel the greater evil. The more we hunt with horn porn and mechanical advantage over the game, the more hunters are despised by voters. What would we band together for, to do more of what helped get us here in the first place? Hunters and voters alike should reject horn porn, the extreme commercialization of hunting, and the exploitation of game resources.
But,... calling scoped crossbow hunting, bow hunting, is confusing to voters , kids, wives etc. The biggest fantasy lie ever.
Missouri why do you keep fueling the fire,,,,, xbows have their own forum,,,, give it a rest,,,, you guys are tired
Then to please voters we should eliminate killing with broadheads and slow hemorrhage, have gun seasons only. Is that what you are saying?
And yes.. there are scoped crossbow forums. Why are scoped crossbow shooters on this forum, do they think they are bow and arrow hunters? Do they tell their friends and family they are going out "bow hunting".... when in reality they are shooting a scoped crossbow and not bow and arrow hunting ?
I always thought bowsite was for bow and arrow hunters like me, not scoped crossbow hunters. Maybe it has changed, OR, there is confusion as to what bow hunting really is. I realize the seasons are the same for bow and arrow hunting, and for scoped crossbow hunting, but are the definitions of weapons and hunters the same?
Who here lies to their children, families and friends as to what weapon is used for bow and arrow hunting? Who here are actually bow and arrow hunters as their primary weapon during archery seasons? I am a real bow and arrow hunter, and do not own a scoped crossbow, or compound for that matter. Not against either, just want to avoid confusion as to what a bow and arrow hunter really is. I go by the current P&Y club definition.
There is nothing any of us can do. Real bow and arrow hunting will continue to decline, animals will continue to be exploited, and most game other than diseased whitetails will continue to be harvested on increasingly point creeping limited drawings and quota systems. Much of this due to the very actions of hunters who embrace horn porn and the easy way to a kill.
Hunters should accept responsability for what they helped cause and stop blaming the far left. Many voters of all types are increasingly seeing hunting for what it has become. This will not change, we are beyond the tipping point. In the meantime, I will continue to challenge myself with equipment and keep the memories of what real bow and arrow hunting once was.... and still is for a minority of us.
It is not the manufactures and sponsors who create the market. It is the hunters who desire and purchase the products. Believe me, if hunters stopped buying the goods, the goods will stop being produced. The entire degradation of bow and arrow hunting culture soley rests on the shoulders of former bow and arrow hunters,.... who no longer bow and arrow hunt.
Why do hunters put the kill before the hunt? Why the easy way for able bodied hunters, vs the challenging way? Why horn porn at all costs?
I have no issue with habitat improvement, that benefits many species. Habitat improvement is an area where hunters are giving, rather than simply taking.
It is lazy, lying people like the dirty one who drive the sport down. Based on his never ending blather, I’d venture to guess he/she hunts very little to not at all.
Just an opinion.
You fellas might want to make this a side bar conversation at this point.
Is anyone else curious as to why slicer and Jake keep giving themselves +1s? Is Slicer just Jake on two different accounts forgetting to switch accounts before giving himself a pat on the back?
My guess is they are a couple old guys/invalids/anti's who do not hunt. The time they spend on these pages repeating their baseless drivel certainly points to that. They were fun for the entertainment value but self deprecation, loathing and jealous remarks do get tiring. Like the old Polish jokes, they are old news.
I was wondering the same thing.
Good link Missouribreaks. That should help those that wish to purchase their 1st crossbow or even those that are thinking about upgrading their current crossbow. Reviews on crossbows that are under $500 as well as ones over $2000, and plenty of other info with the links on the right side of the 1st page. Apparently for only a few hundred dollars a guy can get totally set up with everything he needs to enjoy the crossbow deer season, who knew? Again, good link maybe that'll sway some who have been sitting on the fence in regards to joining the ever increasing ranks of crossbow users.
See above for a great entry for dumbest post of the year.
Now we have a strong runner up post from the dirty one.
Nothing is going to happen this year. Why would you say it will? The P4P was a proposal, and only thru the WCC. It has a long way, before it would be implemented, as the process of something going thru, takes a long time,,,,,,,
I hunt SW Wis, one issue I have,, is that I should be shooting bucks, and I would have a 2 buck tag allowance for that area, besides my doe tags
If you look at ol Slicer " Joe Dirt", he has only taken part in threads about crossbows with exception to the dumpster one he started.
Only threads that are hot spots or gives him ability to agitate being contentious in approach.
Ignore.
Pasq, I agree with your opinion as it is based in truth.
Sorry dirty one, you have issues and no, “we” are in nothing together. You keep to your own “circle” of friends.
Archers are sticking together. Just a fact
Stopped at 2 sport shops Monday , 1 for Minnows , 1 for a gun repair . I asked both owners about Bow sales . Got the same answer from both . Crossbows have passed Compounds in sales. 60-40 at 1store & 70-30 at the other . Average age group was 35 to 45 .
Won't be long & Crossbows will out number Vertical bows. As Hunter #'s continue to slide we all need to stick together . I'm throwing in the towel .
Bow and arrow hunting will continue to decline. My prediction on this site several years ago was a no brainer. Hard to believe how many said I was wrong, lol.
Stickbows , and even compounds, will not totally go away. They will remain, but as a shadow of their former prominence. A select few will trudge on as real bow and arrow hunters.
"The kids would rebel yet it can be done." As a die hard crossbow fan, I have to guess you too would rebel about the brakes?
Slicer , 1 shop had 4 . 1 shop had none . Heck I have 7 recurves & stick bows & that # is about to double . Sad .
Scoped crossbow, they can be silently fired and not spook game or let others know when and where you fired the shot.
Loud is a relative term. Are you saying the scoped crossbow is as loud as a shotgun?
