Get that orange/pink out bowhunters!
Colorado
On the commission agenda this month:
CPW Preferred Alternative: Require archery deer, elk, bear and moose hunters to wear solid daylight fluorescent orange or fluorescent pink during the period of overlap during the September archery and muzzleloader seasons west of I-25 on public land only. This includes a minimum of 500 square inches of solid orange or pink that must be worn as an outer garment above the waist, part of which must be a head covering visible from all directions.
Nonresident Muzzleloader keep killing bowhunters, and we get the Orange/Pink.
See the link for more info.
Also puzzling to me, CBA has submitted a petition to increase max let off to 85%. Did I miss a survey?
Wait...there's an issue bowhunters didn't cause but the solution somehow requires bowhunters losing something or getting some restriction? When has that ever happened?
Except about every issue.
Saw that coming from a mile away.
Wonder why orange camo pattern wouldn't suffice? As a compromise to solid orange.
Like the Covid jab if it saves even 1 life then all should comply for the good of the collective. ??. Humor aside I wear orange whenever I’m afield just so some jerk doesn’t shoot me even bow or muzzy hunting. Animals can’t see it and there’s no valid reason not to wear it. Had the archer been wearing it he wouldn’t have been accidentally killed. If you choose to not wear it then you have no legal recourse should you be shot. My 2 cents.
Okay think about this so we'll be able to work camouflage one week before the Black Powder season starts the rest of time you have to wear orange unless you hunt in an area didn't have a moose license
Why not a helmet too, in case we trip and fall and hit our head. And bubble wrap, too.
How about a few more otc units being limited. Saw that too.
Look at the wording, CHANGING SEASON TIMING IS A POSSIBILITY ALSO
Will orange covid masks count for the head covering?
Asking for a friend...
These snowflakes might decide to require facemasks when hunting.
Laws should be to curb people from harming others with the burden and restriction being on the potential offender. Not to restrict potential victim's freedoms due to possible actions by others.
I already have the option to wear pink when I bowhunt if I'm concerned about my safety or just feeling fabulous. No need for a new law.
Where is the logic? Requiring bow hunters to wear hunter orange during the overlap with the 9 day ML season. The whole month of Sept. has shot gun bird hunters, high powered rifle bear hunters, High country rifle deer and elk hunters, PLO rifle elk hunters, goat and sheep rifle hunters and all of these other manners of take surely outnumber the number of ML hunters and are hunting in Sept. What is interesting is that rifle Mt goat and B Horn Sheep hunter do not have to wear hunter orange. yep, where is the logic to have bow hunter wear Hunter Orange during the 9 day ML season in Sept?
Probably because the last few fatal incidents have all involved muzzleloader and archery hunters. It should be noted that all the muzzleloader hunters have been non residents.
Clearly the ML’s need to be relegated to their own stand alone season. I suggest the 1st. Friday of Oct. thru the next following Saturday to thwart these avoidable accidents.
Too late now but muzzleloader should have been set right after archery years ago. It would be one of the premier seasons in the country to hunt elk. Low hunter numbers, bugling bulls and gorgeous aspens. There have been a couple incidents that were totally avoidable with basic hunting and firearm safety. Still, its incredibly safe compared to many activities. I quit asking for a change a while ago when it became evident that any issue where something that would improve archery season was on the table, the solution was generally worse than the issue.
How about know what the F#*k your shooting at. That’s pretty simple. I think it’s dumb to make Bowhunter’s pay for clowns who think a camo human is an elk.
^^^how about mandatory life in prison for shooting someone while hunting? May make people think twice before pulling the trigger. I don’t hunt public land for elk anymore but if I did I’d probably wear some orange even though I completely disagree that I should have too.
There will always be “accidents” but making the bow hunter pay for it is wrong.
Also per the wording, the issue is being raised to see if there is agreement between ALL stakeholders to make a change. If enough resistance is made, status quo is still an option.
Voice your opinions/concerns here:
[email protected]
OK guys, this is where you put your money where your mouth is. Yep, send email.
When they call out for public comments about Camo I’ll submit my recommendations which will be 1. Yes Orange/pink for all hunters. 2. Camoed orange/pink is ok for use.
Personally, I'm not sending in any comments. The fine for noncompliance should you be cited is $100 plus $39 in fees. Anyone ever had a speeding ticket? Did it make you stop speeding?
With this being the CPW preferred alternative, I think the odds are high upper 90 percent it is going to pass with CPW's preferred option. The commission is not even close to the commission we had before Polis, be careful about what you ask for.
To make this a fight about splitting seasons etc is not wise, IMO
I am certain the CBA position and many others will be different, I get it and I'm ok with it. I did lodge comment about OTC limitations
Cpw has changed their preferred option before after public and stakeholder comments. We can hope for status quo, or even moving ml after archery. This would help with the perceived crowding issue. Heck, they don't limit other recreation in the so-called quiet time
Page 15, Colorado Big Game Brochure.
HUNTER ORANGE AND PINK:
The law requires hunters to wear at least 500 sq in of solid daylight fluorescent orange or flor pink ............ while hunting deer, elk, pronghorn, bear or moose during all (general) rifle seasons., EXCEPT FOR THE LIMITED SEPT. RIFLE BEAR SEASON.
Interesting, I did not know that the limited Sept rifle bears hunters (20,687 in number) did not have to wear hunter orange.
That's weird. I've always worn orange rifle hunting bear.
I just copied the regulation off of the CPW website. as follows,
HUNTER ORANGE & PINK HUNTERS MUST WEAR FLUORESCENT ORANGE OR PINK. The law requires hunters to wear at least 500 square inches of solid daylight fluorescent orange or fluorescent pink material on an outer garment above the waist while hunting deer, elk, pronghorn, bear or moose with any firearm license. A fluorescent orange or pink hat or head covering, visible from all directions, is also required. This includes all muzzleloader hunters. It also includes archery hunters who hunt during rifle season. Archers hunting during the limited Sept. rifle bear season, archers with an archery bear, deer, elk, pronghorn or moose license, and archers licensed for private land hunting through the Ranching for Wildlife program do not have to wear fluorescent orange or pink, but should consider wearing it to increase safety while in the field. Auction- and raffle-license holders do not have to wear orange or pink when hunting with archery equipment when no rifle seasons are open. If using a ground blind or pop-up blind, hunters should display orange or pink that is visible from all directions on the outside of the blind. CAMOUFLAGE ORANGE OR PINK DOES NOT QUALIFY! Mesh garments are legal but not recommended. CPW strongly recommends wearing daylight fluorescent orange or fluorescent pink clothes in the field, even if you’re not hunting. Wearing orange or pink is for hunter safety, as big-game animals don’t see these colors like we do: Movement, sound and smell are what give hunters away.
I copied the above from the 2021 big game brochure, on pg 15 that I have in my office.
BUT, the brochure I have in hand must be a MISPRINT because it states in the first paragraph, " except for the limited Sept. rifle bear season."
I bet the CPW rechecked and caught the mistake in the wording and changed it.
Big Horn Sheep and Mt Goat rifle hunters do not need to wear orange.
I've always worn an orange cap while bowhunting during ml; then I just quit hunting during that time, especially the first 3-4 days of ml season. If they do end up requiring orange for bowhunters, they need to get the ml hunters to wear orange. CPW is just trying to cover their butts and they are creating a new rule to enforce an old rule...know your damned target!
Giving input to the CPW is like giving input to the CBA! Provide all the input you want but they will go ahead and do what ever they want anyhow.
ML rifle hunter do have to wear hunter orange. What I found in the 2021 brochure was, I am sure a misprint, as what is stated in the CPW online brochure does include all rifle hunters for bear, etc. including ML hunters.
I give it 90% odds of NOT passing. They are responding with a PC recommendation but will bow to the will of the people (bowhunters).
Personally, I wear, and would be ok with orange camo being a requirement. Animals won’t know the difference between that and regular camo
I would be ok with a camoborange fleece vest if it came to that. But I don't like the idea of non-bowhunting bureaucrats dictating something that is basically a "feel good" law. Hunting comes with inherent risks that we all accept. Or we can stay home in our little safe rooms if we choose.
With the push of manufacturers to make ML rifles accurate to greater distances even out to 300 yards and them not being the "primitave" weapon they were when the season was originally added, seems like maybe allowing the use scopes might help them better identify their targets. Moving the season is the best idea. Agree, punishing archers for the stupidity of the ML hunters who can't identify their targets is not right. Although, that is usually how our society works.
Mr. Navarre, Thank you for your comments. Your comments will be shared with the Parks and Wildlife Commission as part of the public input process. Please note, there is an issue paper (pages 1-2 here: https://cpw.state.co.us/Documents/Commission/2021/November/Item.18-Ch-W-2-Issues.pdf) related to the archery/muzzleloader overlap that will be discussed at the November Commission meeting as part of the broader agenda item related to annual review of big game regulations. That agenda item is informational at the November meeting. Final action may be taken by the Commission at a future meeting.
With the push of manufacturers to make Compound archery bows accurate to greater distances even out to 150 yards and them not being the "primitive” weapon they were when the season was originally added, seems like maybe allowing the use scopes might help them better identify their targets. Moving the season is the best idea. Agree, punishing others for the stupidity of the Archery hunters who can't identify their targets is not right. Although, that is usually how our society works.
From what I read of this incident it’s clear that if both or even one had been blazed out it wouldn’t have occurred. There’s also the psych involved to consider.
Following are the listed alternatives for Hunter Orange/pink during the over lap of archer and ml early season.
ALTERNATIVES: (POSSIBLE OUTCOMES or POSSIBLE REGULATIONS): 1. Preferred Alternative: Require archery deer, elk, bear and moose hunters to wear solid daylight fluorescent orange or fluorescent pink during the period of overlap during the September archery and muzzleloader seasons west of I-25 on (public land only.) This includes a minimum of 500 square inches of solid orange or pink that must be worn as an outer garment above the waist, part of which must be a head covering visible from all directions 2. Require archery deer, elk, bear and moose hunters to wear solid daylight fluorescent orange or fluorescent pink during the period of overlap during the September archery and muzzleloader (on both public and private lands) seasons west of I-25. This includes a minimum of 500 square inches of solid orange or pink that must be worn as an outer garment above the waist, part of which must be a head covering visible from all directions 3. Separate the regular archery and muzzleloader seasons by date (This may include shortening archery season days or extending muzzleloader season into October) 4. Status Quo
They keep talking that the archery season would be shortened to accommodate the muzzleloaders. While I don't agree that the 'victim' in this case should be the one punished, if there are reductions in season length, shouldn't each be shortened. The current black powder season is 9 days, the archery season is 29 days. Reduce black powder by a weekend (2 days), and archer by 7 days. Percentage wise it's the same.
I also think they should reduce ml to 7 days. When I hunted during ml season, 80-90% of them were long gone before that second weekend.
Shortening the season does nothing to prevent the problem of miss identification of a hunter. How about better hunter education for non residents thru the CPW. Put muzzleloader season in the rifle season, their equipment is no longer a primitive weapon. They are capable of shooting out to 300 yds. I see no reason bowhunters should take the blunt of this problem when this was caused by a muzzleloader hunter. CPW needs to limit the number of non residents muzzleloader hunters during the archery season.
Never, never, never support OR recommend the shorting of the Early Season elk and deer archery season.. It is called, CUTTING ONES OWN THROAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
3 weeks for archery beginning 1st. Friday of Sept. 2 weeks quiet time for the elk then a 9 day ML season. Increase NR’s to 40% and lower the cost of the tags by $125.00. Win win.
NEVER, NEVER, NEVER, SUPPORT OR RECOMMEND THE SHORTING OF THE EARLY SEASON ELK AND DEER ARCHERY SEASON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Well given the quantum leap in the advancements of what passes for "archery" these days I think it deserves a real close consideration. Modern compounds are finely tuned machines and not really a bow. The power comes from the wheels not the limbs. Now if you want to keep a month long season then you should be willing to compromise and go back to trad long bows and recurves. I'm willing to do that both in archery and ML. Sidelocks or in-lines with open sights and exposed NO: 11 caps only works for me.
azelkhntr
first you say what looks like you think it is bow hunters shooting people by accident "...Agree, punishing others for the stupidity of the Archery hunters who can't identify their targets is not right..."
Then you suggest shortening bow season is a solution to the one in a million muzzleloader hunter who shoots another hunter. None of what you are suggesting makes any sense whatsoever
I’m glad I have as many MLs as I do bows and twice as many rifles.
I know I’ll be able to pick my season easily
Why don't we make nonresident ML hunters wear a cow bell??
Scott
The cow bell would be tucked in their pack where they usually keep their orange.
Just kidding, obviously most muzzleloaders wear their orange but I've certainly ran into more than a few that weren't.
I occasionally muzzleload hunt. I built a Lyman Great Plains 54 cal round ball rifle years ago. Lots of fun.
The simplest solution is always the best. Everyone wears orange afield. Everyone.
Orange is lame. How about if you don’t know the difference from a human to an elk you aren’t allowed to hunt
I agree Khunter.
As said before Azelkhntr needs to stay an AZ elk hunter as he’s obviously clueless about CO.
azelkhntr
A sound shot is a sound shot.
Another azelkhntr proposed "solution" where residents lose and NRs win, and calls it a "win-win". SMH while LOL.
Does anyone how the discussion by the staff and commission went on this issue at the meeting?
azelkhunter needs to stay out of CO, and out of the CO forums...
From: Surfbow22-Nov-21Private Reply azelkhunter needs to stay the hell out of CO, and out of the CO forums...
I’m only sharing my viewpoints on topics. Luckily people of such narrow tolerance as yourself don’t have the ability to just ban someone for doing so. This isn’t Hunt Talk.
Listened to the meeting that covered this issue. Day 1, at 4:52:00
Commissioner May said his preference for status quo.
Commissioner Tuchton mentioned moving ML season out of archery.
Commissioner Schaefer spoke of doing something within current season structure.
Commissioner Haskett spoke of using camo orange.
We'll see where CPW goes with this.
Hopefully so many different takes results in status quo in the end.
"I’m only sharing my viewpoints on topics. Luckily people of such narrow tolerance as yourself don’t have the ability to just ban someone for doing so. This isn’t Hunt Talk."
I didn't say to ban you, but did you get banned from Hunt Talk? I wouldn't be shocked...I'm actually a very tolerant person, but my tolerance ends with people who don't know what they're talking about continuing to 'share' their viewpoint over and over, which distracts from an otherwise interesting discussion.
Thanks for the update Stix.
My prediction is CPW will rightly rule that all big game hunters wear orange. In controlling hunting across the State they’re liable for ensuring that the proven safety measures are in place and wearing hunter orange is proven to do so. It’s a non issue since the deer and elk can’t see that. I expect there’ll be wrongful death lawsuits etc. against CPW for not having such a rule in place. It’s a major contributing factor IMO. I’d also like to see all recreationists be required to don the orange when the seasons start.
Requiring all recreational users in the woods during seasons to wear a vest and hat would be a dream for our antihunters here.
It would falsely give the sense that hunting is less safe than it is, annoy nonhunting hikers, bikers, rock climbers, bird watchers, geocachers, etc., and of course be an enforcement burden none of the agencies want or would effectively accomplish.
Azelkhntr, how about posting a field photo of you in an orange vest and hat while bowhunting?
"I expect there’ll be wrongful death lawsuits etc. against CPW for not having such a rule in place."
azelkhntr, there's not one decent attorney out there that would take a case like that, let alone them having even the slightest chance of winning it.
Man, you just continue to spew garbage here on bowsite.
"My prediction is CPW will rightly rule that all big game hunters wear orange. In controlling hunting across the State they’re liable for ensuring that the proven safety measures are in place and wearing hunter orange is proven to do so."
Clearly someone has been watching too much Law & Order during Covid...
Archery season August 20th to September 20th Muzzleloader September 21 to September 30th. Would that work?
Would be great for deer hunters. But dealing with a dead elk in August can be a recipe for lot of spoiled meat.
I wouldn't start requesting season changes. We'll lose.
It WILL end up being archery 9/2-9/21, ML 9/22- 9/30.
Stix is right on the money.
Agreed. Most likely we would lose a week. I already have the option to not hunt ML week if I'm worried. No need to take the option away from me.
Who says ML season has to be in September?
Other than the MLs? :-)
Back in the 80's, archery season ran through the first weekend in October. I don't remember which week MLs had then.
The following Early Seasons for 1970, 1980 and 1990. as follows.
1980 – Deer – 8/30 – 9/28 unrestricted either sex in units 1 – 3; 201; 6-11; 16; 161; 17; 171; 18 – 22; 25; 27 – 32; 34 – 52; 421; 444; 471; 481; 500; 501; 511; 521; 56 – 59; 581; 68; 681; 69; 71- 115; 751; 851; 881.
“ 8/30 – 9/21 unrestricted either sex in units 4; 441; 5; 12; 13; 131; 14; 15; 23; 24; 26; 33; 411; 54; 55; 551; 60 – 67 & 70 . “ 9/29 – 10/22 limited either sex in units 881; 89; 91 & 92. “ 9/1 – 9/22 either sex, all units except ones listed above. Limit was 1 deer – license was archery deer, fee: R - $13, NR - $90.
Elk – 8/30 – 9/28 unrestricted either sex in units 3; 6 - 8; 11; 16; 161; 17; 171; 18– 22; 25; 27 – 32; 34 – 39; 41 – 50; 421; 444; 471; 481; 500; 501; 511; 52; 521; 56 – 59; 581; 68; 681; 69; 71- 86; 751; 851.
“ 8/30 – 9/21 unrestricted either sex in units 4; 441; 5; 12 – 15; 131; 23; 24; 26; 33; 411; 53 – 55; 551; 60 – 67 & 70.
Limit was one elk, license was archery elk, fee: R -$16, NR - $135.
Muzzle-Loading season (deer – antlered only) – 9/13 – 9/21 – All units except 23; 24; 39; 40. (3000 tags)
Limit was one deer, fee: R - $13, NR - $90.
“ “ (elk – antlered only) – 9/13 – 9/21 – All units west of I-25 except 1; 2; 201; 9; 10; 23; 24; 39; 40 & 51. (4000 tags)
Limit was one elk, fee: R - $16, NR - $135.
*** 1970 – Deer – 8/15 – 8/31 antlered only, statewide “ 9/1 – 9/20 either sex, statewide except units 40; 21; 22; 30 – 32. “ 9/1 – 9/20 antlered only in units 40; 21; 22; 30 – 32.
Limit was 1 deer – license was archery deer, fee: R - $7.50, NR - $25.
Elk – 8/15 – 8/31 antlered only, statewide. “ 9/1 – 9/20 either sex, statewide except units 40; 21; 22; 30 – 32 and in portions of units 2 and 58. Also, in units or portions of units 23; 24; 39; 391; 50; 46; and 45, there was a archery/rifle draw in which a certain number of tags were allocated for archery only. These draw tags were for the area drawn only but good for both seasons. Season dates dictated antlered or either sex. Limit was one elk, license was archery elk, fee: R -$10.00, NR - $25.
Primitive season (deer – either sex) – 9/1 – 9/20 – muzzle loading or archery. Required an archery license or regular deer/sportsmen’s licenses to hunt during this time period. Portions of units 1; 11; 27 & 29.
Manner of take, muzzle loader: With muzzle loading rifles of 40 caliber or larger firing a single projectile.
Note: First antelope archery only season.
*** Early elk rifle seasons took place in unit 40 and portions of units 18 & 19 in September. An early rifle season, high-country mule deer hunt took place in Rawah, Snowmass, Mt. Zirkel, Eagles Nest, Holy Cross and Hunter-Fryingpan and other Wilderness areas.
*** 1990 – Deer – 8/23 –8/31 unlimited antlered only in all units wholly west of I-25 and unit 140.
“ 9/1 – 9/25 unlimited either sex in all units wholly west of I-25 and unit 140.
“ 10/6 – 10/19 & 11/3 – 11/28 limited either sex in all units wholly or partially east of I-25. Limit was 1 deer – license was archery deer, fee: R - $17, NR - $120.
Elk – 8/23 – 8/31 - unlimited antlered only in all units wholly west of I-25 and unit 145 except 1; 2; 10; 29; 39; 40; 46; 48; 49; 50; 51; 56 – 58; 61; 69; 76; 84; 104; 201; 461; 481; 500; 501; 512; 561.
“ 9/1 – 9/25 - unlimited either sex in all units wholly west of I-25 and unit 145 except 1; 2; 10; 20; 39; 40; 46; 48; 49; 50; 51; 56 – 58; 61; 69; 76; 84; 104; 201; 461; 481; 500; 501; 512; 561.
“ 8/23 – 8/31 - limited antlered only in units 1; 2; 10; 20; 39; 40; 46; 48; 49; 50; 51; 56 – 58; 61; 69; 76; 84; 104; 201; 461; 481; 500; 501; 512; 561.
“ 9/1 – 9/25 - limited either sex in units 1; 2; 10; 20; 39; 40; 46; 48; 49; 50; 51; 56 – 58; 61; 69; 76; 84; 104; 201; 461; 481; 500; 501; 512; 561. Limit was one elk, license was archery elk, fee: R -$25, NR - $210. Muzzle-Loading season (deer – limited buck) – 9/15 – 9/25 – Statewide except unit 512 (4000 tags).
“ “ “ (deer – limited doe) – 9/15 – 9/25 – Statewide except unit 512 (2000 tags).
“ “ “ (deer – limited mixed) – 9/15 – 9/25 – Statewide except unit 512.
Limit was one deer, fee: R - $17, NR - $120.
Muzzle-loading season (elk – limited either sex) – 9/15 – 9/25 – In all big game units wholly west of I-25 and unit 145 except 1; 2; 10; 20; 39; 40; 46; 48; 49; 50; 56 – 58; 61; 69; 76; 84; 201; 461; 481; 500; 501; 512; 561.
“ “ (elk – limited either sex) – 9/15 – 9/25 – Units 1; 2; 10; 20; 39; 40; 46; 48; 49; 50; 56 – 58; 61; 69; 76; 84; 201; 461; 481; 500; 501; 512; 561.
Limit was one elk, fee: R - $25, NR - $210.
Thx Paul. So I guess changing up the seasons and dates isn’t an usual process at all.
What it shows is that for the past 50 years, the Early Archery elk season has been 30 days ending in late September. This also shows that there has been a 9 day ML rifle season in mid September during those same years..
The Colorado Bow Hunting Assoc, supports Status Quo as do the vast majority of bow hunters who hunt elk in Colorado. Most likely, trying to move the ML season out of the Early Season will not likely happen. Shorting the archery elk season is not popular and should not be supported.
Paul, in 1984 I got married on October 6th and several of my friends missed my wedding because they were still elk hunting that last Saturday of the season. I believe it may have been a one-time season shift. The following weekend the rifle elk (only) season started on the 13th and we spent our honeymoon packed in on horseback on the Continental Divide in a snowstorm. Listened to the infamous Broncos-Packers MNF game on the 15th in the dome tent. That was back when there were three rifle seasons and they alternated between rifle elk and rifle deer going first, with the combination season last.
50 years ago hunters were for the majority using long or recurve style bows which justified a 30 day season. Fast forward to 2021 and the complex powerful machines which masquerade as “bows” need to be re-evaluated. The archery season needs to be shortened to reflect these modern tech killing machines. However if you really want to preserve a 30 day hunt, and who wouldn’t; you should be amenable to a return to the traditional bows for which the seasons length was justifiably for. Eliminate the compounds and stay orange free. Then move the ML season to a week later in October for let’s say 11 days. Regardless, I’ll personally still wear orange for either because I’m responsible for my own safety.
Lou, you are correct, in the early 1980s. there were three years as follows, but then the season converted back to a late Aug, Sept season, ie, Elk – 9/7 – 10/6 - unlimited either sex in units 3; 6 - 8; 11; 16; 161; 17; 171; 18– 22; 171; 181; 191; 27; 28; 30 – 32; 35 – 38; 371; 41 – 45; 47; 421; 444; 471; 511; 52; 521; 59; 581; 68; 681; 71- 75; 751; 77 – 86; 851.
“ 9/7 – 9/29 unlimited either sex in units 12; 13; 131; 23; 24; 26; 33.
“ 9/7 – 10/6 unlimited either sex in units 25; 34.
“ 9/7 – 9/29 unlimited either sex in units 4; 441; 5; 14; 15; 131; 411; 53 – 55; 551; 60; 62 – 67; 70.
“ 9/7 – 10/6 limited either sex in units 1; 2; 201; 10; 20; 29; 39; 40; 46; 48; 481; 49; 50; 500; 501; 56 – 58; 581; 69; 84; 76.
“ 9/7 – 9/29 limited either sex in unit
Tom, a stick bow hunter on his soap box? Why is it you are the only one on this rampage to shorten the Colorado elk archery season? In spite of the "modern machines" the archery elk success percentage is still 10%-12% and has been like that from the start. Bow hunters kill 5,000 elk per year and the CPW does not seem to have an issue with that ,so why should you have an issue and as a non resident from Arizona? You seem like a smart guy, but you are barking up a tree concerning yourself with Colorado hunting issues and regulations. Many of us here on Bowsite are residents of Colorado and have bow hunted for many years, and have worked with the DOW/CPW to formulate a fair season for bow hunters but here you are, a nonresident, a person who has only been on Bowsite for a year or two, and one that is trying to tell us what is best for Colorado. Give us a break!
Still waiting to see that field photo in full orange during archery season...
Considering the success rates of the archery equipment, a 30 day season or longer is fully justified. I shoot traditional, but I would never look to impede someone's opportunity because I voluntarily handicap myself.
Season length isn't a big driving factor in how many days a tag holder is in the field or harvest rates. Jobs, family, finances and other activities are what dictate that.
Success rates wouldn't increase dramatically if bow season was Aug 1st - Dec 31st. What I have observed hunting here and other states is that when you have a long season where everyone's precious few days they can get afield for a certain tag don't all have to happen in a small window where they overlap a lot, the experience is much better. When the season is short and everyone's in the field at the same time, crowding and the impact on game behavior is amplified.
Thank you Paul for at least admitting that compounds are machines. An upside you may not have thought about is that if the requirement for archery turned trad only the numbers of NRs afield will drop off precipitously. Less pressure equals greater opportunity for those willing to accept the challenge. Same with ML’s.
NO Tom, I was just quoting you. Actually I am both a stick and wheel bow shooting and enjoy them both and have been successful with both, and as Stix stated, I would never look to impede someone' s else opportunity or time in the field.
Hahaha! This thread has several strong candidates for "Stupidest Post of the Year" award on Bowsite!
Paul, it very was nice of you to say he seems like a smart guy, I too try to give people the benefit of the doubt.
Paul walks the walk and when he talks, I generally listen. Others should too
My letter to the Colorado Parks and Wildlife:
[email protected]
Dear CPW,
The late Canadian Prime Minister Pierre Trudeau was once quoted as saying: "You can't legislate insanity". Unfortunately, you can't legislate stupidity either.
While the death of a bowhunter in Dolores County this past season (due to an act of gross negligence by a muzzleloader hunter) is tragic, let's put this in perspective. In 2018, 89 pedestrians lost their lives in Colorado when struck by motor vehicles. During that same year, how many archers were killed because they weren't wearing orange? To my knowledge, there have been two accidents in the past five years. TWO.
As a society, if we are not going to mandate that every person crossing a street in Colorado wear a high-visibility safety vest, why are we considering the orange mandate for archers? Wearing orange for a muzzleloader, whose range is 100-150 yards, or a rifle hunter, whose range is 300+ yards, makes no difference in their ability to be successful. But I hunt with the most sporting of weapons - a longbow - where I must be within 20-30 yards to be successful. This requires the concealment offered by camouflage clothing.
If the orange mandate hampers my ability to be successful in Colorado, why would I continue to pour hundreds of license dollars annually into the state’s coffers? Why wouldn't I (and thousands of others) just hunt another state where we can be more successful?
Great perspectives bwanajames !
My comeback would be to give ML's the last week of the season, no orange needed, less crowded habitat, better safety for bowhunters. This proposal alone would likely kill the idea.
You mean give them a week of the current archery season?
No thanks. That's my favorite week and 25% of the season. Plus, I already have the option to not hunt, or hunt and wear pink during muzzleloader if I feel unsafe.
Anyone complete the survey on the CBA website? For those who are more informed on this matter what's more impactful to the commissioners, emails or the findings of the CBA survey (or both).
Thanks.
Matt, both, because they know only a small percentage of bowhunters who hunt CO belong to CBA. CBA has a respected voice. So I did both.
Thanks fellas, I’ll do both. I was a bit confused by the CBA survey as there was no place to indicate which option was our preference (1-4). I mainly wanted to know because I’d like to share with buddies who might not otherwise engage. Thanks.
This question could be construed to help with the over-crowding issue. Implement orange and people will hunt elsewhere
I answered N/A. The issue boils down to yes or no on wearing orange. I would continue to hunt here but I'm not answering yes when it might possibly be misconstrued as any support for having to wear orange.
Years ago the DOW had a survey and one of the issues was shortening archery season. One question was "Would you continue to hunt archery season if it were shortened to one or two weeks?" (I don't recall the actual length but it was really short).
Well, yes I would but no way was I answering yes. I could just see someone at a meeting saying "Well, 65% said they would still hunt so therefore a majority of bowhunters support the shorter season"
The hypocrisy of the CPW and Wildlife Commission is astonishing. Let’s count the ways. A Bowhunter is shot and killed by a muzzleloader wielding a firearm with gross negligence, but Bowhunters are regulated as a result. That is like the rape victim being told she asked for it for wearing a short skirt and the raper being set free.
So the action is all in response to “we have to do something!”, so after a team is assembled to seek out solutions and bring forth a solution, they come up with a new regulation essentially saying the woods are dangerous during muzzleloader season and those sneaky Bowhunters must now wear orange to protect themselves.
What are the consequences for muzzleloader hunters? NOTHING!!!! Not one damn thing, and if Bowhunters complain we’ll lose a week of season and give it to the muzzleloader as a reward.
But wait, we only want Bowhunters to be forced to wear orange during the 9 day overlapping muzzleloader deer and elk season, not during the rest of September- because apparently we are all safe then?
But last year they lowered nonresident rifle bear tags to $50 to encourage more hunter harvest. The season? September 2nd - 30th. High country rifle mule deer, yep September. Rifle sheep and mountain goat, yep September. Private land rifle elk, yep September, and rifle pronghorn also overlaps with September Bowhunting seasons.
Yet they persist giving the defense attorney for the asshole that shot the Bowhunter a great argument since even the CPW thinks it is dangerous during this time and it appears they were negligent to not pass this law years ago after the last incident. Essentially his client is the victim here due to insufficient regulation - and he’ll walk.
This isn’t about safety or accountability, it is merely a weak attempt by the CPW and Commission to cover there ass and deflect question’s because they are afraid of bad P.R.
If there was any logic then the ski industry would be regulated due to their annual death count. And let’s not forget about all the other recreationalists out and about in the woods in September. Apparently our parks department does give a hoot about hikers and bikers. Did you know that only hunters have to wear orange in rifle season, not guides - why???
Hypocrisy at its finest, way to go CPW!
I'll start wearing orange during rifle seasons when every hiker, backpacker, fisherman, horse rider, leafpeeper, and EVERYONE else that's out and about then is also required to wear it!
^^^ Ziek, you forgot muzzleloaders in that list. ;-)
If this idiotic rule is implemented, I'll have to wear orange when bowhunting, but my wife, who comes along to call for me, will not. She is probably in more danger as a camouflaged caller than I am as the shooter.
Has anyone posed these questions/arguments to the CPW or Commission?
What was their answer?
The CBA will be testifying/addressing this issue at the next Commission meeting. The CBA BOD has examined this issue in full at the last BOD meeting, and supports Status Quo. and will offer other alternatives in the best interests of bow hunters. The CBA BOD invited the CPW Director and the author of the issue paper to the BOD meeting but they were not able to attend. Your comments to the CPW Commission pertaining to this issue, are appreciated.
Safety afield should be a priority of every States wildlife division. Wearing the orange is a proven safety measure that in no way hampers a hunters abilities to close the deal since the animals can't see it. I choose to wear the orange in some measure to assure I don't get inadvertently shot by another. It's not a guarantee but I believe in personal responsibility. I also firmly believe in your freedom to choose whether or not. What CPW should do is leave the choice up to the individual with a caveat. When you buy and sign your license and tags all liabilities and legal recourse for redress of such by you, your family or estates should be nullified. Simple death or injury by misadventure. Too bad so sad. But if you're wearing the colors then all legal rights of redress still apply. The same should apply to all recreationists on the public lands during the hunting seasons as well. Not wearing the colors fine; but you assume all the risks and liabilities of your personal choices. A no fault clause if you will. Also separate the A's from the ML's. Shorten archery by one week and then award ML's with say an 11 day season beginning first Friday in Oct.
A question for you Azelkhntr…
Should we require automobiles to all be blaze orange to prevent accidents, too?
If we use your asinine logic, we could allow vehicle owners to choose a different vehicle other than blaze orange if they want to sign away their rights.
I don’t post on this board often, and visit infrequently, and I don’t recognize anyone’s username on here but yours. The reason I recognize yours is because your posts are so absurd and pompous, I can’t believe your presence on this board is even tolerated.
Maybe rifle hunters should have to accept strict liability in order to hunt. There are NO accidental shootings, they should be called what they are - negligent shootings.
Azelk, I like your idea. I can run around with a rifle and pick off hunters not wearing blaze or pink. Tough shit for them and their families, they should have been wearing blaze. I get to thin the crowds and better my chances for a choice tag next season.
PECO2; Thats just nutz. I'm just spitballing about a possible solution thats going to come whether anyone likes it or not. Frankly IMO its long overdue. All recreationists on public lands beginning the first day of hunting season till the last should be wearing blaze. I'm A-OK with camo blaze for the hunters because I know we're smart enough to recognize it for what it is. Well, most are. Everyone else wears the solids.
" I'm A-OK with camo blaze for the hunters because I know were smart enough to recognize it for what it is."
That would be funny if it wasn't so ignorant. The reason ANYONE has to wear blaze orange is BECAUSE rifle hunters aren't smart enough to not shoot other people! Maybe it's time to realize that there just are too many people out and about in the fall and only allow short range weapons for hunting.
A bow hunter gets shot because of the negligence of a gun hunter, now it is going to be the responsibility of the bow hunter to wear orange.....? If a gun hunter accidentally shoots a wolf because the wolf wasn't wearing orange, guess who is going to the responsible party in that case?
One thing about is: if they change the Muzzy season to right after bow season, you can bet the points required to draw will increase dramatically.
A better solution would be keep Muzzy where it is, no bowhunting allowed then, and extend bow season another week
^^^ That would be a great way for guys that hoard PPs to use their PPs
So Azelkhntr, if I'm not hunting and just go for hike in September and fall off a cliff it's my own fault, but if I have orange on I get to sue somebody? Sounds good to me!
Geez Surfbow if you fall of a cliff you'll probably be dead and won't be suing anyone. And yes, it will be your own fault. The orange will help the recovery team find your corpse more readily tho so you'll have that going for you. Cliff selfies are all the rage now.
One WITH Nature
One WITH Nature
There are 2 weeks between S 30 and Rigel start in Col What do other stayed ado for hunter safety ?
Turkey IS OPEN ALSO in Sept Give ml their own season Not blaze Or for biw !
Most on now site are rookies Not 6 decades of Bow harvests Read my book “One WITH NATUTE “ Ag in 2 weeks Seminar was on it and now since 1956 7 slams 64 diff species 96 in books Do Mtn lions where Orange ?
Can't make sense out of 4 lines you typed, think I'll pass on the book.
Drinking and posting can be a mistake sometimes.
With nature makes about as much sense as Azelkhntr
I’m with LFN on this one, looks like something Brandon would put out.
You guys remember Extreme Predator from a few years ago.
Yep. "Extrem Predator". I hope he's ok.
I'll take a free copy of that book.
