Xguns and Pronghorn
Kansas
The other thread got me to thinking again about how the state screwed us on the Xgun introduction. We were told verbatim that there would be a trial period, and then an "assessment" would be done on their affects . I believe it was to be a 2yr trial, but I may be off with that? Instead we got them shoved down our throats, full inclusion, by the Legislature within a couple months and the "trial period" magically disappeared.
All of us, who were involved with fighting against full inclusion, remember the bogus "bucket list" story that was spewed at each Commission meeting by the father of the Tenpoint Marketing rep. Many of us spoke at the meetings, and many more sent correspondence regarding our thoughts and concerns...but the "big money", and Tenpoint backed by the NRA, eventually won the battle.
So, we have very limited data on how Xguns have affected our deer population, since we have virtually no reporting system in place. However, we do have some data to consider on how they have affected the Pronghorn harvests. We have a great Biologist that's in charge of gathering information on Predators and Pronghorn in the KDWP. The link will take you to past harvest studies, and these two diagrams will show plainly the widening gap, and higher success rates these "gunners" are having on the Pronghorn herd.
Granted, Pronghorn and Deer are quite different animals, and we have a VERY small herd of Pronghorn statewide...Just thought some would find it eye opening.
Very concerning. You can bet that for every one of those pronghorn reported as killed with a cross gun there's at least one that was wounded and maybe never recovered by 70+ yard shots.
Just got word on a new Crossbow that shoots at 525 fps with a pretty heavy bolt. Trust me when I say a 150 yard shot will not be out of the norm soon. I don't even dislike crossbows they are very cool tool for killing. I hope though harvest data and hunt pressure will be considered in the future.
I don't dislike the device Matt, they don't belong in archery season.
Ravin's base model shoots out to 100 yards.
The first year they allowed crossguns for antelope I pointed out the huge success rate of crossguns to KDwPT. They said it was just a fluke due to small numbers. OF COURSE it was small numbers, archery antelope IS small numbers.
There Kyle that better. I’m not going to argue.
Don't take this the wrong way Todd but you have zero idea of what we've fought against or for, here in KS, nor do you understand how this all went down. Have you or any of the other NR's ever been to a commission meeting, or even sent correspondence to any legislator in KS?
Pretty sure I know the answer, yet you and others have no issues telling us how it oughta be? You spend maybe 15 days in this state, others spend much less. Don't try to tell anyone here what's good, what we should accept, or how we should act please.
P.S. Dave they ain't "Antelope"
Sito, Absolutely agree with you on that. Time will tell.
Quinn - you have data for that? What about compound shooters who wound animals? Seems to me crossbows would lower loss rates. Hey, they are like shooting a gun.
Much bigger advantage out in the wide-open spaces than sitting in a stand.
So much easier to get a shot off not having to turn and draw a vertical bow.
Need to remember a lot of what WP did was to cut off a crossbow bill in the legislature...pushed by the “bucket list” dude with the son who worked for 10 point.
Someone at the final commission meeting on legalization asked they not be allowed for mule deer and prongalope. :-)
They are antelope. With that said, I'm very saddened that crossbows are allowed in archery season on antelope. I'm very new to hunting them, but from what I've seen it would be a HUGE advantage. We would have killed one with a crossbow this year, but had to let a buck walk because they wouldn't let us get inside of 50. With 2 guys, a decoy, and a crossbow I'm surprised the success rate isn't 40%+. I'm also surprised it's 10-20% for non-crossbow archery. It's hard.
I assume you call soccer "football" and football "american football", as well?
I don't care about either of those
ha I've always wondered why it bothered you so much when someone chooses to call them antelope instead of pronghorn antelope or pronghorn. "It is often known colloquially in North America as the American antelope, prong buck, pronghorn antelope, prairie antelope, or simply antelope." You are passionate about people calling it "pronghorn". When you tell people you are going pronghorn hunting do they know what you're talking about? Do they ask you if you caught any?
lol you're right, they often have no idea what I'm saying...par for the course bud
They ain't buffalo properly called but if someone calls them buffalo you know exactly what they mean. Racoon is proper but if someone calls them coons you know what they mean. They are opposum but if some one calls them possum you know what they mean. They are crafish but if someone called them crawdads you know what they mean.
and a "shooter" ain't 4.5 right ;)
I'll through another one out there...it's Canada goose or geese...not Canadian goose or geese. They do not carry a Canadian passport when flying over the border.
Now you know why biologists talk in scientific names (latin). "Antilocapra americana" is Antilocapra americana no matter where you are in the world or what language you speak. Try telling someone at the bar you are going Antilocapra americana hunting lol. Watch their eyes cross.
If it ain't at least 4 and 13 sixteenth just let it walk so you won't be embarrassed by shrinkage.
I always correct folks on that one too Ryan! Essentially I'm a prick and that's not "shrinking" as I age :?)
Depends, Kyle on....
...oh heck, I'm staying out of this one.
Depends, Kyle on....
...oh heck, I'm staying out of this one.
Minimal Impact? KDWP&T website might be in need of a re-write soon?
Minimal Impact? KDWP&T website might be in need of a re-write soon?
Directly from the 2019 Pronghorn Harvest Report dated Jan 2020
Directly from the 2019 Pronghorn Harvest Report dated Jan 2020
Quinn & Mike... here is some perspective on 2019 archery wound rate....unfortunately “archery” as a whole and doesn’t provide how many were attributed to crossguns.
Quinn & Mike... here is some perspective on 2019 archery wound rate....unfortunately “archery” as a whole and doesn’t provide how many were attributed to crossguns.
If crossgun permit holder #’s keep increasing as well as their success rate %....then KDWP&T’s view on impact of archery being “minimal” may change and their view of over-counter R or NR archery tag sales as well.
Do you see where this could be potentially be heading in the not to distant future....can you say Archery Pronghorn “Draw”? Then we’d be hunting them rascals only every other or couple of years instead of every year like we can now.
Makes you go Huh, don’t it?
Not sure we should be hunting them here every year as few as there are compared to a few states west of us.
Thorton.....yeah go ahead and say that to every NW KS farmer/rancher you meet if your out there next year deer hunting. Hope you don’t come back home with a loose lung or walking with a limp?
Not sure why that would happen but your statement jives with what I've heard of ranchers poaching them in the Flint Hills. Not to mention, they used to be found all over the state, now it's just a few counties. It's a stupid mindset. They go under fences and will often use the same crossings for years. They don't cause near the damage of deer or elk.
painful words - Kyle is correct
