Fat lady has sung
Wisconsin
Contributors to this thread:
Northern forest harvest data
Vertical buck kills-300 Crossbow buck kills-800
I guess she has. If these numbers are accurate there are even more closet scoped crossbow users than I have guessed. Bow and arrow hunting is clearly on a serious decline in Wisconsin. I wonder if the P&Y entries have been effected?
In the North? It looks more like gun season than archery season when you see people going in to hunt now. A lot of those bucks are shot easily with an Xgun before others even get a shot at hunting them. I truly love the big northwoods hunting, but as far as deer management, hunting practices by the locals, night shooting, Wolves that Liberalmindset wants more of, it is a joke.
X2 L2H. I see alot of crossbow users in the bigwoods and I agree with everything else. More wolves on the landscape? Doesn't make sense but feelings over matter is their agenda.
I just looked outside and the sky is definitely falling.
Way too early in the season and way too many factors for those numbers to tell a story. Yet...
Looks like the scoped crossbows are NOT too heavy and bulky after all. They must be zinging those bolts right between the forest of trees and taking the big bucks down.
Just think of we included crossbows minus the scope, Misery. Hell would definitely freeze over!
Ya, the scope and being fully cocked has been a serious game changer. I do not consider deer killed in such a manner as much of an archery trophy, way too easy.
Reggie, those who quit bowhunting would just be standing there in wonderment trying to figure out what the hell to do!!!
The shot is definitely easy, it’s the seeing a deer in the big woods of northern Wisconsin to shoot that is hard.
I dont see how shooting a crossbow to be fun as someone noted in another thread. The time to load in between arrows is way too slow. People who shoot them do it for the ease of a kill. Thats just what this new age has come to.
Will they kill all the bucks? No.. imo most of them are killing 1 or 2 year olds if they even kill at all. I havent seen a decline in mature bucks over the years. They still have to work hard and they have to put themselves in the game.
Now there are scoped, unscoped, fully cocked...if we go down the road of partially cocked, we might as well declare this a modern day Jonestown, and get the kool aide ready!
Reggie, why must we wait until later in the season? Aren’t registration numbers from any point in time a snapshot of what has occurred up to that point? Will real bow hunters hit the woods in larger numbers later in the season? Will crossbow users stop going to the woods as it gets colder?
In my opinion, Capt, that’s exactly some of the factors involved. There’s an entire slug of people that won’t step in the woods until mid October and after. And yes, the snapshot gives numbers to what has occurred. But we need the snapshots of the previous years and kill totals by Oct 5th to be able to even begin to read the numbers properly. Again, just how I see it. Hope everyone is out enjoying nature. The wind just shifted, so my game plan is crap today!
It doesn't matter how lopsided those numbers get, nothing will be done. Manufacturers love it. The state loves it because they say there's to many deer.. Make believe bow hunters love it. Vertical bowhunters are a minority and will continue to dwindle. What's the argument here? For those clinging to the idea that crossbow season is going to be shortened... I'm curious...who's going to support this? What group besides the vertical bow minority? I wouldn't look to gun hunters for support. Lots of gun hunters switched. Do you blame them? Hunt a 4 month gun season, versus a nine day gun season? I'm still convinced the underlying plan all along was to blur the lines so they could create 1 generic season for all weapons. Now might be a good time to get in the blaze orange clothing business...
Total 3600 crossbow, 2400 youth gun season and 2100 vertical kills ( which under 100 are probably with a real bow)
Almost 70% of buck harvest so far statewide has been with a gun.
Might as well open it up to any weapon, she’s over.
Of course the margin will narrow, crossbow guys have there tags filled already
Whitetail deer are over objective in many areas, and the overall harvest is mostly regulated by licenses issued. Other than I think crossbows should be in the gun season and not archery, there is no scientific reason I know of to alter the crossbow season from what it currently is. Bow and arrow hunters pissed away their exclusive season, and in fact the majority quit bow and arrow hunting and took up the scoped crossbow. I do not see a reason to change that. Why cater to the minority, this is not wokeness or BLM?
What morons thought the concurrent seasons was ok, what stupidity
Indeed, to everyone else there is absolutely no reason to go back to the previous season structure other than to make us actual archers happy. We are a shrinking minority and there is less than no chance of that happening. Sad but true. Do not however, try to convince me that my hunting is not impacted by the crossbow. It is clear more deer are being killed with far less effort, and that absolutely impacts the quality of my personal hunting experience. Unfortunately that’s the way everyone wants it but us archers. I’m glad some continue to fight for it, but it’s a lost cause IMO. I’ll advocate for it in conversations but won’t waste time on it beyond that.
You have to blame the bowhunters themselves. They flocked to the stores and purchased the scoped and cocked to replace the unscoped and uncocked. The former bow hunters brought this on, and that is how they pissed away their very own season.
It all started with compounds years ago.
And we are still to dumb to this day, most scoff at an early youth archery hunt but praise a youth early gun hunt, we teach them young that easy is better. Can’t make this stuff up.
There is little sense to anything these days, especially common sense.
Well I'll be, apparently there are a good number of deer in the northern forest here I thought the wolves ate them all.
As far as shortening the crossbow season? lol never gonna happen and it was never gonna happen from day one no matter how much smoke was blown up your rear-ends about the "separate" season. Finally most of you are starting to get it, at least it didn't take a full 10 years to figure it out. The only thing I see possibly changing is combining the crossbow season with the archery season as it is serving no useful purpose having it separate. As pointless as having rifle deer season separate from shotgun deer season or handgun deer season.
Agree, may as well have one season, one license, fill your tag how you choose.
Yep, one season on its way.
Money grubber Walker to thank for it, he’d sell his own mother for a dollar.
Lol spit Same thing was said when compounds came out, and trail cams, and food plots, and sights, and range finders, and redneck condos, and ozonics, and releases, and tree stands, and list list goes on and on, almost as long as snuggle bunnies man bun.
The numbers suggest that the crossbow users are shooting at everything that walks by. Considering it is only Oct 13 and the numbers it's likely these bucks were the first thing to walk by . Some of the other technology mentioned above doesn't seem to make a hunter shoot at the first deer to walk by .
Alwaysright's Link
Some of you have asked where to find the data
Here’s the link
Gritty/Slicer/Neverbait/Pocahontas/Alwaysright/et al, I'm confused. You started a thread on crossbows saying you were looking to buy one and wanted advice. Then you started a thread saying you took an 83 yard shot at a deer on opening day with your xbow and tracked it 600 yards and lost it. Now, you are bashing xbows. Right above you called youths with guns lazy. Can it be that your posts were complete bullshit and you are just back here for like the 20th time under the 20th different name just to antagonize?
Everyone needs to remember that Gritty/Slicer/Neverbait/Pocahontas/Alwaysright/et al is a hunting violator busted for the same crime as Kulas but at a much larger scale. He's a liberal who has always gone on anti-Walker rants and is simply pretending to be a conservative. Know what is worse than xbows? Violators, especially liberal ones, and Gritty will always be one.
"As far as shortening the crossbow season? lol never gonna happen and it was never gonna happen from day one no matter how much smoke was blown up your rear-ends about the "separate" season."
.
When crossbows were pushed, there was no stopping their use in WI. The reason for the separate season was we knew exactly what would happen and you are seeing it now. We looked at other states data with inclusion of crossbow and it took the same amount of time for the xbows buck harvest to eclipse bow and approach gun. It will only grow until the 300K in orange have enough of it. With full inclusion, archery season would be shortened. By separating them, it allows the opportunity to shorten one and not the other. The resource(bucks) were/are managed by success rates and the reason the archery season was so long was the length allowed for archery success rate to be close to the gun.
Your comment of "never gonna happen" may or may not be true. But there is a reason they are now pushing for full inclusion and it isn't because of $$$ or commonsense. Numbers are don't lie and they will have a negative affect on the resource and hunter retention. It's not based on a guess but on previous states experiences. So yeah, the people who understand this and support xbows are concerned. Hence, the attempt to change the law.
Boomer, nice explanation.
Self-proclaimed hunterrrr, you are clearly not a bow hunter.
HappyGoLucky is right about Always. It really isn't hard to see the similarities when someone has been here for years.
I still do not understand why people give this TROLL a time of day?
Missouri does and if I had a dollar for everytime he said the same thing over and over like a broken record. I could pay Pat to clean this place up.
Unhappy knows Jack
Just because you think your queen, you talk a lot, but most here have forgotten more than you know about hunting.
Just sayin.
You sound upset violator Gritty. Nothing worse than an anti-hunting violating liberal who's been booted from here like a dozen times and is only here to cause a stink. I'll Iet you get back to your xbow discussion which has proven that you are quite the liar too. BTW, how's the pumpkin patch this year? Oops, my bad. It wasn't a patch. It was a truck full.
I view the crossbow pressure and the weapon's increased efficacy as a challenge. If I can kill a respectable buck with my bow on local public land, then the crossbow and its associated issues are just another obstacle that I have overcome. Whatever future issues that arise are just future challenges that I will address when they come into being.
Happy Did you get permission to respond, you know you are not allowed to stray from the flock??
Happy he is upset. Called him out on his lonely ways. I feel bad for him. Has to pretend to be someone different everytime. Only a pathetic person will find pleasure in this
I have to repeat myself. I have been right for many years, but some are too dense to understand if I only say it ten times. I am assuming some the densities have had babies so I have to keep repeating over and over so the offspring get it too.
Gritty ended his comment as he often did in the past. Many of his comments ended up with the phrase “ just sayin.” Happy is spot on.
I once defended the hunting community in conversations with folks that said hunters were a bunch of uneducated idiots, today I can see why that perception is very accurate
Unfortunately you are right on that one.
I wouldn’t classify hunters as idiots. Only the right wing radicals like capmike would fall under that classification.
Lib, I am very glad to know that I am nothing like you.
Putting the arrow through the boiler room is such a small fraction of (public land) hunting. You scout, set up stands, shoot, track, drag, skin, butcher and then eat the animal.
I have taken exactly one buck with a crossbow. I love having it as an option. I shoot a few arrows every day before I go out, and sometimes they just aren't flying the way I'd like. Usually when its 15 degrees out and late season and I'm up in a climber.
So I grab the crossbow and enjoy my day on the stand with confidence. No shame. Does it make my hunt easier? Absolutely. Is it bow-hunting? No. It's crossbow hunting.
My buddy in Oneida hunts with a compound. He also has 40 acres and his wife's parent's own the 40 next to him. He has a food plot and dozed trails thru the woods to the plot. Next to the plot is a permanent wooden blind. He arrows a really nice buck from there every year with very minimal effort. Is that "hunting"? Not to me, personally. But I don't hate on him at all or say he has no right to kill that buck.
I certainly don't continually post to a forum about it!
The compound vs crossbow debate is so ridiculously silly. Crossbow is easier to use and you can't get busted on the draw. You still have to get within 30 yards. As MjF said it - it's the seeing the deer in 'Northern WI that's the hard part.
I agree with you, but with one exception. A scoped crossbow has an effective range greater than 30 yards on deer and other species. Even the compound routinely kills antelope, deer and elk beyond 50 yards in the west.
That is a true statement. Granted, compound guys make those shots, too. Although the skills needed for compound shots at 50 yards are considerable vs a crossbow would just take a weekend of practice.
Those of you that can make 30+ yard compound shots, that's impressive. I can hit a target all day at 30 yards. But after that I am just way too blind to get that pin to focus on the target. So in that regard, having a scope is a HUGE advantage, no doubt.
I personally don't shoot past 30 because I could not imagine having the arrow hang in the air that long. But a zillion dead animals out west proves me wrong.
Real bow hunters died when the compound was introduced
Maybe you can help me out with my identity crisis Dirtball. I'm about to be 55 and just bought a Mathews V3. It's not a crossbow but do you consider me in the same category as those that have gone to the "dark side"? Lol
Most here would agree that any vertical bow is considered true archery, but with 75% let off, sights, releases, etc. , it might not be the dark side but it is “pretty gray”, and not true archery.
Wth
Are these numbers right or is someone pulling a fast one.
"When crossbows were pushed, there was no stopping their use in WI. The reason for the separate season was we knew exactly what would happen and you are seeing it now. We looked at other states data with inclusion of crossbow and it took the same amount of time for the xbows buck harvest to eclipse bow and approach gun. It will only grow until the 300K in orange have enough of it. With full inclusion, archery season would be shortened. By separating them, it allows the opportunity to shorten one and not the other. The resource(bucks) were/are managed by success rates and the reason the archery season was so long was the length allowed for archery success rate to be close to the gun.Your comment of "never gonna happen" may or may not be true. But there is a reason they are now pushing for full inclusion and it isn't because of $$$ or commonsense. Numbers are don't lie and they will have a negative affect on the resource and hunter retention. It's not based on a guess but on previous states experiences. So yeah, the people who understand this and support xbows are concerned. Hence, the attempt to change the law."
Correct I've heard that before, in fact possibly word for word. It's a nice thought.
A couple things;
You will not find 300k gun hunters that want to shorten the crossbow season, as many gun hunters now take part. Most that don't really don't care.
I highly doubt crossbow season will be shortened without archery season being shortened along with it. I'm pretty sure crossbow hunters would cry foul and there are a bunch of them.
Plus the wdnr would need to decide there are not enough deer left before any deer season is shortened, have you ever met the wi dnr? Of course truth be told I'm thinking the dnr is on to something with this as I believe most of wi is overrun with deer, especially with all the easy winters lately. Can't kill them if they're not there. :-)
A lot of us understand (and understood from day 1) that separate season or not the crossbow season will always mimic the archery season, that is until they are eventually combined. If the haters bitch and whine enough about too many deer being killed by crossbows and IF someone actually believes it and does something, expect a lot of "I told you so" moments when archery season is shortened right along with the separate crossbow season. Big facts.
Hunterrrr, go spread your BS in some other field. This one is for bow hunters.
captmikey the usual blah blah blah as if you're having another meltdown. You're kinda like a crazy post stalker, doesn't that seem a little unhealthy (mentally) to you?
Crossbow Hunterrrrr, do you talk while pinching your nose or are you used to the crap you spew?
CaptDrinkyDrinky, you must have a memory problem as I thought you understood I hunt with both a crossbow and a compound. You seem angry and full of hate most of the time, possibly trying to find a way to relax would be a good plan. I bet a few drinks would be the perfect solution.
Go to Crossbow nation. You’ll be a hero with the slobs. A crossbow hunter who dares to use a vertical bow? Lol!
Why shorten any deer season, in much of the state whitetails are over objective? Same in some other states.
CaptMorgan, like you have the authority to tell anyone here what to do. We've had this conversation before also, you have zero authority here on bowsite. How ignorant.
When will the fat lady be done singing ? This is a depressing discussion.
Jimbow the tornado thread got some traction then the fat lady sang again. Or maybe it's the October lull
Self-proclaimed hunterrrrr, you are trainable. I post and you respond. Too bad there is no stimulus that might make you a real bow hunter.
New hear
Is this what goes on here all the time ??
Captain and Coke, lol @ I post and you respond. Anyone can look back several threads and see that it usually is the opposite of that. Hence your "post stalking" behavior. I thought I'd stoop to your level and see just how long you continued showing your immaturity and ignorance and trying to get the last word in your attempt to rule over bowsite. Much like other things, you are clearly in denial in regards to your actions. I'm sure you've heard this before but I'll say it again, the fist step is admitting you have a problem. Good luck with whatever you decide.
I was hoping for a more mature group hear.
Just end this BS by making fingers on the string only, still can shoot the compound or the dreaded stickbow, that would be too easy to solve for the bowhunting method.
Any outsider looking at this site would wonder why kindergarten let out so early.
I agree. I for one am going to stop the silliness, no one comes here to read that crap. May all your broadheads fly straight and true!
Bow and arrow hunting is in a sharp downward spiral.
Yes MO, it sure is. Far too many people using the "easy" button. I suspect these are folks who were never very successful using a hand drawn bow.
Bigger than bow and arrow hunting is Pure Archery . The hunt for a deer almost deserves the cross bow . Long Live Archery .
again fingers on the string.
Watch The Hunting Public season 4 episode 30. They shoot a buck during Wisconsin gun season that had a bolt stuck in it.
Drummer Are you implying releases are not real archery??
I agree if a modern / new compound and a release is not enough , you most likely are severely medicaly or mental impaired.
jjs..."The dreaded stickbow"? I'm assuming that was sarcasm. I'm 69, and have shot strictly sticks the last 40 years. I ventured into compounds for awhile, had a lot of fun, filled a lot of tags, but eventually got bored with them. I'm not slamming them, they're just fine for most of the guys I've hunted and shot with back then.
No,I returned to my roots because I like them. Plain and simple. Archery is supposed to be fun. Bowhunting WAS supposed to be challenging. That's all changed with the "easy way". Bowhunting, true bowhunting, is dying, if not already dead. And that's a damn shame.
Where's the fun in a crossbow? Are there a lot of crossbow clubs and shoots? Do friends gather to shoot crossbow? Is there camaraderie amongst crossbow archers?
THAT'S what's lost, and I miss it. I'm nearing the end of my hunting days...not due to age or physical limitations, but due to apathy. But I'm NOT done with archery...not by a long shot! I challenge all to attend a trad shoot, especially the Compton Rendezvous in Berrian Springs, Michigan. You'd rediscover your soul. Find a group of incredible people with a common thread...the love of archery. They'd be happy to share their fire, hand you a cold beer while sitting around it. Let you shoot their gear...answer your questions. Finest kind!
The old WBH Necedah shoot was like that. Compound, recurve, longbow, who cares? We were all brothers (and sisters) of the bow. That old tradition is dead...gone...likely never to be seen again. And for you young brothers that never had the experience...you've no idea what you missed!
I seldom post on this page. I've read through this entire thread and it's filled with the most infantile drivle I've ever seen...WAAAY too many "keyboard tough guys" acting like a bunch of spoiled 5 year olds.
Get a grip!
rallison - thank-you for one of the best posts to appear on this forum in ages. Not much more to add 'cept there's too few like this around. Well said. Good on ya brother.
Well said Rallison. I lost my desire to hunt two years ago. Shooting my recurve at shoots is a blast! Compton's is a blast. Kalamazoo is a great time! (Weather is ugly getting there) Breaking bread with the likes of Gene and Barry , Mike Mitten and hearing their stories. Nothing like it.
You said it well Rallison, and how true it is, keep at it and best of luck to you.
Pasquinell...next summer check out the Horicon trad shoot. It's a blast! Lotta vendors, good food, great course, and great folks! Check it out...stay in touch, my son and I will shoot with ya!
Rallison, that was one of the best post I have read on this board. I did the same in 1996. I have attended every Compton except one, I agree totally. The stickbow world has changed my archery future for the better. It always feels like a family reunion.
I come back from out west and the conversation here sounds like a bunch of old farts at a nursing home.
Archery bucks 2142 ( including wheelie bows) Crossbow bucks 3584
As of 10/18, we can do it, let’s show em whose more skilled,
The rut will be the proving grounds.
All the crossbowers will have filled tags by then
Oh ya, forgot about that.
Any numbers in from the northern forest?
Marinette county 21 archery bucks 100 crossbow bucks Sad
Northern forest 351 archery bucks 1011- crossbow bucks
Wow, bow and arrow hunting is declining faster than even I predicted. The P&Y entries from Wisconsin have to be greatly impacted.
Crossbows, bait piles and motion lights is the land of marinette county
Fat lady has sung, showered, and headed to the buffet.
Regardless of the numbers, I think it's awesome that WI posts such detailed numbers. Many states do not.
Wow I am shocked at the buck to doe ratio harvested in Vilas County, barely more bucks than does. So many anterless being taken. I didn't even look at the tags this year but I thought they were only giving out a few?
Unfortunately without registration stations and backtags it is also common place to buy relatives that don’t hunt a tag and they crossbowers just keep at it. Wish folks would just get out of the woods when they fill there tag, now no need to have a buck tag if that bruiser walks buy, you can buy one for cousin ethyl from your treestand after you shoot.
That is unfortunate, but have heard of the potential.
Agreed Bob, it's happening more frequently.
I personally know a jack ass who lives outside Rio. He detests shooting doe and calls hunters who do "meat hunter mentality". He even went so far as to write up a meat hunter doe killing hunter article for the local rag a couple years ago. It always burned me. Last fall a week before deer season we crossed paths at a local watering hole. I knew he had shot 3 bucks with his crossbow. One for him. One for a non hunting brother and one for his Dad who! was in a nursing home. He thinks he is entitled cause he owns lots of land. Long story short I jumped his meat hunter mentality BS telling him a deer is a deer is a deer regardless of sex. Here is a guy who is such a lazy piss poor hunter he tried but could never kill a Buck with conventional archery gear he tried for years. This stuff happens all the time with crossbows now. The DNR is never in the field anymore unless called and it runs rampant. PS. After I dressed him down he slinked out of the bar with his tail between his legs like a dog who got smacked in the nose by a rolled up newspaper.
The lax penalties for poaching and baiting frustrate me to no end. I'd love to see five figure fines, confiscation of all weapons, cars used to get there and even jail time for people purposefully killing deer illegally and intentionally.
This nonsense where they fine the person a few hundred bucks and suspend their hunting licenses for a few years is bologna. You're telling me that a person that is willing to poach is gonna be stopped because they are not allowed to buy a hunting license?
Are more deer tagged illegally shot with a crossbow vs compounds, guns or other weapons?
Absolutely more deer taken in illegally with crossbow. Without any doubt what so ever. Online license. Online registration. The numbers you guys are posting should tell you that. Easy peasy to do with the online sales and registration
I don't think anyone can answer that with a fact because the data is just not there. But my guess is that blatant poaching is probably crossbows as rifles are so loud. But in terms of people using other peoples tags, I would wager that's definitely with a rifle.
Logic tells me with quality scopes, and no muzzle blast, another 45 minutes (at least) can be tacked on to the illegal hunters shooting hours. Big buck time for sure. Maybe it never happens.
Don't underestimate the folks driving around spotlighting deer and shooting them at night, well after shooting hours.
Is it easier to kill a deer on your wife or friends tag with a crossbow or conventional archery compound equipment? It's black and white. Crossbow. A monkey can shoot a crossbow. Sorry Monkeys not knocking you
https://www.jsonline.com/story/news/2019/11/14/wisconsin-deer-two-men-convicted-illegal-killing-20-deer/4190585002/
It enrages to me know end that these people aren't locked up in jail.
I truly believe the DNR doesn't care. If they get a call they have to respond by law. Like cops who get a call must respond to said call. The DNR is not out in the field enforcing game laws anymore. Sure they stop by the parking lots and boat launch ramps to check on licenses and invasive species stuck on your trailer or to make sure your live well is drained but going afield is a thing of the past. Unless they get that call they are forced to respond
Total non x bow. Buck 3382 Doe 5090 total 8472
Total x bow. Buck 5565 Doe 6144 total 11709.
I dont see that big of a difference. The way you guys talk there wont be any deer left next year. These numbers confirm the sky is not falling.
You just wait until the sales of Gun Deer license s falls off a cliff. The gun hunters be saying screw this. Few good bucks shot in camp. As crossbow kills continue to escalate and gun hunters trade in one gun for another and don't buy the regular gun license then the DNR will notice. We already have 61,000 fewer gun license sales from 7 years ago. But the sales of crossbow licence continues to grow every year. Follow the money
And...you do not manage a deer herd by crossbow kills and culling Bucks. The rifle hunter is the deer managers best friend
Trickle, I have to say I completely agree with your last few statements.
Trickle Rut, the few wardens I have spoken with (all during fishing season) do indeed personally care and are fully invested in stopping poaching and whatnot. Many of these folks chose that career because they too are sportsment and have a passion for fishing and hunting. It's just that their resources are spread so ridiculously thin for the job that they are tasked with.
When I drive to the store I see Vilas and Oneida County deputies pulling folks over for going 10mph over the limit I shake my head. Shake my head. I'd rather see law enforcement effort focused on fish and game and not writing traffic tickets.
The DNR officers are tasked with a very tough job. It's very hard to prove most violations unless you caught someone in the act. The alternative is try to set up a sting - which requires a lot of time and resources.
The relaxed sentences for fish and game crimes is not on the DNR, it's on both the judges and our lawmakers. Look at MI for example - some legislators have been trying to push through a law making the baiting ban $1.00.
What have I done mentioning politics! I should know better. Rest assured, the legislators betraying the hunting community come from both sides of the aisle, so no need to turn this political!
I agree they are spread thin. Yes they do care but the Upper crust does not. I spoke with one of the two wardens from Door County last year out fishing. They were so understaffed that 90 percent of their time was spent patrolling the state parks because they did away with the State Park rangers in a cost cutting move. He said the only time away from state park was when a call was received reporting a fish or game violation for which they were required to respond to. The bean counters at the top of the DNR are the ones causing this. They sure aren't gonna cut their jobs so they cut the field force and Ranger force. God forbid some chair jockey in Madison get his position cut right?
Yep I agree with you there, the fault doesn't lie with the individual officers but much higher up. Both in the DNR but also the budget that they are afforded.
What a funny coincidence - one of the officers I talked to was also on the ice in Door County! Probably the only place I consistently run into any of those folks. Catching those whitefish though.... talk about a good time!
Here is another question. Crossbows used to be illegal. For healthy non disabled and under 65. Not no more. So why is buckshot still illegal for deer hunting? Ahhh....no revenue in changing that law. I get it. Follow the $
What was the original motivation for making buckshot illegal? I'm guessing folks spraying 100 yard shotgun shots like they were hunting rabbits? If so, that's silly. You can be cruel, unethical and irresponsible with any weapon. And also shame on those people!
I don't know. I think it was banned when we had all the southern shotgun only counties back in the 50's thru the 70's. These counties had a 5 day shotgun only season. Buck or Doe. I'm sure alot of you recall those days.
So many stories about poaching in my neck of the woods. I personally know a guy who has been busted a few times. I used to consider him a close friend but we've had a falling out for other reasons besides hunting. His weapon of choice was the crossbow out the truck window. He had other infractions for baiting and not registering game. Believe it or not, he is an outfitter now. It was two or three years off hunting and a fine. Not sure how much it was though. Baiting is legal in my county but he once bragged about pouring 1000 lbs or corn at one time. We also have a neighbor who shot two bucks during archery season a few years back. The first deer he shot was a wall hanger 10. The second was a 6 pointer. What kind of a-hole do you have to be to shoot a wall hanger and still feel the need to shoot a smaller buck? Insane.
Minnesota has a shotgun only season. Is it 5 days? Shotgun only statewide I believe. Right smack in peak rut too I think. Anybody have info in that? Maybe we should have one also? Why not? Piss off the Crossbow crowd? Not sure or just plain don't know if buckshot is legal in Minnesota for their shotgun hunt?
I know you're being sarcastic, but please goodness no. The MN deer season is insane and a bowhunters worst nightmare. Rifles for pretty much all of November.
BigEight, painful to read that story. There should be no such thing as "busted a few times". One major strike you're out. Two minor strikes, you're out.
Trickle rut is right one about the abuse and violations, comes from all groups and economic levels and is increasing rapidly do to technology and lax rules/laws and enforcement issues etc. Don't believe it? You will in a few more seasons, it hit public already, private is coming next. Now with that comment ,time to hit the woods and get after what's "out there". Good luck to the ethical bowhunters here.
I think there are more hunters who blatantly break rules than is realized. Trespassing is one, as are shooting after archery hours, and baiting violations. Filling others tags is also common. I would wonder what percentage of hunters never violate!
Private landowners are the biggest group of violators, it’s the reason most buy land, it’s to provide them the false sense of security that they won’t get caught.
well those numbers make some sense to me. Early season most hunters able to spend time hunting are older and need to or should be able to use the X bow. This is just fluff
Uh no I see most crossbowers being younger, so your half right as the younger are a bit soft.
Same here, in the areas I hunt haven't seen a "no-hair or gray-hair"hunting with them all young.
Most young hunters the last five years have started archery hunting with a scoped crossbow. From the archery season hunters I know, most scoped crossbow users are young.
Convinced that the best part of hunting is a dead deer . The "Industry " won for now . That being said I know old school archery and the desire for the "closest of encounters is alive and practiced / celebrated .
I forgot ...who is processing all these crossbow kills ? I'm to believe that a young person who chooses the easiest weapon there is and than at the same time volunteers their time to care for a dead deer . Or they pay what it cost to do this ? I dought it. More likely dad or grandpa are doing the hard work .
Uh no I see most crossbowers being younger, so your half right as the younger are a bit soft.
Since you admitted to buying an xbow, taking an 83 yard shot and wounding a deer, tracking it 600 yards and quitting not even looking again the next day, how soft are you? Hypocritical too?
Tough as nails unhappy, they let you use the keyboard today?
Gritty you on the sauce again?
Now how in the world did you know my comment was directed at you?
It appears you may have had a little to much this morning, don’t respond to me unless you get permission from PP
You didn't answer the questions Gritty. You are admittedly a new xbow user taking unethical shots and not doing due diligence in tracking wounded deer yet you call young people soft. And, you are a known violator to boot which is really disgusting. You should not be judging others. You should not be on this site seeing you were booted from here around a dozen times and are currently posting under multiple monikers. Your sole purpose is to further divide hunters. Class act for sure...
PP must be losing control, even unhappy is deserting
Happy, is he the one that also lied about the canoe building??
"Happy, is he the one that also lied about the canoe building??" Pasq, you have a bingo! He manufactures so much BS in his head that he cannot keep it straight.
Happy is back on the type no evil ban, he asked to ask to respond first.
Iron county to date 4 archery bucks 26 crossbow bucks
I thought all the he-man skilled woodsman were up north
Oconto county to date 15 archery bucks 60 crossbow bucks
I thought you boys said these numbers would get closer
The only way that happens is if the crossbow tags are all filled
Updated numbers as of 10/26.
Archery - bucks 5922, doe 6774, total 12696
Xbow - bucks 9685, doe 8622, 18307
Youth hunt - bucks 2295, doe 2766, total 5061
Will we see xbow buck kill double archery? On 10/16 the xbow buck kill was only at 5565!
Looks like lots of success.
If anything, this shows the power of the rifle. With one early October weekend on the stand, kids with a rifle were able to take 1/6 as much of all archery + xbow adults in 6 weeks, including prime-time pre-rut.
Let me speak for Missouri here. It also shows the power of the scoped and cocked xbow vilas. Gotta wonder how many of them are taking unethical 83 yard shots right at dark like Gritty/AlwaysRight and losing them????
Happy - Way too many are taking unethical shots. Just because you can hit a target at 80 yards doesn't mean you'll kill a deer.
You miss 100% of shots you don’t take, I’m 1 out of 2 , if I was in the MLB I’d be in the hall of fame
Honestly, I would bet most folks are not taking 80 yard shots, at least in the woods. It is just hard to get an 80 yard shooting lane! All but one of my rifle bucks have been within 60 yards.
I'm sure there's plenty of folks taking unethical shots, but that is true with any weapon. That's on the hunter, not the weapon!
For what it's worth, I wish xbows didn't exist. But they don't bother me that much. I have personally taken 2 bucks with a xbow (and I'm perfectly healthy, I can pull a bow just fine), and while it is nowhere near as fun as it is with a bow, it's still a lot more fun and more of a challenge than with a rifle. Granted one of those xbow bucks was during muzzleloader season and with my firearm tag, so you can't hate on me too bad!
Why did I buy a crossbow? I was curious and it was just $250. I will occasionally take it with me late season when its bitter cold out and I have so many layers that pulling a bow is tough and messes with my anchor points and my jackets get all crunchy loud. I would never take a shot past 30 yards though. Maybe 40 if it was completely broadside and the deer was unalert and just chilling.
Can crossbows shoot 80 yards? Yeah. But the arrow drop is insane. My xbow drops about 5 inches just between 20 and 30 yards. 80 yards is a horrificly unethical shot with a crossbow, but don't kid yourself that it's the same as shooting a 30-06 out to 80 yards. But again - I don't think the vast majority of xbow users are taking those shots. And to those that are, shame on them and I wish that they never be allowed to hunt again.
There's always bad apples. Anyways, I dont't know why I'm rambling. I agree that crossbows should have their own season, separate from archery.
Alwaysright, while you are certainly bananas, that comment did get me to chuckle.
The bolt drop means little. Simply adjust your scope to be dead on at 80 yards.
Last years antlered crossbow kill was 37,000, we have a long ways to go
The crossbow is likely providing relief from the dreaded target panic .If you take target panic away the modern compound is extremely easy to shoot and is made for shooting out of tree stand . The massive crossbow use just doesn't make sense unless many are suffering from target panic .
Vilas, the crossbow manufacturers don’t help their own image when they advertise 100 yard accuracy.
Without a doubt, I shake my head when I see those ads.
JimBow, you are spot on about xbows in a treestand. Crossbows are just plain clunky, they have a limited angle of attack and are tough to keep on scope in a treestand. They are very difficult to shoot free-hand so you're limited to a rail for the most part. Of course you don't have to risk getting busted drawing, and that's a big advantage.
But let's not pretend that it's difficult to hold an 80% let-off bow at full-draw. My left arm (bow arm?) honestly fails me before my right arm/shoulder.
Now if you're using a crossbow in a ground blind with a tripod.... that's a different story and it's a pretty darn effective weapon. Too effective for archery season by any measure.
Same here. But I know a guy who has a Ravin and it's scary accurate. What about the one that shoots 2 arrows? Archery is supposed to be primitive vs firearms.
The silver lining to "shoots 2 arrow crosbows" is that it's stuff like that that might actually reverse the trend of crossbows being allowed all the time and anywhere. Eventually crossbows are gonna get ridiculous enough that something will have to change.
Although realistically, it would probably just result in specific restrictions, like "no two arrow crossbows".
I am curious to try out one of the Ravin crowssbows. I have a $250 Centerpoint and it's pretty accurate out to about 50 yards on a tripod at a bag. After that, the groups start opening up. So I can imagine a $1000+ crossbow is scary accurate.
To be clear - Useing a crossbow to its full capacity within the archery season in year 2021 is a major disregard for how you are impacting others .
The attitude that cocks a bolt within the archery season will change everything .
If you think a $1000 crossbow is accurate try a r29 that retails over $2000 set up and some of you would change your tune on long shots being unethical, you claim unethical but in contrast carry a inferior weapon to take out hunting. You owe it to the animal to be as accurate as possible
Gritty, they owe it to the animal to be proficient with the weapon and the season they choose, including but not limited to their choice of shots taken.
Alwaysright's Link
2 things I do not watch on Youtube, a trad guy sitting in a tree looking at a pile of corn immediately gets turned off, and anything with a xgun I don't waste time thinking about watching. Just seeing people carrying them looks stupid.
L2H, yeah, agreed. Infalt had a group of hunting industry guys up hunting McCoy earlier this year. One guy was “sneaking” around the woods with an Xbow and it just looked dumb, trying to balance that dumb thing while scouting through brush. I like Infalt, but that guy needed to go. I had to fast forward every time they cut to that guy.
You owe it to the animal to be as accurate as possible
Yet you took an unethical 83 shot shot bordering on darkness and then did not even do your due diligence trying to find the wounded animal. You owed it to that animal to take a more ethical shot and try harder to recover it. You then blew it all off saying "there are more out there." You are an insult to real hunters. By the way, did you set your illegal bait that far from your stand? We know you have had issues in the past killing deer unless you were over illegal bait piles.
Dakota, yes, that was the show I turned off when I saw that guy and a xgun. It was his quote of "why am I using a xgun? it's legal" then he laughed about it.
Unhappy Some guys are lousy shots at 20yds, I will take your challenge anytime you want to compare skill
Yeah Happy is right. Yet the same people take this guy serious and respond. 83 yard shot is absolutely unethical. Clearly his skill isn't as he believes it is, he wounded it. Just a fraud is all
Gritty, I've never held, let alone shot an xbow so I can't compare with you. I just know your skill set is not as good as you want people to believe and your hunting ethics suck. Never trying to find a wounded deer after the initial try is very sad. Let's never forget you are a violator too. That can never be mentioned too many times. You needed to hunt over a huge illegal bait pile to be successful. Is that the skill set you are bragging about?
“Yet the same people take this guy serious and respond”
??
Miserable
You need to kiss with this Gritty guy and make up like the Capt and trickle did
Just let it go.
Wood county
50 archery bucks
140 crossbow bucks
Eau Claire county
19 archery bucks 100 crossbow bucks
This is getting worse, talk about being the minority, good luck ever getting anything changed in favor of the vertical bow
Thank you for the information.
So when this harvest data reaches 75% cross and 25% vertical, what do you predict will become of the seasons as we know them now?
Not sure in whitetail country, but most other species would suffer massive point creep, season restrictions, and more quota seasons. Worse than we have seen as a result of the legalization of the compound.
I do like Michigan’s rules minus the baiting.
So much for the vertical catch up As of 11/2 Vertical bucks - 10200 Crossbow- 16600
I wonder how many on this forum actually kill deer with a scoped and cocked crossbow? Time to fess up.
I have to get a deer in front of me to find out!
Shot mine with a Hoyt factor, was the right tool for the set up
I take the recurve when still hunting for the quick jump shots.
Missouri - I use a crossbow now. I'm 72 and have tears in both rotators. After not deer hunting for two years a friend lent me his crossbow. It keeps me in the woods doing what I love to do---deer hunting. I'll tell you one thing after I shot my first deer with one, it was the most anti-climatic hunt I've ever been on. I still hunt like I did when I bow hunted, twenty yards or closer and broadside only. I was a big opponent of crossbows and still am except for the elderly or disabled. They are too easy in my book. I hate it when I hear guys taking 50 yard shots or further. FYI - I did shoot a doe at Case's place last night.
Hoot, no shame in that! Good for you that are still out hunting and congrats on your doe.
Congrats on getting some meat Hoot.
I am glad you are still in the game Hoot, crossbows play an important role in that regard.
At 72 yrs old! Still shooting my trad gear! Have dropped down in weight but still wacking stuff!!!!!!! PRACTICE, PRATICE! Xbows are NOT for me but that's just my choice!
Bobbin - I sure wish I was able to hold/draw a bow again, but it isn't in the cards. I really miss the challenge of bowhunting. I'm really happy you're still able to bow hunt.
When the word gets out on the new crossbow record buck, the next group of crossbow users will be born
Doesn’t matter if there is a record buck or no record buck the fat lady is already pregnant!
Xbows are expanding the lead
11/9 to date
Total buck harvest 46451
Archery buck harvest 17930/37% of total kill
Xbow buck harvest 26222/56% of total kill
Youth buck harvest 2298/ 7% of total kill
Northern forest 71% of total buck harvest is with the superior weapon.
As you can see by the data, contrary to popular opinion, xbows have not really impacted the archery season.
As you can see by the data, contrary to popular opinion, xbows have not really impacted the archery season.
That is sarcasm FYI
Missouribreaks's Link
The bi pod and scope set up would make a great Christmas gift. That is for those of you who voted to keep Christmas in our lives.
I see a lot of those are sold out MO
I bet a lot of them came to Wisconsin and Michigan.
Yep bow hunting just spews from that picture, doesn't it!!! LOL
It does, at least bow hunting according to Wisconsin and Michigan, lol.
How much is deer hunting land worth when the deer are gone??
The deer will not be gone, numbers are controlled by tags issued.
I agree MO, but our public officials are always slow to act, might take awhile to recover if decimated
I cannot speak for anyplace else but northern Bayfield County I have been waiting for the deer to rebound for 10 years now, it’s just the opposite, declining every year.
Deer numbers in any county that has antlerless tags will suffer due to the crossbow.
And will suffer even more with rifle
Does not seem the game manager herd number objectives are the same as the Bowsite hunter objectives.
Trying going to the CDAC meetings. It's literally physically painful hearing the yahoos speak. I watched the Vilas county one on zoom this year and just about every member agreed that the herd should be "maintained" not "grown". Yet every single commenter disagreed with that.
It is frustrating and so ridiculous its hard to do anything but laugh at how absurd it is. I would love for these foresters on the CDAC to show me where the deer are "destroying the forest", because I would be glad to hunt in this mythical big wood place that is teeming with deer destroying the forest.
Dead deer on the side of the road? That's not because there's too many deer. That's because people are feeding deer near the roads. I almost hit a doe in Minoqua this year because the yahoos at that baitshot had open bags of corn stacked up and there was an army of does hanging out on the main street munching down outside the bait shop at night.
Isn't it great that "transportation" gets the same representation as "hunters" at CDAC? It's almost funny. ALMOST. Even the hunter representative in Vilas is against our interests. She stated how "we need more doe tags, so people shoot does, not bucks and we have better trophy bucks". Yeah lady, people are going to shoot a doe and then decide they're done and not shoot a buck.
She also claimed "most hunters I've spoke to would rather shoot one nice buck every handful of years then get a deer each year". There is nothing wrong with that viewpoint, but you can't possibly claim that is what the majority of folks want. People aren't driving from Southern WI to Northern WI for a trophy deer, they are doding it for the hunting experience.
I am getting myself all worked up!
MJF, agreed, however, we always had the rifle season, the crossbow season is new and in addition to it.
You should have cross examined her. Ma'am do bucks not come from Doe? Ma'am do nub fawn bucks get harvested with the doe tags? Ma'am what in your eyes is a trophy? Ma'am do you have any data that shows hunters stop hunting when they fill a doe tag or is this your unscientific poll with you and your besties? Ma'am how many Doe actually have success rearing fawns to one year if age? You don't know? What do you know after all with these comments? Do you have a degree in wildlife management? Have you ever taken any courses? That would have been fun had I been present. Always remember the 6 golden questions. Who? How? What? Where? When? And Why?
Trickle, I brought up a lot of those points, but sadly it's not a back and forth dialogue, it's a "you get two minutes to make your comments which we will certainly ignore". They don't respond to comments, your comments just get entered into the record. It's like a "suggestion box" that no one is ever gonna read.
You can read the summary of the meetings. Vilas had something like 500/700 commentors in favor of "growing the herd", yet the members voted 6-0 to "mantain" the herd. It's really frustrating.
I'm looking forward to CDAC meetings becoming in-person again and I will definitely attend. I think that will lend itself more to a dialogue. Even if you're totally ignored, at least you can speak your mind and feel like you at least tried.
Don't let these know it all do goodies bulldoze people. Make em sweat. Grill em. Ask for yes or no answers. Most will just sink in their chairs if you push them in the right way and admit it's what they heard or read or the best of the best " how I feel"
They had a q&a session with the deer czar. One question allowed per person. I asked "have you ever purchased a license to hunt deer in Wisconsin?" Answer.."I hope to" Wasn't my question sir. "Have you ever purchased a license to hunt deer in Wisconsin?". I answered you next question ..."Sir you did not answer my question" Have you or have you not? "No"
“Deer numbers in any county that has antlerless tags will suffer due to the crossbow”
Look at the numbers Einstein, crossbow hunters shot a much larger percentage of bucks than antlerless.
Up until today, I never thought anyone could be dumb enough to think that because more of one sex of a specie is killed that the reduction of the other does not matter.
Up until 2014 I never thought anyone would be ignorant enough that giving the crossbow a separate season concurrent with the archery season was a win.
Just sayin….
We now know real bow and arrow hunters are an endangered specie in Wisconsin!
Not endangered MO, but they are past breeding age.
Weekly scoreboard as of 11/16
Total bucks 56000
Archery bucks -21838/39% Xbow archery bucks-31862/57% Youth bucks- 2299/4%
Staying pretty consistent, I’m sure a lot of unused archery tags will be filled next week. Wink wink
On our way to a record archery harvest.
Looks like most here are likely using crossbows, not bows and arrows. That is my guess.
MO, you are probably right, some just can’t admit it, they will be strewn from the sheep herd.
Should be a perfect week for the 9 day any weapon season, will be the perfect measure on the numbers of the herd
Nothing to blame the low kill on, no COVID, no weather issues, no late start, if it’s down the crossbow slaughter before the 9 day any weapon season will be on the minds of gun hunters that haven’t made the jump to the crossbow. If that happens expect the next wave of crossbow hunters to hit the landscape next fall.
Just sayin….
Alwaysright's Link
How bad do you think the numbers are skewed if you account for people who don't register their deer. I think it's a problem in my area. Wondering if you guys are suspecting the same thing.
Yep plenty of it going on where I'm at.No way to enforce until we are willing to put some "teeth" into the equation, doubt if that will happen anytime soon.
“ But in the farmland regions, where the deer populations are abundant and crop harvests were ahead of schedule this fall, the deer kills were substantially down.
Pritzl said it is premature to make conclusions about this year's hunt. But he noted a years-long trend of hunters shifting their effort from the nine-day deer gun season toward earlier opportunities during the bow and crossbow seasons.”
We need to get this Pritzl dude fired, biggest smoke blower out there,
These numbers are ugly, so much for the 2020 numbers being down do to a late opener theory.
I have asked this before and I never get an answer. I'll ask it again.
How do you convince anyone not to shoot a Xbow?
People are going to do whatever they want. So in order to curve this or stop it completely is to lobby for regulation. However it is a rather slippery slope in doing so. Because if you fight to limit reduce or eliminate someone's right to use one, the next time it might be another group doing the same to what you have.
It boils down to ethics, greed, laziness and a general ignorance of pride. Unfortunately, those same traits have been lost by a growing number of people through our society. When a person has no shame or self-respect, there is not much that can be said to change them.
Boy not sure a I agree with that last statement, if you can’t kill them with a bow might as well kill them during gun season, where’s the ethnics in that?
"Because if you fight to limit reduce or eliminate someone's right to use one, the next time it might be another group doing the same to what you have."
Unfortunately some crossbow haters are too blinded by their greed and jealousy and too concerned with what the other guy is doing to figure that out. This is all about a very small group of greedy hunters not wanting to share the woods with others, which is why they were laughed out of these conversations in the past and will be again. Crossbow season is not going anywhere, not without other seasons being changed right along with it. Only a few still seem to not be able to come to terms with this and keep whining. These days almost no one is listening, and rightfully so.
Of course a crossbow user is not greedy. Just because they want to use a superior weapon during a time when bucks are more susceptible has nothing to do with greed. Lol! Hypocritical POS.
What a surprise stalker-boy posts within 3 minutes. 24/7/365. Owned.
That’s all you have? Don’t want to talk about your greed? Your hypocrisy? Your inability to hunt with a vertical bow?
The way you stalk I would think you'd remember, I hunt with several different kinds of bows. You = fail.
Why do you hunt with several different bows? What makes you choose one over the Other?
MirageTC, if your question was "how do you convince someone not to use a crossbow?" If you're talking about literally a single person you personally know that you're trying to convince, I would say encourage them to take a single deer with a bow. The accomplishment they feel after taking a deer with a bow should convince them. If you're talking about the general population at large, and not just one person, then I don't have any ideas!
HunterR, what a touching piece about crossbows allowing everyone to share the woods....Allow me to dry my eyes before I continue........... The fact of the matter is that bowhunting was always open to EVERYONE!!!!! Only the lazy try to paint a picture of it formerly being an exclusive club by invitation only..... Crossbows for the disabled opened up a door for those that truly needed it. Crossbows for everyone opened the door to societies lazy entitlement crowd. You guys are hilarious with all your cry story blubbering trying desperately to justify it. Crossbows weren't about anything other than a money grab.
Most here have used and endorsed the scoped crossbow for years.
Most here have used and endorsed the scoped crossbow for years.
Missouri i think you have said that 1000 times.
Crossbowhunterrrr = lazy hunter for anyone who is able bodied but chooses the easy way.
Again HunterR shows his reasoning to go with a xgun instead of a bow. He said "bowhunters greed and jealousy". If that is what he thinks we are concerned with, that is his thought process only. So, evidently he is a greedy and jealous person that has a hard time shooting them with a bow. Most xgunners are this way. They aren't concerned with the resource or how there decisions affect it. As long as it requires no work for there gain, there good. If it causes a decline in populations, quality of the resource, they do not care. They only see as far as the end of there nose. I'm sure he has his own property, so why care about what is happening beyond it. Just in there own little world and selfish. Unfortunately his kind wreck it for all when what they are doing is too much. We are seeing the effects of guns during the rut as MN is. Unfortunately it will get worse and plateau with shit for quality unless you grow your own. WI had this for all on public and private till only a few years ago. Now public is shit and unless they get the xguns out of the breeding season and control the wolves it will not come back. They can do Antler Restrictions, one buck, bla bla bla, it will stay shit because of the xguns.
Live, you are spot on. What amazes me is that people like him can even mention "greed" when that is the very reason they choose that weapon.
In 2013 I was testifying in Madison at an Assembly hearing regarding the crossbow issue. After my testimony, Mike Brust from WBA testified. During his testimony, Republican chairman All Ott made the remark that Mr Brust and my testimony came from a “very narrow, dare I say selfish point of view” as he held his thumb and forefinger closely together. At this point I was no longer testifying but from my seat I blurted out that if he was going to call Brust and I selfish that he damned better call each and every person who testified selfish as we were all there representing our or own organizations perspective. Of course he pounded his gavel and told me I was out of order. I responded to him that he was the one who was out of order. The NRA representative and the Wi Bear hunter lobbyist made remarks that got them much closer to a fistfight than I think they know. And, with the NRA’s money influencing Mr Ott as well as others, we all know how it ended.
CaptMike, I just want to say good on you for taking your personal time and going and testifying there. I can't imagine how frustrating that must of been. The chairman was way out of line with that comment, I can't believe he said that.
"Bow hunters greed and jealosy" stated by the hunter that hits it EASY button. All I can do is laugh. My youngest son (stepson) that have been part of my life for close to 30yrs now, he left at 18 to join the Navy after 9 yrs of service ended up on the west coast, so never really hunted much. This year he and his wife moved to Wi and I got him bow hunting. he absolutley loves it. He is staying at my house till they close on their home the end of this month. He is out at least 5 times a week after work. He missed a big 8pt about a month ago and is hooked. He talks about the guys at work that shoot x-guns an even from a non-seasoned hunter, he does not understand why someone would do something so easy. He is determined and really enjoys the challenge. I hope he gets a nice one.
Thanks Vilas & Retro. The only reason I mentioned it was that I cannot get over the blatant hypocrisy some people exhibit. This was another example of it, just as hunterrrr's was.
After reading all these post and laughing many times I dont see things changing any time soon. I am a die hard bow hunter, and have been for 42 years, I did own a cross gun for 2 years but ended up selling due to lack of enjoyment, owned and used for target practice,thought it would be fun shooting at 80 and 100 yards, it was, just not as fun as my vertical bow. What makes me laugh is all this talk about cross gun hunters being lazy and wanting the easy way, and I do very much agree with that statement, but that is the way with most things in life. This goes for all of us, do you own a remote control for your tv, how about a garage door opener, electric can opener, remote car starter, table saw, battery operated drills, microwave oven, and this list could go on and on, my point is that things change and in one way or another we all take the easy way, or convenient way, after all if you have a garage door opener you must be lazy. JM2C Carl
Well said Dash. Which is the reason game depts need to put limits/laws in effect as hunters will not- ever
Well said Mark S. Dash, I'd never think of using my TV remote during a non-remote TV season.
dash, those analogies aren't even close to what some people are talking about here. If we use your thought process then we should all just quit hunting and go get our meat from a grocery store because it's easier.
Dash, we aren't talking about everyday, meaningless task type easy buttons. We are talking a natural resource where populations can be affected by these easy buttons to the point of crashing or making it undesirable to pursue. Take fishing electronics, yes I do have a vexlar for ice fishing and know how easy it is to catch fish using one. But, I also know that I cannot keep 25 panfish everytime I go out and am now a proponent of 5 or 10 panfish limits and releasing those 9+" gills, big crappies and perch because of the ease of catching them. The electronics for open water now is absolutely nuts, that 360 side image thing takes all skill out of it. In fact it makes it so easy, the excitement is not there. No I do not have that or side image, only a small garman with lake maps. Anyway, with deer hunting, these easy buttons combined with wolves, tribal 24 hour shooting and poaching is reducing the adult buck populations and doe populations to the point of not rebuilding and creating a stunted out lake type of scenario. Something has to be done to stop this chain. All I know deer hunting was a lot better before all this crap. Being fortunate enough to go through it was great, watching the demise of it is a sour pill to take for sure.
Just so I'm understanding this... any state that allows remote control garage door openers, should allow a 4 month gun season? I guess when you think about it, that makes total sense....
Lol, retro that was a good laugh! Live, I give you credit for having far more patience than I in attempting to explain this to others.