2B January Bow Hunt
New Mexico
With the new youth rifle dates in unit 2B being Nov23- Dec1, I wonder how much it will impact the January bow hunt? I called the G&F and asked why the dates were moved so close to the rutand shared my concern about 150 rifle tags & was told the surveys showed nearly 40 bucks to every 100 doe.I have a few friends who have drawn it last few years( I can't seem to draw that one) and say they do see deer but 40 buck to 100 doe doesn't at all seem accurate , but then again they are on the ground and not in an airplane or helicopter ...I'm afraid this late rifle hunt with that many tags is going to seriously impact the archery hunt in a bad bad way..What do you all think?
I really don’t see how it’s going to affect the bowhunt. Are you concerned about 150 trophy bucks being killed? I highly doubt 150 people will kill a trophy buck. If anything, some decent bucks will be shot and a handful of trophy quality. I know it’s more in the rut but people will be picky and then shoot a small buck in the end anyways. Most of the deer rifle hunts are pretty dang early, especially the 2a and 2b youth. I’m at least glad they moved that one for the kids. They need a good chance at a decent buck to keep them encouraged at a young age. I see lots of dads and their kids come in with a small 2 point they finally found on the last day of a tough early season hunt. They are so discouraged and a lot have told me how they won’t even bother with the youth hunt again. I actually wish they would move the January hunt to Dec1-15 and the last rifle hunt during Thanksgiving.
Remember everyone, the only thing that will allow you the chance to hunt in 10 or 15 years from now will be youth hunters keeping an interest in it.
A kid can go camping anytime. A kid can go for a ride in the mountains or hike around anytime. A kid can't go out all the time to hunt and shoot an animal and be excited for next year.
I applaud NM on this one. That Oct 2B youth deer hunt is a tough one and at a way wrong time of the year.
Another reason hunting is not "any time" is that for many kids, going to school is like a job and hunting is recreation. I applaud the Thanksgiving Day weekend hunts. At least we can get 4 days hunting with out teaching my kid that school is optional (if he draws, eh?).
Some excellent points guys...I agree the youth should have a great chance while in the field and best point I hadn't realized is our future really does depend with our youth to fight to continue our privileges.
I'm all for giving youth more opportunities but this will destroy the trophy quality in these units. You simply can't have 150 rifle tags during the rut. It will be a massacre. In a couple of years you will agree with me. This was a terrible decision.
Kids don't need a chance at a good buck. They just need a chance at a buck.
I will not apply for a unit 2A or 2B January tag. It will be a complete waste of time.
Explain to me why a kid does not need a chance at a good buck but adults do?
Of course with our new state leadership, it may be a moot point to worry about quality hunting in the future...
Nathan you are missing the entire point here. No one should be rifle hunting mule deer in the rut. Give them 150 more tags in early November if they need more opportunities. This will be a premier trophy hunt (for one year anyway) and they are giving way too many tags. If it were 15-20 tags I would probably let it go but this will ruin this area as a trophy buck unit. Have you not driven around out there the last week of November? Mule deer are too stupid to be hunted during the rut.
You are right about our state leadership. We're just screwed.
Slightly off topic, but related. IMO youth don't need to have premier tags set aside for them: deer during the rut, bighorn, ibex, etc. If they want to hunt trophies, apply for trophy tags like everyone else.
Youth need to have opportunities to hunt: doe deer (where population allows, admittedly few areas like that in NM), cow elk, F/IM ibex, bighorn ewe, doe pronghorn. Vast majority of kids are thrilled (understandably so) to kill any animal; they don't need the pressure associated with trophy hunts. Unless they are the few that truly are trophy hunters, in which case apply for trophy tags like the rest of us.
All too often IMO it's the dad that puts youth in for trophy tags and the kid could care less that they kill a bighorn ram or whatever.
+1 for smarba's comment. My kid just want's to shoot something besides range targets.
So does mine Bill, and she would've shot a doe quick fast and in a hurry last year on the youth hunt in Oct if it weren't so taboo. My daughter actually asked "how am I supposed to continue to like hunting if I can't at least have a good chance at a buck?" Mind you, this a 13 year old speaking and she gets it. You don't go out in the hills with a tag and weapon in hand to look at fall colors and woodpeckers.
No, Jim, I have not missed the point. I get it that the Jan bowhunts will likely be more difficult but the statement made that a youth did not need to shoot a good deer indicated they didn't have the right to shoot a good deer, I simply asked why. As I stated in my post on that other forum, I don't agree with the 150 tags. But I also know the egos of dad's and uncle's will prevent every mature deer from being shot, which means average 3 points and up. The reason mule deer bucks are so stupid in the rut is because they are not hunted during the rut. The real impact will be the remaining two points and basket head 2x3's after the 3rd rifle hunt is over that will surface it's ugly head in 3 or 4 more years.
Carl, the reason there are special youth hunts is because most youths do not have the opportunity or ability to ditch a week or so of school and a lot don't have the experience or stamina to compete with an adult. If you don't believe me, take a youth hunting. As long as we are stating our opinions, in mine, I am really not interested if an adult, and probably accomplished, hunter, thinks it's unfair to give a 12 year an additional and special opportunity and compete with like peers.
My preference would've been to give, as Jim stated, 20 tags or so, and make a few doe hunts availabe earlier on for the kids who want to shoot just any deer...
HDE: I'm NOT saying that there shouldn't be special youth hunts to help kids juggle school, etc. My daughter is an avid hunter and it's tough to fit in hunts I get it. I've taken her out since she was 9, some youth, some "adult" tags. I get that taking kids hunting is a lot different than an adult. IMO balancing school is the hardest part.
But I'm saying I personally don't think that there should be so many "trophy" tags allocated for youth. Kids need to get outdoors and be thrilled to kill a forky, a doe, whatever. Not draw a bighorn tag or ibex tag because their dad wants to hunt vicariously (and in some cases illegally pull the trigger - I know it happens) and be subject to pressure to kill a once-in-a-lifetime animal on perhaps their first big game hunt.
The majority of youth tags are geared toward "trophy" animals or "rut" seasons. Thus the odds of drawing youth tags are often lower than for regular hunts. If the point is to encourage kids to hunt, I'd rather see more doe/cow/similar hunts for youth that will be easier to draw so kids get a chance to hunt every year rather than have youth hunts that are so hard to draw the kid might never draw one of them. If we're going to get kids involved and interested in hunting they need to be able to get tags often when they are starting out.
Most youth hunts coincide with the regular hunts, a few do not, or are sandwiched in between the regular hunts.
Up until now, there were a handful of youth deer hunts at primo times. As hard as it is to draw a tag these days, it is disappointing for a youth hunter to finally pull a deer tag only to have it during a rifle bull hunt, and a muzzleloader elk and deer hunt a week before it.
Allowing a youth hunter to have a quality hunt/tag should not be an issue and really nothing to be jealous of. The real issue is all the hype of this damn idiotic trophy hunting flat-brim-Insta-hero hunter crap that has plagued the hunting world. Or the stupidity we will face in the Roundhouse for the next 3-1/2 years.
I would love for a youth hunter to have an ES deer tag in Oct, but that would only usher in a whole new arguement and the Extinction Level Event for NM mule deer...
If anyone should get quality hunts I believe the youth then senior citizens along with our disabled veterans. The rest of the strong need to hunt hard and quite complaining about the kids getting their quality hunts. Most youth will shoot the 1st buck in their sights on this 2b or any other hunt. Doubt there will be more than 10-15 trophy class bucks harvested on this youth hunt each yr. Youth are not going to decimate the 2b deer. Glad to see youth getting put first and being a priority in our NM hunting for a change. Would rather see a few kids pics every yr with nice bucks above the grown men for sure.
They did the same thing in the unit I hunt several years back. Did not affect the bow hunt. Originally I thought the same thing as the op on this thread. Drought and overgrazing has affected the big buck population more than a few youth hunters ever could......
