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Ohio has been doing put and take pheasants for almost as long as I can remember. As a youngster, I have memories of a few actual wild pheasants. Seems there are little to none of these left here anymore as are quail, very sparsely populated. I Think with the influx of coyote and red tail hawk, these birds don't have a chance of ever coming back to what it once was.
Until recently I haven't given it much thought, but it seems that the money, time, and resources that go into the odnr raising and releasing all these birds, could go into restoring them as they once were. Not to mention the last time I went out to partake in opening day festivities, there was 42 cars parked in the 12 car parking lot. which translated into about 80 people and 36 dogs in 3 adjoining fields all trying to flush the 6 birds that were released the day before. Its downright craziness.
What is your thoughts concerning the plight of the pheasant/quail in Ohio?
My thoughts are ; 1..put a moratorium in place until a hunt-able population is established. 2.. make it a lottery system just like beaver trapping is now 3.. open a season on red tail hawks for two years , we have enough of them.
I know technically the pheasant is a "non native" species here. However, I've enjoyed their presence , as I'm sure many of you have as well .
It's a habitat issue that is more expensive to resolve than pen raising birds every year
The practice of clean farming will prevent the pheasant and quail populations from ever returning to the golden days to which you are referring.
Not much corn stubble anymore or corn shocks.and as was stated,lots more predators.
Not much corn stubble anymore or corn shocks.and as was stated,lots more predators.
Yep habitat issue. I killed the last wild bird that I will likely hunt in my lifetime about 15 years ago in Ashtabula.
Yeah agree, it's all about habitat...
When a young man, raised a dozen day old pheasant chicks one time until they out grew my coup and gave them to a friend who ended up releasing most of them, but have only seen maybe a few true wild ones through the years, probably less than ten... My uncle in Guernsey County had a wild hen nest in his garden and hatch a clutch one year, but that was probably 30 years ago... With family and friends we used to shoot preserve birds annually but the only true wild one I ever killed was in Geauga County, ironically Rickm near Ashtabula county line about 25 years ago...
Dad told me there used to be Reeves pheasants around, but I don't remember them...
I miss the call of the Bobwhite before the winters of 77-78, but really miss grouse hunting after bow season in February... Was nothing to get 20 or more flushes a day, but I haven't seen a grouse in years... I know, I know, grouse 10 year cycle, but they haven't cycled back up here since turkeys moved in...
Bought a small chicken coup from TSC a few years ago to try and do the Johnny house thing to try and raise some Bobwhites to release around the house so I can hear them, but have yet to unbox the coup, it's still on my to-do list... They probable won't last long with all the neighborhood cats around, but was an idea... Researched it a little, and from what I understand ya need wild strain birds from Kansas, Nebraska, or the Dakotas, but most pen raised mail order chicks aren't hardy enough to survive Ohio winters...
Anybody had any luck trying to raise Bobwhites?
Used to be a pheasant place outside of Darbydale years ago,I'm thinking you could hunt there and they raised them there.think it was called rambling acres.this was maybe 50 years ago.
Z, I have not seen a grouse or woodcock in NE Ohio in years. Used too hunt them mid day when I was bow hunting in the Middlefield area years ago and could count on enough flushes to actually hit some! Grouse are still doing well around our place in Forest county Pa. Not so much in Lake and Geauga Ohio.
I see woodcock around here Northern OH. quite often. They always do they're mating flights in the spring (fun to watch and listen to).and then I see them come through in the fall migrating south.
The game clubs around here release pheasants every year around here (put and take releases) and it's surprising how many you can hear cackling during turkey season looking for a mate they'll never find. I always wondered if they released hens also if any would make it and reproduce successfully.
I'm with Zbone about the Bobwhites calling. Used to watch my mom years ago call coveys almost to the back door with her whistling. I tilt my head like a dog listening whenever I think I hear one now ;-)
Btnbuck - usually it's better if you have a wild hen with a stocked bird as often pen reared hens do not sit on their eggs as they are taken from them and incubated in captivity. But, it does happen, so, would be interesting to have some hens out in the spring with at least 1 rooster
I have not seen a wild pheasant in about 25 years. Quail maybe 3 or 4 times. Grouse have become scare - it has been decades. I am not out in the woods as often. Woodcock 20 or so years. I really wish all were doing better.
Woodcock are migratory, but was looking over the new game law proposals and see no changes for next small game seasons, but like others have also mentioned when's the last time you've seen or heard a grouse? As mentioned above, used to luv hunting them in February after bow season in which was the longest season of all small game running from first Saturday of October through the last day of February with a bag limit of three if I remember correctly... Would flush them and hear them drumming all the time during bowseason too...
A few years ago they shortened grouse season to the last day of January and this season to January 1st with a bag limit of one... Personally think they oughta shorten grouse season maybe to the month of October to give them a chance to rebound... Once rabbit season comes in first week of November, grouse should be off limits... I know a few grouse get shot while rabbit hunting cause have done it, and boy it sure was frustrating to jump a rabbit during February while grouse hunting and not be allowed to shoot it...8^) Those woods rabbits were big too...8^)
I too used to enjoy February grouse hunting. We used to hunt down around Woodsfield in Monroe County. I also had a place in Meigs County that held a few grouse. I can remember hearing them drum while spring turkey hunting. ODOW likes to blame it on aging habitat but I think it's deeper than that. There still seems to be clear cutting going on and that leads to forest regeneration. Some guys blame the growth in the turkey population but southern Ohio has always had turkeys. Even then the grouse cycle would reach its high end. I've always thought West Nile Virus maybe has something to do with the low grouse population.
"Some guys blame the growth in the turkey population but southern Ohio has always had turkeys."
Have to be more specific Old Reb, what counties had turkeys prior to the 1980s? I never seen a wild turkey until they were reintroduced around the late 70's in SW Ohio... When turkeys started to reestablish during the 80s and 90s grouse populations declined and have never recovered in my areas... Had a old time grouse and upland bird hunter tell me as turkeys scratch along through the woods feeding, they destroy nests as they come across them... I tend to agree with him...
I definitely do not qualify as an old time grouse hunter but I can remember kicking up flocks of turkeys in the same areas that held grouse in tha Woodsfield area. This was during that 80's and 90's even into the early 2000's. I will try to find if any studies have been done linking the rise in turkey populations to the decline in grouse populations. It may take me a few days.
Zbone, The initial wild turkey restoration program began in 1956 and ended in 1971. Turkeys from other states were trapped and then released in mainly S.E Ohio. In 1972 17 counties had significant turkey populations. Those counties were Jefferson, Monroe, Washington, Morgan, Perry, Hocking, Athens, Meigs, Vinton, Gallia, Jackson, Ross, Highland, Pike, Lawrence, Scioto, and Adams. The first spring season was held in 1966. Two of these counties, Monroe and Meigs is where I hunted grouse into the early 2000's. It's my opinion that if turkeys were the cause of the demise of grouse populations, it would have taken lass than 35 yrs. I hunted turkeys and grouse on the same land in Meigs county from 1996 to 2008. In the last few years of hunting there, grouse were no longer being seen or heard drumming in the spring. This is from my personal experience. I tried to provide a link to a grouse study conducted in West Virginia but I couldn't attach it to this post. You should be able to see it by Googling www.michigan-sportsman.com>threads>page-2 turkeys and grouse. Scroll down to thread #25 and click on the link in the thread. I could find no mention of wild turkeys negatively impacting grouse populations in the study. I didn't even see turkeys mentioned at all. Also Google Pennsylvania Game Commission study of West Nile Virus in ruffed grouse. It very well may be that the rise in the turkey population and the decline in grouse populations is just a coincidence.
When I was a teenager in the late 80s, most all the farms around here were in CRP and we had a good number of pheasants. Seen a few quail over the years but not many. As the ground was put back into ag ground the numbers started going down . In 2000 i got permission to hunt the last piece of CRP in the area , 150acres. It was absolutely loaded with pheasants. I had a stand in the only fencerow on the property and i would get sick of listening to them. I would see 20-30 flying and hear probably triple that. I could have shot at multiple birds as they walked the edge every time I hunted but the lady who owns it would never let me kill any. They slowly disappeared over the years. 5 years ago the farm went to ag except for a 15 acre piece . This was the first year since I have hunted it that I did not see a pheasant while hunting. I did get 2 pics on trail cams though, 1 cock and 1 hen.
The Big blow of 1977/78 was the beginning of the end for quail/ pheasant. They "could have" made a comeback , but ...farming practices of clean every fence row , kill every weed and insect took away everything these birds need to live .The Bobwhite "is" native and natural to Ohio. It has history and evolution with coyotes/hawks/mink/weasel/fox and has a working plan of survival with them.(lives in thick brushy terrain =hard to catch;) Feral cats are a greater threat in numbers and balance than any natural predator....Fact...... Man and his ways is to blame as is the case world wide in the Big picture.
Pheasant ...are a non native species . The same pertains to their demise . Its not the natural predators .Its 100% habitat destruction coupled with the poisoning of needed plant and insects to survive , flourish , LIVE.
Stop trying to eradicate/ extinguish every competitive predator to human fix a human wrong. Its not the wolves, Coyote ,Fox , Mink , Hawks , Owls that have caused the extinctions. One only needs a mirror to see the cause.
That big storm of 77 wiped out all the birds around Hartville where i grew up. Befor ethat we could count on 4-5 flushes when bunny hunting. Sad. The lack of Grouse bothers me more tho. Was thinking clear cut timbering would probably help them but i'm no biologist. What is the exact best habitat for Grouse?
Grouse, Though found in dense wood, "need" New / young forest growth areas with brushy clearings mixed in to do best .Most strongholds in Ohio for grouse are the more natural woodlots of the SW in the Wayne area .Last I was that way hunting on a friends place in the 90's , they had a good population on grouse. Never hunted them , but often seen them while bowhunting whitetail .I'm sure even that area isn't doing well for grouse these days .
When I was a kid we had wild birds everywhere. Wood county was a world reknown pheasant destination. Modern farming practices, hedge row removal and cutting hay at night wiped our pheasants out. I've heard stories of entire broods being baled into the hay as the hen wouldn't desert her chicks. We may still have some in extreme NW Ohio but it's been a long time since I've seen or heard one.
Well Mace ,
sadly many of the farming practices you mention are now the norm . Gone the mindset of the old days with each passing generation the gap of caring is lost ...lengthened ...A distancing if you will. Caring if pheasant , quail , deer , trees , wild natural things have a place . To remove all nature other than the fertile soil they through life and death have helped produce.........Taint the soil . air , water ....Poison , remove , kill everything that they perceive or have been trained /taught to be the enemy !
Gone are those that cared , but the few......the very few. Not a bash on farmers ....just acknowledging the facts . Mindset of many that hold /control what remains of our wild places . The futures wild places & things . Each of us are just passing through. Do we have a right to taint what we leave for the next generations ?
............these are human ways......human ways come with a price , that we all will pay. sadly it didn't have to be................
